Howland Vist w/ Malik

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Tookie has potential to be the best PG ever at MSU. He shouldn't even be considered as a potential drop. Have you guys watched any games of his? He'd be our third best player the second he steps on campus.

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You're kidding, right?

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

You're kidding, right?

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I believe tookie is superior to ready right now

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

You're kidding, right?

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Nope. Tookie is that good. I'm confident.

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Originally Posted by msstate7

I believe tookie is superior to ready right now

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He very well may be. However, could be best ever according to 61? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only other scholarship offer I can find on him is to UAB. He is 5 ft 10 and playing against similar sized players in all of his highlights. It doesn't take much foresight that calling him "possibly one of the best ever" as a slightly premature statement.

Keep an eye on ready. With Malik guaranteed pg and tookie committed, ready might transfer out. Pure speculation...

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Nope. Tookie is that good. I'm confident.

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And I'm confident I'd rather have Dunlap than Tookie (if it came down to that). However, I see nothing in them that convinces me either of them will be the best ever. Your prior basketball knowledge sure won't sway me, either.

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Originally Posted by msstate7

Keep an eye on ready. With Malik guaranteed pg and tookie committed, ready might transfer out. Pure speculation...

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I wouldn't be surprised by that.

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Originally Posted by msstate7

Keep an eye on ready. With Malik guaranteed pg and tookie committed, ready might transfer out. Pure speculation...

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I'd be very very surprised by that.

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

Your prior basketball knowledge sure won't sway me, either.

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Remember who you're talking to Brad. I'm the guy that was screaming for three years to get Ray fired. You're the other guy.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Remember who you're talking to Brad. I'm the guy that was screaming for three years to get Ray fired. You're the other guy.

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You screamed for lots of things, and thankfully this administration showed patience until the proper time. I never screamed for Ray to stay - I simply said he deserved his 3rd year. I also said if he didn't make the NIT or win 9-10 conference games, it's probably time to move on. Well here we are with Coach Howland, so I think we should both be okay with that scenario, right?

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

And I'm confident I'd rather have Dunlap than Tookie (if it came down to that). However, I see nothing in them that convinces me either of them will be the best ever. Your prior basketball knowledge sure won't sway me, either.

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Welcome back Brad Stevens...

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

You screamed for lots of things, and thankfully this administration showed patience until the proper time. I never screamed for Ray to stay - I simply said he deserved his 3rd year. I also said if he didn't make the NIT or win 9-10 conference games, it's probably time to move on. Well here we are with Coach Howland, so I think we should both be okay with that scenario, right?

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Again welcome back Brad...

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

You screamed for lots of things, and thankfully this administration showed patience until the proper time. I never screamed for Ray to stay - I simply said he deserved his 3rd year. I also said if he didn't make the NIT or win 9-10 conference games, it's probably time to move on. Well here we are with Coach Howland, so I think we should both be okay with that scenario, right?

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I remeber two things I screamed most for. 1. Forced positive attrition and 2. Ray gone. Which I find ironic because we're posting in a thread talking about whose going to be the forced attrition. But you're right I am very ecstatic we landed Howland!

Tookie is a stud, and he has far more potential than Dunlap. Dunlap will never be a PG, and he's too small to routinely play the 2, especially without great athleticism.

My only question on Tookie is whether he's big enough for what Howland wants at PG. But if he isn't big enough at the 1, then Dunlap certainly isn't big enough at the 2.

As others have said, though, I trust Howland.

if IJ stays and I'm pretty sure he will, a lot of you may be eating your words on the play of IJ... Everyone knows ALL of the turnover issues we had last year.. I think IJ was like 6th or 7th on the team in that department..
Get him in an offense where he can distrubte the ball to scores like Malik and sword which will lead to him getting more open shots..
And the notion that Tookie is already better than IJ is jumping the gun a lot. Hopefully he will come , and if he doesn't that tells me all I need to know about him... He isn't as good as advertised.. No way that kid wouldn't want to play for Coach Howland esp with the few offers he has.. And CBH may not really want him.. Who knows time will tell.
It's also funny all the hate IJ takes for being 5'10 and "supposedly" can't be play defense.. ( led team in steals) I think Tookie is about the same size...

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Tookie has potential to be the best PG ever at MSU. He shouldn't even be considered as a potential drop. Have you guys watched any games of his? He'd be our third best player the second he steps on campus.

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Exactly! State fans are tough to digest! Extremely tough. Coach will be in home with tookie tomorrow.

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Originally Posted by mic

if IJ stays and I'm pretty sure he will, a lot of you may be eating your words on the play of IJ... Everyone knows ALL of the turnover issues we had last year.. I think IJ was like 6th or 7th on the team in that department..
Get him in an offense where he can distrubte the ball to scores like Malik and sword which will lead to him getting more open shots..
And the notion that Tookie is already better than IJ is jumping the gun a lot. Hopefully he will come , and if he doesn't that tells me all I need to know about him... He isn't as good as advertised.. No way that kid wouldn't want to play for Coach Howland esp with the few offers he has.. And CBH may not really want him.. Who knows time will tell.
It's also funny all the hate IJ takes for being 5'10 and "supposedly" can't be play defense.. ( led team in steals) I think Tookie is about the same size...

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Again with the IJ defense. I'm not fired up for Tookie's defense. I'm sure it's no worse than IJ's. Please do not regurgitate IJ Ready defensive stats.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Again with the IJ defense. I'm not fired up for Tookie's defense. I'm sure it's no worse than IJ's. Please do not regurgitate IJ Ready defensive stats.

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I'm just trying to follow you.. If IJ size was ur biggest issue Tookie is the same size..
I hope Tookie turns out to be Stephen Curry.. I am just saying lets pump the brakes on him a little..

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Originally Posted by mic

I'm just trying to follow you.. If IJ size was ur biggest issue Tookie is the same size..
I hope Tookie turns out to be Stephen Curry.. I am just saying lets pump the brakes on him a little..

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Except Stephen Curry is 6 foot 3.

I think most people see high school highlights and forget they will be playing against much bigger players at the D-1 level. Maybe Tookie does come in and succeed - I am just saying I have no proof of that based upon his opponents in his film. I personally would rather NOT have 2 sub-6-foot PGs.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Tookie is a stud, and he has far more potential than Dunlap. Dunlap will never be a PG, and he's too small to routinely play the 2, especially without great athleticism.

My only question on Tookie is whether he's big enough for what Howland wants at PG. But if he isn't big enough at the 1, then Dunlap certainly isn't big enough at the 2.

As others have said, though, I trust Howland.

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For the life of me I don't know why anyone would want Dunlap over Tookie. Dunlap was questionable when we took him as an undersized shooting guard who played at a smaller MS HS. Tookie averaged 30 points/game at a mid-level GA HS and led his team to championships. The few games Dunlap played this year he looked somewhat lost on the court and didn't shoot the ball very well which was suppose to be his strength. They are both undersized but I don't see what Dunlap has shown that would make anyone want him over Tookie if they have actually seen Tookie play.

I just have a few comments based on several different posts in this thread.

I do not want Ready to go anywhere. I love Tookie's potential, but he is not better than Ready right now, at least in certain areas.

Tookie, however, is bigger than Ready. He's not taller than Ready, but he is definitely bigger.

Ready's defense is much better than a lot of State fans believe. Tookie played very good defense and gave great effort from what I saw of him.

Tookie's height is a real question mark. Of course he played against smaller players than he'll see on the next level, but that's true of everyone. He will be able to score in college basketball. He won't be able to do everything he currently does at the rim, but he will still do a lot of it. 3A in Georgia is far from a joke; there is plenty of quality there. Tookie would play a big role for us right away, especially if we don't get Newman.

Again, the only question on Tookie for me is if Howland is ok with a PG of that size. He may want a big guy to be able to defend more effectively.

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

Except Stephen Curry is 6 foot 3.

I think most people see high school highlights and forget they will be playing against much bigger players at the D-1 level. Maybe Tookie does come in and succeed - I am just saying I have no proof of that based upon his opponents in his film. I personally would rather NOT have 2 sub-6-foot PGs.

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Maybe I should have said the scorer that Steph Curry is..
I was aware that Steph isn't 5'10..

I guess my biggest thing is not that I'm opposed to a small PG; I just don't know if having two 5'10" PGs is what we really want. It seems that at least one of them would HAVE to go if we bring in Malik. And maybe I'm just too optimistic - but, I can see how all our current players and signees could succeed with Coach Howland, but we can't keep them all. Either way, Howland will work it out and I'm pumped to see the product on the court next year.

This whole argument could be a complete waste of time considering Malik and kasongo aren't even commits at this point

I don't think you should base any decisions about the future roster on Newman.

If Newman comes and you drop Tookie, then in 2016 you have Ready as a Sr and no other PG. At least we have Weatherspoon and Simonds, who we should get back, at SG.

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Originally Posted by msstate7

This whole argument could be a complete waste of time considering Malik and kasongo aren't even commits at this point

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Haha, great point. Let's get back on topic. Has anyone heard any more news from the home visit?

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Originally Posted by msstate7

This whole argument could be a complete waste of time considering Malik and kasongo aren't even commits at this point

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Agreed.

I saw an article today listing out the reasoning for him picking UK, State, or LSU, and the case for LSU is still really strong. Newman was quoted, too, saying he wants to play with other great players, he wants to win, and he doesn't want to have to shoulder the load.

I know we have a strong pitch, too, but I think it's still far from a done deal.

Could somebody refresh my memory on this, but wasn't the reason IJ came to us in the first place, was because of a very close relationship between his father and one of our now 'former' asst, coaches?

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Some people just ask things because they dont keep up with things as much as others. It's in no way a violation- Westbrook never attended Miss State

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Sometimes they are trolls.

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Originally Posted by MabenMaroon

Could somebody refresh my memory on this, but wasn't the reason IJ came to us in the first place, was because of a very close relationship between his father and one of our now 'former' asst, coaches?

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I think he was coached by Wes Flanigan's father at Little Rock Parkview.

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Originally Posted by MabenMaroon

Could somebody refresh my memory on this, but wasn't the reason IJ came to us in the first place, was because of a very close relationship between his father and one of our now 'former' asst, coaches?

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Ready is a good player. He's not bottom two on the team. We need Strugg's size with Roq leaving and Ware, Zuppardo, Fred and Daniels soon too. Ndoye is a wasted spot. He is one for sure. I think I'd drop Daniels. He's gone in a year anyways. Dunlap's ability to shoot and having four years left is more valuable than the one year left Daniels has. Tough choices. Gets much harder the better we get to force transition but it's a necessary evil to being good.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

I think I'd drop Daniels. He's gone in a year anyways.

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This is exactly why I don't want to drop any of the seniors. We get their spot open next year anyway, and it will be much easier to fill it with a quality player than scrambling around now.

I'd rather have a year to get as many good players as we can than to fill that spot with an Ndoye-type, or another Daniels, and be stuck with that for the next several years.

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Originally Posted by smootness

This is exactly why I don't want to drop any of the seniors. We get their spot open next year anyway, and it will be much easier to fill it with a quality player than scrambling around now.

I'd rather have a year to get as many good players as we can than to fill that spot with an Ndoye-type, or another Daniels, and be stuck with that for the next several years.

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Newman and Kasongo aren't Ndoye-type.