A runner on first ands second on in the fourth inning is a "severe hole" now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer Dawg
How many times Fitts can get through the lineup is irrelevant with Cohen. He has proven that he can start games- which is something Lindgren couldn't do. If he struggles, we'll likely bring in Laster if I had to guess based on what Cohen has said. He won't have to get through the lineup more than twice worst case scenario.
Only way Fitts isn't in our weekend rotation is if he is hurt. More than likely it's going to be Fitts, Ross, and Hudson with Laster coming in relief. The bullpen of course is up in the air at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer Dawg
Exactly. You would think that this would have been obvious to everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
But no- let's do some advanced statistical research that ignores several key factors while beating the hell out of only one point that factored into the entire decision.
Would be great to groom Hudson and either Tatum or Sexton as weekend guys, and Laster as our 3rd starter....and then have Fitts, Ross, and Tatum/Sexton in the pen behind them. I feel like Fitts has gutted it out and provided us with a decent starting pitcher.....but he is not a typical weekend starter in the SEC. He would provide us with a good right arm in middle relief.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
I know Cohen won't do that, but it would probably be a good move to consider.
I think I'm just ready to get back to having a true Ace Friday night starter. Seems like injuries and guys not having stones has kept us from having an Ace lately.
He's probably more typical weekend starter than a lot of people realize. More accurately, we don't use him typically. He's not a typical SEC ace, but at worst he's a number three guy. His ERA in SEC play was well under 2. I wouldn't be surprised if sabermetrics doesn't like him because he allows some hits, isn't overpowering, and etc. But he does the job for the most part and does what is asked of him.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
You have to also consider that he will likely be one of our leaders on our pitching staff, and that makes him even more likley to be in the rotation among other things.
Really what we need are Hudson and Tatum to be 5-7 IP guys.
Henderson started both games of the CWS final. Cohen had no problem benching him. Same for Rea near the end last year (and hopefully next year.. Go Ingram)
We have better options than Fitts
I agree. He would pass as a Sunday guy....I'm just referring to being a Friday night guy. I wish we could get him out of that role, and selfishly I'd love to see him in long relief because I'm ready to see these Sophomore arms get in there and get comfortable. But hopefully we will see them a lot in long relief if they don't startQuote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Platooning = benching?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer Dawg
If you want to troll, there's a place called sixpackspeak. Otherwise, let the grown ups talk about sports.
It just depends on how Hudson and the others do. To start with, I suspect it will be Fitts on Friday, Ross on Sat., and Hudson on Sun. most likely. But, if Hudson or someone else does really well Cohen won't have a problem moving him up to the Saturday or even Friday spot I don't think.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
Speaking of pitchers... Are we expecting our TJ guys back next season? Did Preston have any surgery? Preston is the guy I expect to take the leap forward
How is Hudson doing in summer ball so far?Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
I don't think Preston will ever be more than a midweek guy for us. He had a nice few weeks last season, but I'm not a believer. I have more hope that Paul Young will be a weekend guy than Brown, and I've never seen Young pitch, ha.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
I disagree. Preston is a ground ball pitcher and infield defense should be one of biggest strengths next season assuming holland is the stud he's supposed to be at ss.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
Preston = Graveman. When he's healthy...Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Don't let being wrong on bunting and covering up past statements on Garner threaten you "status" as the spoken word on all things MSU baseball. You're very good at keeping up with recruiting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Every time you resort to this, it's basically seen as an admission of defeat on the topic at hand to everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer Dawg
"Trolling" = Consistently asking for things you know will never happen -- and then pretending that you are a better baseball mind than our coaching staff.
That explains the low draft status. My bad. Only playing two years messed me up. I don't look at roster to know what yr guys are or there they're from. I just know who plays and who the ones are who should be playing. And when I looked up Pirtles draft stock, it doesn't say anything about him signing any contract. With only playing two yrs, I figured 700th was too low to sign and he had another year. My bad for not having enough free time to analyze and removed our roster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homedawg
You don't have enough free time to know Pirtle is gone -- but do have enough free time to know you are a better offensive mind than anyone we have on staff at MSU? Interesting...Quote:
Originally Posted by RougeDawg
Wrong on bunting? I have it bookmarked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer Dawg
http://www.billjamesonline.com/bunting_for_a_hit/
That's all I'll say on that.
And covering up for Garner? There was nothing to cover up. I said he would be a candidate for first base and he was indeed moved to first base by our staff. Once he was moved there, he failed to perform at a satisfactory level in the field and at the plate and was passed by Rooker, Ingram, and once Cole Gordon came to campus he would have been passed by him as well and then he and the staff decided to part separate ways. I can't fix comprehension issues on your part. If I was a moderator, I would certainly have fixed trolling issues on your part, but ironically I don't have enough "status". Which is fine by the way- I'm not advocating for a moderator role.
Every single one of my team outlook posts includes basically every player on the roster at the time of that post. I don't "predict" who is leaving via transfer or who will transfer in either because I don't think it's productive to do because it starts rumors that may/may not be true and it has the potential to start problems. It's also very unfair to do that to a player IMO, so I avoid doing so until an announcement is officially made. I care more about MSU baseball than I do about any "status" that I may or may not have. The rumors about Garner transferring were known by me for a while and others as well as Hann for that matter. I certainly could have chosen to put those rumors into those posts, but I chose not to because I thought it would have been extremely classless on my part. If another poster asks about a rumor or brings it up, I do address it- but I try not to bring up rumors like that on my own.
I'm glad you enjoyed the recruiting post. Read more often, post less.
Fitts not being a weekend starter is "something I KNOW will never happen"?Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Uh ok
In the ideal situation, with the younger guys progressing as we hope, a Fitts/Lindgren combo would be replaced with a Fitts/Mitchell piggyback. But we probably won't get lucky enough to allow Ross back in the pen. We can hope, though.
We SHOULD. If Tatum or Sexton are going to start for us, we need to get it going sooner than later. It's as simple as Butch and Cohen saying Ross is moving to the pen and sticking with it, thus forcing someone to step up. Ross can throw long innings of relief, so even if one of those guys can do like Fitts and get through the order a time or 2, we will have Ross to mop up. That's why I wish Ross, Fitts, AND Laster would go to the pen as piggy backs on the 3 youngsters as starters at the beginning of the year. It will give them great experience, needed starts, and also the comfort in having veterans behind them with long inning experience in case we struggle early in games. Just a thought, but I feel like something has got to be done to break this cycle of piggy backs and us develop some true starters for down the road. This would be the "safe" way to develop them IMO. It will never happen, but I like to think it would be a great idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by State82
For me, I think it should be Fitts/Laster, Hudson and Tatum with Ross backing up Hudson and Myles Gentry backing up Tatum. I like Ross in the bullpen personally, but I think the staff likes Ross as a starter.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
With my groups, you really wouldn't have to have Hudson and Tatum go more than 4-5, which should take some pressure off of them. I like the idea of going from Hudson's 95 to Ross's 82, and then with Tatum and Gentry, by starting Tatum the other team is going to probably try to load up on RH hitters, which is a good match-up for him.
I think Cohen and Butch's philosophy on the piggy backing is pretty much if you are Chris Stratton dominant, we'll let you go deep- or even Kendall Graveman or Ross Mitchell, but if not we're not going to ask a guy to do something that isn't as advantageous to us. One thing I have heard Cohen say is that they feel that the batting order has a big advantage the third time through.
Last thing I heard was Paul Young and John Marc Shelly were ahead of schedule and Will Cox was on schedule. Preston didn't have surgery, but using my medical opinion, he probably should. The rumor is he was told to get surgery and he decided that he didn't want to do it. That's why I'm not expecting much from him next year, even though he's a good pitcher.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
He's doing well. The best of the group of sophomores next year.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
He is 1-2 with 18K's in 14 IP and 6 BB's, and his ERA is 3.21, but the game before that, his ERA was 1.80.
Personally, if given the choice between the two, I start Laster and put Ross back in the pen. To me, Ross's ultimate value was/is getting us out of the big inning 2-3 times per weekend. Although he gave us a bunch of quality starts, we lost that to an extent without him. Lindgren was great most of the time -- but never had the consistency of Ross and would quite often fail to stop the bleeding in the big inning before settling in. I think Laster can eat up Ross's starter innings allowing him back into what I see as his better role.
Time one of the young 3 stepped up. I think Tatum will -- yet to be seen on the other 2.
Thats just incorrect. Ross was good at logging innings in relief but it was a proven statistical fact that he allowed a higher percentage of inherited runners to score than his peers last year. He was not as valuable in getting us out of jams. This is due to low K numbers.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Ehhhh I think you are exactly backwards here. Lindgren would often get those K's and limit damage where Ross would allow the run to score.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will James
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Croom Diaries
Mitchell is an outstanding guy to start or bring out of the pen- but not a good "get out of jams" guy. His strength as a RP was coming in the game in say the 4th inning- and then finishing it for us and saving the pen.
Your data set is hugely incomplete and inconclusive. I'll fix it when I get back to my laptop.
While Mitchell was less likely to get k's, he was more likely to get gdps. You also fail to account for the location of the runners inherited, which is every bit as important as the number of outs inherited.
BingoQuote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
That was quoted from last year. Please don't sell that Ross is better getting out of jams than Lindgren. It's silly. If you want to try to so a WPA analysis be my guest. It's common sense that myself and Coach are right on this.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
That's not what I heardQuote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Yes you ****ing moron. It's difficult to forget something you learned and actually did many years ago. Knowing something for years has no impact on my time priorities now. That's like me calling you out for telling people how to ride bikes, even though you haven't had one for years. Just because you don't read about it or perform it currently doesn't mean you don't know how it's supposed to be done properly.
My bad for being an engineering manager, responsible for a large sum of market share and people working under me. I know proper mechanics, approach, and how to call pitches. Just because you and others can't, doesn't mean it can't be done. Maybe it is really rare, because our players don't know how to do it and coaches don't teach it. What exactly have I said incorrect about our hitting? Why do other teams have players with proper swings and approache? Why are those other players with proper mechanics and swings, more productive at the plate than we are? Tell me where I've been incorrect. Until then, you can go f*ck yourself.
One small thing.....
He's GOOD as a starter, but OUTSTANDING only out of the pen. IMO. Stats bear that out. He often had some rocky 1st/2nd innings as a starter.
Yeeeeeah, this probably is not true.Quote:
Originally Posted by RougeDawg
Yea, well joke's on you bud. Nice try though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goat Holder
Basically everything you've said is incorrect about our hitting to the point of absurdity. We were a top 20 hitting team in the country last year -- yet you think you are better at it than our coaches -- while preaching a homerun approach for singles hitters. For an "Engineering Manager" -- you sure don't know how to apply engineering principles to your opinion. Nor do you have the common sense to realize that you aren't a better hitting coach or pitching coach that what we currently have at MSU. That puts you in an exclusive class of idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by RougeDawg