Since Leach passed

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Hyperbole. You said best buddy and that's not close to true between Selmon and Lebby. Friendly acquaintances at best.

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Ok. At the very least they are former friendly acquaintances that knew each other coming in and that played in Lebbys favor to get and keep his job. Maybe that?s enough sugar and sunshine

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Any contributors or decent talent would have transferred out of this shit show if they had half a brain.

That is why there are none.

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Your argument back to me is a hypothetical. Im literally telling you, go look at those names in those classes. Nobody Leach recruited us is helping in 2024. Do you know how hard it is to be successful when you get nothing for 3 years out of recruiting? Then MSU did the most good ole boy thing imaginable and hired Arnette which was the final nail in the coffin. It will take 3 years if we do it right to get back to 2010-2020 standards. Let?s hope only 2 more years left.

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

Your argument back to me is a hypothetical. Im literally telling you, go look at those names in those classes. Nobody Leach recruited us is helping in 2024. Do you know how hard it is to be successful when you get nothing for 3 years out of recruiting? Then MSU did the most good ole boy thing imaginable and hired Arnette which was the final nail in the coffin. It will take 3 years if we do it right to get back to 2010-2020 standards. Let?s hope only 2 more years left.

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Yep, that true. It?s a hard sale with this fire them all bunch. They are all pitch forks and torches, and don?t realize that part of why we suck.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

Right. Im sure they had to learn each others names at the interview. To act like there is not a problem here and there is no favoritism, nepotism, buddy ball going on at MSU since Leach passed is just sticking your head in the sand

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You continue to show you know nothing as to how this works. Since NIL killed State?can you ask Will to donate that $300K he got from us back? Or tell Nowell, Robinson, and Ashley in next years class at Brandon to not take NIL money from any school because ?that?s not the way?.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

On all the boards? This is the only one I read or have an account on. Im just not gonna lie. Keenum needs to go, Lebby is not ready and Selmon has done absolutely nothing visually to inspire any confidence. He has had multiple chances to do what needed to be done and he kept Lemonis and hired his best buddy to keep ruining a tough football program and make it a flashy frat boy party.

Im glad we had some anonymous donors to give some money so Lebby can decide what to do with it haha

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You do realize not everyone in the fan base duck hunts, quail hunts, deer hunts, nor fish all the time correct? Some people do wear things different than boots and Wranglers and I can guarantee that there are more big money donor fitting into what I?m talking about than what you perceive as ?one of us? Remember you were suckin Arnett because ?he wore boots and was redneck like me from Rankin County?.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

Ok. At the very least they are former friendly acquaintances that knew each other coming in and that played in Lebbys favor to get and keep his job. Maybe that?s enough sugar and sunshine

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Again-not how it works.

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Originally Posted by BankerDog

You continue to show you know nothing as to how this works. Since NIL killed State?can you ask Will to donate that $300K he got from us back? Or tell Nowell, Robinson, and Ashley in next years class at Brandon to not take NIL money from any school because ?that?s not the way?.

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Will gave a bunch of it to bookie and tulu so they could stay while y?all ran him and his family down because he wouldn?t throw the ball deep enough. Im not even gonna begin to comment on the rest of that

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

Your argument back to me is a hypothetical. Im literally telling you, go look at those names in those classes. Nobody Leach recruited us is helping in 2024. Do you know how hard it is to be successful when you get nothing for 3 years out of recruiting? Then MSU did the most good ole boy thing imaginable and hired Arnette which was the final nail in the coffin. It will take 3 years if we do it right to get back to 2010-2020 standards. Let?s hope only 2 more years left.

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I get your argument, but the liklihood of anyone Leach recruited with any talent or ability to contribute would have left by now, is pretty high considering it's 2 coaches later.

Leach had some guys that contributed a hell of a lot more than ANYONE on this year's team through his few years with us. Including noodle arm WR. Leach averaged in the 25-28 range. Sure it's just numbers beside names, but those numbers are placed there by guys that do this shit for a living. It's not a random number and it does hold some value.

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Originally Posted by BankerDog

You do realize not everyone in the fan base duck hunts, quail hunts, deer hunts, nor fish all the time correct? Some people do wear things different than boots and Wranglers and I can guarantee that there are more big money donor fitting into what I?m talking about than what you perceive as ?one of us? Remember you were suckin Arnett because ?he wore boots and was redneck like me from Rankin County?.

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He sure did fool all of us after he let the wrong crowd call the shots. As far as the rest of that im not even sure how it is relevant to what I said at all. I?m just glad there is someone with more money than me to throw at this bunch we have running the show now

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

the liklihood of anyone Leach recruited with any talent or ability to contribute would have left by now, is pretty high considering it's 2 coaches later.

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It was 24 months ago that Leach died. I was told by everyone that Arnette was the right hire to keep that recruiting class together that was so important. Okay so those guys should have been 12 months in the program and ready to contribute this season in Aug 2024. Where are they?

To make my stance clear, I really liked Leach here but it?s just sticking your head in sand to pretend he didnt severely hurt our program for the next guy. Obviously not his fault, we all thought we had more time and rest in peace coach, but unfortunately life is not fair and that is what happened and it screwed us.

Then we doubled down by making the dumbest hire Ive ever seen a college team make in Arnette. We should have bit the bullet and done what we did this season last year. We added an extra year of misery that wasnt needed by promoting the most unqualified P5 HC coach in 2023 and trying to piece together some hybrid air raid bullshit. I get so mad just thinking about how dumb of a decision that was to ever hire him.

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

It was 24 months ago that Leach died. I was told by everyone that Arnette was the right hire to keep that recruiting class together that was so important. Okay so those guys should have been 12 months in the program and ready to contribute this season in Aug 2024. Where are they?

To make my stance clear, I really liked Leach here but it?s just sticking your head in sand to pretend he didnt severely hurt our program for the next guy. Obviously not his fault, we all thought we had more time and rest in peace coach, but unfortunately life is not fair and that is what happened and it screwed us.

Then we doubled down by making the dumbest hire Ive ever seen a college team make in Arnette. We should have bit the bullet and done what we did this season last year. We added an extra year of misery that wasnt needed by promoting the most unqualified P5 HC coach in 2023 and trying to piece together some hybrid air raid bullshit. I get so mad just thinking about how dumb of a decision that was to ever hire him.

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Man. Hiring Arnett was dumb as hell.

It was obvious after 1-2 games.

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Originally Posted by SPMT

Man. Hiring Arnett was dumb as hell.

It was obvious after 1-2 games.

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Amen

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Go back and look at those last few classes under Leach and circle all of those contributors. Especially on defense and tell me it was equal to Mullen's recruiting. Not to mention Leach thought Emerick was good to have around in recruiting. Leach ran a good program, don't mistake me thinking he didn't, but recruiting was not his strong suit.

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Leach gave us the national attention that we had since the days of JWS. He was good for MSU in that respect. Leach had us respectable (in most cases) and was building something. Unfortunately, he was unable to complete what he started.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

No I want to hang on to winning a conference game or two and don?t really care how we do it. Unlike some of our folks whod rather be a cool swaggy showtime 2-10 while recruiting at the same level we are blaming leach for haha

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Leach is 100 % to blame for our lack of defensive talent right now. I wasn’t aware that was even a debate.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

What explosive offense?? We railed on the defense all year long but what did our offense ever do? When it really mattered? The Georgia game was over a month ago and it was over at halftime. A staff with a future does not get destroyed by Toledo

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We were having to play a true freshman quarterback against the toughest schedule in the country. The decision to go get an injury prone quarterback was the problem and that falls on Lebby, but it is pretty obvious that the offense is not going to be an issue with Lebby.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

Probably would have went 2-10. What was his record at WKU again? Damn I mean Washington who is 6-5 after replacing an entire staff and more starters than anyone in the country. I hate he had to miss all the drip and showtime we?ve had

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He was awful all year and got benched the last 2 games. Just like we said he would.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Any contributors or decent talent would have transferred out of this shit show if they had half a brain.

That is why there are none.

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We lost 1 SEC level defensive player in the portal. Look at where they all went when they transferred out. Dave Emerick destroyed our recruiting. Particularly on defense.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

I get your argument, but the liklihood of anyone Leach recruited with any talent or ability to contribute would have left by now, is pretty high considering it's 2 coaches later.

Leach had some guys that contributed a hell of a lot more than ANYONE on this year's team through his few years with us. Including noodle arm WR. Leach averaged in the 25-28 range. Sure it's just numbers beside names, but those numbers are placed there by guys that do this shit for a living. It's not a random number and it does hold some value.

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Leach died after signing day of 2022. There has been 1 recruiting cycle signing day since his death. These are his players and the defensive ones are almost all awful. That is not debatable. In this day and age, it will not be an excuse after this portal cycle though. If Lebby can’t flip the roster on defense in this portal cycle it is 100% on his staff.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

We lost 1 SEC level defensive player in the portal. Look at where they all went when they transferred out. Dave Emerick destroyed our recruiting. Particularly on defense.

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Between him and the CC staff they burned damn near every bridge in the state and elsewhere. This staff is having to dig out from under that.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

What explosive offense?? We railed on the defense all year long but what did our offense ever do? When it really mattered? The Georgia game was over a month ago and it was over at halftime. A staff with a future does not get destroyed by Toledo

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Saw this tweet this morning https://x.com/langloismsu/status/186...AiOwVOmMGHXcTA

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Originally Posted by Jarius

Leach is 100 % to blame for our lack of defensive talent right now. I wasn’t aware that was even a debate.

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I don?t understand how people can even think otherwise. They act like Leach left us 5 years ago, 2024 class should all be sophomores from leach?s last recruiting cycle starting to contribute. Where are those guys if the argument is this isn?t Leach and his staffs fault? Agree with you, this isnt even a debate

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

I don?t understand how people can even think otherwise. They act like Leach left us 5 years ago, 2024 class should all be sophomores from leach?s last recruiting cycle starting to contribute. Where are those guys if the argument is this isn?t Leach and his staffs fault? Agree with you, this isnt even a debate

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You make no sense. How do we go from 41 last year in total defense to 127 this year? Anyone that Leach recruited is no longer here. They have transferred. Are you that dim? The entire team this year was practically from the transfer portal. Not because the guys Leach recruited are still on the team. People have to exit in order for us to have room on the roster.

Good lord brother.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

We lost 1 SEC level defensive player in the portal. Look at where they all went when they transferred out. Dave Emerick destroyed our recruiting. Particularly on defense.

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We lost multiple defensive players to the portal since 2022. You obviously no jack all about building a roster. You think that because a player does not transfer to an SEC school - they are not SEC caliber. That has zero logic, because majority of our transfers that started for us this year did NOT come from an SEC school.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

We lost multiple defensive players to the portal since 2022. You obviously no jack all about building a roster. You think that because a player does not transfer to an SEC school - they are not SEC caliber. That has zero logic, because majority of our transfers that started for us this year did NOT come from an SEC school.

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Son, they transferred to G5 programs after leaving us because they knew they were not good enough to play in the SEC. We processed them because they were not any good. It happens at every program in the country. Are you really this clueless? You think all the ones that left us and went to USM level schools turned down better options to do so? Please stop embarrassing yourself. Let me break this down Barney style for you. If a player transfers from a power 4 school to a G5 school it is because they are not good enough to play. Every single one of our Leach defensive transfers except 1 fit this mold. If you are a G5 player and transfer up to a p4 school it is because you excelled in the G5 and want to get an NiL check and more exposure. We had 1 player leave us for a better opportunity on defense. That is why we are where we are defensively.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

Son, they transferred to G5 programs after leaving us because they knew they were not good enough to play in the SEC. We processed them because they were not any good. It happens at every program in the country. Are you really this clueless? You think all the ones that left us and went to USM level schools turned down better options to do so? Please stop embarrassing yourself. Let me break this down Barney style for you. If a player transfers from a power 4 school to a G5 school it is because they are not good enough to play. Every single one of our Leach defensive transfers except 1 fit this mold. If you are a G5 player and transfer up to a p4 school it is because you excelled in the G5 and want to get an NiL check and more exposure. We had 1 player leave us for a better opportunity on defense. That is why we are where we are defensively.

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Keep blaming a dead guy for the shit show we have.

The guy that had the last winning season for State for the foreseeable future.

The guys we brought in from the portal got ran out of Starkville by a G5 school, my guy.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Keep blaming a dead guy for the shit show we have.

The guy that had the last winning season for State for the foreseeable future.

The guys we brought in from the portal got ran out of Starkville by a G5 school, my guy.

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The entire reason we had to bring in guys from the portal was because the dead guy recruited like a*s on the defensive side of the ball, moron. There were 3 Leach recruiting classes on this roster, 1 Arnett recruiting class, and 1 Lebby spring portal class. You not being able to do math isn’t my fault.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

The entire reason we had to bring in guys from the portal was because the dead guy recruited like a*s on the defensive side of the ball, moron.

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That got us pretty far, didn't it. This argument is stupid. You are obviously simple minded and have no clue about modern day football.

Coach dies, players leave. Hire a shit coach and fire him after one year, players leave. Hire a 1st year HC that goes 2-10. Players leave. They have/had no reason to stay. Likely bottom feeders left on the roster from when Leach was alive. You're an idiot if you think otherwise.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

That got us pretty far, didn't it. This argument is stupid. You are obviously simple minded and have no clue about modern day football.

Coach dies, players leave. Hire a shit coach and fire him after one year, players leave. Hire a 1st year HC that goes 2-10. Players leave. They have/had no reason to stay. Likely bottom feeders left on the roster from when Leach was alive. You're an idiot if you think otherwise.

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Hey dumba*ss, the players that left after Leach died and Arnett left went to sh*tty programs at a lower level because they were sh*tty football players. No one left for a better opportunity. That means his recruiting was not good. You are too stupid to have a conversation with.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

You make no sense. How do we go from 41 last year in total defense to 127 this year? Anyone that Leach recruited is no longer here. They have transferred. Are you that dim? The entire team this year was practically from the transfer portal. Not because the guys Leach recruited are still on the team. People have to exit in order for us to have room on the roster.

Good lord brother.

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You cannot be this dense, you have to be trolling. If all these Leach defensive players transferred to G5 schools and half of them can?t even get on the field there, what does that tell you? Why do you think we HAD TO GO FULL PORTAL ON D THIS YEAR? Im not following what part you can?t understand. You are just proving my point more

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

You cannot be this dense, you have to be trolling. If all these Leach defensive players transferred to G5 schools and half of them can?t even get on the field there, what does that tell you? Why do you think we HAD TO GO FULL PORTAL ON D THIS YEAR? Im not following what part you can?t understand. You are just proving my point more

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So you're changing your argument now from Leach's recruits not contributing.. now you're saying they are not here.. so you are agreeing with me that Leachs recruits have transferred out? Who knows the reasoning and who cares. They're not on this team and did not put 10 Ls on our schedule.

Whether his guys that transferred out were good or not. They aren't on the 17n team. Jesus christ.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

Hey dumba*ss, the players that left after Leach died and Arnett left went to sh*tty programs at a lower level because they were sh*tty football players. No one left for a better opportunity. That means his recruiting was not good. You are too stupid to have a conversation with.

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Youre an idiot. If they are no longer on the team, it wouldn't matter if they were good or not. The guys that transferred out did jack shit to lose games this year. If they were worth a shit they would have left too. Nothing to make them stay.

Leach's teams never had a defense ranked worse than 41st in the country. This year's was 127th. Seems like even on Leach's worst year, we were not historically bad.

I know numbers are difficult for you. I tried to simplify it the best that I can.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

So you're changing your argument now from Leach's recruits not contributing.. now you're saying they are not here.. so you are agreeing with me that Leachs recruits have transferred out? Who knows the reasoning and who cares. They're not on this team and did not put 10 Ls on our schedule.

Whether his guys that transferred out were good or not. They aren't on the 17n team. Jesus christ.

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8 of the 11 starters on defense were Leach recruits. The ones who left the program did so because they sucked. You are the only one that doesn’t know that.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Youre an idiot. If they are no longer on the team, it wouldn't matter if they were good or not. The guys that transferred out did jack shit to lose games this year. If they were worth a shit they would have left too. Nothing to make them stay.

Leach's teams never had a defense ranked worse than 41st in the country. This year's was 127th. Seems like even on Leach's worst year, we were not historically bad.

I know numbers are difficult for you. I tried to simplify it the best that I can.

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When you recruit 3 year’s worth of sh*tty defensive players it does not show up right away. It shows up when all of the previous coach’s good players leave. That’s why they call recruiting the lifeblood of the program, you mental midget. You can’t whiff on 3 entire signing classes defensively and then act like it isn’t that person’s fault the very year all of those players would be playing if they were worth a sh*t. Those players not being here any more created a huge void in the roster. Please have someone with a brain that you can sit down with and not judge you explain how recruiting and roster management work because I don’t have the patience for your ignorance. I’m going to stop replying now because you are either a troll or legitimately retarded and I don’t want to make fun of an actual retard and do not want to deal with a troll.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

You make no sense. How do we go from 41 last year in total defense to 127 this year? Anyone that Leach recruited is no longer here. They have transferred. Are you that dim? The entire team this year was practically from the transfer portal. Not because the guys Leach recruited are still on the team. People have to exit in order for us to have room on the roster.

Good lord brother.

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Alright, just because I'm bored today I will lay it out for you. You will reply with why it isn't Leach's fault but I got nothing else going on so why not.

Class of 2022, Leach's last full class. Can we agree that class should be having a significant impact and playing time for the 2024 season? I would believe we can both agree with that. Defensive players he recruited in his class.

Mojo Dortch (highest rated recruit) - Was supposed to be a DB for us. 2 catches at Troy this year. Can't see the field at a G5
Trevion Williams - 33 tackles for us this year. 0.5 sacks. Depth piece level, not an SEC starter. SEC quality depth type imo, but definitely a starter for us with how bare the cupboard is.
Avery Sledge - 13 total tackles at Southern Miss. Can barely see the field at the worst G5 school.
Decarlos Nicholson - Juco guy so will give a pass here since those guys aren't really meant to be impact unless you're in a real bad spot. May have started for us this year, transferred out and is a career backup at USC
Javae Gilmore - 2 total tackles this year. Not even depth quality
Donterry Russel - 4 total tackles this year. Not even depth quality
Kalvin Dinkins - Keep hearing this dude is an important part of our DL. 2 total tackles this year. That should tell you something


If you want to defend how that defensive recruiting isn't on Leach and that staff go ahead, but we will never see eye to eye on it. He screwed us defensively. Again, rest in peace and he did a great job in his time here but both things can be, and are, true.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

So you're changing your argument now from Leach's recruits not contributing.. now you're saying they are not here.. so you are agreeing with me that Leachs recruits have transferred out? Who knows the reasoning and who cares. They're not on this team and did not put 10 Ls on our schedule.

Whether his guys that transferred out were good or not. They aren't on the 17n team. Jesus christ.

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My brother in christ, HOW CAN THEY CONTRIBUTE IF THEY HAD TO TRANSFER OUT BECAUSE THEY AREN'T EVEN GOOD ENOUGH TO PLAY ON A SHITTY 2-10 TEAM. lmao come on man, you cannot be this dense.

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

Alright, just because I'm bored today I will lay it out for you. You will reply with why it isn't Leach's fault but I got nothing else going on so why not.

Class of 2022, Leach's last full class. Can we agree that class should be having a significant impact and playing time for the 2024 season? I would believe we can both agree with that. Defensive players he recruited in his class.

Mojo Dortch (highest rated recruit) - Was supposed to be a DB for us. 2 catches at Troy this year. Can't see the field at a G5
Trevion Williams - 33 tackles for us this year. 0.5 sacks. Depth piece level, not an SEC starter. SEC quality depth type imo, but definitely a starter for us with how bare the cupboard is.
Avery Sledge - 13 total tackles at Southern Miss. Can barely see the field at the worst G5 school.
Decarlos Nicholson - Juco guy so will give a pass here since those guys aren't really meant to be impact unless you're in a real bad spot. May have started for us this year, transferred out and is a career backup at USC
Javae Gilmore - 2 total tackles this year. Not even depth quality
Donterry Russel - 4 total tackles this year. Not even depth quality
Kalvin Dinkins - Keep hearing this dude is an important part of our DL. 2 total tackles this year. That should tell you something


If you want to defend how that defensive recruiting isn't on Leach and that staff go ahead, but we will never see eye to eye on it. He screwed us defensively. Again, rest in peace and he did a great job in his time here but both things can be, and are, true.

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Once again, majority of your post is made up of people that are not on the team.

How is that in any way impacting this year's results and how bad we were defensively?

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Originally Posted by DEDawg

My brother in christ, HOW CAN THEY CONTRIBUTE IF THEY HAD TO TRANSFER OUT BECAUSE THEY AREN'T EVEN GOOD ENOUGH TO PLAY ON A SHITTY 2-10 TEAM. lmao come on man, you cannot be this dense.

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Youre blaming people that aren't on the team for how bad we are.. that's pretty dense. There are teams out there with far less talent winning games and beating us by 24 points.

That's not on Leach my brother. That's on us. We are too good to admit that though.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

When you recruit 3 year’s worth of sh*tty defensive players it does not show up right away. It shows up when all of the previous coach’s good players leave. That’s why they call recruiting the lifeblood of the program, you mental midget. You can’t whiff on 3 entire signing classes defensively and then act like it isn’t that person’s fault the very year all of those players would be playing if they were worth a sh*t. Those players not being here any more created a huge void in the roster. Please have someone with a brain that you can sit down with and not judge you explain how recruiting and roster management work because I don’t have the patience for your ignorance. I’m going to stop replying now because you are either a troll or legitimately retarded and I don’t want to make fun of an actual retard and do not want to deal with a troll.

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You're a rare breed. Please do not reproduce.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Youre blaming people that aren't on the team for how bad we are.. that's pretty dense. There are teams out there with far less talent winning games and beating us by 24 points.

That's not on Leach my brother. That's on us. We are too good to admit that though.

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Someone having to explain to you why it’s Leach’s fault that we could not replace 3 sh*tty recruiting classes in 1 year has to be an all time troll job. There is just no way you are this ignorant.

Anyway.