Is Fancy really trying to spin this 2015 class

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

It's a long way until February. Remember at one point we led for singleton, had whitehead and Johnson and brassell committed and got none. I'm not saying it's going to be a repeat, not close. But after years of them doing whatever it takes, I've learned to temper my excitement 10 months ahead of time. With that said, I'd dang sure rather lead than trail on any player. And it appears we lead, and in some cases commandingly, for a majority of the top guys.

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It is a long way to February. And I hope that when Ole Miss tries to flip these players that they remember that Yancy thought that they were overrated in February.

And I'd also submit that Dan has learned a lot since that class that you are referring to and Dan is also a lot more established than he was at that time. If we had been to four straight bowls and won four out of five, those players you are referring to could very well have ended up at MSU.

You can temper your excitement as much as you need to- but as of THIS MOMENT- I'm stating facts as they stand in April.

Todd has good points and I think that MSU people have also caught on to most of olemiss' recruiting tactics and figured out how to counter them to some degree.

There will surely be a big push during the all-star games and late dec. early jan. to make some deals, especially if they are struggling on their top out of state prospects.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

It's a long way until February. Remember at one point we led for singleton, had whitehead and Johnson and brassell committed and got none.

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Whitehead never committed to us if I remember correctly and Brassell had never even visited our campus when he committed to us. ...and since that happened in 2011, the only flip they have had has been the CB from Holmes CC in 2013 (I dont count Koolio because that was so orchestrated we all called that months ahead of time). They tried hard on Jones, Richie Brown, Graham, Aeris Williams, and others since with no luck. There's a reason for that. We learned our lesson

And the year that they had the best recruiting class in the history of football, they still couldn't flip Shumpert, Chris Jones, or Jake Thomas.

Heck- Dan did better than Georgia did as far as guys flipping to Ole Miss.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Whitehead never committed to us if I remember correctly and Brassell had never even visited our campus when he committed to us. ...and since that happened in 2011, the only flip they have had has been the CB from Holmes CC in 2013 (I dont count Koolio because that was so orchestrated we all called that months ahead of time). They tried hard on Jones, Richie Brown, Graham, Aeris Williams, and others since with no luck. There's a reason for that. We learned our lesson

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I agree w pretty much all you said about us learning and them working our guys. Doesn't keep me from being concerned......whitehead was committed to us though.

Has either team ever dominated Mississippi recruiting??? It's the same story every single year... We get our share of Ms kids, and TSUN gets their share of kids every year.. One of Bama and LSU cherry pick one of the top guys, and every once in a while USM gets a grade casualty. It's like I'm taking crazy pills... Between Yancy and Steve, there's enough bullshit to fertilize the entire south. It's like they work together to keep the shit flowing all year.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

And the year that they had the best recruiting class in the history of football, they still couldn't flip Shumpert, Chris Jones, or Jake Thomas.

Heck- Dan did better than Georgia did as far as guys flipping to Ole Miss.

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Did Pat Patterson every commit to us. Wanna talk about a shady deal??? Then those wack jobs accused State of turning him in for a fake SAT.

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

Has either team ever dominated Mississippi recruiting??? It's the same story every single year... We get our share of Ms kids, and TSUN gets their share of kids every year.. One of Bama and LSU cherry pick one of the top guys, and every once in a while USM gets a grade casualty. It's like I'm taking crazy pills... Between Yancy and Steve, there's enough bullshit to fertilize the entire south. It's like they work together to keep the shit flowing all year.

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My years run together, but the closest we came was the class Jackie had that was like #9 by rivals. Thompson twins, Corey Miley, fant. Got 6 of the top ten and the Rebs got one or none. I don't have the energy to look it up, but that's as close as we have come for sure.

Yeah, Whitehead was definitely committed. But everyone knew he was 'along for the ride' and that getting him was partly contingent on getting Brassell, Singleton, and the rest.

It was not a surprise at all that he decommitted after everything went down in January; most were expecting it.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

My years run together, but the closest we came was the class Jackie had that was like #9 by rivals. Thompson twins, Corey Miley, fant. Got 6 of the top ten and the Rebs got one or none. I don't have the energy to look it up, but that's as close as we have come for sure.

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Yeah 2003... The 2002 class looked nice on paper as well.

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

Has either team ever dominated Mississippi recruiting??? It's the same story every single year... We get our share of Ms kids, and TSUN gets their share of kids every year.. One of Bama and LSU cherry pick one of the top guys, and every once in a while USM gets a grade casualty. It's like I'm taking crazy pills... Between Yancy and Steve, there's enough bullshit to fertilize the entire south. It's like they work together to keep the shit flowing all year.

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Depends on what you call dominating. Recently, Dan has based on results as in on the field and how they turned out in college results.

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

Has either team ever dominated Mississippi recruiting??? It's the same story every single year... We get our share of Ms kids, and TSUN gets their share of kids every year.. One of Bama and LSU cherry pick one of the top guys, and every once in a while USM gets a grade casualty.

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I agree with you, but I've never seen such a consensus among the top prospects in the state before. And it's not as though it's just Steve or a State guy saying it - everyone is acknowledging that we are way out in front for most of the top guys in MS this year. It could be a pretty unprecedented year.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Depends on what you call dominating. Recently, Dan has based on results as in on the field and how they turned out in college results.

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I totally agree with gotten more out of the Mississippi kids, but that's more about coaching, not recruiting...

I'm talking about head to head battles for kids EVERYONE thinks are great football prospects. Seems like we always split 50-50... I consider a 60-540 split on the blue chips a very good year in recruiting... I'd say dominating is a 70-30 spit, which usually only happens when there's a coaching change or something like that. Head to Head with both coaches in good standing... I don't see either school taking the lions share.

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Originally Posted by smootness

I agree with you, but I've never seen such a consensus among the top prospects in the state before. And it's not as though it's just Steve or a State guy saying it - everyone is acknowledging that we are way out in front for most of the top guys in MS this year. It could be a pretty unprecedented year.

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Yeah, we look really good right now... There's no denying that, but it always works itself out. This time of year, certain boosters/fans in certain areas considered MSU/OM strongholds, haven't started applying pressure yet. When recruiting heats up, kids will start hearing it at every turn. That's when you see the chips start to fall.

It will be interesting this year.

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

I totally agree with gotten more out of the Mississippi kids, but that's more about coaching, not recruiting...

I'm talking about head to head battles for kids EVERYONE thinks are great football prospects. Seems like we always split 50-50... I consider a 60-540 split on the blue chips a very good year in recruiting... I'd say dominating is a 70-30 spit, which usually only happens when there's a coaching change or something like that. Head to Head with both coaches in good standing... I don't see either school taking the lions share.

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To me recruiting doesn't stop once they sign on the dotted line. If we sign 25 five star players that are all busts that doesn't do us much good. Development is part of that. And sustained development helps with eventually dominating in state because when these guys see guys that they thought were awesome in high school like Singleton and Brassell flame out and then they see guys like Jameon and McKinney going to MSU and becoming stars- it makes a difference.

Ole Miss can spin that away however they want to- but kids aren't stupid.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

To me recruiting doesn't stop once they sign on the dotted line. If we sign 25 five star players that are all busts that doesn't do us much good. Development is part of that. And sustained development helps with eventually dominating in state because when these guys see guys that they thought were awesome in high school like Singleton and Brassell flame out and then they see guys like Jameon and McKinney going to MSU and becoming stars- it makes a difference.

Ole Miss can spin that away however they want to- but kids aren't stupid.

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It does... retention and development is a completely different ball game... Do those things help recruiting? Absolutely... For every Brassell or Singleton, there's a Nick James, or Quay Evans... These coaches know how to play the game, and convincing an 18 year old that something like that would never happen to them, isn't that hard.

It's hard to dominate on the dotted line... You're just not going to sign every kid... When OM was WAY down and on fire, they still signed their share of guys... When Croom was falling apart, OM never was able to come in and dominate... It just is what it is...

As long as we sign our fair share, and continue to evaluate/find/develop the rough 2 and 3 start guys... We will continue to win on the field. That I do know...

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

I totally agree with gotten more out of the Mississippi kids, but that's more about coaching, not recruiting.

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Recognizing guys like McKinney and Calhoun is indeed recruiting. They didnt just suddenly get talented when they got to S'ville. They were guys that were underrated by the services.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Recognizing guys like McKinney and Calhoun is indeed recruiting. They didnt just suddenly get talented when they got to S'ville. They were guys that were underrated by the services.

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I know that, but that wasn't what I was talking about... I was talking about the head to head battles with the "can't miss" prospects both MSU and TSUN are pressing hard for. The top 10 or so players in the state... There' no doubt this staff is A+ when it comes to spotting players before anyone else... We usually split the top 10 or so players in the state though. It's hard for either school to dominate those guys.

I agree with that

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Originally Posted by jimbo352

It does... retention and development is a completely different ball game... Do those things help recruiting? Absolutely... For every Brassell or Singleton, there's a Nick James, or Quay Evans... These coaches know how to play the game, and convincing an 18 year old that something like that would never happen to them, isn't that hard.

It's hard to dominate on the dotted line... You're just not going to sign every kid... When OM was WAY down and on fire, they still signed their share of guys... When Croom was falling apart, OM never was able to come in and dominate... It just is what it is...

As long as we sign our fair share, and continue to evaluate/find/develop the rough 2 and 3 start guys... We will continue to win on the field. That I do know...

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That's just not how I look at it. If you get a class that the recruiting services don't care for on NSD, but then you have three or four guys that end up being 1st day NFL picks- I can't say that we recruited poorly. I'm more concerned about the players we do get rather than what the Clarion-Ledger, Rosebowl, Yancy etc. think about our class and who their top 10 are. I trust my evaluation skills and opinions more than them. No one remembers losing on NSD. It's a racket. All you have to do is put four stars by someone's name and they're a good player. But in the grand scheme of things, that doesn't really mean anything.

For example, I remember watching Bear Wilson's film from high school. I thought it was incredible. He was like a three star guy I think. But I thought he would have an immediate impact and he pretty much did. Despite what the recruiting people told me, I was excited to get him. Same with Chris Jones before he blew up. He didn't even make Dandy Dozen.

These recruiting sites are not going to have it so that one school dominates even if that is reality because they have fans from the other school to entertain. I'm sure Willie Hibbler will be a top 10 player this year for that reason alone. The reality is he's probably not even in the top 15.

Recruiting takes connections and relationships. That's why Nutt and Dan didn't do as well in both of those cases you are referring to. For the past 20 years or so, neither one of us has been clearly dominate over the other. UNTIL Dan came along and has now won four out of five. We're starting to establish dominance. That's why I like playing USM- if we beat them, then that makes even more of a statement in state. That's also why I like playing the SWAC schools from Mississippi as well- we're establishing dominance while helping them out. The Romans pretty much did the same thing during the height of their empire.

Now we have a legit Heisman contender at QB and a chance to have some very good teams for the next couple of years. It should impact our recruiting in a major way and in a positive way.