I think we have enough guys for Parker to fix. Holcombe and Loftin could be All Americans with good development. Plus this TAM dude was pitching for Yeskie, pretty good coach. Maybe he just plain sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Saltydog
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I think we have enough guys for Parker to fix. Holcombe and Loftin could be All Americans with good development. Plus this TAM dude was pitching for Yeskie, pretty good coach. Maybe he just plain sucks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Saltydog
Not if Lemonis wants to keep his job. We need two legit starters. A Friday stud gets us in a regional at best.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
Ah man, the Auburn Tigers got the 400 hitting SS with 25 HR from Jersey.
If he's going to leave civilization, why not come to Starkville.
You can can't even get decent food in Auburn. You order spaghetti with marinara, you'll get egg noddles and ketchup. He'll be an average nobody over there . Live 12 months like a Schnook.
https://youtu.be/Cf-bF_IQi6MQuote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
If I remember correctly this is playing out in a similar way as last year. Which was a good portal haul.Quote:
Originally Posted by Commercecomet24
This one has the potential to be much much better than last year though.
A Friday stud probably gets us at least into a SR. Skenes would have completely changed our season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooterpoot
Last years portal haul had us to 13th in the SEC. This year we replace that portal haul AND need to improve the team. So this year's damn sure better be much betterQuote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Oh I believe well get more, the question is will it be enough? EVERYONE is adding studs via the Portal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Commercecomet24
Hell, we don't even have the best 3B transfer in the SECW
I obviously think we will get more players. I?m just curious about the quality of said players.
Not saying that we don't need guys, we don't need somebody else's Andrew Walling. Especially a failed prospect from a PC we all respect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooterpoot
Get the Bama Ace and Burns, we are in the Omaha and NC hunt.
There are even 100 MPH guys that can locate like Witchita's Jake Snead. Even a 100MPH Senior LHP from UNLV, Jack Sellinger with a 4:1 K to BB ratio and strikes out 14 per 9 innings.
Skenes os the best pitcher we've ever seen. Not exactly a typical Friday starter.
And no, we would not have made a Super with him. We'd have made a regional yeah, but you've got to remember LSU had a much better lineup and theor pitching staff behind Skenes turned it on in the postseason in a way our staff would not have.
7 innings of elite pitching doesn't make a 13th in the SEC team and turn them into a top 16 national team. Skenes wouldn't have saved OM or Mizzou either, for example. But regardless we aren't getting a Skenes this class so why bring him up as an example?
Amd do those good player move the needle relative to other SEC teams that are adding studs from the Portal as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZedFedder
Yes, get the best 2 pitchers in the Portal and our team will be much better next season. More news at 11.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
What if I told you the 100mph giys that can locate are recruited by everyone? That it's hard to put together the NIL for one of Holman/Burns, let alone both?
Auburn has a coach that hosted a regional last year. We have a coach that may be fired next May. They have a SS spot wide open, we are telling Cupp it's his job to loose and don't want to scare him into the pros.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
But I'm glad you bring him up. EVERYONE is getting studs via the Portal. SWAC and SOCON players of the year etc. Friday aces from small schools. We've got to land a huge OF and a couple huge pitchers to gain on the competition for next year
We ended up with a CF that is going to be no worse than a second round pick, a closer that is borderline elite that we couldn't use as much as we would have liked because of injuries and game situations, Nate Dohm who was probably our second or third best pitcher depending on your opinion of Cade Smith and Aaron Nixon, a good second baseman in Amani Larry. And the bonus is we may get some of those guys back for multiple years. Our portal class was not the reason for last year.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Correct! Lemonis's inability to evaluate his assistant coaches or roster talent or develop players or coach defense or create leaders on the team was why last year happened- not the Portal class being a bust.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
I'm saying we're trying to make the team BETTER than it was last year. To do that, we need to upgrade the sports that are open- 3B, 2x OF, SS, 10ish innings of weekend pitching. So far we've upgraded at 3B, nothing on the rest yet but I'm sure we'll hear some confirmed names eventually
I think that Parker can help get some extra mileage from last year's D1 portal guys still. Dohm can get better and Gartman seemed to lose his identity last year. Powell mentioned that Gartman was not pitching like he did successfully in Memphis and prior. Are we getting Gartman for another year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Gartman was a Covid Freshman, so has another year of eligibility
I think we have at least 3 SEC SP’s on campus already. Getting 1 more top arm would be great. Need another quality OF to go with Jordan and Hugesak.
I agree with you, but that?s not stopping other teams who had much better seasons than us from stockpiling talent. With what we had last year pitching wise, we need to get all the help we can.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Gartman supposedly had TJ surgery
There are no Skenes though. And we have no proven starter behind who comes in (unless Cade stays). Our lineup still needs some help too. Some extra pen pieces would be nice but we're ok if all stay healthy. Two starters and a lineup piece make us a CWS team.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
I would say that we have 3 SEC pitcher prospects. Being guided by numbers and actual performance, you could argue that MSU may only have 3 pitchers an above-average SEC team would care to take and most likely, not to be startersQuote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
JC, Loftin, Dohm, and maybe Holcombe, assuming Nixon and Cade go pro. Were is Pico?
Extraordinary that after all these great recruiting classes, 3 straight Omahas, and a 6th year coach... MSU has no healthy and performing Junior Class of pitchers to speak of. You have a walk-on Junior and that is it.
Like l've said several times, we shouldn't be in this situation. It's all speculation going into next year.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
What about LSU- where were their returning SP's? UPig had one returning SEC SP. Auburn's top 3 SP's didnt pitch for them in 2022. Almost nobody in the SEC has a bunch of returning SP's because of the draft at age 21Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
It's that way for most teams. It's not just usQuote:
Originally Posted by basedog
I can?t wait to see the battle for 14th place next year between State, Ole Miss, and LSU. It?s gonna be epic to see which previous NC gets that 12th and final Hoover spot!
LSU is buying them, special case that few others can emulate. For others 3 years is all a good to top-level SEC pitcher is going to give you. That's been the standard for a few decades now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
But unless you are Vandy, you need the Junior year to max the capability of your prospects.
If this past year's group of freshmen pitchers are anything close to what they are supposed to be, we should be much much improved in 2024 on the mound. We will see.
But that's my point- with the draft age at 21 now- you have guys leaving after 2 years. We're gonna lose Loo and Jordan to next year's draftQuote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
Loo has the stuff to be a legit Friday guy, especially as a Righty. He just needs to learn what it takes to succeed at this level, which is cutting out the mental lapses. This past season, he would have 2 innings where he made the hitters look silly and then the next inning totally fall apart. This is where we are hoping the new PC makes a difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
Depends on the birth day. Most still do 3 years to 21.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Also, CJ and Jordan prospects were not even collegiate players in the 80s and 90s. I recall losing players drafted in the 30th round even in great MSU periods. MLB is giving colleges players that never used to wear school colors. Draft is shorter and they closed down many minor league teams.
Several organizations shut down their satellite MiLB development locations. But the current best team in baseball, the Atlanta Braves still have most of their Feeders intact. They just don?t own those teams any more. But they still have 2 Latin American player development locations, Rookie League, A, AA, and AAA locations along with their rehab and development center in Orlando. The Head Groundskeeper (if he is still there)at that Orlando complex used to be the Head GK at Pearl. Last I heard he was over all 5 fields and the training pods in Orlando.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer
So, they still want the best High School players in their Minor League training facilities. Especially the young pitchers.
He's got to get some dog in him tooQuote:
Originally Posted by AlSwearengen
Well now to be fair, most of our Freshmen pitchers in 2023 threw as many pitches in 2 innings as they threw in an entire 7 inning high school game against guys who would swing at anything close because HS umps would a 2 meter by 1 meter strike zone while the next one would have a 12 inch x 12 inch strike zone.
That is why Baseball needs off field evaluators that can find a guy and then watch multiple games with different umps and different levels of competition.
LSU- returned Ty Floyd (3.77 ERA, 10 starts, 59IP) and Blake Money (5.31 ERA, 12 starts, 61IP). They went out and got Skenes and Hurd from the Portal to go with FLoyd for the rotation- they didn't say "we'll just develop some guys on staff and keep using Money" like you're acting like we should be fine with doing for Loo, Loftin, and Holcombe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Upig- returned SMith (4.66 ERA, 15 starts, 77IP) and McEntire (2.59 ERA, 8 starts, 48IP). For 23 they rode McEntire for more innings (his ERA took a dive to 5.07) and added a Juco guy in Hollan and a Portal guy in Adcock to make up the rest of their starts. Again, they didnt' say "Well we've got 3 talented Fr I'm sure they'll be fine as starters next year".
Auburn- You're making my point. They went out and got 3 transfers to make the rotation- they didn't rely on already on the roster talent to make a hug jump and fill those roles.
Lets look at who State returns: Jurrangelo (8.1 ERA, 13 starts, 50IP), Dohm (4.07 ERA, 2 starts, 42IP), Holcombe (8.25 ERA, 3 starts, 36IP), Siary (7.07 ERA, 3 starts, 28IP), Loftin (3.08 ERA, 5 starts, 26IP). There's more but we're getting into sup 25IP last year so they're kinda irrelevant.
Basically you want to say "every SEC team is in the same boat as us- the rotation is made up of new guys each year" but you're ignoring that those teams don't rely on their roster alone- they add transfers. And they NEVER rely on guys who had 8+ ERAs the year before to make a huge jump in the offseason.
Do you not see how awful this comparison is to our competition? We NEED 2 SEC starters via the Portal. That's what the comps to the 3 teams you list say we need
It's not a bad comparison when our guys haven't announced yet. You'd have to assume we aren't adding arms to our rotation like you mentioned. We're going to add arms.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Nobody has said we shouldnt add an arm or two. I have said numerous times we need to add at least one quality (meaning SEC starter level) arm. But I also believe we are in great shape with the talent we already have. We get Loo, Holcombe, and Loftin throwing strikes more consistently and we will be in business. Then throw Simmons, Auger, Dohm, Siary, and more to the mix. Add a couple more arms from the portal and we should be in great shape.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
We're adding arms tooQuote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Hey, people can't melt about football recruiting so the fanbase needs something to melt about.Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
I'm aware we're trying to add arms, the point of my post was to say we NEED to add arms. Stud starter level arms. Plural.
C34 keeps trying to have his cake and eat it too- saying we're going to add arms, but also saying our Fr are so talented we'll be fine riding with them. He's said that multiple times in this thread alone
Look up- he said regarding our pitching rotation "it's like that for most teams". My post shows nobody is in as bad of a situation as we are- they either have returning guys with better numbers than ours OR they get quality arms from the Portal. The best do both. Thus far we have neither. Even if we land Holman we'll definitely need another starter