Favorite to land Tommy Stevens

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Originally Posted by Maroonthirteen

Not talking about Fitz. I’m talking about KT v SFA ..... 13 of 31 attempts.

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How many of those 18 incompletions were throw aways out of bounds so he didn't take a sack? What's his average yards per completion in those 13 throws with 360 yards passing? How many tds did he throw? At the end of the day it's about yards, tds and wins not about how many completions you get or your completion %. Don't get stuck on a misleading stat like completion %. It doesn't paint the whole story.

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Originally Posted by Ari Gold

As usual some of you aren’t getting the point
If CJM thought KT was the guy needed to lead this team to the level he wants he wouldn’t be out looking for someone that MAY be able to do that
The same way CDM did with Cam

Again I never said or hinted that Stevens is Cam , hell Kelly Bryant isn’t even close to Cam

But there is a reason CJM is a little worried about the QB position, and we should be thankful he is trying to fix the problem
And I I don’t give a **** what teams are after Stevens
The same way no one was after Minshaw and we see how that turned out at Wash state.

If Stevens comes he comes . If he doesn’t he doesn’t.
It’s KT ‘s job to lose wether he comes or not. If he can beat him great, if Stevens wins the jobs great as well

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Good post. If KT is fine with Stevens coming here I'll be fine with it too. I just don't want to lose two years of KT for one year of Stevens. I think KT is that good.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

How many of those 18 incompletions were throw aways out of bounds so he didn't take a sack? What's his average yards per completion in those 13 throws with 360 yards passing? How many tds did he throw? At the end of the day it's about yards, tds and wins not about how many completions you get or your completion %. Don't get stuck on a misleading stat like completion %. It doesn't paint the whole story.

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He had 2-3 throw aways but he also had multiple bad throws that the WR help complete (or weak secondary). Williams made that great catch behind and right off the ground, for example. We were gifted a ton of yards that are stopped at the catch, knocked down or intercepted by a real opponent. He made a good throw to TE in 1st quarter and throws that were easy throws. But man at least be the objective with the entire game. How long did the WR have to stop and wait on 2 of the big pass plays. That neither pass could reach 50 yards.

ETA. I don’t care that you don’t think completion percentage means much because Moorehead sure does. Brought it up a lot last season. And when you are only running 64-65 plays a game, it most definitely is a factor in being efficient as an offense.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

He had 2-3 throw aways but he also had multiple bad throws that the WR help complete (or weak secondary). Williams made that great catch behind and right off the ground, for example. We were gifted a ton of yards that are stopped at the catch, knocked down or intercepted by a real opponent. He made a good throw to TE in 1st quarter and throws that were easy throws. But man at least be the objective with the entire game. How long did the WR have to stop and wait on 2 of the big pass plays. That neither pass could reach 50 yards.

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Peyton Manning threw under thrown deep balls all the time. It's a 50/50 ball. WR can never catch it when it's ten yards over their head. Wayne Madkin used to do that all the time and I couldn't stand it. This is one thing (among many others) that Alabama and Saban are so much better at understanding and implementing than we have ever been. When they throw deep the QB puts a ton of loft on it basically making it the easiest of possible catches for a receiver. I don't get caught up on how nice a pass looks or how great a qbs completion % is. Tim Tebow got robbed of a 5+ starting career because everyone was obsessed with the optics of passes and completion %. He won games, was a great runner and an elite leader.

He threw for a ton of yards because our athletes are so much better than sFA. We had yards of separation. The first pass that Hill ran for a TD (that are credited as passing yards) was because Hill
Out ran their defense after the catch for 50 yards. That?s a zero to 5 yard play vs the sec.

With the separation and protection in that game, we should have been playing pitch and catch.

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Originally Posted by Maroonthirteen

He threw for a ton of yards because our athletes are so much better than sFA. We had yards of separation. The first pass that Hill ran for a TD (that are credited as passing yards) was because Hill
Out ran their defense after the catch for 50 yards. That?s a zero to 5 yard play vs the sec.

With the separation and protection in that game, we should have been playing pitch and catch.

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Done arguing this. Cut KT and give the starting job to the guy living in Pennsylvania currently.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Good post. If KT is fine with Stevens coming here I'll be fine with it too. I just don't want to lose two years of KT for one year of Stevens. I think KT is that good.

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What are you seeing that most of us are not? I really want to know, because I want KT to be good, but I just don't see him being successful in this offense. I mean the supposed "IT" factor he has isn't helping him pick up this offense. He's just not a passing QB. He's more along the lines of Fitz but slightly more accurate. He's a statue in the pocket and has a bad tendency to stare down receivers. He also underthrows a lot of deep balls which has been mentioned before. One or two deep balls its ok, but a majority of his are underthrown and this offense thrives on blowing the top off the defense and throwing the deep ball. Again, I think KT is a great athlete and if Dan is still HC we aren't having this conversation.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

Peyton Manning threw under thrown deep balls all the time. It's a 50/50 ball. WR can never catch it when it's ten yards over their head. Wayne Madkin used to do that all the time and I couldn't stand it. This is one thing (among many others) that Alabama and Saban are so much better at understanding and implementing than we have ever been. When they throw deep the QB puts a ton of loft on it basically making it the easiest of possible catches for a receiver. I don't get caught up on how nice a pass looks or how great a qbs completion % is. Tim Tebow got robbed of a 5+ starting career because everyone was obsessed with the optics of passes and completion %. He won games, was a great runner and an elite leader.

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Those throws were NOT a 50/50 throw. What are you watching? He just could not physically get the ball to the WR. Even though they had 10 yards of separation completely around them (the only time all year they were that open as well)

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

What are you seeing that most of us are not?

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There were more than a couple that were vying for KT to be the starter before the season started last year. He had good showings vs Ole Miss and Louisville. So what happened to all those KT fans? Oh it's cause he missed a couple of throws in a total blowout game that he scored 7 tds and had 473 total yards in only 3 quarters. 7 touchdowns in 3 quarters is difficult vs air. Also he got a series vs aTm and their 3 straight full blitzes straight up the middle and was supposed to do something against that but since 6 guys can't block 8 dudes sprinting straight at them KT no longer gets to have a great future here. Instead let's give it to the career backup at PSU.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Those throws were NOT a 50/50 throw. What are you watching? He just could not physically get the ball to the WR. Even though they had 10 yards of separation completely around them (the only time all year they were that open as well)

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5 tds thrown in 3 quarters. I'll wait for you to find another game in MSU history a QB did that in only 3 quarters in his 2nd career start. I'll even make it easier for you if you can find another one in any start of their career to do that in just 3 quarters.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

There were more than a couple that were vying for KT to be the starter before the season started last year. He had good showings vs Ole Miss and Louisville. So what happened to all those KT fans? Oh it's cause he missed a couple of throws in a total blowout game that he scored 7 tds and had 473 total yards in only 3 quarters. 7 touchdowns in 3 quarters is difficult vs air. Also he got a series vs aTm and their 3 straight full blitzes straight up the middle and was supposed to do something against that but since 6 guys can't block 8 dudes sprinting straight at them KT no longer gets to have a great future here. Instead let's give it to the career backup at PSU.

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You'd think by that third blitz KT would have dumped the ball to the TE. Somebody was wide the **** open on those blitzes. KT met an SEC level defense.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

There were more than a couple that were vying for KT to be the starter before the season started last year. He had good showings vs Ole Miss and Louisville. So what happened to all those KT fans? Oh it's cause he missed a couple of throws in a total blowout game that he scored 7 tds and had 473 total yards in only 3 quarters. 7 touchdowns in 3 quarters is difficult vs air. Also he got a series vs aTm and their 3 straight full blitzes straight up the middle and was supposed to do something against that but since 6 guys can't block 8 dudes sprinting straight at them KT no longer gets to have a great future here. Instead let's give it to the career backup at PSU.

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He didn’t look very good throwing vs UNM or Louisville either. With the EB it was mainly all the fumbles as well he coughed up. Come on dude. I think he COULD be really really good. He is a good runner now. But he hasn’t shown enough passing. And this has nothing to do with Stevens. I have not mentioned him at all

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

5 tds thrown in 3 quarters. I'll wait for you to find another game in MSU history a QB did that in only 3 quarters in his 2nd career start. I'll even make it easier for you if you can find another one in any start of their career to do that in just 3 quarters.

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3 interceptions and 1 maybe 2 passing TD’s and 150-175 yards tops is what he would have had against any defense with a pulse. Bring up the SFA all you want, I’ve posted the video numerous times, that was a bad overall passing performance in actuality. And so was Louisville. But SFA game is the definition of stats looking much better than actual performance.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

I think it was challenging in the sense that you have a record setting QB at running the ball who was the face of the program coming off of a pretty horrific injury that was dirty...but at the same time he was also a known party animal, got suspended in game one, and was very inaccurate. I think we were solid at RB, TE, and C/G. That's only about half of the offense. People talk about how good Dan was- but this offense put up similar numbers all told in 2017 and 2018. People can scream but...?.but.....CONFERENCE games.....all they want to. This offense also blew out all of our OOC opponents- Dan did not one out of four times. Not complaining because we usually still won and that's all that matters plus everyone has an off day. Point is that's a far cry from Crooooom-esque. We also hung 52 on Arkansas and 35 on the road against Ole Miss in what was probably honestly the best all around Egg Bowl I have ever seen us play as I was not alive in 1909 or whatever year it was that we beat Ole Miss 65-0. We also scored in the 20's against A&M and Auburn which was good enough to win and those were quality SEC teams. All of that tells me it wasn't the system and that we need to add talent to the roster. Because when we are getting beat by LSU and allowing 17 and Alabama and allow 24 that tells me we are there on defense in terms of talent because there have definitely been times in other years where the defense wasn't "there" yet either.

I also find it interesting that Joe has now taken over as the OC since Getsy left. That makes me wonder how much was called by Joe vs Getsy and it makes me wonder if Joe disagreed with a lot of what Getsy was calling- however much that may have been. It kind of reminds me of when Les Koenning left and Dan took over as the OC after 2013. The whole reason why Dan hired Les was so he could focus on being the head coach until he realized that he could handle both calling plays and managing the team. Perhaps Joe had the same thought in year one?

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Getsy didn't call a single play. Not one. He was oc in title like Hevesy and Billy were. That's all

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

There were more than a couple that were vying for KT to be the starter before the season started last year. He had good showings vs Ole Miss and Louisville. So what happened to all those KT fans? Oh it's cause he missed a couple of throws in a total blowout game that he scored 7 tds and had 473 total yards in only 3 quarters. 7 touchdowns in 3 quarters is difficult vs air. Also he got a series vs aTm and their 3 straight full blitzes straight up the middle and was supposed to do something against that but since 6 guys can't block 8 dudes sprinting straight at them KT no longer gets to have a great future here. Instead let's give it to the career backup at PSU.

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Yep. I am on the KT train. I thought he should have started last year. If he had, we would have won exactly the same number of games and we would be better off for it today. The worst thing about KT is that Staley processed himself at the same time as Tiano. KT should be a RS soph right now, but nope he had to play as a young freshman.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

What are you seeing that most of us are not? I really want to know, because I want KT to be good, but I just don't see him being successful in this offense. I mean the supposed "IT" factor he has isn't helping him pick up this offense. He's just not a passing QB. He's more along the lines of Fitz but slightly more accurate. He's a statue in the pocket and has a bad tendency to stare down receivers. He also underthrows a lot of deep balls which has been mentioned before. One or two deep balls its ok, but a majority of his are underthrown and this offense thrives on blowing the top off the defense and throwing the deep ball. Again, I think KT is a great athlete and if Dan is still HC we aren't having this conversation.

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To me, none of that is indicative of anything other than being a normal true freshman and true sophomore.

My only concern with KT is that as bad as qb play was at times this year, Moorhead still didn't feel like KT could do any better. For all I know, maybe that was more a reflection of Moorhead's thoughts on Fitz and what it would do to his psyche, and not any indication of Moorhead's thoughts on KT's long term potential at QB. But it's concerning.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

There were more than a couple that were vying for KT to be the starter before the season started last year. He had good showings vs Ole Miss and Louisville. So what happened to all those KT fans? Oh it's cause he missed a couple of throws in a total blowout game that he scored 7 tds and had 473 total yards in only 3 quarters. 7 touchdowns in 3 quarters is difficult vs air. Also he got a series vs aTm and their 3 straight full blitzes straight up the middle and was supposed to do something against that but since 6 guys can't block 8 dudes sprinting straight at them KT no longer gets to have a great future here. Instead let's give it to the career backup at PSU.

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He looked like a true freshman caught in the headlights versus Ole Miss, but showed athletic ability. He didnt' lose the game against a Sirmon coached defense.

I think what happened to the KT fans is that they watched us be completely lost at times for QB play without Moorhead being tempted to go to KT. That may not be fair, but on the otherhand, it's also ridiculous to think that going after a QB at this point means KT doesn't have a future here. Lots of good QB's only have the reigns for their RS JR and Sr seasons. I suspect for a lot of QBs playing before then their coaches wish they had had the luxury of keeping them in a backup role until then. The only thing that really sucks for KT is that if we get a new QB that beats him out, he will have to spend his third year RSing and getting limited snaps rather than RSing his first year and then spending his third year getting as many snaps as possible as the backup.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

What are you seeing that most of us are not? I really want to know, because I want KT to be good, but I just don't see him being successful in this offense. I mean the supposed "IT" factor he has isn't helping him pick up this offense. He's just not a passing QB. He's more along the lines of Fitz but slightly more accurate. He's a statue in the pocket and has a bad tendency to stare down receivers. He also underthrows a lot of deep balls which has been mentioned before. One or two deep balls its ok, but a majority of his are underthrown and this offense thrives on blowing the top off the defense and throwing the deep ball. Again, I think KT is a great athlete and if Dan is still HC we aren't having this conversation.

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I want Stevens to come because I think it will HELP KT. Not because I want to get rid of him. All the MSU experts are saying that KT probably won't transfer if we get Stevens so I think the running him off thing is WAY overblown and isn't based on anything tangible.

Who gives a damn who the QB is? Just put the best one out there. I have little faith in any of them until they’re put under that starting SEC QB spotlight and show they can handle it. None of them have done that to this point.

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Originally Posted by Johnson85

He looked like a true freshman caught in the headlights versus Ole Miss, but showed athletic ability. He didnt' lose the game against a Sirmon coached defense.

I think what happened to the KT fans is that they watched us be completely lost at times for QB play without Moorhead being tempted to go to KT. That may not be fair, but on the otherhand, it's also ridiculous to think that going after a QB at this point means KT doesn't have a future here. Lots of good QB's only have the reigns for their RS JR and Sr seasons. I suspect for a lot of QBs playing before then their coaches wish they had had the luxury of keeping them in a backup role until then. The only thing that really sucks for KT is that if we get a new QB that beats him out, he will have to spend his third year RSing and getting limited snaps rather than RSing his first year and then spending his third year getting as many snaps as possible as the backup.

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The good news about that is the new redshirt rule at least allows him to play in four games this year. Which is by my math 1/3 of the games which is a lot for most back-up QB's all things considered unless the starter gets hurt.