MSU vs USM Game 1 thread

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

Last 2 innings I didn't think we looked good at the plate and seemed a little anxious. But then reading I see a lot of hard hit balls right at folks for the game. So I might would say it like "make the pitcher give you a good pitch to hit until you get to 2 strikes then swing at anything close. Be patient at the plate". But that is hitting 101 right there.

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Well, hitting is not easy.** I think there is a fine line between being too passive and too aggressive. Obviously, you want to get your pitch to hit and crush it. I know I oversimplified because I don't want to get all into situational baseball- getting a fly ball to get a sac fly, hitting the ball to the right side, bunting, and etc.

To me, if our scouting report said to attack him early because he likes to throw fastballs basically over the plate to get strike one- that's fine. But when it doesn't go to plan you have to adapt a little bit. And that's the part I have an issue with- assuming that our plan was to attack early in the count. Which I honestly don't know if that was the plan on offense or not- but even if it wasn't we still didn't adjust so it doesn't really matter. So, I'm giving our coaches some benefit of the doubt there because I don't know- but there is no question the lack of adjustments is why we got shut out.

I guess to answer your question if a guy is getting us out on first and second pitches we need to make an adjustment of some kind whether that is trying to work the count or maybe trying to hit the ball to the opposite field, maybe try a drag bunt when the game was tied if the third baseman is back and it's not one of our power guys.

Here's what Lemonis said:

"Chris Lemonis said this isn't a very good Mississippi State offense right now. He doesn't think the team is working well enough as a nine-man unit. Not making pitchers work hard enough to get a rally going."

I wonder if there is some kind of problem going on because Lemonis and Gautreau both teach hitting. I know Lemonis said he was an offensive guy who was going go teach hitting. Maybe they don't teach the same way, and it's causing a problem.

I?m not liking our approach at the plate, especially first time thru the order. I think we have been told to be aggressive but the hitters are going a little overboard.

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Originally Posted by Dawg2003

I wonder if there is some kind of problem going on because Lemonis and Gautreau both teach hitting. I know Lemonis said he was an offensive guy who was going go teach hitting. Maybe they don't teach the same way, and it's causing a problem.

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I don't think so because we only struck out 4 times in 10 innings and we're hitting the ball hard. I think it's more of an overaggressive approach issue and potentially a matter of some guys making some adjustments at the plate.

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Originally Posted by sleepy dawg

They're good, don't be stupid. They'll be top 25 all year.

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We'll see. They didn't look that talented to me.

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Originally Posted by AlSwearengen

I?m not liking our approach at the plate, especially first time thru the order. I think we have been told to be aggressive but the hitters are going a little overboard.

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We need something in between today and Tommy Raffo.

Except for Jake Mangum.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Well, hitting is not easy.** I think there is a fine line between being too passive and too aggressive. Obviously, you want to get your pitch to hit and crush it. I know I oversimplified because I don't want to get all into situational baseball- getting a fly ball to get a sac fly, hitting the ball to the right side, bunting, and etc.

To me, if our scouting report said to attack him early because he likes to throw fastballs basically over the plate to get strike one- that's fine. But when it doesn't go to plan you have to adapt a little bit. And that's the part I have an issue with- assuming that our plan was to attack early in the count. Which I honestly don't know if that was the plan on offense or not- but even if it wasn't we still didn't adjust so it doesn't really matter. So, I'm giving our coaches some benefit of the doubt there because I don't know- but there is no question the lack of adjustments is why we got shut out.

I guess to answer your question if a guy is getting us out on first and second pitches we need to make an adjustment of some kind whether that is trying to work the count or maybe trying to hit the ball to the opposite field, maybe try a drag bunt when the game was tied if the third baseman is back and it's not one of our power guys.

Here's what Lemonis said:

"Chris Lemonis said this isn't a very good Mississippi State offense right now. He doesn't think the team is working well enough as a nine-man unit. Not making pitchers work hard enough to get a rally going."

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I was just trying to understand what everyone was getting at. As I said I only watched last 2 innings. I'm with you on the scouting report stuff but if the first 8 innings there were hard hit balls all over, then I would tend to think the approach wasn't way off. But if Lemonis wants to make the pitcher work deep into the count based on what he's saying and the scouting report then maybe they didn't execute the plan.

I also think that days like this happen in baseball. Baseball of all sports is a sport you're gonna lose quite a few games. USM is pretty good team I believe.

If we're aggressive we will live by it and die by it. We can't hit the ball a ton if we don't swing the bat early in the count.

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Originally Posted by I seen it dawg

At one point in the 9th we had 7 first pitch outs and 12 in first 2 pitches. Horrible approach. Time to reign the hitters back in but Lemonis has a lot to talk to them about.

Have to have 2 lefty out of the pen and Barlow gonna have to be one of them with Eagan. I leave him in as long as he was in today to see if he can get the job done and get the 3rd out there to the LH hitter. He failed. But he can be a quality option out of the pen we just have to remember he's coming off injury. Don't throw him away yet.

We pitched it fantastic, made all the plays with a couple of outstanding ones, we simply hit like we were trying to play in an hour long game. Will see how hitters react next time out. Not end of the world there's a whole lot of these to be played.

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I like aggressive hitting but you can't be undisciplined. We didn't make Powell break a sweat today. After the first time through the order it would've been nice to see us take some pitches instead of making so many first pitch outs. Have to adjust some. Early in the year gonna take some lumps. Our lineup is deep just have to show a little more patience. Our pitching is OUTSTANDING! Southern can hit and we put a cork in em.

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Originally Posted by Dawg2003

I wonder if there is some kind of problem going on because Lemonis and Gautreau both teach hitting. I know Lemonis said he was an offensive guy who was going go teach hitting. Maybe they don't teach the same way, and it's causing a problem.

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Doubt it. I think it's all in the approach. Nothing to do with form or mechanics, just our standards for when to swing. Be a little more selective early in counts. Our 2 strike approach is fine. Our ability to see and read the pitches seems fine. It's just early in the count we go "Hey a FB inside! it's a strike so I'll swing at it even though I was sitting on something outside and this will jam me".

I've been very vocal in my criticism about this but it's easily fixed

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

I was just trying to understand what everyone was getting at. As I said I only watched last 2 innings. I'm with you on the scouting report stuff but if the first 8 innings there were hard hit balls all over, then I would tend to think the approach wasn't way off. But if Lemonis wants to make the pitcher work deep into the count based on what he's saying and the scouting report then maybe they didn't execute the plan.

I also think that days like this happen in baseball. Baseball of all sports is a sport you're gonna lose quite a few games. USM is pretty good team I believe.

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USM is good- but we should have done better on offense and when you shut out someone over 9 IP and strike out a ton of the opposing hitters you should win 10 out of 10 times. What makes it frustrating is approach is something our players have more control of than a lot of things in baseball.

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

Doubt it. I think it's all in the approach. Nothing to do with form or mechanics, just our standards for when to swing. Be a little more selective early in counts. Our 2 strike approach is fine. Our ability to see and read the pitches seems fine. It's just early in the count we go "Hey a FB inside! it's a strike so I'll swing at it even though I was sitting on something outside and this will jam me".

I've been very vocal in my criticism about this but it's easily fixed

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Exactly!

JoeMo say MSU Baseball Offense is worse than his.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

USM is good- but we should have done better on offense and when you shut out someone over 9 IP and strike out a ton of the opposing hitters you should win 10 out of 10 times. What makes it frustrating is approach is something our players have more control of than a lot of things in baseball.

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No argument there. Sounds like we were undisciplined at the plate today. Still early in the year tho IMO. Won't lose too much sleep over it right now.

ETA: It's not quite like when Smoltz pitched lights out against the Twins in Series in '91 and still lost.

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

Doubt it. I think it's all in the approach. Nothing to do with form or mechanics, just our standards for when to swing. Be a little more selective early in counts. Our 2 strike approach is fine. Our ability to see and read the pitches seems fine. It's just early in the count we go "Hey a FB inside! it's a strike so I'll swing at it even though I was sitting on something outside and this will jam me".

I've been very vocal in my criticism about this but it's easily fixed

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Yep. Exactly.

Ugly day when our hitters get owned by a guy throwing 85 mph with 2 k's. Gotta be patient and barrel up the slop. Blue wasn't helping them much either though. His strike zone was gigantic and inconsistent from what I saw.

Find a way to win the next two, and today will be a minor hiccup

Some of you need to back away and STFU. It?s week one. Our hitting will be fine once we see game pitching a few weeks. We crushed several balls that didn?t fall. We didn?t stand up there K?ing. If the pitcher is filling up the zone, you?re more aggressive. We shouldn?t need to wear that 85 mph guy down. We should pound him and we will once we get settled in.

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Originally Posted by CadaverDawg

A loss isn't the worst thing in the world, but 10 innings vs USM with 0 runs is a bit concerning

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Lemonis ran JoMo's offense today.***

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

I also think that days like this happen in baseball. Baseball of all sports is a sport you're gonna lose quite a few games. USM is pretty good team I believe.

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The problem is that this essentially happened 2 days ago as well against a very average UAB team. We were lucky as heck to win a 3-2 game that we only managed 3 hits in. Of course then it was just blown off as Ashcraft being 'on'. Apparently every pitcher we face not from YSU is on so far.