Giving Croom credit

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Originally Posted by drunkernhelldawg

Of all the ridiculous ideas, this one is a star. The idea that Jackie left us in good shape after the three years he'd put us through is mythmaking at its most dishonest.

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Where in anyone's response has anyone said JWS left us in good shape?? No one has said that only that the players he left had some talent and with the low level of competition we played after that, a good coach could have gotten us bowl eligible is the point.

As others have posted, I liked some of the things Croom stood for but his lack of appreciation for MSU at the end for giving him 5 years is offensive considering the disaster he left our program. Some disagree but the mess Croom left is nothing compared to what JWS left. Mullen made us competitive just with coaching in year 1 with only sparse talent.

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

Where in anyone's response has anyone said JWS left us in good shape?? No one has said that only that the players he left had some talent and with the low level of competition we played after that, a good coach could have gotten us bowl eligible is the point.

As others have posted, I liked some of the things Croom stood for but his lack of appreciation for MSU at the end for giving him 5 years is offensive considering the disaster he left our program. Some disagree but the mess Croom left is nothing compared to what JWS left. Mullen made us competitive just with coaching in year 1 with only sparse talent.

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Between the people on the team and the people that were committed to Croom, there was a decent amount of NFL talent on the roster. That was one reason that Mullen was able to turn it around so quickly. It helps when you inherit a team with a 1st round LT and the leading rusher in MSU history. Any competent head coach could have got us to 6 wins Mullen's second year. Mullen however was a good coach and got us to 9 wins but the talent was there to go bowling.

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Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe

Between the people on the team and the people that were committed to Croom, there was a decent amount of NFL talent on the roster. That was one reason that Mullen was able to turn it around so quickly. It helps when you inherit a team with a 1st round LT and the leading rusher in MSU history. Any competent head coach could have got us to 6 wins Mullen's second year. Mullen however was a good coach and got us to 9 wins but the talent was there to go bowling.

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Other than AD and a couple other players what great talent was on that first team Mullen had not a freshman or that actually played much his first year? Talent comment did not include freshmen as other than Cox, I don't remember any big impact freshmen. Cox wasn't all pro DT Cox his freshman year either - good for a freshman yes but I am talking about talent that played Dan's first year. Again other than freshman, Croom had the same talent the game before getting bounced 45-0 in egg bowl.

Can we lock this?

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Originally Posted by drunkernhelldawg

Of all the ridiculous ideas, this one is a star. The idea that Jackie left us in good shape after the three years he'd put us through is mythmaking at its most dishonest.

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Which is probably why nobody has made that argument. We had what was possibly the easiest schedule we have played since I've been a fan. Everybody in the West was down except LSU and Auburn and then we got the two worst teams from the East. So we have 4 games we win with solid coaching in conference, then Bama and FLorida that we could be competitive with, before having Main, UAB, and Tulane for OOC wins. Just going chalk in the OOC and beating 3 of the 4 worst SEC teams gets us to 6-5. We could have pretty reasonably gone 7-4 without beating a decent team. If we played that type of schedule today, people would be living if we did worse than 9-2.

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Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe

Between the people on the team and the people that were committed to Croom, there was a decent amount of NFL talent on the roster. That was one reason that Mullen was able to turn it around so quickly. It helps when you inherit a team with a 1st round LT and the leading rusher in MSU history. Any competent head coach could have got us to 6 wins Mullen's second year. Mullen however was a good coach and got us to 9 wins but the talent was there to go bowling.

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This is selective memory. Croom left some really good pieces and a roster with some gigantic holes. Not everybody just any competent coach could have taken a team with Relf or a RS Tyler RUssell (who probably would have been the starter if we have any coach other than Mullen b/c Relf wouldn't have improved as much and we likely wouldn't have had an offense that made use of his strengths).

Ole Miss, UK, Florida, UGA, and @Houston we all games we could have lost with a competent coach. I think there's a pretty decent chance we would have lost UK, FLorida, UGA, and ole Miss. We likely wouldn't have lost them all

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

Other than AD and a couple other players what great talent was on that first team Mullen had not a freshman or that actually played much his first year? Talent comment did not include freshmen as other than Cox, I don't remember any big impact freshmen. Cox wasn't all pro DT Cox his freshman year either - good for a freshman yes but I am talking about talent that played Dan's first year. Again other than freshman, Croom had the same talent the game before getting bounced 45-0 in egg bowl.

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Ignoring the freshmen, looking at the roster and going off memory:
Charles Mitchell was a good safety.
McRae and Leon Berry were decent if not great wide receivers.
Maurice Langston was a solid CB.
Wade Bonner was a solid safety.
Jamar Chaney was a very good linebacker.
Dixon was a very good RB.
Christian Ducre was a good RB.
KJ Wright was a very good LB.
Patrick Hanrahan was a solid fullback.
Depasquale was a good kicker
Saulsberry was a good OG
Addison Lawrence was a solid OL (not sure if he played that year though)
DJ Looney was a good OL (again, not sure if he was good yet)
Brignone was a good Center
Derek Sherrod was a very good OT
Kyle Love was a good DL

Had major holes at free Safety and QB that were damn near debilitating, and some of those I likely am giving credit for how good they were a year or two later, but there were pieces for Mullen to work with, especially on defense.

ON offense, I think that first year was Mullen's best jobs his entire time at MSU as far as taking advantage of the playmakers he had on offense.

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Originally Posted by Johnson85

Ignoring the freshmen, looking at the roster and going off memory:
Charles Mitchell was a good safety.
McRae and Leon Berry were decent if not great wide receivers.
Maurice Langston was a solid CB.
Wade Bonner was a solid safety.
Jamar Chaney was a very good linebacker.
Dixon was a very good RB.
Christian Ducre was a good RB.
KJ Wright was a very good LB.
Patrick Hanrahan was a solid fullback.
Depasquale was a good kicker
Saulsberry was a good OG
Addison Lawrence was a solid OL (not sure if he played that year though)
DJ Looney was a good OL (again, not sure if he was good yet)
Brignone was a good Center
Derek Sherrod was a very good OT
Kyle Love was a good DL

Had major holes at free Safety and QB that were damn near debilitating, and some of those I likely am giving credit for how good they were a year or two later, but there were pieces for Mullen to work with, especially on defense.

ON offense, I think that first year was Mullen's best jobs his entire time at MSU as far as taking advantage of the playmakers he had on offense.

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I agree. Mullen did a good job in 09, probably should have been a 7-8 win team. Got screwed vs LSU and a Houston team that had maybe 1 loss on the season

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

Other than AD and a couple other players what great talent was on that first team Mullen had not a freshman or that actually played much his first year? Talent comment did not include freshmen as other than Cox, I don't remember any big impact freshmen. Cox wasn't all pro DT Cox his freshman year either - good for a freshman yes but I am talking about talent that played Dan's first year. Again other than freshman, Croom had the same talent the game before getting bounced 45-0 in egg bowl.

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Go back and look at the roster. KJ Wright, Pernell McPhee, Kyle Love, and Derek Sherrod (1st round LT). That is without even looking at the roster. Doesn't count Cox, Gabe Jackson, and other guys in that recruiting class that was already committed.

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Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****

I agree. Mullen did a good job in 09, probably should have been a 7-8 win team. Got screwed vs LSU and a Houston team that had maybe 1 loss on the season

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We ran into the #1 strength of schedule that year. Mullen did a great job with that schedule.

To summarize this thread for the people too young to remember the 2000s. It sucked.

If you lived through 2003 and 2004, you really appreciated 2014. The final minutes of the Auburn game might have made you cry. Dan cried.

From losing to Maine to being #1 in the Nation... for 5 weeks

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Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead

Can we lock this?

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Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer

To summarize this thread for the people too young to remember the 2000s. It sucked.

If you lived through 2003 and 2004, you really appreciated 2014. The final minutes of the Auburn game might have made you cry. Dan cried.

From losing to Maine to being #1 in the Nation... for 5 weeks

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I'm trying to figure out how this thing has made it 10 pages?

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

I'm trying to figure out how this thing has made it 10 pages?

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Apparently some people are really nostalgic about MSU being a total and complete laughingstock and just generally sucking dick.