Our fans remind me of the scouts in MoneyBall

[cheewgumm]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.

[BeardoMSU]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.

https://media.tenor.com/hC0jXa6bmuAAAAAC/adapt-or.gif

[Santiago]

Except we do not have a Billy Bean mastermind on campus.
I would say the scouts remind me of a few of Arnett's staff members, hiring their buddies and having a group think and in his ear.

[EdwardDrayton]

Fans have drawn the line in the sand. They are not willing to pay for the seats, concessions, parking, travel, food, hotels AND fund the players. So that's not the play here. It's get this mess fixed with a sustainable model.

[Homedawg]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.

Yes. Factual

[StarkVegasSteve]

Fans have drawn the line in the sand. They are not willing to pay for the seats, concessions, parking, travel, food, hotels AND fund the pleyers. So that's not the play here. It's get this mess fixed with a sustainable model.

No, OUR fans have drawn a line in the sand. OM fans continue to fund it because they see a payoff with a brash HC, exciting offense, and a buy in from their administration from the top down. And again, I am no ever going to tell someone how to spend the money they work hard for, but either you adapt to this model or be ok with it being 2005 every year. Because that is what will happen. There is no sustainable model. They opened the Pandora?s box with no safeguards around it and they will never be able to put it back in the box.

[EdwardDrayton]

No, OUR fans have drawn a line in the sand. OM fans continue to fund it because they see a payoff with a brash HC, exciting offense, and a buy in from their administration from the top down. And again, I am no ever going to tell someone how to spend the money they work hard for, but either you adapt to this model or be ok with it being 2005 every year. Because that is what will happen. There is no sustainable model. They opened the Pandora?s box with no safeguards around it and they will never be able to put it back in the box.

There is no transparency so there is no way to know this. It's merely a hypothetical until proven.

[cheewgumm]

If our fans have decided not to fund NIL (our choice) then things will only get worse, Not better.

Knute Rockne can be the coach and it wont matter.

You fund it , we compete.
You dont, we dont.

All these other arguments are for teams that have the players. We are not at the point to even know if Arnett is good or bad.

He brought a rock to a gunfight.

[THE Bruce Dickinson]

No, OUR fans have drawn a line in the sand. OM fans continue to fund it because they see a payoff with a brash HC, exciting offense, and a buy in from their administration from the top down. And again, I am no ever going to tell someone how to spend the money they work hard for, but either you adapt to this model or be ok with it being 2005 every year. Because that is what will happen. There is no sustainable model. They opened the Pandora?s box with no safeguards around it and they will never be able to put it back in the box.

This is a good post.

Ive heard so many of our fans say "Nobody was paying players when I was in school"! Well no they weren't- at least not openly, but times have changes. We can't have our cake and eat it too. Either we pony up or we will not be competitive. We are already behind the 8-ball due to the size of our alumni base. We can either make a conscious effort to try to keep up or we will be in the cellar. There is no middle.

[cheewgumm]

Can we get the sports admin students to take in the task of building the monthly donation install base?

They can be at every game (every sport) signing people up for $20 or more per month.

Simple easy.

That is their only job - increase the qty of people giving (a small amount) monthly. Thats it:

Charlie can talk to big donors - the sports admin interns build the monthly revenue base.

[StarkVegasSteve]

There is no transparency so there is no way to know this. It's merely a hypothetical until proven.

There is plenty of transparency. You just have to know where to look.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Can we get the sports admin students to take in the task of building the monthly donation install base?

They can be at every game (every sport) signing people up for $20 or more per month.

Simple easy.

That is their only job - increase the qty of people giving (a small amount) monthly. Thats it:

Charlie can talk to big donors - the sports admin interns build the monthly revenue base.

Probably a good idea, but just warn them that there will be plenty of people they talk to that will bitch at them for asking for money.

[Coursesuper]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.

You get it!

[EdwardDrayton]

There is plenty of transparency. You just have to know where to look.

Then post it for all to see.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Then post it for all to see.

Tulu is 6 figures and all the others being paid (Johnson, Watson, Rodgers, Thomas, Marks, etc) are low to mid 5 figures.

[EdwardDrayton]

Tulu is 6 figures and all the others being paid (Johnson, Watson, Rodgers, Thomas, Marks, etc) are low to mid 5 figures.

So $250,000 in round numbers. Source? And what are other teams spending?

[StarkVegasSteve]

So $250,000 in round numbers. Source? And what are other teams spending?

Between 250-450. Other teams our size (USCe, Mizzou, UK) are spending around 10x what we are. Our problem is we spend too much on baseball. We need to spend 10 percent of our NIL on baseball, 25 percent on basketball, and the rest on football

[Lord McBuckethead]

This is a good post.

Ive heard so many of our fans say "Nobody was paying players when I was in school"! Well no they weren't- at least not openly, but times have changes. We can't have our cake and eat it too. Either we pony up or we will not be competitive. We are already behind the 8-ball due to the size of our alumni base. We can either make a conscious effort to try to keep up or we will be in the cellar. There is no middle.

With this coaching staff? Hm. They took a defense that could play defense and destroyed it. The took an offense that could play offense and wholesale changed it.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Between 250-450. Other teams our size (USCe, Mizzou, UK) are spending around 10x what we are. Our problem is we spend too much on baseball. We need to spend 10 percent of our NIL on baseball, 25 percent on basketball, and the rest on football
Well it looks like we need to consolidate some schools to compete then. Because I am not giving my kids money for their future to a program that can?t even figure out how a sound system works.

[HRTFXR]

As absurd as it sounds because, let’s face it, we’re talking about MILLIONS of dollars being spent currently. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR. If the University, City of Starkville, and fan base don’t embrace the statistical correlation between high levels of achievement in the major athletic programs and corresponding increases in both numbers and qualifications of university student applications, the entire ecosystem is going to be relegated to abject mediocracy.

[EdwardDrayton]

Between 250-450. Other teams our size (USCe, Mizzou, UK) are spending around 10x what we are. Our problem is we spend too much on baseball. We need to spend 10 percent of our NIL on baseball, 25 percent on basketball, and the rest on football

Other teams our size? Do you mean student enrollment?

[StarkVegasSteve]

Other teams our size? Do you mean student enrollment?

Alumni and donor base size.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Well it looks like we need to consolidate some schools to compete then. Because I am not giving my kids money for their future to a program that can?t even figure out how a sound system works.

And I agree with you. I think there has to be buy in from the administration and athletic dept to get people excited and wanting to donate. Other schools do that?..we do not.

[EdwardDrayton]

Alumni and donor base size.

Fair to say alumni of significant means funding the difference at the other schools? Because at $250-$450 I'm thinking our significant means folks are not weighing in too heavily. Except for contributions to academics of course.

[Homedawg]

Other teams our size? Do you mean student enrollment?

Sorry wrong person

[Homedawg]

Between 250-450. Other teams our size (USCe, Mizzou, UK) are spending around 10x what we are. Our problem is we spend too much on baseball. We need to spend 10 percent of our NIL on baseball, 25 percent on basketball, and the rest on football

When someone cuts you a check and says I want it going to basketball, are we supposed to say no?? And there are people that solely give to hoops.

[StarkVegasSteve]

When someone cuts you a check and says I want it going to basketball, are we supposed to say no?? And there are people that solely give to hoops.

Again, as I said earlier, I am never going to tell someone how to spend the money they worked hard for. However, at our current donation rate, if a majority of our donations are not going to football then we will not be successful in either retaining current talent or getting new talent into the program.

[R2Dawg]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.

If someone wants to give go ahead but suggesting our problem last night was NIL is ignorant. Bama has as much money as anyone and we are one player away from playing them down to the wire. TAMU more money than anyone and it ain't got them nothing. We spent some NIL what did it get us? Fact is nothing.

Will a player here or there be bought? Sure. Could it make a difference down the road for a few teams if they spend 100 million, maybe but there ain't enough money to buy all the good players. Yes the blue bloods have been and will always be that for various reasons. You saw the stripped reasons last night again with Bama. More money will always flow to those schools, that is fact.

[cheewgumm]

R2

Is your point that we do or do not need to raise more money to pay for better players?

[R2Dawg]

R2

Is your point that we do or do not need to raise more money to pay for better players?

Can some players be bought, sure. My point is it had nothing to do with last night and just cause you spend some money don't mean automatic results. Bama got 50X more money than we do and give us Fitz, Shrader, Keyton, etc. last night and we are down to wire with Bama. Has anyone had success buying a championship team? No. Teams been trying for years and got no more to show than we do.

Only so much money and there are a lot of good players out there.

Now years from now, will there be a handful of money teams with all the players, could be but I don't think it is going to be as bad as everyone predicts. We already had that for decades already - Bama, OSU, UGA, etc. etc. The good teams been good a long time.

[Coursesuper]

Can some players be bought, sure. My point is it had nothing to do with last night and just cause you spend some money don't mean automatic results. Bama got 50X more money than we do and give us Fitz, Shrader, Keyton, etc. last night and we are down to wire with Bama. Has anyone had success buying a championship team? No. Teams been trying for years and got no more to show than we do.

Only so much money and there are a lot of good players out there.

Now years from now, will there be a handful of money teams with all the players, could be but I don't think it is going to be as bad as everyone predicts. We already had that for decades already - Bama, OSU, UGA, etc. etc. The good teams been good a long time.

Let me know for sure, is ignorance bliss?

[EdwardDrayton]

Can some players be bought, sure. My point is it had nothing to do with last night and just cause you spend some money don't mean automatic results. Bama got 50X more money than we do and give us Fitz, Shrader, Keyton, etc. last night and we are down to wire with Bama. Has anyone had success buying a championship team? No. Teams been trying for years and got no more to show than we do.

Only so much money and there are a lot of good players out there.

Now years from now, will there be a handful of money teams with all the players, could be but I don't think it is going to be as bad as everyone predicts. We already had that for decades already - Bama, OSU, UGA, etc. etc. The good teams been good a long time.

Where are you seeing Bama is spending $15 million? We need to source these spending figures to get a documented picture of what's being spent. SVS is saying we're spending around $300,000; maybe some of you who know can back him as a bona fide source. And some other schools (KY, SC etc) are spending $3,000,000 according to him.

[cheewgumm]

Doest matter how much they are spending.

We need more money.

We will always need more.

[EdwardDrayton]

Doest matter how much they are spending.

We need more money.

We will always need more.

You're never going to get people to buy in unless you help them understand with documented information.

[EdwardDrayton]

Can some players be bought, sure. My point is it had nothing to do with last night and just cause you spend some money don't mean automatic results. Bama got 50X more money than we do and give us Fitz, Shrader, Keyton, etc. last night and we are down to wire with Bama. Has anyone had success buying a championship team? No. Teams been trying for years and got no more to show than we do.

Only so much money and there are a lot of good players out there.

Now years from now, will there be a handful of money teams with all the players, could be but I don't think it is going to be as bad as everyone predicts. We already had that for decades already - Bama, OSU, UGA, etc. etc. The good teams been good a long time.

Are we getting value for what we're spending is a significant question. In some individual cases it's at least questionable.

[Fader21]

If I was getting some return on my investment, I would be in on it. Yes, I get the return is wins on the field, but I want to have a fun family experience. Not just looking at a 65 year old female drop it like its hot multiple times on the Jumbotron, or a 40 year old in a oversized hat being a human bobblehead multiple times. (those were literally the loudest cheers of the night, last night)

[SpaceWranglerDawg]

The whole NIL system is stupid. We will forever be behind the eight ball due to our size, lack of willingness and the types of professionals that we graduate. I firmly believe the vast majority of our fan base just doesn't care.

[EdwardDrayton]

The whole NIL system is stupid. We will forever be behind the eight ball due to our size, lack of willingness and the types of professionals that we graduate. I firmly believe the vast majority of our fan base just doesn't care.

I'd bet our majority is no different from any other. And intuitively I'd bet folks of significant means are making a big difference elsewhere.

[Dawgology]

My hope with the NIL is that the money will eventually get so significant that you will have 40-50 universities that break off and make their own conference and basically create an NFL minor league. Then the smaller alumni base/financed schools like ours can get back to true amateur athletes composed of actual student athletes. I would gladly travel to state each weekend to watch that. These days I enjoy high school football more than what college football has become.

[StarkVegasSteve]

If I was getting some return on my investment, I would be in on it. Yes, I get the return is wins on the field, but I want to have a fun family experience. Not just looking at a 65 year old female drop it like its hot multiple times on the Jumbotron, or a 40 year old in a oversized hat being a human bobblehead multiple times. (those were literally the loudest cheers of the night, last night)

That is the biggest problem why we have a bunch of people that are still on the fence are off the fence completely. We do not play an exciting brand of football and our gameday atmosphere is a dud. The entrance is good. I like the video and I like the garage doors opening. It is a cool way to come onto the field, but after that it is crickets. Most of our fans rely too much on cowbells to do everything and do not get into the ballgame. Add on to that, our stadium is consistently taken over by any fan base that remotely travels well.

[Maroonthirteen]

The whole premise of money ball was to identify and acquire talent by unorthodox means with a limited budget.

I feel that's what Mississippi State has always done. It seems to me, Leachs staff (including Arnett) were not very good at recruiting as Sherrill and Mullen's staffs.

[StarkVegasSteve]

My hope with the NIL is that the money will eventually get so significant that you will have 40-50 universities that break off and make their own conference and basically create an NFL minor league. Then the smaller alumni base/financed schools like ours can get back to true amateur athletes composed of actual student athletes. I would gladly travel to state each weekend to watch that. These days I enjoy high school football more than what college football has become.

And we will still have the same lame ass gameday atmosphere. We will still have the stupid Maroon and White chant, blue hairs yelling “another T”, no one standing, and we will probably still roll out the MF atmosphere killer of them all, The Kiss Cam.

[StarkVegasSteve]

The whole premise of money ball was to identify and acquire talent by unorthodox means with a limited budget.

I feel that's what Mississippi State has always done. It seems to me, Leachs staff (including Arnett) were not very good at recruiting as Sherrill and Mullen's staffs.

No they were actually better at recruiting from a rankings standpoint. However, Sherill relied on JUCO guys who were ready to go from Day 1 and Mullen developed better than any coach we have ever had. Not many players made leaps under Leach and Co. They were the same player as a junior/senior as they were a freshman. There are a few exceptions but they are just that, exceptions.

[R2Dawg]

And we will still have the same lame ass gameday atmosphere. We will still have the stupid Maroon and White chant, blue hairs yelling “another T”, no one standing, and we will probably still roll out the MF atmosphere killer of them all, The Kiss Cam.

Heck get rid of the cowbell while you are at it, the old generation did it so it can't be any good. Some of you need to grow up and show a little respect for your elders. Someone saying "another T" is really that big a deal? I'm not saying a few things need to go. I'm for bad to bone going but some of the things this board complains about is just plain little girlish.

[R2Dawg]

No they were actually better at recruiting from a rankings standpoint. However, Sherill relied on JUCO guys who were ready to go from Day 1 and Mullen developed better than any coach we have ever had. Not many players made leaps under Leach and Co. They were the same player as a junior/senior as they were a freshman. There are a few exceptions but they are just that, exceptions.

Things have changed. I don't think the JUCO talent is as good as it was back in the 90s. I may be wrong.

Here is why I think that is so. Back then JUCO took players who didn't have the academics - they went to JUCO got all cleaned up ready for D1 ball. Well today there are no standards anymore so no more need to send good players to JUCO. Just cheat their papers for D1, pay some NIL money and good to go. The money pot we've had an advantage in for decades i think is now dried up.

[EdwardDrayton]

Heck get rid of the cowbell while you are at it, the old generation did it so it can't be any good. Some of you need to grow up and show a little respect for your elders. Someone saying "another T" is really that big a deal? I'm not saying a few things need to go. I'm for bad to bone going but some of the things this board complains about is just plain little girlish.

I've seen a couple of those interactions go beyond the discussion stage, and the younger pup learned an old dog still can get it done. So be careful out there you young folks.

[Coursesuper]

My hope with the NIL is that the money will eventually get so significant that you will have 40-50 universities that break off and make their own conference and basically create an NFL minor league. Then the smaller alumni base/financed schools like ours can get back to true amateur athletes composed of actual student athletes. I would gladly travel to state each weekend to watch that. These days I enjoy high school football more than what college football has become.

I firmly believe that this is where D1 is headed. I don't think that it will be good for our institution. There will be the haves that are in the big $$ TV deal and the rest of us. We will end up in an AAC type situation.

[cheewgumm]

Edward, if our fans cant understand that raising more money to buy better players makes sense without some type of documentation then those fans just need to not give.it is so apparent that I fear if I bothered to slowly explain it to them, they would simply find some other reason not so give.

They can just not give would be my solution.

I get her point ot Money Ball?I am only using the narrow view of the scene to show illustrate that our fans are not seeing the problem. Im not saying that we need to find some genius way to out saber metric then other teams. We need more $.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Things have changed. I don't think the JUCO talent is as good as it was back in the 90s. I may be wrong.

Here is why I think that is so. Back then JUCO took players who didn't have the academics - they went to JUCO got all cleaned up ready for D1 ball. Well today there are no standards anymore so no more need to send good players to JUCO. Just cheat their papers for D1, pay some NIL money and good to go. The money pot we've had an advantage in for decades i think is now dried up.

Yep Mississippi JUCO is nothing like it used to be. Northwest had Cortez Kennedy at DL and Gerald Perry at OL when I was up there and that wasnt even one of their better teams.

[Dawgology]

Edward, if our fans cant understand that raising more money to buy better players makes sense without some type of documentation then those fans just need to not give.it is so apparent that I fear if I bothered to slowly explain it to them, they would simply find some other reason not so give.

They can just not give would be my solution.

I get her point ot Money Ball?I am only using the narrow view of the scene to show illustrate that our fans are not seeing the problem. Im not saying that we need to find some genius way to out saber metric then other teams. We need more $.

I donate…a good bit. I don’t know where the money goes. There is no accountability. I also am seeing no returns not even any interesting byproducts. No news. No other investment agency asks or requires that of you. And it IS and investment not a donation.

[gtowndawg]

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/DtumWOsgFXc/maxresdefault.jpg

"His girlfriend is ugly. Means he has no confidence."

[Maroonthirteen]

With NIL there needs to be a members conference.

The conference could present our products and the guys we are looking at for spokesmen. Then here is what we need to hawk more products and get even more guys to be spokesmen.

Oh and here are the guys that are hawking for other schools products and what it take to get them in our camp.

I say that in jest because I know it will never happen. "Just give us money and we will decided what to do with it." Meanwhile is there any top rated MS recruits considering us?

[Dawgology]

With NIL there needs to be a members conference.

The conference could present our products and the guys we are looking at for spokesmen. Then here is what we need to hawk more products and get even more guys to be spokesmen.

Oh and here are the guys that are hawking for other schools products and what it take to get them in our camp.

I say that in jest because I know it will never happen. "Just give us money and we will decided what to do with it." Meanwhile is there any top rated MS recruits considering us?

This is the issue. You can’t get on social media and crow about a million+ increase in NIL over one week but produce subpar on field results and accomplish little to nothing in recruiting. Seems like a scam.

[Goldendawg]

Edward, if our fans cant understand that raising more money to buy better players makes sense without some type of documentation then those fans just need to not give.it is so apparent that I fear if I bothered to slowly explain it to them, they would simply find some other reason not so give.

They can just not give would be my solution.

I get her point ot Money Ball?I am only using the narrow view of the scene to show illustrate that our fans are not seeing the problem. Im not saying that we need to find some genius way to out saber metric then other teams. We need more $.

We are by no means where we need to be but, Charlie Winfield posted in a recent thread that everyone of our FB players now have an NIL deal and it is in its best shape to date (Charlie, please correct me if I read the post incorrectly). Think he said we will move forward on HS recruits deals in addition to retention of players. A lot in on our square pegs into round holes new coaching staff "schemes" have contributed at 2-3, but ROI is poor to date. Hail State!

[Todd4State]

We are by no means where we need to be but, Charlie Winfield posted in a recent thread that everyone of our FB players now have an NIL deal and it is in its best shape to date (Charlie, please correct me if I read the post incorrectly). Think he said we will move forward on HS recruits deals in addition to retention of players. A lot in on our square pegs into round holes new coaching staff "schemes" have contributed at 2-3, but ROI is poor to date. Hail State!

I think our biggest issue with NIL is we were a little behind in getting it up and running up to speed. Charlie may have saved MSU athletics in the long run.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I think our biggest issue with NIL is we were a little behind in getting it up and running up to speed. Charlie may have saved MSU athletics in the long run.

John Cohen and Lee Van Horn tried to ruin MSU athletics, Charlie saved it. We are about 18 months behind everyone else.

[SpaceWranglerDawg]

I firmly believe that this is where D1 is headed. I don?t think that it will be god for our institution. There will be the haves that are in the big $$ TV deal and the rest of us. We will end up in an AAC type situation.

Yep, we will be left in the dust... There is literally nothing about the NIL that gives us an advantage... We will forever be playing catchup to the larger schools. Buckle up, it's going to be a frustrating ride.

On that note, Fight On and Who Dat...let me get away from this alcoholism inducing lifestyle of mississippi state fandom.

[Maverick91]

This issue boils down to optics. As it has been said over and over and over again, our fan base is not only small, but we are more than likely lower in the middle class than most fan basses so the ease of excess money to throw at kids that aren?t our actual blood is a hard sale.

The things this admin needs to do is sale the benefits that out way the odds. They can start with me, while I have a baby on the way, excess money is going 100% to the needs of her for when she arrives.

Why would I throw any money at a program right now, that does currently have money. Do we have the war chest of bama, no! But we do have money. Also why invest more when it?s clear that our admin doesn?t care, Tater made a really good post about how bad the stadium atmosphere was Saturday. This also doesn?t include the abundance of meddling that is taking place from high boosters in our coaching staff.

The above doesn?t even factor in the free 4 year degree, room and board, meals, clothes, travel, fame, chance of a lifetime to get into the NFL. You want me on top of all of that to give my hard earned money to these kids to do what? Play pitch and catch? They already earn the fair trade items listed above to play pitch and catch. This was supposed to be about NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS not just a check in their hands.

It?s hard enough to watch NFL because it?s all about the money and not playing a long good career. These kids in college are doing the same thing, they follow the money except it?s just give these kids money to come, at least in the NFL usually they have to prove they are worth a bigger check before that payday.

If the admin would fix their side of things, I actually would think about throwing a few bucks at it, but until then why? It seems to go into a money pit that like our football program will get mismanaged.

[Dawgology]

This issue boils down to optics. As it has been said over and over and over again, our fan base is not only small, but we are more than likely lower in the middle class than most fan basses so the ease of excess money to throw at kids that aren?t our actual blood is a hard sale.

The things this admin needs to do is sale the benefits that out way the odds. They can start with me, while I have a baby on the way, excess money is going 100% to the needs of her for when she arrives.

Why would I throw any money at a program right now, that does currently have money. Do we have the war chest of bama, no! But we do have money. Also why invest more when it?s clear that our admin doesn?t care, Tater made a really good post about how bad the stadium atmosphere was Saturday. This also doesn?t include the abundance of meddling that is taking place from high boosters in our coaching staff.

The above doesn?t even factor in the free 4 year degree, room and board, meals, clothes, travel, fame, chance of a lifetime to get into the NFL. You want me on top of all of that to give my hard earned money to these kids to do what? Play pitch and catch? They already earn the fair trade items listed above to play pitch and catch. This was supposed to be about NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS not just a check in their hands.

It?s hard enough to watch NFL because it?s all about the money and not playing a long good career. These kids in college are doing the same thing, they follow the money except it?s just give these kids money to come, at least in the NFL usually they have to prove they are worth a bigger check before that payday.

If the admin would fix their side of things, I actually would think about throwing a few bucks at it, but until then why? It seems to go into a money pit that like our football program will get mismanaged.

Exactly. I never thought I would enjoy NFL more than college but here we are. I know NFL players are there for the bucks and pride in the name on their jersey has little to do with it. I can deal with that because those standards are set up front. College football used to be about pride in the university. The “pageantry and pride” stuff is dead but Disney and the other owners of the brand are still pushing it as a gimmick. College football is dead in the sense of what it once stood for. I’m ready for the Div-0 football. Let the universities far with cash start that and let us get back to student athletes fighting on the gridiron for school colors.

[Maverick91]

Exactly. I never thought I would enjoy NFL more than college but here we are. I know NFL players are there for the bucks and pride in the name on their jersey has little to do with it. I can deal with that because those standards are set up front. College football used to be about pride in the university. The “pageantry and pride” stuff is dead but Disney and the other owners of the brand are still pushing it as a gimmick. College football is dead in the sense of what it once stood for. I’m ready for the Div-0 football. Let the universities far with cash start that and let us get back to student athletes fighting on the gridiron for school colors.

I’m down for it, now if they would actually make NIL about NIL I would be for it and could get behind it. Right now I just cannot get behind this scam. You want my money in this economy show me you are doing the right things to earn it. The admin isn’t!

[EdwardDrayton]

This issue boils down to optics. As it has been said over and over and over again, our fan base is not only small, but we are more than likely lower in the middle class than most fan basses so the ease of excess money to throw at kids that aren?t our actual blood is a hard sale.

The things this admin needs to do is sale the benefits that out way the odds. They can start with me, while I have a baby on the way, excess money is going 100% to the needs of her for when she arrives.

Why would I throw any money at a program right now, that does currently have money. Do we have the war chest of bama, no! But we do have money. Also why invest more when it?s clear that our admin doesn?t care, Tater made a really good post about how bad the stadium atmosphere was Saturday. This also doesn?t include the abundance of meddling that is taking place from high boosters in our coaching staff.

The above doesn?t even factor in the free 4 year degree, room and board, meals, clothes, travel, fame, chance of a lifetime to get into the NFL. You want me on top of all of that to give my hard earned money to these kids to do what? Play pitch and catch? They already earn the fair trade items listed above to play pitch and catch. This was supposed to be about NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS not just a check in their hands.

It?s hard enough to watch NFL because it?s all about the money and not playing a long good career. These kids in college are doing the same thing, they follow the money except it?s just give these kids money to come, at least in the NFL usually they have to prove they are worth a bigger check before that payday.

If the admin would fix their side of things, I actually would think about throwing a few bucks at it, but until then why? It seems to go into a money pit that like our football program will get mismanaged.

OK stay with me here but if the numbers we're being told are accurate, we're spending around $300-$400 thousand and KY & SC are spending $3 million. Hard to believe our alumni/donor base is less affluent than those. Intuitively would say those of significant means are responsible for that differential and not the general base. And maybe that's because Cohen did not embrace it from the beginning. But isn't that supposed to be one of Zac's strengths or is he not allowed to petition for NIL.

[Maverick91]

OK stay with me here but if the numbers we're being told are accurate, we're spending around $300-$400 thousand and KY & SC are spending $3 million. Hard to believe our alumni/donor base is less affluent than those. Intuitively would say those of significant means are responsible for that differential and not the general base. And maybe that's because Cohen did not embrace it from the beginning. But isn't that supposed to be one of Zac's strengths or is he not allowed to petition for NIL.

I haven’t heard if that’s one of his strengths or not. But he does petition for it, he brings up the Bulldog Initiative a few times in his press conferences.

[Coursesuper]

This issue boils down to optics. As it has been said over and over and over again, our fan base is not only small, but we are more than likely lower in the middle class than most fan basses so the ease of excess money to throw at kids that aren?t our actual blood is a hard sale.

The things this admin needs to do is sale the benefits that out way the odds. They can start with me, while I have a baby on the way, excess money is going 100% to the needs of her for when she arrives.

Why would I throw any money at a program right now, that does currently have money. Do we have the war chest of bama, no! But we do have money. Also why invest more when it?s clear that our admin doesn?t care, Tater made a really good post about how bad the stadium atmosphere was Saturday. This also doesn?t include the abundance of meddling that is taking place from high boosters in our coaching staff.

The above doesn?t even factor in the free 4 year degree, room and board, meals, clothes, travel, fame, chance of a lifetime to get into the NFL. You want me on top of all of that to give my hard earned money to these kids to do what? Play pitch and catch? They already earn the fair trade items listed above to play pitch and catch. This was supposed to be about NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS not just a check in their hands.

It?s hard enough to watch NFL because it?s all about the money and not playing a long good career. These kids in college are doing the same thing, they follow the money except it?s just give these kids money to come, at least in the NFL usually they have to prove they are worth a bigger check before that payday.

If the admin would fix their side of things, I actually would think about throwing a few bucks at it, but until then why? It seems to go into a money pit that like our football program will get mismanaged.

This bullshit is proof that our alumni and fan base just don?t get it. The conference is running circles around us, hell the rest of the country on our level is running circles around us and yet we hear this diatribe. The only optics that matter are do you have the talent to compete and win in the big time. That?s it. You have a base willing to win or not. Auburn just hired Hugh Fing Freezus, do you think they give a shit about optics, nope, they don?t care, just win. That?s the game it?s simple. You win and you survive if not MSU will be in the Funbelt within 5 years.

[EdwardDrayton]

This bullshit is proof that our alumni and fan base just don?t get it. The conference is running circles around us, hell the rest of the country on our level is running circles around us and yet we hear this diatribe. The only optics that matter are do you have the talent to compete and win in the big time. That?s it. You have a base willing to win or not. Auburn just hired Hugh Fing Freezus, do you think they give a shit about optics, nope, they don?t care, just win. That?s the game it?s simple. You win and you survive if not MSU will be in the Funbelt within 5 years.

Auburn is 0-2 in conference. Not sure you want to sail your ship with the Freeze Flag.

[Coursesuper]

Auburn is 0-2 in conference. Not sure you want to sail your ship with the Freeze Flag.

Jesus, again as a group we are so shortsighted. Given time and the resources that they have it is a matter of time, they will acquire the talent and will win. They gave UGA all they wanted, the guy is a terrible human being but he can coach.

[Homedawg]

Auburn is 0-2 in conference. Not sure you want to sail your ship with the Freeze Flag.
His point is valid. What their record is now is irrelevant. They will get better players and are. And will get back to auburn level.

[StarkVegasSteve]

This bullshit is proof that our alumni and fan base just don?t get it. The conference is running circles around us, hell the rest of the country on our level is running circles around us and yet we hear this diatribe. The only optics that matter are do you have the talent to compete and win in the big time. That?s it. You have a base willing to win or not. Auburn just hired Hugh Fing Freezus, do you think they give a shit about optics, nope, they don?t care, just win. That?s the game it?s simple. You win and you survive if not MSU will be in the Funbelt within 5 years.

I think another thing is with the people that are on the fence about donating is that they want to know EXACTLY where their money is going. And I get that, but NIL needs change by the day, if not the hour. I understand the want to say I helped buy/keep that player, but the problem is that the minute they do that then other teams can figure out exactly how much we are giving a specific kid and up their offer. Right now that is mostly generalities unless you know someone really on the inside. I think another thing people want is access and benefits to go along with their donations.

[Ezsoil]

Trying to define the problem.

?We need a new coach?
?Change the QB?
?We run too much?
?Why arent we running??

If you want to know our problem, watch that scene.

NIL = more $ = better players = more wins = you being happy

Sign up for $20 / month.


In actuality it's you who has the mentality of the scouts..... the whole point of the scene is you have to change how you evaluate players and not buy the free agent players the same ole way.....blindly throwing money in to an NIL fund solves nothing without changing how you evaluate and develop talent as the smallest public school in the conference. Until someone figures out a way to find undervalued and under recruited players ....MSU will always be behind the pack.

[Ezsoil]

OK stay with me here but if the numbers we're being told are accurate, we're spending around $300-$400 thousand and KY & SC are spending $3 million. Hard to believe our alumni/donor base is less affluent than those. Intuitively would say those of significant means are responsible for that differential and not the general base. And maybe that's because Cohen did not embrace it from the beginning. But isn't that supposed to be one of Zac's strengths or is he not allowed to petition for NIL.


Yes not only is our fan base less affluent, we are vastly smaller.....farmers and engineers do not make as much money as doctors and lawyers....throw in the fact that they have five times the number of alumni that we have and you see that we have to find innovative ways to compete.

[Maverick91]

This bullshit is proof that our alumni and fan base just don?t get it. The conference is running circles around us, hell the rest of the country on our level is running circles around us and yet we hear this diatribe. The only optics that matter are do you have the talent to compete and win in the big time. That?s it. You have a base willing to win or not. Auburn just hired Hugh Fing Freezus, do you think they give a shit about optics, nope, they don?t care, just win. That?s the game it?s simple. You win and you survive if not MSU will be in the Funbelt within 5 years.

Step off the high horse boss. This is reality, if the athletic department cares (which I don’t think they do) they would be fighting to change the alumni perspective. Even if we brought in top talent guess who is still running that talent? The lackluster athletic department.

[Maverick91]

I think another thing is with the people that are on the fence about donating is that they want to know EXACTLY where their money is going. And I get that, but NIL needs change by the day, if not the hour. I understand the want to say I helped buy/keep that player, but the problem is that the minute they do that then other teams can figure out exactly how much we are giving a specific kid and up their offer. Right now that is mostly generalities unless you know someone really on the inside. I think another thing people want is access and benefits to go along with their donations.

I just want to know that I am donating to an athletic department that wants to win. Right now, I don’t think they care to win, I think they want to stay right where they are. There are no movers and shakers in our department I was hoping that Selmon would be that but to date I haven’t seen it. Verdict is still out there. So, why am I going to donate just to stay right where we are? We have all talked about it, this university sits on cash we don’t spend it. If we spent the money we get we could compete well.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I just want to know that I am donating to an athletic department that wants to win. Right now, I don’t think they care to win, I think they want to stay right where they are. There are no movers and shakers in our department I was hoping that Selmon would be that but to date I haven’t seen it. Verdict is still out there. So, why am I going to donate just to stay right where we are? We have all talked about it, this university sits on cash we don’t spend it. If we spent the money we get we could compete well.

Well when you donate to NIL you are not donating to the athletic dept.

[cheewgumm]

Our fan base could easily come up with 25,000 fans to give $20 / month.

That?s 67 cents per day.

We can afford that.

That would be $6m per year.

We wont do it (as evidence fed by this thread) but to act like it?s is impossible is short sighted at best.

[Coursesuper]

Step off the high horse boss. This is reality, if the athletic department cares (which I don’t think they do) they would be fighting to change the alumni perspective. Even if we brought in top talent guess who is still running that talent? The lackluster athletic department.

Welcome to the Funbelt bro.

[cheewgumm]

In actuality it's you who has the mentality of the scouts..... the whole point of the scene is you have to change how you evaluate players and not buy the free agent players the same ole way.....blindly throwing money in to an NIL fund solves nothing without changing how you evaluate and develop talent as the smallest public school in the conference. Until someone figures out a way to find undervalued and under recruited players ....MSU will always be behind the pack.

I addressed this, as I knew people would say this. After all people on here pick apart every minute detail and ignore the point.

[Maverick91]

Well when you donate to NIL you are not donating to the athletic dept.

My point is that I think if our athletic department showed that they actually want to win more people would give.

[Maverick91]

Welcome to the Funbelt bro.

We would be in the funbelt no matter how much NIL we gave. The athletic department doesn’t want to win big.

[Todd4State]

This issue boils down to optics. As it has been said over and over and over again, our fan base is not only small, but we are more than likely lower in the middle class than most fan basses so the ease of excess money to throw at kids that aren?t our actual blood is a hard sale.

The things this admin needs to do is sale the benefits that out way the odds. They can start with me, while I have a baby on the way, excess money is going 100% to the needs of her for when she arrives.

Why would I throw any money at a program right now, that does currently have money. Do we have the war chest of bama, no! But we do have money. Also why invest more when it?s clear that our admin doesn?t care, Tater made a really good post about how bad the stadium atmosphere was Saturday. This also doesn?t include the abundance of meddling that is taking place from high boosters in our coaching staff.

The above doesn?t even factor in the free 4 year degree, room and board, meals, clothes, travel, fame, chance of a lifetime to get into the NFL. You want me on top of all of that to give my hard earned money to these kids to do what? Play pitch and catch? They already earn the fair trade items listed above to play pitch and catch. This was supposed to be about NAME IMAGE AND LIKENESS not just a check in their hands.

It?s hard enough to watch NFL because it?s all about the money and not playing a long good career. These kids in college are doing the same thing, they follow the money except it?s just give these kids money to come, at least in the NFL usually they have to prove they are worth a bigger check before that payday.

If the admin would fix their side of things, I actually would think about throwing a few bucks at it, but until then why? It seems to go into a money pit that like our football program will get mismanaged.

Our football program needs a reboot. Badly.

If this goes sideways this offseason will be a big test for MSU.

Our brand is boring, our coach looks in over his head and appears to be relying on advice from a high school coach.

At least we get to see the interlocking MSU back soon- hopefully a step to making it permanent.

We also aren't a major player in recruiting and we consistently undervalue that.

[Maroonthirteen]

Our fan base could easily come up with 25,000 fans to give $20 / month.

That?s 67 cents per day.

We can afford that.

st.

Im not hating on your idea. I wish it would happen. However, just FYI, there is only 14,000+ in the Bulldog Club. Also, I am pretty sure, if you bought season tickets and gave $1,000 just this year, your ranking would be under 10,000.

[Cooterpoot]

This bullshit is proof that our alumni and fan base just don?t get it. The conference is running circles around us, hell the rest of the country on our level is running circles around us and yet we hear this diatribe. The only optics that matter are do you have the talent to compete and win in the big time. That?s it. You have a base willing to win or not. Auburn just hired Hugh Fing Freezus, do you think they give a shit about optics, nope, they don?t care, just win. That?s the game it?s simple. You win and you survive if not MSU will be in the Funbelt within 5 years.

Our administration has been way worse than the fans. It's not close. They give the school millions from from our athletic budget and then rainy day fund millions instead of putting it into recruiting to help level the field. We prioritized 17ing baseball over everything. That's as dumb as it gets. We can't even get our damn new logo on the scoreboard but other schools have it on theirs when we go there. We've been so poorly operated by the good ole boys selling blue collar bullshit for so long the fans are finally sick of it.
I'm waiting to see how this circus of a football program goes the next two months to decide if I need to invest my money somewhere else. If we keep the circus in town after a losing record, I'm out. If they straighten out things, & win games or we fire Amatuer Hour for sucking, Im increasing my investment. Either MSU invests in the program, or they need to stop asking people to.

[Coursesuper]

Our administration has been way worse than the fans. It's not close. They give the school millions from from our athletic budget and then rainy day fund millions instead of putting it into recruiting to help level the field. We prioritized 17ing baseball over everything. That's as dumb as it gets. We can't even get our damn new logo on the scoreboard but other schools have it on theirs when we go there. We've been so poorly operated by the good ole boys selling blue collar bullshit for so long the fans are finally sick of it.
I'm waiting to see how this circus of a football program goes the next two months to decide if I need to invest my money somewhere else. If we keep the circus in town after a losing record, I'm out. If they straighten out things, & win games or we fire Amatuer Hour for sucking, Im increasing my investment. Either MSU invests in the program, or they need to stop asking people to.

This sense of entitlement is the problem now and has been for a long long time and it and the fractures with in our base and the want for control are our biggest road blocks it. Just cant understand the basic premise that we are the university. This has always has been and seems that it always will be our issue. I'm not saying the admins are perfect but, the spectacular lack of vision of our alumni and base is a death sentence at this juncture. It's get on board with the current situation or die, we have been dying slowly for a long time and it getting faster every day. I see this ending poorly for our school. When we get shuffled out, oh that's coming, it will hit the university hard. Non revenue sports will struggle mightily and cuts across the board will happen university wide. The athletes we have been able to attract are gone up the road is all sports. Y'all better get used to the home games with Troy, Jacksonville State and Ark State and those great road trips to Layfette, Monroe and Mobile. It s simple math now and its rolling at us like a steamroller.

[Cooterpoot]

This sense of entitlement is the problem now and has been for a long long time and it and the fractures with in our base and the want for control are our biggest road blocks it. Just cant understand the basic premise that we are the university. This has always has been and seems that it always will be our issue. I'm not saying the admins are perfect but, the spectacular lack of vision of our alumni and base is a death sentence at this juncture. It's get on board with the current situation or die, we have been dying slowly for a long time and it getting faster every day. I see this ending poorly for our school. When we get shuffled out, oh that's coming, it will hit the university hard. Non revenue sports will struggle mightily and cuts across the board will happen university wide. The athletes we have been able to attract are gone up the road is all sports. Y'all better get used to the home games with Troy, Jacksonville State and Ark State and those great road trips to Layfette, Monroe and Mobile. It s simple math now and its rolling at us like a steamroller.

Dude, the fans have vision. It's why they're so loud now. The school leadership is short-sighted. John Cohen refused to even get involved with NIL and attempted to prioritize 17ing baseball. Our leaders allowed that. Our boosters were ok with that too. The realization is football is the life-blood of athletics and we hire Arnett? We don't even attempt to get a good coach? Nobody else in the SEC would do that. Come the 17 on!!! We good ole boy the shit out of everything. We take care of too much dead weight because they're "State people". I was hoping Selmon would fix some things but he's buddies with the coaches and isn't communicating with the fan base at all. He and Arnett hocking their family goods on SEC Nation was embarrassing! We need leadership at the university. It's simply not there.

[Coursesuper]

Dude, the fans have vision. It's why they're so loud now. The school leadership is short-sighted. John Cohen refused to even get involved with NIL and attempted to prioritize 17ing baseball. Our leaders allowed that. Our boosters were ok with that too. The realization is football is the life-blood of athletics and we hire Arnett? We don't even attempt to get a good coach? Nobody else in the SEC would do that. Come the 17 on!!! We good ole boy the shit out of everything. We take care of too much dead weight because they're "State people". I was hoping Selmon would fix some things but he's buddies with the coaches and isn't communicating with the fan base at all. He and Arnett hocking their family goods on SEC Nation was embarrassing! We need leadership at the university. It's simply not there.

Most everything your saying is irrelevant at is point and as far a vision most can't see the forest for the trees. John Cohen is gone and his leadership helped to handcuff us for sure. I agree the hire probably wasn't the one to make and we are in very bad situation. This is due to exactly to the what is was talking about. I don't know much about what this AD is doing, maybe you do, but changes are happening, don't know if its good or bad yet. As far as our overall situation, its a dire one, something that you and most here completely miss. If things continue to go south with football our $$$ maker we will get shuffled back as realignment continues to sort itself out. The situation right now is $$ for athletes. It's pay for play and those that are willing pay are going to survive and those that can't will go the way of Wazzu and Ore State. Is the current state of affairs sustainable? I don't think so but it is what it is. That's where the breakdown is, the pettiness of I cant get my way so I'm not giving only serves to put this university and its interest further and further behind the eight ball. So, its up to us to fund the damn thing and maybe survive or not and seal our fate.

[Cooterpoot]

Most everything your saying is irrelevant at is point and as far a vision most can't see the forest for the trees. John Cohen is gone and his leadership helped to handcuff us for sure. I agree the hire probably wasn't the one to make and we are in very bad situation. This is due to exactly to the what is was talking about. I don't know much about what this AD is doing, maybe you do, but changes are happening, don't know if its good or bad yet. As far as our overall situation, its a dire one, something that you and most here completely miss. If things continue to go south with football our $$$ maker we will get shuffled back as realignment continues to sort itself out. The situation right now is $$ for athletes. It's pay for play and those that are willing pay are going to survive and those that can't will go the way of Wazzu and Ore State. Is the current state of affairs sustainable? I don't think so but it is what it is. That's where the breakdown is, the pettiness of I cant get my way so I'm not giving only serves to put this university and its interest further and further behind the eight ball. So, its up to us to fund the damn thing and maybe survive or not and seal our fate.

ROI matters. The fans can't constantly fight the admin/booster headwinds. That's got to change. We won't have a P5 program if they want to keep this a big club instead of actually pushing to be good. Fans don't want to support that club.

[Coursesuper]

ROI matters. The fans can't constantly fight the admin/booster headwinds. That's got to change. We won't have a P5 program if they want to keep this a big club instead of actually pushing to be good. Fans don't want to support that club.

I give up. Just don't get it. The only thing your correct on is we wont be P5 for much longer.

[Maroonthirteen]

I don't think we are about to relegated to the sunbelt for one losing season. However I do wonder if there is something fundamentally wrong in the Bryan building or the relationship between the big money boosters and the Bryan building. Because Stricklin leaving was a head scratcher.... but ok it's Florida. However then the next AD, who is a former MSU athlete, leaving for another sec rival... what the hell is going on here? Not a good sign.

[ArrowDawg]

OM fans continue to fund it because they see a payoff with a brash HC, exciting offense, and a buy in from their administration from the top down.

And we have none of those things at State. We have a cheap, old school mentality. You have to believe your money is going to make a difference.

[Maverick91]

This sense of entitlement is the problem now and has been for a long long time and it and the fractures with in our base and the want for control are our biggest road blocks it. Just cant understand the basic premise that we are the university. This has always has been and seems that it always will be our issue. I'm not saying the admins are perfect but, the spectacular lack of vision of our alumni and base is a death sentence at this juncture. It's get on board with the current situation or die, we have been dying slowly for a long time and it getting faster every day. I see this ending poorly for our school. When we get shuffled out, oh that's coming, it will hit the university hard. Non revenue sports will struggle mightily and cuts across the board will happen university wide. The athletes we have been able to attract are gone up the road is all sports. Y'all better get used to the home games with Troy, Jacksonville State and Ark State and those great road trips to Layfette, Monroe and Mobile. It s simple math now and its rolling at us like a steamroller.

We can give all day long, but if the people “admin” don’t do the right things with the money. Nothing will change, it goes and sits and waists away. It is bureaucracy at its best. Why can you not see that?

[Maverick91]

Most everything your saying is irrelevant at is point and as far a vision most can't see the forest for the trees. John Cohen is gone and his leadership helped to handcuff us for sure. I agree the hire probably wasn't the one to make and we are in very bad situation. This is due to exactly to the what is was talking about. I don't know much about what this AD is doing, maybe you do, but changes are happening, don't know if its good or bad yet. As far as our overall situation, its a dire one, something that you and most here completely miss. If things continue to go south with football our $$$ maker we will get shuffled back as realignment continues to sort itself out. The situation right now is $$ for athletes. It's pay for play and those that are willing pay are going to survive and those that can't will go the way of Wazzu and Ore State. Is the current state of affairs sustainable? I don't think so but it is what it is. That's where the breakdown is, the pettiness of I cant get my way so I'm not giving only serves to put this university and its interest further and further behind the eight ball. So, its up to us to fund the damn thing and maybe survive or not and seal our fate.

I will be shocked if State is out to pasture. We are a founding member of the SEC and we have the brinks trucks to use if we need to. That’s cooters point, we have the money we just chose to hoard it. For reasons I cannot understand.

[Coursesuper]

I will be shocked if State is out to pasture. We are a founding member of the SEC and we have the brinks trucks to use if we need to. That’s cooters point, we have the money we just chose to hoard it. For reasons I cannot understand.

Exactly where is this money?

[Fader21]

Yes not only is our fan base less affluent, we are vastly smaller.....farmers and engineers do not make as much money as doctors and lawyers....throw in the fact that they have five times the number of alumni that we have and you see that we have to find innovative ways to compete.

I would say farmers and engineers make around the same amount of money, its just that Farmers have to pay for more things which takes a way their net income.

[SpaceWranglerDawg]

Our fan base could easily come up with 25,000 fans to give $20 / month.

That?s 67 cents per day.

We can afford that.

That would be $6m per year.

We wont do it (as evidence fed by this thread) but to act like it?s is impossible is short sighted at best.

You're 100% correct, we won't do it. It'll never happen. Too much push back.

Welcome to the beginning of the end! Going to be a bumpy ride! Sunbelt here we come!

[Maverick91]

Exactly where is this money?

That’s not exactly, you have been saying this whole time “we have to cough up the money” now you are saying the admin has to cough up the money? I’m confused.

[Maverick91]

You're 100% correct, we won't do it. It'll never happen. Too much push back.

Welcome to the beginning of the end! Going to be a bumpy ride! Sunbelt here we come!

The issue is the admin has not pushed this, they won’t. That would have been the first thing I did if I was selmon was create a marketing drive to get 20-50 bucks a month donations. If that would have happened things would seem a lot different right now.

[Coursesuper]

That’s not exactly, you have been saying this whole time “we have to cough up the money” now you are saying the admin has to cough up the money? I’m confused.

Where did I say that? I asked where this Brinks truck of $$$ is.

[Maverick91]

Where did I say that? I asked where this Brinks truck of $$$ is.

Bro… wouldn’t we all like to know. Chilling in some bank making some banker a TON of money and not being invested in any of the activities on campus. If their was a national championship for financial responsibility State would probably win it every year.

[Cooterpoot]

We've routinely hoarded $10-15MM a year in rainy day funds. At least cut that in half to help football. Lowest recruiting budget is instantly corrected. Pay a legitimate coach and staff what it takes to get them. Don't Arnett the shit out of everything. Stop paying "State people" to 17 up.
Selmon should've been the right move, and he's done some things. I'm not ready to throw him out or anything. He just needs to step up communications a bit. I'll give him a year to get completely settled because the job isn't easy.

[Coursesuper]

[QUOTE=Maverick91;1544173]Bro… wouldn’t we all like to know. Chilling in some bank making some banker a TON of money and not being invested in any of the activities on campus. If their was a national championship for financial responsibility State would probably win it every year.[/QUOTE

Damn, its amazing the BS people will believe. I should know better but alas. I guess I now understand why Rosebowl has such a easy time peddling his propaganda.

[Cooterpoot]

[QUOTE=Maverick91;1544173]Bro… wouldn’t we all like to know. Chilling in some bank making some banker a TON of money and not being invested in any of the activities on campus. If their was a national championship for financial responsibility State would probably win it every year.[/QUOTE

Damn, its amazing the BS people will believe. I should know better but alas. I guess I now understand why Rosebowl has such a easy time peddling his propaganda.

You mean like Nike owning our logo? That kinda BS? LOL

[Homedawg]

[QUOTE=Maverick91;1544173]Bro… wouldn’t we all like to know. Chilling in some bank making some banker a TON of money and not being invested in any of the activities on campus. If their was a national championship for financial responsibility State would probably win it every year.[/QUOTE

Damn, it's amazing the BS people will believe. I should know better but alas. I guess I now understand why Rosebowl has such an easy time peddling his propaganda.
Correct

[Maverick91]

[QUOTE=Maverick91;1544173]Bro… wouldn’t we all like to know. Chilling in some bank making some banker a TON of money and not being invested in any of the activities on campus. If their was a national championship for financial responsibility State would probably win it every year.[/QUOTE

Damn, its amazing the BS people will believe. I should know better but alas. I guess I now understand why Rosebowl has such a easy time peddling his propaganda.

What’s BS about my statement? We both agree that we hoard money for reasons that are never explained to us, why would it not be sitting in some bank account?

[Maverick91]

[QUOTE=Coursesuper;1544178]

You mean like Nike owning our logo? That kinda BS? LOL

Whoever came up with that to sell to the fans should never be allowed back on campus.

[Coursesuper]

[QUOTE=Coursesuper;1544178]

What’s BS about my statement? We both agree that we hoard money for reasons that are never explained to us, why would it not be sitting in some bank account?

I never agreed we hoard money, I'd say that you have been misinformed informed.

[Maverick91]

Delete

[cheewgumm]

Im not hating on your idea. I wish it would happen. However, just FYI, there is only 14,000+ in the Bulldog Club. Also, I am pretty sure, if you bought season tickets and gave $1,000 just this year, your ranking would be under 10,000.


Youre making a good point. I'm not up on all the numbers. To me, it seems like we could sell this, but to me, this ia a good point. Still hopeful.


Jus to add...I think you could get a lot of people to give $20 a month as its less daunting and easy to quickly cancel. Seems much easier than getting $1k. so maybe that helps the numbers.

[Cooterpoot]

From Coaching HotSeat:

Zach Arnett, Mississippi State

Status: Incredibly perilous for a first-year coach

Most of the newer coaches in the Big Ten or SEC have little to worry about because they have laughably humungous buyouts (see the Billy Napier section above), but Arnett is in a very different situation. His promotion to head coach came after the sudden and tragic passing of Mike Leach, and while Mississippi State leaders wanted to provide some continuity for the program, it?s clear they didn?t want to be locked into their new coach. The Bulldogs are currently 2-3. They should beat Western Michigan on Saturday, but after that comes a stretch of at Arkansas, at Auburn, Kentucky at home, and at Texas A&M. By the end of that, we might know whether Mississippi State leaders have a decision to make.
Arnett got a four-year deal that pays $3 million a year. His buyout calls for him to get 50 percent of the remaining amount on the contract. That means Mississippi State would owe Arnett $4.5 million over three years if it fired him after this season. But unlike Napier?s deal, Arnett?s also includes a duty to mitigate. In other words, the salary for Arnett?s next job would be subtracted from the buyout figure. Arnett has proven himself to be a very capable defensive coordinator, and it?s quite possible he could land a job either elsewhere in the SEC or somewhere in the Big Ten that would pay as much or more than the $1.5 million a year Mississippi State would owe him. So the Bulldogs might be able to make a change for relative pennies ? a rare occasion in today?s coaching contract environment.

[Really Clark?]

From Coaching HotSeat:

Zach Arnett, Mississippi State

Status: Incredibly perilous for a first-year coach

Most of the newer coaches in the Big Ten or SEC have little to worry about because they have laughably humungous buyouts (see the Billy Napier section above), but Arnett is in a very different situation. His promotion to head coach came after the sudden and tragic passing of Mike Leach, and while Mississippi State leaders wanted to provide some continuity for the program, it?s clear they didn?t want to be locked into their new coach. The Bulldogs are currently 2-3. They should beat Western Michigan on Saturday, but after that comes a stretch of at Arkansas, at Auburn, Kentucky at home, and at Texas A&M. By the end of that, we might know whether Mississippi State leaders have a decision to make.
Arnett got a four-year deal that pays $3 million a year. His buyout calls for him to get 50 percent of the remaining amount on the contract. That means Mississippi State would owe Arnett $4.5 million over three years if it fired him after this season. But unlike Napier?s deal, Arnett?s also includes a duty to mitigate. In other words, the salary for Arnett?s next job would be subtracted from the buyout figure. Arnett has proven himself to be a very capable defensive coordinator, and it?s quite possible he could land a job either elsewhere in the SEC or somewhere in the Big Ten that would pay as much or more than the $1.5 million a year Mississippi State would owe him. So the Bulldogs might be able to make a change for relative pennies ? a rare occasion in today?s coaching contract environment.

It was a good contract for us and a good job by the president to make sure we have an out.

[Cooterpoot]

As long as there's an out it's hard to complain beyond "we should've done this or that" stuff. We just have to be prepared to use the out if things don't pick up. I feel better about the situation now.

[TrapGame]

From Coaching HotSeat:

Zach Arnett, Mississippi State

Status: Incredibly perilous for a first-year coach

Most of the newer coaches in the Big Ten or SEC have little to worry about because they have laughably humungous buyouts (see the Billy Napier section above), but Arnett is in a very different situation. His promotion to head coach came after the sudden and tragic passing of Mike Leach, and while Mississippi State leaders wanted to provide some continuity for the program, it?s clear they didn?t want to be locked into their new coach. The Bulldogs are currently 2-3. They should beat Western Michigan on Saturday, but after that comes a stretch of at Arkansas, at Auburn, Kentucky at home, and at Texas A&M. By the end of that, we might know whether Mississippi State leaders have a decision to make.
Arnett got a four-year deal that pays $3 million a year. His buyout calls for him to get 50 percent of the remaining amount on the contract. That means Mississippi State would owe Arnett $4.5 million over three years if it fired him after this season. But unlike Napier?s deal, Arnett?s also includes a duty to mitigate. In other words, the salary for Arnett?s next job would be subtracted from the buyout figure. Arnett has proven himself to be a very capable defensive coordinator, and it?s quite possible he could land a job either elsewhere in the SEC or somewhere in the Big Ten that would pay as much or more than the $1.5 million a year Mississippi State would owe him. So the Bulldogs might be able to make a change for relative pennies ? a rare occasion in today?s coaching contract environment.

Yeah, he's gone, barring a significant turnaround which is very unlikely to happen. He wasn't ready to be head coach.

[Goldendawg]

I don't think we are about to relegated to the sunbelt for one losing season. However I do wonder if there is something fundamentally wrong in the Bryan building or the relationship between the big money boosters and the Bryan building. Because Stricklin leaving was a head scratcher.... but ok it's Florida. However then the next AD, who is a former MSU athlete, leaving for another sec rival... what the hell is going on here? Not a good sign.

We are an on-the job training program for AD's. We must be somewhat good at it as our former guys are now at bama, AU, and FL. Now with NIL/Portal some of best players also leave, (We do however replace them with players who make little or no contributions it seems. See the poor evaluations by this staff on our players from this years portal class). No way they will kick us out of the SEC as we are their feeder program!*****

[Todd4State]

Yeah, he's gone, barring a significant turnaround which is very unlikely to happen. He wasn't ready to be head coach.

Yeah. We're not going to hamstring a first year AD with a bad contract that isn't his doing to the point where he can't do his job.

The best thing is the money we are saving should allow us to be very aggressive in the coaching market.

[cheewgumm]

5 games in

?Weve seen enough. We couldnt beat Alabama and LSU so youre gone!?

Ha. Wow.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Yeah. We're not going to hamstring a first year AD with a bad contract that isn't his doing to the point where he can't do his job.

The best thing is the money we are saving should allow us to be very aggressive in the coaching market.

First we "saved money" by going cheap on Moorhead. Then we spent a bit more on Leach but still "saved money" on the overall staff relative to the SEC average. Then we "saved money" by hiring Arnett, promoting the DC from within, hiring and unproven G5 OC, and no real notable assistants. Then we "saved money" by not using NIL to get good Portal transfers for Football. Then we "saved money" by not firing Lemo. Then we "saved money" by not being able to get a baseball Portal transfer worthy of NIL. Moorhead buyout was relatively low for an SEC HC and -supposedly- was paid for with Seal money earmarked for that purpose. We are financially banking several million every year per any source you look at. OM out here paying a HC $8M a year and we're paying less than that for our entire football coaching staff. We have also been EXTREMELY fortunate on coaching buyouts over the last decade- Mullen left, JoMo was a cheap contract, Can was fired with cause, Henderson didn't need a buyout, Howland and Penson retired, etc. Most SEC school have spent 4x what we have on buyouts over the last 5 years. Facilities is a littel closer, we built a big baseball stadium. But all other schools still spend more than us on facilities overall.

SO yeah, we damned sure BETTER start spending on something.

[Cooterpoot]

5 games in

?Weve seen enough. We couldnt beat Alabama and LSU so youre gone!?

Ha. Wow.

Y'all act like LSU is good. They're 3-2.

[Homedawg]

First we "saved money" by going cheap on Moorhead. Then we spent a bit more on Leach but still "saved money" on the overall staff relative to the SEC average. Then we "saved money" by hiring Arnett, promoting the DC from within, hiring and unproven G5 OC, and no real notable assistants. Then we "saved money" by not using NIL to get good Portal transfers for Football. Then we "saved money" by not firing Lemo. Then we "saved money" by not being able to get a baseball Portal transfer worthy of NIL. Moorhead buyout was relatively low for an SEC HC and -supposedly- was paid for with Seal money earmarked for that purpose. We are financially banking several million every year per any source you look at. OM out here paying a HC $8M a year and we're paying less than that for our entire football coaching staff. We have also been EXTREMELY fortunate on coaching buyouts over the last decade- Mullen left, JoMo was a cheap contract, Can was fired with cause, Henderson didn't need a buyout, Howland and Penson retired, etc. Most SEC school have spent 4x what we have on buyouts over the last 5 years. Facilities is a littel closer, we built a big baseball stadium. But all other schools still spend more than us on facilities overall.

SO yeah, we damned sure BETTER start spending on something.

Fact is, going back to Mullen, our list of people that wanted our job has been less than stellar. Leach was by far the biggest name. The rest are a bunch of assistants or lower level guys that are meh. I know everyone thinks oh we can get so and so bc we're are in the sec. But our job is perceived as a tough job and guys like Napier wait for bigger jobs and won't touch it.

[Goldendawg]

Y'all act like LSU is good. They're 3-2.

And how bad did they beat us compared to how they beat OM? Oh, nvm.***

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Fact is, going back to Mullen, our list of people that wanted our job has been less than stellar. Leach was by far the biggest name. The rest are a bunch of assistants or lower level guys that are meh. I know everyone thinks oh we can get so and so bc we're are in the sec. But our job is perceived as a tough job and guys like Napier wait for bigger jobs and won't touch it.

Yeah we can't hire a "big name", but there's no reason we can't pay $10M total for a staff. And look at other SEC teams- TN hired a G5 coach who wasn't doing that hot. We could hire someone with a Huepel resume. Or look at Mizzou hiring the App St coach, we could have done that. SC hired a TE coach and it's working ok ish. Arky hired an OL coach and it's working ok ish. We hired JoMo and Arnett and both were epic failures.

Point is, there's good coaches we could land, but we historically SUCK at it. Epically so. I have my suspicion it's Keenum/boosters that are the cause. One more dud hire and it's confirmed we have an institutional problem.

[Cooterpoot]

Fact is, going back to Mullen, our list of people that wanted our job has been less than stellar. Leach was by far the biggest name. The rest are a bunch of assistants or lower level guys that are meh. I know everyone thinks oh we can get so and so bc we're are in the sec. But our job is perceived as a tough job and guys like Napier wait for bigger jobs and won't touch it.

Then offer a real salary compared to competitors and stop going cheap. And with all the crap going on in college football, our job looks better every day. It's weird how OM isn't perceived the same. That's because they're committed. Their record the last decade isn't something special. But look at them going and getting it instead of 17ing poor mouthing about everything and penny pinching the shit out of everything for the sake of the blue collar fans.

[Homedawg]

Then offer a real salary compared to competitors and stop going cheap. And with all the crap going on in college football, our job looks better every day. It's weird how OM isn't perceived the same. That's because they're committed. Their record the last decade isn't something special. But look at them going and getting it instead of 17ing poor mouthing about everything and penny pinching the shit out of everything for the sake of the blue collar fans.

I think we would offer a "real" salary for a guy worth it. We did to leach. But why pay 6 mil + just because. That's dumb. I'm talking g about we didn't even have any legit candidates of anyone remotely deserving a real salary.

[Todd4State]

Our administration has been way worse than the fans. It's not close. They give the school millions from from our athletic budget and then rainy day fund millions instead of putting it into recruiting to help level the field. We prioritized 17ing baseball over everything. That's as dumb as it gets. We can't even get our damn new logo on the scoreboard but other schools have it on theirs when we go there. We've been so poorly operated by the good ole boys selling blue collar bullshit for so long the fans are finally sick of it.
I'm waiting to see how this circus of a football program goes the next two months to decide if I need to invest my money somewhere else. If we keep the circus in town after a losing record, I'm out. If they straighten out things, & win games or we fire Amatuer Hour for sucking, Im increasing my investment. Either MSU invests in the program, or they need to stop asking people to.

This is where I am at as a fan too.

[Todd4State]

I think we would offer a "real" salary for a guy worth it. We did to leach. But why pay 6 mil + just because. That's dumb. I'm talking g about we didn't even have any legit candidates of anyone remotely deserving a real salary.

We need to start being a little more aggressive on taking a chance on coaching talent if we believe a coach that is not as proven as say a Leach is potentially special.

That's a big difference between MSU baseball and MSU football. If we think a baseball coach is potentially special whether that is an assistant or a head coach we pay and we do what it takes to get them.

In football we worry about things like age, and they had a bad year one time six years ago, and they've never been to Mississippi, etc.

If I'm MSU this offseason and Arnett doesn't work out, my first call is to Sonny Dykes and I'm going to offer him 40 million a year for 5 years and then see if he can bring in Kendall Briles, Ben Arbuckle, or Mack Leftwich to run the offense. Now he may very well say no but that's the type of move we should be trying to make.

If that doesn't work go after Dickert at Wazzu.

After that then go after the Tyson Helton's, Charles Huff, Kinne at Texas State, etc.

[Really Clark?]

We need to start being a little more aggressive on taking a chance on coaching talent if we believe a coach that is not as proven as say a Leach is potentially special.

That's a big difference between MSU baseball and MSU football. If we think a baseball coach is potentially special whether that is an assistant or a head coach we pay and we do what it takes to get them.

In football we worry about things like age, and they had a bad year one time six years ago, and they've never been to Mississippi, etc.

If I'm MSU this offseason and Arnett doesn't work out, my first call is to Sonny Dykes and I'm going to offer him 40 million a year for 5 years and then see if he can bring in Kendall Briles, Ben Arbuckle, or Mack Leftwich to run the offense. Now he may very well say no but that's the type of move we should be trying to make.

If that doesn't work go after Dickert at Wazzu.

After that then go after the Tyson Helton's, Charles Huff, Kinne at Texas State, etc.

I agree with a lot of this but you are out of your ever loving mind offering $40 MIL a year to a HC. Sonny Dykes at that. Offer that to Belichick, that's double his salary. Still stupid but at least he has the rings to somewhat back up a stupid spend.

[Santiago]

I agree with a lot of this but you are out of your ever loving mind offering $40 MIL a year to a HC. Sonny Dykes at that. Offer that to Belichick, that's double his salary. Still stupid but at least he has the rings to somewhat back up a stupid spend.

Hopefully Selmon is his own man, and coming from OU, wants a modified AR for us again. Hopefully he does not have to listen to retreads in the administration, boosters, or staff talking about the old days, blue collar football crap.

[Really Clark?]

Hopefully Selmon is his own man, and coming from OU, wants a modified AR for us again. Hopefully he does not have to listen to retreads in the administration, boosters, or staff talking about the old days, blue collar football crap.

What in world does that have to do with what I posted?

You know, I use to love the Air Raid. Y'all have absolutely ruined wanting to ever see or hear of it again with this cult mindset that it's the only offense that works.

[Santiago]

What in world does that have to do with what I posted?

You know, I use to love the Air Raid. Y'all have absolutely ruined wanting to ever see or hear of it again with this cult mindset that it's the only offense that works.

I don't know, lol.
I was just adding on the part about future hires. probably should have posted on Todd's instead.
Sorry though if we ruined that for real and not the intention, but I get it. My frustration is really at our administration and staff. My concern is we really do have backward thinking still going on in our admin, booster, and staff to the point at how they totally made a 180 in a year of so many returning upperclassmen.

I am on the same page though with you when some say throw a ton of money at a coach, etc. I love MSU, but we are not getting those guys here if they already have an easier path to the playoffs.

[Cooterpoot]

The Air Raid 17ing sucked to watch! Ball control, four corners in football BS! It struggled mightily against every legitimate team it ran into.

[CoachT14]

The Air Raid 17ing sucked to watch! Ball control, four corners in football BS! It struggled mightily against every legitimate team it ran into.

I'm not really an Air Raid guy per-say. But I think it would've been a lot different with another QB besides Will. That was always my issue with Leach was just the insistence that Will be the guy.

[Santiago]

The Air Raid 17ing sucked to watch! Ball control, four corners in football BS! It struggled mightily against every legitimate team it ran into.

I really don't think we were running the full air raid. We were signing mobile QBs and Locke probably would have been the next upgrade to our offense.
Leach was running it with what he had as he recruited in the players. Watching Minshew at Wazzou looked more Air Raid.