Got to stop with the Barbay blame game

[Coach34]

As someone that does the same job he does on a lower level- I know what it's like to have someone in your ear constantly saying "let's run the ball coach- and shorten the game". It's part of the job and you deal with it. At no time in my career have I ever had someone say into my headset- "We need to start throwing the ball a little more". I believe 100% Arnett got in Barb's ear and told him to run the ball to shorten the game after we had to play D for 18 plays. I've heard it in my ear a 100 times from defensive minded coaches I've worked with. No HC is shy about voicing what they want the offense to do. If Arnett had wanted more passes to be thrown on Sat- there would have been.

Barbay is 13-14 years younger than I am and has grown up in the Spread Offense Era. You dont find many overly conservative guys 40 or younger today. And just by going off the numbers- Barbay's offenses:

2021- QB's couldnt run- 34.5 passes per game
2022- QB wasnt real mobile but ran just a little- 27.5 passes per game
2023? QB is a statue and 2 games in we are at 23 passes per.

I'm very curious as to what we will see Saturday because this will tell us what "they" want the offense to look like. You go into the season knowing you will beat SELA and also figure you wont have to show alot to beat Arizona (altho they certainly upgraded on D thru the portal). You plan to show what you got in Week 3 vs an SEC Big Dawg. We have lost our top TE already, Robinson hasnt been full speed, and Whitt is still a baby learning whats going on. So I get what could be some hesitancy to call as many passes so far. But I dont excuse it.

Saturday should tell us alot.

[TrapGame]

Thank you C34, blessings be upon your holy resurrection.

Luginbill was on OOB saying Arizona massively upgraded in the portal on OL and DL. Our coaches had no way of knowing how much of an upgrade it would be. He said the same about FSU/LSU. FSU upgraded some spots in the portal. One of those portal guys gave LSU hell all night. LSU didn't have to deal with him last year and had no way of really evaluating on film what he could do in Norvell's offense.

[Bubb Rubb]

As someone that does the same job he does on a lower level- I know what it's like to have someone in your ear constantly saying "let's run the ball coach- and shorten the game". It's part of the job and you deal with it. At no time in my career have I ever had someone say into my headset- "We need to start throwing the ball a little more". I believe 100% Arnett got in Barb's ear and told him to run the ball to shorten the game after we had to play D for 18 plays. I've heard it in my ear a 100 times from defensive minded coaches I've worked with. No HC is shy about voicing what they want the offense to do. If Arnett had wanted more passes to be thrown on Sat- there would have been.

Barbay is 13-14 years younger than I am and has grown up in the Spread Offense Era. You dont find many overly conservative guys 40 or younger today. And just by going off the numbers- Barbay's offenses:

2021- QB's couldnt run- 34.5 passes per game
2022- QB wasnt real mobile but ran just a little- 27.5 passes per game
2023? QB is a statue and 2 games in we are at 23 passes per.

I'm very curious as to what we will see Saturday because this will tell us what "they" want the offense to look like. You go into the season knowing you will beat SELA and also figure you wont have to show alot to beat Arizona (altho they certainly upgraded on D thru the portal). You plan to show what you got in Week 3 vs an SEC Big Dawg. We have lost our top TE already, Robinson hasnt been full speed, and Whitt is still a baby learning whats going on. So I get what could be some hesitancy to call as many passes so far. But I dont excuse it.

Saturday should tell us alot.

I hear what you're saying. But at the same time, if Arnett is the accountability guy we all think he is, and Barbay has the freedom we were all told that he has, then when Arnett gets in Barbay's ear to tell him to run the ball because the defense needs a break after an 18 play drive, then Barbay needs to say back to him that he needs to figure out how to get his damn defense off the field on third down. It goes both ways.

[confucius say]

Let's clear something up. Arnett admitted he told KB to run the ball after the 18 play drive. But the reason was not to shorten the game. Arnett said the reason was to give the defense a rest. Those are not the same. If the reason to run is to shorten the game then that makes sense because running the ball keeps the clock running. But if the reason is to give the defense a breather then that doesn't make sense because the way to do that is to keep your offense on the field for a while, which is accomplished by running successful plays that pick up first downs whether they be run or pass.

That said. What we did worked. We went on an 11 play drive that took 5:14 off the clock. And we scored a TD that was negated by an unnecessary hold on 57. Then we missed a 41 yard fg.

But despite getting a long breather, the defense immediately crapped the bed by giving up a 3 play, 77 yard TD drive to close the half. Woof.

[PMDawg]

I think a lot of the criticism from Saturday is overblown (and that's saying something coming from me). The run was working early, we got a big lead pretty quickly, we had short fields on offense, and the defense needed a rest. It all added up to some decisions that may not have been the best. Understandable. However, the main criticism I have is that we didn't adjust as the flow of the game changed. The run was working early, but AZ adjusted and it wasn't working as well by halftime. We did not adjust and just kept trying to do the same thing that worked early in the game but was no longer working. We needed to do something different. Same on defense. The zone blitzes worked early, but they figured it out and DeLaura started picking us apart. We needed to give him some new looks and maybe throw in some man to man a little more on the blitzes. Or add a robber. Or something. But we just kept doing the same thing. Needed to make a change. We have to do better at that. If we do, we'll be fine.

[RockyDog]

I don’t have a problem with running the ball. BUT you still have to mix it up. We ran on first and 2nd down way too much.

I get being conservative to an extent but not so much that you completely take away one phase of the offense. Like Wyatt pointed out, we only involved the outside receivers on 2 passes. And the pass to Walley was basically a dump off crosser. Arizona was down 2 corners and we didn’t even test their secondary.

The other thing is, if you aren’t even going to pretend to involve the TE then we just need to scrap the position for this year. Our opponents already know that we aren’t going to test them down the field. We don’t need a receiver on the field that is never going to get the ball.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Yeah... no. The truth is he failed on Saturday. And that's ok to say. He's a big boy making big $$$. BTW, he stated in an interview that he has seen the talk and that it was hard to get away from the run because early on it was 6 to 8 yard pops. That's great, but if that's all you do then those are going to keyed on.

The passing game was averaging 12.5 yards per completed pass.

[Commercecomet24]

Yeah... no. The truth is he failed on Saturday. And that's ok to say. He's a big boy making big $$$. BTW, he stated in an interview that he has seen the talk and that it was hard to get away from the run because early on it was 6 to 8 yard pops. That's great, but if that's all you do then those are going to keyed on.

The passing game was averaging 12.5 yards per completed pass.

This is accurate. I liken it to a pitcher throwing a fastball over and over, in the same spot. No matter how hard you throw it's gonna get hit if that's all you got. I had an mlb hitting coach tell me one time that mlb hitters could hit a jet if they see it in the same place everytime, lol. A little hyperbole but you get the point. You have to change speeds at some point whether you're a pitcher or an OC.

[Leroy Jenkins]

Barbay say: Paraphrasing "I am not oblivious of people's opinions, and I did get too conservative..it won't happen again".


I think everyone has made their feelings known, from coaches to fans, and it's time to learn and move on. We know we screwed this up a little. Got the W, learned a lesson. Next.

[BlackSailsDawg]

This is accurate. I liken it to a pitcher throwing a fastball over and over, in the same spot. No matter how hard you throw it's gonna get hit if that's all you got. I had an mlb hitting coach tell me one time that mlb hitters could hit a jet if they see it in the same place everytime, lol. A little hyperbole but you get the point. You have to change speeds at some point whether you're a pitcher or an OC.

BTW... I'm not saying he has to go. But this can't be what we hired! He's got to open it up.

[dawgday166]

Barbay say: Paraphrasing "I am not oblivious of people's opinions, and I did get too conservative..it won't happen again".


I think everyone has made their feelings known, from coaches to fans, and it's time to learn and move on. We know we screwed this up a little. Got the W, learned a lesson. Next.

Bet ya it happens again. Hopefully extremely infrequently tho.

[TrapGame]

Yeah... no. The truth is he failed on Saturday. And that's ok to say. He's a big boy making big $$$. BTW, he stated in an interview that he has seen the talk and that it was hard to get away from the run because early on it was 6 to 8 yard pops. That's great, but if that's all you do then those are going to keyed on.

The passing game was averaging 12.5 yards per completed pass.

I think Barbay was trying to App St/A&M this game but a stupid ass coach like Jimbo wasn't on the opposing sideline and Haynes King wasn't the QB. Jedd Fisch has been doing this for 25 years. We better hope he doesn't come after a talent rich job in the SEC.

If we come out against LSU with the same idiotic play calling and offensive management then I'll be done with Barbay. He better have an ace up his sleeve Saturday.

[KB21]

Yeah... no. The truth is he failed on Saturday. And that's ok to say. He's a big boy making big $$$. BTW, he stated in an interview that he has seen the talk and that it was hard to get away from the run because early on it was 6 to 8 yard pops. That's great, but if that's all you do then those are going to keyed on.

The passing game was averaging 12.5 yards per completed pass.

The issue here is that it is very clear that running the ball is what he wants to do. If he could do it, he would run the ball every play. Of course, I knew all of this by simply looking at his history as a play caller. He only throws it because he has to.

[BlackSailsDawg]

I think Barbay was trying to App St/A&M this game but a stupid ass coach like Jimbo wasn't on the opposing sideline and Haynes King wasn't the QB. Jedd Fisch has been doing this for 25 years. We better hope he doesn't come after a talent rich job in the SEC.

If we come out against LSU with the same idiotic play calling and offensive management then I'll be done with Barbay. He better have an ace up his sleeve Saturday.

Hopefully, we will be smiling this time next week.

[TrapGame]

Hopefully, we will be smiling this time next week.

I hope so, Brother.

[Commercecomet24]

BTW... I'm not saying he has to go. But this can't be what we hired! He's got to open it up.

100%!

[Commercecomet24]

Hopefully, we will be smiling this time next week.

Amen and let's hope so!

[Dawgface]

The issue here is that it is very clear that running the ball is what he wants to do. If he could do it, he would run the ball every play. Of course, I knew all of this by simply looking at his history as a play caller. He only throws it because he has to.

I've been waiting for your 'I told you so moment'. And you were right.

[Coach34]

The issue here is that it is very clear that running the ball is what he wants to do. If he could do it, he would run the ball every play. Of course, I knew all of this by simply looking at his history as a play caller. He only throws it because he has to.

His history shows he threw it 34.5 times per game just 2 years ago

[KB21]

His history shows he threw it 34.5 times per game just 2 years ago

He is currently on an 8 game stretch where he has called a run 63% of the time, and over the past 6 quarters, he's called a run 70% of the time.

[ZedFedder]

To add to the conversation, it will not surprise me if we get to the end of the year and Arizona is an 8 win team. They are definitely upgraded in their talent.

This win, while very ugly and exposing some flaws in our play calling, will age well over the season.

[KB21]

To add to the conversation, it will not surprise me if we get to the end of the year and Arizona is an 8 win team. They are definitely upgraded in their talent.

This win, while very ugly and exposing some flaws in our play calling, will age well over the season.

I'm not sure I see where they will get their 8 wins. They have USC and Washington. Both will win by multiple touchdowns. They aren't going to sit on the ball and will keep throwing it. Washington State is going to be a tough game for them. Oregon State is a tough game. Utah is a tough game.

[Really Clark?]

I'm not sure I see where they will get their 8 wins. They have USC and Washington. Both will win by multiple touchdowns. They aren't going to sit on the ball and will keep throwing it. Washington State is going to be a tough game for them. Oregon State is a tough game. Utah is a tough game.

They have the offense to win 8, just depends on if the defensive upgrades help enough. They actually scored enough last year to go bowling and did upset UCLA. It was just a putrid defense.

[MaroonFlounder]

I'm sorry, but Barbay will be a major reason we lose to LSU.

This offense doesn't utilize many of the playmakers like he promised it would.

[Jarius]

As someone that does the same job he does on a lower level- I know what it's like to have someone in your ear constantly saying "let's run the ball coach- and shorten the game". It's part of the job and you deal with it. At no time in my career have I ever had someone say into my headset- "We need to start throwing the ball a little more". I believe 100% Arnett got in Barb's ear and told him to run the ball to shorten the game after we had to play D for 18 plays. I've heard it in my ear a 100 times from defensive minded coaches I've worked with. No HC is shy about voicing what they want the offense to do. If Arnett had wanted more passes to be thrown on Sat- there would have been.

Barbay is 13-14 years younger than I am and has grown up in the Spread Offense Era. You dont find many overly conservative guys 40 or younger today. And just by going off the numbers- Barbay's offenses:

2021- QB's couldnt run- 34.5 passes per game
2022- QB wasnt real mobile but ran just a little- 27.5 passes per game
2023? QB is a statue and 2 games in we are at 23 passes per.

I'm very curious as to what we will see Saturday because this will tell us what "they" want the offense to look like. You go into the season knowing you will beat SELA and also figure you wont have to show alot to beat Arizona (altho they certainly upgraded on D thru the portal). You plan to show what you got in Week 3 vs an SEC Big Dawg. We have lost our top TE already, Robinson hasnt been full speed, and Whitt is still a baby learning whats going on. So I get what could be some hesitancy to call as many passes so far. But I dont excuse it.

Saturday should tell us alot.

If last Saturday’s offense is what Arnett wants to run he won’t be coaching here next year because we will go 4-8 and fire him. He had better figure out he’s the head coach who needs both sides of the ball to produce in order to win and not the DC who just needs the defense to win. Running the ball 40 times with Will Rogers at quarterback is ****ing retarded.

[PMDawg]

And you were right.

Get out of here with that garbage. A one game sample size?! Come on.

I can't believe the amount of people who are ready to fire him or call him a failure 2 games into his tenure. That's so unbelievably ignorant. And I'm not talking about you, because I haven't seen where you have said that. But there are plenty on this board. It's ridiculous. We come out and put up a goose egg against LSU and start SEC play 0-4 because we can't score the ball? Alright, let's start talking. One ugly game against a P5 team, a game we still won btw? Jeez. This really is the instant gratification generation.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Get out of here with that garbage. A one game sample size?! Come on.

I can't believe the amount of people who are ready to fire him or call him a failure 2 games into his tenure. That's so unbelievably ignorant. And I'm not talking about you, because I haven't seen where you have said that. But there are plenty on this board. It's ridiculous. We come out and put up a goose egg against LSU and start SEC play 0-4 because we can't score the ball? Alright, let's start talking. One ugly game against a P5 team, a game we still won btw? Jeez. This really is the instant gratification generation.

I get your point, but people are not calling for him to be fired. They are saying that it should not have been an OT win and you don't limit your QB and WRs

[drummerdawg]

For me, it's not even so much that we ran the ball more. It's the decisions to have Wright in for 1 play then pull him on 3rd and 1 or handing the ball off to Will. Was that Barbay? If so, then he sucks regardless if ZA told him to run more.

[PMDawg]

I get your point, but people are not calling for him to be fired. They are saying that it should not have been an OT win and you don't limit your QB and WRs

No, there are people saying it already. What I said is true. I understand a wait and see attitude with the expectation that it probably won't get better. But a LOT of people have already made up their minds, and it's just too early for that. Even if they end up being right. It's too early.

[PMDawg]

For me, it's not even so much that we ran the ball more. It's the decisions to have Wright in for 1 play then pull him on 3rd and 1 or handing the ball off to Will. Was that Barbay? If so, then he sucks regardless if ZA told him to run more.

I agree that was not smart. I hope he's learned from that. They want him on the field, I get it. But it can't be forced and obvious. So, yeah, bad plan. Scrap it and come up with something better. I don't think that's the end all be all that determines whether or not he "sucks" though. Lots of good coaches make dumb decisions. Many of them do it every game (Lane Kiffin anyone?). It's part of it. If you have to make that many decisions on the fly at that kind of pace, you're going to screw up. Obviously. Just learn from it and do it better next time. I guess I just have the mindset that all of these guys have been coaching for a long time and haven't made it this far by being complete morons and/or "sucking". I think they're pretty smart people who will learn and get better. I don't think that Arnett or Barbay at the end of this season will be exactly the same Arnett and Barbay that coached Saturday. Successful people are always working to get better. It's in their DNA.

[starkvegasdawg]

How many times we run vs how many we pass is irrelevant to me. It's how we do it. We put Wright in as QB and he never runs one time. Maybe he tried once and got blown up but 99% of the time he handed it off. My fat ass could do that. Sooner or later he's got to try a forward pass. And don't put Will out as receiver. Nobody thinks the ball will ever be thrown to him. If it were he'd probably slide down before the ball got to him. Put another receiver on the field to force the defense to burn a guy covering him making it harder to contain Wright when he runs.

[KB21]

How many times we run vs how many we pass is irrelevant to me. It's how we do it. We put Wright in as QB and he never runs one time. Maybe he tried once and got blown up but 99% of the time he handed it off. My fat ass could do that. Sooner or later he's got to try a forward pass. And don't put Will out as receiver. Nobody thinks the ball will ever be thrown to him. If it were he'd probably slide down before the ball got to him. Put another receiver on the field to force the defense to burn a guy covering him making it harder to contain Wright when he runs.

When he was in, Arizona basically knew what was going to be run and made sure he didn't keep the ball. They were more than willing to let the RB get the ball, but they also know that Barbay has shown no propensity to throw the ball from those formations. Wright only plays when they have two tight ends on the field, and they know that neither TE is a threat.

[MrCoachKlein]

Yeah... no. The truth is he failed on Saturday. And that's ok to say. He's a big boy making big $$$. BTW, he stated in an interview that he has seen the talk and that it was hard to get away from the run because early on it was 6 to 8 yard pops. That's great, but if that's all you do then those are going to keyed on.

The passing game was averaging 12.5 yards per completed pass.

I agree with this, but for an apples to apples the comp should be YPA which was 9.5.

On a positive note CZA is our second undefeated HC.

[RockyDog]

The issue here is that it is very clear that running the ball is what he wants to do. If he could do it, he would run the ball every play. Of course, I knew all of this by simply looking at his history as a play caller. He only throws it because he has to.

Here we go with your dumb ass bullshit again. He ?only? had a 2900+ yard passer last year. That would put Mr App State QB at or near MSU?s top 5 all time season high. But you keep perpetuating that myth that Barbay has never used the pass in his system.

[Maverick91]

I'm sorry, but Barbay will be a major reason we lose to LSU.

This offense doesn't utilize many of the playmakers like he promised it would.

Annnnnnnnd we are two game in bosshog. Not saying that you couldn’t be right, I just don’t think we have seen the pinnacle of this offense yet.

[confucius say]

When he was in, Arizona basically knew what was going to be run and made sure he didn't keep the ball. They were more than willing to let the RB get the ball, but they also know that Barbay has shown no propensity to throw the ball from those formations. Wright only plays when they have two tight ends on the field, and they know that neither TE is a threat.

Wright played with 11 personnel

[Leroy Jenkins]

I am 100% convinced, we have fans who would rather go 7-5 playing their preferred style of ball, than go 10-2 with a style they don't agree with.

[KOdawg1]

I'd like our offense to play offense and not defense.

"Shortening the game" or giving your defense a rest is how you get beat. In today's age of college football, we should never sacrifice offense for the sake of anything. If the defense is gassed, then hope your depth can survive long enough to give them a breather, but you can't hold anything back on offense.

[BlackSailsDawg]

How many times we run vs how many we pass is irrelevant to me. It's how we do it. We put Wright in as QB and he never runs one time. Maybe he tried once and got blown up but 99% of the time he handed it off. My fat ass could do that. Sooner or later he's got to try a forward pass. And don't put Will out as receiver. Nobody thinks the ball will ever be thrown to him. If it were he'd probably slide down before the ball got to him. Put another receiver on the field to force the defense to burn a guy covering him making it harder to contain Wright when he runs.

But there is always a defender on Rogers. Never once have I seen him standing there open.

[Really Clark?]

When he was in, Arizona basically knew what was going to be run and made sure he didn't keep the ball. They were more than willing to let the RB get the ball, but they also know that Barbay has shown no propensity to throw the ball from those formations. Wright only plays when they have two tight ends on the field, and they know that neither TE is a threat.

We were in 11 personnel when Wright was in.

[BrunswickDawg]

I am 100% convinced, we have fans who would rather go 7-5 playing their preferred style of ball, than go 10-2 with a style they don't agree with.

What style do MSU fans prefer? Cause over the years we've hated Jackie's offense cause we didn't pass enough to take advantage of Moulds and then wasting Jerious Norwood; hated Crooms for multiple reasons; hated Dan for Tyler Russell being a statue, Holloway up the middle and for Fitz for running too much; hated JoMo's RP-No; detested Leach'e air raid until he died (at which point we then wanted more air raid); and now hate Barbay.

[Really Clark?]

What style do MSU fans prefer? Cause over the years we've hated Jackie's offense cause we didn't pass enough to take advantage of Moulds and then wasting Jerious Norwood; hated Crooms for multiple reasons; hated Dan for Tyler Russell being a statue, Holloway up the middle and for Fitz for running too much; hated JoMo's RP-No; detested Leach'e air raid until he died (at which point we then wanted more air raid); and now hate Barbay.

It's the MSU Fan Psychosis, hate what we are doing at the moment.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

What style do MSU fans prefer? Cause over the years we've hated Jackie's offense cause we didn't pass enough to take advantage of Moulds and then wasting Jerious Norwood; hated Crooms for multiple reasons; hated Dan for Tyler Russell being a statue, Holloway up the middle and for Fitz for running too much; hated JoMo's RP-No; detested Leach'e air raid until he died (at which point we then wanted more air raid); and now hate Barbay.

It?s almost like ?MSU fans? are actually a lot of different people with different opinions. There isn?t an offense in the world that everyone agrees is best for that personnel, and unhappy people are more motivated to bitch on a message board than happy people are to sing a coaching staffs praises

[Leroy Jenkins]

What style do MSU fans prefer?

I'm taking about on an individual fan basis. There is no style for the whole fanbase, there are different camps, hence this trend.

[BrunswickDawg]

It's the MSU Fan Psychosis, hate what we are doing at the moment.

Hate the offense, love QB 2

[Commercecomet24]

It's the MSU Fan Psychosis, hate what we are doing at the moment.

Nailed it. We have literally ran every offense from the wishbone to the air raid and every single time it's been hated at the moment.

[KB21]

I am 100% convinced, we have fans who would rather go 7-5 playing their preferred style of ball, than go 10-2 with a style they don't agree with.

Yep. We have fans that would rather lose with ground and pound than win with throwing the ball.

[Really Clark?]

Yep. We have fans that would rather lose with ground and pound than win with throwing the ball.

He was including you in his statement.

[bulldawg28]

How many times we run vs how many we pass is irrelevant to me. It's how we do it. We put Wright in as QB and he never runs one time. Maybe he tried once and got blown up but 99% of the time he handed it off. My fat ass could do that. Sooner or later he's got to try a forward pass. And don't put Will out as receiver. Nobody thinks the ball will ever be thrown to him. If it were he'd probably slide down before the ball got to him. Put another receiver on the field to force the defense to burn a guy covering him making it harder to contain Wright when he runs.

Lmao...@slide down. I could literally see that happening with him.

[KB21]

He was including you in his statement.

I don't think so, because you aren't winning 10 games with the offense Barbay put on the field against Arizona, period.

[PMDawg]

He was including you in his statement.

He's not smart enough to figure that out, and too stubborn to believe it anyway.

[KB21]

He's not smart enough to figure that out, and too stubborn to believe it anyway.

Got to love this idea that I'm not smart enough considering the fact that everything I told you about Kevin Barbay and his offense is being proven true. In fact, I can't think of anything I said in the off season that has turned out to be incorrect. From my statement that Barbay runs a pro style offense that many people tried to argue with me over, to the fact that he is a run heavy play caller, to the fact that Will Rogers would be the first scapegoat when the offense struggles. All of that has happened.

[BuckyIsAB****]

As someone that does the same job he does on a lower level- I know what it's like to have someone in your ear constantly saying "let's run the ball coach- and shorten the game". It's part of the job and you deal with it. At no time in my career have I ever had someone say into my headset- "We need to start throwing the ball a little more". I believe 100% Arnett got in Barb's ear and told him to run the ball to shorten the game after we had to play D for 18 plays. I've heard it in my ear a 100 times from defensive minded coaches I've worked with. No HC is shy about voicing what they want the offense to do. If Arnett had wanted more passes to be thrown on Sat- there would have been.

Barbay is 13-14 years younger than I am and has grown up in the Spread Offense Era. You dont find many overly conservative guys 40 or younger today. And just by going off the numbers- Barbay's offenses:

2021- QB's couldnt run- 34.5 passes per game
2022- QB wasnt real mobile but ran just a little- 27.5 passes per game
2023? QB is a statue and 2 games in we are at 23 passes per.

I'm very curious as to what we will see Saturday because this will tell us what "they" want the offense to look like. You go into the season knowing you will beat SELA and also figure you wont have to show alot to beat Arizona (altho they certainly upgraded on D thru the portal). You plan to show what you got in Week 3 vs an SEC Big Dawg. We have lost our top TE already, Robinson hasnt been full speed, and Whitt is still a baby learning whats going on. So I get what could be some hesitancy to call as many passes so far. But I dont excuse it.

Saturday should tell us alot.

Arnett is covering for Barbay. It is what it is

[MrCoachKlein]

What style do MSU fans prefer? Cause over the years we've hated Jackie's offense cause we didn't pass enough to take advantage of Moulds and then wasting Jerious Norwood; hated Crooms for multiple reasons; hated Dan for Tyler Russell being a statue, Holloway up the middle and for Fitz for running too much; hated JoMo's RP-No; detested Leach'e air raid until he died (at which point we then wanted more air raid); and now hate Barbay.

I think we just hate sucking at offense. I definitely didn't like Mullen never testing 1 on 1 outside (besides derunya). Our defense always seems to be serviceable if we have a decent coach. On O we hire a legend and are still pedestrian.

[confucius say]

Arnett is covering for Barbay. It is what it is

That was my thought. The one drive where arnett said he told KB to run the ball doesn't even matter. We marched down the field and scored a TD that was called back by holding and then missed a FG. Nobody is upset with KB about that drive.

The issue was the second half play calling once they took away the run.

[MrCoachKlein]

Got to love this idea that I'm not smart enough considering the fact that everything I told you about Kevin Barbay and his offense is being proven true. In fact, I can't think of anything I said in the off season that has turned out to be incorrect. From my statement that Barbay runs a pro style offense that many people tried to argue with me over, to the fact that he is a run heavy play caller, to the fact that Will Rogers would be the first scapegoat when the offense struggles. All of that has happened.

Go kick some rocks and pound sand. Literally the only thing you've been right about is Barbary running more than throwing and not many disagreed with you.

[SpaceWranglerDawg]

Question. What would make yall happy? Who could be in that spot, what scheme, so on and so forth would make people happy?

It just seems everybody has the perfect recipe of how it should be.

[Really Clark?]

I don't think so, because you aren't winning 10 games with the offense Barbay put on the field against Arizona, period.

Yeah, he wasn't talking about Barbay's offense either. It was a completely general statement and you have no self awareness to understand it was directed at you and others like you who worship a scheme, a certain coach, play calling ratio., etc. over our team winning.

[basedog]

Question. What would make yall happy? Who could be in that spot, what scheme, so on and so forth would make people happy?

It just seems everybody has the perfect recipe of how it should be.

Better play calling with taking a few chances throwing down the field.

[basedog]

I agree. No way do I think Arnett is telling him to be conservative. We are way to vanilla on offense.

[PMDawg]

Got to love this idea that I'm not smart enough considering the fact that everything I told you about Kevin Barbay and his offense is being proven true. In fact, I can't think of anything I said in the off season that has turned out to be incorrect. From my statement that Barbay runs a pro style offense that many people tried to argue with me over, to the fact that he is a run heavy play caller, to the fact that Will Rogers would be the first scapegoat when the offense struggles. All of that has happened.

There's so many lies here that have already been called out. You're not worth the effort. You've been banned or run off from so many message boards - your time will come on this one as well.

[3dawgnight15]

We?ve literally seen 8 quarters of Barbay?s MSU offense and the melts/I told you so?s are abundant. 8 quarters.

[Leroy Jenkins]

We?ve literally seen 8 quarters of Barbay?s MSU offense and the melts/I told you so?s are abundant. 8 quarters.

Isn't it great?

[basedog]

Arnett is covering for Barbay. It is what it is

I agree, no way do I think Arnett is saying be conservative.

[Coach34]

I agree. No way do I think Arnett is telling him to be conservative. We are way to vanilla on offense.

Sooooooo- why is he more vanilla now than he has ever been?

[KB21]

Question. What would make yall happy? Who could be in that spot, what scheme, so on and so forth would make people happy?

It just seems everybody has the perfect recipe of how it should be.

A pass oriented scheme that is QB centric.

[KB21]

There's so many lies here that have already been called out. You're not worth the effort. You've been banned or run off from so many message boards - your time will come on this one as well.

It?s OK that you were wrong. I?m used to being right all the time.

[Leroy Jenkins]

I'd line up with 10 O-linemen and QB sneak the ball down the field all game if it means a W.
Or go 5-wide empty, either way, just want to win.

[Cooterpoot]

Sooooooo- why is he more vanilla now than he has ever been?

He's not.

[Cooterpoot]

Arnett told him to slow it down one series Saturday. Not the whole damn game. Barbey stays nowhere long. He better show something this week.

[Coach34]

He's not.

34.5 passes per in 2021
23 this season

Math doesnt lie and is not racist

[BigDawg81]

Y?all are crazy! First time HC learning on the fly. First time DC calling plays learning on the fly. New OC in the SEC trying to figure out what works in the SEC. Let?s hope that they learn from their mistakes. The good news is that every team inside the SEC is beatable especially in the SECW. It?s been awhile since the SECW is wide open.

[coachnorm]

https://x.com/CFBONFOX/status/1700663319747604992?s=20

If you were to look at the successful offense executed against upper tiered football teams, you will find receivers winning contested catches. Any elitedogger can get on YouTube and watch high lites, hundreds can be located. Also, any elitedogger can source hundreds of plays in high school, college, and NFL and confirm this allegation.

I will use the Tennessee vs Alabama and LSU vs Florida State games as an example. In both games schematic passing took a back seat to match-up passing. I flew out to the MSU game against Arizona, last year, and saw receivers like Ducking and RARa do the same, win the ball.

Two seasons ago, I saw MSU win contested catches against Kentucky in a decisive win. I sat in the scoreboard club seats and had a great view. The year after, last season against the same Kentucky, Rogers chose to wait, in the pocket, for receivers to schematically get open and we got shut down on the road.

I have seen Rogers throw contested catches, in person, yet at times he of his own free will choses to stop and revert back to the deer in the headlamps and bad things happen. This is not the play callers doing. Before halftime, against Arizona, Rogers was so mentally frozen that he could not throw the football away like the average college or high school quarterback, he took the sac. How can you fault play calling when the 4th year quarterback offers up that kind of garbage to him?

Included is a Mississippi State 3rd string quarterback, from the past, Jalen Maden throwing a successful pass for sorry San Diego State. Granted, he was not at State very long but he was a brief 3rd stringer. Take notice that there is not much progression reading going on. Also take notice that it does not take great offensive line play to get that kind of pass off. The football is passed just too quickly. It is painful to see Mr. 3rd string execute while a 4th year quarterback becomes a deer in the headlamps taking a critical sac. That probably scared the coaches also?

[basedog]

Sooooooo- why is he more vanilla now than he has ever been?

34, you as an offensive coach, surely you see that there is no imagination in Our OC play calling. Everyone in the stadium Saturday knew when Wright comes in what the play is. Our playmakers with game speed are our wideouts you gotta get the ball in space to them. Marks with 24 carries was really good in first half. But second half we went into a “4 corner stall”.

I’m not against running the ball, but you gotta be somewhat creative. I haven’t seen that “so far”. Hope things change, now we go play LSU with lots of questions.

[confucius say]

34.5 passes per in 2021
23 this season

Math doesnt lie and is not racist

27.5 in 2022 right?

This year will be about the same.

[Coach34]

34, you as an offensive coach, surely you see that there is no imagination in Our OC play calling. .

Sooooooo again I ask- what's different from the guy in 2021 to now?

[Coach34]

27.5 in 2022 right?

This year will be about the same.

I hope so. 27-28 passes per game with 40 runs is perfect. 40 runs with 17 passes? Not so much

[Homedawg]

He was including you in his statement.

I think you meant, he was talking about your kb21.

[Jarius]

Question. What would make yall happy? Who could be in that spot, what scheme, so on and so forth would make people happy?

It just seems everybody has the perfect recipe of how it should be.


The scheme we are running is fine. The play calling within that scheme this past Saturday was Croom level bad. He was just way too conservative and then when it’s 3rd and 9 and the whole damn building knows you have to throw it Will gets murdered and we blame the OL because the DL just has their ears pinned back because they know what’s coming. We have to be more balanced offensively within the scheme we are running.

[Homedawg]

Got to love this idea that I'm not smart enough considering the fact that everything I told you about Kevin Barbay and his offense is being proven true. In fact, I can't think of anything I said in the off season that has turned out to be incorrect. From my statement that Barbay runs a pro style offense that many people tried to argue with me over, to the fact that he is a run heavy play caller, to the fact that Will Rogers would be the first scapegoat when the offense struggles. All of that has happened.

Cool. But you worshiped the CML offense. That wasn't good last year. Was ok year two. And stunk year one. You are killing rhe guy after two games. Two. If one or two games decided a season, woe would have gone 10-0 in CML first season based one game one.... yet we all know to well how that turned out. Trash

[basedog]

Sooooooo again I ask- what's different from the guy in 2021 to now?

My bad 34, u r correct, nothing different bout him. I was just thinking while watching we would be more creative in this offense.
I wonder if Will would be better calling most plays.

[Homedawg]

It?s OK that you were wrong. I?m used to being right all the time.

Correct narcissistic asshole.

[Coach34]

My bad 34, u r correct, nothing different bout him. I was just thinking while watching we would be more creative in this offense.
I wonder if Will would be better calling most plays.

But he called basically 35 passes per game in 2021. Only 23 per so far this season. What's different? Could it be the HC?

[SpaceBully]

As someone that does the same job he does on a lower level- I know what it's like to have someone in your ear constantly saying "let's run the ball coach- and shorten the game". It's part of the job and you deal with it. At no time in my career have I ever had someone say into my headset- "We need to start throwing the ball a little more". I believe 100% Arnett got in Barb's ear and told him to run the ball to shorten the game after we had to play D for 18 plays. I've heard it in my ear a 100 times from defensive minded coaches I've worked with. No HC is shy about voicing what they want the offense to do. If Arnett had wanted more passes to be thrown on Sat- there would have been.

Barbay is 13-14 years younger than I am and has grown up in the Spread Offense Era. You dont find many overly conservative guys 40 or younger today. And just by going off the numbers- Barbay's offenses:

2021- QB's couldnt run- 34.5 passes per game
2022- QB wasnt real mobile but ran just a little- 27.5 passes per game
2023? QB is a statue and 2 games in we are at 23 passes per.

I'm very curious as to what we will see Saturday because this will tell us what "they" want the offense to look like. You go into the season knowing you will beat SELA and also figure you wont have to show alot to beat Arizona (altho they certainly upgraded on D thru the portal). You plan to show what you got in Week 3 vs an SEC Big Dawg. We have lost our top TE already, Robinson hasnt been full speed, and Whitt is still a baby learning whats going on. So I get what could be some hesitancy to call as many passes so far. But I dont excuse it. T

Saturday should tell us alot.

I said we'd know what our team was after September is done. It was clear back in the spring that we were going to run the ball much more than Leach did. I'm good with it, but would like to see us use the TE more on passing plays. Surely, Barbay has some plays to involve the TE. I'm a 65/35 run/pass fan, but would like to see more passing as in...... to the TE, or some screen plays. We don't need to throw down field a lot.....just enough to keep the D off balance. Wish we'd see some draw plays with Woody too.

[basedog]

But he called basically 35 passes per game in 2021. Only 23 per so far this season. What's different? Could it be the HC?

Have no idea, I would be surprised Arnett being the problem. Let’s assume Arnett did say run the ball. If so why wasn’t Wright given a chance as this is what he does best. You think Arnett saying no tonWright being involved?

[Really Clark?]

I said we'd know what our team was after September is done. It was clear back in the spring that we were going to run the ball much more than Leach did. I'm good with it, but would like to see us use the TE more on passing plays. Surely, Barbay has some plays to involve the TE. I'm a 65/35 run/pass fan, but would like to see more passing as in...... to the TE, or some screen plays. We don't need to throw down field a lot.....just enough to keep the D off balance. Wish we'd see some draw plays with Woody too.

With Spivey out, I think you can only really count on Harmon as a flex TE to be able to catch consistently. None of our attached TE's have shown the ability to really be a passing weapon during the fall camp. Using Pitman and Lee as an HBack could give you a chip - release into a TE routine.

[Todd4State]

Have no idea, I would be surprised Arnett being the problem. Let’s assume Arnett did say run the ball. If so why wasn’t Wright given a chance as this is what he does best. You think Arnett saying no tonWright being involved?

If you look at Barbay's history as an OC:

1. At CMU he was the OC under Jim McElwain. I have on doubt that McElwain had a big say in the offense there.

2. He was at App State under Shawn Clark who prior to getting the head coaching job there was the co-OC. I'm sure he had some say in the offense.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I know how much say Barbay had in those offenses and his last two schools but it's pretty clear to me that he has a lot more freedom and say in the offense than he ever has before. That's why he was an unknown for me when we first hired him.

[Really Clark?]

Not to get in a huge debate but I can say what we did in practice and scrimmage this fall is not really what we have looked like offensively the first 2 games.

[basedog]

If you look at Barbay's history as an OC:

1. At CMU he was the OC under Jim McElwain. I have on doubt that McElwain had a big say in the offense there.

2. He was at App State under Shawn Clark who prior to getting the head coaching job there was the co-OC. I'm sure he had some say in the offense.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I know how much say Barbay had in those offenses and his last two schools but it's pretty clear to me that he has a lot more freedom and say in the offense than he ever has before. That's why he was an unknown for me when we first hired him.

Good points, I think he has a lot of freedom at MSU. But we shall see Saturday, I hope we have high energy with no turnovers. Gotta run more than 54 plays.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Sooooooo- why is he more vanilla now than he has ever been?

He was trying not to lose the other night and thought he was playing Texas A&M. Its not totally his fault the kids have to go play but calling 26 runs in a row aint gonna work.

They have made some big promises they are not fulfilling

[confucius say]

But he called basically 35 passes per game in 2021. Only 23 per so far this season. What's different? Could it be the HC?

More likely it's a one off. First game was in line with his normal. And he said yesterday he should have thrown more and was too conservative. So my money is on that was a one off.

[Todd4State]

Not to get in a huge debate but I can say what we did in practice and scrimmage this fall is not really what we have looked like offensively the first 2 games.

Why do you think that is?

IMO that's him overthinking everything and putting pressure on himself. Which is something Moorhead struggled with when he was here.

It feels like to me that he is all up in his head worried about sequencing plays, complimenting the defense, and then he ends up setting up nothing because he forgets about living in the moment.

[Todd4State]

He was trying not to lose the other night and thought he was playing Texas A&M. Its not totally his fault the kids have to go play but calling 26 runs in a row aint gonna work.

They have made some big promises they are not fulfilling

What did he promise?

[Todd4State]

Good points, I think he has a lot of freedom at MSU. But we shall see Saturday, I hope we have high energy with no turnovers. Gotta run more than 54 plays.

Absolutely. We're very lucky he won.

[Maverick91]

With Spivey out, I think you can only really count on Harmon as a flex TE to be able to catch consistently. None of our attached TE's have shown the ability to really be a passing weapon during the fall camp. Using Pitman and Lee as an HBack could give you a chip - release into a TE routine.

I thought this was why we brought Goede in? Was he not supposed to be our go to TE?

[Todd4State]

I thought this was why we brought Goede in? Was he not supposed to be our go to TE?

And Spivey.

Instead we're playing a guy that should be redshirting as an OL at TE.

[Really Clark?]

I thought this was why we brought Goede in? Was he not supposed to be our go to TE?

He has to perform better to be that guy

[KentuckyDawg13]

Yep. We have fans that would rather lose with ground and pound than win with throwing the ball.

MSU has never been known as a good passing team. Air Raid is the only time I can recall our passing game being the main offensive tool and our running game, which is what MSU is ALWAYS known for, suffered.

[TrapGame]

Not to get in a huge debate but I can say what we did in practice and scrimmage this fall is not really what we have looked like offensively the first 2 games.

This is why I am cautiously optimistic about Saturday.

[gtowndawg]

What did he promise?

Yeah, I'd like to know more about this as well.

[KB21]

He was trying not to lose the other night and thought he was playing Texas A&M. Its not totally his fault the kids have to go play but calling 26 runs in a row aint gonna work.

They have made some big promises they are not fulfilling

I imagine that we will have some talented receivers hit the portal in the off season.

[Maverick91]

He has to perform better to be that guy

Well that’s annoying ant he a grad transfer?

[KB21]

I still can't believe we had Drew Hollingshead on staff and decided to hire Kevin Ground and Pound Barbay. What Drew is doing at Western Kentucky from a schematic standpoint and a play calling standpoint blows what Kevin Barbay is doing away.

We could have gotten Ben Arbuckle very easily as well. Again, what he's doing at Washington State from a schematic standpoint and a play calling standpoint blows what ground and pound is doing away.

[Maroonthirteen]

I believe most of the play calls were because of what was going on. Here is a recap of the drives ...

1Q.
Rush yds. Pass yds
6 49. 7. 12. Fumble
3. 27. 1. 23. TD
2. 6. 0. 0. TD
3. 6. 0. 0. Punt

2Q. 8. 39. 2*. 6. FG
# we had 14 yard TD run called back
* pass call but no attempt, was a sack

3Q. 3. 15. 1. 15. TD
3. 9. 0. 0. Punt (we had 3rd and 1)
1. 6. 2. 21. End of quarter

4Q. 1. 1. 3. 9. Punt. 2 pass attempts on 3 pass calls, one sack
3. 9. 1. 37. FG
2. 1. 1. 0. Punt. (Only bad series imo)

OT. 1. 7. 2. 35. TD

[Leroy Jenkins]

Well that’s annoying ant he a grad transfer?

I don't think he has ever recorded a catch in a game.

[Maverick91]

I don't think he has ever recorded a catch in a game.

Unless he just sucks the dude was a 92 4 star prospect coming out of high school. Like does he just not care? Lol

I feel like raw talent alone would get him as a starter in our offense with no real TE.

[drummerdawg]

So, if the other SEC teams out-tallent us, what are we going to do schematcally to beat them? Run the pistol? How is this going to work at State? What will be our offensive advantage against SEC defenses?

[BlackSailsDawg]

MSU has never been known as a good passing team. Air Raid is the only time I can recall our passing game being the main offensive tool and our running game, which is what MSU is ALWAYS known for, suffered.

Without looking, Dak was like 68% I think, but outside of him, our systems has not attracted QBs capable of throwing well. The beared one is now a 68% passer too. That post transferring. While here, 57%.

Personally, I do not want to return to the days of 52% to 57%. It was always an issue. Can't pass, nobody respects it and they play to stop the run.

[Really Clark?]

So, if the other SEC teams out-tallent us, what are we going to do schematcally to beat them? Run the pistol? How is this going to work at State? What will be our offensive advantage against SEC defenses?

Not picking on you but a formation (run the pistol) is not a scheme. To beat a superior talented team is not really about scheme. It's about executing a play that exploits their vulnerability for the defense that's called. Example, a screen pass can take advantage of an aggressive rush / blitz if executed well. Every scheme has a screen pass, so is it really scheme or is it just the play call and execution? Now for an entire game, that's a lot more complicated but scheme alone won't win vs a superior talented team.

[Commercecomet24]

Not picking on you but a formation (run the pistol) is not a scheme. To beat a superior talented team is not really about scheme. It's about executing a play that exploits their vulnerability for the defense that's called. Example, a screen pass can take advantage of an aggressive rush / blitz if executed well. Every scheme has a screen pass, so is it really scheme or is it just the play call and execution? Now for an entire game, that's a lot more complicated but scheme alone won't win vs a superior talented team.

Bingo! I don't think a lot of folks understand this.

[Maroonthirteen]

To give an example of what Clark said, go watch the TD play in OT. That play worked well because the RB didn't go down. We fooled them. But not one AZ guy. We missed the block on him. AZ Lb got a hit on our RB. But our RB was able to break the tackle and score. LSU may have a bigger stronger LB that makes that tackle. Such a fine line on some plays.

[Commercecomet24]

To give an example of what Clark said, go watch the TD play in OT. That play worked well because the RB didn't go down. We fooled them. But not one AZ guy. We missed the block on him. AZ Lb got a hit on our RB. But our RB was able to break the tackle and score. LSU may have a bigger stronger LB that makes that tackle. Such a fine line on some plays.

Yes, makes me remember the ?inches? speech from any given sunday

[Coach34]

To give an example of what Clark said, go watch the TD play in OT. That play worked well because the RB didn't go down. We fooled them. But not one AZ guy. We missed the block on him. AZ Lb got a hit on our RB. But our RB was able to break the tackle and score. LSU may have a bigger stronger LB that makes that tackle. Such a fine line on some plays.

It was such a good playcall by BARBAY we actually had 3 guys there to block the one LB and still didnt. But Smith missing that block pisses me off. Too many times Linemen wont get their eyes up and find their target quick enough. HS OL guys are terrible at it- especially at first

[Goldendawg]

I don't think he has ever recorded a catch in a game.

I think he was deep on the GA depth chart behind their All American type TE's. Correct, I think on no catches in a college game. Only catch we have by a TE thus far is by Antonio Harmon ( a tweener WR/TE). Losing Spivey was big but we haven't even targeted TE's after all the pre-season hype. Maybe we successfully surprise LSU.

[Goldendawg]

Without looking, Dak was like 68% I think, but outside of him, our systems has not attracted QBs capable of throwing well. The beared one is now a 68% passer too. That post transferring. While here, 57%.

Personally, I do not want to return to the days of 52% to 57%. It was always an issue. Can't pass, nobody respects it and they play to stop the run.

Last couple of years, no one respected us to run. AZ didn't respect us to pass. Can we not get a little balance and make opponents guess at least a little? Saturday would be a great start. Hail State!

[Goldendawg]

I imagine that we will have some talented receivers hit the portal in the off season.

Lack of targets for the outside WR's is very concerning in the first two games, especially AZ. These guys are usually Prima Donas and want the ball. We need to get it to them and stretch the field. we need a balanced O, now.

[Commercecomet24]

It was such a good playcall by BARBAY we actually had 3 guys there to block the one LB and still didnt. But Smith missing that block pisses me off. Too many times Linemen wont get their eyes up and find their target quick enough. HS OL guys are terrible at it- especially at first

Amen to this. Goes back to that execution thing. Great playcall but Cole missed his assignment but luckily Pittman broke the tackle.

[confucius say]

Not picking on you but a formation (run the pistol) is not a scheme. To beat a superior talented team is not really about scheme. It's about executing a play that exploits their vulnerability for the defense that's called. Example, a screen pass can take advantage of an aggressive rush / blitz if executed well. Every scheme has a screen pass, so is it really scheme or is it just the play call and execution? Now for an entire game, that's a lot more complicated but scheme alone won't win vs a superior talented team.

But there are schemes that help neutralize talent disadvantages at positions. Like the air raid doesn't require an OL who can physically whip DL. Being the worst recruiter in the west, that's why it intrigued me even though it has flaws. There is a reason leach had more wins as an underdog than anybody.

Certainly multiple ways to skin a cat though.

[confucius say]

It was such a good playcall by BARBAY we actually had 3 guys there to block the one LB and still didnt. But Smith missing that block pisses me off. Too many times Linemen wont get their eyes up and find their target quick enough. HS OL guys are terrible at it- especially at first

He's missing a lot of blocks. Our OL has to pick it up quickly.

[Really Clark?]

But there are schemes that help neutralize talent disadvantages at positions. Like the air raid doesn't require an OL who can physically whip DL. Being the worst recruiter in the west, that's why it intrigued me.There is a reason leach had more wins as an underdog than anybody.

Certainly multiple ways to skin a cat though.

But Mullen's system did require a lot more physicality and totally different assignments from the OL and he won here as well. I just think too many believe in scheme when ultimately it's more about play call and execution against the defense that's called. BTW, it's a big reason CML ran so few plays and worked a lot on execution in practice. That was as much or more of what made him successful and what he believed in.

[Commercecomet24]

He's missing a lot of blocks. Our OL has to pick it up quickly.

Cole was excellent as a guard last year, physical and tough. Maybe he's just having some growing pains learning a new position in a new offense. I hope he figures it out quick though because he needs to play better.

[Really Clark?]

Cole was excellent as a guard last year, physical and tough. Maybe he's just having some growing pains learning a new position in a new offense. I hope he figures it out quick though because he needs to play better.

I'm going to be honest, it needs to happen quick or we need to adjust our line quickly Sat. At right tackle as well.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Well that?s annoying ant he a grad transfer?

That saw no action at UGA..

https://www.espn.com/college-football/player/stats/_/id/4426421/ryland-goede

From HailState

2019-2022 (Georgia)
Saw action in 19 career games for the Georgia Bulldogs from 2019-2022 ? Member of back-to-back National Championship squads.



No stats

[Commercecomet24]

I'm going to be honest, it needs to happen quick or we need to adjust our line quickly Sat. At right tackle as well.

Agreed.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Last couple of years, no one respected us to run. AZ didn't respect us to pass. Can we not get a little balance and make opponents guess at least a little? Saturday would be a great start. Hail State!

Agreed, I understand the passing was an "extension" of the ground game, but everybody played the pass. Yes we needed more balance. But it's like KB stated. Everybody had the thought of a Mike Leach Air Raid and there was never going to be another Leach Air Raid. None of those assistants that are OCs is doing that. Jr is more run than pass. Hollingshed has thrown it 88 times to 48 rushes or about 36%.

For comparison, since Arbuckle was mentioned. 84 passing attempts to 71 rushes .


Each of those run it more than Leach and is pretty balanced.

[BlackSailsDawg]

But Mullen's system did require a lot more physicality and totally different assignments from the OL and he won here as well. I just think too many believe in scheme when ultimately it's more about play call and execution against the defense that's called. BTW, it's a big reason CML ran so few plays and worked a lot on execution in practice. That was as much or more of what made him successful and what he believed in.

I think it's a combination. The real difference is at the QB position and WRs. If those can be recruited at a high level, Teams do better. It took me some time, but the proof is in the top teams:

1- UGA: Threw 492 times at 68.3% completion ratio.

2- TCU- 454 attempts at a 64.3%

3- Michigan- 370/64.3%

4- OSU- 410/66.8%

5- Bama- 438/64%

6- Tenn- 422/68.7%

7- PSU- 422/64%

8- Washington- 575/65%

9- Tulane- 379/64%

10- Utah- 446/65%

If we continue all the way down the list to those outside the top 25, you will see major deficiencies in the passing game. Fresno St ended in the top 25. They had 4 loses. Those 3 of those losses were due to the QB getting hurt. He is a 70% passer. The guy behind him sucked.

What I don't see is in the top teams a QB only completing 50 to 57% of their passes. Not even 60%.

Long way to say, that scheme can matter in that it pulls talent. We loaded up on a lot of WR and QB talent due to the scheme and RBs. And unlike what people may think, I believe we needed to run it more and feel we would have won another game, maybe 2 last year. LSU and UK. But that's just personal opinion.

You are not going to pull in great WRs and QBs into a system that only throws it 15 times in regulation. You aren't going to pull them throwing 25 times per game either.

[Commercecomet24]

I think it's a combination. The real difference is at the QB position and WRs. If those can be recruited at a high level, Teams do better. It took me some time, but the proof is in the top teams:

1- UGA: Threw 492 times at 68.3% completion ratio.

2- TCU- 454 attempts at a 64.3%

3- Michigan- 370/64.3%

4- OSU- 410/66.8%

5- Bama- 438/64%

6- Tenn- 422/68.7%

7- PSU- 422/64%

8- Washington- 575/65%

9- Tulane- 379/64%

10- Utah- 446/65%

If we continue all the way down the list to those outside the top 25, you will see major deficiencies in the passing game. Fresno St ended in the top 25. They had 4 loses. Those 3 of those losses were due to the QB getting hurt. He is a 70% passer. The guy behind him sucked.

What I don't see is in the top teams a QB only completing 50 to 57% of their passes. Not even 60%.

Long way to say, that scheme can matter in that it pulls talent. We loaded up on a lot of WR and QB talent due to the scheme and RBs. And unlike what people may think, I believe we needed to run it more and feel we would have won another game, maybe 2 last year. LSU and UK. But that's just personal opinion.

You are not going to pull in great WRs and QBs into a system that only throws it 15 times in regulation. You aren't going to pull them throwing 25 times per game either.

That's good info and I agree. You have to be around 65% completion pct to be successful and there also needs to be balance. We went from one extreme to the other from last year to the first 2 games this year.

[confucius say]

But Mullen's system did require a lot more physicality and totally different assignments from the OL and he won here as well. I just think too many believe in scheme when ultimately it's more about play call and execution against the defense that's called. BTW, it's a big reason CML ran so few plays and worked a lot on execution in practice. That was as much or more of what made him successful and what he believed in.

Yea mullen scheme can win here no doubt. KB too. Didn't win as an underdog really, but whatever. He won games.

The biggest thing is players imo. Dan had a bunch of nfl guys, to his credit. Including a likely hall of fame qb. We don't have many nfl guys playing right now.

[confucius say]

I'm going to be honest, it needs to happen quick or we need to adjust our line quickly Sat. At right tackle as well.

Yep. Our OL is old but very meh in this scheme right now. Need to gel quickly.

[BlackSailsDawg]

That's good info and I agree. You have to be around 65% completion pct to be successful and there also needs to be balance. We went from one extreme to the other from last year to the first 2 games this year.

Like everybody else, I hope we correct that vs LSU

Also, @ReallyClark stated execution and how Leach accomplished that. Reps. Unrelenting reps

[KB21]

Like everybody else, I hope we correct that vs LSU

Also, @ReallyClark stated execution and how Leach accomplished that. Reps. Unrelenting reps

One of my concerns with a "multiple" offense is whether they try to run so many things that they end up losing practice reps and ultimately execution. In the NFL, there are no practice time limits that allow teams to be very multiple. In college, you have 20 hours per week.

[Homedawg]

Just got giggles I looked up nfl stats for yardage vs wins.
Teams that had the most total yards went 11-5. Teams that had the most passing yards went 11-5. Teams that had the w most rushing yards went 10-6. But funny, the teams with most passing attempts went 3-12. Hmm. Cowboys, dolphins and rams won and threw it more than opponent. But the dolphins were the only one w a high ratio pass vs run. And w those weapons. I don't blame em.

[Commercecomet24]

Just got giggles I looked up nfl stats for yardage vs wins.
Teams that had the most total yards went 11-5. Teams that had the most passing yards went 11-5. Teams that had the w most rushing yards went 10-6. But funny, the teams with most passing attempts went 3-12. Hmm. Cowboys, dolphins and rams won and threw it more than opponent. But the dolphins were the only one w a high ratio pass vs run. And w those weapons. I don't blame em.

I watched the greatest qb of all time throw 65 passes in a playoff game this past January and get absolutely blown out by the cowboys l.

[Homedawg]

To add-nfl again- the teams who threw it 37 times or more went 1-10. Teams that threw it less than 30 went 9-0. But kb carry on w your running it ever is stupid. And I'm certainly not against throwing it. But it doesn't have to be all or nothing. On either end.

[Commercecomet24]

To add-nfl again- the teams who threw it 37 times or more went 1-10. Teams that threw it less than 30 went 9-0. But kb carry on w your running it ever is stupid. And I'm certainly not against throwing it. But it doesn't have to be all or nothing. On either end.

Good post! I don't care what you're doing in sports or life, there has to be a balance. And balance doesn't necessarily mean 50/50 pass/run plays in football but more about being efficient and successful. I look more at yards gained, yards per play in the pass/run game for balance as opposed to 35 pass plays/35 run plays in a game. It's not about how many of each type of play you run but how successful you are at running those plays. Has to be balance.

[Maverick91]

Good post! I don't care what you're doing in sports or life, there has to be a balance. And balance doesn't necessarily mean 50/50 pass/run plays in football but more about being efficient and successful. I look more at yards gained, yards per play in the pass/run game for balance as opposed to 35 pass plays/35 run plays in a game. It's not about how many of each type of play you run but how successful you are at running those plays. Has to be balance.

Agreed. I like 60-65% sitting on the beach nice breeze in Cabo to 35-40% flying to my Aspen mountainside estate in the winter for skying.

[Commercecomet24]

Agreed. I like 60-65% sitting on the beach nice breeze in Cabo to 35-40% flying to my Aspen mountainside estate in the winter for skying.

Same here! Although Jones County is nice during August lol!

[Maverick91]

Same here! Although Jones County is nice during August lol!

Hahaha not nicer than Mobile Bay with a low tide.

[Commercecomet24]

Hahaha not nicer than Mobile Bay with a low tide.

Man i don't know about that, lol!

[HancockCountyDog]

What did he promise?

I respect Bucky for not answering, so I will just share what I was told by people that know certain players that flirted with the portal.

One - They were keeping the Air Raid system, but just incorporating more run concepts.

Two - They were going to pass the ball more than they ran it, and they needed WRs to make plays.

After two games, if that was said, I could understand some frustration by certain players.

[Cooterpoot]

You're going to see some old air raid this week. Just have to see how much.

[Todd4State]

You're going to see some old air raid this week. Just have to see how much.

That's the only prayer this team has on offense.

[TrapGame]

You're going to see some old air raid this week. Just have to see how much.

Josh Pate just said in his new video today: "If you think State is going to come out with the same run first game plan vs LSU they had against Arizona, y'all are probably gonna be shocked."

He expects Will to come out throwing the ball a lot in the first quarter.

[KB21]

I'll believe it when I see it.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Josh Pate just said in his new video today: "If you think State is going to come out with the same run first game plan vs LSU they had against Arizona, y'all are probably gonna be shocked."

He expects Will to come out throwing the ball a lot in the first quarter.

I would be impressed.

[confucius say]

Too many people talking about us throwing the ball this week for it not to be true.

[Homedawg]

Somebody check on kb. Eagles just ran it 7 straight times. 13 outta 16 on the drive and scored a td.

[HancockCountyDog]

Somebody check on kb. Eagles just ran it 7 straight times. 13 outta 16 on the drive and scored a td.

Well I guess you are advocating for Mike Wright for our QB, because he is a lot closer to Hurts in college than Will.

[Homedawg]

Well I guess you are advocating for Mike Wright for our QB, because he is a lot closer to Hurts in college than Will.

Nope. Have to be able to throw it. Just use Will properly. Let him throw it. Just not every down.