Buy or Sell Cintje

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Gets moved to a position player SS or 2nd in the Minors

[AlSwearengen]

That arm would be nice to have at SS.

[KOdawg1]

I think the switch pitching thing is a little gimmicky.

It's gonna be hard to develop at a high level when you have to split your focus.

He could be pretty good from the right side I think. Could see him transferring though

[CaptainObvious]

I buy that he may be playing somewhere else next season along with about 10 others. If I am a parent and Lemonis is back, we are in the portal the day it is announced. Lemonis lost this team. When a team quits on the last day of the season you sure don?t have their respect.

[Really Clark?]

I buy that he may be playing somewhere else next season along with about 10 others. If I am a parent and Lemonis is back, we are in the portal the day it is announced. Lemonis lost this team. When a team quits on the last day of the season you sure don?t have their respect.

Dude, he didn't lose the team, realizing they are out of conference tournament is what lost the team. The team has fought hard the last several games. Not saying I'm against a change at all, but it's not because he lost the team.

[HoopsDawg]

Gets moved to a position player SS or 2nd in the Minors

I think you have to buy since that's where he was drafted.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

That arm would be nice to have at SS.
What about this? Cintje at SS, Mershon at 2nd, Dakota at CF and Highfill at Catcher. That is pretty strong up the middle.

[SpaceBully]

He's had no coaching to improve his development. I think he transfers out to look for someone who can make him a better pitcher.

[maroonmania]

Dude, he didn't lose the team, realizing they are out of conference tournament is what lost the team. The team has fought hard the last several games. Not saying I'm against a change at all, but it's not because he lost the team.

Agree, last night's 9th inning is what lost the team. Today may as well have been an exhibition game.

[msstate7]

If he's a legit ss, I'd try to sell him on playing SS and a rh reliever

[CaptainObvious]

Dude, he didn't lose the team, realizing they are out of conference tournament is what lost the team. The team has fought hard the last several games. Not saying I'm against a change at all, but it's not because he lost the team.

I stand corrected. They love him. Who wouldn?t. You can be on the team, have the girls ogle and aww you and not have to perform to 25% of your ability. They will all be yucking it up and partying in the District tonight and talking about how great it will be next year with their drinking Buddy as their head coach again.

[CaptainObvious]

Man. Ya got to feel bad for a guy like Wil Hoyle. Transfers to State to play for Lemonis and meanwhile his former Duke team is in the Top 10. Reality Check Young Man. Green Grass and such.

[Really Clark?]

I stand corrected. They love him. Who wouldn?t. You can be on the team, have the girls ogle and aww you and not have to perform to 25% of your ability. They will all be yucking it up and partying in the District tonight and talking about how great it will be next year with their drinking Buddy as their head coach again.

You can spout irrelevant crap all you want, he didn't lose the team. They played liked crap, he didn't develop, missed evaluations, etc. all are true but he didn't lose the locker room.

[TNDawg35]

The kid come to State cause he wanted to pitch. He needs a good pitching coach and he will be elite. Please for the love of god stop thinking every FRESHMAN is dog shit cause they aren’t throwing 7 innings of 2 hit baseball. The kid has everything to be elite, just needs a good pitching coach to guide him.

Some of y’all need to relax. I have never in my life seen a fan base try to Will bad stuff on themselves like some of y’all do…

[EdwardDrayton]

Cintje will be a pitcher with the right development. Lose the switch pitching.

[SpaceWranglerDawg]

The kid come to State cause he wanted to pitch. He needs a good pitching coach and he will be elite. Please for the love of god stop thinking every FRESHMAN is dog shit cause they aren’t throwing 7 innings of 2 hit baseball. The kid has everything to be elite, just needs a good pitching coach to guide him.

Some of y’all need to relax. I have never in my life seen a fan base try to Will bad stuff on themselves like some of y’all do…

Agreed, he will be fine. All the freshman that would have come in and instantly been lights out are all in minor league baseball right now.

[msstate7]

We don't have to will bad stuff on us... Lemonis brings in live in real life

[KOdawg1]

The kid come to State cause he wanted to pitch. He needs a good pitching coach and he will be elite. Please for the love of god stop thinking every FRESHMAN is dog shit cause they aren’t throwing 7 innings of 2 hit baseball. The kid has everything to be elite, just needs a good pitching coach to guide him.

Some of y’all need to relax. I have never in my life seen a fan base try to Will bad stuff on themselves like some of y’all do…

We don't will bad stuff on ourselves.

Our team does that on their own.

[Mjoelner34]

The kid come to State cause he wanted to pitch. Please for the love of god stop thinking every FRESHMAN is dog shit cause they aren’t throwing 7 innings of 2 hit baseball. The kid has everything to be elite, just needs a good pitching coach to guide him.

Some of y’all need to relax. I have never in my life seen a fan base try to Will bad stuff on themselves like some of y’all do…

My question is what pitching coach that could do that is going to sign on with the sword of Damocles hanging over his head if Lemonis is back?

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

My question is what pitching coach that could do that is going to sign on with the sword of Damocles hanging over his head if Lemonis is back?

A coach that wants to get paid

A coach that believes they're a good enough PC to save Lemonis

A coach that wants to get into the SEC

Could we hire a proven coach from a big school? No. Could we hire the PC from a G5? Yes. Do I know what PCs in the G5 are good? No. But their are ELITE PCs none of us know the name of who'd love to get a 4x pay bump and a shot in the SEC. I don't trust Lemonis to find them, but I'm not goi g to say we CAN'T make a good hire just because of Lemonis being on a hot seat

[Saltydog]

A coach that wants to get paid

A coach that believes they're a good enough PC to save Lemonis

A coach that wants to get into the SEC

Could we hire a proven coach from a big school? No. Could we hire the PC from a G5? Yes. Do I know what PCs in the G5 are good? No. But their are ELITE PCs none of us know the name of who'd love to get a 4x pay bump and a shot in the SEC. I don't trust Lemonis to find them, but I'm not goi g to say we CAN'T make a good hire just because of Lemonis being on a hot seat

I just dont' get all the blame on the pitching coach. Proper coaching was only a small part of the problem, IMO. The bigger issue is talent, or lack thereof. I don't think Leon Mazzone or Dave Duncan could've done much with our staff. So, in the end it's talent and that's on fat boy slim.

[CaptainObvious]

State May keep Lemonis another year, but not even F. Lee Bailey will keep him from walking the plank next year. If State extends him another year, heads should roll. He should work under no contract extension with strict goals to achieve. No BS like squeaking into Hoover as a 9-12 seed. No Tuesday game in Hoover next year. Minimum Top 8 SEC seed. And it gets harder next year with Okra and Tahas coming in.

[Coach34]

My question is what pitching coach that could do that is going to sign on with the sword of Damocles hanging over his head if Lemonis is back?

Lemon's college roommate is a G5 PC. He'll find one

[Homedawg]

Gets moved to a position player SS or 2nd in the Minors

Sell. He's gonna be a rhp only

[Pancho]

and throw consistent for more than 3 innings?

[Coach34]

and throw consistent for more than 3 innings?

He's an 18 year old Freshman. Are you seriously judging where he will be 2 years from now in his development?

[sandjunky]

Gets moved to a position player SS or 2nd in the Minors

Sell

LSU will rehab his pitching

[Pancho]

He's an 18 year old Freshman. Are you seriously judging where he will be 2 years from now in his development?

yes

[The Federalist Engineer]

Obviously- the player is a keeper.

But if someone gives him 50K in NIL money. Then bye.

He seems 75% likely to suck, 20% likely to be ok, and 5% likely to be an All American.

We have seen All Americans before, they don't get rocked like this dude. Ethan Small as a freshman is the eternal hope for the bad freshman. We even had Cerantola fans claim he was Ethan Small 2.0.

Texas AM or LSU can buy him this summer.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Obviously- the player is a keeper.

But if someone gives him 50K in NIL money. Then bye.

He seems 75% likely to suck, 20% likely to be ok, and 5% likely to be an All American.

We have seen All Americans before, they don't get rocked like this dude. Ethan Small as a freshman is the eternal hope for the bad freshman. We even had Cerantola fans claim he was Ethan Small 2.0.

Texas AM or LSU can buy him this summer.

Ok. So say we let the Fr who throws 97 right handed and 95 left handed and has never had real pitching walk because he's not CURRENTLY a stud.

Who so you replace him with? You know of a 97mph stud we can replace him with? Personally I'd rather use the new stud to replace one of our non-SEC arms

[Coach34]

Stick to grilling and making cheese dip for games. Loo has some great tools on the mound. He's just learning how to pitch

[The Federalist Engineer]

Sell

LSU will rehab his pitching

FIFY. "LSU will offer to rehab his pitching". Based on results in BR they will TJ both his arms.

If Lemonis can get the USM PC by paying him a USM Head Coach salary, MSU is the best place in the SEC for any pitcher.

Lemons should transfer part of his salary for the purpose.

[EdwardDrayton]

Stick to grilling and making cheese dip for games. Loo has some great tools on the mound. He's just learning how to pitch

^^^^^^

[Really Clark?]

FIFY. "LSU will offer to rehab his pitching". Based on results in BR they will TJ both his arms.

If Lemonis can get the USM PC by paying him a USM Head Coach salary, MSU is the best place in the SEC for any pitcher.

Lemons should transfer part of his salary for the purpose.

He is most likely taking over for Berry at USM at the end of the season.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Stick to grilling and making cheese dip for games. Loo has some great tools on the mound. He's just learning how to pitch

Your comment is exactly the issue. A MLB prospect at 18 can be raw and inconsistent, they won't need him in the Big Leagues until the player is 22 or 23. Minor league stats barely matter for top picks, it's all development.

For College baseball, the team needs to win now. You want Alex Lange or Paul Maholm, good from Freshman to Junior. If the development gap is too huge, then you might exceed the 2 year limit before the next draft. Dakota Hudson was good but took two years, he wanted to transfer. Graham Ascraft was good potentially and did transfer. It was smart and good to have JC recruited, what is happening is part of nature for college baseball.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Your comment is exactly the issue. A MLB prospect at 18 can be raw and inconsistent, they won't need him in the Big Leagues until the player is 22 or 23. Minor league stats barely matter for top picks, it's all development.

For College baseball, the team needs to win now. You want Alex Lange or Paul Maholm, good from Freshman to Junior. If the development gap is too huge, then you might exceed the 2 year limit before the next draft. Dakota Hudson was good but took two years, he wanted to transfer. Graham Ascraft was good potentially and did transfer. It was smart and good to have JC recruited, what is happening is part of nature for college baseball.

"Just recruit guys that are studs for 3 years"

Yeah that's easier said than done. Everyone wants that. But when the last roster spot is either A) a high potential project, or B) A guy with zero SEC potential (Yntema) then why not take the loto number?

[The Federalist Engineer]

"Just recruit guys that are studs for 3 years"

Yeah that's easier said than done. Everyone wants that. But when the last roster spot is either A) a high potential project, or B) A guy with zero SEC potential (Yntema) then why not take the loto number?

We are talking the Optionality post recruitment. Like you said the Alex Lange is rare. But once you see it up close, you need to determine what you can do with the project.

Coaches now have close up look at work ethic, determination, and coachabiity. A new decision point is reached.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We are talking the Optionality post recruitment. Like you said the Alex Lange is rare. But once you see it up close, you need to determine what you can do with the project.

Coaches now have close up look at work ethic, determination, and coachabiity. A new decision point is reached.

And Loo has a great arm, fights on the mound, seems to support his teammates, and hasn't had any decent coaching yet.

You can't simultaneously say "other SEC programs will offer him decent NIL money" and "we should t care if he leaves". Unless you're saying we're so loaded at pitching that we can afford to dump our projects, but that's obviously not the case.

I mean if we're down to our last NIL dollar and are deciding between Loo or a surefire stud from the portal yeah, let's get the stud, but I doubt that'll happen. I mean we have NIL to Hancock and Stinnett, surely Loo will make the list of guys to keep

[Pancho]

can Loo receive any NIL money?

[Coach34]

We are talking the Optionality post recruitment. Like you said the Alex Lange is rare. But once you see it up close, you need to determine what you can do with the project.

Coaches now have close up look at work ethic, determination, and coachabiity. A new decision point is reached.

Our problem has been getting too many guys like that. Holcombe's big country ass is another. Power arm with potential. Loftin walked too many this year but didnt give up many hits. These guys have been having to throw too many innings in Y1 of SEC ball. And Loftin didnt even finish the season. But those 3 should have good Soph seasons if healthy and coached.

[sandjunky]

Our problem has been getting too many guys like that. Holcombe's big country ass is another. Power arm with potential. Loftin walked too many this year but didnt give up many hits. These guys have been having to throw too many innings in Y1 of SEC ball. And Loftin didnt even finish the season. But those 3 should have good Soph seasons if healthy and coached.
Loftin?s arm was in a sling in the dugout

What is the story on that?

[The Federalist Engineer]

And Loo has a great arm, fights on the mound, seems to support his teammates, and hasn't had any decent coaching yet.

You can't simultaneously say "other SEC programs will offer him decent NIL money" and "we should t care if he leaves". Unless you're saying we're so loaded at pitching that we can afford to dump our projects, but that's obviously not the case.

I mean if we're down to our last NIL dollar and are deciding between Loo or a surefire stud from the portal yeah, let's get the stud, but I doubt that'll happen. I mean we have NIL to Hancock and Stinnett, surely Loo will make the list of guys to keep

I'm talking generically. I don't know these players personally up close. What we are talking is "buy or sell ". I say definitely keep. But if it's a question of money, you have to compare production to price. That's all.

Even in pre-NIL time, I think MSU had to "renegotiate" Graham Ascrafts slice of the 11.7 and he transferred as a result. If Ascraft was BJ Wallace in production, he gets 1 of 11.7, but he wasn't. Nor did he show promise of being that productive. I think he was a 97/98 mph pitcher.

[Coach34]

Loftin?s arm was in a sling in the dugout

What is the story on that?

a little clean up. He'll be fine for the Fall. Summer off will probably be great for him

[Cowbell]

Stick to grilling and making cheese dip for games. Loo has some great tools on the mound. He's just learning how to pitch

Yeah a kid that is a weekend starter in the SEC as a freshman... and has obviously hit his freshman wall. These are some ridiculous takes.

[somebodyshotmypaw]

Ok. So say we let the Fr who throws 97 right handed and 95 left handed and has never had real pitching walk because he's not CURRENTLY a stud.

Who so you replace him with? You know of a 97mph stud we can replace him with? Personally I'd rather use the new stud to replace one of our non-SEC arms

This is one of the issues. The whole post talks about velocity. It talks about our freshman who throws 97 and 95. It talks about replacing him with someone who throw 97. It never mentions ?can our player, or the replacement, actually pitch and get people out?. Folks would rather have a guy who throw 98 with an ERA of 9.00, over one that throws 89 with an ERA of 2.25. It?s all about velocity today.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

This is one of the issues. The whole post talks about velocity. It talks about our freshman who throws 97 and 95. It talks about replacing him with someone who throw 97. It never mentions ?can our player, or the replacement, actually pitch and get people out?. Folks would rather have a guy who throw 98 with an ERA of 9.00, over one that throws 89 with an ERA of 2.25. It?s all about velocity today.

It's not ALL about velo, but velo is very important when it comes to how good a pitcher can be. Like a offensive tackle needs to be tall with quick feet, or a Power Forward needs to be taller than the point guard. You still need to know how to block a DE or make a move in the paint, but without the measurable you can't be elite

For pitchers, obviously I'd rather have the 89 guy with the low ERA. But not many 89 guys have a low era. Take Skenes- lower that velo 8 mph and he wouldn't be the stud he is

[somebodyshotmypaw]

It's not ALL about velo, but velo is very important when it comes to how good a pitcher can be. Like a offensive tackle needs to be tall with quick feet, or a Power Forward needs to be taller than the point guard. You still need to know how to block a DE or make a move in the paint, but without the measurable you can't be elite

For pitchers, obviously I'd rather have the 89 guy with the low ERA. But not many 89 guys have a low era. Take Skenes- lower that velo 8 mph and he wouldn't be the stud he is

Extremely fair point. But I wouldn’t want Greg Maddux if he raised his velocity by 4 mph by overthrowing, resulting in an injury or total lack of control which results in 5 walks per inning. The name of the game on the mound is not velocity. It’s getting people out and preventing them from scoring.

[schddog72]

You can spout irrelevant crap all you want, he didn't lose the team. They played liked crap, he didn't develop, missed evaluations, etc. all are true but he didn't lose the locker room.

And you KNOW this how? Or is this a classified, eyes-only, need-to-know secret??

[ZedFedder]

Loo just tweeted out Hail State. I don?t think he?s leaving? not yet anyway.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Extremely fair point. But I wouldn’t want Greg Maddux if he raised his velocity by 4 mph by overthrowing, resulting in an injury or total lack of control which results in 5 walks per inning. The name of the game on the mound is not velocity. It’s getting people out and preventing them from scoring.

I don't disagree, but it's math. For every 1 slow throwing Maddox, there's 99 slow throwers that get shelled. For every 1 hard thrower with good numbers there's 4 hard throwers that never figured out how to pitch, and 5 hard throwers that got injured. Therefore, the MLB drafts 10 hard throwers to get 1 to pan out vs 100 slow throwers to get 1 to pan out.

It's like a short slow WR. Yeah he might have great hands or clean routes or block pretty good, but his ceiling is capped. His taller faster teammate still needs to catch the ball, run good routes, and block, but we all know which guy out of HS we'd rather sign. I understand baseball has the smaller roster limits and that makes taking "developmental" players more of a risk, but fundamentally it's the same concept to taking a raw athlete in football and coaching them up