Basketball program destroyed - long 11 years

[Dawsonmsu]

Will our basketball team ever be relevant again?

[Joebob]

If Jans can recruit, it absolutely will.

[mparkerfd20]

Nope. Never.

[msstate7]

No.

Anytime we come close to turning a corner a team will come out and shoot 80% from 3 like tonight. This program is cursed, and im done investing my time and give-a-shit. Im out

[Dawg2003]

It's crazy to think how long ago it was that we were relevant. With NIL, you need a lot more money to get players, so I don't see us being relevant again anytime soon.

[Coach34]

Meanwhile Western Kentucky is 11-7 and 3-4 in Conference USA under the guy that destroyed the program

[Gutter Cobreh]

Meanwhile Western Kentucky is 11-7 and 3-4 in Conference USA under the guy that destroyed the program

Did he destroy it or did a current Colorado assistant coach??? Lots of blame to go around...

[somebodyshotmypaw]

Meanwhile Western Kentucky is 11-7 and 3-4 in Conference USA under the guy that destroyed the program

Agreed it was destroyed under Stans. When he let cancers like Dee Bost, Renardo Sidney, etc. do their destruction with no accountability, it all went down hill. When you have cancer, you cut it out or nuke it. It’s the only way.

[Coach34]

Did he destroy it or did a current Colorado assistant coach??? Lots of blame to go around...

Stands let it rot from within and then we made an absolute terrible hire behind it. So you can say it started with Stands and the Cheerleader helped kill it

Cant blame Ray- he never should have gotten the job

[PGHBulldogBG]

Not defending it, but our basketball history has been terrible overall since I remember being old enough to watch State which was in the mid 90s. 2 great seasons under Williams. A great season in 2004 under Stans. A nice tournament SEC tourney run under Stans in 2009. That’s basically the highlights of MSU basketball in my lifetime that I can remember. No matter who takes this job it’s difficult. This year is still less frustrating than the Howland years because we underachieved every year with him. This isn’t really an underachievement we just don’t have the players to compete with Bama or UT. We are going to be looking at a Rick Ray year though if we don’t beat UF Saturday. It’s a must win to keep our team bought in. The schedule gets lighter in February and we need to take advantage of that.

[EdwardDrayton]

Stands let it rot from within and then we made an absolute terrible hire behind it. So you can say it started with Stands and the Cheerleader helped kill it

Cant blame Ray- he never should have gotten the job

An excellent characterization of what transpired.

[EdwardDrayton]

The jury is still out on Jans. We'll see.

[maroonmania]

Not defending it, but our basketball history has been terrible overall since I remember being old enough to watch State which was in the mid 90s. 2 great seasons under Williams. A great season in 2004 under Stans. A nice tournament SEC tourney run under Stans in 2009. That’s basically the highlights of MSU basketball in my lifetime that I can remember. No matter who takes this job it’s difficult. This year is still less frustrating than the Howland years because we underachieved every year with him. This isn’t really an underachievement we just don’t have the players to compete with Bama or UT. We are going to be looking at a Rick Ray year though if we don’t beat UF Saturday. It’s a must win to keep our team bought in. The schedule gets lighter in February and we need to take advantage of that.

We got an SEC championship in 1991. That was a really nice year as well. I've quit watching this year though. A team that can't score has little to no hope in this day and age of basketball when playing a good team.

[PGHBulldogBG]

The jury is still out on Jans. We'll see.

I don’t doubt his coaching ability but we have to see how he recruits. I’m still 100 percent behind Jans. He seems to beat all the teams he is supposed to beat. We got dealt a bad first half SEC schedule. Even UGA is much improved at 3-1 and currently winning at Rupp arena

[BHildreth3]

Give the f'n guy a chance. It's its 1st f'n year. Ya'll suck as fans. No one is patient anymore. This is a program that is years away from being solid under him. Give him another year before you bitch about it.

[EdwardDrayton]

Give the f'n guy a chance. It's its 1st f'n year. Ya'll suck as fans. No one is patient anymore. This is a program that is years away from being solid under him. Give him another year before you bitch about it.

Don't see anyone here calling for Coach Jans ouster, Karen.

[confucius say]

Jans will be fine. Total faith in that guy.

Running stans off remains one of the dumbest moves in our history.

[tcdog70]

No.

Anytime we come close to turning a corner a team will come out and shoot 80% from 3 like tonight. This program is cursed, and im done investing my time and give-a-shit. Im out

Great does that mean you will quit posting your negative shit?

[msstate7]

Jans will be fine. Total faith in that guy.

Running stans off remains one of the dumbest moves in our history.

If we had a good class instead of one of the worst in the sec in recent years, I'd have more faith

[Dawsonmsu]

Jan’s is a good coach for sure. Just worried the long term damage incurred from Ray and Howland will carry over during his tenure. Hard to remove the demons.

[EdwardDrayton]

Jans will be fine. Total faith in that guy.

Running stans off remains one of the dumbest moves in our history.

Total faith at this stage is unfounded; he has to show he can recruit.

Stans had to go and it was his fault he had to go.

[Rawdawg]

Jan’s is a good coach for sure. Just worried the long term damage incurred from Ray and Howland will carry over during his tenure. Hard to remove the demons.

There is no long term damage from the Howland era. I hate to tell you this but the best players on this team Howland signed.

[Coach34]

Running stans off remains one of the dumbest moves in our history.

Wrong. People still dont get that we would have hit rock bottom the next year with him as coach. I wish we had so that we wouldnt have this doubt by a few people today. Our admin tried to fix it before it hit rock bottom but instead hired an anchor. Their bad hire to replace him doesnt mean he didnt need to be replaced

[PGHBulldogBG]

Jans will be fine. Total faith in that guy.

Running stans off remains one of the dumbest moves in our history.

The same Stans that has been unsuccessful at WKU in a conference they should dominate? Or the one that lost to a 2 win Louisville team?

[Coach34]

The same Stans that has been unsuccessful at WKU in a conference they should dominate? Or the one that lost to a 2 win Louisville team?

Its not an accident Stands hasnt done shit since leaving State

[Cooterpoot]

11 years? We haven't beaten a top 10 team in 21 years. Twenty 17ing one years! At this point, we could eliminate basketball and our fans wouldn't even know.

[Cowbell]

11 years? We haven't beaten a top 10 team in 21 years. Twenty 17ing one years! At this point, we could eliminate basketball and our fans wouldn't even know.

And our finances would be better off....

[CaptainObvious]

And our finances would be better off....

Could build a hell of a parking garage in that space. 8 floors for 2400 cars.

[BuckyIsAB****]

I used to be all in for it. Watched every game I could when I was a kid of Lawrence Roberts and Shane Power. Charles Rhodes and Ravern Johnson. But at some point mainly after the fight in Hawaii and the refs hosing us vs UK in Starkville I just lost it and it has never came back. I just think the product itself is so bad. March madness is fun but only to root for the smallest of small schools. Like the fighting golden retrievers beating Virginia that year. Its close to unwatchable

[msu15]

Stands let it rot from within and then we made an absolute terrible hire behind it. So you can say it started with Stands and the Cheerleader helped kill it

Cant blame Ray- he never should have gotten the job

Bingo. I'll always go back and forth on whether we should have fired Stans or not, but you absolutely can not make that move and proceed to hire a Rick Ray.

[BuckyIsAB****]

I will add that I do like Jans. Those kids play hard every night and that is what has to come first. Howland didnt always demand that. You can be Bear Bryant or Adolph Rupp but you better have some players regardless of sport

[SpaceBully]

No.

Anytime we come close to turning a corner a team will come out and shoot 80% from 3 like tonight. This program is cursed, and im done investing my time and give-a-shit. Im out

And Vescovi didn't even play.

[SpaceBully]

I'd give Jans more than a fair shot at it. What have we got to lose. We can't keep turning over the program. Think I'd give him at least 5-6 years.

[NCMSTFAN]

Basketball in today's age is easy to get turned around if you have good coaching, the biggest question is can you bring in recruits. I have faith is Jans as a coach, especially on the defensive side of the ball but I just don't know how many highly ranked recruits he can get to Starkville. Our best players are all currently Howlands guys, one thing Howland was doing was bringing in 4 star guys and even a few 5 star. I just don't see Jans getting those guys right now but that's how you win games in this league.

[Eric Nies Grind Time]

Basketball in today's age is easy to get turned around if you have good coaching, the biggest question is can you bring in recruits. I have faith is Jans as a coach, especially on the defensive side of the ball but I just don't know how many highly ranked recruits he can get to Starkville. Our best players are all currently Howlands guys, one thing Howland was doing was bringing in 4 star guys and even a few 5 star. I just don't see Jans getting those guys right now but that's how you win games in this league.

Really hoping we are spenders for some transfers.

[LC Dawg]

Our last three ADs all played a part in hurting our basketball program. Byrnes reseated the Hump which hurt a damn good atmosphere with the students on the side and later led to a near completely empty lower level, Stricklin hired Rick Ray, and Cohen basically moved baseball ahead of basketball in importance. Add that to the fact that a lot of Mississippi State fans and even athletic administrators think baseball is more important than basketball and it's not surprising where our program is. Richard Williams was a good coach and had a talented team that got hot at the right time and went to the Final Four and I enjoyed every second of it but that was 27 years ago. We will never get back to the Final Four without significant changes in our athletic department. Schools that care about basketball build new arenas - not throw a little money at an almost 50 year old relic.

[EdwardDrayton]

Our last three ADs all played a part in hurting our basketball program. Byrnes reseated the Hump which hurt a damn good atmosphere with the students on the side and later led to a near completely empty lower level, Stricklin hired Rick Ray, and Cohen basically moved baseball ahead of basketball in importance. Add that to the fact that a lot of Mississippi State fans and even athletic administrators think baseball is more important than basketball and it's not surprising where our program is. Richard Williams was a good coach and had a talented team that got hot at the right time and went to the Final Four and I enjoyed every second of it but that was 27 years ago. We will never get back to the Final Four without significant changes in our athletic department. Schools that care about basketball build new arenas - not throw a little money at an almost 50 year old relic.

Yep. Time to stop putting lipstick on the pig. Build new.

[Political Hack]

We have an identity. We have a system. We have a program. That's a start. Jans is actually doing a good job with what he has, but he's got to go recruit some scorers. Defense is great and we have a solid identity to build off of, but we have to be able to score more consistently.

[Coach34]

Our last three ADs all played a part in hurting our basketball program. Byrnes reseated the Hump which hurt a damn good atmosphere with the students on the side and later led to a near completely empty lower level, Stricklin hired Rick Ray, and Cohen basically moved baseball ahead of basketball in importance. Add that to the fact that a lot of Mississippi State fans and even athletic administrators think baseball is more important than basketball and it's not surprising where our program is. Richard Williams was a good coach and had a talented team that got hot at the right time and went to the Final Four and I enjoyed every second of it but that was 27 years ago. We will never get back to the Final Four without significant changes in our athletic department. Schools that care about basketball build new arenas - not throw a little money at an almost 50 year old relic.

Agree about the 3 AD's contributing but I do think you are slighting the 1996 team a little. Did they get hot at the right time? Sure. But they were also a very good basketball team that had been to the Sweet 16 the year before returning 4 starters. Dontae was added and ended up being just the right catalyst.

[LC Dawg]

Agree about the 3 AD's contributing but I do think you are slighting the 1996 team a little. Did they get hot at the right time? Sure. But they were also a very good basketball team that had been to the Sweet 16 the year before returning 4 starters. Dontae was added and ended up being just the right catalyst.

Absolutely. They were a national championship caliber team. It wasn't meant as a slight but to point out that it is doable at Mississippi State but that was 27 years ago and some things will have to change at Mississippi State for it to happen again.
Richard Williams did a great job building the program to that point. I liked the '91 SEC champion team as much as the Final Four team. Maybe even a little more.

[tcdog70]

Wrong. People still dont get that we would have hit rock bottom the next year with him as coach. I wish we had so that we wouldnt have this doubt by a few people today. Our admin tried to fix it before it hit rock bottom but instead hired an anchor. Their bad hire to replace him doesnt mean he didnt need to be replaced

Coach--as time has past--and you being a smart guy--just admit you were wrong on Stans. If he had stayed we would have continued to be a top 5 team in the SEC. the proof is in the pudding--his record would show only 2 (maybe 3) teams had a winning record against Him.. the fact that He beat the living shit at Ole Miss was reason alone to have at least given Him another year. Since then we had not had a Coach come close to Him. We always had a top player and sure He could have done better as a bench Coach. But we would have been a 20 win team every year.

[Liverpooldawg]

Meanwhile Western Kentucky is 11-7 and 3-4 in Conference USA under the guy that destroyed the program

The people that ran him off WHEN they did are the ones that destroyed the program.

[R2Dawg]

Not defending it, but our basketball history has been terrible overall since I remember being old enough to watch State which was in the mid 90s. 2 great seasons under Williams. A great season in 2004 under Stans. A nice tournament SEC tourney run under Stans in 2009. That?s basically the highlights of MSU basketball in my lifetime that I can remember. No matter who takes this job it?s difficult. This year is still less frustrating than the Howland years because we underachieved every year with him. This isn?t really an underachievement we just don?t have the players to compete with Bama or UT. We are going to be looking at a Rick Ray year though if we don?t beat UF Saturday. It?s a must win to keep our team bought in. The schedule gets lighter in February and we need to take advantage of that.

Over last 45 years yeah, we haven't been a great program but from 90 to mid 2000s we were a really good program. An we can be again with the right leadership/coach, etc. I don't know if Jans if the one or not, we'll see. If we could combine Howland talent getting with Jans floor coaching and maybe a good O asst coach, we are in business.

We gotta give Jans a chance.

I'm not giving up yet overall (this year not happening) but when you've been good a decade or longer, it can happen again.

[Cooterpoot]

Coach--as time has past--and you being a smart guy--just admit you were wrong on Stans. If he had stayed we would have continued to be a top 5 team in the SEC. the proof is in the pudding--his record would show only 2 (maybe 3) teams had a winning record against Him.. the fact that He beat the living shit at Ole Miss was reason alone to have at least given Him another year. Since then we had not had a Coach come close to Him. We always had a top player and sure He could have done better as a bench Coach. But we would have been a 20 win team every year.

Lolololol no. Stans was a train wreck and as soon as divisions were eliminated he had nothing to play for. The rest of the SEC decided to invest in basketball and we were done then. We've had a few years of good basketball but our program has never been a top program. 96 was it.

[KB21]

Jans can coach. He?s got to recruit players that have shoot/pass/dribble skill. We have athletes, but they are below average when it comes to skill.

[R2Dawg]

Basketball in today's age is easy to get turned around if you have good coaching, the biggest question is can you bring in recruits. I have faith is Jans as a coach, especially on the defensive side of the ball but I just don't know how many highly ranked recruits he can get to Starkville. Our best players are all currently Howlands guys, one thing Howland was doing was bringing in 4 star guys and even a few 5 star. I just don't see Jans getting those guys right now but that's how you win games in this league.

Look what happened at Bama when they hired Nate Oats. After Bama got rid of Gotfried, basketball was an afterthought over there with Saban dominating the discussion. Look at Pearl at Auburn. Auburn was more of a basketball wasteland than we've ever been and look what has happened with one hire.

[Cooterpoot]

We aren't skilled at all. We're not big either, especially at G. We need a portal/JC bonanza in a bad way.

[PGHBulldogBG]

Look what happened at Bama when they hired Nate Oats. After Bama got rid of Gotfried, basketball was an afterthought over there with Saban dominating the discussion. Look at Pearl at Auburn. Auburn was more of a basketball wasteland than we've ever been and look what has happened with one hire.

Pearl has made Auburn a completely different program. No coach was ever able to recruit there in the past the way Pearl does. He is also a good floor coach and gets the talent to equal wins. He was a great hire for them and their atmosphere is incredible. I’m hoping we will be saying this same thing about Jans and State in a few years.

[HancockCountyDog]

My position on this hasn't changed. If I had a time machine and my only option was to either allow Stansbury to be fired and endure the last 11 years or keep Stans and the future is unknown, I don't fire Stans.

I would have rolled the dice with him and I bet that our results over the last 11 years would be better than 1 NCAA trip in 11 years and 7 years of losing SEC records. Maybe not, but if I had the power to only make that binary choice - fire or not to fire, I don't fire. Anyone that says otherwise, hates Stans more than they love MSU.

[Coach34]

Lolololol no. Stans was a train wreck and as soon as divisions were eliminated he had nothing to play for. The rest of the SEC decided to invest in basketball and we were done then. We've had a few years of good basketball but our program has never been a top program. 96 was it.

Hood was leaving as was Sidney, Moultrie, and others. Drugs and rampant disrespect were rotting the program. Stands wasnt fired after going 21-10 on a whim.

[HoopsDawg]

My position on this hasn't changed. If I had a time machine and my only option was to either allow Stansbury to be fired and endure the last 11 years or keep Stans and the future is unknown, I don't fire Stans.

I would have rolled the dice with him and I bet that our results over the last 11 years would be better than 1 NCAA trip in 11 years and 7 years of losing SEC records. Maybe not, but if I had the power to only make that binary choice - fire or not to fire, I don't fire. Anyone that says otherwise, hates Stans more than they love MSU.

In hindsight, firing Stans was a pretty big mistake

[NCMSTFAN]

Look what happened at Bama when they hired Nate Oats. After Bama got rid of Gotfried, basketball was an afterthought over there with Saban dominating the discussion. Look at Pearl at Auburn. Auburn was more of a basketball wasteland than we've ever been and look what has happened with one hire.

Completely agree, Oats and Pearl are both good coaches but they are also good recruiters, that's the only way you will win in our league. Rounding up a bunch of mid major tough nosed players won't get the job done. I'm hoping Jans can get the recruiting figured out

[LC Dawg]

In hindsight, firing Stans was a pretty big mistake

Hiring Rick Ray to replace him was the mistake.
Actually, not having a ****ing clue who you were going to hire when Stansbury was fired was the biggest mistake.

[StarkVegasSteve]

In hindsight, firing Stans was a pretty big mistake

No it wasn't. If you think that then it shows you don't know all the behind the scenes stuff that was going on those last few years. I know everyone saw the fight, but Sidney was a constant problem every day. They'd have to drag his ass out of bed to actually get him to show up to practice. Hood tried to quit 3 times his Freshman year. Those are the big things, we also had drug issues, attitude issues, and culture issues. Stans should've been fired after the fiasco in Hawaii. We were going nowhere. Keeping Stans would've been kicking the can down the road a little more. We would've not have been an attractive job in two years just because Stans stayed

The issue has been, is, and will always be that WE DIDN'T HAVE A MF CLUE WHO WE WERE GOING TO HIRE WHEN WE FIRED RICK. And then, we panic hired the 3rd bench asst at Clemson. Which, is the most indefensible thing Scott Stricklin ever did. I will never understand who was consulting him or who he ran that hire by that ok'd it.

[HancockCountyDog]

No it wasn't. If you think that then it shows you don't know all the behind the scenes stuff that was going on those last few years. I know everyone saw the fight, but Sidney was a constant problem every day. They'd have to drag his ass out of bed to actually get him to show up to practice. Hood tried to quit 3 times his Freshman year. Those are the big things, we also had drug issues, attitude issues, and culture issues. Stans should've been fired after the fiasco in Hawaii. We were going nowhere. Keeping Stans would've been kicking the can down the road a little more. We would've not have been an attractive job in two years just because Stans stayed

You are missing the point. No one is arguing about whether Stans deserved to be fired. The issue is that with hindsight being 20/20 - and the only option was firing Stans or not firing Stans, you would still want him fired and go through the last 11 years as opposed to just rolling the dice with him? That doesn't make sense.

Sure Stans could have turned in a worse 11 years than the last 11 we have had, but that doesn't seem likely, I mean it would be pretty hard to do worse than our last 11 years.

[StarkVegasSteve]

You are missing the point. No one is arguing about whether Stans deserved to be fired. The issue is that with hindsight being 20/20 - and the only option was firing Stans or not firing Stans, you would still want him fired and go through the last 11 years as opposed to just rolling the dice with him? That doesn't make sense.

Sure Stans could have turned in a worse 11 years than the last 11 we have had, but that doesn't seem likely, I mean it would be pretty hard to do worse than our last 11 years.

Well you're talking to the wrong person on that. I wanted to fire him after 09, but he lucked up and won the SEC Tournament. Then I wanted to fire him after 11, but we had Hood and Moultrie coming in with Bost coming back.

I will always say that firing him wasn't the mistake. The mistake was the next hire. He could've always just hired Kermit. He would've crawled on broken glass to Starkville.

[Coach34]

We used to go back and forth on Sixpack about Stands vs Mark Gottfried.

Gottfried moved on from Bama and got a job at NC State- made the Sweet 16 a couple of times.
Stands got WK- and has kept their program from making the NCAA's as they have under every previous coach since the 1970's

[HancockCountyDog]

Well you're talking to the wrong person on that. I wanted to fire him after 09, but he lucked up and won the SEC Tournament. Then I wanted to fire him after 11, but we had Hood and Moultrie coming in with Bost coming back.

I will always say that firing him wasn't the mistake. The mistake was the next hire. He could've always just hired Kermit. He would've crawled on broken glass to Starkville.

Sure, i get that, but looking back - and your choice was keeping Stans or suffering through just Rick Ray - you would still pick firing Stans?

I mean at some point, your love of MSU has to eclipse the anger towards Stans. I mean for me, I really don't care who the coach is, I just want to watch us play meaningful basketball games in February/March. We did that all the time with Stans, not so much the last 11 years.

[EdwardDrayton]

We aren't skilled at all. We're not big either, especially at G. We need a portal/JC bonanza in a bad way.

Yep

[R2Dawg]

Completely agree, Oats and Pearl are both good coaches but they are also good recruiters, that's the only way you will win in our league. Rounding up a bunch of mid major tough nosed players won't get the job done. I'm hoping Jans can get the recruiting figured out

Yep, Pearl cheats to recruit but I guess that don't matter now. Basketball has changed in ways I don't like but we won't ever go back. I like our current work ethic and attitude, we just need some basketball skills to go with it. We are a couple good shooters away from being pretty dang good now.

[R2Dawg]

In hindsight, firing Stans was a pretty big mistake

Agree, I think most agree firing Stans without a competent hire was stupid. Yes changes needed to be made if Stans stayed and maybe Stans thought he was bigger than loafers and the ego was the issue.

I think Stans could have recovered in a few years but sometimes it is time for a change.

People can say what they want but outside of 2 good Richard Williams years (of which Stans contributed), the Stans era is the best MSU basketball since Bailey Howell in 60s.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Sure, i get that, but looking back - and your choice was keeping Stans or suffering through just Rick Ray - you would still pick firing Stans?

I mean at some point, your love of MSU has to eclipse the anger towards Stans. I mean for me, I really don't care who the coach is, I just want to watch us play meaningful basketball games in February/March. We did that all the time with Stans, not so much the last 11 years.

We played just as many meaningful games in February/March under Howland as we did under Rick and won about the same amount. Just like with Stansbury, we lost any game that actually mattered, won most of the games we were supposed to, and had head scratching losses.

I don't hate Rick. He did a fine job in his 15+ years. We made the tournament 6 times, which is fine, and we won some meaningless division championships. But we never made it past the first weekend. He also coached in an era where on average 4 of the other 6 division teams were complete and utter dogs***. Auburn didn't even know the had a basketball program, Ole Miss' ceiling leaked, and Arkansas, Alabama, and LSU all had like one or two good years in that stretch. The East dominated every year.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Agree, I think most agree firing Stans without a competent hire was stupid. Yes changes needed to be made if Stans stayed and maybe Stans thought he was bigger than loafers and the ego was the issue.

I think Stans could have recovered in a few years but sometimes it is time for a change.

People can say what they want but outside of 2 good Richard Williams years (of which Stans contributed), the Stans era is the best MSU basketball since Bailey Howell in 60s.

Ego wasn't the issue. He had lost control of the program and Bailey Howell walked into Stricklin's office and said fire Stansbury or me and some others are pulling all our money from basketball until a change is made.

[Coach34]

People can say what they want but outside of 2 good Richard Williams years (of which Stans contributed), the Stans era is the best MSU basketball since Bailey Howell in 60s.

Williams had 3 really good years- 91, 95, 96 and a couple of NIT seasons. He took over a program that had lost to Delta State. While the 1991 team was Stands 1st year as a asst- that team had been built by Reboul and Brady years prior. Stands took over an NCAA Tourney ready team and underachieved in Y1. But he certainly grew into the job

Williams/Stands is like comparing Jackie/Mullen

Williams/Jackie took us to higher highs during their tenure. SEC title Game/Final Four etc but Mullen/Stands brought consistency.

[R2Dawg]

Ego wasn't the issue. He had lost control of the program and Bailey Howell walked into Stricklin's office and said fire Stansbury or me and some others are pulling all our money from basketball until a change is made.

Yes I understand the issues then of losing control of program.

Where is all that support now from Howell and boys? It ain't there. Winning takes care of needed support. Firing Stans and nuking the program did nothing. There is no support now.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Yes I understand the issues then of losing control of program.

Where is all that support now from Howell and boys? It ain't there. Winning takes care of needed support. Firing Stans and nuking the program did nothing. There is no support now.

It was there under Howland and it's there now. Just cause they aren't in the seats doesn't mean they aren't stroking the checks. Richard Adkerson isn't able to come to a lot of the midweek games but he's given more money in one year JUST to the basketball program than the members of this board have given in a lifetime.

Richard cut two different 7 figure checks so that we could complete renovations on The Hump. He stroked a mid 7 figure check the first time and stroked another one in about February of 22 because we were short a few million

[Rawdawg]

Firing Stans was the right thing to do for the better of the program and the image of the university.

Hiring Ray was a mistake obviously but it?s not Ray?s fault he was hired. However there were things that transpired during that coaching search that put MSU in the position it was in that led to the hiring of Ray, a lot of it our own fault. Some coaches and agents black balled us. Some of our administration panicked and didn?t listen to some of our more prominent boosters. Things happened that we made mistakes on.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Firing Stans was the right thing to do for the better of the program and the image of the university.

Hiring Ray was a mistake obviously but it?s not Ray?s fault he was hired. However there were things that transpired during that coaching search that put MSU in the position it was in that led to the hiring of Ray, a lot of it our own fault. Some coaches and agents black balled us. Some of our administration panicked and didn?t listen to some of our more prominent boosters. Things happened that we made mistakes on.

100% FACT.

[Coach34]

100% FACT.

Yes- the Cheerleader and the Politician did a horrible job during the search

[basedog]

Agree, I think most agree firing Stans without a competent hire was stupid. Yes changes needed to be made if Stans stayed and maybe Stans thought he was bigger than loafers and the ego was the issue.

I think Stans could have recovered in a few years but sometimes it is time for a change.

People can say what they want but outside of 2 good Richard Williams years (of which Stans contributed), the Stans era is the best MSU basketball since Bailey Howell in 60s.

Yes

[EdwardDrayton]

It was the right move to fire Stansbury and it was his own fault he got fired.

See, we can say that just as many times as y'all who want to keep saying it was wrong.

How many years y'all wanna dance this jig?!!? Bottom line he got fired so let it go.

[HoopsDawg]

It was there under Howland and it's there now. Just cause they aren't in the seats doesn't mean they aren't stroking the checks. Richard Adkerson isn't able to come to a lot of the midweek games but he's given more money in one year JUST to the basketball program than the members of this board have given in a lifetime.

Richard cut two different 7 figure checks so that we could complete renovations on The Hump. He stroked a mid 7 figure check the first time and stroked another one in about February of 22 because we were short a few million

Where was the money on Sears, Boum, Appleby, Johnson, Mosely and the other 5-6 transfers we missed on this past offseason.

[HoopsDawg]

Firing Stans was the right thing to do for the better of the program and the image of the university.

Hiring Ray was a mistake obviously but it?s not Ray?s fault he was hired. However there were things that transpired during that coaching search that put MSU in the position it was in that led to the hiring of Ray, a lot of it our own fault. Some coaches and agents black balled us. Some of our administration panicked and didn?t listen to some of our more prominent boosters. Things happened that we made mistakes on.

Please. Some of those boosters wanted Kenny Payne.

[EdwardDrayton]

Where was the money on Sears, Boum, Appleby, Johnson, Mosely and the other 5-6 transfers we missed on this past offseason.

Hoops, do we know for a fact our transfer class was substandard because we did not have enough money? If so, how do we know this? And to be clear, we're saying we bought transfers we could afford?

[StarkVegasSteve]

Where was the money on Sears, Boum, Appleby, Johnson, Mosely and the other 5-6 transfers we missed on this past offseason.

Sears wanted to play for Oats and Bama. He's from Muscle Shoals so that one wasn't hard to figure out.

Johnson, I assume you're talking about Keontae, couldn't get into grad school here.

Our money was there on Mosely. Missouri offered him a house. We just got outbid.

Don't know who the other two are, but regardless these guys are stroking 6 and 7 figure checks almost every year. To then expect them to turn around and stroke 6 and 7 figure NIL checks is not doable. Outside of Richard, who was the one they hit up for every one of those transfers, we don't have that kind of alumni wealth. Our average fans have to up their giving in NIL. We can't expect our top 10-15 donors who consistently bail us out in facilities funding to also be the ones bailing us out in NIL as well.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Please. Some of those boosters wanted Kenny Payne.


And Kenny Payne and World Wide Wes were two of the people that black balled us. And since I doubt you know who World Wide Wes is he's William Wesley. EVP for the Knicks now. He was a super agent for CAA and was close personal friends with Kenny Payne and Calipari.

[HoopsDawg]

Hoops, do we know for a fact our transfer class was substandard because we did not have enough money? If so, how do we know this? And to be clear, we're saying we bought transfers we could afford?

I'm saying we targeted and missed on at least 5-6 transfers that would have made a huge difference this season. Whatever the reason this happened, we didn't get it done.

When a name got floated under Howland or Stans, 9 times out of 10 we closed. I have no idea how we didn't close on Hubbard so add him to the list. He visited multiple times.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I'm saying we targeted and missed on at least 5-6 transfers that would have made a huge difference this season. Whatever the reason this happened, we didn't get it done.

When a name got floated under Howland or Stans, 9 times out of 10 we closed. I have no idea how we didn't close on Hubbard so add him to the list. He visited multiple times.

I've talked to Richard Duease on that multiple times, he had comfortability with Kermit and that staff. He liked our staff, but was more comfortable with theirs because of the relationship they built with him. It's simple as that. George hasn't stopped recruiting him though. When they make the move on Kermit I would expect Hubbard will end up at State.

[EdwardDrayton]

Sears wanted to play for Oats and Bama. He's from Muscle Shoals so that one wasn't hard to figure out.

Johnson, I assume you're talking about Keontae, couldn't get into grad school here.

Our money was there on Mosely. Missouri offered him a house. We just got outbid.

Don't know who the other two are, but regardless these guys are stroking 6 and 7 figure checks almost every year. To then expect them to turn around and stroke 6 and 7 figure NIL checks is not doable. Outside of Richard, who was the one they hit up for every one of those transfers, we don't have that kind of alumni wealth. Our average fans have to up their giving in NIL. We can't expect our top 10-15 donors who consistently bail us out in facilities funding to also be the ones bailing us out in NIL as well.

I'm not giving much but if a lot of folks are like me, we're not giving any more into a black hole without some transparency. How much has been collected, where is it going and how much are we short? Blindly giving money is not something any of us considers wise.

[Ari Gold]

Where was the money on Sears, Boum, Appleby, Johnson, Mosely and the other 5-6 transfers we missed on this past offseason.

Bama finished number 2 in the money offer for Sears we finished 3rd.
Texas was highest bidder
When Janz was hired we had and may still have a worse situation with basketball NIL than the College of Charleston.. and that’s a fact

And you guys do know we had tolu , dj and Shaq Moore were all in the portal at one time .. can you imagine the program if those 3 had gone elsewhere ..

Janz was a homer in hire as a Coach. We will see if he can get the players here he needs..

[Homedawg]

Thank goodness we didn't pay Mosley. He doesn't hardly play at Missouri.

[Saltydog]

There is no long term damage from the Howland era. I hate to tell you this but the best players on this team Howland signed.

And while that's true, it aint' saying a whole lot...........

[Saltydog]

We aren't skilled at all. We're not big either, especially at G. We need a portal/JC bonanza in a bad way.

And good luck with that in this day/age of NIL.......CBB may be the most corrupt collegiate sport anyway...........

[StarkVegasSteve]

I'm not giving much but if a lot of folks are like me, we're not giving any more into a black hole without some transparency. How much has been collected, where is it going and how much are we short? Blindly giving money is not something any of us considers wise.

Call or email Charlie. He'll be happy to explain to you exactly how we use it.

[StarkVegasSteve]

On another note, watching Riley Kugel play big minutes for Florida really hurts. He was a huge signee and it hurt when we lost him. He would've started for us this year.

[Rawdawg]

Those that wanted Kenny Payne arent the boosters administrators listen to?

[SpaceBully]

Yep. Time to stop putting lipstick on the pig. Build new.

If we were to ever build a new one, I wouldn't go more than about 8,000/8,500 capacity. Make sure the aisles and seats were wider for all our fat asses. Then have club levels and skyboxes all the way around. Make everything premium as possible.