Question for the camp fire

[Maverick91]

I know we all hate Saben except for Tusk. I myself would love to see what he could do without all the star power that he brings in.

My question though: if you watch a bama game the team executes, they don?t miss blocks, they don?t drop balls, they don?t miss tackles, they don?t seem to get flagged very often. My point is even though Saben gets his star power I still think he would be at or near the top in a completely equal talent league based on the perfection at which his teams play. It always boggles my mind that other teams cannot execute like bama does. There is something that he does that is different. Even different from other blue bloods Ohio state, Michigan, Texas? whatever.

Do you guys see that as well?

[starkvegasdawg]

I think they commit certain penalties at the same rate as other schools. It's just not called. Holding is a prime example. What they don't do is commit stupid penalties like false start or pass interference on 3 and 17 extending a drive. But all of what you mentioned comes down to one word...discipline. He has the elite of the elite recruits so they are already above average talent wise and usually work ethic wise. They probably already possess a lot of on field discipline. So it's not like he's taking scraps and turning it into diamonds. But he's a hard nose unmerciless dictator that demands perfection and the players know if they don't give 100% every play there's 5 guys behind them just as talented just waiting for their shot.

[TheLostDawg]

I think they commit certain penalties at the same rate as other schools. It's just not called. Holding is a prime example. What they don't do is commit stupid penalties like false start or pass interference on 3 and 17 extending a drive. But all of what you mentioned comes down to one word...discipline. He has the elite of the elite recruits so they are already above average talent wise and usually work ethic wise. They probably already possess a lot of on field discipline. So it's not like he's taking scraps and turning it into diamonds. But he's a hard nose unmerciless dictator that demands perfection and the players know if they don't give 100% every play there's 5 guys behind them just as talented just waiting for their shot.

Yes and not naming any names but I can think of one player we were over the moon to get as a transfer until we realized why he didn't start there(kept jumping off sides).

He can just let the next guy up that doesn't make this mistakes.

[Hot Rock]

Saban is a really, really, really good coach. If he had to play with average players then he would still be respectable but national championships are won by the players not the coaches.

Good coaches give players the chance to maximize their abilities. You can't get greatness from average players but you can get shit from great players with bad coaching.

The combination of Saban and his domineering, detailed coaching style and Bama's recruiting machine will give you a dynasty. Saban could do it elsewhere but not just anywhere.

[parabrave]

I know we all hate Saben except for Tusk. I myself would love to see what he could do without all the star power that he brings in.

My question though: if you watch a bama game the team executes, they don?t miss blocks, they don?t drop balls, they don?t miss tackles, they don?t seem to get flagged very often. My point is even though Saben gets his star power I still think he would be at or near the top in a completely equal talent league based on the perfection at which his teams play. It always boggles my mind that other teams cannot execute like bama does. There is something that he does that is different. Even different from other blue bloods Ohio state, Michigan, Texas? whatever.

Do you guys see that as well?

He requires players to meet high standards and doesn't tolerate those who don't. Kinda reminds you of guys named Landry, Belichik, Lombardi/
Believe it or not the best players want to play for guys like that.

[confucius say]

He's great at Bama and was very good at lsu.

At mich state he was:
6-5-1
6-6
7-5
6-6
9-2

Maybe he got better as a coach as he aged. Or maybe he has better players than everybody else. Or maybe a combination of the two.

[parabrave]

He's great at Bama and was very good at lsu.

At mich state he was:
6-5-1
6-6
7-5
6-6
9-2

Maybe he got better as a coach as he aged. Or maybe he has better players than everybody else. Or maybe a combination of the two.

And remember he beat the crap out of Bama his final yr at MSU north.

[memsu06]

Leach preaches execution as well.

Saban may have more people on his staff to analyze every single play and make adjustments with the players.

[Coach34]

Had he stayed at LSU- he would have 6-7 Nattys as well. He was building Mich State into a power but having the chance to recruit the South took him next level

[Maroonthirteen]

I certainly believe Saban is a very good coach. However when you have your pick of 5*s. You pick the 5*s and 4s with higher IQ.

[DownwardDawg]

Saban is great at building a program and recruiting to sustain a high level. He has more coaches and top talent than everyone else, as has already been mentioned. When you consider ALL THINGS, he's an elite coach. However, Saban has been out coached in game on plenty of occasions. Talent overcomes mistakes quite regularly.

[TUSK]

There is a lot of "correct" in this thread...

Saban, himself, was quoted as saying, [paraphrasing] "I'm not a great coach, but I'm a good recruiter." Due to that, he has the luxury of "processing" players that don't buy in on "the process"...

It's a machine, for sure.

[Coach34]

Saban, himself, was quoted as saying, [paraphrasing] "I'm not a great coach, but I'm a good recruiter."

He's been the best defensive coach or top 3 in college football for 20 years. Thats a great coach

[PMDawg]

He's been the best defensive coach or top 3 in college football for 20 years. Thats a great coach

Just not quite as good as Les Miles, right?

[TUSK]

Just not quite as good as Les Miles, right?

https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.594041977.6640/flat,750x,075,f-pad,750x1000,f8f8f8.u1.jpg

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Saban has to have better talent than his opponents. He is in trouble if another team has equal talent.

[HoopsDawg]

Saban lost to Croom. Wes Carroll was our QB. Do I need to repeat that?

[Jarius]

Saban has to have better talent than his opponents. He is in trouble if another team has equal talent.

I wouldn't say he's in trouble but outside of Georgia, anyone he loses to is an indictment on him and his on the field coaching ability considering how much more talent he has than everyone else. He was average in the NFL and would be above average but not dominant in CFB as a head coach at a program that doesn't recruit itself.

[Catfish]

I wouldn't say he's in trouble but outside of Georgia, anyone he loses to is an indictment on him and his on the field coaching ability considering how much more talent he has than everyone else. He was average in the NFL and would be above average but not dominant in CFB as a head coach at a program that doesn't recruit itself.

Poor talent - poor coach, good talent -good coach, great talent - great coach. Elementary.

[TUSK]

This thread went from "a lot correct" to "suspect"...


https://youtu.be/-JBvfZTx-vs

[Maverick91]

😂
The key here some people have said it. He would be top but it would be very even. He does, it makes you wonder what football would look like it it was purely on coaching ability outside of recruiting ability.

[MadDawg]

How many times is pass interference due to just poor form versus an inferior player trying to overcome the talent differential and maybe hold the jersey a little too much?
How many times is a holding call due to the coaching staff's poor practice routine versus a slower OL matched up with a much more talented rusher?

My point being, Saban for sure gets credit for his program, discipline and all. But, let's be honest, as a Bama player, you rarely if ever face a more talented player lined up against you. So you rarely have to decide between pass interference or a giving up a TD or a holding call versus giving up a sack.

[Schultzy]

There is a lot of "correct" in this thread...

Saban, himself, was quoted as saying, [paraphrasing] "I'm not a great coach, but I'm a good recruiter." Due to that, he has the luxury of "processing" players that don't buy in on "the process"...

It's a machine, for sure.

Verbatim to the ad who hired him “you didn’t hire a great coach, you hired a great recruiter.”

But the two interceptions against us last year were definitely tendency calls versus down & distance

[Apoplectic]

Why did they lose to uga in the NC game?

[TheLostDawg]

Saban is great at building a program and recruiting to sustain a high level. He has more coaches and top talent than everyone else, as has already been mentioned. When you consider ALL THINGS, he's an elite coach. However, Saban has been out coached in game on plenty of occasions. Talent overcomes mistakes quite regularly.

To build on what others has said, he has cream of the crop in talent, can choose from them, has a ton of staff to develop and game plan but on top of all that he can be a disciplinarian (for lack of a better word). Kids that go to Alabama will listen and respond to what he says. Other coaches that try to act that way and demand perfection, we'll this day and age, the kids will get mad and transfer.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Saban has been "outcoached" in games because HCs aren't the ones making adjustments- that's the coordinators. Saban is elite at feeling the pulse of his team- remember pulling Hurts for Tua at halftime? He knows what his team needs and has the balls to do it.

Why are his teams so disciplined? Well in addition to being able to take the high IQ recruits, Saban is clear to all that they'll have to be damned near perfect to see the field. There's no "well I made 2 1 handed TD catches in practice, so I can be a lazy blocker and they'll still play be due to my talent". 5* or not, you WILL ride the pine if you aren't great at everything... discipline included.

Saban takes a wholistic approach because he's smart- he doesn't just play the guys with the high ceilings, he plays the guys that will help the team. No false starts, no dropped passes, no missed assignments. Done like it? You'll be processed.

[FISHDAWG]

I don't hate Saban at all - I admire a guy that can do what he's done and in my opinion he is the GOAT .... Bama wasn't recruiting itself before he got there the way it does now and that's because of Saban's drive to be the best. I'm seeing a lot of excuses for his success ... think about that - EXCUSES for success. Now I'm like everyone else in that I'm ready for the man to retire and give the rest of the conference a break... but I'll never believe with the young short memories of todays young athletes that they are drawn to Bama just because it's Alabama - they're there because of Saban making Bama what it is .... today's student athletes would have to read a book to know who Bear Bryant was