I'm confused... I was told by

[calidawg]

Several on this board that this is the best basketball team that Howland has had and that we should be for sure NCAA tourney bound. While some, like myself, expressed extensive skepticism. And here we are yet again, outside the tourney with teams like auburn #1 in the country and Bama winning its 2nd top 5 match up of the season..

Howlands swan song is sounding louder by the game.

[OLJWales]

This team is gonna make us forget about Rose Bowl.

[Quaoarsking]

I mean, we're not a lock yet, but we're probably going to get a bid.

[sleepy dawg]

I mean, we're not a lock yet, but we're probably going to get a bid.

50/50 right now. Being an 11 or 12 seed in the tournament though is not the mark of a good team.

[msstate7]

50/50 right now. Being an 11 or 12 seed in the tournament though is not the mark of a good team.

358 teams eligible for the tourney.
32 automatic bids
36 at large bids

Let's say half of 32 automatic bid teams are actually good teams, so 16 + 36 (at large) = 52 teams in the tourney are good. That means being in the tourney from a P5 conf puts you are the top 15% in the country. I'd say that's pretty good. If you throw in NIT and say all postseason teams are good, that means just making any postseason (68 ncaa + nit 32), puts you in the top 28% of the country. In football, 42 bowls means postseason puts you in the top 65% of college football (84 postseason teams out of 130 eligible).

There's a reason we've only been to the tourney 11 times total. It's hard

[Quaoarsking]

Also, the SEC basketball is just not what the SEC is football or baseball. You can come in 10th or 11th in the SEC in football and still get a bowl and feel good about your season. Just looking over the past few years, 10th or 11th in the SEC in men's basketball is NIT bubble territory at best.

Ben Howland's career SEC winning % (.478) is higher than Dan Mullen's (.458).

[Saltydog]

Also, the SEC basketball is just not what the SEC is football or baseball. You can come in 10th or 11th in the SEC in football and still get a bowl and feel good about your season. Just looking over the past few years, 10th or 11th in the SEC in men's basketball is NIT bubble territory at best.

Ben Howland's career SEC winning % (.478) is higher than Dan Mullen's (.458).

Stans was .545......Just saying......

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Not to make excuses but the 2nd best player has only played what 7-8 out of 19 games. He's missed I think every true road game.

[Walkerhill]

Not to make excuses but the 2nd best player has only played what 7-8 out of 19 games. He's missed I think every true road game.

Prediction - this team makes the sweet sixteen after winning the sec tournament to get in.

[CadaverDawg]

358 teams eligible for the tourney.
32 automatic bids
36 at large bids

Let's say half of 32 automatic bid teams are actually good teams, so 16 + 36 (at large) = 52 teams in the tourney are good. That means being in the tourney from a P5 conf puts you are the top 15% in the country. I'd say that's pretty good. If you throw in NIT and say all postseason teams are good, that means just making any postseason (68 ncaa + nit 32), puts you in the top 28% of the country. In football, 42 bowls means postseason puts you in the top 65% of college football (84 postseason teams out of 130 eligible).

There's a reason we've only been to the tourney 11 times total. It's hard

Aww, it's hard.

I'm sorry but this sounds like our program is a bunch of nerds trying to score their first date. We hire a coach that has been to multiple Final 4's, he lands a ton of talent, and we are making excuses for him losing by 30 with his "best team here yet"?? What is wrong with our fan base...you want to know why nobody shows up, it's probably bc nobody has any expectations or demands that the program take steps forward. The whole hoops program from the fans down needs a tune up and regrouping. It's all out of whack.

https://c.tenor.com/zHkO4G27SU0AAAAC/excuse-train-train.gif

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Stans was .545......Just saying......

Also to be fair if you take away his 1st 2yrs resurrecting the program from the Rick Ray ashes he has a .532 SEC win %

[CadaverDawg]

Prediction - this team makes the sweet sixteen after winning the sec tournament to get in.

https://media3.giphy.com/media/l4HnWa5toF8gtBhLO/giphy.gif

[msstate7]

Aww, it's hard.

I'm sorry but this sounds like our program is a bunch of nerds trying to score their first date. We hire a coach that has been to multiple Final 4's, he lands a ton of talent, and we are making excuses for him losing by 30 with his "best team here yet"?? What is wrong with our fan base...you want to know why nobody shows up, it's probably bc nobody has any expectations or demands that the program take steps forward. The whole hoops program from the fans down needs a tune up and regrouping. It's all out of whack.

https://c.tenor.com/zHkO4G27SU0AAAAC/excuse-train-train.gif

Do you think our talent is better than Florida, Kentucky, ark, bama, auburn, and LSU's?

[msstate7]

Not to make excuses but the 2nd best player has only played what 7-8 out of 19 games. He's missed I think every true road game.

Any chance we see him this week?

[CadaverDawg]

Do you think our talent is better than Florida, Kentucky, ark, bama, auburn, and LSU's?

Was it better than Liberty's in the Tourney a few years back?

Was our talent better than Kentucky's the year we went to the Final Four?

Was VCU's talent the best when they made a deep run? How about George Mason's?

Basketball rarely crowns the "most talented team" Champion at the end of the year. They crown the team that plays the best together, gels, is best coached, is most disciplined, and is most fundamentally sound. So to answer your question...no, we aren't the most talented...just like we weren't more talented than A&M in football, or several other teams we beat. If I'm supposed to base my expectation on recruiting rankings, we should probably never attend another MSU sporting event with any expectations of winning. Shape up or ship out. Excuses are for losers.

[msstate7]

Was it better than Liberty's in the Tourney a few years back?

Was our talent better than Kentucky's the year we went to the Final Four?

Was VCU's talent the best when they made a deep run? How about George Mason's?

Basketball rarely crowns the "most talented team" Champion at the end of the year. They crown the team that plays the best together, gels, is best coached, is most disciplined, and is most fundamentally sound. So to answer your question...no, we aren't the most talented...just like we weren't more talented than A&M in football, or several other teams we beat. If I'm supposed to base my expectation on recruiting rankings, we should probably never attend another MSU sporting event with any expectations of winning. Shape up or ship out. Excuses are for losers.

You brought up talent, so how we match up with our conf?

[msstate7]

And we're still squarely on the bubble. Making the tournament should be the goal every year for us, and we still have a great shot at it. Probably best to judge this team on if this happens or not

[HoopsDawg]

50/50 right now. Being an 11 or 12 seed in the tournament though is not the mark of a good team.

This is a poor take. Getting into the tournament is a big deal and is a successful season. We aren't Duke or UK.

[OLJWales]

50/50 right now. Being an 11 or 12 seed in the tournament though is not the mark of a good team.

It CAN be the mark of being good. Depends. Not Great maybe but makin' the Dance is Never " Not Good".

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Any chance we see him this week?

Not this week.

[msstate7]

Not this week.

Man, that's a tough pill to swallow... we really need a good week

[confucius say]

358 teams eligible for the tourney.
32 automatic bids
36 at large bids

Let's say half of 32 automatic bid teams are actually good teams, so 16 + 36 (at large) = 52 teams in the tourney are good. That means being in the tourney from a P5 conf puts you are the top 15% in the country. I'd say that's pretty good. If you throw in NIT and say all postseason teams are good, that means just making any postseason (68 ncaa + nit 32), puts you in the top 28% of the country. In football, 42 bowls means postseason puts you in the top 65% of college football (84 postseason teams out of 130 eligible).

There's a reason we've only been to the tourney 11 times total. It's hard

And we ran off our best coach post integration who had us in that 28% 11 out of 14 years. Still mind boggling.

[msstate7]

And we ran off our best coach post integration who had us in that 28% 11 out of 14 years. Still mind boggling.

I still can't believe we fired him with no real plan. If you fire a guy that had been as successful here as stansbury, you have to pretty have a guy ready to take the job. I think firing howland without a guy pretty much lined up would another big mistake

[99jc]

Several on this board that this is the best basketball team that Howland has had and that we should be for sure NCAA tourney bound. While some, like myself, expressed extensive skepticism. And here we are yet again, outside the tourney with teams like auburn #1 in the country and Bama winning its 2nd top 5 match up of the season..

Howlands swan song is sounding louder by the game.

YOU JUST TRYING TO STIR SHIT.....WE ARE WHO WE THOUGHT WE WERE!

[BeardoMSU]

I still can't believe we fired him with no real plan. If you fire a guy that had been as successful here as stansbury, you have to pretty have a guy ready to take the job. I think firing howland without a guy pretty much lined up would another big mistake

Yep.

[PGHBulldogBG]

I don?t think people want to accept the fact that Stansbury wasn?t fired for performance. He was fired because he lost control of his team and we made an embarrassment of ourselves on Christmas Day with the Hawaii fight. There is no point of even discussing the Stansbury situation because the administration didn?t have a choice. The problem is we have people that love Stans or people that hate him. He might still be our coach if not for his lack of institutional control with the team. The way he handled that team was a fireable offense. It?s unfortunate for Stans and Miss State that it had to happen, but you can?t take it back. My point is that I don?t get this argument 10 years later about whether he should?ve been fired for performance or not. The point is moot because he was fired for other reasons

[HoopsDawg]

And we ran off our best coach post integration

Richard Williams?

[Quaoarsking]

And we ran off our best coach post integration who had us in that 28% 11 out of 14 years. Still mind boggling.

Howland is about to have us in that 28% for the 5th straight year. And his first 2 years of cleaning up after Rick Ray, we're probably a 100%er in that 28%.

[Saltydog]

YOU JUST TRYING TO STIR SHIT.....WE ARE WHO WE THOUGHT WE WERE!

He's not necessarily stirring shit, he's telling the truth. What's the ole saying, "truth hurts".........MANY here said how good the talent was and that Howland knew it......Well, if that's the truth what does that say about our coaching?

[MaroonFlounder]

I mean, we're not a lock yet, but we're probably going to get a bid.

To the NIT

[RougeDawg]

The talent is there. Have transfers from top notch programs. And got Tolu. The talent is there to win. No team with these guys except when Tolu is on the group.

If we play like we have with him when he gets back and win some games these losses won?t be weighted as much. But we are toast if he comes back and we still look like dog shit. We are toast.

[Cowbell]

I still can't believe we fired him with no real plan. If you fire a guy that had been as successful here as stansbury, you have to pretty have a guy ready to take the job. I think firing howland without a guy pretty much lined up would another big mistake

I'm totally ready to see us replace Howland, but I 100% agree with this.

[Percho]

The best BB coach in Starkville is coaching the women. They are playing well presently.

[Coach34]

Howland is going to “retire” if we don’t make the Tourney

[msstate7]

The best BB coach in Starkville is coaching the women. They are playing well presently.

Maybe, but men have better overall record, sec record, and NET ranking

[msstate7]

Howland is going to “retire” if we don’t make the Tourney

And he won't if they do? Cooter made it sound like either way he's retiring

[msstate7]

I'm totally ready to see us replace Howland, but I 100% agree with this.

I'm on board big time if we can convince howland to "retire" and hire Marshall

[confucius say]

I don?t think people want to accept the fact that Stansbury wasn?t fired for performance. He was fired because he lost control of his team and we made an embarrassment of ourselves on Christmas Day with the Hawaii fight. There is no point of even discussing the Stansbury situation because the administration didn?t have a choice. The problem is we have people that love Stans or people that hate him. He might still be our coach if not for his lack of institutional control with the team. The way he handled that team was a fireable offense. It?s unfortunate for Stans and Miss State that it had to happen, but you can?t take it back. My point is that I don?t get this argument 10 years later about whether he should?ve been fired for performance or not. The point is moot because he was fired for other reasons

False. If we went to the elite 8 in 2012 he doesn't get fired.

Also, he wasn't fired after the fight. Nobody gave two craps about that if we would have went to the sweet 16. We fired him bc we didn't think he won enough. Bottom line. We've shown we don't fire coaches for a bunch of failed drug tests.

[confucius say]

I'm on board big time if we can convince howland to "retire" and hire Marshall

I'd take this too

[msstate7]

False. If we went to the elite 8 in 2012 he doesn't get fired.

Also, he wasn't fired after the fight. Nobody gave two craps about that if we would have went to the sweet 16. We fired him bc we didn't think he won enough. Bottom line. We've shown we don't fire coaches for a bunch of failed drug tests.

If we beat Georgia and make the tourney, I don't think he would've been fired

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I'm on board big time if we can convince howland to "retire" and hire Marshall

We're not hiring Gregg Marshall. If we were to say F it & go all in then the hire would be Sean Miller.

[calidawg]

We're not hiring Gregg Marshall. If we were to say F it & go all in then the hire would be Sean Miller.

That would be incredible

[msstate7]

We're not hiring Gregg Marshall. If we were to say F it & go all in then the hire would be Sean Miller.

Yeah, I'm fine with that too

[msstate7]

About Sean miller, does he have a show cause?

[Quaoarsking]

If we need a new MBB coach next year (and I hope we don't), but feel that it would be too slimy to hire Marshall or Miller, we could look at Chris Mack, who was just fired by Louisville. He was very solid at Xavier and actually not bad at Louisville either.

[msstate7]

If we need a new MBB coach next year (and I hope we don't), but feel that it would be too slimy to hire Marshall or Miller, we could look at Chris Mack, who was just fired by Louisville. He was very solid at Xavier and actually not bad at Louisville either.

What the heck happened this year to him?

ETA... our neighboring states have Pearl and wade, so I certainly wouldn't apologize for miller. Marshall was more than just paying kids, so I think it's a little slimy, but I don't know all the details

[Coach34]

False. If we went to the elite 8 in 2012 he doesn't get fired.

Also, he wasn't fired after the fight. Nobody gave two craps about that if we would have went to the sweet 16. We fired him bc we didn't think he won enough. Bottom line. We've shown we don't fire coaches for a bunch of failed drug tests.

He was 100% fired because of off the court problems. Teams with the off the court problems we had dont make the Sweet 16- thus the firing.

[Quaoarsking]

What the heck happened this year to him?

Not sure, but this is the first year in Chris Mack's entire career that whatever team he head coached had a worse KenPom rating that Mississippi State.

[dawgday166]

Several on this board that this is the best basketball team that Howland has had and that we should be for sure NCAA tourney bound. While some, like myself, expressed extensive skepticism. And here we are yet again, outside the tourney with teams like auburn #1 in the country and Bama winning its 2nd top 5 match up of the season..

Howlands swan song is sounding louder by the game.

So you believed all that LOL? The same posters that make every excuse for Howland, regardless of how talented we are and how bad we play, are most times wanting to fire Leach in his 1st and 2nd years playing a true Fr/So at QB and inheriting a similar dumpster fire as Howland. And one of those years is a Covid year. But our QB should play like he's surrounded by same talent as Bryce Young SMFH.

I was a Howland fan and thought we hit a HR with his hire. I was a fan... I've given him time, just like I am with Leach but ... Ben is in retirement mode. The stuff at UCLA adversely affected him IMO. Ben's been here 7 years now ... He should have at very least produced one year of better results (regular season/SEC tourney/NCAA) than he has.

I've defended Leach some but still waiting to see if he's in retirement mode yet. Air Raid shouldn't be an issue IMO. It all comes down to Leach. Recruiting has been decent and we'll see. But he should be given time to turn things around.

ETA: Up thru UCLA years, Ben's teams were tough, smart, and scrappy. Played smart, tough D. Not so much at MSU. There are flashes here and there but, it's way too inconsistent.

[msstate7]

So you believed all that LOL? The same posters that make every excuse for Howland, regardless of how talented we are and how bad we play, are most times wanting to fire Leach in his 1st and 2nd years playing a true Fr/So at QB and inheriting a similar dumpster fire as Howland. And one of those years is a Covid year. But our QB should play like he's surrounded by same talent as Bryce Young SMFH.

I was a Howland fan and thought we hit a HR with his hire. I was a fan... I've given him time, just like I am with Leach but ... Ben is in retirement mode. The stuff at UCLA adversely affected him IMO. Ben's been here 7 years now ... He should have at very least produced one year of better results (regular season/SEC tourney/NCAA) than he has.

I've defended Leach some but still waiting to see if he's in retirement mode yet. Air Raid shouldn't be an issue IMO. It all comes down to Leach. Recruiting has been decent and we'll see. But he should be given time to turn things around.

ETA: Up thru UCLA years, Ben's teams were tough, smart, and scrappy. Played smart, tough D. Not so much at MSU. There are flashes here and there but, it's way too inconsistent.

And some think will is better than Bryce young, who is a consensus top 5 pick next year.

BTW, leach made a bowl with a losing record 2 years ago... that never happens in basketball. Leach made it at 7-5 this year... that's at best an NIT season in basketball

Let's let the season play out in basketball, and see where we end up. And you should toss the first 2 seasons for howland. He took over a wreck. It took Bruce Pearl 4 seasons to make the tourney at auburn, and he's one of the best.

ETA... I came here after auburn eating my crow on will and leach. I was very impressed by the offense and will in particular against auburn. Now after that, we were not impressive.I'm ready to see which offense we really are

[KentuckyDawg13]

I could post a lot of info abt Mack, but you have Google. He's a disaster, just leave it at that.


If we need a new MBB coach next year (and I hope we don't), but feel that it would be too slimy to hire Marshall or Miller, we could look at Chris Mack, who was just fired by Louisville. He was very solid at Xavier and actually not bad at Louisville either.

[sleepy dawg]

This is a poor take. Getting into the tournament is a big deal and is a successful season. We aren't Duke or UK.

Is that the line then? If you make the tournament you are a good team and if not you're not? How many teams can be considered good? The almost the same number of teams go to the tournament as they do in regionals is baseball. If we missed regionals we would absolutely say we were not a good team. There wouldn't even be a question, and just making a regional doesn't make it a successful year.
Making the tournament would be an improvement, but that alone is not that impressive. 68 teams make the tournament. The majority of the 358 teams in D1 are trash and have no shot. Just making the tournament is the minimum of what we should be pulling for. That's the baseline. We should make the tournament more years than not, or we are failing and should consider making changes.

[Saltydog]

About Sean miller, does he have a show cause?

Honestly, does that really mean anything now? You take Will Wade, heck, nothings happened to him and even Pearl got off light considering and with no post season ban...........

[msstate7]

Is that the line then? If you make the tournament you are a good team and if not you're not? How many teams can be considered good? The almost the same number of teams go to the tournament as they do in regionals is baseball. If we missed regionals we would absolutely say we were not a good team. There wouldn't even be a question, and just making a regional doesn't make it a successful year.
Making the tournament would be an improvement, but that alone is not that impressive. 68 teams make the tournament. The majority of the 358 teams in D1 are trash and have no shot. Just making the tournament is the minimum of what we should be pulling for. That's the baseline. We should make the tournament more years than not, or we are failing and should consider making changes.

We've hit the baseline 11 times in our history

[sleepy dawg]

We've hit the baseline 11 times in our history

Just because we've sucked doesn't mean we have to keep sucking.

[MedDawg]

And we ran off our best coach post integration who had us in that 28% 11 out of 14 years. Still mind boggling.

I spent Stans' last few years at State defending him. One thing I noted was it's not easy to find a coach who wins even a decent amount. Much bigger/richer schools have failed over and over again. Stans had the 2nd or 3rd most wins in the SEC around 2002-2008, maybe longer.

I didn't care that much about the debacle in Hawaii. It wasn't something we couldn't get past. What did concern me about the lack of discipline was apparent the lack of weight training. Apparently Stans didn't push them to lift, and there was something about Renardo Sydney not lifting so other players weren't going to. Our guys remained skinny through senior year, and we were getting pushed around more and more as the years went on. For Stans' first several years we led the SEC in rebounding or were near the top, but that stopped after 2005.

I finally gave up on Stans after he had us at 19-5 in his last season but we didn't even make the tourney (finished 21-12). That made it seven years with only one NCAA appearance that was earned from regular season success (plus one earned from winning the SEC Tourney). He just wasn't getting us there enough after 2005.

Turns out I was right about not being able to find a winning coach to replace him. Maybe we should have kept Stans. However, who knows if he would have had much success after 2012. Overall in basketball, the SEC got better, and he wasn't improving.

Should we fire Howland? I don't know. We have some really good players right now but seem to be underperforming. Aren't most of them leaving after this year? If not, then keep Howland at least another year. If so, then will Howland be able to replace them?

I'm one of those who have become apathetic towards basketball. Maybe a new coach can bring some enthusiasm. Just know that there are no "can't miss" coaches out there.

If we do get a new coach, let's get the best out there we can possibly get, I don't care if he's slimy (see Pearl at Auburn). It looks like the NCAA doesn't even care anymore, so it's not like they are going to set up an office in Starkville if we hire one who has been caught doing something wrong.

[msstate7]

Just because we've sucked doesn't mean we have to keep sucking.

Well, most coaches don't wanna enter into a situation where fans expect to be really good without good facilities, poor recruiting base, and bad fan support. I think most coaches see howland as doing a good job. Much like when we let stansbury go.

[dawgday166]

And some think will is better than Bryce young, who is a consensus top 5 pick next year.

BTW, leach made a bowl with a losing record 2 years ago... that never happens in basketball. Leach made it at 7-5 this year... that's at best an NIT season in basketball

Let's let the season play out in basketball, and see where we end up. And you should toss the first 2 seasons for howland. He took over a wreck. It took Bruce Pearl 4 seasons to make the tourney at auburn, and he's one of the best.

ETA... I came here after auburn eating my crow on will and leach. I was very impressed by the offense and will in particular against auburn. Now after that, we were not impressive.I'm ready to see which offense we really are

Young ... then there's Tua and Hurts which everyone thought were the greatest too. I think Young has more potential at being really good in pros than they do but it's too early to tell IMO. He floundered around some in several games this year and that's playing with Bama talent. But then the excuse was ... he's a young Soph QB. Really, that's the excuse?? He didn't impress me much this year except maybe in 1st Ga game.

For a 3 or 4 game stretch culminating with AU, Will was better than Young IMO. Young was struggling at that time somewhat. Will also moved very well in pocket and threw some dimes while on the move that were very impressive during that stretch. And Will ain't playing with Bama talent either.

Leach needs to be more consistent too, but he's only in his 2nd season. However, sometimes we go into a few games extremely shorthanded due to Covid (1st year OM game is one with only 47 players) and not too many wants to cut Leach any slack for that. But the excuses for Howland's very underwhelming losses are out in full force whether we have a full roster or not. I'll buy seeing what happens rest of way with the hoops team, but I'll also say we need to do same over next 2 years with football team too.

[Coach34]

Young ... then there's Tua and Hurts which everyone thought were the greatest too. I think Young has more potential at being really good in pros than they do but it's too early to tell IMO. He floundered around some in several games this year and that's playing with Bama talent. But then the excuse was ... he's a young Soph QB. Really, that's the excuse?? He didn't impress me much this year except maybe in 1st Ga game.

For a 3 or 4 game stretch culminating with AU, Will was better than Young IMO. .

Thats an impressive take that the Heisman winner didnt really impress you. He will join Tua and Hurts as NFL QB's as he will likely be a 1st round pick in 2023. I thought his 47 TD's to 7 picks was pretty damn good myself. Rogers at no time in 2021 was better than Young as a QB but Rogers is extremely accurate up to 20 yards. He just doesnt possess the arm strength to be an NFL QB with a bigger ball, smaller windows, and less time while avoiding a pass rush

[msstate7]

The last 3 bama qbs start in the nfl. 2 of the 3 made the playoffs, and the other missed the playoffs by 1 game. That's really unbelievable. Can you think of any school ever this has happened?

[KOdawg1]

So I'm skimming this thread, only really half reading it, and now we're suddenly talking about Bama QBs. That took a turn

[BrunswickDawg]

The last 3 bama qbs start in the nfl. 2 of the 3 made the playoffs, and the other missed the playoffs by 1 game. That's really unbelievable. Can you think of any school ever this has happened?

I can't think of any. The closest I get is Kelly/Kosar/Testaverde - but none of the 3 were ever in the playoffs in the same season that I can find.

[msstate7]

I can't think of any. The closest I get is Kelly/Kosar/Testaverde - but none of the 3 were ever in the playoffs in the same season that I can find.

That's good enough. Basically the first part was what I was looking for. Miami and bama only

ETA... the Miami trio is pretty damn impressive. Did they have 4? I think young makes it 4 straight starters in nfl

[BrunswickDawg]

That's good enough. Basically the first part was what I was looking for. Miami and bama only

And I was wrong - Bills played the Browns in the '89 AFC Divisional Round - Kelly vs. Kosar. Browns won 34-30, held off a potential game-winning drive when Clay Matthews picked off Kelly at the 1 with :03 left on the clock. I remember watching this game after reading about it.

[PGHBulldogBG]

We aren?t firing Howland unless he loses out which isn?t happening. Rick Ray is probably the only person that could do that with this team. At worst we go 7-11 and that still wouldn?t get Howland fired. Now if he retires that?s certainly possible, but the rebuilding process at least won?t be as bad as it was for Ray or Howland. We should be able to get a decent mid major coach in here now where that wasn?t happening after the Stansbury mess. Thankfully Howland doesn?t have off court issues like Stansbury or recruit Sun belt talent like Ray did so the new coach should at least get able to keep us decent for a year or two while he gets his players and system in here

[dawgday166]

Thats an impressive take that the Heisman winner didnt really impress you. He will join Tua and Hurts as NFL QB's as he will likely be a 1st round pick in 2023. I thought his 47 TD's to 7 picks was pretty damn good myself. Rogers at no time in 2021 was better than Young as a QB but Rogers is extremely accurate up to 20 yards. He just doesnt possess the arm strength to be an NFL QB with a bigger ball, smaller windows, and less time while avoiding a pass rush

There's been lots of Heisman winning QBs that were average or below in NFL. Those are extremely good stats but outside of Ga, Bama's talent level is so far superior to everyone else's that happens almost regardless of the QB. And he was pretty meh in a few of those games (FL, TAM, AU). Similar happened with Mac Jones (who I do think will be a top notch NFL QB) and Tua. He was a true soph tho so we'll see when he goes pro.

But point of thread is really Ben and I have been somewhat disappointed with him so far. We'll see what happens rest of year tho. Since he's supposed to retire, this year results don't dictate future coaching direction regardless. And FWIW .. my post isn't just about this past weekend's game. It a 7 year composite IMO.

[OLJWales]

False. If we went to the elite 8 in 2012 he doesn't get fired.

Also, he wasn't fired after the fight. Nobody gave two craps about that if we would have went to the sweet 16. We fired him bc we didn't think he won enough. Bottom line. We've shown we don't fire coaches for a bunch of failed drug tests.

Richard Williams got a FF and we canned him for alleged.....Stans IMO let Sidney Destroy him....Can canned for alleged.....rumors of Vik"s departure now... Seems we have a TON of successful HC's departing under personal issues.

[MedDawg]

Richard Williams got a FF and we canned him for alleged.....Stans IMO let Sidney Destroy him....Can canned for alleged.....rumors of Vik"s departure now... Seems we have a TON of successful HC's departing under personal issues.

Because ours can't have regular affairs like normal coaches, they have to go and do it with students, players, relatives of prominent alums, or employees.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

We aren?t firing Howland unless he loses out which isn?t happening. Rick Ray is probably the only person that could do that with this team. At worst we go 7-11 and that still wouldn?t get Howland fired. Now if he retires that?s certainly possible, but the rebuilding process at least won?t be as bad as it was for Ray or Howland. We should be able to get a decent mid major coach in here now where that wasn?t happening after the Stansbury mess. Thankfully Howland doesn?t have off court issues like Stansbury or recruit Sun belt talent like Ray did so the new coach should at least get able to keep us decent for a year or two while he gets his players and system in here

If he doesn't make the tourney I totally disagree

[msstate7]

If he doesn't make the tourney I totally disagree

Please tell me miller wasn't just some random name you mentioned. I can't think of any coach I'd rather have more than him.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Please tell me miller wasn't just some random name you mentioned. I can't think of any coach I'd rather have more than him.

Do you believe John Cohen & Mark Keenum would hire Sean Miller.

[msstate7]

Do you believe John Cohen & Mark Keenum would hire Sean Miller.

No idea. What did he do other than cheat some?

[OLJWales]

No idea. What did he do other than cheat some?

Did LSU Fire their hoops coach after all that BS?

[msstate7]

Did LSU Fire their hoops coach after all that BS?

No, and they won't unless they have to

[KentuckyDawg13]

Yes, you are confused if you cannot look at the talent on our team and determine it should be the best under Howland.
SEC happens to be the strongest it has been EVER.
This Howland bashing needs to stop, it really does nothing to help the team currently.

[KentuckyDawg13]

Only highlights the lack of basketball knowledge displayed here.

[OLJWales]

Yes, you are confused if you cannot look at the talent on our team and determine it should be the best under Howland.
SEC happens to be the strongest it has been EVER.
This Howland bashing needs to stop, it really does nothing to help the team currently.

Too many knowledgeable folks saying how loaded we were makes the current "average talent" people hard to read. Growing tired of excuses.

[msstate7]

Too many knowledgeable folks saying how loaded we were makes the current "average talent" people hard to read. Growing tired of excuses.

Both are true. This is at worst howland's 2nd most talented team. Our talent still isn't better than ark, bama, lsu, Kentucky, auburn, Tennessee, and Florida... Florida and ark are close though imo

[OLJWales]

Both are true. This is at worst howland's 2nd most talented team. Our talent still isn't better than ark, bama, lsu, Kentucky, auburn, Tennessee, and Florida... Florida and ark are close though imo

1/2 or more here insisted we had Sweet 16 Talent pre-season. Sick of moving Howland's Goal Posts.

[msstate7]

1/2 or more here insisted we had Sweet 16 Talent pre-season. Sick of moving Howland's Goal Posts.

Hell, I may have been one of them, but I vastly overrated Jeffries preseason. I don't think he's a bad player, but he isn't as good as I thought. Brooks around the basket is a damn good player; brooks playing on the perimeter is... well, he's not as good on the perimeter.

[OLJWales]

Hell, I may have been one of them, but I vastly overrated Jeffries preseason. I don't think he's a bad player, but he isn't as good as I thought. Brooks around the basket is a damn good player; brooks playing on the perimeter is... well, he's not as good on the perimeter.

Coaching and Player Resumes not living up to expectations. Howland's Trademark here since arrival.

[Hot Rock]

I am like a lot of people I have an opinion and I will voice it, my two cents worth:

The number one thing on these players minds is getting to the NBA.

Ben can offer them an opportunity to work on their game to get to the NBA. Many of the players that transfer are very talented players that were not on track to make it to the NBA for one reason or the other. They need to expand their skill sets in order to meet their goals. Therefore, you get guys shooting threes that can't or you get guys simply learning how to play a different way so they can meet their ultimate goal which is not about winning games. Sure, everyone hates losing and wants to win. If they don't work on that 3 point shot in games, then whatever it is that they need work on in real game time situations will not get developed and they will never make it to the NBA.

So, inconsistency will be the norm under Howland until he gets a squad that plays selflessly enough to do what is best for the team or enough of them actually do develop these other skills they need to make it to the NBA. These guys this year, just may come together and be good enough to make a run in the post season. They certainly have the talent to do it if they all can stay healthy.