Todd4State
09-21-2021, 02:20 AM
I started following MSU football in 1991 after we knocked off Texas. At least seriously- I remember when Felker was the coach and there were fire Rockey signs in the stands on the news but I didn't pay that much attention to the team as a whole. Back then I remember as a child my Mom who is a MSU alum telling me that MSU is bad in football but we're good in baseball. And that's just the way it is. This was the 1980's for context- post 1985 for sure. Anyway- we hired Jackie and that changed some we started to win in football, Croom had one good year, Dan was good, and even Joe won at MSU. I believe Leach will too just based on pure history- both his and MSU as every MSU coach going back to Wade Walker has had at least one winning season- even Shira pulled out a 6-5 in 1970.
Anyway, all of that is to say that there is a prevailing attitude at MSU that "we're good in baseball but not good in football". However, to the contrary we've been to 11 bowls in a row have been #1 in the country for a time, and won the SEC West. All of this has occurred in my fan lifetime and has been witnessed by me often times in person. We even have a winning record in the Egg Bowl since 1991 and have not lost to USM since 1988. In my fan lifetime we have done a LOT of good things and won a LOT of games. However, despite this it seems like the MSU athletic administration can't believe that we can actually be good in football. And some fans as well. As a result it appears as if they do not appear to even try to be better. Now I'm sure I'm going to get "But they want to win more than you"- impossible to quantify sure. At any rate I don't believe that to be the case. Just that this is the impression that is given off. I think the truth is the MSU administration doesn't know how to win or promote the team well enough. It feels as though we're living in the Scott Stricklin past of 2014 and have just never really left or adapted or changed.
And this isn't the first time MSU has done this with a sport. Believe it or not, this happened to baseball in the 2000's when we brought back Ron Polk and as hard as it is to believe we de-emphasized baseball. We literally just played the Chicken Dance at games and just "let Ron handle baseball." Then we hit a crossroads where we could have either hired Tommy Raffo who would have been same old same old MSU who the old guard wanted or we could decide to actually reach our ceiling in baseball. We then went out and hired John Cohen to reach our ceiling. This caused a massive rift, a rebuild that essentially last three years but once it got going we started to get closer and closer to our ceiling starting 2011. We won SEC Tournaments, started going to Omaha, started to win Governor's Cups, make it to the National Championship series, won the SEC, and then finally won the National Championship. As we all know, Cohen did not win the title as coach but he did lay the ground work and put the program in a stable position and did win it as AD 13 years after he was hired.
Similarly, I feel like MSU just expects Dan, Joe, or Mike to "handle football" and the athletic department just opens the gates to Davis Wade, makes sure I don't bring a gun in the stadium, and sells me crappy chicken tenders. Like baseball that is NOT going to work and MSU needs to figure out how to reach our ceiling. And of course, I have ideas.
1. We need to really invest in football recruiting and embrace it. I think this is one of the things that began the turnaround in baseball starting with Chris Stratton's commitment. MSU has been woeful in this arena for years. It is however understandable. We have had highly rated classes flame out before. We have also been hit heavily with probation before as well for doing lesser things than other schools- mostly due to MSU's historical "exemplary compliance" stance. That has in effect discouraged boosters from getting involved as MSU has historically proven that they will not support boosters involved in infractions. However, we are now entering a new era where there is no reason to cheat because now everyone can just claim it as NIL. Unless they don't have a brain. So MSU MUST GET THEIR BOOSTERS ORGANIZED AND ENCOURAGE THEM TO PARTICIPATE IN THE NIL. It's absolutely vital. And you can sit there and say "well, we're only going to recruit at this level, and I don't like the offense so other recruits must not like it, and the coach doesn't like to recruit. All of that doesn't matter. Case in point. Ole Miss football 2010. They went 2-10 and were one year off of losing to Jacksonville State while running everything out of the I formation pretty much while wearing Confederate uniforms and were STILL able sign three Army All-American players that MSU wanted while we had a 9-4 season and beat the snot out of Michigan and Ole Miss and had a fun offense and defense. The point is everyone has their price. And we need to start paying it. Our historical philosophy has been to hire a coach who is a offensive guru and ask him to basically outsmart everyone with our lower rated players while being outgunned. Realistically that's only going to go so far whether we're running the wishbone, the West Coast Offense, the Air Raid, or the spread option. And if we can recruit men's basketball well- heck women's basketball there is no reason why we can't be a top 20 team in recruiting. At this point it's all about what we put into it.
2. Along those lines, build an indoor practice facility. Who cares if Leach thinks we need one or not? It's like a deck on a house. It may not be necessary and the owner may not care about whether there is one or not- but without question a decent deck helps the value of the house. Leach I'm sure doesn't care if we build one. And if not him another coach will probably want one somewhere along the line. Oh yeah- and it helps with recruiting.
3. MSU has done a poor job of promoting MSU football IMO. It's like they're just trying to poorly imitate Scott Stricklin every gameday. I don't see billboards around promoting the team as much. The only time I've ever seen an ad with Leach in it was after we beat LSU. During the game there is nothing where fans participate on the field. No pass, punt, kick contest. No throw the football through the truck and you win it. Nothing new. It's basically "Here's the men's golf team", "Here's Rafael Palmeiro", "Here's the tailgaters of the game", and that's about it. I mean, it's OK to keep doing that stuff. I think MSU should. But there should be more active things going on for casual fans to watch during the game. Cohen's a baseball guy. He needs to look up the Savannah Bananas college summer league team. Since he or whoever he hired can't come up with anything good on their own. Also, drop ticket prices. That in and of itself would help. And if I'm Cohen I start a drive to build more hotels that are relatively inexpensive so that fans can stay the night as Starkville isn't exactly the most convenient place to go watch a game and you have constantly worry about the Louisville Highway Patrol for about 10-15 miles on top of it. That would help our fans on the Gulf Coast and out of state go to a game. Sometimes I can't even find anything in Starkville for a baseball regional much less a football game. The food quality needs to be improved at the concession stands. And all of this "well we couldn't find workers and had to use Bart Gregory so serve beer"- I mean seriously? MSU is a college campus of what 20K students? You're telling me that NONE of those plus however many 18 year olds at the area high schools are willing to go work a Saturday and make some money? I mean, I know the youth have questionable work standards but even I trust them to fill a cup of Coke. Chik- Fil- A manages to make them do it 6 days a week and we only need like seven Saturdays. Yes, winning helps more than anything but I think it was Dan Mullen that said the fans have to show up first to support the program before it wins. I think there is something to that.
4. Along those lines MSU continues to give it's fans the middle finger by not using the interlocking MSU in some form or fashion forcing us to use the LT M-State banner. What other football program in the country does that to their fans? Really? Save me all of the "marketing 101 and branding" bullshit that MSU wants us to believe and no one really buys. MSU shouldn't care if someone in Wyoming recognizes us. Just because they see M-State on TV they're not going to just go on Fanatics and buy a t-shirt that is the wrong shade of maroon. Our primary market is guess who? OUR FANS! Marketing 101. Look how well the Flying-M sold. The interlocking MSU will sell three times as well. And no, I'm NOT talking about using the 1990's Nike one. Adidas should come up with their own. We can use it once or twice a year and I think everyone will go nuts with joy buy up a ton of merchandise and they can still use M-State the other 10 games. And it won't kill any branding. Which I know because sports teams have been using throwback logos and uniforms as one offs for years now and no one has lost their identity in the process. And they've actually sold a ton of stuff. So quite the opposite.
5. I like Mike Leach and I do think he will be successful here. I think he will be here for several years. We'll see. That said, like all coaches he will inevitably leave at some point. And whenever that point comes I think MSU needs to go in a different direction than the model I talked about earlier where we essentially hire a offensive guru and try to outsmart everyone. Interestingly enough we haven't really hired a Southern coach since Croom. We've hired two guys from the North and Leach is from the West Coast. I think that has hurt us somewhat as far as the fans go because right or wrong I think a lot of our fans want someone "Southern" that is "like us". So if I was Cohen I would start to identify coaching prospects and start to groom them essentially for the future. And the guy I have in mind to ideally to do that is Joe Judge. And yes, I know Judge is from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania not Philadelphia, Mississippi. But he is a MSU grad. So he is one of us. And basically I would want our next coach whoever it is whether it's Judge or someone else to be a CEO coach instead of an offense or defense guy. Now, I'm not saying that not getting Judge was a bad break. To the contrary I don't think Judge was ready for our job. Now he has head coaching experience in New York City no less in the NFL. So I think he would be even more ready for our job when the time comes. Now, I need to explain what I mean when I say grooming. I mean I think Cohen needs to help him make connections to the brightest offensive and defensive minds in the college game and back to point number one recruiters as position coaches that have Mississippi ties. We need to do whatever we can do to attract the best local coaches to MSU that are qualified. I could see Judge being the OC at Alabama at some point in time as well. Which I think would be a great experience for him. Cohen needs to get up to date on the best current recruiting practices and then help Judge implement them when the time comes because if he's in the NFL he may not know what those are.
6. For me personally- have the band march in the stadium before the game again.
Anyway- that's how we reach our ceiling in football. I think it's doable and it's past time for MSU Administration to stop "can't believing" we are successful in football.
Anyway, all of that is to say that there is a prevailing attitude at MSU that "we're good in baseball but not good in football". However, to the contrary we've been to 11 bowls in a row have been #1 in the country for a time, and won the SEC West. All of this has occurred in my fan lifetime and has been witnessed by me often times in person. We even have a winning record in the Egg Bowl since 1991 and have not lost to USM since 1988. In my fan lifetime we have done a LOT of good things and won a LOT of games. However, despite this it seems like the MSU athletic administration can't believe that we can actually be good in football. And some fans as well. As a result it appears as if they do not appear to even try to be better. Now I'm sure I'm going to get "But they want to win more than you"- impossible to quantify sure. At any rate I don't believe that to be the case. Just that this is the impression that is given off. I think the truth is the MSU administration doesn't know how to win or promote the team well enough. It feels as though we're living in the Scott Stricklin past of 2014 and have just never really left or adapted or changed.
And this isn't the first time MSU has done this with a sport. Believe it or not, this happened to baseball in the 2000's when we brought back Ron Polk and as hard as it is to believe we de-emphasized baseball. We literally just played the Chicken Dance at games and just "let Ron handle baseball." Then we hit a crossroads where we could have either hired Tommy Raffo who would have been same old same old MSU who the old guard wanted or we could decide to actually reach our ceiling in baseball. We then went out and hired John Cohen to reach our ceiling. This caused a massive rift, a rebuild that essentially last three years but once it got going we started to get closer and closer to our ceiling starting 2011. We won SEC Tournaments, started going to Omaha, started to win Governor's Cups, make it to the National Championship series, won the SEC, and then finally won the National Championship. As we all know, Cohen did not win the title as coach but he did lay the ground work and put the program in a stable position and did win it as AD 13 years after he was hired.
Similarly, I feel like MSU just expects Dan, Joe, or Mike to "handle football" and the athletic department just opens the gates to Davis Wade, makes sure I don't bring a gun in the stadium, and sells me crappy chicken tenders. Like baseball that is NOT going to work and MSU needs to figure out how to reach our ceiling. And of course, I have ideas.
1. We need to really invest in football recruiting and embrace it. I think this is one of the things that began the turnaround in baseball starting with Chris Stratton's commitment. MSU has been woeful in this arena for years. It is however understandable. We have had highly rated classes flame out before. We have also been hit heavily with probation before as well for doing lesser things than other schools- mostly due to MSU's historical "exemplary compliance" stance. That has in effect discouraged boosters from getting involved as MSU has historically proven that they will not support boosters involved in infractions. However, we are now entering a new era where there is no reason to cheat because now everyone can just claim it as NIL. Unless they don't have a brain. So MSU MUST GET THEIR BOOSTERS ORGANIZED AND ENCOURAGE THEM TO PARTICIPATE IN THE NIL. It's absolutely vital. And you can sit there and say "well, we're only going to recruit at this level, and I don't like the offense so other recruits must not like it, and the coach doesn't like to recruit. All of that doesn't matter. Case in point. Ole Miss football 2010. They went 2-10 and were one year off of losing to Jacksonville State while running everything out of the I formation pretty much while wearing Confederate uniforms and were STILL able sign three Army All-American players that MSU wanted while we had a 9-4 season and beat the snot out of Michigan and Ole Miss and had a fun offense and defense. The point is everyone has their price. And we need to start paying it. Our historical philosophy has been to hire a coach who is a offensive guru and ask him to basically outsmart everyone with our lower rated players while being outgunned. Realistically that's only going to go so far whether we're running the wishbone, the West Coast Offense, the Air Raid, or the spread option. And if we can recruit men's basketball well- heck women's basketball there is no reason why we can't be a top 20 team in recruiting. At this point it's all about what we put into it.
2. Along those lines, build an indoor practice facility. Who cares if Leach thinks we need one or not? It's like a deck on a house. It may not be necessary and the owner may not care about whether there is one or not- but without question a decent deck helps the value of the house. Leach I'm sure doesn't care if we build one. And if not him another coach will probably want one somewhere along the line. Oh yeah- and it helps with recruiting.
3. MSU has done a poor job of promoting MSU football IMO. It's like they're just trying to poorly imitate Scott Stricklin every gameday. I don't see billboards around promoting the team as much. The only time I've ever seen an ad with Leach in it was after we beat LSU. During the game there is nothing where fans participate on the field. No pass, punt, kick contest. No throw the football through the truck and you win it. Nothing new. It's basically "Here's the men's golf team", "Here's Rafael Palmeiro", "Here's the tailgaters of the game", and that's about it. I mean, it's OK to keep doing that stuff. I think MSU should. But there should be more active things going on for casual fans to watch during the game. Cohen's a baseball guy. He needs to look up the Savannah Bananas college summer league team. Since he or whoever he hired can't come up with anything good on their own. Also, drop ticket prices. That in and of itself would help. And if I'm Cohen I start a drive to build more hotels that are relatively inexpensive so that fans can stay the night as Starkville isn't exactly the most convenient place to go watch a game and you have constantly worry about the Louisville Highway Patrol for about 10-15 miles on top of it. That would help our fans on the Gulf Coast and out of state go to a game. Sometimes I can't even find anything in Starkville for a baseball regional much less a football game. The food quality needs to be improved at the concession stands. And all of this "well we couldn't find workers and had to use Bart Gregory so serve beer"- I mean seriously? MSU is a college campus of what 20K students? You're telling me that NONE of those plus however many 18 year olds at the area high schools are willing to go work a Saturday and make some money? I mean, I know the youth have questionable work standards but even I trust them to fill a cup of Coke. Chik- Fil- A manages to make them do it 6 days a week and we only need like seven Saturdays. Yes, winning helps more than anything but I think it was Dan Mullen that said the fans have to show up first to support the program before it wins. I think there is something to that.
4. Along those lines MSU continues to give it's fans the middle finger by not using the interlocking MSU in some form or fashion forcing us to use the LT M-State banner. What other football program in the country does that to their fans? Really? Save me all of the "marketing 101 and branding" bullshit that MSU wants us to believe and no one really buys. MSU shouldn't care if someone in Wyoming recognizes us. Just because they see M-State on TV they're not going to just go on Fanatics and buy a t-shirt that is the wrong shade of maroon. Our primary market is guess who? OUR FANS! Marketing 101. Look how well the Flying-M sold. The interlocking MSU will sell three times as well. And no, I'm NOT talking about using the 1990's Nike one. Adidas should come up with their own. We can use it once or twice a year and I think everyone will go nuts with joy buy up a ton of merchandise and they can still use M-State the other 10 games. And it won't kill any branding. Which I know because sports teams have been using throwback logos and uniforms as one offs for years now and no one has lost their identity in the process. And they've actually sold a ton of stuff. So quite the opposite.
5. I like Mike Leach and I do think he will be successful here. I think he will be here for several years. We'll see. That said, like all coaches he will inevitably leave at some point. And whenever that point comes I think MSU needs to go in a different direction than the model I talked about earlier where we essentially hire a offensive guru and try to outsmart everyone. Interestingly enough we haven't really hired a Southern coach since Croom. We've hired two guys from the North and Leach is from the West Coast. I think that has hurt us somewhat as far as the fans go because right or wrong I think a lot of our fans want someone "Southern" that is "like us". So if I was Cohen I would start to identify coaching prospects and start to groom them essentially for the future. And the guy I have in mind to ideally to do that is Joe Judge. And yes, I know Judge is from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania not Philadelphia, Mississippi. But he is a MSU grad. So he is one of us. And basically I would want our next coach whoever it is whether it's Judge or someone else to be a CEO coach instead of an offense or defense guy. Now, I'm not saying that not getting Judge was a bad break. To the contrary I don't think Judge was ready for our job. Now he has head coaching experience in New York City no less in the NFL. So I think he would be even more ready for our job when the time comes. Now, I need to explain what I mean when I say grooming. I mean I think Cohen needs to help him make connections to the brightest offensive and defensive minds in the college game and back to point number one recruiters as position coaches that have Mississippi ties. We need to do whatever we can do to attract the best local coaches to MSU that are qualified. I could see Judge being the OC at Alabama at some point in time as well. Which I think would be a great experience for him. Cohen needs to get up to date on the best current recruiting practices and then help Judge implement them when the time comes because if he's in the NFL he may not know what those are.
6. For me personally- have the band march in the stadium before the game again.
Anyway- that's how we reach our ceiling in football. I think it's doable and it's past time for MSU Administration to stop "can't believing" we are successful in football.