Our Recruiting Stinks

[ShotgunDawg]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

[HoopsDawg]

I don't follow recruiting this time of the year, but that's rough if true. I will say that at a place like MSU, the head coach has to really care and prioritize recruiting for us to have much success. And that's not Leach.

[Homedawg]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

We could pour a million into more staff and it wouldn't make one ounce of difference. And CML doesn't want anymore anyway says he has more than he's ever had so there's that. We gonna be a 25-35 team. Is what it is. That's our "budget"

[Homedawg]

I don't follow recruiting this time of the year, but that's rough if true. I will say that at a place like MSU, the head coach has to really care and prioritize recruiting for us to have much success. And that's not Leach.
Mullen likes recruiting and works at it way more than leach. All true

[HoopsDawg]

Mullen likes recruiting and works at it way more than leach. All true

Yes, thanks for the preemptive post b/c you know the Mullen posts were coming. Mullen said a million times that recruiting is like shaving, miss one day and you look like a bum. Leach probably talks to recruits 1 day a week at the most.

[TheLostDawg]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

They flipped Clayton as well

[Todd4State]

Dan's problem had more to do with roster management. Which Leach appears to be much better at that than Dan. Give me a Leach ranked 27th class over a Dan class ranked 27th because the Dan class likely had no receivers over 6'0 tall and 2 OL in it.

MSU's problem is we don't prioritize football recruiting enough. At a recruiting department level OR at a booster level. We're way too scared about getting nailed by the NCAA- and with Bracky that's not surprising why they would feel that way.

Add in MSU winning a National Championship in baseball causing Ole Miss boosters to flip out and this is not surprising at all.

[Todd4State]

They flipped Clayton as well

Basically because we refused to not tell the guy the truth. So he's going to go to Ole Miss and play OL anyway. Which is another issue we have.

[BHildreth3]

Do yourself a favor. Stop following recruiting. It took me into my 40's to do this b/c I loved the idea of getting top 10 recruiting classes. My stress level has decreased. It's pathetic. We don't have enough alumni who CARE($) enough to do anything about it. It's frustrating. No doubt about it. I hope we can surprise and win a lot of games, that will help, but seriously, just don't follow recruiting as much as you have and just catch up at the end. it's better that way.

Pretty soon, if we don't start getting 4stars, we're not going to be competing with Ole Miss for players. We'll be competing for players that are considering smaller schools.

[ShotgunDawg]

The is normally where I'd complain that OM is paying players, but, honestly, it feels like they're going uncontested for players in state. Like we're not even trying

[Todd4State]

The is normally where I'd complain that OM is paying players, but, honestly, it feels like they're going uncontested for players in state. Like we're not even trying

If we're leading for a player and then we suddenly lose them- that's not a coaching issue. Because our coaches did their job in the first place selling the player on MSU for us to lead in the first place. Then it comes down to money at that point.

[Dannyripms]

Id like to hire some more analyst for recruiting but losing these guys aren't the coaching staff's fault. They've been calling and trying to get them in. I have a feeling after we surprise some folks this year things may change for the better. But we will never be a top 10 recruiter unless we play the game all the way like some schools do.

[bulldawg28]

Shotgun, you do this EVERY YEAR!

[Leeshouldveflanked]

We get what we pay for in recruiting. Lowest recruiting budget in Power 5. Thanks LT, I mean Cohen.

[MetEdDawg]

We get what we pay for in recruiting. Lowest recruiting budget in Power 5. Thanks LT, I mean Cohen.

Explain why this is a Cohen issue? Our revenue is shit. We are a small school with a low giving donor base compared to the teams we compete against.

Give more money = spend more money.

This is easy math, but for a long long time a large portion of our fan base refuse to understand that we just don't have nearly as many people as other programs that are willing to consistently give enough money to make a difference. Sure we have folks that will step up to the plate for a capital campaign.

But our base doesn't give enough consistently year over year. Last I checked we had like 12,000 in the Bulldog Club. Not enough. And I hang around the middle of the pack and don't give a lot, but I'm working towards giving more. We need a lot more donors giving a lot more money. That's how you change a program.

[ShotgunDawg]

Explain why this is a Cohen issue? Our revenue is shit. We are a small school with a low giving donor base compared to the teams we compete against.

Give more money = spend more money.

This is easy math, but for a long long time a large portion of our fan base refuse to understand that we just don't have nearly as many people as other programs that are willing to consistently give enough money to make a difference. Sure we have folks that will step up to the plate for a capital campaign.

But our base doesn't give enough consistently year over year. Last I checked we had like 12,000 in the Bulldog Club. Not enough. And I hang around the middle of the pack and don't give a lot, but I'm working towards giving more. We need a lot more donors giving a lot more money. That's how you change a program.

Has anyone ever asked you to give money to build up the recruiting department?

You'd think we run targeted fund raising campaigns but nope, I guess fans are supposed to have an intuition about what we need budget wise.

I bet if the AD asked for money to improve this area, he get plenty of money.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

How many coaches on the staff have a history in Mississippi? Tony Hughes and who else?

[ShotgunDawg]

How many coaches on the staff have a history in Mississippi? Tony Hughes and who else?

I'm not sure that matters anymore with all the recruiting sites. The landscape of recruiting has shifted away from local coaches having much advantage.

[ShotgunDawg]

Stone Blanton has been basically a lock for 3 months and we can't even get him to commit, even if to just get some momentum.

If I didn't know better, I'd think out school has completely de-emphasized football. It seriously appears as though we aren't trying.

[msstate7]

Stone Blanton has been basically a lock for 3 months and we can't even get him to commit, even if to just get some momentum.

If I didn't know better, I'd think out school has completely de-emphasized football. It seriously appears as though we aren't trying.

I don't think leach thinks he needs top talent to run his offense. This may or may not be true, but we won't stop anyone if we load up our defense with a buncha 84-86 rated guys

[ShotgunDawg]

I don't think leach thinks he needs top talent to run his offense. This may or may not be true, but we won't stop anyone if we load up our defense with a buncha 84-86 rated guys

My biggest frustration is that MSU has a culture of lacking a commitment to excellence in football. There is a 100% commitment to mediocrity.

While I like to make fun of OM as well, it?s undeniable that they have a larger commitment to football than us. They have bad ROI, but they try really hard. When you look at our football facility needs and recruiting budget needs, and then realize that no one at MSU is asking for the money to build these things, it?s becomes difficult to then make a case that we?re trying to win in this sport.

[BrunswickDawg]

I don't think leach thinks he needs top talent to run his offense. This may or may not be true, but we won't stop anyone if we load up our defense with a buncha 84-86 rated guys

More talent is better regardless of the system.

However, I think Leach is not going to play the "game" against Ole Miss to land in-state guys. Leach is going to go out of state more than any coach we have ever had, and would rather take an out of state kid with no drama instead of playing the game vs. OM.

[Cowbell]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

Didn't you say that Robertson is the best QB we have ever signed?! Embarrassing...

[KOdawg1]

I used to follow recruiting closely, but I'm starting to care less and less these days, which is sad because the more talent you have, the better you are, but our "network" is so far behind the others in the SEC that we really don't stand much of a chance. We're not willing to do what it takes. It's just the way it is. So we'll continue to recruit around 30, and we'll average 6-7 wins a year and be happy with it I guess.

[Johnson85]

Explain why this is a Cohen issue? Our revenue is shit. We are a small school with a low giving donor base compared to the teams we compete against.

Give more money = spend more money.

This is easy math, but for a long long time a large portion of our fan base refuse to understand that we just don't have nearly as many people as other programs that are willing to consistently give enough money to make a difference. Sure we have folks that will step up to the plate for a capital campaign.

But our base doesn't give enough consistently year over year. Last I checked we had like 12,000 in the Bulldog Club. Not enough. And I hang around the middle of the pack and don't give a lot, but I'm working towards giving more. We need a lot more donors giving a lot more money. That's how you change a program.

Not that this isn't true, but what you see reported isn't what is influencing recruiting. We'd be better off with less revenue on the books if that meant more boosters with money they're willing to send to kids or pay for NIL deals.

[MaroonFlounder]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

Signing day is when? Checks calendar....mid December and early Feb.

The book is not written on this class, and verbal commits often change with the weather. Quit freakin' out.

[Offshore Dawg]

Well I would assume that you did not get the memo. MSU is not suppose to have a good football team, they are to provide wins for the big boys. State must be satisficed with having a good baseball team and know their place. The big boys have to win so that their fans won't feel like they had their dicks cut off.

[thf24]

Small sample size, but two of Mullen's worst classes rankings-wise were his first two full cycles. It seems logical to me that those would be the toughest years for any coach, particularly one who's not a natural recruiter - honeymoon during which most of the work on the class was done by the predecessor is over, but you're still working to build local and regional relationships.

The SEC is obviously a different beast with a learning curve when it comes to recruiting, but I still don't see any reason to doubt that Leach, once acclimated, will recruit at about the same level his program does historically, just like he did at his previous two stops.

[OLJWales]

Leach talks to croots once a week? Are you sure? All I know is that if it was played by the rules, STATE would dominate In-State for many reasons. We just don't wanna show money like others it appears. UhGAIN.

[HoopsDawg]

Leach talks to croots once a week? Are you sure? All I know is that if it was played by the rules, STATE would dominate In-State for many reasons. We just don't wanna show money like others it appears. UhGAIN.

dominate if it was played by the rules? Oh boy.

[OLJWales]

Rebel Flag-Plantation VS People's University. No Brainer.

[tcdog70]

We have to continue to fill our needs with JUCOs. If we sign 6-8 top Jucos we will be fine. Look at the Jucos we have now playing and also the ones that are now in the NFL. The transfer Portal is another way to compete. so really the recruitment of High school players is not as make or break as it used to be. Plus , when you recruit a HS player about half the hot shots are bust. JUCOs and transfers are a more sure thing, at worst most provide depth.

[confucius say]

We could pour a million into more staff and it wouldn't make one ounce of difference. And CML doesn't want anymore anyway says he has more than he's ever had so there's that. We gonna be a 25-35 team. Is what it is. That's our "budget"

Been that way since recruiting rankings began.

[OLJWales]

Maybe get the specifics on Ole Miss crootin then double down?

[confucius say]

The is normally where I'd complain that OM is paying players, but, honestly, it feels like they're going uncontested for players in state. Like we're not even trying

We have 8 in state players committed to their 5. What in state guy committed to them do you look at as a big miss other than Harris?

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Gonna lose Bryson Hurst to OM on Wed.

At one point we led for Williams, Harris, and Dorsch, and won?t likely get any.

MSU has always gotten its share of instate players, but we?re getting destroyed currently.

A lifeless recruiting department that doesn?t get enough funding or staff. Pretty embarrassing what?s going on.

We can win without instate talent. They are mostly overrated

[KOdawg1]

We can win without instate talent. They are mostly overrated

Nope. That first statement is completely false.

[Coach34]

We can win without instate talent. They are mostly overrated

Fletcher Cox
Chris Jones
Jeffrey Simmons
B-Mac
Elgston Jenkins

Most of our top NFL guys are from Mississippi

[HoopsDawg]

We can win without instate talent. They are mostly overrated

damn, bad take my friend.

[HoopsDawg]

We have to continue to fill our needs with JUCOs. If we sign 6-8 top Jucos we will be fine. Look at the Jucos we have now playing and also the ones that are now in the NFL. The transfer Portal is another way to compete. so really the recruitment of High school players is not as make or break as it used to be. Plus , when you recruit a HS player about half the hot shots are bust. JUCOs and transfers are a more sure thing, at worst most provide depth.

now that the free, one time transfer is in place, and freshman eligibility rules are much easier than in Jackie's day, Juco pickings are going to be slim. You will only be able to find really poor students and the extremely late bloomer. Take this recent juco class we signed, potentially no contributors from those signees.

But yeah, we have to hit the transfer portal extremely hard. We need to direct a lot of resources there as far as evaluating, recruiting, and closing the deal.

[msstate7]

damn, bad take my friend.

It changes... if we do well in-state, that's the most important. If we don't do well, in-state isn't important.

[confucius say]

Fletcher Cox
Chris Jones
Jeffrey Simmons
B-Mac
Elgston Jenkins

Most of our top NFL guys are from Mississippi

And nobody wanted two of those five. Or gabe.

We should always start in state. With the usual exception of the QB position.

[BB30]

We can win without instate talent. They are mostly overrated

Very few schools have the ability to win without wrapping up the best players in their respective state. Even schools that recruit well nationally(which we do not, nor have we ever) generally lock up the best players in their state.

We have never recruited well nationally, because from the outside looking in we don't have a great pitch. Now, we can go snag some kids that aren't high profile out of state guys but the majority of our top end talent over the last decade have come directly from MS.

If you want us to start recruiting nationally and forego our local guys we are going to struggle.

Biggest problem is we have a horrible big money donor base and we don't have enough sidewalk fans donating to make up the difference. Alabama has fans that would donate their last 50$ to football even if it meant them not eating for a week. We don't have that same kind of commitment from our fanbase. The problem is just going to amplify as schools get better at using the pay for play model. We can't compete with those schools at our current donor rate.

Cohen only has so much money to work with. It isn't on him. If you want to see recruiting improve it is going to take us regular folks donating much more money along with finding some more big name boosters that just aren't there.

[Homedawg]

damn, bad take my friend.

Correct we HAVE to get more than our fair share of in state.

[Bothrops]

We have by far the most players in the NFL of programs in this state, but it doesn't translate as a recruiting asset for MSU. All our recruits ratings go down when they commit, and the media is carrying on this offseason like our program shut down a decade ago. This stuff is starting to weird me out a little.

[HancockCountyDog]

Correct we HAVE to get more than our fair share of in state.

We can't let out of state schools win so many recruiting battles. Right now on 247 - There are 7 four star kids in-state this year. The bears lead for 3 and the other 4 are committed out of state. Last year 5 four star kids, two went to bears, we got one, and the other 2 went out of state.

Last year we signed 3 of the top 10 in state (one was Harmon, who didn't have many options)
This year we look to sign 2 of the 10 ten - 9 and 10 (Blanton and Moss)

If y'all think we can be competitive without in-state kids, I'm not sure what to tell you.

[ShotgunDawg]

We can't let out of state schools win so many recruiting battles. Right now on 247 - There are 7 four star kids in-state this year. The bears lead for 3 and the other 4 are committed out of state. Last year 5 four star kids, two went to bears, we got one, and the other 2 went out of state.

Last year we signed 3 of the top 10 in state (one was Harmon, who didn't have many options)
This year we look to sign 2 of the 10 ten - 9 and 10 (Blanton and Moss)

If y'all think we can be competitive without in-state kids, I'm not sure what to tell you.

What's currently happening in Mississippi is embarrassing and the effort of a G5 program.

I guess that's what our boosters want.

[KOdawg1]

I saw an interesting post on Jeans Paige..

"Interesting stat for the moral high horse contingent. Did you know that during/immediately following the 3 best 3 year period of MSU football since WWII there was some form of NCAA probation? '74-76 we went 24-9-1. Probation followed. '98-00 we went 26-11. Probation followed. '13-15 we went 26-13. That was during the middle of the Redmond suspension and we got some probation for that as well. The modern story of MSU football is if we want to have some double digit wins, we are going to have to go up to and over whatever the line is in order to get the players required to get the job done. Those 9 years I referenced, we won 70% of all games. Equate that to a 12 game season-that's 10-2. I think it's certainly worth it even if there are repercussions. I'd rather try to get to the mountain top and get knocked back down to the valley than just settle for staying at base camp."

In summary, we gotta get down and dirty. .

[gtowndawg]

In regards to budgets and fundraising...we just announced today our largest fundraising year ever. Not saying it's Stanford money or anything but I would think we could make the budget if there was desire.

Carry on...

[gtowndawg]

I saw an interesting post on Jeans Paige..

"Interesting stat for the moral high horse contingent. Did you know that during/immediately following the 3 best 3 year period of MSU football since WWII there was some form of NCAA probation? '74-76 we went 24-9-1. Probation followed. '98-00 we went 26-11. Probation followed. '13-15 we went 26-13. That was during the middle of the Redmond suspension and we got some probation for that as well. The modern story of MSU football is if we want to have some double digit wins, we are going to have to go up to and over whatever the line is in order to get the players required to get the job done. Those 9 years I referenced, we won 70% of all games. Equate that to a 12 game season-that's 10-2. I think it's certainly worth it even if there are repercussions. I'd rather try to get to the mountain top and get knocked back down to the valley than just settle for staying at base camp."

In summary, we gotta get down and dirty. .

Getting my bags ready!

[Hot Rock]

The media does not believe in this team, this offense or in Mississippi State.

Listening to Cover 3 podcast one of the CBS national radio guys said we should appreciate Mullen more because of how much he was able to win in Starkville, all the others agreed. I say they are full of shit. Jackie took us to the SEC championship game, Leach beat a top 25 team his first year with a bunch of freshman on offense with half a roster. Even Croom put together some winning seasons with an offense that he couldn't teach. The facilities and fan support is getting better and better.

Same CBS guy says that Leach's offense is predicated on finding a weak link in the defense and exploiting it. He said that there won't be weak links in the defenses of the SEC because all the guys can run and we simply don't have the athletes to compete.

That is not at all what Leach's offense is about. His offense is about making you defend as much of the field as possible. He does this by spreading out the attack and using as many different players as possible to do it. Attacking the weak link has nothing to do with it, its about attacking the empty space the entire width of the field and as deep as the Oline can stand.

Note about that empty space: Leach's best teams have run the ball effectively. They don't necessarily run it 35 times a game but they do make defenses defend against it. His RB's have more yards from the line of scrimmage than most think. All but a couple years at Tech they would have at least one guy have 700-900 yards rushing plus another 400-500 receiving. That's close to 1400 yards of production from one RB. At WSU, he would have as many as 3 guys have 500 yards Rushing with another 1,000 in receiving split between them. That's close to 2500 yards from the RB position.

I think what people don't like is the dink and dunk stuff constantly. I get it, that OL will have to perform better so that can change. Leach called the Oline the most important positions on the team. Hurst or no Hurst, it is on him to get them in here. I will not live and die over missing one player. I have liked his overall OL recruiting. It has been much better than we had under Mullen. I also like the roster management, I think the portal does help for sure in that area.

Bottom line: Watching recruiting will drive you nuts. At the end of the day you have to look at the roster. Is it balanced and can it compete. Looking at individual recruiting will get to you eventually, it never seems to go our way because the losses stick in your brain but in reality, we have a really nice roster with some good commits ranked 23rd in roster talent in 2020. Can it be better? Yes, and I think it will be after Leach proves his offense will work in the SEC. If he can't, then go back and try again.

I am ready for some football!

[confucius say]

We're going to go at least 7-5 this year. Which is exactly what Dan averaged here. A good coach can average that here.

[Cowbell]

The only reason anyone should miss Mullen is because Cohen absolutely royally screwed up the first hire. That 18 team should have mopped the field with the gators at home. And should have won 10 games.

[FriarsPoint]

I saw an interesting post on Jeans Paige..

"Interesting stat for the moral high horse contingent. Did you know that during/immediately following the 3 best 3 year period of MSU football since WWII there was some form of NCAA probation? '74-76 we went 24-9-1. Probation followed. '98-00 we went 26-11. Probation followed. '13-15 we went 26-13. That was during the middle of the Redmond suspension and we got some probation for that as well. The modern story of MSU football is if we want to have some double digit wins, we are going to have to go up to and over whatever the line is in order to get the players required to get the job done. Those 9 years I referenced, we won 70% of all games. Equate that to a 12 game season-that's 10-2. I think it's certainly worth it even if there are repercussions. I'd rather try to get to the mountain top and get knocked back down to the valley than just settle for staying at base camp."

In summary, we gotta get down and dirty. .

The ncaa is irrelevant. If we are not cheating our ass off at this very moment, we don?t care about being good at football. Period.

[Offshore Dawg]

We can't let out of state schools win so many recruiting battles. Right now on 247 - There are 7 four star kids in-state this year. The bears lead for 3 and the other 4 are committed out of state. Last year 5 four star kids, two went to bears, we got one, and the other 2 went out of state.

Last year we signed 3 of the top 10 in state (one was Harmon, who didn't have many options)
This year we look to sign 2 of the 10 ten - 9 and 10 (Blanton and Moss)

If y'all think we can be competitive without in-state kids, I'm not sure what to tell you.

So how do you propose to stop this ??

[KOdawg1]

So how do you propose to stop this ??

Cheat harder

[msstate7]

So how do you propose to stop this ??

Forward Dawgs

[TheLostDawg]

Basically because we refused to not tell the guy the truth. So he's going to go to Ole Miss and play OL anyway. Which is another issue we have.

Tee Shepard comes to mind. They'll say whatever to get whoever for whatever reason.

[somebodyshotmypaw]

Fletcher Cox
Chris Jones
Jeffrey Simmons
B-Mac
Elgston Jenkins

Most of our top NFL guys are from Mississippi

And Johnathan Abram, KJ Wright, Gabe Jackson, JT Gray, Martinas Rankin, Logan Cooke, Tyre Phillips, Willie Gay, ……..

Dak, Preston Smith, and Cam Dantzler are out of state

Denico Autry, Montez Sweat, Pernell McPhee, and Darius Slay are out-of-state but played JUCO in Mississippi.

We’ve done our best work in state.

[ScoobaDawg]

Cheat harder

With the nli why the hell do we need to cheat...

[R2Dawg]

I don't think leach thinks he needs top talent to run his offense. This may or may not be true, but we won't stop anyone if we load up our defense with a buncha 84-86 rated guys

If we lose the top D players in the State our program will take a long time to recover. This is what we do.

If Leach tanks, someone can write the book - how to kill a program with two bad coaching hires in a row.

Hope this doesn't happen. We have so much on the line this fall.

[HancockCountyDog]

So how do you propose to stop this ??

I?d hire a coach and pay him close to 5 million a year to address the problem.

If we can win without in state recruiting, then I don?t care. I just don?t think we can.

[Todd4State]

I saw an interesting post on Jeans Paige..

"Interesting stat for the moral high horse contingent. Did you know that during/immediately following the 3 best 3 year period of MSU football since WWII there was some form of NCAA probation? '74-76 we went 24-9-1. Probation followed. '98-00 we went 26-11. Probation followed. '13-15 we went 26-13. That was during the middle of the Redmond suspension and we got some probation for that as well. The modern story of MSU football is if we want to have some double digit wins, we are going to have to go up to and over whatever the line is in order to get the players required to get the job done. Those 9 years I referenced, we won 70% of all games. Equate that to a 12 game season-that's 10-2. I think it's certainly worth it even if there are repercussions. I'd rather try to get to the mountain top and get knocked back down to the valley than just settle for staying at base camp."

In summary, we gotta get down and dirty. .

Yeah. And then we have to stop exhibiting exemplary cooperation when we get caught.

Maybe the NIL will end that. At least I hope it will.

[1bigdawg]

Explain why this is a Cohen issue? Our revenue is shit. We are a small school with a low giving donor base compared to the teams we compete against.
.

While it could be better, our 2019 revenues were ~$120MM. Coincidentally, that is more than the school up the road. We cannot use that excuse in recruiting.

[BrunswickDawg]

I saw an interesting post on Jeans Paige..

"Interesting stat for the moral high horse contingent. Did you know that during/immediately following the 3 best 3 year period of MSU football since WWII there was some form of NCAA probation? '74-76 we went 24-9-1. Probation followed. '98-00 we went 26-11. Probation followed. '13-15 we went 26-13. That was during the middle of the Redmond suspension and we got some probation for that as well. The modern story of MSU football is if we want to have some double digit wins, we are going to have to go up to and over whatever the line is in order to get the players required to get the job done. Those 9 years I referenced, we won 70% of all games. Equate that to a 12 game season-that's 10-2. I think it's certainly worth it even if there are repercussions. I'd rather try to get to the mountain top and get knocked back down to the valley than just settle for staying at base camp."

In summary, we gotta get down and dirty. .

People seem to ignore the fact that we are still on probation for the Tutor crap that we self-reported. Our compliance department isn't going to let us step out until we are out from under the "repeat offender" window

[Ari Gold]

Do y’all think Kiffin is out there burning up the recruiting trail?? **** no he isn’t . Hell he was in Oxford less than Leach was in Starkville.
We all know the game of recruiting and we don’t play it never really have .
Yes Leach needs more interest on the recruiting side , a lot more, but this staff ( minus one maybe 2 ) does get after it with recruiting.
Leach and Kiffin give 2 shits about recruiting , or the OM / MSU rivalry

If we had a HC that was all in on recruiting would we be doing better ? Probably a little .. CJM was a very passionate recruiter and the results were basically the same as always

But we were told Coach Mason Smith was just a “ computer “ guy he didn’t really make much of a factor with recruiting
I guess we don’t need guys that made college football rising stars under 30.. yeah we need less guys like that on the staff..

The NIL will do is zero favors in football, we better hope the portal is our best friend going forward.. of course it is college football it doesn’t matter until something is changed . The new playoff will help get a few more teams and fan bases excited but until them I can tell you 3 of the 4 teams in the final four
Bama , Clemson , Ohio state
same song different year

Just enjoy our 7-5 maybe 8-4 like we have averaged the last 15 years or so , and hope we beat OM more than not.
It is what it is

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Fletcher Cox
Chris Jones
Jeffrey Simmons
B-Mac
Elgston Jenkins

Most of our top NFL guys are from Mississippi

ok the argument is we can WIN without in state talent. When they get to the NFL they really don't help us anymore do they? And don't say it helps with recruiting because it doesn't. I would rather have players that can give us 3 or 4 good years instead of the ones that hit their peak just in time to leave for the NFL.

[OLJWales]

I think we must continue to dominate MS D-Linemen as there is no reason not to. If we continue to do that while Leach continues to get good out of state QB's, we should be good.

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Just enjoy our 7-5 maybe 8-4 like we have averaged the last 15 years or so , and hope we beat OM more than not.
It is what it is

https://media.giphy.com/media/RKRqMvwdQgOiWLsIkD/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47hobz17uj0lp9zsow9rnj1p5ov1qx wpwkx934fu2n&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

[Hot Rock]

All that is True Ari except I don't think we are stuck, you can always build to a magical year.

Thing is Miss State has been getting incrementally better over the years, I expect a bowl game now. Last year, the overall college team talent was 23rd. If they can continue the growth with Leach, you could see some top 20 level teams in a couple years or even better. He will attract QB's, WR's better than we have ever have. I am interested to see where this team talent ends up for this year, we did have several leave. I think the roster is more balanced, at least for this offense. For sure it's getting deeper for this offense in the QB, WR and OL positions where we had been paper thin last year. The Mullen years, we always seemed to have just enough OL to get scrimmage up. Leach values that position much more.

I would expect the portal to give us 1-3 contributors most years as well. This year, we will probably have 5 that will contribute if not start from the portal. Two WR's, one DB, one DL and a QB.

Recruiting is changing, if you consider a couple from the portal and/or JuCo, Leach's draw for WR's & QB's, in-state talent, Texas connection with this group of coaches then the overall team talent could improve over the next couple years.

Will it? I say we have to win some games this year.

[Hot Rock]

I wasn't even thinking about the portal guys from the years before. Scott Lashley, Cole Smith and Ruiz are all portal guys so that's 8 portal guys that are key contributors on this years team.

It's not just about High School recruiting anymore. Mississippi State's overall team talent will be a mixture of things.

[Ari Gold]

All that is True Ari except I don't think we are stuck, you can always build to a magical year.

Thing is Miss State has been getting incrementally better over the years, I expect a bowl game now. Last year, the overall college team talent was 23rd. If they can continue the growth with Leach, you could see some top 20 level teams in a couple years or even better. He will attract QB's, WR's better than we have ever have. I am interested to see where this team talent ends up for this year, we did have several leave. I think the roster is more balanced, at least for this offense. For sure it's getting deeper for this offense in the QB, WR and OL positions where we had been paper thin last year. The Mullen years, we always seemed to have just enough OL to get scrimmage up. Leach values that position much more.

I would expect the portal to give us 1-3 contributors most years as well. This year, we will probably have 5 that will contribute if not start from the portal. Two WR's, one DB, one DL and a QB.

Recruiting is changing, if you consider a couple from the portal and/or JuCo, Leach's draw for WR's & QB's, in-state talent, Texas connection with this group of coaches then the overall team talent could improve over the next couple years.

Will it? I say we have to win some games this year.

Agree I said on average 7-5 or 8-4 .. sure we can have a 10-2 year we can also have a 5-7 year

[War Machine Dawg]

Leach has never been known for his "crootin'." It's laughable that some thought that would change just because he came to the SEC. The guy literally hates that part of the job and puts almost no effort into it. It's no surprise we're getting wrecked. And yes, the structure of our off the field staff is bad too. We just don't take football seriously enough. We may not have Bama, TAMU, FL, etc. money, but we've got enough that we should be able to have a functional off field staff. But our Woke Bastard AD is a disaster for everything that isn't baseball. Unfortunately, he probably has a job for life now that baseball finally got the natty. It's so frustrating to see how little our admin believes in MSU compared to us fans.

[War Machine Dawg]

Yeah. And then we have to stop exhibiting exemplary cooperation when we get caught.

Maybe the NIL will end that. At least I hope it will.

NIL basically ends the "impermissible benefits" arm of enforcement. The NCAA is basically dead now and will be officially within a few years. NIL destroyed their sole reason to exist.

[OLJWales]

Leach has never been known for his "crootin'." It's laughable that some thought that would change just because he came to the SEC. The guy literally hates that part of the job and puts almost no effort into it. It's no surprise we're getting wrecked. And yes, the structure of our off the field staff is bad too. We just don't take football seriously enough. We may not have Bama, TAMU, FL, etc. money, but we've got enough that we should be able to have a functional off field staff. But our Woke Bastard AD is a disaster for everything that isn't baseball. Unfortunately, he probably has a job for life now that baseball finally got the natty. It's so frustrating to see how little our admin believes in MSU compared to us fans.

Can anyone validate this bad stuff?

[somebodyshotmypaw]

Recruiting has changed. NIL is changing it. The handling of the portal (both players leaving and players coming) must be managed correctly. JUCO is a huge deal for us, and always has been. You can really fill some glaring holes with some immediate JUCO help. You basically have to have a few staffers that are almost like GM's. There is so much turnover, and so many places to get players, and it is constantly changing. Roster management is important.

[Hot Rock]

Leach has never been known for his "crootin'." It's laughable that some thought that would change just because he came to the SEC. The guy literally hates that part of the job and puts almost no effort into it. It's no surprise we're getting wrecked. And yes, the structure of our off the field staff is bad too. We just don't take football seriously enough. We may not have Bama, TAMU, FL, etc. money, but we've got enough that we should be able to have a functional off field staff. But our Woke Bastard AD is a disaster for everything that isn't baseball. Unfortunately, he probably has a job for life now that baseball finally got the natty. It's so frustrating to see how little our admin believes in MSU compared to us fans.

I have never kept up with his day to day activities but there is one thing on cruit'n. He always improved team talent wherever he has been.

Texas Tech in 1999 did not recruit a single rated player. Not one, I can't go back any further . Leach averaged 46th in recruiting while he was there. They had that honeymoon for a few years after Leach and did pretty well with Tuberville and Kingsbury but that got started by Leach but the last 4 years they are back down to averaging 58th.

Washington State had won a total of 9 ballgames in the previous 4 years combined with an average ranking of 63rd. He averaged getting 52nd while he was there.

I know he never brought in top talent but he always seemed to do well for the places he was located. Sure, he can do better but I am betting they know players make a difference and really like he is balancing the team out and he will get skill players from all over. We do need some in-state guys. I can't see us ever winning without them but NIL money is no joke. It's a new day folks.

[Bothrops]

These national football talk guys are clueless. They haven't learned one thing about this game since they started getting paid well.

[ShotgunDawg]

Recruiting has changed. NIL is changing it. The handling of the portal (both players leaving and players coming) must be managed correctly. JUCO is a huge deal for us, and always has been. You can really fill some glaring holes with some immediate JUCO help. You basically have to have a few staffers that are almost like GM's. There is so much turnover, and so many places to get players, and it is constantly changing. Roster management is important.

Since most of our best JUCOs lately have been D1 kickbacks, the immediate transfer rule is going to destroy JUCO. Abram & Sweat wouldn't have gone to JUCO

[IMissJack]

That is his J O B!

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Since most of our best JUCOs lately have been D1 kickbacks, the immediate transfer rule is going to destroy JUCO. Abram & Sweat wouldn't have gone to JUCO

Oh wow, I hadn't evne though of that. But yeah, all the good players will just transfer to another P5 now, not go JuCo which is the only advantage MS has

[bulldawg28]

Since most of our best JUCOs lately have been D1 kickbacks, the immediate transfer rule is going to destroy JUCO. Abram & Sweat wouldn't have gone to JUCO

You're correct. They wouldn't have gone to Juco they would have come straight to MSU with an additional year to play.

[ShotgunDawg]

You're correct. They wouldn't have gone to Juco they would have come straight to MSU with an additional year to play.

I don't think that's true.

I think the MS JUCO system brought kids to MS & made them comfortable here. What reason would Sweat have had to come to MSU after leaving Michigan State & being from Atlanta?

[HoopsDawg]

You're correct. They wouldn't have gone to Juco they would have come straight to MSU with an additional year to play.

probably would have still gotten Abram, not Sweat. Probably not Rivers. Juco system is not the advantage it once was.

[Todd4State]

NIL basically ends the "impermissible benefits" arm of enforcement. The NCAA is basically dead now and will be officially within a few years. NIL destroyed their sole reason to exist.

Yeah. The problem is will our boosters figure that out or is it going to take 5-6 years for them to figure it out?

[Todd4State]

Oh wow, I hadn't evne though of that. But yeah, all the good players will just transfer to another P5 now, not go JuCo which is the only advantage MS has

Well if we're not going to play the game and by all appearances we aren't we're going to have to rely heavily on JUCO AND the portal both.

I agree about JUCO not having as many players as they did before the portal but there are still going to be some late bloomers or guys that played at some random 1A school that didn't go to camps his senior year in high school that can help us.

Of course with the portal the good news is we can get some guys like Cole Smith and Lashley back or guys without having to wait on them in JUCO.

If our boosters keep operating the way they are I seriously think we need to shift back to Jackie style recruiting in the 1990's and get like 10-15 high school guys, about 5 JUCO's and 5 transfers from the portal every year. Yeah- I know recruiting like that jacked up our numbers but recruiting like that also led to our run in the late 1990's and Dan's best class maybe was the one that produced Sweat and Abrams. At least it led to the best defense we've had since 1999 anyway.

[bulldawg28]

I don't think that's true.

I think the MS JUCO system brought kids to MS & made them comfortable here. What reason would Sweat have had to come to MSU after leaving Michigan State & being from Atlanta?

Because we would have been one of the few SEC teams to give him a chance, and he's from Atlanta. We've signed players from his high school before. He was well informed about Mississippi state.

[bulldawg28]

probably would have still gotten Abram, not Sweat. Probably not Rivers. Juco system is not the advantage it once was.

You're contradicting your own statement. If it wasn't an advantage they wouldn't have signed.

[HoopsDawg]

You're contradicting your own statement. If it wasn't an advantage they wouldn't have signed.

SMH

[Dawgfan77]

Picked up a DB yesterday about to flip a DB from Michigan State. Also in on some OL prospects that could pull the trigger this fall.

[Cowbell]

Picked up a DB yesterday about to flip a DB from Michigan State. Also in on some OL prospects that could pull the trigger this fall.

How dare you bring optimism here