Joe Judge losing the locker room

[Cowbell]

https://www.si.com/nfl/texans/news/former-houston-texans-starter-zach-fulton-retiring-new-york-giants-nfl-joe-judge?fbclid=IwAR3IGLoUEOijyVHyHXWRQTDDmNW6Q-v9kQOAwDZc6lVFtPgdsm8TRfrniTE

[TheLostDawg]

Seems like he's doing to the Giants what Leach did to our bad apples.
Everyone wants to get babies and not have consequences.

[HancockCountyDog]

Seems like he's doing to the Giants what Leach did to our bad apples.
Everyone wants to get babies and not have consequences.

Big difference between college students and professional athletes.

If he wins, his players may not mind it, but his players can very easily quit on him and at the end of the day, part of NFL coaching gig is having everyone buy in. I thought his team was playing really well towards the end of the season. Hopefully this is just a bump in the road.

[Cowbell]

Seems like he's doing to the Giants what Leach did to our bad apples.
Everyone wants to get babies and not have consequences.

Loosing a guy like Joe Looney is a bad sign.

[somebodyshotmypaw]

Loosing a guy like Joe Looney is a bad sign.

Then Judge should tighten him up.

[Irondawg]

Judge may indeed be out of his depth here but there is also no doubt that keeping a locker room these days is near impossible. Players continually want a bigger voice and you can't have everyone always wanting their way and causing stir when they don't get their way. Because there are going to groups of players with different ideals and none of those may fit the coaching staff ideal. It's a recipe for disaster and kudos to the teams that figure it out somehow.

It seems to eat a bunch of these young coaches up b/c they are also trying extra hard to show they are in charge.

[Jarius]

Big difference between college students and professional athletes.

If he wins, his players may not mind it, but his players can very easily quit on him and at the end of the day, part of NFL coaching gig is having everyone buy in. I thought his team was playing really well towards the end of the season. Hopefully this is just a bump in the road.

Quitting on a coach in the NFL is a bold strategy Cotton. Let’s see how that turns out for them.

[HancockCountyDog]

Quitting on a coach in the NFL is a bold strategy Cotton. Let’s see how that turns out for them.

If you don't think NFL players have quit on a coach that they don't believe in before, well I can't help you.

The NFL isn't the NBA where one player can get a coach fired, but you can't coach NFL players the same way you can coach HS and college kids. The most successful coaches understand this and I do expect Judge to get this as well. I just hope he wins enough to earn more time.

Stuff like this won't cost him his job right now, but it does break a tie if you have a 7-9 or 6-10 season and there is a debate on you getting another year.

[Jarius]

If you don't think NFL players have quit on a coach that they don't believe in before, well I can't help you.

The NFL isn't the NBA where one player can get a coach fired, but you can't coach NFL players the same way you can coach HS and college kids. The most successful coaches understand this and I do expect Judge to get this as well. I just hope he wins enough to earn more time.

Stuff like this won't cost him his job right now, but it does break a tie if you have a 7-9 or 6-10 season and there is a debate on you getting another year.

Yea I’m Sure they have. Let me know how that turned out for them going forward….at least the ones who are the quality of players the Giants have on their roster for the most part. There are 8 million people dying to take some no name Giants player on the field and will gladly accept millions of dollars to do it. This isn’t little league where your daddy can come tell the head coach he doesn’t like you yelling at their kid. You can show up and go to work or you can quit on your coach and watch him break your plate and put your tail in the unemployment line. Did it ever occur to you that Joe Judge may be trying to weed out the reasons that that franchise has sucked ass for a really long time? Doing it the way those players have wanted to have things run has not worked for a very long time.

[HancockCountyDog]

Yea I’m Sure they have. Let me know how that turned out for them going forward….at least the ones who are the quality of players the Giants have on their roster for the most part. There are 8 million people dying to take some no name Giants player on the field and will gladly accept millions of dollars to do it. This isn’t little league where your daddy can come tell the head coach he doesn’t like you yelling at their kid. You can show up and go to work or you can quit on your coach and watch him break your plate and put your tail in the unemployment line. Did it ever occur to you that Joe Judge may be trying to weed out the reasons that that franchise has sucked ass for a really long time? Doing it the way those players have wanted to have things run has not worked for a very long time.

You are thinking about NFL locker rooms like a college locker room. Telling a 30 year old man to run wind sprints as a punishment doesn't hit the same way it does to a 20 year old kid.

An NFL head coach has to earn respect. It is not given with the head coach title. You earn respect by winning and by giving respect. The coaches that think they are going to win games by "hitting the other team in the mouth" are not long for the NFL.

Players respond to coaches that know how to outscheme and out gameplan the other team. Trying to bring back 1980's style football is a waste of damn time. There have been plenty of tough coaches that have tried it, by and large it just doesn't work anymore.

You can lose the locker room by failing to treat men like men and not like kids. I hope that is not the case because he is a good guy, but he has to be careful here.

[TheLostDawg]

Yea I’m Sure they have. Let me know how that turned out for them going forward….at least the ones who are the quality of players the Giants have on their roster for the most part. There are 8 million people dying to take some no name Giants player on the field and will gladly accept millions of dollars to do it. This isn’t little league where your daddy can come tell the head coach he doesn’t like you yelling at their kid. You can show up and go to work or you can quit on your coach and watch him break your plate and put your tail in the unemployment line. Did it ever occur to you that Joe Judge may be trying to weed out the reasons that that franchise has sucked ass for a really long time? Doing it the way those players have wanted to have things run has not worked for a very long time.

I agree with this. He's going to have to take that role until someone on the team steps up and does it. Then he can take the role as HCD states but not before. That's why Dak is so valuable. You always hear about him pushing his team and being labeled a leader. Until the Giants find a leader Judge will have to take the role or the team will continue the state that it's in.

[Jarius]

You are thinking about NFL locker rooms like a college locker room. Telling a 30 year old man to run wind sprints as a punishment doesn't hit the same way it does to a 20 year old kid.

An NFL head coach has to earn respect. It is not given with the head coach title. You earn respect by winning and by giving respect. The coaches that think they are going to win games by "hitting the other team in the mouth" are not long for the NFL.

Players respond to coaches that know how to outscheme and out gameplan the other team. Trying to bring back 1980's style football is a waste of damn time. There have been plenty of tough coaches that have tried it, by and large it just doesn't work anymore.

You can lose the locker room by failing to treat men like men and not like kids. I hope that is not the case because he is a good guy, but he has to be careful here.


In a normal situation he would not have to be this way. He is obviously sending a message because of a lack of leadership with a group of players that have been failing miserably well before he arrived. His quarterback was in the bottom of a pile during a fight. When shit like that stops happening he will start treating them like men. If you want to get treated like a man then act like one. The fact that one of the ones he ran off started running his mouth about the coach afterwards proves that he didn’t need to be on the team to start with. Players like that guy (who has been a turd everywhere he’s ever played) don’t need to be on your team.

[somebodyshotmypaw]

You can lose the locker room by failing to treat men like men and not like kids. I hope that is not the case because he is a good guy, but he has to be careful here.

I disagree. If you want to be treated like a man, then you need to act like a man. If the players act like kids, then they will be treated like kids. The players were acting like idiotic, selfish, ignorant teenagers, so that’s how the coach treated them. If they would grow up and show some maturity, then they might be treated as such.

[HancockCountyDog]

I disagree. If you want to be treated like a man, then you need to act like a man. If the players act like kids, then they will be treated like kids. The players were acting like idiotic, selfish, ignorant teenagers, so that?s how the coach treated them. If they would grow up and show some maturity, then they might be treated as such.

Here is a great article that talk about Payton and the Saints are viewed by players across the league.

https://www.nola.com/sports/jeff_duncan/article_3a4eb1ec-f785-11eb-85ea-1fb31b4bf87c.html

[Jarius]

Here is a great article that talk about Payton and the Saints are viewed by players across the league.

https://www.nola.com/sports/jeff_duncan/article_3a4eb1ec-f785-11eb-85ea-1fb31b4bf87c.html

Payton had a hall of fame quarterback on his roster for over a decade. You don’t have to do anything remotely close to that when you have a leader like Drew Brees on your roster. He’s going to go 6-11 this year.

[HancockCountyDog]

Payton had a hall of fame quarterback on his roster for over a decade. You don’t have to do anything remotely close to that when you have a leader like Drew Brees on your roster. He’s going to go 6-11 this year.

Thats the point, despite having a HOF QB he treats his players like men. He makes sure to do things that will win over the locker room. These are things that a coach with Super Bowl ring, doesn't have to do. He has already proven that he can get the job done.

Look - if you think making 30 year old men do wind sprints will earn you respect as a head coach and make these guys think you are a "leader" then we simply disagree. Leadership and respect are earned, they are not given.

I just read this article this morning and thought it was a different position than what we are reading from Giants' camp.

[Jarius]

Thats the point, despite having a HOF QB he treats his players like men. He makes sure to do things that will win over the locker room. These are things that a coach with Super Bowl ring, doesn't have to do. He has already proven that he can get the job done.

Look - if you think making 30 year old men do wind sprints will earn you respect as a head coach and make these guys think you are a "leader" then we simply disagree. Leadership and respect are earned, they are not given.

I just read this article this morning and thought it was a different position than what we are reading from Giants' camp.


The point I’m making is that there are a bunch of styles that can work as a head coach when you have a great HOF quarterback. Sean will have the same style this year and his team is going to suck ass. Him being nice to his players is not why he’s been winning. I guarantee you that Joe Judge does not want to be treating his players like this. I’m sure he wants them to take ownership so he doesn’t have to act this way, but they are not doing that. Like you said, respect is earned, not given. His team hasn’t earned shit.

[bulldawg28]

The point I’m making is that there are a bunch of styles that can work as a head coach when you have a great HOF quarterback. Sean will have the same style this year and his team is going to suck ass. Him being nice to his players is not why he’s been winning. I guarantee you that Joe Judge does not want to be treating his players like this. I’m sure he wants them to take ownership so he doesn’t have to act this way, but they are not doing that. Like you said, respect is earned, not given. His team hasn’t earned shit.

Judge hasn't earned it either.

[Jarius]

Judge hasn't earned it either.

He isn’t doing it to earn respect for himself. He’s doing it to make them take accountability and have someone step up and be a leader on the team. The real issue is the quarterback more than likely. If your team doesn’t respect you enough to not have you on the bottom of a pile during a brawl then you probably aren’t doing your job as the player leader of the team. Daniel Jones needs to do what he needs to do so Joe Judge doesn’t have to treat the team like college freshmen on the first day of fall camp. This would never happen with a team with strong leadership, no Matter what coach is at the helm. Brees, Brady, Dak, Mahomes, etc will never have this issue.

[TheLostDawg]

Here is a great article that talk about Payton and the Saints are viewed by players across the league.

https://www.nola.com/sports/jeff_duncan/article_3a4eb1ec-f785-11eb-85ea-1fb31b4bf87c.html

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10009886-saints-rumors-michael-thomas-ignored-teams-calls-for-3-months-during-offseason

[bulldawg28]

He isn’t doing it to earn respect for himself. He’s doing it to make them take accountability and have someone step up and be a leader on the team. The real issue is the quarterback more than likely. If your team doesn’t respect you enough to not have you on the bottom of a pile during a brawl then you probably aren’t doing your job as the player leader of the team. Daniel Jones needs to do what he needs to do so Joe Judge doesn’t have to treat the team like college freshmen on the first day of fall camp. This would never happen with a team with strong leadership, no Matter what coach is at the helm. Brees, Brady, Dak, Mahomes, etc will never have this issue.

I understand the intent of what you're saying. However, in regards of Qbs mentioned Non of them played under a rookie coach. They wouldn't have vouched for it nor the Executive team making this type of hire. Judge will have to adjust like the players. NFL players have power and a voice this isn't college. The moment his team struggles those locker room voices will get louder and will be heard.

[Jarius]

I understand the intent of what you're saying. However, in regards of Qbs mentioned Non of them played under a rookie coach. They wouldn't have vouched for it nor the Executive team making this type of hire. Judge will have to adjust like the players. NFL players have power and a voice this isn't college. The moment his team struggles those locker room voices will get louder and will be heard.

Pretty sure Manning did play with a rookie coach during the end of his tenure, but even if he didn’t, that is not the point. Joe Judge would not be acting this way if there wasn’t a leadership problem on the team. None of those guys I mentioned have ever had to deal with that because they are alpha leaders. Judge would not coach this way if any of those type leaders were on his team. What he is looking for is for someone to step up and challenge the team so he doesn’t have to do that petty BS to 30 year olds. You should not have to motivate people getting paid millions of dollars to play football. It’s actually sickening that he feels he needs to do this. How lazy can you be to have to have a coach treat you like you are in high school in order to get your attention when that organization is paying you millions of dollars?

[bulldawg28]

Pretty sure Manning did play with a rookie coach during the end of his tenure, but even if he didn’t, that is not the point. Joe Judge would not be acting this way if there wasn’t a leadership problem on the team. None of those guys I mentioned have ever had to deal with that because they are alpha leaders. Judge would not coach this way if any of those type leaders were on his team. What he is looking for is for someone to step up and challenge the team so he doesn’t have to do that petty BS to 30 year olds. You should not have to motivate people getting paid millions of dollars to play football. It’s actually sickening that he feels he needs to do this. How lazy can you be to have to have a coach treat you like you are in high school in order to get your attention when that organization is paying you millions of dollars?

The truth is you don't have anything to base your assumptions of Joey's coaching style. From reading the content and listening on TV this was his style regardless of leadership there. Hard old school coaching is what he's implementing. The actual running and up downs we did at State.

[Jarius]

The truth is you don't have anything to base your assumptions of Joey's coaching style. From reading the content and listening on TV this was his style regardless of leadership there. Hard old school coaching is what he's implementing. The actual running and up downs we did at State.

I am aware he is an old School guy but it got turned up a level recently because of that brawl.

[TheLostDawg]

Here is a great article that talk about Payton and the Saints are viewed by players across the league.

https://www.nola.com/sports/jeff_duncan/article_3a4eb1ec-f785-11eb-85ea-1fb31b4bf87c.html

CBS Sports: Michael Thomas rumors: Ranking seven potential landing spots if Saints look to trade disgruntled receiver.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/michael-thomas-rumors-ranking-seven-potential-landing-spots-if-saints-look-to-trade-disgruntled-receiver/