Coaching today's players has gotta be tough

[Indndawg]

trying to find that balance between being a hard ass and running off needed players and a wimp (see Jo Mo).

90's JWS was prolly the best at this.

[Fader21]

It's crazy how much more they care about tiktok followers they have or showing off the Snapchat model/70 year old guy they are talking to from LA

[Indndawg]

It's crazy how much more they care about tiktok followers they have or showing off the Snapchat model/70 year old guy they are talking to from LA

and young, urban culture.

Young men use to want tough, firm, but caring leadership. Not so sure about that today

[BuckyIsAB****]

Yup

[ShotgunDawg]

trying to find that balance between being a hard ass and running off needed players and a wimp (see Jo Mo).

90's JWS was prolly the best at this.

It's not hard to coach the good players, who crave getting better & take coaching well. "The future NFL guys". Simmons, Sweat, Abram, Preston Smith, Dak, Calhoun, Jenkins, Ballard, McKinney, etc wouldn't have any issues with Leach's coaching style. In fact, they may love it. Someone should ask Kobe Jones about Leach's coaching style. He's our only leader right now.

When it's hard to coach your players, you have a culture issue.

What people don't realize, is once Leach gets his culture set, the players will really like him because the team will police itself. About 90% of the problem right now is that the coaches are having to police the team culture instead of the players because we lack leadership.

Once leaders emerge, all the sudden the coaches will become much more likeable and everyone will think they changed when they really didn't.

They just have a standard that currently isn't being met.

[bluelightstar]

It's not hard to coach the good players, who crave getting better & take coaching well. "The future NFL guys"

When it's hard to coach your players, you have a culture issue.

What people don't realize, is once Leach gets his culture set, the players will really like him because the team will police itself. About 90% of the problem right now is that the coaches are having to police the team culture instead of the players because we lack leadership.

Once leaders emerge, all the sudden the coaches will become much more likeable and everyone will think they changed when they really didn't.

They just have a standard that currently isn't being met.

The fact that there are articles about Leach’s players pretty openly not liking him but going along because he gets results suggests that is not going to change. But whatever, I want him to win; I don’t much care if they all are best friends.

[ShotgunDawg]

The fact that there are articles about Leach’s players pretty openly not liking him but going along because he gets results suggests that is not going to change. But whatever, I want him to win; I don’t much care if they all are best friends.

Do you have a link to one of those articles? I'd love to hear what the players had to say

[basedog]

It's not hard to coach the good players, who crave getting better & take coaching well. "The future NFL guys". Simmons, Sweat, Abram, Preston Smith, Dak, Calhoun, Jenkins, Ballard, McKinney, etc wouldn't have any issues with Leach's coaching style. In fact, they may love it. Someone should ask Kobe Jones about Leach's coaching style. He's our only leader right now.

When it's hard to coach your players, you have a culture issue.

What people don't realize, is once Leach gets his culture set, the players will really like him because the team will police itself. About 90% of the problem right now is that the coaches are having to police the team culture instead of the players because we lack leadership.

Once leaders emerge, all the sudden the coaches will become much more likeable and everyone will think they changed when they really didn't.

They just have a standard that currently isn't being met.

I see more problems from so called "advisor/agents" and mostly parents of today's generations. Today's players are more "politically correct" or protesting and disregard discipline when needed. I blame poor parenting to a much of today's problems in sports and in schools.
Kids today or soft overall, it's pretty easy to see, plus social media is a bitch!!!

[ShotgunDawg]

I see more problems from so called "advisor/agents" and mostly parents of today's generations. Today's players are more "politically correct" or protesting and disregard discipline when needed. I blame poor parenting to a much of today's problems in sports and in schools.
Kids today or soft overall, it's pretty easy to see, plus social media is a bitch!!!

I don't disagree, but literally every generation in the history of mankind has complained about the next generation in this way & we've managed

[HoopsDawg]

The free 1 time transfer is making it even tougher to coach and that is only going to get worse. Probably get name, likeness and image payments soon as well. College football will never be the same.

[ShotgunDawg]

The free 1 time transfer is making it even tougher to coach and that is only going to get worse. Probably get name, likeness and image payments soon as well. College football will never be the same.

The ones you want to keep will stay and be fine. It will expose the below average makeup kids though

[BuckyIsAB****]

The free 1 time transfer is making it even tougher to coach and that is only going to get worse. Probably get name, likeness and image payments soon as well. College football will never be the same.

The transfer rule killed any sense of work ethic or patience. Especially at QB.

[Commercecomet24]

I see more problems from so called "advisor/agents" and mostly parents of today's generations. Today's players are more "politically correct" or protesting and disregard discipline when needed. I blame poor parenting to a much of today's problems in sports and in schools.
Kids today or soft overall, it's pretty easy to see, plus social media is a bitch!!!

Well said!

[Commercecomet24]

I heard this form a coach one time and I've found it to be true: "On great teams, players lead. On good teams, coaches lead. On bad teams nobody leads".

[ShotgunDawg]

I heard this form a coach one time and I've found it to be true: "On great teams, players lead. On good teams, coaches lead. On bad teams nobody leads".

THIS. It's true

MSU football is in an odd situation right now because the older guys that should be the current leaders have not been developed to be that due to coaching changes & Moorhead's staff.

That will change soon

[parabrave]

One thing My BN Commander told me when I was a young infantry platoon leader in the 82nd Airborne Division. Always be Firm with your men. But always be fair. They look to you for leadership not to be their buddy. This holds true to today.

[Cooterpoot]

Kids today struggle to handle being told no and struggle to understand other players are better than them. They struggle with the team concept over individuality. Their parents undermine the coaching. They've been told they're great by their parents, friends, and sometimes club coaches so much they can't handle reality. Kids lack coping skills. God forbid a coach calls you soft, points out your short-comings or something trying to push you to get better. Good coaches will always play the best available. That doesn't mean the most potential. It means the ones that get it done. Remember when kids appreciated a tough coach that forced the best out of them? Far fewer kids appreciate that now because mama tells them the coach is an asshole. Kids want discipline and direction. Parents want the easy way. And it bleeds over.

[Lord McBuckethead]

I see more problems from so called "advisor/agents" and mostly parents of today's generations. Today's players are more "politically correct" or protesting and disregard discipline when needed. I blame poor parenting to a much of today's problems in sports and in schools.
Kids today or soft overall, it's pretty easy to see, plus social media is a bitch!!!

I blame the boomers. They raised a bunch of little pansy as kids, they started the participation trophies, they couldn't stand not being their kids best friends. And now here we are.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Kids today struggle to handle being told no and struggle to understand other players are better than them. They struggle with the team concept over individuality. Their parents undermine the coaching. They've been told they're great by their parents, friends, and sometimes club coaches so much they can't handle reality. Kids lack coping skills. God forbid a coach calls you soft, points out your short-comings or something trying to push you to get better. Good coaches will always play the best available. That doesn't mean the most potential. It means the ones that get it done. Remember when kids appreciated a tough coach that forced the best out of them? Far fewer kids appreciate that now because mama tells them the coach is an asshole. Kids want discipline and direction. Parents want the easy way. And it bleeds over.

except kylin and aeris. Aeris is still better.

[basedog]

I blame the boomers. They raised a bunch of little pansy as kids, they started the participation trophies, they couldn't stand not being their kids best friends. And now here we are.

Wrong on boomers!!!

[MadDawg]

I don't disagree, but literally every generation in the history of mankind has complained about the next generation in this way & we've managed

And they've been right. Every generation gets progressively worse. And what we've managed to do is find ourselves right where we are - with uncoachable kids with parents you wouldn't want to spend 10 seconds with.

[Mobile Bay]

I blame the boomers. They raised a bunch of little pansy as kids, they started the participation trophies, they couldn't stand not being their kids best friends. And now here we are.

You do realize the children of Boomers are in their 40's and 50's now. Right?

[BeastMan]

I blame the boomers. They raised a bunch of little pansy as kids, they started the participation trophies, they couldn't stand not being their kids best friends. And now here we are.

We didn?t even have a national debt until the boomers started voting. Boomers ruined everything! Millennials, my gen, suck too! They don?t make them like my grandfather?s generation any more!

[Virgil Caine]

Y?all are ridiculous making sweeping statements about KIDS THESE DAYS. You need to find something different to spend your time on that college sports if you hate 18-22 year olds.

College athletics are more competitive than ever. Our players mostly worked hard to get where they are. This program isn?t bleeding talent and putting together because somehow we managed to find soft kids. We hired a coach with a niche system, and our talent didn?t fit his system. On top of that (like him or not) he?s known to have an abrasive personality. Instead of acknowledging the situation as a whole, people talk crap on the players because it?s easier to do.

[Cooterpoot]

Y?all are ridiculous making sweeping statements about KIDS THESE DAYS. You need to find something different to spend your time on that college sports if you hate 18-22 year olds.

College athletics are more competitive than ever. Our players mostly worked hard to get where they are. This program isn?t bleeding talent and putting together because somehow we managed to find soft kids. We hired a coach with a niche system, and our talent didn?t fit his system. On top of that (like him or not) he?s known to have an abrasive personality. Instead of acknowledging the situation as a whole, people talk crap on the players because it?s easier to do.

P5 athletics aren't for pusseez, especially SEC football. Being fast and in great shape with a ton of potential is a fraction of what's required. Work ethic is only a part. That whole toughness and metal toughness are big. You don't quit because practice is tough and your coach tells you you're not getting it done or are half-assing it. But here we are.

[Cooterpoot]

except kylin and aeris. Aeris is still better.

I said GOOD coaches...

[Virgil Caine]

P5 athletics aren't for pusseez, especially SEC football. Being fast and in great shape with a ton of potential is a fraction of what's required. Work ethic is only a part. That whole toughness and metal toughness are big. You don't quit because practice is tough and your coach tells you you're not getting it done or are half-assing it. But here we are.
For sure I agree. Hard work and the mentality that is behind it is why people succeed in any field. At the same time, I just have a hard time believing that our players are some how softer than the rest of the SEC, and that our defections and on-field struggles are a product of our players being uniquely soft.

Besides, people preaching mental toughness right now need to take a look at our coach. He?s 1) not taking ownership of on field product (I get it?s year 1 but you?re in charge. Buck stops with you) 2) taking player criticism that should be behind closed doors in a constructive way into the public and 3) as of last week lashing out at fans. Not the signs of strong, steady leadership.

[BrunswickDawg]

You do realize the children of Boomers are in their 40's and 50's now. Right?

That right's, we are Gen X. I'm just going to have an edible, listen to some Pearl Jam and ignore y'all fighting about who is the shittiest generation.

[Cooterpoot]

For sure I agree. Hard work and the mentality that is behind it is why people succeed in any field. At the same time, I just have a hard time believing that our players are some how softer than the rest of the SEC, and that our defections and on-field struggles are a product of our players being uniquely soft.

Besides, people preaching mental toughness right now need to take a look at our coach. He?s 1) not taking ownership of on field product (I get it?s year 1 but you?re in charge. Buck stops with you) 2) taking player criticism that should be behind closed doors in a constructive way into the public and 3) as of last week lashing out at fans. Not the signs of strong, steady leadership.

He's taken ownership as much as he's kicked the players. He always includes the coaching is his criticism. Last week he basically said they had been too easy on the team and said that would change. It did, and one quit. Said they've got to do a better job of coaching and make some changes. And I'm not giving them a pass, the play calling has sucked at times.
As for public criticism, the coaches get killed with public criticism. No reason the players should be exempt. And I've not heard him mention specific players by name.

[Virgil Caine]

He's taken ownership as much as he's kicked the players. He always includes the coaching is his criticism. Last week he basically said they had been too easy on the team and said that would change. It did, and one quit. Said they've got to do a better job of coaching and make some changes. And I'm not giving them a pass, the play calling has sucked at times.
As for public criticism, the coaches get killed with public criticism. No reason the players should be exempt. And I've not heard him mention specific players by name.

That?s fair for the most part. This has been the toughest year for our football team in over a decade, so I?m probably just being overly harsh. I will say I think him saying ?Its our fault as coaches. We?ve been too easy on the team.? really feels like a backhanded criticism of the players more than a criticism of the coaches, but you?re right he has said the coaching has been bad each week too.

I?m not saying the players should be above criticism, but this across the board criticism of our players as soft or the criticism that the younger generation is soft is what bothers me. These kids have challenges we didn?t?just like some of y?all old heads had challenges I didn?t. They chose to be apart of the MSU family just like we all did. We should avoid criticizing their character and leave it to on field stuff for the most part.

[Wade Garrett]

That right's, we are Gen X. I'm just going to have an edible, listen to some Pearl Jam and ignore y'all fighting about who is the shittiest generation.

Seconded

[Virgil Caine]

Seconded
I?m an old millennial so I?m going to take my edible and be sensitive and listen to drake ;)

[Homedawg]

The fact that there are articles about Leach?s players pretty openly not liking him but going along because he gets results suggests that is not going to change. But whatever, I want him to win; I don?t much care if they all are best friends.

John Cohen wasn't liked as a coach even after the early year when he had "calmed" it's not his job to be liked, just respected. With that said, he's not coaching the same type of player as far as where they come from, and the environments etc etc.

[BeastMan]

Gen X and Millennials coming together over edibles. Beautiful!

[Quaoarsking]

Pick a year, any year in history, and old and middle-aged people were complaining about how soft and emotional young people were. There truly is nothing new under the sun.

[R2Dawg]

I heard this form a coach one time and I've found it to be true: "On great teams, players lead. On good teams, coaches lead. On bad teams nobody leads".

So we have no one leading. About what it looks like.

[ShotgunDawg]

You do realize the children of Boomers are in their 40's and 50's now. Right?

The boomers were following WW2. They're in their 60s and 70s

[ShotgunDawg]

Pick a year, any year in history, and old and middle-aged people were complaining about how soft and emotional young people were. There truly is nothing new under the sun.

This. It never changes.

[Bothrops]

Worst time in America since the 1930s and only getting worse.

[Todd4State]

THIS. It's true

MSU football is in an odd situation right now because the older guys that should be the current leaders have not been developed to be that due to coaching changes & Moorhead's staff.

That will change soon

Thanks to terrible roster management we hardly have any older guys. You're right about Moorhead though.

I think we really failed in assessing the character of many of our players and we used to do a really good job with that. Especially on the offensive side of the ball.

[Todd4State]

Kids today struggle to handle being told no and struggle to understand other players are better than them. They struggle with the team concept over individuality. Their parents undermine the coaching. They've been told they're great by their parents, friends, and sometimes club coaches so much they can't handle reality. Kids lack coping skills. God forbid a coach calls you soft, points out your short-comings or something trying to push you to get better. Good coaches will always play the best available. That doesn't mean the most potential. It means the ones that get it done. Remember when kids appreciated a tough coach that forced the best out of them? Far fewer kids appreciate that now because mama tells them the coach is an asshole. Kids want discipline and direction. Parents want the easy way. And it bleeds over.

Well said.

I will say that as far as social media goes I've seen a LOT less arrogant stuff from our players than I did under Moorhead. I don't follow every player though.

[Indndawg]

There's plenty of blame to go around.

Still these kids are going to have bosses that are gruff and may hurt their delicate feelings. I bet colleges didn't have safe spaces when you were in college.