I am MORE optimistic about our future with Leach after that game.

[calidawg]

Allright you emotional teenage girls. Here's the rundown:

Yes losing always sucks but

1) our D is way ahead of schedule. We're supposed to be mad our Secondary gets burned occasionally? We're starting true freshman and walk ons...
2) Our best offensive player went down in the first 5 minutes and we had 2 true freshman running backs the rest of the game, Dillon J is a nice surprise. Kylin would have eaten big during this game.
3) Our rent-a-QB played bad. Made bad decisions. The plays were there to be made. Leach created good opportunities for him, but his first time to see a zone was just tough on him. I liked our second half adjustments, but again KJ just made bad decisions.
4) Love the aggressiveness going for it on 4th downs. You want to continue to compete with LSU's and Auburn's and Bama's in the future? That's the type of mindset you have to have. Again the plays were THERE to be made, KJ made poor decisions and our true freshman rb didn't make a play that our Kylin would have probably made.

If we just don't turn the ball over we win. It's as simple as that. That is fixable. if Will Rogers is as advertised we are going to win a ton of games the next 4 years.

[ZedFedder]

I?ll have what you?re having.

[R2Dawg]

Allright you emotional teenage girls. Here's the rundown:

Yes losing always sucks but

1) our D is way ahead of schedule. We're supposed to be mad our Secondary gets burned occasionally? We're starting true freshman and walk ons...
2) Our best offensive player went down in the first 5 minutes and we had 2 true freshman running backs the rest of the game, Dillon J is a nice surprise. Kylin would have eaten big during this game.
3) Our rent-a-QB played bad. Made bad decisions. The plays were there to be made. Leach created good opportunities for him, but his first time to see a zone was just tough on him. I liked our second half adjustments, but again KJ just made bad decisions.
4) Love the aggressiveness going for it on 4th downs. You want to continue to compete with LSU's and Auburn's and Bama's in the future? That's the type of mindset you have to have. Again the plays were THERE to be made, KJ made poor decisions and our true freshman rb didn't make a play that our Kylin would have probably made.

If we just don't turn the ball over we win. It's as simple as that. That is fixable. if Will Rogers is as advertised we are going to win a ton of games the next 4 years.

See the reason for adding alcohol to the stadium this year now.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

You can say hindsight is 20/20 all you want, Leach should have taken the points twice when down in the redzone and got a fgs, be down one. And then if Austin Williams is out there, we take the fair catch and only need a fg for the lead. Why the hell Walley was out there I will never know. Even with all the bs at the end, if we had just taken the damn points, we only would have needed to get in fg range in 25 seconds for a win. Did this team deserve to win after 4 turnovers? Hell no, but we would have still had a shot. These are the kind of calls Leach is going to make and he is not changing so be ready to pull your damn hair out....

[Lord McBuckethead]

I agree. Think about this one more time. 4 turnovers. 2 turnovers on downs. A muffed punt, and we still could have won this thing. Not picking up that last 1st down on KJs slide hurt. I am cool with him saving his ass when the game is not literally on the line....but that was the game.

[HoopsDawg]

In my opinion, going for it on 4th down was absolutely the right call. I can't believe people are even debating that. Now the run up the middle, that's something to question.

Putting a true freshman on Punt return is a horrible decision..always.

Saw a good tweet, we've gotten the full Mike Leach experience in only 2 weeks. This is what you get with Leach. At least it's entertaining.

[calidawg]

You can say hindsight is 20/20 all you want, Leach should have taken the points twice when down in the redzone and got a fgs, be down one. And then if Austin Williams is out there, we take the fair catch and only need a fg for the lead. Why the hell Walley was out there I will never know. Even with all the bs at the end, if we had just taken the damn points, we only would have needed to get in fg range in 25 seconds for a win. Did this team deserve to win after 4 turnovers? Hell no, but we would have still had a shot. These are the kind of calls Leach is going to make and he is not changing so be ready to pull your damn hair out....

Well you said I can say hindsight is 20/20 all i want soooo hindsight is 20/20. The analtyics is clear. Leaches decisions were the correct decisions. That 4th and 1 pass play to Walley(?) was a great play call. It was a bad throw and even then it could have been caught.

[KOdawg1]

Yeah, in no way is being Arkansas' first win in 3 years a good thing. It's embarrassing.

[Lord McBuckethead]

This entire game reminded me of some WSU comments about Leach, about how he will piss you off with his play calling at times, and how the offense looks bad ass and terrible sometimes without real clear difference in circumstances. That is what this reminds me of. We all heard all week how Ark and pretty much everyone else in the entire league is going to drop 8 on us every single down, and yet we didn't know exactly how to attack it. Never did we try to bust the zone on top to just stretch the field on iota.

Saying all that, I realize Kylin was out the entire game and that made a huge difference, no doubt.

[Cooterpoot]

If we take the points, it's a 1 point game with plenty of time. If we leave Williams returning punts, we have the ball around the 50 and need about 15 yards to get in Ruiz range. It's bad coaching.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

Well you said I can say hindsight is 20/20 all i want soooo hindsight is 20/20. The analtyics is clear. Leaches decisions were the correct decisions. That 4th and 1 pass play to Walley(?) was a great play call. It was a bad throw and even then it could have been caught.

If he had just kicked it on one of the possessions we would have been going for the lead with a TD, it was dumbass call, and he did it twice and failed....

[preachermatt83]

In my opinion, going for it on 4th down was absolutely the right call. I can't believe people are even debating that. Now the run up the middle, that's something to question.

Putting a true freshman on Punt return is a horrible decision..always.

Saw a good tweet, we've gotten the full Mike Leach experience in only 2 weeks. This is what you get with Leach. At least it's entertaining.

And I would not trade it for anything. I hope he?s our coach the next 20 years.

[calidawg]

If he had just kicked it on one of the possessions we would have been going for the lead with a TD, it was dumbass call, and he did it twice and failed....

This is just where we differ. Once you reach mid field and you are 4th and 3 and shorter I'm pretty much always game with going for it... and the analytics back this up.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

And I would not trade it for anything. I hope he?s our coach the next 20 years.

Well that's fine but do not expect to sniff Atlanta in those 20 years....plenty of 4-4 Sec seasons ahead. I was optimistic and would hope you know maybe with SEC caliber players he wouldn't lose these unexpected games...he's already answered that in 2 weeks. He blew a 32 point lead to UCLA LAST YEAR....he ain't changing....he is what he is...

[Charlie_Sheen420]

This is just where we differ. Once you reach mid field and you are 4th and 3 and shorter I'm pretty much always game with going for it... and the analytics back this up.

The analytics don't take into account how well the D was playing in the 4th, they couldn't move the damn ball, we take the points and keep taking them and we have the lead...pretty simple. As I said he only would have had to kick once on any of the three possessions (including the one we should have had with the muff punt) and we only would have needed a TD for the lead on either of the other 2, it was dumb and he did it twice....and he pulls this crap everywhere he goes, always has, always will

[Maroonthirteen]

Well that's fine but do not expect to sniff Atlanta in those 20 years....plenty of 4-4 Sec seasons ahead. is...

As long as Saban is at Bama, State isn't sniffing Atlanta anyways

[ScoobaDawg]

And I would not trade it for anything. I hope he?s our coach the next 20 years.

3 for 3 tonight... well i think i agree. I dont know about 20 but I believe we will know all we need to know by year 5... if he's battling with Bama / LSU regular at that time.
I still believe in him after tonight. A lot of bad decisions tonight were made by Costello in his execution at critical times.

[Bothrops]

Leach experiment will bring heart attacks and kicks in the balls weekly to this fanbase. Our qb is a bit of a ***** and we won't win shit this year. It's a gimmick job. I am so ****ing pissed off. Slumpbuster U.

[Bothrops]

We couldn't even make the easy plays to move the ****ing chains. We're ****ed

[Statecoachingblows**]

Well that's fine but do not expect to sniff Atlanta in those 20 years....plenty of 4-4 Sec seasons ahead. I was optimistic and would hope you know maybe with SEC caliber players he wouldn't lose these unexpected games...he's already answered that in 2 weeks. He blew a 32 point lead to UCLA LAST YEAR....he ain't changing....he is what he is...

How many times have we sniffed Atlanta in the previous 20?

[Bothrops]

And I would not trade it for anything. I hope he?s our coach the next 20 years.
Might as well, we aren't going anywhere

[calidawg]

The analytics don't take into account how well the D was playing in the 4th, they couldn't move the damn ball, we take the points and keep taking them and we have the lead...pretty simple. As I said he only would have had to kick once on any of the three possessions (including the one we should have had with the muff punt) and we only would have needed a TD for the lead on either of the other 2, it was dumb and he did it twice....and he pulls this crap everywhere he goes, always has, always will

it is dumb in your short sighted opinion. My opinion and analytics say it was a good decision and bad execution. We will win 10 games with Leach at some point in the next 3-5 years if this coaching staff can recruit well. I simply do not want to ever see a FG unit trot onto the field in an SEC game on 4th and 2 or shorter on the opponents end of the field ever. We will agree to disagree.

[HailStateSZN19]

There’s ZERO positives you can take away from tonight if you’re sane and sober.

There was nothing good about tonight. Honeymoon is over. We play like this against UK and they’ll beat us waaayyyyyy worse than 7 points. Gonna be a hell of a week at practice I’d think.

[TimberBeast]

If we take the points, it's a 1 point game with plenty of time. If we leave Williams returning punts, we have the ball around the 50 and need about 15 yards to get in Ruiz range. It's bad coaching.

This all day. Going for it with Hill in the game and without KJ sliding and ducking anytime someone is near him is one thing, but in this kind of game where our defense is holding you take the damn points every time you can get them.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

How many times have we sniffed Atlanta in the previous 20?

It should be 2...2014 and 2018 (had Mullen stayed, the offense would have been competent enough with that 2018 championship caliber defense, we could have made some noise, we will never know)

Edit: I'm also going to say 2010 had Cam Newton came to play at State...so 3 possibly

[calidawg]

We couldn't even make the easy plays to move the ****ing chains. We're ****ed

The first line in this thread referenced emotional teenage girls I guess I should have just said Bothrops.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

This all day. Going for it with Hill in the game and without KJ sliding and ducking anytime someone is near him is one thing, but in this kind of game where our defense is holding you take the damn points every time you can get them.

You need to take into account the analytics!!!!!***

[Quaoarsking]

While tonight was far from Leach's finest hour, he made put us in position to scrape out a win but we didn't execute. I'll go ahead and predict a W next week against Kentucky.

[Bothrops]

The first line in this thread referenced emotional teenage girls I guess I should have just said Bothrops.

Slumpbuster U, baby

[BeardoMSU]

You need to take into account the analytics!!!!!***

What's the Sabermetrics equivalent for football?**

https://media4.giphy.com/media/378IyHiTEheI8/giphy.gif

[Liverpooldawg]

Allright you emotional teenage girls. Here's the rundown:

Yes losing always sucks but

1) our D is way ahead of schedule. We're supposed to be mad our Secondary gets burned occasionally? We're starting true freshman and walk ons...
2) Our best offensive player went down in the first 5 minutes and we had 2 true freshman running backs the rest of the game, Dillon J is a nice surprise. Kylin would have eaten big during this game.
3) Our rent-a-QB played bad. Made bad decisions. The plays were there to be made. Leach created good opportunities for him, but his first time to see a zone was just tough on him. I liked our second half adjustments, but again KJ just made bad decisions.
4) Love the aggressiveness going for it on 4th downs. You want to continue to compete with LSU's and Auburn's and Bama's in the future? That's the type of mindset you have to have. Again the plays were THERE to be made, KJ made poor decisions and our true freshman rb didn't make a play that our Kylin would have probably made.

If we just don't turn the ball over we win. It's as simple as that. That is fixable. if Will Rogers is as advertised we are going to win a ton of games the next 4 years.

Opioid addiction is a bad thing.

[Bothrops]

While tonight was far from Leach's finest hour, he made put us in position to scrape out a win but we didn't execute. I'll go ahead and predict a W next week against Kentucky.

Kentucky is meh, but we'll have to see if our transfer can get all the crying out of his system by then. Even still it'll be a dog fight.

[TimberBeast]

You need to take into account the analytics!!!!!***

Yep. Pac football means hanging out a little bit and thinking about things for about 15 seconds before you have to make a decision. In the SEC you have two seconds and then you better put your head down and do your job when you have to. The only reason they are even playing football this year is because of the SEC and ACC.

[Statecoachingblows**]

It should be 2...2014 and 2018 (had Mullen stayed, the offense would have been competent enough with that 2018 championship caliber defense, we could have made some noise, we will never know)

Edit: I'm also going to say 2010 had Cam Newton came to play at State...so 3 possibly


Should But we didn't. We should have won tonight. IF IF IF.

I'd rather have this hiccup than knowing we beat lesser teams but basically accepting defeat before kickoff to the LSUs and Bamas. At least we have a chance, and that's all I want in all reality. I want to have hope and not just expect to get our ass kicked. K.J. shit the bed tonight. This Arkansas team isn't the same one sloppy joe beat.

[TimberBeast]

Should But we didn't. We should have won tonight. IF IF IF.

I'd rather have this hiccup than knowing we beat lesser teams but basically accepting defeat before kickoff to the LSUs and Bamas. At least we have a chance, and that's all I want in all reality. I want to have hope and not just expect to get our ass kicked. K.J. shit the bed tonight. This Arkansas team isn't the same one sloppy joe beat.

What do you think would have happened last week if LSU played the same defensive scheme that Arkansas did?

[Charlie_Sheen420]

Should But we didn't. We should have won tonight. IF IF IF.

I'd rather have this hiccup than knowing we beat lesser teams but basically accepting defeat before kickoff to the LSUs and Bamas. At least we have a chance, and that's all I want in all reality. I want to have hope and not just expect to get our ass kicked. K.J. shit the bed tonight. This Arkansas team isn't the same one sloppy joe beat.

This Arkansas is basically the same team with the addition of Franks....watch Auburn win by at least 21 on them next week...

[Bothrops]

What do you think would have happened last week if LSU played the same defensive scheme that Arkansas did?

We lose

[calidawg]

Should But we didn't. We should have won tonight. IF IF IF.

I'd rather have this hiccup than knowing we beat lesser teams but basically accepting defeat before kickoff to the LSUs and Bamas. At least we have a chance, and that's all I want in all reality. I want to have hope and not just expect to get our ass kicked. K.J. shit the bed tonight. This Arkansas team isn't the same one sloppy joe beat.

Yep, if you told me we are 1-1 at the beginning of the season and both games were close games I would have said great because before the season I would have thought that meant that we played LSU close which is what I want. We will of course lose to Bama and UGA but I have seen nothing that shows that we won't play our tails off in those games. After tonight, I also don't see any reason why we won't be in a dog fight with Auburn late. For this season to still turn out well, KJ just has to play better or let's just start the Will Rogers era early.

[calidawg]

What do you think would have happened last week if LSU played the same defensive scheme that Arkansas did?

We probably lose, and we probably lose even with that same defense + Stingley + a full house crowd.. but it would have been close. On the flip side, we probably win this game because KJ and our team doesn't get sunshined pumped all week. When was the last time State played well after being sunshine pumped all week by national media?

Hindsight doesn't matter. We were destined to be 1-1 after this game and I'll take it in year 1.

[Statecoachingblows**]

What do you think would have happened last week if LSU played the same defensive scheme that Arkansas did?

I guess since everything sucks today we would have lost.

We didn't execute tonight but we didn't look like an 8th grade pop warner team so it's still an improvement from the last couple years.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

Yep, if you told me we are 1-1 at the beginning of the season and both games were close games I would have said great because before the season I would have thought that meant that we played LSU close which is what I want. We will of course lose to Bama and UGA but I have seen nothing that shows that we won't play our tails off in those games. After tonight, I also don't see any reason why we won't be in a dog fight with Auburn late. For this season to still turn out well, KJ just has to play better or let's just start the Will Rogers era early.

You don't understand....we just got beat by ARKANSAS....at HOME. We basically lost to KANSAS!!! The rest of the defenses of the SEC are going to be a hell of a lot tougher than ARKANSAS. The only reason we beat LSU was because Pellini never adjusted like an idiot. We should have lost that game turning the ball over 4 damn times. This team will be lucky to win 1 to 2 more games. And the problem is this is Leach's system...it's not going to change...

[calidawg]

You don't understand....we just got beat by ARKANSAS....at HOME. We basically lost to KANSAS!!! The rest of the defenses of the SEC are going to be a hell of a lot tougher than ARKANSAS. The only reason we beat LSU was because Pellini never adjusted like an idiot. We should have lost that game turning the ball over 4 damn times. This team will be lucky to win 1 to 2 more games. And the problem is this is Leach's system...it's not going to change...

Your ramblings make no sense. "We should have lost that game (LSU) turning the ball over 4 times"? How about we could have beaten LSU even worse had we not turned the ball over. What exactly is the problem with Leach's system? Our team plays as hard as we did in ******* best years, our D is way ahead of schedule, and our Offense had plenty of plays to be made with a QB that makes good decisions. And Ark was beating UGA in the first half, they have 2 great coordinators and finally found what seems to be a decent coach. We lost the game because of poor QB decisions, thats it. I'm looking long term, your looking at 1 game. Based off what I've seen in 2 games, we will have a chance to win every game the rest of the year excluding bama and uga. We will see how many we win or lose but I am excited about fielding a competitive team game in and game out after the last 2 years of JoeMo.

[Charlie_Sheen420]

Your ramblings make no sense. "We should have lost that game (LSU) turning the ball over 4 times"? How about we could have beaten LSU even worse had we not turned the ball over. What exactly is the problem with Leach's system? Our team plays as hard as we did in ******* best years, our D is way ahead of schedule, and our Offense had plenty of plays to be made with a QB that makes good decisions. And Ark was beating UGA in the first half, they have 2 great coordinators and finally found what seems to be a decent coach. We lost the game because of poor QB decisions, thats it. I'm looking long term, your looking at 1 game. Based off what I've seen in 2 games, we will have a chance to win every game the rest of the year excluding bama and uga. We will see how many we win or lose but I am excited about fielding a competitive team game in and game out after the last 2 years of JoeMo.

Based on analytics, we are turning the ball over at least 4 times a game, so far we are 100% on that through 2 games....we are not winning many games doing that, and the defenses we will be playing are going to be a hell of a lot better than Arkansas, so watch the turnovers continue to add up.
The problem with Leach's system isn't a problem with his system, it's a problem with his in game decisions which are not going to change. You take the damn points when you get them, and when you have a lead late you run the clock. Through his entire coaching career he never adjusts to do this late in the game. He's not going to change and it will cost this team wins that should be easily avoidable. We had a big lead on LSU in the 4th last week, and instead of running clock, he keeps doing his thing leading to 2 turnovers in 3 plays letting LSU back in the game. Tonight when he can take points, he instead goes for it on 4th and fails. These 2 past games are a microcosm of his career and he never adjusts....I've never seen a team blow a 32 point lead before, but damn sure enough he did it last year against UCLA because he would not run clock, he will do the same thing here...

[MoreCowbell]

Allright you emotional teenage girls. Here's the rundown:

Yes losing always sucks but

1) our D is way ahead of schedule. We're supposed to be mad our Secondary gets burned occasionally? We're starting true freshman and walk ons...
2) Our best offensive player went down in the first 5 minutes and we had 2 true freshman running backs the rest of the game, Dillon J is a nice surprise. Kylin would have eaten big during this game.
3) Our rent-a-QB played bad. Made bad decisions. The plays were there to be made. Leach created good opportunities for him, but his first time to see a zone was just tough on him. I liked our second half adjustments, but again KJ just made bad decisions.
4) Love the aggressiveness going for it on 4th downs. You want to continue to compete with LSU's and Auburn's and Bama's in the future? That's the type of mindset you have to have. Again the plays were THERE to be made, KJ made poor decisions and our true freshman rb didn't make a play that our Kylin would have probably made.

If we just don't turn the ball over we win. It's as simple as that. That is fixable. if Will Rogers is as advertised we are going to win a ton of games the next 4 years.

This is spot on. You hate to blame a player, and KJ probably won it last week for us but he lost it this week for us. If your QB has an off night in the air raid you are going to lose.

[defiantdog]

This is spot on. You hate to blame a player, and KJ probably won it last week for us but he lost it this week for us. If your QB has an off night in the air raid you are going to lose.
Not completely true..... we ran the ball more tonight. You can be off and still win. K.J. literally freaked out when his first receiver option wasn't open.

[TUSK]

Allright you emotional teenage girls. Here's the rundown:

Yes losing always sucks but

1) our D is way ahead of schedule. We're supposed to be mad our Secondary gets burned occasionally? We're starting true freshman and walk ons...
2) Our best offensive player went down in the first 5 minutes and we had 2 true freshman running backs the rest of the game, Dillon J is a nice surprise. Kylin would have eaten big during this game.
3) Our rent-a-QB played bad. Made bad decisions. The plays were there to be made. Leach created good opportunities for him, but his first time to see a zone was just tough on him. I liked our second half adjustments, but again KJ just made bad decisions.
4) Love the aggressiveness going for it on 4th downs. You want to continue to compete with LSU's and Auburn's and Bama's in the future? That's the type of mindset you have to have. Again the plays were THERE to be made, KJ made poor decisions and our true freshman rb didn't make a play that our Kylin would have probably made.

If we just don't turn the ball over we win. It's as simple as that. That is fixable. if Will Rogers is as advertised we are going to win a ton of games the next 4 years.

No.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Looks like losing a few prospects to them in recruiting has come back to bite a little bit as well. How many guys contributed tonight for them that were either committed to MSU or heavily interested?

[msu15]

No.

Not tonight dude

[Todd4State]

Based on analytics, we are turning the ball over at least 4 times a game, so far we are 100% on that through 2 games....we are not winning many games doing that, and the defenses we will be playing are going to be a hell of a lot better than Arkansas, so watch the turnovers continue to add up.
The problem with Leach's system isn't a problem with his system, it's a problem with his in game decisions which are not going to change. You take the damn points when you get them, and when you have a lead late you run the clock. Through his entire coaching career he never adjusts to do this late in the game. He's not going to change and it will cost this team wins that should be easily avoidable. We had a big lead on LSU in the 4th last week, and instead of running clock, he keeps doing his thing leading to 2 turnovers in 3 plays letting LSU back in the game. Tonight when he can take points, he instead goes for it on 4th and fails. These 2 past games are a microcosm of his career and he never adjusts....I've never seen a team blow a 32 point lead before, but damn sure enough he did it last year against UCLA because he would not run clock, he will do the same thing here...

If K.J. continues to throw interceptions Leach will sit him. Leach's system is very quarterback driven and the QB makes a lot of the calls and the QB has to make the right decisions within the play as it develops. K.J. didn't do that tonight and again if he doesn't improve he will sit.

Leach fired his DC after that 32 point blown lead.

[Gypsy_RoadDawg]

I agree. Think about this one more time. 4 turnovers. 2 turnovers on downs. A muffed punt, and we still could have won this thing. Not picking up that last 1st down on KJs slide hurt. I am cool with him saving his ass when the game is not literally on the line....but that was the game.

It was helicopter time at that point.

[Percho]

You can say hindsight is 20/20 all you want, Leach should have taken the points twice when down in the redzone and got a fgs, be down one. And then if Austin Williams is out there, we take the fair catch and only need a fg for the lead. Why the hell Walley was out there I will never know. Even with all the bs at the end, if we had just taken the damn points, we only would have needed to get in fg range in 25 seconds for a win. Did this team deserve to win after 4 turnovers? Hell no, but we would have still had a shot. These are the kind of calls Leach is going to make and he is not changing so be ready to pull your damn hair out....

There is a reason the top 10 or more leaders in points in the NFL are kickers.