We ran the ball on 1st down 14 out of 15 of our possessions vs KSU

[biggun]

And we rushed for 2 yards or less on all 14 1st down rushes! We faced 2nd and 8 or longer a whopping 14 times last Saturday. Not good. The O Line must get much better push, but when the D knows what is coming it is much easier to defend.

Way too predictable! Mix in a few passes on 1st down, please Joe.

[msstate7]

Fitz making the wrong reads

[ATTILLA THE DOG]

Fitz making the wrong reads

Yep and he threw the ball to hard to guidry on the pick

[Captain Falcon]

We just going to ignore the fact that we were either playing a QB with a hurt shoulder or a true freshman for all of those drives? Feels kind of significant. It’s perfectly logical to rely heavily on your running game on a day when your passing isn’t what you want it to be.

14/15 probably is higher than it needs to be, but would you have preferred we aired it out more? The passing game obviously wasn’t working for us.

[msstate7]

We just going to ignore the fact that we were either playing a QB with a hurt shoulder or a true freshman for all of those drives? Feels kind of significant. It’s perfectly logical to rely heavily on your running game on a day when your passing isn’t what you want it to be.

14/15 probably is higher than it needs to be, but would you have preferred we aired it out more? The passing game obviously wasn’t working for us.
Thought we run an RPO like every play. Perhaps the defense baited us into runs

[Coursesuper]

We just going to ignore the fact that we were either playing a QB with a hurt shoulder or a true freshman for all of those drives? Feels kind of significant. It’s perfectly logical to rely heavily on your running game on a day when your passing isn’t what you want it to be.

14/15 probably is higher than it needs to be, but would you have preferred we aired it out more? The passing game obviously wasn’t working for us.

Don't any of you know anything about football, the call is at the line it's all box count. You either have numbers or not, so it's either run or pass depending on the number of men in the tackle box.

But yes the offense line got their ass whipped last week, the are large and slow.

[dawgday166]

Offensive Savant.

[starkvegasdawg]

Don't any of you know anything about football, the call is at the line it's all box count. You either have numbers or not, so it's either run or pass depending on the number of men in the tackle box.

But yes the offense line got their ass whipped last week, the are large and slow.

Except Hill tweeted Monday about eight in the box all game long.

[timotheus]

wait for it......... but will it ever happen?

[HoopsDawg]

W

14/15 probably is higher than it needs to be, but would you have preferred we aired it out more? The passing game obviously wasn’t working for us.

probably? do you guys just defend everything?

[HoopsDawg]

Don't any of you know anything about football, the call is at the line it's all box count. You either have numbers or not, so it's either run or pass depending on the number of men in the tackle box.

But yes the offense line got their ass whipped last week, the are large and slow.

We didn't have the numbers. It's ok to constantly pump sunshine if you really believe it. But why pump sunshine just for the heck of it.

[dawgday166]

Thought we run an RPO like every play. Perhaps the defense baited us into runs

Like you said ... Fitz making wrong reads. Also throwing uncatchable ball on the drops too.

ETA: Tommy would've made NFL reads *** Easy there dantheman haha.

[ATTILLA THE DOG]

We just going to ignore the fact that we were either playing a QB with a hurt shoulder or a true freshman for all of those drives? Feels kind of significant. It’s perfectly logical to rely heavily on your running game on a day when your passing isn’t what you want it to be.

14/15 probably is higher than it needs to be, but would you have preferred we aired it out more? The passing game obviously wasn’t working for us.

How bout lets try something besides the same two running plays. A toss sweep,jet sweep ,quick pitch etc. Looks like shrader could run the option as well.

[timotheus]

But the moorhead O doesn't use plays such as those........He said we had a TE but i'm not sure anymore and I'm not sure the TE helped in the blocking situation last saturday. This is hard to watch

[Coursesuper]

We didn't have the numbers. It's ok to constantly pump sunshine if you really believe it. But why pump sunshine just for the heck of it.

I am anything but a sunshine pumper, just saying what I observed.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Fitz making the wrong reads

But, but you and Shotgun started 15,000 threads last year that we needed to RTGDB!!! Now that we are, you're still not happy!***

Sarcasm works both ways.

[timotheus]

When the most successful offensive play is a roll out and dodge 2 defenders and then sling the ball side armed to a receiver who has to contort his body in such a way just to touch the ball then it ain't the result of a designed QB progression. that is what we call a busted play, which is legal in football but one can't survive on them alone

[timotheus]

I'll admit that I thought the O line would be a strength this season but man was I wrong. this kinda kills the run the ball bidness

[Cooterpoot]

I’m squaring of the belief this offense either isn’t food or Jo is struggling with play calling and needs an OC.

[Cooterpoot]

I?m of the belief this offense either isn?t good or Jo is struggling with play calling and needs an OC.

[timotheus]

good point worthy of discussion

[dantheman4248]

OP is a liar and should be ashamed.

1st & 10 at MSST 8
(10:10 - 4th) Kylin Hill run for 6 yds to the MisSt 14

2nd & 4 at MSST 14
(9:49 - 4th) Kylin Hill run for 2 yds to the MisSt 16

3rd & 2 at MSST 16
(9:02 - 4th) Garrett Shrader pass incomplete

4th & 2 at MSST 16
(8:55 - 4th) Tucker Day punt for 37 yds, fair catch by Phillip Brooks at the KanSt 47

The rest of y'all should be ashamed for not having Sean McVay like memory and knowing how false of a statement this was. Especially when the drive in question was so pivotal that we didn't run it on 3rd down but instead had a pass thrown behind a receiver and dropped.

[dantheman4248]

This "fact" OP posted is just so horribly wrong.

1st & 10 at KSU 45
(9:53 - 2nd) Kylin Hill run for 5 yds to the KanSt 40

1st & 10 at KSU 18
(8:34 - 2nd) Kylin Hill run for 3 yds to the KanSt 15

1st & Goal at KSU 4
(6:41 - 2nd) Kylin Hill run for 3 yds to the KanSt 1

Just adding them as I find them

1st & 10 at MSST 38
(0:31 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens run for 4 yds to the KanSt 38 for a 1ST down KANSAS ST Penalty, Personal Foul (15 Yards) to the KanSt 47 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at 50
(9:37 - 3rd) Kylin Hill run for 11 yds to the KanSt 39 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at KSU 39
(9:01 - 3rd) Kylin Hill run for 9 yds to the KanSt 30

1st & Goal at KSU 5
(4:47 - 3rd) Garrett Shrader run for 5 yds for a TD, (Jace Christmann KICK)

1st & 10 at KSU 43
(1:26 - 3rd) Kylin Hill run for 10 yds to the KanSt 33 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at MSST 25
(5:20 - 4th) Garrett Shrader run for 12 yds to the MisSt 37 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at KSU 45
(3:59 - 4th) Kylin Hill run for 16 yds to the KanSt 29 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at MSST 20
(0:23 - 4th) Garrett Shrader run for 11 yds to the MisSt 31 for a 1ST down

1st & 10 at MSST 31
(0:07 - 4th) Garrett Shrader run for 4 yds to the MisSt 40 Kylin Hill

[timotheus]

glad to see why the O is sputtering so. bet these SEC DT will take it easy on us

[dantheman4248]

And for those wanting to say OP meant we had a possession where a first down run went form 2 or less yards... that happened on only 10 out of our 15 possessions.

The fact that you have to make up stats to hate on the coach... there's plenty of material that members of this board will let you know about. Making up something is pathetic.

ETA: Posting a stat like this screams “I’m a box score fan” and shows everyone to not take your football related opinions seriously because who knows if you even watched the game.

[Captain Falcon]

I’m not opposed to some variety in the running game, but we have the SEC’s leading rusher who is averaging almost 7 yards per carry and leads the nation in runs of 10 yards or more. We also had our backup QB rush for almost 100 yards in a half on over 8 yards a carry.

Like I said, I’d be fine with us mixing it up some more, but it’s not like our running game hasn’t been working.

[Really Clark?]

And for those wanting to say OP meant we had a possession where a first down run went form 2 or less yards... that happened on only 10 out of our 15 possessions.

The fact that you have to make up stats to hate on the coach... there's plenty of material that members of this board will let you know about. Making up something is pathetic.

ETA: Posting a stat like this screams “I’m a box score fan” and shows everyone to not take your football related opinions seriously because who knows if you even watched the game.

I hear ya. He missed some of those opening drive possessions. But saying “only” for a 67% fail is also kind of planting a skewed thought in a readers mind as well.

[dantheman4248]

I hear ya. He missed some of those opening drive possessions. But saying “only” for a 67% fail is also kind of planting a skewed thought in a readers mind as well.

Well it’s not really a fail if 3 out of those 10 were scoring drives. 30% of drives we had a 1st down run of 2 or less yards at any point in the possession we scored on. 20% of drives we didn’t have a run like that we scored on.

[Really Clark?]

Well it’s not really a fail if 3 out of those 10 were scoring drives. 30% of drives we had a 1st down run of 2 or less yards at any point in the possession we scored on. 20% of drives we didn’t have a run like that we scored on.

He was only talking about the opening play of a drive. Regardless of the outcome of the entire possession, 67% of the time it was not a positive opening play.

[Lord McBuckethead]

And we rushed for 2 yards or less on all 14 1st down rushes! We faced 2nd and 8 or longer a whopping 14 times last Saturday. Not good. The O Line must get much better push, but when the D knows what is coming it is much easier to defend.

Way too predictable! Mix in a few passes on 1st down, please Joe.

Thats a good point. It did feel like we were falling into a very predictable scheme.

[dantheman4248]

He was only talking about the opening play of a drive. Regardless of the outcome of the entire possession, 67% of the time it was not a positive opening play.

Then that makes its 9/15 we opened a drive with a run of 2 or less. 1 incompletion, 1 12 yard completion, 4 runs of 4 or more yards.

The point is that the OP posted blatantly false statistics. I have a problem with that. Clear spreading of misinformation is not good.

ETA: It’s damning showing how many people have blindly accepted this false statistic. Shocking some people I would trust to watch with a closer eye than to believe something this ludicrous.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Then that makes its 9/15 we opened a drive with a run of 2 or less. 1 incompletion, 1 12 yard completion, 4 runs of 4 or more yards.

The point is that the OP posted blatantly false statistics. I have a problem with that. Clear spreading of misinformation is not good.

ETA: It’s damning showing how many people have blindly accepted this false statistic. Shocking some people I would trust to watch with a closer eye than to believe something this ludicrous.

What's going to piss you off even more is when this is thrown out again in other threads, even weeks down the road. Been here too long to see misinformation read and then regurgitated as gospel.

[dantheman4248]

What's going to piss you off even more is when this is thrown out again in other threads, even weeks down the road. Been here too long to see misinformation read and then regurgitated as gospel.

Anyone who spits out this statement as fact tells me everything I need to know about that person's opinion of football: that they got it from the message board.

Wish I could tag users like on reddit to keep up with the idiots that repeat this ad nauseam. You're definitely right that this isn't the last of the statistic we've seen.

Sad part is, once I looked at the game, I'm irked again that we didn't run the ball more down the end of the game.

[timotheus]

I sit in a seat and do my own evaluating and then listen to the coaches explanation. I do not need any thought police to act critical of what an actual flawed process is. I do hope that Kentucky sux and that it was a fluke that they almost beat florida. We are a messy work in progress on offense and I think we took a pretty good hit with a couple of the new coaches on D.

[Goldendawg]

And we rushed for 2 yards or less on all 14 1st down rushes! We faced 2nd and 8 or longer a whopping 14 times last Saturday. Not good. The O Line must get much better push, but when the D knows what is coming it is much easier to defend.

Way too predictable! Mix in a few passes on 1st down, please Joe.

Explosive play calling.**

[RezDog7]

Fitz making the wrong reads

Last year you wanted to run the ball. This year you want to throw the ball. You bitch like a woman.

[Todd4State]

Last year you wanted to run the ball. This year you want to throw the ball. You bitch like a woman.

Even worse than a woman. He tries to twist everything to try to fit his narrative.

[RezDog7]

After years of watching Lee, Relf, Russell, Prescott, Fitz up the middle on every third and whatever, you would think we'd appreciate some different players getting the ball. There was nothing more predictable than what Mullen was running. My 9 yo daughter knew Dak and Fitz were going run the ball.

[msu15]

Fitz making the wrong reads

Getting so old

[dantheman4248]

The fact that A. so many still believe this incorrect statistic and B. neglect to read any of the thread that shows it being disproven is just sad.

[RougeDawg]

Even worse than a woman. He tries to twist everything to try to fit his narrative.

Noooooo, not 7. He never would twist or take a topic down his irrational, irrelevant rabbit hole.

Fact is this. We wore their asses down in 2nd half and could have rammed the ball down their throat. Another fact is, our offensive guru provides zero deception to make our running threat more effective. The only game he has ever done this was auburn last season. He stuck to the run and added in some deception with motion and other tricks. Funny how that seemed to work well, yet we never went back to it.

The data and track record suggest our guru is hell bent on forcing his square peg into and octagonal hole, come hell or high water. Until the data (play calling) proves otherwise, anyone thinking anything will change, probably has purchased numerous bridges and Arizona ocean front lots in their lifetimes.

Carry on sheeple. Keep believing a tiger can change their stripes. Please document it when you see it. We will put it up there with the Bigfoot and Loch Ness monster sightings.

[timotheus]

Joe did that against auburn because the heat was building up in the higher ups in the fan base. I honestly wonder if that heat is now warm enough this season for him to go back to it to get things kinda back on track this year. It may not matter though unless gibson is full go as he'll need hill and gibson to carry the ball that many times.

[confucius say]

Noooooo, not 7. He never would twist or take a topic down his irrational, irrelevant rabbit hole.

Fact is this. We wore their asses down in 2nd half and could have rammed the ball down their throat. Another fact is, our offensive guru provides zero deception to make our running threat more effective. The only game he has ever done this was auburn last season. He stuck to the run and added in some deception with motion and other tricks. Funny how that seemed to work well, yet we never went back to it.

The data and track record suggest our guru is hell bent on forcing his square peg into and octagonal hole, come hell or high water. Until the data (play calling) proves otherwise, anyone thinking anything will change, probably has purchased numerous bridges and Arizona ocean front lots in their lifetimes.

Carry on sheeple. Keep believing a tiger can change their stripes. Please document it when you see it. We will put it up there with the Bigfoot and Loch Ness monster sightings.

I think joe would do well to have a run game coordinator. It does not seem to be his strong suit, I agree.

He seems to be pretty good in the passing game conceptually, meaning good at getting people open. Even Saturday we had receivers running open and TS either sailed it, Guidry and zuber dropped it, or GS didn?t see it.

[1bigdawg]

And we rushed for 2 yards or less on all 14 1st down rushes! We faced 2nd and 8 or longer a whopping 14 times last Saturday. Not good. The O Line must get much better push, but when the D knows what is coming it is much easier to defend.

Way too predictable! Mix in a few passes on 1st down, please Joe.

I actually believe it was 12 out of 15 and the other two times we threw a swing pass to Kylin. All they had to do on first down was key on Kylin.

[dantheman4248]

I actually believe it was 12 out of 15 and the other two times we threw a swing pass to Kylin. All they had to do on first down was key on Kylin.

It’s already been shown that there were only 10 drives that this had a first down run for 2 or less yards at all and only 9/15 were on the first play of the drive, A majority of them in the first half.

[Bothrops]

This is the default signature MSU play when gameplan isn't working.

[Prediction? Pain.]

For what it's worth, we're averaging 4.96 ypc on 1st down rushes on the season. That's 6th in the SEC. SC and UGA are kicking ass and taking names on 1st down rushes. Ranked 1 & 2 in the SEC and nationally at 8.34 and 8.22 ypc. Florida's bringing up the rear in the SEC at 2.81 ypc on first downs.

Just for kicks, I looked at our performance at 1st down rushes over the past decade. The curve isn't huge. The top team in the SEC usually averages around 6 - 6.4 ypc and the bottom usually averages around 3.7 - 4.0 ypc. We ranked 1st in the SEC in 2014 and 2018, averaging 6.21 ypc both years. We were middle of the pack a lot -- 5th, 6th, 7th, or 8th in seven of the ten seasons -- and below average only once (2012 (surprise surprise) at 10th in the league).

[BrunswickDawg]

2017 MSU Fan - "Always Run, Never Pass" is the motto, but also Dan is so predictable always running it on 3rd down

2018 MSU Fan - "Always Run, Never Pass" but not with our #2 all-time rushing leader, use the "NFL level" talent Sophomore.

2019 MSU Fan - "Always run, never pass" except on first down that's too predictable, but do it on 3rd and 2, even though we used to complain about Dan doing all the time

[biggun]

It’s already been shown that there were only 10 drives that this had a first down run for 2 or less yards at all and only 9/15 were on the first play of the drive, A majority of them in the first half.

Our first 10 drives of the game, we ran the ball on every 1st down!!! Go to Hailstate.com and look it up!!!!

And we ran on 1st down, 13 of the 15 total drives we had for the game. Once again, go look it up.

My bad for saying 14/15 when it was 13/15!!!!

[dantheman4248]

Our first 10 drives of the game, we ran the ball on every 1st down!!! Go to Hailstate.com and look it up!!!!

And we ran on 1st down, 13 of the 15 total drives we had for the game. Once again, go look it up.

My bad for saying 14/15 when it was 13/15!!!!

You said for 2 or less yards too. Made it seem like they were all bad run plays.

How long have you been watching football? The old style used to be the 2-3 yd bruising runs all game to weaken the defense and by the 2nd half, especially the 4th, those runs turn into 5,10+ yds as the defense is worn out.

ETA:
Your mentality about running is actually what a lot of people claim that Moorhead fails at (myself included). He doesn’t simplify it and let this team grind a d-line all game to where it pays dividends in the 4th even against a stacked box. Against a stacked box in the 4th after doing that is where the hb hits the homerun cause there’s no secondary to support that initial broken tackle. Had we continued to run it on the FG drive instead of “not being predictabel” I’d bet we score a TD and if we continued that mentality the rest of the game we’d have walked out winning.

That’s my biggest gripe with Moorhead. UK last year was a prime example where he kept passing when it didn’t work and didn’t let our run game factor at all in the 4th. (Be that called plays or QB reads). This team doesn’t have Moorhead’s identity yet. At its core it is a power run team. You can’t abandon that identity with a QB who can’t run our passing system properly.

[msstate7]

Our first 10 drives of the game, we ran the ball on every 1st down!!! Go to Hailstate.com and look it up!!!!

And we ran on 1st down, 13 of the 15 total drives we had for the game. Once again, go look it up.

My bad for saying 14/15 when it was 13/15!!!!

Here's the espn play-by-play

https://www.espn.com/college-football/playbyplay?gameId=401110792

[dantheman4248]

Our first 10 drives of the game, we ran the ball on every 1st down!!! Go to Hailstate.com and look it up!!!!

And we ran on 1st down, 13 of the 15 total drives we had for the game. Once again, go look it up.

My bad for saying 14/15 when it was 13/15!!!!


“Every 1st down”

1st & 10 at MSST 43
(7:37 - 1st) Tommy Stevens sacked by Kyle Ball for a loss of 4 yards to the MisSt 39

1st & 10 at KSU 44
(6:28 - 1st) Tommy Stevens pass intercepted Denzel Goolsby return for 16 yds to the KanSt 47

1st & 10 at KSU 47
(0:26 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass incomplete

1st & 10 at KSU 35
(0:09 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass complete to Osirus Mitchell for 35 yds for a TD, (Jace Christmann KICK)

1st & 10 at KSU 28
(7:39 - 3rd) Garrett Shrader pass incomplete

From the first 10 drives. How about YOU look up your facts for you blatantly lie about them.

[Jack Lambert]

“Every 1st down”

1st & 10 at MSST 43
(7:37 - 1st) Tommy Stevens sacked by Kyle Ball for a loss of 4 yards to the MisSt 39

1st & 10 at KSU 44
(6:28 - 1st) Tommy Stevens pass intercepted Denzel Goolsby return for 16 yds to the KanSt 47

1st & 10 at KSU 47
(0:26 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass incomplete

1st & 10 at KSU 35
(0:09 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass complete to Osirus Mitchell for 35 yds for a TD, (Jace Christmann KICK)

1st & 10 at KSU 28
(7:39 - 3rd) Garrett Shrader pass incomplete

From the first 10 drives. How about YOU look up your facts for you blatantly lie about them.

It's a message board.

[biggun]

“Every 1st down”

1st & 10 at MSST 43
(7:37 - 1st) Tommy Stevens sacked by Kyle Ball for a loss of 4 yards to the MisSt 39

1st & 10 at KSU 44
(6:28 - 1st) Tommy Stevens pass intercepted Denzel Goolsby return for 16 yds to the KanSt 47

1st & 10 at KSU 47
(0:26 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass incomplete

1st & 10 at KSU 35
(0:09 - 2nd) Tommy Stevens pass complete to Osirus Mitchell for 35 yds for a TD, (Jace Christmann KICK)

1st & 10 at KSU 28
(7:39 - 3rd) Garrett Shrader pass incomplete

From the first 10 drives. How about YOU look up your facts for you blatantly lie about them.

LOL