Can Moorhead Win You Back This Weekend?

[ShotgunDawg]

For me no. Beating KY will do nothing to make me believe he is the right guy for this program. Losing to KY will however further confirm to me that he is not the right guy.

The only thing in the near future that Moorhead can do to show me he is the real deal is to win at Auburn. Beat KY & then go to Auburn & beat them & I'll be back on the Moorhead train.

Beat KY & then lose to Auburn in a good game = Meh

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a close game, beat Tennessee = Ok, at least there is a floor here. We aren't great, but it ain't Croom.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, lose to Tennessee - Further confirms my suspicion that he's a fraud.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, beat Tennessee = Meh. He's not awful but this program is going nowhere.

[Todd4State]

I want to wait and see how things are in two years. He appears to be able to recruit. I want to see if he can develop. Also want to see if he makes the proper changes in the offseason at S&C coach and special teams coach.

[StarkVegasSteve]

No.

Beat UK, be competitive with Auburn, and beat UT and he'll at least have me back where I was to start the year. Not too high on him, but not too low.

[ShotgunDawg]

I want to wait and see how things are in two years. He appears to be able to recruit. I want to see if he can develop. Also want to see if he makes the proper changes in the offseason at S&C coach and special teams coach.

I just want to see some it factor. A coach that has the capacity to get players to play above themselves.

I've yet to see that. Seems like we never score as many as we should & just simply never make winning plays under him

[Pipedream]

Our previous coach was pretty much dead even for his career on games won as an underdog vs games lost as a favorite. Moorhead has lost 4 games as a favorite and only won 1. Until that number evens out, I can't be on board with him. He's in a 3 game hole right now.

[Jack Lambert]

I just want to see some it factor. A coach that has the capacity to get players to play above themselves.

I've yet to see that. Seems like we never score as many as we should & just simply never make winning plays under him

Edited to say: "Never mind this thread don't apply to me."

[Scared_Hitless]

This whole thread was just to give you another opportunity to bitch. Just package another way.

That is every thread on this board lately sadly. Feels like a bunch of fans pulling in opposite directions. Most people care more about their online rep than what is best for MSU and that is a sad state of affairs.

To me regardless of if JoMo is the guy I will be rooting for him until he is fired. That is the MSU way we have lost that somewhere. People before the season said if we went bowling it was a good indicator of things, now the Goalposts have moved again. JoMo cannot be successful because he has 0 fan support through no fault of his own. Guy seems to be cut from the same cloth as most of MS ppl and is a good father and husband. He will go on to be successful somewhere guy doesnt just forget how to coach after all of his career success.

[ShotgunDawg]

Our previous coach was pretty much dead even for his career on games won as an underdog vs games lost as a favorite. Moorhead has lost 4 games as a favorite and only won 1. Until that number evens out, I can't be on board with him. He's in a 3 game hole right now.

This is my feeling as well.

I can handle losing some games you should win so long as the risk/reward makes sense due to you winning some games you should not.

Freeze was kind of like this at OM. He'd lose some games he shouldn't have but also mixed in beating Bama twice. I can handle that.

What I can't handle is only losing games you shouldn't with no upside on beating teams better than you

[ShotgunDawg]

That is every thread on this board lately sadly. Feels like a bunch of fans pulling in opposite directions. Most people care more about their online rep than what is best for MSU and that is a sad state of affairs.

To me regardless of if JoMo is the guy I will be rooting for him until he is fired. That is the MSU way we have lost that somewhere. People before the season said if we went bowling it was a good indicator of things, now the Goalposts have moved again. JoMo cannot be successful because he has 0 fan support through no fault of his own. Guy seems to be cut from the same cloth as most of MS ppl and is a good father and husband. He will go on to be successful somewhere guy doesnt just forget how to coach after all of his career success.

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.

[Tbonewannabe]

That is every thread on this board lately sadly. Feels like a bunch of fans pulling in opposite directions. Most people care more about their online rep than what is best for MSU and that is a sad state of affairs.

To me regardless of if JoMo is the guy I will be rooting for him until he is fired. That is the MSU way we have lost that somewhere. People before the season said if we went bowling it was a good indicator of things, now the Goalposts have moved again. JoMo cannot be successful because he has 0 fan support through no fault of his own. Guy seems to be cut from the same cloth as most of MS ppl and is a good father and husband. He will go on to be successful somewhere guy doesnt just forget how to coach after all of his career success.

I think if we get to 6 wins that everyone is just kind of still in wait and see mode, 7 wins and he is at least kind of keeping the status quo where Mullen had it, 8 wins is a little better and we are continuing to build toward something, and anything above that will have almost everyone on the Joe train.

4-5 wins and Joe needs to finish with a good to great recruiting class but even then his seat is really warm.

3 or less wins and most people will think we definitely need to be looking for a new coach this year.

[Percho]

For me no. Beating KY will do nothing to make me believe he is the right guy for this program. Losing to KY will however further confirm to me that he is not the right guy.

The only thing in the near future that Moorhead can do to show me he is the real deal is to win at Auburn. Beat KY & then go to Auburn & beat them & I'll be back on the Moorhead train.

Beat KY & then lose to Auburn in a good game = Meh

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a close game, beat Tennessee = Ok, at least there is a floor here. We aren't great, but it ain't Croom.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, lose to Tennessee - Further confirms my suspicion that he's a fraud.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, beat Tennessee = Meh. He's not awful but this program is going nowhere.

And if he wins out?

[Scared_Hitless]

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.

No one is objective lately. We lost a close game to a P5 Program in a rebuilding year starting a ton of freshman. They returned 15 starters and were JR and Sr across the board. Everyone expected some type of drop off coming into the season. Now we are acting shocked that it happened. We had G5 level receivers last year sure they have improved but they are still below average. Only players we have that are bonafide SEC starters on offense are Hill, Williams, and Parker who have been injured. You can argue Reese as well. Our running game has been good still produced Saturday at a decent level with 0 passing threat.

Some ppl don't realize 90% of our seasons 8-4 is our ceiling adding a power 5 game to the schedule just increased the chances we end up 7-5 more often than not. I will give him at minimum till the end of the year to make a judgement. Hopefully Tommy is Healthy.

[TrapGame]

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.

You're so ****ing bipolar.

[ShotgunDawg]

No one is objective lately. We lost a close game to a P5 Program in a rebuilding year starting a ton of freshman. They returned 15 starters and were JR and Sr across the board. Everyone expected some type of drop off coming into the season. Now we are acting shocked that it happened. We had G5 level receivers last year sure they have improved but they are still below average. Only players we have that are bonafide SEC starters on offense are Hill, Williams, and Parker who have been injured. You can argue Reese as well. Our running game has been good still produced Saturday at a decent level with 0 passing threat.

Some ppl don't realize 90% of our seasons 8-4 is our ceiling adding a power 5 game to the schedule just increased the chances we end up 7-5 more often than not. I will give him at minimum till the end of the year to make a judgement. Hopefully Tommy is Healthy.

It's more of a trend. We look unorganized & not well coached.

Yes, there are excuses as to why we lost, but it doesn't make the same re-occurring issues we've seen for 2 years excusable.

[msstate7]

No one is objective lately. We lost a close game to a P5 Program in a rebuilding year starting a ton of freshman. They returned 15 starters and were JR and Sr across the board. Everyone expected some type of drop off coming into the season. Now we are acting shocked that it happened. We had G5 level receivers last year sure they have improved but they are still below average. Only players we have that are bonafide SEC starters on offense are Hill, Williams, and Parker who have been injured. You can argue Reese as well. Our running game has been good still produced Saturday at a decent level with 0 passing threat.

Some ppl don't realize 90% of our seasons 8-4 is our ceiling adding a power 5 game to the schedule just increased the chances we end up 7-5 more often than not. I will give him at minimum till the end of the year to make a judgement. Hopefully Tommy is Healthy.

Also you...

"My thing is their recruiting averages in the 60's and everyone on this board puts a ton of stock into that ranking when it is not in our favor. Tennessee for example before the season. We are more talented, more athletic, and faster than them at every position. We are going to bully them offensively similar to last year. They have a weak D-Line and we will name our score. Now the one thing they have is a good Senior Laden Oline, but our D-Line will force more stops than theirs and we win and cover. Kentucky will be the first true test for this team."

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?76321-Why-the-K-St-concerns&p=1146902

...

I just wish you guys would remain consistent... you can't say we better them at every position and gonna name our score, and then boom.... well they return all these starters and really good, so a loss is acceptable

[Scared_Hitless]

Also you...

"My thing is their recruiting averages in the 60's and everyone on this board puts a ton of stock into that ranking when it is not in our favor. Tennessee for example before the season. We are more talented, more athletic, and faster than them at every position. We are going to bully them offensively similar to last year. They have a weak D-Line and we will name our score. Now the one thing they have is a good Senior Laden Oline, but our D-Line will force more stops than theirs and we win and cover. Kentucky will be the first true test for this team."

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?76321-Why-the-K-St-concerns&p=1146902

...

I just wish you guys would remain consistent... you can't say we better them at every position and gonna name our score, and then boom.... well they return all these starters and really good, so a loss is acceptable

We were better than them and our DLine did make stops. Also this was assuming Tommy was healthy and I thought we would score. Tommy couldn't hit guys running wide open. Most ppl did not foresee that. Their OLine looked good as did their coaching. Also without the KO return we were well on our way to covering with a freshman QB. Also I said SEC starters we have plenty of players that would start for KState. Am I surprised we couldn't run the ball at will sure you got me there. Our lack of experience showed and both teams made costly turnovers. If we have healthy Tommy I still think we win and cover.

[Pipedream]

Also you...

"My thing is their recruiting averages in the 60's and everyone on this board puts a ton of stock into that ranking when it is not in our favor. Tennessee for example before the season. We are more talented, more athletic, and faster than them at every position. We are going to bully them offensively similar to last year. They have a weak D-Line and we will name our score. Now the one thing they have is a good Senior Laden Oline, but our D-Line will force more stops than theirs and we win and cover. Kentucky will be the first true test for this team."

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?76321-Why-the-K-St-concerns&p=1146902

...

I just wish you guys would remain consistent... you can't say we better them at every position and gonna name our score, and then boom.... well they return all these starters and really good, so a loss is acceptable

Yeah. This is spot on. We had a 40 spot recruiting advantage at home and lost. That's a huge problem. That's a coaching problem and clearly a game you shouldn't lose. There's two things people can do after a loss like that-make excuses for the coaching staff (injuries, suspensions, fr QB, drops, etc.) or cast blame. I'm not going to tell anyone how to think/feel, but I'm not interested in making excuses for a guy that makes $3M+/year to win football games. There's a larger issue here that isn't being talked about enough-we were incredibly lucky to not have been blown off the field in the first half. If not for some big time luck, we're staring in the face of a 17-0 hole less than 5 mins into the 2nd quarter. After that, we outplayed them slightly the remainder of the game, but we could've gotten blasted by a first year coach in our house with a 40 spot recruiting disadvantage. And all of that was before our starting QB went out. If you're making excuses for Moorhead, I just don't understand why. What has he shown that he deserves any sort of confidence or leeway?

[WPDawg]

That is every thread on this board lately sadly. Feels like a bunch of fans pulling in opposite directions. Most people care more about their online rep than what is best for MSU and that is a sad state of affairs.

To me regardless of if JoMo is the guy I will be rooting for him until he is fired. That is the MSU way we have lost that somewhere. People before the season said if we went bowling it was a good indicator of things, now the Goalposts have moved again. JoMo cannot be successful because he has 0 fan support through no fault of his own. Guy seems to be cut from the same cloth as most of MS ppl and is a good father and husband. He will go on to be successful somewhere guy doesnt just forget how to coach after all of his career success.

Agreed. The true MSU fans are pulling for Joe and this team to continue to improve. The message writers who claim to be objectively helping with their public diatribe are not part of the solution to making this program better. I get that it makes them feel better to express how they feel and what they think in a public forum. But it does not help the program they claim to support. It only adds unnecessary baggage to the process of building something better.

[Scared_Hitless]

Also since we wanna run down Recruiting as be all end all. Mullen Lost to BYU, South Alabama, Kentucky, and struggled with Samford and UMASS in year 7 of his tenure. That was with his guys every single person on the team was recruited and handpicked by him. We out recruit every school on that list.

He also got smoked in one of the biggest bowl games in our history to a composite 50ish Recruiter in GA Tech. This was with our best player of all time. Cohen tried to elevate and hell maybe it will fail, but Mullen wasn't taking us to the promised land either. If he couldn't do it with Dak he was never going to do anything special.

[msstate7]

Also since we wanna run down Recruiting as be all end all. Mullen Lost to BYU, South Alabama, Kentucky, and struggled with Samford and UMASS in year 7 of his tenure. That was with his guys every single person on the team was recruited and handpicked by him. We out recruit every school on that list.

He also got smoked in one of the biggest bowl games in our history to a composite 50ish Recruiter in GA Tech. This was with our best player of all time. Cohen tried to elevate and hell maybe it will fail, but Mullen wasn't taking us to the promised land either. If he couldn't do it with Dak he was never going to do anything special.

Show us where everyone said those losses were acceptable. People were mad at those losses, but now we ok with em.

ETA... Mullen had taken us to a NY6 bowl 2 years before that too, so he earned some leeway

[TrapGame]

Also since we wanna run down Recruiting as be all end all. Mullen Lost to BYU, South Alabama, Kentucky, and struggled with Samford and UMASS in year 7 of his tenure. That was with his guys every single person on the team was recruited and handpicked by him. We out recruit every school on that list.

He also got smoked in one of the biggest bowl games in our history to a composite 50ish Recruiter in GA Tech. This was with our best player of all time. Cohen tried to elevate and hell maybe it will fail, but Mullen wasn't taking us to the promised land either. If he couldn't do it with Dak he was never going to do anything special.

Mullen tried to ride Dak into a bigger job instead of realizing he just did something at State no other head coach had ever done and built off of that. Mullen could have made us the LSU of Mississippi if he had swallowed his ego and actually tried to recruit some blue chips after our first #1 season.

[TrapGame]

Show us where everyone said those losses were acceptable. People were mad at those losses, but now we ok with em.

He never said they were. That's not the point of his post. But, you know that already.

[Scared_Hitless]

Show us where everyone said those losses were acceptable. People were mad at those losses, but now we ok with em.

So are we comparing JoMo to our historical standard or previous coach to determine he is a failure. Because he is way above the historical mean and right on pace with the best coach we have ever had. No wonder we cant hire anyone here it is a no win situation.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Yeah. This is spot on. We had a 40 spot recruiting advantage at home and lost. That's a huge problem. That's a coaching problem and clearly a game you shouldn't lose. There's two things people can do after a loss like that-make excuses for the coaching staff (injuries, suspensions, fr QB, drops, etc.) or cast blame. I'm not going to tell anyone how to think/feel, but I'm not interested in making excuses for a guy that makes $3M+/year to win football games. There's a larger issue here that isn't being talked about enough-we were incredibly lucky to not have been blown off the field in the first half. If not for some big time luck, we're staring in the face of a 17-0 hole less than 5 mins into the 2nd quarter. After that, we outplayed them slightly the remainder of the game, but we could've gotten blasted by a first year coach in our house with a 40 spot recruiting disadvantage. And all of that was before our starting QB went out. If you're making excuses for Moorhead, I just don't understand why. What has he shown that he deserves any sort of confidence or leeway?

To be clear, when we make plays that alter the flow of the game - it's luck. When another team makes plays against us, we simply suck. Is that accurate?

It couldn't be that our coaches put our players in a position to be successful and those players went out and made plays, it has to be that a "blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then" and we were just lucky. Right?

[msstate7]

So are we comparing JoMo to our historical standard or previous coach to determine he is a failure. Because he is way above the historical mean and right on pace with the best coach we have ever had. No wonder we cant hire anyone here it is a no win situation.

Fine, as last as he maintains our current .494 all time winning %, he's doing fine.

[msstate7]

To be clear, when we make plays that alter the flow of the game - it's luck. When another team makes plays against us, we simply suck. Is that accurate?

It couldn't be that our coaches put our players in a position to be successful and those players went out and made plays, it has to be that a "blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then" and we were just lucky. Right?

You claiming muffs as a skill on our part?

[Scared_Hitless]

Fine, as last as he maintains our current .494 all time winning %, he's doing fine.

Think we all know he is well above that and has not shown regression to even the .500 level yet so how about you give him some time. Based on our team Saturday I believe even you would agree we have some young talent. Lovett, JJones, Emerson, Cross, Shrader, Witherspoon. That all look the part as freshman. I am willing to let him recruit and find some receivers that are above G5 level to catch the ball.

[Coursesuper]

No, its a long season and then we shall see. But this isn't on Joe, this is on those that made the decision to hire him in the first place.

[Pipedream]

Also since we wanna run down Recruiting as be all end all. Mullen Lost to BYU, South Alabama, Kentucky, and struggled with Samford and UMASS in year 7 of his tenure. That was with his guys every single person on the team was recruited and handpicked by him. We out recruit every school on that list.

He also got smoked in one of the biggest bowl games in our history to a composite 50ish Recruiter in GA Tech. This was with our best player of all time. Cohen tried to elevate and hell maybe it will fail, but Mullen wasn't taking us to the promised land either. If he couldn't do it with Dak he was never going to do anything special.

Mullen averaged beating 1.7 teams/ year that recruited better than him and lost to 1.1 teams/per that he recruited better than. He's on the positive side there. He was on the right side of the line on outperforming his recruiting rankings. Moorhead won 2 games last year over teams that out recruit State (Aub & A&M) and lost to 2 teams that we outrecruit (UK & Iowa). This year he's already lost to KSU. Maybe Moorhead gives you a little more upside, but a lot more downside. Probably too small of a sample size to tell yet. Either way-Mullen only lost 10 games to teams that he outrecruited in 9 years. Moorhead has already lost 3 in a 1.25 seasons.

[msstate7]

Think we all know he is well above that and has not shown regression to even the .500 level yet so how about you give him some time. Based on our team Saturday I believe even you would agree we have some young talent. Lovett, JJones, Emerson, Cross, Shrader, Witherspoon. That all look the part as freshman. I am willing to let him recruit and find some receivers that are above G5 level to catch the ball.

We took Kansas state's leading wr, and he can't do anything here. He caught 103 balls the last 2 years at KSU and has 3 for us. Why can't he surpass our G5 WRs?

[Homedawg]

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.

This. Don't know why people think that just Bc someone is critical, means he- we are against him is asinine. Nobody, I repeat nobody wants us to lose. I hope jomo coaches here for a while. Bc is he does, then we've been successful.

[Homedawg]

And if he wins out?


Another unicorn....and ridiculous post

[Scared_Hitless]

Mullen averaged beating 1.7 teams/ year that recruited better than him and lost to 1.1 teams/per that he recruited better than. He's on the positive side there. He was on the right side of the line on outperforming his recruiting rankings. Moorhead won 2 games last year over teams that out recruit State (Aub & A&M) and lost to 2 teams that we outrecruit (UK & Iowa). This year he's already lost to KSU. Maybe Moorhead gives you a little more upside, but a lot more downside. Probably too small of a sample size to tell yet. Either way-Mullen only lost 10 games to teams that he outrecruited in 9 years. Moorhead has already lost 3 in a 1.25 seasons.

I hate Dave Bartoo but when it comes to recruiting there is a reason to use +- 10 spot averages. Qualifiers, Attrition, and Injuries matter. Kentucky is right around 30 when it comes to recruiting and we are at 23. Not much separation for a Away game if you ask me. Iowa is similar to Kansas State the more talented team lost. So yes that is on Joe, granted if Guidry could catch and we cover a KO we win those as well.

[Homedawg]

We took Kansas state's leading wr, and he can't do anything here. He caught 103 balls the last 2 years at KSU and has 3 for us. Why can't he surpass our G5 WRs?

But it's Bc they had a qb that threw a catchable ball..... wait, that was our excuse last year...

[Pipedream]

To be clear, when we make plays that alter the flow of the game - it's luck. When another team makes plays against us, we simply suck. Is that accurate?

It couldn't be that our coaches put our players in a position to be successful and those players went out and made plays, it has to be that a "blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then" and we were just lucky. Right?

The guy dropped a punt? What skill did we develop to cause that to happen? We were way ahead on the luck in that game. We had 1 maybe 2 things happen to us that were fluky-the KO return is really the only one that I would say go against us, but some could argue the Stevens fumble was also bad luck-even though I just think that's a guy making a stupid play and not securing the ball when running-something that is coachable. You could also say we were unlucky on the tipped ball to Guidry, but it was a high throw and a guy that is drop prone didn't catch it. Both things are coachable. We recovered 2 fumbled punts by them, recovered a fumbled punt by our own guy (Dear), hit a guy for a 40 yard TD one a one handed catch in the back of the end zone with less than 30 seconds to play that without a boneheaded penalty by their guy would have sent us to the lockerroom, their QB overthrew wide open guys for TD's at least twice, we threw a pick then caused a fumble and recovered it that was going to give them possession deep in our zone. We were absolutely on the + end of the luck in that game and still couldn't get it done.

[Scared_Hitless]

We took Kansas state's leading wr, and he can't do anything here. He caught 103 balls the last 2 years at KSU and has 3 for us. Why can't he surpass our G5 WRs?

Most likely because he was injured and hasn't picked up the offense completely. Now he should be 100% returning punts and kicks at minimum.

[gtowndawg]

No.

Beat UK, be competitive with Auburn, and beat UT and he'll at least have me back where I was to start the year. Not too high on him, but not too low.

That's my answer as well.

[confucius say]

I just want to see some it factor. A coach that has the capacity to get players to play above themselves.

I've yet to see that. Seems like we never score as many as we should & just simply never make winning plays under him

You mean like against aub and Aggie last year?

[Scared_Hitless]

You mean like against aub and Aggie last year?

Shhhhh those don't count since we lost to Iowa.

[Pipedream]

I hate Dave Bartoo but when it comes to recruiting there is a reason to use +- 10 spot averages. Qualifiers, Attrition, and Injuries matter. Kentucky is right around 30 when it comes to recruiting and we are at 23. Not much separation for a Away game if you ask me. Iowa is similar to Kansas State the more talented team lost. So yes that is on Joe, granted if Guidry could catch and we cover a KO we win those as well.

We're talking about last years game, so the 2018 versions of those teams State had a 4yr average of 24 and UK had a 4 yr average of 35 which falls outside of this mystical +-10 spot separator. That was a bad loss.

[Scared_Hitless]

We're talking about last years game, so the 2018 versions of those teams State had a 4yr average of 24 and UK had a 4 yr average of 35 which falls outside of this mystical +-10 spot separator. That was a bad loss.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-football-recruiting/2018/2/8/16990550/college-football-recruiting-rankings-2018-class

According to this it was 25 and 35 respectively with a 2 year average of 26 and 29 but yep they suck. They finished 12th in the country it was two defensive teams in the rain and we made costly mistakes. Its a loss, but hardly a bad one.

[confucius say]

Take note that title of this thread assumes that Joe has lost each of you and needs to win you back.

Again, our offense looked great with a healthy TS. Can anybody name me a team that has beaten a top 25 team despite being without 6 starters, it?s Sr qb, and playing a true freshman qb?

[Homedawg]

I hope win for multiple reasons. One, I like wining and hate losing. Two, I really don't want to see the defenders move the goal posts for the second time and we haven't even made it out of sept yet.

[Homedawg]

Take note that title of this thread assumes that Joe has lost each of you and needs to win you back.

Again, our offense looked great with a healthy TS. Can anybody name me a team that has beaten a top 25 team despite being without 6 starters, it?s Sr qb, and playing a true freshman qb?

Great is a strong word. But certainly better w him for sure. As one would expect.

[Fader21]

This. Don't know why people think that just Bc someone is critical, means he- we are against him is asinine. Nobody, I repeat nobody wants us to lose. I hope jomo coaches here for a while. Bc is he does, then we've been successful.

Maybe its because he has repeatedly said that he is done with Moorhead or Moorhead has to go

[Coach007]

For me no. Beating KY will do nothing to make me believe he is the right guy for this program. Losing to KY will however further confirm to me that he is not the right guy.

The only thing in the near future that Moorhead can do to show me he is the real deal is to win at Auburn. Beat KY & then go to Auburn & beat them & I'll be back on the Moorhead train.

Beat KY & then lose to Auburn in a good game = Meh

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a close game, beat Tennessee = Ok, at least there is a floor here. We aren't great, but it ain't Croom.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, lose to Tennessee - Further confirms my suspicion that he's a fraud.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, beat Tennessee = Meh. He's not awful but this program is going nowhere.

LOL at any person who claims he has to win you back after a loss.

Talk about roller coaster emotions.

[Pipedream]

https://www.sbnation.com/college-football-recruiting/2018/2/8/16990550/college-football-recruiting-rankings-2018-class

According to this it was 25 and 35 respectively with a 2 year average of 26 and 29 but yep they suck. They finished 12th in the country it was two defensive teams in the rain and we made costly mistakes. Its a loss, but hardly a bad one.

https://247sports.com/Season/2018-Football/CompositeTeamRankings/

Composite has State 15-18 at 18/28/24/27 average of 24.25. UK 38/34/30/37 average of 34.75.
The line closed at State -10 which equates to roughly a 75% chance of the favorite winning. It was a bad loss by any metric you'd like to use.

[Homedawg]

LOL at any person who claims he has to win you back after a loss.

Talk about roller coaster emotions.

It's not after A loss it's after ANOTHER loss in game we shouldn't have. Nobody comes calling for someone's head when we lose to bama. It's really not hard to figure out and doesn't make a person on a roller coaster.

[Coach007]

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.

Objective would be seeing that

- This is not the Mullen offense. And Just LIKE Mullen, he needed to have his QBs and guys catching balls. UNLIKE Mullen, it took him 1 recruiting class to do it.
- That Mullen left a ton of holes.
- That we are down a ton of players
- that despite being extremely young on the DL our guys are improving

[msstate7]

Objective would be seeing that

- This is not the Mullen offense. And Just LIKE Mullen, he needed to have his QBs and guys catching balls. UNLIKE Mullen, it took him 1 recruiting class to do it.
- That Mullen left a ton of holes.
- That we are down a ton of players
- that despite being extremely young on the DL our guys are improving

Sounds pretty bleak... you still have us winning 11?

[Coach007]

It's more of a trend. We look unorganized & not well coached.

Yes, there are excuses as to why we lost, but it doesn't make the same re-occurring issues we've seen for 2 years excusable.

Pardon? The Defense looked unorganized last year? Here is a thought. Maybe it's due to the lack of senior leadership and a ton of Freshmen and Sophomores on the field.

On Offense. LMAO!!! If you can't see a difference in our offense last year and this year, you are purposefully burying your head.

[Coach007]

Show us where everyone said those losses were acceptable. People were mad at those losses, but now we ok with em.

ETA... Mullen had taken us to a NY6 bowl 2 years before that too, so he earned some leeway

Huge difference in 7 years and entering your 2nd

[Coach007]

We took Kansas state's leading wr, and he can't do anything here. He caught 103 balls the last 2 years at KSU and has 3 for us. Why can't he surpass our G5 WRs?

Speaking of objectivity...


You know damn well he hasn't been the main target. We spread the ball out a ton.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Look, we all knew coming into the year this was a "show me" season. He hasn't lost me, but shit. We do not look good. And have not looked good.

[Coach007]

It's not after A loss it's after ANOTHER loss in game we shouldn't have. Nobody comes calling for someone's head when we lose to bama. It's really not hard to figure out and doesn't make a person on a roller coaster.

But it does.

And it is.

[Todd4State]

Why are we all of a sudden using recruiting rankings to determine actual objective overall talent?

[Homedawg]

Pardon? The Defense looked unorganized last year? Here is a thought. Maybe it's due to the lack of senior leadership and a ton of Freshmen and Sophomores on the field.

On Offense. LMAO!!! If you can't see a difference in our offense last year and this year, you are purposefully burying your head.
We throw it better yes. I'll hold out judgment until we play sec defenses. Yardage numbers total are about the same to this point. Ultimately, it comes down to how many points you can score. Again, We shall see if we can against sec D's or not.

[Coach007]

Why are we all of a sudden using recruiting rankings to determine actual objective overall talent?

Obviously for objectivity. :)

[Lord McBuckethead]

I am going to ammend my previous statement. Mitchell, Stevens, Hill, and Shrader have looked good. DThomas when targeted has looked good. TEs look good. CAM d looked good. Everyone else, slow and fat.

[Coach007]

We throw it better yes. I'll hold out judgment until we play sec defenses. Yardage numbers total are about the same to this point. Ultimately, it comes down to how many points you can score. Again, We shall see if we can against sec D's or not.


Tis true.

[Scared_Hitless]

Look, we all knew coming into the year this was a "show me" season. He hasn't lost me, but shit. We do not look good. And have not looked good.

This was never a show me season, most people expected this to be a rebuilding year. I figured 8-4 or 9-3 with the Tommy and Zuber news but that was optimistic. But with the suspensions and injury woes we dropped a game we shouldn't have. Still think we upset someone this season, and look much better this week with Gay and Autry on the field.

[PMDawg]

That is every thread on this board lately sadly. Feels like a bunch of fans pulling in opposite directions. Most people care more about their online rep than what is best for MSU and that is a sad state of affairs.

To me regardless of if JoMo is the guy I will be rooting for him until he is fired. That is the MSU way we have lost that somewhere. People before the season said if we went bowling it was a good indicator of things, now the Goalposts have moved again. JoMo cannot be successful because he has 0 fan support through no fault of his own. Guy seems to be cut from the same cloth as most of MS ppl and is a good father and husband. He will go on to be successful somewhere guy doesnt just forget how to coach after all of his career success.

Yeah, this is just total BS. Whiney, crybaby BS. I dont recall a single person claiming he was a bad hire. Everyone was pretty optimistic and got behind Joe. Then last year happened. It caused legitimate concern. And instead of coming out and moving the needle in the right direction this year, he's struggled through the first 3 games and made it worse. There are enough negative trends to cause legitimate concerns. It's not hoping he fails to point them out

[Fader21]

Could you imagine where Clemson would be, if they would have fired Dabo after his first full season he won 9 games and the next season he only won 6?

[WPDawg]

Could you imagine where Clemson would be, if they would have fired Dabo after his first full season he won 9 games and the next season he only won 6?

great point. Takes time to build your program with the right pieces. With change, there are sometimes valleys before you find the right path to the peak.

"In 2010, Swinney led Clemson to a 6–6 (4–4 in ACC) regular season. Of the 6 losses in the 2010 season, 5 were by less than 10 points and 4 were by 6 points or less. The season included close losses to Cam Newton and the eventual national champion Auburn Tigers (27–24 on the road in OT), and the eventual division champion Florida State Seminoles (16–13 on a 55-yard, time-expiring field goal on the road). After the conclusion of the regular season, many fans called for the firing of both Swinney and athletic director Terry Don Phillips.[11] Swinney would say years later he expected to be fired after the regular season ended with a loss to South Carolina.[14] Don Phillips instead gave Swiney a vote of confidence and allowed him to return for the 2011 season.[15] Discontent with Swinney grew even more after a bowl loss to South Florida made Clemson's final record 6-7, Clemson's first losing season since 1998. Swinney, who was 19-15, entered the 2011 season widely considered to be a coach on the hot seat.[16] Despite a disappointing 6–7 record, the 2010 team featured one of the nation's top defenses and the Bronko Nagurski and Ted Hendricks award winner, Da'Quan Bowers"

[Doggie_Style]

Could you imagine where Clemson would be, if they would have fired Dabo after his first full season he won 9 games and the next season he only won 6?

Nobody is talking about firing Joe after this year. If win 6 or less this year and 6 or less again next year then yes the conversation needs to happen.

[msstate7]

Nobody is talking about firing Joe after this year. If win 6 or less this year and 6 or less again next year then yes the conversation needs to happen.

ANY criticism of Moorhead seems to equal wanna fire him, not a real state fan, or actively pulling against him

[gtowndawg]

Nobody is talking about firing Joe after this year. If win 6 or less this year and 6 or less again next year then yes the conversation needs to happen.

Exactly, he's not getting fired this year. If we're 6-6 this year, then he starts next year on a warm seat that could get hot (or cold) depending on the season. Just need to accept it and pull for 7 wins (the ceiling for this season in my opinion).

[dantheman4248]

ANY criticism of Moorhead seems to equal wanna fire him, not a real state fan, or actively pulling against him

There are people who are being realistic and there are definitely people calling for his head regardless. Both sides have reasonable and delusionals when it comes to Moorhead

[Maroonthirteen]

Hold on...... I?m looking to the sidelines to get my reply.... the tutor is almost done writing it.

Damn.... wait a little longer..... TS was running the reply in.... tripped over the hash mark.... broke his arm.

[Pipedream]

Why are we all of a sudden using recruiting rankings to determine actual objective overall talent?

When it became the most accurate talent evaluating system available. Do you have another system you'd like to recommend that more accurately depicts team talent better than recruiting rankings?

[Homedawg]

great point. Takes time to build your program with the right pieces. With change, there are sometimes valleys before you find the right path to the peak.

"In 2010, Swinney led Clemson to a 6–6 (4–4 in ACC) regular season. Of the 6 losses in the 2010 season, 5 were by less than 10 points and 4 were by 6 points or less. The season included close losses to Cam Newton and the eventual national champion Auburn Tigers (27–24 on the road in OT), and the eventual division champion Florida State Seminoles (16–13 on a 55-yard, time-expiring field goal on the road). After the conclusion of the regular season, many fans called for the firing of both Swinney and athletic director Terry Don Phillips.[11] Swinney would say years later he expected to be fired after the regular season ended with a loss to South Carolina.[14] Don Phillips instead gave Swiney a vote of confidence and allowed him to return for the 2011 season.[15] Discontent with Swinney grew even more after a bowl loss to South Florida made Clemson's final record 6-7, Clemson's first losing season since 1998. Swinney, who was 19-15, entered the 2011 season widely considered to be a coach on the hot seat.[16] Despite a disappointing 6–7 record, the 2010 team featured one of the nation's top defenses and the Bronko Nagurski and Ted Hendricks award winner, Da'Quan Bowers"

Didn't know we had lost to the national champ by a fg or to the conference champ by a fg. Considering we can't score against teams like that I guess a 3-0 loss wouldn't be so bad.

[dantheman4248]

Didn't know we had lost to the national champ by a fg or to the conference champ by a fg. Considering we can't score against teams like that I guess a 3-0 loss wouldn't be so bad.

Our only loss this year is to and undefeated power 5 by 7 and there is still 3 top 7 teams on the schedule. That was Swinney’s year 2 and this is Moorhead’s year 2. No telling what the future may hold.

[Percho]

Another unicorn....and ridiculous post

I was just wondering how he would feel about, "Vester," IF that took place.

I'll tell you how he would feel, Just as you would feel. Blind hog, I tell you, blind hog, bet you he can't do it again.

Because that is who a lot on this forum are.

[Homedawg]

Our only loss this year is to and undefeated power 5 by 7 and there is still 3 top 7 teams on the schedule. That was Swinney’s year 2 and this is Moorhead’s year 2. No telling what the future may hold.

Correct on the future, unfortunately, I've seen the past, too many games we should have won and bad coaching jobs. Hell I'll be happy if we can just get to halftime wo pissing away all 3 timeouts. Last week it was all 3. And that's the norm not the exception.

[Homedawg]

I was just wondering how he would feel about, "Vester," IF that took place.

I'll tell you how he would feel, Just as you would feel. Blind hog, I tell you, blind hog, bet you he can't do it again.

Because that is who a lot on this forum are.


Well if that happened I'm sure everyone would be on board. People spend time thinking about what they are going to do when they win the lottery too.

[ShotgunDawg]

So are we comparing JoMo to our historical standard or previous coach to determine he is a failure. Because he is way above the historical mean and right on pace with the best coach we have ever had. No wonder we cant hire anyone here it is a no win situation.

This is ridiculous & undermines the absurd difference between our resources back in the day & now

[ShotgunDawg]

I pray that someday I can have a job that pays me $3 mil a year & I get your excuse makers defending me for inadequacy

It's really unreal how far some of you will go to prove to people that have watched a ton of football that they don't see the game right & can't tell the difference between a well coached team & a not well coached team

[Percho]

Look, we all knew coming into the year this was a "show me" season. He hasn't lost me, but shit. We do not look good. And have not looked good.

I agree with this. We do not look team coordinated and we are not disciplined IMHO.

[Pipedream]

This is ridiculous & undermines the absurd difference between our resources back in the day & now

A good coach can win 60% of there games here and not really beat a good team. Especially right now. OM and Ark are down. An average coach should win 7 games/year at State or 54%. We are 51% since the division split in 92. 63% since the SEC Network started($$) and Mullen went 66%. Calling 6-6 acceptable is ludicrous. It's not acceptable anymore. If we're going to let that go back to being the standard let's just pack this shit up and head home.

[yjnkdawg]

I'm absolutely cheering for Moorhead. Our program is much much better off if he is the guy. However, it's important to be objective. Objectively, he hasn't been up to snuff.


Let me make sure I get this straight. You are cheering for JoeMO, but you started a thread right after the KSU that you wanted him fired after he so far has gone 2 and 1 in his second season at MSU? .................... JoeMo definitely needs more fans cheering him on like you then.****

[Cloak]

We just lost to Kansas freaking State. Their own fans were trolling the team.

How would beating a Kentucky team, that we are favored by a touchdown in, make the grass any greener?

[yjnkdawg]

Edited to say: "Never mind this thread don't apply to me."


I agree Jack. The thread would have been more accurate if he had said "Can Moorhead win me back this weekend?". Then he could have ranted on and on with what he thinks needs to be done or not be done or just answer "No". Thus no need for the thread then.

[Gutter Cobreh]

I agree Jack. The thread would have been more accurate if he had said "Can Moorhead win me back this weekend?". Then he could have ranted on and on with what he thinks needs to be done or not be done or just answer "No". Thus no need for the thread then.

He has to put food on the table and to do so has to create content for the site... we're simply enjoying the 75th different thread he can create to express how much he despises the coach and wants him gone. But remember, it's all because he loves the school and that our expectations are too low for the program...***

[Jack Lambert]

We just lost to Kansas freaking State. Their own fans were trolling the team.

How would beating a Kentucky team, that we are favored by a touchdown in, make the grass any greener?

I thought KY had blue grass?

[confucius say]

A good coach can win 60% of there games here and not really beat a good team. Especially right now. OM and Ark are down. An average coach should win 7 games/year at State or 54%. We are 51% since the division split in 92. 63% since the SEC Network started($$) and Mullen went 66%. Calling 6-6 acceptable is ludicrous. It's not acceptable anymore. If we're going to let that go back to being the standard let's just pack this shit up and head home.

Dan did not win 66% here. And I love Dan. But he was 69-46, and that?s including bowl games. He was 64-44 in regular season, which is a 7-5 coach. Exactly what you call average in your post. But people wanted to run Dan off on numerous occasions too.

[WPDawg]

ANY criticism of Moorhead seems to equal wanna fire him, not a real state fan, or actively pulling against him

If you read some of these messages on another team's message board, how would you perceive it? If some of this was printed in the CL, how would it read? Lot of people dislike losing and have their opinions on what looks wrong but it doesn't make those opinions right enough to state publicly. Some of you may be great people in person but your anonymous postings of criticizing quickly and often doesn't tread well. May be the presentation. Some can criticize more eloquently than others.

I am more for everyone pulling in same direction and "hard discussions" are held in private. "Can Moorhead win you back this weekend" ..... really? Is that what you want outsiders to read as the pulse of the MSU fanbase?

[Pipedream]

Dan did not win 66% here. And I love Dan. But he was 69-46, and that?s including bowl games. He was 64-44 in regular season, which is a 7-5 coach. Exactly what you call average in your post. But people wanted to run Dan off on numerous occasions too.

My apologies. I goofed the numbers here. His teams went 70-46. 60%. In a 13 game season that's 7.8 wins. I think Dan was a very very good-not great, not average coach. He was above average. I think an average coach at State should win 7 games/year.

[Pipedream]

If you read some of these messages on another team's message board, how would you perceive it? If some of this was printed in the CL, how would it read? Lot of people dislike losing and have their opinions on what looks wrong but it doesn't make those opinions right enough to state publicly. Some of you may be great people in person but your anonymous postings of criticizing quickly and often doesn't tread well. May be the presentation. Some can criticize more eloquently than others.

I am more for everyone pulling in same direction and "hard discussions" are held in private. "Can Moorhead win you back this weekend" ..... really? Is that what you want outsiders to read as the pulse of the MSU fanbase?

There is a flip side to this coin too. Imagine going to a teams message board who took football seriously and had a super passionate fanbase after losing a game at home to Kansas St as a 7.5 point favorite. What kind of venom do you think would be spewing at those places? This is all pretty tame when you have that perspective.

[confucius say]

My apologies. I goofed the numbers here. His teams went 70-46. 60%. In a 13 game season that's 7.8 wins. I think Dan was a very very good-not great, not average coach. He was above average. I think an average coach at State should win 7 games/year.

69. He did not win the bowl game in his last season bc he was gone already.

Bowl games are largely a crapshoot outside of the NY6 games, so that is why I try to look at regular season.

My bigger point is that Dan was a 7-5 coach here. And I think he was seen as a success by the national media here. I certainly think he was. But I feel like if joe is a 7-5 coach here (and I def think he will be) that he will never be good enough for our fan base.

[Jack Lambert]

69. He did not win the bowl game in his last season bc he was gone already.

Bowl games are largely a crapshoot outside of the NY6 games, so that is why I try to look at regular season.

My bigger point is that Dan was a 7-5 coach here. And I think he was seen as a success by the national media here. I certainly think he was. But I feel like if joe is a 7-5 coach here (and I def think he will be) that he will never be good enough for our fan base.

Hey confucius is it true "He who go to bed with itchy butt wakes up with smelling fingers?"

[Jack Lambert]

69. He did not win the bowl game in his last season bc he was gone already.

Bowl games are largely a crapshoot outside of the NY6 games, so that is why I try to look at regular season.

My bigger point is that Dan was a 7-5 coach here. And I think he was seen as a success by the national media here. I certainly think he was. But I feel like if joe is a 7-5 coach here (and I def think he will be) that he will never be good enough for our fan base.

I face the truth. It takes three to four years for Miss State to build up to a really good season. I think we should go to bowl games every year during the period between. Last season was the season for a really good season but our captain abandon ship. New guy comes in and doesn't have that really good season and then you end up with a portion of fans who hate him for that. We are in a rebuilding period and it will be three to four years before the next really good season opportunity. The new guy has to be giving the chance and the support to do it. To want to fire a guy after one and one half season and to continue to rant about it over and over is really stupid. Also other coaches from other schools look at our boards and print post and use it in recruiting against us. Nix from Ole Miss did it and that was a proven fact. So I am pretty sure it is being done now.


Edited to add any Miss State fan who wants to fire a coach after 16 games should never ever ever say another word about how bat ape shit pin-sol drinking crazy Bama or Arkansas fans are.

[Todd4State]

When it became the most accurate talent evaluating system available. Do you have another system you'd like to recommend that more accurately depicts team talent better than recruiting rankings?

The NFL draft would be a good place to start.

Saying that recruiting rankings are the most accurate talent system available and relying heavily on it is like relying on a sawed off shotgun for accuracy because that's all you have that's available.

[Todd4State]

If you read some of these messages on another team's message board, how would you perceive it? If some of this was printed in the CL, how would it read? Lot of people dislike losing and have their opinions on what looks wrong but it doesn't make those opinions right enough to state publicly. Some of you may be great people in person but your anonymous postings of criticizing quickly and often doesn't tread well. May be the presentation. Some can criticize more eloquently than others.

I am more for everyone pulling in same direction and "hard discussions" are held in private. "Can Moorhead win you back this weekend" ..... really? Is that what you want outsiders to read as the pulse of the MSU fanbase?

There's also literally a thread on this board titled "Joe must go".

[Coursesuper]

The NFL draft would be a good place to start.

Saying that recruiting rankings are the most accurate talent system available and relying heavily on it is like relying on a sawed off shotgun for accuracy because that's all you have that's available.

That's is absolutely correct, those doing the ratings are amateurs at best.

[confucius say]

Hey confucius is it true "He who go to bed with itchy butt wakes up with smelling fingers?"

Depends on well he washed his ass before bed

[msstate7]

That's is absolutely correct, those doing the ratings are amateurs at best.

As smoot said yesterday... when Moorhead recruits a few spots ahead of Mullen, that means everything. When our recruiting rankings are 30 spots higher than Kansas state's though... well, you can't put any stock in that.

[Pipedream]

The NFL draft would be a good place to start.

Saying that recruiting rankings are the most accurate talent system available and relying heavily on it is like relying on a sawed off shotgun for accuracy because that's all you have that's available.

Go look at most drafted players from a school and the recruiting rankings and tell me where the holes are comparing the two. I didn't say they were infallible, just that they were the best method available. A lot of folks just want to throw their hands up and say "look at FSU, look at Tennessee-they're awful but have great recruiting numbers", but recruiting rankings on the whole are a great way to evaluate talent on a team. They're getting more and more accurate every year and to ignore them or dismiss them is sticking your head in the sand.

[CadaverDawg]

No

[confucius say]

As smoot said yesterday... when Moorhead recruits a few spots ahead of Mullen, that means everything. When our recruiting rankings are 30 spots higher than Kansas state's though... well, you can't put any stock in that.

I am not a huge recruiting rankings guy, but what weight they hold is greatly lessened when 27.2% of your starters, including your qb, are out.

[gravedigger]

For me no. Beating KY will do nothing to make me believe he is the right guy for this program. Losing to KY will however further confirm to me that he is not the right guy.

The only thing in the near future that Moorhead can do to show me he is the real deal is to win at Auburn. Beat KY & then go to Auburn & beat them & I'll be back on the Moorhead train.

Beat KY & then lose to Auburn in a good game = Meh

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a close game, beat Tennessee = Ok, at least there is a floor here. We aren't great, but it ain't Croom.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, lose to Tennessee - Further confirms my suspicion that he's a fraud.

Beat KY, lose to Auburn in a blow out, beat Tennessee = Meh. He's not awful but this program is going nowhere.

I am a fan of Mississippi State and whomever coaches or plays for us in a particular moment. I have always been. I will always be. Moorhead wont lose anyone of any significance if we lose to Kentucky.

Matter of fact, if by losing to UK, you and the rest of the junior high children would decide to forever leave our fanbase, I would pull against my bulldogs for the ONLY time in my life.

[timotheus]

facts are hard to deal with I see.

[gravedigger]

facts are hard to deal with I see.

What is even harder is realizing that just because you believe something, does not make it fact.

[timotheus]

I watch and then listen and we have an issue about to spiral. It does sound good to hear it described but its hard to swipe things out the way like on the dry erase when the game is live. And we are still to believe that we confuse the defense by letting them set up and then dictate what play we run. play action is still play action no matter what we call it but it only works if it fools a defender for a split second. So I guess we need to try to stand still a bit longer and do a better job of fooling defenders who do a good job of reading their keys.

[Coach007]

As smoot said yesterday... when Moorhead recruits a few spots ahead of Mullen, that means everything. When our recruiting rankings are 30 spots higher than Kansas state's though... well, you can't put any stock in that.

Oh friggin A BS!!!


there is a massive difference in YOUNG talent and Mature talent.

So what if we recruited better? They are YOUNG! Sometimes that matters a hell of a lot more in game situations.

[Coach007]

I am not a huge recruiting rankings guy, but what weight they hold is greatly lessened when 27.2% of your starters, including your qb, are out.

Common sense....


You know, there is an old saying... birds of the feather. They flock together.


Seems we have a flock here

[msstate7]

Oh friggin A BS!!!


there is a massive difference in YOUNG talent and Mature talent.

So what if we recruited better? They are YOUNG! Sometimes that matters a hell of a lot more in game situations.

Recruiting rankings by year for each school (state/KSU)...
2016 = 28th/72nd
2017 = 24th/61st
2018 = 27th/66th
2019 = 24th/62nd
4 year avg = 25.75/65.25

Every class is basically the same for us using rankings

[dantheman4248]

facts are hard to deal with I see.

And when you can’t deal with them some people on the board make them up.

[GeorgeKaplan]

You're so ****ing bipolar.

Blahahahaha!

Its funny because it is true!

[Coach007]

Recruiting rankings by year for each school (state/KSU)...
2016 = 28th/72nd
2017 = 24th/61st
2018 = 27th/66th
2019 = 24th/62nd
4 year avg = 25.75/65.25

Every class is basically the same for us using rankings

Once again.. It's more than just a friggin ranking. There are factors. But you do you. We suck.. Coach sucks and we must abandon ship. Same ole same ole.. Has been that way since I registered here.


Charles Cross a 5 star got beat by a SR from another team? Gee I friggin wonder why. After all... it's a FIVE star.... who happened to be playing in a college game, NOT HS, in fact what? His second game?


That whole Offense was made up of all SRs save the JR QB, FB, and 1 WR(Fr). And some of those SRs were 5th year. Vs Crumedy and Lovett.


Next.. Is Simmons still here? Why don't you remove the players not here and redo those rankings?

In fact, Durr, Thomas, Todd, Brown, Simmons, Couch, etc.. all gone from that class.

Objectivity my ass!

[msstate7]

Once again.. It's more than just a friggin ranking. There are factors. But you do you. We suck.. Coach sucks and we must abandon ship. Same ole same ole.. Has been that way since I registered here.


Charles Cross a 5 star got beat by a SR from another team? Gee I friggin wonder why. After all... it's a FIVE star.... who happened to be playing in a college game, NOT HS, in fact what? His second game?


That whole Offense was made up of all SRs save the JR QB, FB, and 1 WR(Fr). And some of those SRs were 5th year. Vs Crumedy and Lovett.


Next.. Is Simmons still here? Why don't you remove the players not here and redo those rankings?

In fact, Durr, Thomas, Todd, Brown, Simmons, Couch, etc.. all gone from that class.

Objectivity my ass!

How's that 11-1 prediction looking for you? You predicted 11-1... you thought we had great, elite talent. Now we lose a game, and you say it's bc we have no talent bc you must protect your coach. You're ridiculous. That 11-1 prediction should disqualify you from EVER questioning ANYONE'S "objectivity"

[Todd4State]

Once again.. It's more than just a friggin ranking. There are factors. But you do you. We suck.. Coach sucks and we must abandon ship. Same ole same ole.. Has been that way since I registered here.


Charles Cross a 5 star got beat by a SR from another team? Gee I friggin wonder why. After all... it's a FIVE star.... who happened to be playing in a college game, NOT HS, in fact what? His second game?


That whole Offense was made up of all SRs save the JR QB, FB, and 1 WR(Fr). And some of those SRs were 5th year. Vs Crumedy and Lovett.


Next.. Is Simmons still here? Why don't you remove the players not here and redo those rankings?

In fact, Durr, Thomas, Todd, Brown, Simmons, Couch, etc.. all gone from that class.

Objectivity my ass!

To your point- that's possibly why S&P takes returning players into account. In theory the more experienced you are "the better".

Which is why I heavily criticized Dan for leaving gaps in classes that have absolutely killed us in the past. If we can get a team basically of juniors and seniors- with the exception being maybe a special talent like a Jeffrey Simmons who can play and contribute at a high level as a freshman- that's how we take the next step.

[msstate7]

To your point- that's possibly why S&P takes returning players into account. In theory the more experienced you are "the better".

Which is why I heavily criticized Dan for leaving gaps in classes that have absolutely killed us in the past. If we can get a team basically of juniors and seniors- with the exception being maybe a special talent like a Jeffrey Simmons who can play and contribute at a high level as a freshman- that's how we take the next step.

S&p+ still says we're better than KSU. In fact, s&p+ has us better than 4 of the 6 teams Moorhead has lost to

[dantheman4248]

S&p+ still says we're better than KSU. In fact, s&p+ has us better than 4 of the 6 teams Moorhead has lost to

Does S&P+ account for the injuries and the "will they play this week" suspensions?

[dawgday166]

To your point- that's possibly why S&P takes returning players into account. In theory the more experienced you are "the better".

Which is why I heavily criticized Dan for leaving gaps in classes that have absolutely killed us in the past. If we can get a team basically of juniors and seniors- with the exception being maybe a special talent like a Jeffrey Simmons who can play and contribute at a high level as a freshman- that's how we take the next step.

We had all of that last year.

[msstate7]

Does S&P+ account for the injuries and the "will they play this week" suspensions?

FPI says we should've won
Recruiting rankings say we should've won
S&p+ says we should've won
Vegas says we should've won
Hell, you predicted we'd win 45-21

Why are you making excuses?

[ShotgunDawg]

FPI says we should've won
Recruiting rankings say we should've won
S&p+ says we should've won
Vegas says we should've won
Hell, you predicted we'd win 45-21

Why are you making excuses?

Because many Mississippians grow up with an inferiority complex and a lean towards submitting to authority. It's the same reason LT stayed in power for so long. Heck, we had tons of people complaining when Croom was fired.

It's a submissive group that doesn't think for themselves. They choose to be delusional instead of acknowledging reality.

[dantheman4248]

FPI says we should've won
Recruiting rankings say we should've won
S&p+ says we should've won
Vegas says we should've won
Hell, you predicted we'd win 45-21

Why are you making excuses?

I said if Tommy was healthy. I mean going from a 5th year senior to a true freshman in week 3 at QB... surely you can't expect me to have that clairvoyance. If you have it then go be Shawn Spencer the psychic detective.

Oh wait, you couldn't even see through someone posting blatantly false statistics earlier. And you supposedly watched the game?

For someone who talks about enjoying moments at MSU you sure like to use stats when it suits you, but don't let anyone else do the same against your narrative.

[msstate7]

I said if Tommy was healthy. I mean going from a 5th year senior to a true freshman in week 3 at QB... surely you can't expect me to have that clairvoyance. If you have it then go be Shawn Spencer the psychic detective.

Oh wait, you couldn't even see through someone posting blatantly false statistics earlier. And you supposedly watched the game?

For someone who talks about enjoying moments at MSU you sure like to use stats when it suits you, but don't let anyone else do the same against your narrative.

What stats are you using to discredit this post?

[msstate7]

I said if Tommy was healthy. I mean going from a 5th year senior to a true freshman in week 3 at QB... surely you can't expect me to have that clairvoyance. If you have it then go be Shawn Spencer the psychic detective.

Oh wait, you couldn't even see through someone posting blatantly false statistics earlier. And you supposedly watched the game?

For someone who talks about enjoying moments at MSU you sure like to use stats when it suits you, but don't let anyone else do the same against your narrative.

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?76356-KSU-Call-your-shot/page2

Post 31 is you, and you say nothing about if Stevens plays. Quit lying... you got so upset with biggun, and now you do what you accuse him of

[dantheman4248]

What stats are you using to discredit this post?

I'm talking about the 14/15 thread that by no measure is correct. I would hope that a proud statistician like yourself would combine your ability to savor the moments at MSU to know that was a lie. But you didn't. Because it fit your narrative.

[dantheman4248]

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?76356-KSU-Call-your-shot/page2

Post 31 is you, and you say nothing about if Stevens plays. Quit lying... you got so upset with biggun, and now you do what you accuse him of

Must have been the reddit post I said if Tommy was healthy on. Regardless, knowing that Tommy wouldn't be anywhere close to 100% and that Shrader would play almost a full half would clearly change my prediction. But I guess I'm the idiot for not seeing that coming when everyone on this board trumpeted up how healthy Tommy was and that he would be fine to play and that they were just being extra cautionary.

ETA: https://www.reddit.com/r/CFB/comments/d321bu/week_3_matchup_preview_thread_mississippi_state/ezya8hn/

It was the reddit post and it was where I talked my self from 45-17 to 45-24. My bad for getting the two sites messed up.

[Maridian Dawg]

I'm gonna have to see about 5 things Saturday to start to win me back.

1. Well prepared
2. Well disciplined
3. Distribute more evenly
4. Score at least 28
5. Limit "Check with Me's"

[timotheus]

you forgot preventing a DT from blowing up a play just after a check with me

[Coach007]

How's that 11-1 prediction looking for you? You predicted 11-1... you thought we had great, elite talent.

I did. Sucks to look at positive things?? We do.



Now we lose a game, and you say it's bc we have no talent bc you must protect your coach.


Point to where I stated we have no talent! Just anywhere... in any thread will do.

You won't be able to because I never stated we don't have talent.



You're ridiculous. That 11-1 prediction should disqualify you from EVER questioning ANYONE'S "objectivity"


That 11-1 is me picking my team in close games and stating that we will have the opportunity to win.


BUT, you do you. and I see you avoided the obvious. Redo the ranking and then measure up the experience. I helped with the 2016. Let me help with the 2017:

Where are these players:

- Gay (top recruit that year)
- Abrams
- Pope
- Autry
- Sweat

Who else?

[Coach007]

To your point- that's possibly why S&P takes returning players into account. In theory the more experienced you are "the better".

Which is why I heavily criticized Dan for leaving gaps in classes that have absolutely killed us in the past. If we can get a team basically of juniors and seniors- with the exception being maybe a special talent like a Jeffrey Simmons who can play and contribute at a high level as a freshman- that's how we take the next step.

If you add up the people gone from 2016-17 vs what he recruited, it's OBJECTIVELY obvious to those who actually want to be objective.

[Coach007]

FPI says we should've won
Recruiting rankings say we should've won
S&p+ says we should've won
Vegas says we should've won
Hell, you predicted we'd win 45-21

Why are you making excuses?

Vegas does not, and has never picked winners....

[Goldendawg]

I predicted 8-4 this year with 4-4 in the SEC. I never expected tutor-gate and BTW, who should be held responsible for this? Do we not have checks and balances in a multi-million $ operation where "student athletes" have help normal students don't have ? If we lose to Ky, 6-6 will be hard to achieve and a disaster in my opinion. Where are the big plays expected in this offense thus far? I saw my first game in 1963, and have been fortunate to have had season tickets for 50 plus years. I have seen many MSU coaches in that time and more losses than wins. I sat in the hot weather for the entire game against KSU and was never excited in what I saw on offense the entire game and never thought we were in control. Only 2 of my 8 family members even wanted to come and I had trouble giving away 5 of the 6 tickets to other MSU fans. MSU/KSU tickets going for $5 outside DWS for game three! I've heard enough excuses, beat who we are supposed to beat and be interesting, well organized, and competitive in all other games with an upset here and there. Hail State!

[Coach007]

They choose to be delusional instead of acknowledging reality.


OMG!!! LMAO!








Maybe it is just that people are actually rational and telling you you can't blame a guy for the former coaching errors.

[Todd4State]

S&p+ still says we're better than KSU. In fact, s&p+ has us better than 4 of the 6 teams Moorhead has lost to

Then why don't you use the more objective stat than use recruiting rankings to make your point?

[Todd4State]

We had all of that last year.

And we won eight games and went to a NYD bowl with two fairly impressive wins over Auburn and Texas A&M.

And we didn't really have "all of that". We started a sophomore at WR, both tackle spots which is very critical- not to mention both played out of their natural position out of necessity. None of whom were 4-5 star players. That's honestly too many even though it's just a few players. Kylin was a sophomore that started but he's a special talent.

On defense the only sophomores who started were Errol and Willie Gay and Gay is a special talent.

[Todd4State]

If you add up the people gone from 2016-17 vs what he recruited, it's OBJECTIVELY obvious to those who actually want to be objective.

Actually the biggest discrepancy is the fact that some of our classes are pretty JUCO heavy and a lot of those players are gone.

[Goldendawg]

And we won eight games and went to a NYD bowl with two fairly impressive wins over Auburn and Texas A&M.

And we didn't really have "all of that". We started a sophomore at WR, both tackle spots which is very critical- not to mention both played out of their natural position out of necessity. None of whom were 4-5 star players. That's honestly too many even though it's just a few players. Kylin was a sophomore that started but he's a special talent.

On defense the only sophomores who started were Errol and Willie Gay and Gay is a special talent.

Yeah, we benched a 1000 yd plus rusher who could pass block to start Hill. A very disappointing 8-5 season.

[Todd4State]

Yeah, we benched a 1000 yd plus rusher who could pass block to start Hill. A very disappointing 8-5 season.

Benched? We platooned both of them. Which was honestly the best way to utilize both of them.

[Goldendawg]

Benched? We platooned both of them. Which was honestly the best way to utilize both of them.

What were each players' number of carries for the year?

[Coach007]

Actually the biggest discrepancy is the fact that some of our classes are pretty JUCO heavy and a lot of those players are gone.

100%! I am all about being critical when need. I point to the 3rd and 2. Why pass with Hill and Shrader in the game? To be over the topic to the point of calling for the job of a man who has had little to do with the 85 people on that Roster is baffling. He can't help the gaps in a single recruiting class. He can not help that Love was forced to sit out by the NCAA. He can't help Simmons leaving early and WHAT coach in his right mind would ask a 1st rounder to stay?

Moorhead has identified the issues and addressed them. Our team, our coaches, and University deserve the respect and the support of our fans. There is plenty of time for the fire him crowd. It's not now.. why?

- because he is not going to be fired and no amount of bitching on a message board is going to change that. All this does is present to the public and recruits and PLAYER( don't believe they read... watch Stevens interview from this week on leaving PSU and the things he read from 'fans').

- he is showing signs of improving the status quo.


The fact is, Ms St and the fans should be family. You expect family to cheer you on and to pull for you. not 100% be a horses ass about every damn thing you do or don't do. "with friends like this, who needs enemies" applies here.

[RougeDawg]

Let’s just get this clear. No one here wants to see us lose. Some here are willing to watch the train go off the cliff, hoping it will not, even though the locomotive is blazing on fire and the tracks ahead are out.

Some of us here have the ability to see things for what they are. Be it the girl you used to date, but knew it never would last for very evident, glaring deficiencies. You tolerate it a little bit, because the crazy sometimes translates between the sheets, but deep down you know you can’t go on forever like this. At some point the very few exhilarating times cannot out weigh the glaring deficiencies and you know it’s time to cut bait. The girl attempts to prevent this by periods of acting differently than their normal crazy self. You think she has changed, but she goes back to full on batshit crazy and you cut your losses.

My friends, SloMo is that crazy chick in your life that taught you everything you do not want in a life mate. Until you come to that understanding yourself, you will keep enabling the behaviors.

[timotheus]

Dam rougedawg dun hit the nail on the head.....lookie there

[dawgday166]

And we won eight games and went to a NYD bowl with two fairly impressive wins over Auburn and Texas A&M.

And we didn't really have "all of that". We started a sophomore at WR, both tackle spots which is very critical- not to mention both played out of their natural position out of necessity. None of whom were 4-5 star players. That's honestly too many even though it's just a few players. Kylin was a sophomore that started but he's a special talent.

On defense the only sophomores who started were Errol and Willie Gay and Gay is a special talent.

If Aeris starts over "Mr. Special Talent" who ain't half the back JRob was, then Fitz has more than 1.5 secs to get rid of the ball (and I timed this in the KY & FL games) and is more comfortable in the pocket cause he ain't getting LBs helmets planted between his shoulder blades. And if the Savant can adjust some blocking schemes to account for someone like Allen that would've helped too. Fitz's best game was TAM, which is coincidentally the one Kylin was hurt for and Aeris started. That's the most comfortable Fitz was in the pocket all year.

If that happens then we probably win 3 or the 4 we lost and average points scored vs SEC close to or better than what we did in 2017, when the whole offense was nuthin but Jr & Sophs ... with only 2 Srs. With a QB that took the lead on Bama 3 different times ... BTW the only QB under Mullen who was able to do that.

Ever notice how our Oline coach ain't with his guys coaching them up and adjusting when the D is on the field?

[BB30]

Because many Mississippians grow up with an inferiority complex and a lean towards submitting to authority. It's the same reason LT stayed in power for so long. Heck, we had tons of people complaining when Croom was fired.

It's a submissive group that doesn't think for themselves. They choose to be delusional instead of acknowledging reality.

That could quite possibly be the most absurd thing I have seen on here and mighty rich coming from the person that has completely lost track of reality when it comes to Mississippi State Football. One day your talking about how good we are and then the next you are talking about how terrible everything regarding Mississippi State Athletics.

Walk around our campus during a regular day and tell me if you see a bunch of kids that are submissive and don't think for themselves.Visit some of the new corporations started by Mississippians in MS that have opened in the last decade. Some of the most forward thinking, intelligent, non submissive, people out there.

Talk with the great team responsible for all of the relatively new industry in the Golden Triangle area and see if they are submissive and don't think for themselves.

Your painting MS with a very broad brush simply based off of a college football team... that is pretty "delusional".