Carter Stewart signs with a team

[Todd4State]

He is signing with the Fukowa SoftBank Hawks of the Japanese League. I'm not joking. He went JUCO and his stock dropped and now instead of signing with the team he grew up pulling for he is going overseas. Whoever is advising this kid should be shot.

[BrunswickDawg]

I just saw that. Any idea what his JUCO starts we're like?

ETA - they were pretty good - http://www.efsctitans.com/sports/bsb/2018-19/bios/stewart_carter_jbwi?view=career&pos=p

Makes it more bizarre that he is going to Japan.

[InTheIttaBenaHotSun]

Sad to think what could have been...

[Leroy Jenkins]

Is he actually signing, or is this leverage for the draft? All I saw was he had agreed to a deal with the Japs, I didn't see that pen met paper.

[ShotgunDawg]

$ he gone get paid

[msstate7]

Kid should've taken the braves offer. I'm glad he didn't... his stock has crashed

[Irondawg]

surely he would wait for the draft right?

[Dawg2003]

Can't you get paid a lot of money if you are an American in the Japanese league? That's what I've always heard.

[Johnson85]

Can't you get paid a lot of money if you are an American in the Japanese league? That's what I've always heard.

A lot of overseas leagues will overpay for aging american stars. I suspect Japan is one of the better paying foreign baseball leagues, but I doubt he gets paid extra just for being an American when he hasn't established a name for himself. But I dont' know; maybe it generates some buzz for them to claim they signed a first round draft pick.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I'm starting to think those arm issues that scared the Braves off might still be an issue.

[msstate7]

I'm starting to think those arm issues that scared the Braves off might still be an issue.

Wrist issues

[drunkernhelldawg]

I doubt any of us would turn down a chance to travel the world and get paid for playing baseball.

[Todd4State]

I'm starting to think those arm issues that scared the Braves off might still be an issue.

Naw. MLB was about to offer him less than what the Braves were. His stock was dropping.

[Todd4State]

$ he gone get paid

Yeah but Japan? Now he's going to have to get posted to come back to MLB.

[KentuckyDawg13]

$7M

[msstate7]

$7M

Wow, good for him. How long?

[confucius say]

$7M

Per year?

[Really Clark?]

$7M

That?s the rumor of what he is seeking not what is agreed. And no way of knowing how much is structured as a bonus, that?s not going to be guaranteed salary

[Tbonewannabe]

So was there any chance at any point that he was coming to MSU or were we just the MLB leverage the entire time? Kind of like Lebron signing with Ohio St, there was always zero chance from his 9th grade year on that he wasn't going straight to the NBA.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Naw. MLB was about to offer him less than what the Braves were. His stock was dropping.

Did he not pitch well at JUCO or did scouts see something they didn't like?

[MetEdDawg]

This kid is taking horrible advice it sounds like. Sounds like a leverage play. Here's the problem. His stock will never be as high as it was last draft cycle. It can only go down from there and it has.

Japan isn't going to pay a foreign kid that much money to play baseball. Home grown kid maybe. But not Carter Stewart. MLB teams aren't going to go out of their way to chase a kid like that down and pay him a crap ton of money because of how deep this draft is with pitching and how much of a risk he might be.

I'll put money on it now. We don't see Carter Stewart in the majors ever.

[Johnson85]

Yeah but Japan? Now he's going to have to get posted to come back to MLB.

What does getting posted mean? Are Japanese players not treated like other international players?

[Tbonewannabe]

What does getting posted mean? Are Japanese players not treated like other international players?

Do you have to play overseas for a certain amount of time before you can go "free agent"? I am guessing there is a minimum service time or else Bryce Harper would have done it. He hit almost every loophole imaginable.

[BrunswickDawg]

This kid is taking horrible advice it sounds like. Sounds like a leverage play. Here's the problem. His stock will never be as high as it was last draft cycle. It can only go down from there and it has.

Japan isn't going to pay a foreign kid that much money to play baseball. Home grown kid maybe. But not Carter Stewart. MLB teams aren't going to go out of their way to chase a kid like that down and pay him a crap ton of money because of how deep this draft is with pitching and how much of a risk he might be.

I'll put money on it now. We don't see Carter Stewart in the majors ever.

Scott Boras is his agent. So, I doubt it is horrible advice, but it is definitely a leverage play.

[TNDawg35]

The kid went from being a top ten pick to end of 1st top of second round pick. To be honest, when he didn’t want to sign with the braves, he should have come to State. Now he will be lucky to play in the bigs. I thought when he decided to go to Juco it was a huge mistake.

[Really Clark?]

Do you have to play overseas for a certain amount of time before you can go "free agent"? I am guessing there is a minimum service time or else Bryce Harper would have done it. He hit almost every loophole imaginable.

He will be under the normal 10 year control system for that league but I’m sure there will terms in the contract for a possible earlier posting

[Homedawg]

He will be under the normal 10 year control system for that league but I?m sure there will terms in the contract for a possible earlier posting

20 mil buy out. He's getting bad advice. I don't care who his agent is.

[fishwater99]

https://sports.yahoo.com/american-draft-prospect-carter-stewart-142105193.html

$7 million per year. Wow..

[Really Clark?]

https://sports.yahoo.com/american-draft-prospect-carter-stewart-142105193.html

$7 million per year. Wow..

It’s not per year. He is looking for $7 MIL guaranteed contract, not $7 MIL per season

[Johnson85]

20 mil buy out. He's getting bad advice. I don't care who his agent is.

If he is concerned about his health and is getting around $7M guaranteed, when he was going to get what, $4M from the brave's offer? That doesn't seem like terrible advice. He'll be set for life when he's 22 and still have a chance to make the majors eventually?

I'm not sure I'd want to live in Japan long term, but it's not like he's going to Pakistan or something.

[Todd4State]

That?s the rumor of what he is seeking not what is agreed. And no way of knowing how much is structured as a bonus, that?s not going to be guaranteed salary

The rumor going around is top half of the draft as far as signing bonus. Top half varies between 3 million and 8 million is the top value. Based on the scale of slot values I'm guessing 3-4 million if the rumor is true.

[Todd4State]

So was there any chance at any point that he was coming to MSU or were we just the MLB leverage the entire time? Kind of like Lebron signing with Ohio St, there was always zero chance from his 9th grade year on that he wasn't going straight to the NBA.

No chance he was coming obviously. But a lot of guys do that so it's hardly just him. The difference is none of them expect to have to use their fall back plan.

[Todd4State]

Did he not pitch well at JUCO or did scouts see something they didn't like?

Velocity dropped some and seen as difficult to sign. Concern about injury issues.

[Todd4State]

If he is concerned about his health and is getting around $7M guaranteed, when he was going to get what, $4M from the brave's offer? That doesn't seem like terrible advice. He'll be set for life when he's 22 and still have a chance to make the majors eventually?

I'm not sure I'd want to live in Japan long term, but it's not like he's going to Pakistan or something.

He likely won't make as much long term in Japan. And may not even pitch in America now. MLB is where the money is. That's one reason why Japan's best come to America to play.

[BrunswickDawg]

20 mil buy out. He's getting bad advice. I don't care who his agent is.

Boras is known for pushing the envelope and being creative with how he creates leverage. He's been doing things like this for 30 years and has been highly successful at it. I don't think it is the right advice, but knowing Boras, he has a reason that he is doing it. With all the collusion over the past two winters (baseball, not politics), I wonder if he is looking at opening up the market in Japan as a more viable alternative or so he can drive change in the slotting rules. It's not the fist time he's done this with a 1st round draft pick - he did it with Brien Taylor and the Yankees in the early 90s.

[Todd4State]

Boras is known for pushing the envelope and being creative with how he creates leverage. He's been doing things like this for 30 years and has been highly successful at it. I don't think it is the right advice, but knowing Boras, he has a reason that he is doing it. With all the collusion over the past two winters (baseball, not politics), I wonder if he is looking at opening up the market in Japan as a more viable alternative or so he can drive change in the slotting rules. It's not the fist time he's done this with a 1st round draft pick - he did it with Brien Taylor and the Yankees in the early 90s.

This is the first time he has done this with a draft pick. Brien Taylor was nothing like this at all.

[Johnson85]

He likely won't make as much long term in Japan. And may not even pitch in America now. MLB is where the money is. That's one reason why Japan's best come to America to play.

He may not make as much if he turns out great, but it seems like he could do much better if he turns out mediocre. A good length career in Japan seems like it would be better than taking his signing bonus and minor league pay in the US while never making it to the majors.

I'm still questioning whether he will be stuck there for 10 years. If they really don't have a way for him to get to the majors sooner, then it makes me think they are way more concerned about his injury than they are letting on.

[BrunswickDawg]

This is the first time he has done this with a draft pick. Brien Taylor was nothing like this at all.


In 1991, Boras said that Brien Taylor, the No. 1 overall pick in that year's Draft, was considering going to Japan. Taylor eventually signed with the Yankees for $1.55 million, which was nearly three times the record for a signing bonus at the time. In 2009, Boras suggested that Stephen Strasburg, the Nationals' No. 1 overall pick, could explore the possibility of signing in Japan. Strasburg ended up getting just over $15.1 million in guaranteed money from Washington, easily topping the previous record of $10.5 million awarded to Mark Prior in 2001.

https://www.mlb.com/news/carter-stewart-pitcher-signs-japan

I know Taylor had other major issues - but Boras has made this play in the past. MLB teams may call his bluff on it.

[Todd4State]

https://www.mlb.com/news/carter-stewart-pitcher-signs-japan

I know Taylor had other major issues - but Boras has made this play in the past. MLB teams may call his bluff on it.

nm

[Homedawg]

Boras is known for pushing the envelope and being creative with how he creates leverage. He's been doing things like this for 30 years and has been highly successful at it. I don't think it is the right advice, but knowing Boras, he has a reason that he is doing it. With all the collusion over the past two winters (baseball, not politics), I wonder if he is looking at opening up the market in Japan as a more viable alternative or so he can drive change in the slotting rules. It's not the fist time he's done this with a 1st round draft pick - he did it with Brien Taylor and the Yankees in the early 90s.

apples vs oranges. and he's pushed the button the wrong way before more than once.

[Johnson85]

apples vs oranges. and he's pushed the button the wrong way before more than once.

Wasn't Boras the one that cost Alex Rodrigues huge money by having him opt out of his contract when the Rangers were still on the tab for a lot of it, and he basically had to come groveling to the Yankees for a lesser offer they were so pissed about it?

[Tbonewannabe]

Boras is known for pushing the envelope and being creative with how he creates leverage. He's been doing things like this for 30 years and has been highly successful at it. I don't think it is the right advice, but knowing Boras, he has a reason that he is doing it. With all the collusion over the past two winters (baseball, not politics), I wonder if he is looking at opening up the market in Japan as a more viable alternative or so he can drive change in the slotting rules. It's not the fist time he's done this with a 1st round draft pick - he did it with Brien Taylor and the Yankees in the early 90s.

The slotting rules need to be changed. It is screwed up that basically a 2nd round pick that is a senior will get around what a 30th round pick gets.

[msstate7]

The slotting rules need to be changed. It is screwed up that basically a 2nd round pick that is a senior will get around what a 30th round pick gets.

If they had to pay the guys according to where they drafted them, doubt seriously most college seniors would be drafted in spots like that

[vv83]

I don't get it, why would he go overseas? Wouldn't either entering the MLB draft or going to college (hopefully here or staying JUCO) be the better option both short and long term?

[Really Clark?]

Looks like he is getting a little over $4 MIL, not the $7 MIL he was asking

[Tbonewannabe]

3092

From Twitter

[msstate7]

3092

From Twitter

Go budaw on sps says tax rate is 56% over there. If so, I don't see how this is better than what the braves offered. I think some of this is carter saving face bc he knows he won't get what braves offered this season

[BrunswickDawg]

The slotting rules need to be changed. It is screwed up that basically a 2nd round pick that is a senior will get around what a 30th round pick gets.


3092

From Twitter

It's the slotting rules, the 6 year clock and and MiLB wages. I think this will be an interesting thing to watch play out.

[drunkernhelldawg]

One reason he may be looking forward to Japan is that he'll get farther away from all the people who know what it is he should do.

[Johnson85]

Go budaw on sps says tax rate is 56% over there. If so, I don't see how this is better than what the braves offered. I think some of this is carter saving face bc he knows he won't get what braves offered this season

I don't think that's right. Hard to say b/c there are so many overlapping taxes, but it looks life it would top out at maybe 55% on income not subject to an exemption/deduction according to this sorce, https://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2206.html

I'm not sure how the signing bonus is paid out, but with Georgia's income tax, he could have still ended up paying a 30%ish effective tax rate, so a big difference on the initial amount, but not enough to negate it. So in the rosy scenario of him going to the US, let's say on the first $4M, he gets $2M instead of the $2.8M he'd get in the US, and on the additional $3M, he gets $1.5M net, he still ends up $700k ahead and then gets to be a free agent three years sooner. That's all taking what Tbone linked to at face value, but seems like pretty much a no brainer unless he really doesn't want to live in Japan. And of course it's way batter than the scenario where he is a bust and doesn't get anything meaningful beyond his signing bonus.

[msstate7]

I don't think that's right. Hard to say b/c there are so many overlapping taxes, but it looks life it would top out at maybe 55% on income not subject to an exemption/deduction according to this sorce, https://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2206.html

I'm not sure how the signing bonus is paid out, but with Georgia's income tax, he could have still ended up paying a 30%ish effective tax rate, so a big difference on the initial amount, but not enough to negate it. So in the rosy scenario of him going to the US, let's say on the first $4M, he gets $2M instead of the $2.8M he'd get in the US, and on the additional $3M, he gets $1.5M net, he still ends up $700k ahead and then gets to be a free agent three years sooner. That's all taking what Tbone linked to at face value, but seems like pretty much a no brainer unless he really doesn't want to live in Japan. And of course it's way batter than the scenario where he is a bust and doesn't get anything meaningful beyond his signing bonus.

If he lives in US during offseason, will he be taxed by both countries?

[Johnson85]

If he lives in US during offseason, will he be taxed by both countries?

From a US perspective, he would be subject to extrajurisdictional taxation by the US, but he would get a credit for taxes paid in the foreign jurisdiction, so effectively no taxation. Banking and filing taxes will be a pain in the ass, but a 4 figure pain in the ass. Based on the two websites I looked at, Japan doesn't tax you on foreign earnings unless you are a permanent resident.

[Tbonewannabe]

If he lives in US during offseason, will he be taxed by both countries?

I think you have to be out of the country for 9 months out of the year for your income made abroad to be nontaxable. I am not a tax accountant but it seems like that was the rule at one time at least.

[dawgs]

https://es.pn/2JW5VEQ

Espn article on Stewart. As someone posted above, financially this makes a shit load of sense and could be a viable path for kids projected to go outside the first round especially. Being able to return as a FA by 25 is a major selling point. Obviously if he flames out, then he flames out, but kids flame out in the minors too, and he'll be clearing more $$ while he's flaming out in Japan.