MSU Baseball mid early season moves

[Todd4State]

Friday- Small
Saturday- Ginn

Earth shattering I know.

Sunday- Tyler Spring. We need to see what he can do because I think he's our best chance to have a conventional starter in the rotation.

Closer- Keegan
Relief ace- Cole Gordon
Set-up- Barlow
Self, Brandon Smith, Leibelt, Colby White in ONE INNING STINTS.

Midweek- Plumlee and the pen.

C- Skelton (shocking I know)
1B- Hatcher- really almost has to happen at this point.
2B- Rowdey Jordan. Makes more sense than Allen because he is more athletic and came up as an infielder in high school.
3B- Foscue
SS- Westburg

LF- Cumbest- gives us more power, speed, and as good if not better defense.
CF- Mangum (Shocking)
RF- MacNamee (Shocking)

DH- Allen. Even though he is slumping I still think he is a better offensive player than Halter.

Doesn't really re-invent the wheel but I'm essentially replacing Halter with Cumbest.

[bulldogcountry1]

Plumlee and James are really our only options on Sunday right now. Until someone else can pitch 4 good innings against a SWAC team, then they don’t deserve an SEC start. Nobody else had done that. Spring’s longest outing is 2 innings and Cerantola can’t hit the side of a barn. You know what you are going to get with Plumlee, and that's going to have to be good enough.

Is McLeod going to be healthy enough to pitch this year? He performed well in the fall.

I’m not ready for wholesale defensive changes, either. At the very least, it will require an adjustment period, and we still probably won’t be any better off. We just need to figure something out at 2B and go from there. I just don’t see Halter hitting SEC pitching, anyway. Put the best defender we have there and then see where we are.


For what it's worth, in pre-game warm-ups, the only guys working the IF are :

1B - Allen, Hatcher, Childers
2B - Halter, L Jordan
SS - Westburg
3B - Foscue, Gilbert

[Homedawg]

They tries Rowdey at second for a brief time. That got axed fast, so that's out.

[Homedawg]

As for Spring starting, it's not very close to happening, considering he wasn't on the active roster this weekend. 27 players and he wasn't one of them. Maybe it changes, but one can tell our confidence level on him isn't the super high when they took him out mid inning last week.

[AlSwearengen]

Concerning Spring, last week when he was pitching, he was doing o.k. I thought. Not tearing it up, but he was getting along fairly well with all things considered. Lemonis came out to the mound and seemed to be unhappy with what was going on and pulled Spring. He wasn’t in a bad jam and Foxhall hadn’t been out for a visit, so it seemed a little abrupt. I got the feeling that he was not making the coaches happy at all.

Maybe I am totally off base on this but it just seemed a little different.

[Scared_Hitless]

I honestly do not think Gunner Halter has played so bad that we need to disrupt our entire outfield. Cumbest is an impressive kid, but he is not ready to hit SEC pitching on a day to day basis. Allen is my biggest concern currently his defense is and continues to be a huge liability and it is affecting Halter, and now his bat has gone ice cold. I imagine we will take the Rowdey approach and let him work through it, but with Rowdey is a plus fielder so you can justify hitting .200

[Tbonewannabe]

I honestly do not think Gunner Halter has played so bad that we need to disrupt our entire outfield. Cumbest is an impressive kid, but he is not ready to hit SEC pitching on a day to day basis. Allen is my biggest concern currently his defense is and continues to be a huge liability and it is affecting Halter, and now his bat has gone ice cold. I imagine we will take the Rowdey approach and let him work through it, but with Rowdey is a plus fielder so you can justify hitting .200

Allen and Westburg are below SEC average defensively. When you hit the ball like Westburg then you take the good with the bad. Allen struggling makes his subpar defense stick out even more. Maybe let Hatcher play 1st and DH Allen if Hatcher is better defensively.

I will say that Halter replacing Stovall is why Halter isn't as impressive. Stovall might have been the best defensive 2nd baseman I have seen wearing the MS. Halter in the few plays at SS made some that Westburg hasn't been able to.

[Scared_Hitless]

Allen and Westburg are below SEC average defensively. When you hit the ball like Westburg then you take the good with the bad. Allen struggling makes his subpar defense stick out even more. Maybe let Hatcher play 1st and DH Allen if Hatcher is better defensively.

I will say that Halter replacing Stovall is why Halter isn't as impressive. Stovall might have been the best defensive 2nd baseman I have seen wearing the MS. Halter in the few plays at SS made some that Westburg hasn't been able to.

100% agree we have had Gridley and then Stovall at 2b the last few years they were so good we were spoiled. I think Halter is more than serviceable. Allen is struggling and doesn't have the athleticism or bat of Westy. I say shake it up or please at least drop him down the lineup.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Foscue can play 2b
Skelton can play 3b

That lets us just move Hatcher to 1b and get more quality bats in the game.

I'm not sure that Keegan is not the 3rd best starter...the other guys are way more scary. Spring needs a chance to start, if does not give up 4 in the first, he's hired

[Tbonewannabe]

100% agree we have had Gridley and then Stovall at 2b the last few years they were so good we were spoiled. I think Halter is more than serviceable. Allen is struggling and doesn't have the athleticism or bat of Westy. I say shake it up or please at least drop him down the lineup.

Gridley was very good, well above average and Stovall was Elite. Anyone following those 2 wouldn't look great.

[Homedawg]

Foscue can play 2b
Skelton can play 3b

That lets us just move Hatcher to 1b and get more quality bats in the game.

I'm not sure that Keegan is not the 3rd best starter...the other guys are way more scary. Spring needs a chance to start, if does not give up 4 in the first, he's hired

Foscue can play second. And Skelton can play third. But being able to and making us better are two different things. And those two things don't make us better anywhere. Actually worse.

[bulldogcountry1]

One thing that could help us immediately is for Westburg to not miss high on his throws to first. When you miss high, you have zero chance of making an out, and the runner typically ends up at second. When you miss low, it's and out over 50% of the time, and the runner rarely gets the extra base. That's what Gridley and Stovall always did, and it gives you a chance. He throws one into row 12 every weekend, and that can be eliminated.

Whoever the best defender is at first should be there. Maybe that's Allen, but the game is really fast for him right now.

[CadaverDawg]

One thing that could help us immediately is for Westburg to not miss high on his throws to first. When you miss high, you have zero chance of making an out, and the runner typically ends up at second. When you miss low, it's and out over 50% of the time, and the runner rarely gets the extra base. That's what Gridley and Stovall always did, and it gives you a chance. He throws one into row 12 every weekend, and that can be eliminated.

Whoever the best defender is at first should be there. Maybe that's Allen, but the game is really fast for him right now.

Hard not to miss high or low when you have a 5'8 first baseman that doesn't know how or when to stretch for the ball, and doesn't help our guys in the field at all due to poor foot and stretching technique over there. You put a decent first baseman with a 6 foot frame over there and you can probably cut Westburg's errors in half. I can't count the number of times we had an error and I thought, "damn Tanner, if you just reach up or stretch a little that's an out".

[Tbonewannabe]

Hard not to miss high or low when you have a 5'8 first baseman that doesn't know how or when to stretch for the ball, and doesn't help our guys in the field at all due to poor foot and stretching technique over there. You put a decent first baseman with a 6 foot frame over there and you can probably cut Westburg's errors in half. I can't count the number of times we had an error and I thought, "damn Tanner, if you just reach up or stretch a little that's an out".

He also doesn't dig them out of the dirt very well. I guess that is what you get when you move a 2B over to first.

[Todd4State]

Hard not to miss high or low when you have a 5'8 first baseman that doesn't know how or when to stretch for the ball, and doesn't help our guys in the field at all due to poor foot and stretching technique over there. You put a decent first baseman with a 6 foot frame over there and you can probably cut Westburg's errors in half. I can't count the number of times we had an error and I thought, "damn Tanner, if you just reach up or stretch a little that's an out".

This is my thinking as well.

[Homedawg]

He also doesn't dig them out of the dirt very well. I guess that is what you get when you move a 2B over to first.

Haha. It's harder to play second than it is to pick balls at first. Need to pick at second too. Tanner isn't a good fielder, agree. But he damn sure isnt a second baseman.

[Todd4State]

Haha. It's harder to play second than it is to pick balls at first. Need to pick at second too. Tanner isn't a good fielder, agree. But he damn sure isnt a second baseman.

I agree. I think he's an DH/OF type.

[Homedawg]

I agree. I think he's an DH/OF type.

There are only two explanations for Allen staying at first over Hatcher. And I'm leaving the positon of the lineup concerning Tanner part at our of this discussion. 1- they think Allen is a better 1b than Hatcher. Meh, find that hard to believe at this point but ok. 2- which makes way more sense, Hatcher really struggles with Lhp. If you start Hatcher at 1b and dh Allen you are stuck w hatch the entire game there. You can't take him out. We don't have another first baseman and you would lose the dh if you put Allen there. I get it, Allen is struggling at the plate and some will say just dh someone else. I do think Tanner is going to hit. He hit last year and this year he's cut his k's way down. So that's better. I don't think we are at panic point w him just yet.

[AlSwearengen]

I think Homedawg just figured out the Allen/Hatcher 1B/DH thing. Hatcher’s struggles against lefties.

[Tbonewannabe]

Haha. It's harder to play second than it is to pick balls at first. Need to pick at second too. Tanner isn't a good fielder, agree. But he damn sure isnt a second baseman.

While I agree, wasn't Tanner a 2B originally?

[Homedawg]

While I agree, wasn't Tanner a 2B originally?

He played ss in hs most of the time I think. We had him originally at 3b and Lf. He's too stiff and slow to play second. Never mind the turn at second. There is a reason our dp's this year have gone way down, one of course is we strike out a ton of guys. Second is we are so avg in the middle.

[Tbonewannabe]

He played ss in hs most of the time I think. We had him originally at 3b and Lf. He's too stiff and slow to play second. Never mind the turn at second. There is a reason our dp's this year have gone way down, one of course is we strike out a ton of guys. Second is we are so avg in the middle.

Halter looked pretty good at SS the few times I have seen him. Westburg just doesn't have very good range and he looks stiff. I wonder if they could move Westburg to 1st, Halter to SS, Rowdey to 2nd, and Allen to LF. That seems like it would be where they were more suitable.

[preachermatt83]

No on spring as Sunday starter... big no on keagan as closer.

[Homedawg]

Halter looked pretty good at SS the few times I have seen him. Westburg just doesn't have very good range and he looks stiff. I wonder if they could move Westburg to 1st, Halter to SS, Rowdey to 2nd, and Allen to LF. That seems like it would be where they were more suitable.

Halter has struggled playing second. Maybe he's more comfortable at ss who know. But, he played there in the fall and he made a ton of errors in kick at ss. They gave Rowdey a brief look at 2b. I'm pretty sure all those options are off the table. Heck those guys want to win way more than you and I. I'm sure they've thought of everything. Heck half or more of westy' series are throwing. He squeezes one too tight or air mails one, that becomes mental. He's a heck of an athlete. But he's a corner guy at the next level.

[Todd4State]

There are only two explanations for Allen staying at first over Hatcher. And I'm leaving the positon of the lineup concerning Tanner part at our of this discussion. 1- they think Allen is a better 1b than Hatcher. Meh, find that hard to believe at this point but ok. 2- which makes way more sense, Hatcher really struggles with Lhp. If you start Hatcher at 1b and dh Allen you are stuck w hatch the entire game there. You can't take him out. We don't have another first baseman and you would lose the dh if you put Allen there. I get it, Allen is struggling at the plate and some will say just dh someone else. I do think Tanner is going to hit. He hit last year and this year he's cut his k's way down. So that's better. I don't think we are at panic point w him just yet.

I think in general when Tanner is right and not struggling at the plate and the field he is the best option. But right now in the moment Tanner is not hitting either right or left handers and is playing poorly defensively and I think it's affecting the entire infield. So, yes, while Hatcher does struggle against LH hitters at this moment during the season all things considered he is probably the best option.

Now, that said I do think that at some point Allen will snap out of his slump too. And at that point I think you then maybe put him back out there. I think he just needs to rest/refocus at the moment like Rowdey did a week or two ago.

[Todd4State]

Halter looked pretty good at SS the few times I have seen him. Westburg just doesn't have very good range and he looks stiff. I wonder if they could move Westburg to 1st, Halter to SS, Rowdey to 2nd, and Allen to LF. That seems like it would be where they were more suitable.

That's a small sample size though. I'm not sure that Westburg can play first because I don't think he has ever played there before. While it may not be the most difficult thing to play there are still certain skills that a first baseman needs to do like scooping the ball out of the dirt. He may be able to do it but it's risky at best. I think they would try Cumbest because I believe he practiced there some in the spring if I remember correctly before they thought about trying Westburg but that would be after trying Hatcher.