THE HITCH

[shoeless joe]

I wasn?t going to start this thread but figgered what the hell...take from this long post what you will

After going back and forth with shotgun I have put a little thought and tried to pay attention to Rowdey and his swing. This hitch that everyone is talking about is merely his hand drop as he loads for the swing. It?s not ideal and it can cause issues, shotgun is correct here. But it?s not some terrible detrimental thing that no one can hit with...tho it?ll never be taught. Go back and watch video on a lot of the old timers, particularly ted Williams. Most of the guys that have this and are successful,even at the college level, are guys with athletic swings and they basically overcome this hitch. BUT typically there comes a point where the competition is so good that it gets harder and harder to overcome. If somebody is going to overcome it they must have good strong hands...and have a good top hand in particular. Otherwise they will drag the barrel thru the zone. What I imagine occurred in this instance is Rowdey was trying to correct his bat drag and got a little top hand happy causing his barrel to change and raise out of the hitting zone quicker. Which lead to consistently poor contact. Multiply that again with him being a switch hitter.

Where this argument has gone sideways is shotgun saying there was no FIX. Folks took that as him saying Rowdeys struggles couldn?t be fixed and he wouldn?t hit ever again because of this. What I think he meant, and did a poor job of explaining, is that the hitch itself couldn?t be fixed but if he got his timing and all other nuances back together he could come around but the hitch made that a more difficult process.

I do stand behind my original post on this topic. It can be fixed. It?s not easy because at this level guys have had succes doing things a certain way so the necessary buy in to a load remake is lacking. Usually the hands are merely calmed down which fixes a lot of issues. However I have seen guys, usually younger, that have corrected this swing flaw.

[Randolph Dupree]

Good post. Thanks for breaking that down.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Well Shotgun did say that the hitch was tough to fix, but having the hitch will mean that Rowdey would be streaky as hell. Not that he would never hit again.

All of this to say, the 1st 18 games Rowdey looked scared to swing and was a mess when initializing his swing. Looked like a folded up lawn chair.

[Cooterpoot]

LOL at these hitting threads.

[BrunswickDawg]

Good post. I haven't studied Rowdey's swing, so I won't speak to his particular hitch. But, having been a batter with a hitch (some will call it a trigger or loading mechanism), I can speak to what I know. My tendency was to have my hands high (think Jose Cruz) and drop into a loaded chest high position as the pitcher began his motion. It was a timing thing for me - as a I tended to be a dead pull hitter that liked to step in the bucket with my front foot and open too far resulting in a lot of foul balls down third. For me, moving my hands high added enough time and motion into my overall swing that I could reduce my tendency to open that front foot and yank my swing thru and drive it foul. Don't know why - it just worked. When I would get in a funk, it was normally because I had started dropping my hands down in my stance and started from a chest high or more traditional position instead of doing the Jose Cruz thing. I had coaches try to monkey with it all the time because "you have a hitch". Interestingly, it only worked batting RH. When I would flip over and bat LH, my stance was totally different. It was more Rod Carew, with a flat bat at shoulder height. I also taught myself to bat LH in high school, so it was a novelty more than anything. Of course, I was a .280 hitter in HS - so I'm not professional FWIW

[Gutter Cobreh]

With no disrespect to Rowdey, Mangum, or MacNamee but can we just acknowledge the improvement made by the three guys below?

The improvement is off the charts!


2018
Player avg gp-gs ab r h 2b 3b hr rbi slg% bb
Westburg, Jordan .248 42-31 121 18 30 11 0 2 30 .388 10
Foscue, Justin .241 58-48 187 24 45 12 0 3 20 .353 22
Skelton, Dustin .238 47-38 122 18 29 7 0 1 13 .320 13

2019
Player avg gp-gs ab r h 2b 3b hr rbi slg% bb
Westburg, Jordan .376 25-25 101 33 38 11 2 4 29 .644 14
Foscue, Justin .349 26-26 109 28 38 8 0 7 28 .615 11
Skelton, Dustin .338 22-19 74 18 25 2 1 5 20 .595 9

[ShotgunDawg]

I wasn?t going to start this thread but figgered what the hell...take from this long post what you will

After going back and forth with shotgun I have put a little thought and tried to pay attention to Rowdey and his swing. This hitch that everyone is talking about is merely his hand drop as he loads for the swing. It?s not ideal and it can cause issues, shotgun is correct here. But it?s not some terrible detrimental thing that no one can hit with...tho it?ll never be taught. Go back and watch video on a lot of the old timers, particularly ted Williams. Most of the guys that have this and are successful,even at the college level, are guys with athletic swings and they basically overcome this hitch. BUT typically there comes a point where the competition is so good that it gets harder and harder to overcome. If somebody is going to overcome it they must have good strong hands...and have a good top hand in particular. Otherwise they will drag the barrel thru the zone. What I imagine occurred in this instance is Rowdey was trying to correct his bat drag and got a little top hand happy causing his barrel to change and raise out of the hitting zone quicker. Which lead to consistently poor contact. Multiply that again with him being a switch hitter.

Where this argument has gone sideways is shotgun saying there was no FIX. Folks took that as him saying Rowdeys struggles couldn?t be fixed and he wouldn?t hit ever again because of this. What I think he meant, and did a poor job of explaining, is that the hitch itself couldn?t be fixed but if he got his timing and all other nuances back together he could come around but the hitch made that a more difficult process.

I do stand behind my original post on this topic. It can be fixed. It?s not easy because at this level guys have had succes doing things a certain way so the necessary buy in to a load remake is lacking. Usually the hands are merely calmed down which fixes a lot of issues. However I have seen guys, usually younger, that have corrected this swing flaw.

Outstanding post!!!

Perhaps I did a poor job of explaining it but we are on the same page now.

I don't think you can fix his hitch without instigating other issues. However, as he gets more ABs in the season, his timing and rhythm naturally gets better which allows his swing, bat speed, and athletcism to play.

You correct that many great players have a hitch in their swing but there is a fine line between a hitch actually creating more rhythm, which is good, and being a detriment to timing. For me, Rowdy's falls a little bit more the detriment lane.

[msudawglb]

LOL at these hitting threads.

Agreed. I had no idea that we had so many excellent hitting coaches on ED. Surely the world needs to know.

One post will say that the goggles changed his hitting. Another will say there's a hitch that makes his hitting broken. Well, goggles don't change a swing. And his swing is the same as it was last season. And its the same now that he's hitting again. Just enjoy the hitting and quit trying to prove how you're the greatest hitting instructor ever.

[ShotgunDawg]

Agreed. I had no idea that we had so many excellent hitting coaches on ED. Surely the world needs to know.

One post will say that the goggles changed his hitting. Another will say there's a hitch that makes his hitting broken. Well, goggles don't change a swing. And his swing is the same as it was last season. And its the same now that he's hitting again. Just enjoy the hitting and quit trying to prove how you're the greatest hitting instructor ever.

What a stupid post

[shoeless joe]

Agreed. I had no idea that we had so many excellent hitting coaches on ED. Surely the world needs to know.

One post will say that the goggles changed his hitting. Another will say there's a hitch that makes his hitting broken. Well, goggles don't change a swing. And his swing is the same as it was last season. And its the same now that he's hitting again. Just enjoy the hitting and quit trying to prove how you're the greatest hitting instructor ever.

There are several folks on here that know the game at a level where quality conversation can be had...I enjoy that. Just like the game itself, pay attention and those things can be picked up on rather quickly.

But also, like I said in another thread, nothing brings out the bigdickers quicker than a baseball conversation. After all, we were all bad asses in little league!*

[Lord McBuckethead]

Agreed. I had no idea that we had so many excellent hitting coaches on ED. Surely the world needs to know.

One post will say that the goggles changed his hitting. Another will say there's a hitch that makes his hitting broken. Well, goggles don't change a swing. And his swing is the same as it was last season. And its the same now that he's hitting again. Just enjoy the hitting and quit trying to prove how you're the greatest hitting instructor ever.

Well hell, might as well shut down the site then. No need discussing "sports" stuff.
We discuss it because dude was struggling. Shotgun, me, and others shared what we noticed about his specific situation and how that could impact his production.
Now that Rowdey has gotten into a groove, maybe we start talking about Tanner Allen. Along with Rowdey, Allen needs a productive weekend more than almost anyone on the team right now.

[Ari Gold]

I think I said it best
Give the kid 100 AB then let’s talk
Well he is at 96
And he is hitting .240 I believe

So let’s move on ..

[Commercecomet24]

There are several folks on here that know the game at a level where quality conversation can be had...I enjoy that. Just like the game itself, pay attention and those things can be picked up on rather quickly.

But also, like I said in another thread, nothing brings out the bigdickers quicker than a baseball conversation. After all, we were all bad asses in little league!*

Hear, hear! Nothing better than standing around talking baseball with people that know and understand the game. Great thing about baseball is there are more than one way to skin a cat. What works for one player may not work for another, that's why it's so important not to try and "cookie cutter" mechanics in hitting or pitching. Sure there are basic things you have to do but I've seen many different approaches be very successful.

[Dawgbite]

Probably has no bearing on Rowdy busting out of his slump but we did have a Sports Psychologist come into town Sunday to address the team.

[Todd4State]

Probably has no bearing on Rowdy busting out of his slump but we did have a Sports Psychologist come into town Sunday to address the team.

That psychologist needs to talk to Cerentola one on one.

As far as the hitch- stuff like that is usually more about comfort and trying to get timing down than anything. If a hitter is comfortable with that you usually don't want to mess with it to much. Usually it's a start sooner/later issue depending on the situation.

[Dawgbite]

That psychologist needs to talk to Cerentola one on one.

As far as the hitch- stuff like that is usually more about comfort and trying to get timing down than anything. If a hitter is comfortable with that you usually don't want to mess with it to much. Usually it's a start sooner/later issue depending on the situation.

And he doesn't even need to make eye contact with Jake, he is perfect just like he is.

[Cooterpoot]

I seriously doubt there are more than a couple guys that really understand everything involved with hitting. And no, the casual fan can’t watch a game and figure out what’s going on with a hitter. If you want to talk the same catch phrases that get tossed around by guys that believe they know something or charge $50 to hit a ball off a tee, or run some drill they saw at a Juco camp, then cool. But Ari has the best take in this thread in regards to Rowdy.

[Todd4State]

And he doesn't even need to make eye contact with Jake, he is perfect just like he is.

If anyone tells Jake to do anything they should be flogged in the town square.

[Todd4State]

I seriously doubt there are more than a couple guys that really understand everything involved with hitting. And no, the casual fan can’t watch a game and figure out what’s going on with a hitter. If you want to talk the same catch phrases that get tossed around by guys that believe they know something or charge $50 to hit a ball off a tee, or run some drill they saw at a Juco camp, then cool. But Ari has the best take in this thread in regards to Rowdy.

That's an oversimplification because I guarantee you that Rowdey and the coaches made some adjustments the past two weeks. It's not a game of just go up there and you will just hit 300 when the wash comes out.

[Cooterpoot]

That's an oversimplification because I guarantee you that Rowdey and the coaches made some adjustments the past two weeks. It's not a game of just go up there and you will just hit 300 when the wash comes out.

He did the exact same thing last season. The AU weekend was when he took off, just like this year. He just needed ABs to get it all worked out.

[Gutter Cobreh]

And he doesn't even need to make eye contact with Jake, he is perfect just like he is.

Jake can improve! I think if he readjusted his batting gloves one less time while in the box (just cutting it down from 6 times to 5 times), it would definitely help him get the barrel of the bat through the zone faster. He won't be able to hit .500 without the necessary bat speed and I think it's because his gloves are tightened too frequently!***

[fevans]

I found several old videos and verified that Rowdey did in fact have the the same exact hitch last year. As others have said, it's probably something he's done for a long time. I always thought his swing was a little different, but couldn't quite put my finger on it. At the time, I thought it had more to do with how in his starting stance he has his back elbow down.

In one of the videos, I noticed something very interesting. In it, he appears to start with his back elbow down initially just like he always has, but the so called hitch may actually be where he gets it up into firing position. If you watch the video below in 1/4 speed, you can see that the bat goes forward initially and when it goes back to the loaded position, his back elbow comes up at the end. From there, his swing looks pretty normal. I am no hitting expert but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express once. :cool:

Anyway here's the video. He also gets some work at SS in it. The hitting is at the end from both sides, but the left hand hitting is the best for "hitch" analysis.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqF_bAIPMsw

[msudawglb]

What a stupid post

You obviously don?t read your own posts.

[Todd4State]

He did the exact same thing last season. The AU weekend was when he took off, just like this year. He just needed ABs to get it all worked out.

I just disagree. He was worse this year at the beginning of the year than he was in 2018. Rowdey also struggled this summer as well. It was a major slump that went on for awhile. Last year I think his struggles early were more about being a freshman. A lot of our guys struggled until the Ole Miss series. This year I think Rowdey had either a mechanical and/or timing issue that Gautreau was able to recently correct.

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2018/plyr_4.htm

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2019/plyr_4.htm

[StarkVegasSteve]

Rowdey will be fine now. Lemonis talked to him last week about eliminating some personal distractions and what do you know....he's lit it up the last 5 games

[Cooterpoot]

I just disagree. He was worse this year at the beginning of the year than he was in 2018. Rowdey also struggled this summer as well. It was a major slump that went on for awhile. Last year I think his struggles early were more about being a freshman. A lot of our guys struggled until the Ole Miss series. This year I think Rowdey had either a mechanical and/or timing issue that Gautreau was able to recently correct.

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2018/plyr_4.htm

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2019/plyr_4.htm

You?re splitting hairs. He didn?t overhaul his swing mechanics. Some of us told you guys to wait until SEC play and holy shit! Look at that! A lot of guys made a huge deal out of absolutely nothing and now they?re trying to prove they?re right. He adjusted and got it straight. It?s not at all unusual to start a season slow for some hitters. I?ve never seen fans knit pick the hell out of every little thing like we do early season baseball.

[shoeless joe]

You?re splitting hairs. He didn?t overhaul his swing mechanics. Some of us told you guys to wait until SEC play and holy shit! Look at that! A lot of guys made a huge deal out of absolutely nothing and now they?re trying to prove they?re right. He adjusted and got it straight. It?s not at all unusual to start a season slow for some hitters. I?ve never seen fans knit pick the hell out of every little thing like we do early season baseball.

An I told you so post complaining about folks trying to prove that they are rite...interesting

[BuckyIsAB****]

He's a tough kid. I said it in the last thread, it would work out bc he is a dawg. Competitor and gritty. You dont do what he did last year as a Fr. and fall off the map like that. Tanner Allen too. Both will be fine

[Political Hack]

That "hitch" probably helps him against a fastball. Problem becomes keeping his hands back and hips back on offspeed stuff. IMO, it's easier to teach that than to screw with his timing. You want to see some god awful at bats, start messing with a kids timing and load.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Rowdey will be fine now. Lemonis talked to him last week about eliminating some personal distractions and what do you know....he's lit it up the last 5 games

Yep, need to get rid of that crazy ass girl friend when the season starts. Also, 17 as many randos as you can get with no strings attached during the season, but never during a weekend series.

[HooverDawg]

I just disagree. He was worse this year at the beginning of the year than he was in 2018. Rowdey also struggled this summer as well. It was a major slump that went on for awhile. Last year I think his struggles early were more about being a freshman. A lot of our guys struggled until the Ole Miss series. This year I think Rowdey had either a mechanical and/or timing issue that Gautreau was able to recently correct.

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2018/plyr_4.htm

https://static.hailstate.com/custompages/stats/bb/2019/plyr_4.htm

He was hitting .211 through 26 games last year. He's hitting .240 through 26 games this year.

[BrunswickDawg]

Yep, need to get rid of that crazy ass girl friend when the season starts. Also, 17 as many randos as you can get with no strings attached during the season, but never during a weekend series.

"Never 17 with a winning streak" - Crash Davis

[Todd4State]

You?re splitting hairs. He didn?t overhaul his swing mechanics. Some of us told you guys to wait until SEC play and holy shit! Look at that! A lot of guys made a huge deal out of absolutely nothing and now they?re trying to prove they?re right. He adjusted and got it straight. It?s not at all unusual to start a season slow for some hitters. I?ve never seen fans knit pick the hell out of every little thing like we do early season baseball.

I never said he did overhaul his swing mechanics. Just that our coaches helped him make adjustments.

[Todd4State]

He was hitting .211 through 26 games last year. He's hitting .240 through 26 games this year.

He also had a lower batting average for much of this year compared to last when comparing other games at the same point.

[Offshore Dawg]

Probably has no bearing on Rowdy busting out of his slump but we did have a Sports Psychologist come into town Sunday to address the team.

"He could of found a slump buster", there are always a few cleat chasers around.

[I seen it dawg]

Give him 100 ABs and relax - Ari Gold