SEC record post Stansbury (39-79) 33 percent winning percentage.

[Dawsonmsu]

Not sure what the future holds for our basketball program.

[Matty Dispatch]

Howland has basically gotten State back to where we were in the last 4 years of Stansbury: a .500 SEC team.

Stans last 4 years as coach (2009-2012):
23-13 (9-7)
24-12 (9-7)
17-14 (9-7)
21-12 (8-8)

Howland last two years:
25-12 (9-9)
16-6 (4-5)

State has had some good teams in the past, but it's not like we're some historical power that lost it's way. Stans had double-digit SEC wins 3 times in 14 years. He certainly did a lot better than the Rick Ray years and 1st two with Howland, but save for a few years in the early 00s when he was more focused on defense and rebounding, MSU basketball has at least regained it's place in the middle of the SEC - where Stans lived his in his last 8 years as head coach (average SEC record was 8.6 - 7.4).

[BrunswickDawg]

Howland has basically gotten State back to where we were in the last 4 years of Stansbury: a .500 SEC team.

Stans last 4 years as coach (2009-2012):
23-13 (9-7)
24-12 (9-7)
17-14 (9-7)
21-12 (8-8)

Howland last two years:
25-12 (9-9)
16-6 (4-5)

State has had some good teams in the past, but it's not like we're some historical power that lost it's way. Stans had double-digit SEC wins 3 times in 14 years. He certainly did a lot better than the Rick Ray years and 1st two with Howland, but save for a few years in the early 00s when he was more focused on defense and rebounding, MSU basketball has at least regained it's place in the middle of the SEC - where Stans lived his in his last 8 years as head coach (average SEC record was 8.6 - 7.4).

Kind of like Moorhead winning at the the higher end of what Dan did, but our fans being ready to string him up? At least we are consistent.

[Tbonewannabe]

Kind of like Moorhead winning at the the higher end of what Dan did, but our fans being ready to string him up? At least we are consistent.

Just wait until Lemonis loses in a Super Regional. If he doesn't win the national title there will probably be people on her saying he is a bust.

[BrunswickDawg]

Just wait until Lemonis loses in a Super Regional. If he doesn't win the national title there will probably be people on her saying he is a bust.

All that will take is losing a mid week game and an SEC series in the same week. Or god forbid, he bunts.

[Rick Danko]

All that will take is losing a mid week game and an SEC series in the same week. Or god forbid, he bunts.

After yesterday?s meltdown, I?m seriously considering taking a message board break for a couple of years. I love State and like to come here for information regarding State, but damn this board goes off the rails over the smallest thing sometimes.

[I seen it dawg]

I don't see how some of these people live their day to day if they are as negative as much as they are on here.

[AROB44]

After yesterday?s meltdown, I?m seriously considering taking a message board break for a couple of years. I love State and like to come here for information regarding State, but damn this board goes off the rails over the smallest thing sometimes.


So true....rep given

[I seen it dawg]

Not sure what the future holds for our basketball program.

Lol this should go well. Nice first post.

[Tbonewannabe]

I don't see how some of these people live their day to day if they are as negative as much as they are on here.

Hopefully this is just where they vent instead of the real world. If you need to blow up at somebody/something I guess this is the healthiest way to do it rather than ruin something in RL.

[Matty Dispatch]

Hopefully this is just where they vent instead of the real world. If you need to blow up at somebody/something I guess this is the healthiest way to do it rather than ruin something in RL.

I think it's a coping mechanism. They care deeply about MSU sports, and when it doesn't go well they want to see that they aren't alone in the anguish....so they go to message boards where other MSU fans are experiencing similar emotions. Same goes for winning - they want to enjoy it with other State fans. If you're not at college, single or attending the game, odds are you watched it by yourself or with a woman so this is a substitute for buddy time with your MSU friends.

[MedDawg]

Howland has basically gotten State back to where we were in the last 4 years of Stansbury: a .500 SEC team.

Stans last 4 years as coach (2009-2012):
23-13 (9-7)
24-12 (9-7)
17-14 (9-7)
21-12 (8-8)

Howland last two years:
25-12 (9-9)
16-6 (4-5)

State has had some good teams in the past, but it's not like we're some historical power that lost it's way. Stans had double-digit SEC wins 3 times in 14 years. He certainly did a lot better than the Rick Ray years and 1st two with Howland, but save for a few years in the early 00s when he was more focused on defense and rebounding, MSU basketball has at least regained it's place in the middle of the SEC - where Stans lived his in his last 8 years as head coach (average SEC record was 8.6 - 7.4).


PLUS Howland this season avoided losses to bad non-conference teams so we will/should make the NCAA's. Stans didn't make the NCAA his last few years and only made the NCAAs only once in his last 7 without winning the SEC tournament. Losses to bad non-conference teams cost Stans at least a couple NCAA bids.

P.S. I was pro-Stans up until his 2012 season collapse.

[Ari Gold]

Lol this should go well. Nice first post.

Hahahahaha... I’m embarrassed I even opened the thread

[Tbonewannabe]

PLUS Howland this season avoided losses to bad non-conference teams so we will/should make the NCAA's. Stans didn't make the NCAA his last few years and only made the NCAAs only once in his last 7 without winning the SEC tournament. Losses to bad non-conference teams cost Stans at least a couple NCAA bids.

P.S. I was pro-Stans up until his 2012 season collapse.

When Stans had good players that could help control the team then he was pretty good. He went off the rails when Sidney was on the team and either didn't have the team leadership to straighten it out or he was in too deep with Sidney to do anything about it. He rolled the dice that Sidney was the type of player to get him success in the tourney and it bit him in the ass.

[Dawsonmsu]

That is the equivalent to winning 2 1/2 games per season in football. The post Stansbury era has been a huge struggle in many ways.

[msu15]

That is the equivalent to winning 2 1/2 games per season in football. The post Stansbury era has been a huge struggle in many ways.

Nice to hear from you again Rick

[tcdog70]

9-7 isn't .500 ---we will be in great shape for NCAA with a 9-7 SEC record. Getting to the Stansbury Standard would be a good thing.

[Matty Dispatch]

That is the equivalent to winning 2 1/2 games per season in football. The post Stansbury era has been a huge struggle in many ways.

Your comparison to include Rick Ray's years in with Howland's rebuild is the equivalent to including the Croom years in with the first 4 years of Mullen and calling the post-Jackie Sherrill years a disaster. What happened from 2013-2017 has nothing to do with the last two years - which is the current state of MSU basketball, now that Ben Howland has had the opportunity to establish his mark on the program.

[Matty Dispatch]

9-7 isn't .500 ---we will be in great shape for NCAA with a 9-7 SEC record. Getting to the Stansbury Standard would be a good thing.

9-7 = 10-8

Since the SEC went to 18 games in 2013, there have been 10 teams to go 10-8 in conference play. Only 4 of them made the NCAA Tournament. Sounds about like being on the bubble. Sounds about like where Stans was from 2015-2012. Sounds about like where we are now.

[tcdog70]

9-7 = 10-8

Since the SEC went to 18 games in 2013, there have been 10 teams to go 10-8 in conference play. Only 4 of them made the NCAA Tournament. Sounds about like being on the bubble. Sounds about like where Stans was from 2015-2012. Sounds about like where we are now.

if we are 10-8 we are dancing.. so you admit 9-7 isn't .500 like you said--right?

[Matty Dispatch]

if we are 10-8 we are dancing.. so you admit 9-7 isn't .500 like you said--right?

Technically Stans was not a .500 coach his last 8 years. His winning percentage was actually .537. So, sure, you're right.

4 out of 10 SEC teams have made the NCAA Tournament with a 10-8 record. So it's no guarantee.

My point is that while many long for the days of Rick Stansbury, the facts show that the bulk of his tenure was just being a bubble team. That's really good considering MSU's history.....and that's where Howland has been able to get the program back to. Rick Ray was a failed experiment and we lost 5 years there where we could've been on the bubble probably every year instead of at the bottom of the SEC.....but that's over and we are basically back to where we were with Stans. So there's no sense in talking about Stans anymore. The 2002-2004 teams were actually outliers and not indicative of the bulk of his tenure, as he went away from defense and rebounding and instead relied more heavily on 3 point shooting and wasn't able to regain that success except for in 2008.....but even then we got an 8 seed.

[msstate7]

He just stated our actual record and said he didn't know what the future holds. Not sure what he said that was so negative

[Dawg61]

Just wait until Lemonis loses in a Super Regional. If he doesn't win the national title there will probably be people on her saying he is a bust.

It'll be 8 years before we know if Lemons commits are busts

[RocketCityDawg]

He just stated our actual record and said he didn't know what the future holds. Not sure what he said that was so negative

He included the Rick Ray years in with the Howland years. Surely, you don't think the Ray years have anything to do with what our basketball future holds. Do you?

[Liverpooldawg]

He included the Rick Ray years in with the Howland years. Surely, you don't think the Ray years have anything to do with what our basketball future holds. Do you?

The Rick Ray years showed us what our real base is without competent coaching. We have been there before. Now when we fired Stans, I was assured, direct quote, that anyone would do better. We found out better, as I knew we would. We need to hang on to Howland.

[Dawg61]

We can't learn anything from the Rick Ray era other than never hire the one application that was thrown in the trash by the secretary it was such a joke. I wish we could still fire Stricklin for that abortion of a hire. I could hire a better coach than Ray using only a walky talky as a point of contact.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Technically Stans was not a .500 coach his last 8 years. His winning percentage was actually .537. So, sure, you're right.

4 out of 10 SEC teams have made the NCAA Tournament with a 10-8 record. So it's no guarantee.

My point is that while many long for the days of Rick Stansbury, the facts show that the bulk of his tenure was just being a bubble team. That's really good considering MSU's history.....and that's where Howland has been able to get the program back to. Rick Ray was a failed experiment and we lost 5 years there where we could've been on the bubble probably every year instead of at the bottom of the SEC.....but that's over and we are basically back to where we were with Stans. So there's no sense in talking about Stans anymore. The 2002-2004 teams were actually outliers and not indicative of the bulk of his tenure, as he went away from defense and rebounding and instead relied more heavily on 3 point shooting and wasn't able to regain that success except for in 2008.....but even then we got an 8 seed.

We are the only fanbase in the country that could have a program with 10 reg season conference titles, 4 tourney titles and 10 dance appearances and say it has the worst history in the league.

[Liverpooldawg]

We can't learn anything from the Rick Ray era other than never hire the one application that was thrown in the trash by the secretary it was such a joke. I wish we could still fire Stricklin for that abortion of a hire. I could hire a better coach than Ray using only a walky talky as a point of contact.

We learned that "anyone" couldn't do better than a guy that had done more than anyone other than Babe and Dick.

[Dawg61]

We learned that "anyone" couldn't do better than a guy that had done more than anyone other than Babe and Dick.

Pretty sure you're misquoting C34 here. That is who you're attempting to lull outta hibernation here right.

[Bdawg]

It'll be 8 years before we know if Lemons commits are busts

Oh damn. Not again! ;)

[BrunswickDawg]

We are the only fanbase in the country that could have a program with 10 reg season conference titles, 4 tourney titles and 10 dance appearances and say it has the worst history in the league.

Well, except the fact that we only have 6 regular season SEC titles. And they are spread over 80+ years. It's good middle of the pack in SEC history. Those other 4 no one alive today is old enough to have seen.

And 10 times to the dance in 80 years is a little better then once a decade. It ties us for 9th in the SEC for appearances.

Our history isn't bad - and no one has claimed it is - but it's not as elite as many want to make it sound.

[Liverpooldawg]

Pretty sure you're misquoting C34 here. That is who you're attempting to lull outta hibernation here right.

Nope, direct quote, on another board.

[Matty Dispatch]

We are the only fanbase in the country that could have a program with 10 reg season conference titles, 4 tourney titles and 10 dance appearances and say it has the worst history in the league.

I never said it was the worst history in the league. Counting conference titles in 1912, 1913, 1914 and 1916 as part of your argument is pretty baffling. We've had TWO in the last 55 years. Our basketball power is the same as Ole Miss' football power: something that happened in the 1950s and early 1960s but that was a long, long, time ago and anyone who remembers it is either retired or dead.

Also, I'll say this: MSU men's basketball has 10 wins all time in the NCAA Tournament. Vic Scheafer has that many in the last 2 years. What we've accomplished is not exactly something special. Baseball at MSU is special, women's basketball has become special. Men's basketball has been competitive, but not special.....there are a ton of teams that have a Final Four banner.

[KentuckyDawg13]

https://www.elitedawgs.com/image.php?u=326&dateline=1365099012

[StarkVegasSteve]

I never said it was the worst history in the league. Counting conference titles in 1912, 1913, 1914 and 1916 as part of your argument is pretty baffling. We've had TWO in the last 55 years. Our basketball power is the same as Ole Miss' football power: something that happened in the 1950s and early 1960s but that was a long, long, time ago and anyone who remembers it is either retired or dead.

Also, I'll say this: MSU men's basketball has 10 wins all time in the NCAA Tournament. Vic Scheafer has that many in the last 2 years. What we've accomplished is not exactly something special. Baseball at MSU is special, women's basketball has become special. Men's basketball has been competitive, but not special.....there are a ton of teams that have a Final Four banner.

I'd call the run we had from 95-10 pretty damn special. It didn't necessarily equate to tournament success, but in that time we won at least a share of 7 division championship, 3 tournament titles, an outright SEC title, and a Final Four. Again parity in college basketball is so much greater than any sport. In football there's legitimately 10-15 teams that can win a national championship on a yearly basis. In women's basketball there's maybe 6, college baseball probably has 20-25 teams. College basketball on the other hand has between 45-50 teams that could win a national championship in a given year.

I've said it before and I'll say it 100 more times. The fans make basketball here special. Just like they've made baseball special here for generations. Hell, look at the women's team. They're good, but the fans showing up have made them a nationally relevant program. We had great players in those days with Dontae, Darryl, Dampier, and all the way up through Mario, Zimmerman, Power, Bowers, Roberts, Gordon and Rhodes. But the fans made it special, and they made it hell on opponents.

[Tbonewannabe]

Nope, direct quote, on another board.

Whoever said that was a moron unless it was taken out of context. Stans was a good coach who lost control of his program. Rick Ray wasn't qualified to be a Division 1 coach but for some reason loafers hired him anyway. Not a knock on Ray but unless you are coming from a high profile program like Duke, UNC, Kansas, or UK then you shouldn't be hired into a P5 program with no head coaching experience.

Hiring Rick Ray would have been like if we replace Mullen with the Offensive Coordinator from Miami OH. The guy had zero job offers for even small schools. He got the SEMO job just because he was MSU head coach. Without us on his resume' then he would be a normal assistant coach somewhere else.

[Dawg61]

Ray's D1 record is 71-119. Unreal this dude has gotten rich off being a coach. He's 17ing awful at it.

[I seen it dawg]

Yeah

[Matty Dispatch]

I'd call the run we had from 95-10 pretty damn special. It didn't necessarily equate to tournament success, but in that time we won at least a share of 7 division championship, 3 tournament titles, an outright SEC title, and a Final Four. Again parity in college basketball is so much greater than any sport. In football there's legitimately 10-15 teams that can win a national championship on a yearly basis. In women's basketball there's maybe 6, college baseball probably has 20-25 teams. College basketball on the other hand has between 45-50 teams that could win a national championship in a given year.


Well, you can pick out any span of years and make them look good. That 16 year stretch was solid. The 27 year period from 1964-1990 was pretty bad.

The point is, there are some schools that have a long history of success, thus a dedicated fanbase that demands that success continue because that's the reason they are fans of that school. Kentucky basketball, Ohio State football, etc. Mississippi State basketball and football have pockets of success and also stretches of mediocrity, so the fans just kind of hope for the best and prepare for the worst. In baseball it's different, the fanbase expects success and won't tolerate losing for more than maybe one year at a time. The 1995-2010 relatively sustained level of success had a lot of people thinking MSU basketball had taken the next step for the long term, but it wasn't true. The fans, as you say, are what makes a program special because they drive the expectation level. MSU fans do not demand success in basketball.....because was have not had that much national success. You can frame it any way you want to, but we aren't near the top 25 in historical NCAA Tourney success. The fans don't sell out the Hump or get all that excited about it and they won't because really 2004 is the only year in the history of MSU basketball where it felt like we could win a national title while the regular season was being played.