John Cohen, it's time for you to do your job

[CadaverDawg]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

[ShotgunDawg]

Cohen grew up a Bama fan. Not sure why he?d care. He accepted the SEC pecking order at a young age.

Mind boggling how mismanaged things are right now

A complete embarrassment to our school.

I hope season tickets suffer so people in power are held accountable

[RougeDawg]

If he isn?t in the phone this week, wearing out the SEC office he needs to find retirement next week m. No excuse

[WinningIsRelentless]

Y?all are some dumb@@@&&. This happens everyday in every business and in sports. You do your damn job by going and finding the next good coaches. God we have a fanbase full of crying !!!!!!!.

[dawgday166]

Guys I have one question due to the Baker MSU contract terms Bama ain't happy with. Apparently Cohen tried to lock him in and make him more un-poachable but Bama has DEEP pockets.

My question: Do y'all know for a fact that our coaches are underpaid at all (to include outside non-State of Mississippi funds)?

Just asking cause I have no clue and everybody seems to want to fire ADs right and left, regardless of who they are from my observations.

[RougeDawg]

Y?all are some dumb@@@&&. This happens everyday in every business and in sports. You do your damn job by going and finding the next good coaches. God we have a fanbase full of crying !!!!!!!.

Not sure what business you are in but I do know you aren?t successful in it from your response.

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn’t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .

[msstatelp1]

If are a football coach that wants to advance and Nick Saban offers you a job, you take it. He is currently considered the best HC in CFB and having his name on your resume puts you above all those that don't.

[K9 Avenger]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

Maybe it?s not the money.....and, if not, that?s worse. John?s a smart guy...if all it?s about is money, that?s a relatively simple fix. With 4 coaches now gone.....makes me wonder....

[CadaverDawg]

If are a football coach that wants to advance and Nick Saban offers you a job, you take it. He is currently considered the best HC in CFB and having his name on your resume puts you above all those that don't.

You don't take less pay to do it. Pay them more than they're worth. Hell, look at what Clemson did with Venebles, and I'd say it was worth the $

[dawgday166]

If he isn?t in the phone this week, wearing out the SEC office he needs to find retirement next week m. No excuse

This does need to happen IMO. I'm a fair market/capitalism guy but with regard to the US economy there are antitrust laws in place to prevent monopolies and I'm starting to think something similar needs to happen in CFB to some extent. Not sure how far to go, but Saban is getting ridiculous in the shit he does.

[yjnkdawg]

Cohen grew up a Bama fan. Not sure why he?d care. He accepted the SEC pecking order at a young age.

Mind boggling how mismanaged things are right now

A complete embarrassment to our school.

I hope season tickets suffer so people in power are held accountable




Some more BS

[MetEdDawg]

Ask Cohen to bitch to the SEC? No wonder our fan base doesn't get it. What the hell is the SEC going to do?

It's money people. If we want this crap to end we need more money. And a lot of it. Until we all step up and donate more and find others who are willing to donate more it's not going to matter

[ShotgunDawg]

Regardless of the reasons, MSU how NO CHANCE, of building a nationally competitive program with this happening.

Not sure what the answer is, but, if those in power can't c find one, then we need new people in power.

[CadaverDawg]

Maybe it?s not the money.....and, if not, that?s worse. John?s a smart guy...if all it?s about is money, that?s a relatively simple fix. With 4 coaches now gone.....makes me wonder....

Good point

And to those saying "this happens to everyone"....not a whole staff after one underachieving year. No it doesn't. This is a problem, and we aren't going to be able to keep batting a thousand on these replacement hires every year.

[ShotgunDawg]

Some more BS


He's from Tuscaloosa and grew up a Bama football fan.

[Todd4State]

Why don't we just hire a better defensive line coach?

[WinningIsRelentless]

Not sure what business you are in but I do know you aren?t successful in it from your response.

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn’t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .

Successful companies are scared of top talent leaving because they know they can go find someone else.

You see sometimes the perceived value on the outside is more than perceived value on the inside.

[CadaverDawg]

Why don't we just hire a better defensive line coach?

We'll try. And if we succeed we'll be replacing him this time next year and losing the recruits he's bringing in.

[yjnkdawg]

He's from Tuscaloosa and grew up a Bama football fan.


He's loyal to MSU. Book it.

[Todd4State]

Good point

And to those saying "this happens to everyone"....not a whole staff after one underachieving year. No it doesn't. This is a problem, and we aren't going to be able to keep batting a thousand on these replacement hires every year.

I'd worry if they weren't taking "better" jobs. We're losing guys to the NFL and Bama.

[BrunswickDawg]

You don't take less pay to do it. Pay them more than they're worth. Hell, look at what Clemson did with Venebles, and I'd say it was worth the $

2017 - We are overpaying Mullen to keep him! Let him go, we can find another!

2019 - Overpay assistants so we can keep them!!!!

[RougeDawg]

Ask Cohen to bitch to the SEC? No wonder our fan base doesn't get it. What the hell is the SEC going to do?

It's money people. If we want this crap to end we need more money. And a lot of it. Until we all step up and donate more and find others who are willing to donate more it's not going to matter

Haha Haha Haha are you this naive? You don?t think coaches/ADs complaining to the SEC office has an impact? Dillon Day disagrees.

[Todd4State]

We'll try. And if we succeed we'll be replacing him this time next year and losing the recruits he's bringing in.

That seems to be how the coaching industry is. The Joe Paterno's and Bear Bryant's don't exist anymore. I'd guess the career span of a head coach is only about 5-6 years.

[BrunswickDawg]

He's from Tuscaloosa and grew up a Bama football fan.

{Black helicopter floats overhead}

[Gutter Cobreh]

Not sure what business you are in but I do know you aren?t successful in it from your response.

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn’t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .

Care to share why Bama, the most successful program in the last decade, has vacancies they need to fill? Wouldn't they have locked up their "top talent"? Otherwise, they wouldn't be hiring correct?

Your rention plan theory sounds great, but it isn't practical. Ambition drives people, and it doesn't follow the company plan.

[RougeDawg]

Why don't we just hire a better defensive line coach?

We could have a wet paper bag coaching DL and be great. Saban is trying to disrupt this recruiting class because he is scared. The DL talent in Mississippi would make any coach look great. Just look at the nfl rosters.

This is about Saban trying to disrupt what he sees as his biggest threat in the West.

[Todd4State]

2017 - We are overpaying Mullen to keep him! Let him go, we can find another!

2019 - Overpay assistants so we can keep them!!!!

I agree. We need to figure out if we actually are underpaying our coaches or not before we declare that as the issue. I do believe that we have the resources to pay coaches more than we are based on Dan and what we were willing to pay him.

[LC Dawg]

If are a football coach that wants to advance and Nick Saban offers you a job, you take it. He is currently considered the best HC in CFB and having his name on your resume puts you above all those that don't.

Dabo is currently the best HC in CFB. He keeps coaches and beats Saban and Saban can't keep coaches because he's a dick. That's what is driving the issue being discussed.
I do agree, though, that having Bama on your coaching resume is a big plus.

[preachermatt83]

What has John done that was above average since being AD? Serious question cause the only thing I can think of is paying Vic big money. I think LeMo will end up being a great hire but his handling of he baseball search as a whole was a joke. I like John so I'm hoping I'm missing something but I just don't see what he's done that's anything above average.

[yjnkdawg]

Not sure what business you are in but I do know you aren?t successful in it from your response.

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn’t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .


LOL A response on a message board makes a person unsuccessful in their own business ventures. If that were the case then several on here would be on the unemployment line.

[timotheus]

We could have a wet paper bag coaching DL and be great. Saban is trying to disrupt this recruiting class because he is scared. The DL talent in Mississippi would make any coach look great. Just look at the nfl rosters.

This is about Saban trying to disrupt what he sees as his biggest threat in the West.

Spot on rougedawg.

[CadaverDawg]

Maybe we should just accept that 6+ wins should be a great year for MSU going forward, and just forget about ever competing at a high level. Then we wouldn't care about coaches leaving and recruits decommitting, and the MSU fanbase would never have to hear negativity...and I could get back my Saturday's during the fall and the money I pump into MSU. Because the way things are now, this is only the beginning of this type of stuff.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

Where do you think money comes from? Do you think he's sitting on millions in cash? Do you think we paid Lemonis $3M and that's where the money went??

WE DON'T HAVE THE MONEY

It's that simple. It's up to the boosters how much we can pay coaches. If you want to say Cohen sucks at fundraising you can, though you'll need to show me the numbers proving he's worse than the previous AD's. The fact is we're poor. Maybe Cohen's worse fundraising is costing us a million or so a year, but even that is a joke compared to Bama.

14 months ago we supposedly had the boosters ready to give out $6M to keep Dan. Joe makes less tan half that. Assistants don't make 3M more than they did under Dan. Lemones can't be making more than 200k more than Cann was, so that's not where the money went. It appears to me like the Boosters were willing to shell out for Dan, but pulled back their total contributions for Joe. I blame them far more than Cohen

[dawgday166]

Care to share why Bama, the most successful program in the last decade, has vacancies they need to fill? Wouldn't they have locked up their "top talent"? Otherwise, they wouldn't be hiring correct?

Your rention plan theory sounds great, but it isn't practical. Ambition drives people, and it doesn't follow the company plan.

Cause Saban is the hardest m'fer in CFB to work for. Enos packed his bags and left without telling him he was leaving. At next meeting Saban supposedly said "Where the f*** is Dan?"

[I seen it dawg]

Sorry to do this....
Bama football in playoff every year
Bama football top talent 1-85
Bama has Saban to put on a resume.
State football is not Bama football.

Unless it is a very unusual circumstance and you're Pat Fitzgerald you have no true loyalty to a school. It's a job for these guys.

Why are any of you shocked, surprised, angry coaches leave any school? Is it hard to understand? Has anyone ever looked to see how many alumni actually coach at the schools they went to?

I hate to see Baker leave but shit it's not like he grew up in Starkville and went to State. Until all the money from state alums gets serious, and not just puffing sizzle chests and yapping about it, about building a Clemson we will be what we are right now. 6-9 win SEC football program.

[MetEdDawg]

Haha Haha Haha are you this naive? You don?t think coaches/ADs complaining to the SEC office has an impact? Dillon Day disagrees.

When it comes to programs hiring positional coaches away from others is the actual question here. And no they aren't going to do shit.

[Cooterpoot]

Y?all are some dumb@@@&&. This happens everyday in every business and in sports. You do your damn job by going and finding the next good coaches. God we have a fanbase full of crying !!!!!!!.

Yeah, we?ve all got faith in Cohen to do that. LOL, he bungled the hires all over the place already. He?s refurbing seats in a new stadium, and underpaying coaches. Good luck.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Cause Saban is the hardest m'fer in CFB to work for. Enos packed his bags and left without telling him he was leaving. At next meeting Saban supposedly said "Where the f*** is Dan?"

I guess that's why Sarkisian is retuning right? Stop regurgitating nonsense.

[I seen it dawg]

What has John done that was above average since being AD? Serious question cause the only thing I can think of is paying Vic big money. I think LeMo will end up being a great hire but his handling of he baseball search as a whole was a joke. I like John so I'm hoping I'm missing something but I just don't see what he's done that's anything above average.

Outside of your perception how was the baseball search a joke? We got a young up and comer who apparently has good references. One you keep posting is gonna be awesome. Did he just call up Cohen and say hey I'm lemonis you should hire me and Cohen said sounds good? To me it played out not a joke.

[bluelightstar]

Don’t we have the longest drought against Alabama in the SECW? Yeah I’m sure Saban sees us a huge threat

[RougeDawg]

Care to share why Bama, the most successful program in the last decade, has vacancies they need to fill? Wouldn't they have locked up their "top talent"? Otherwise, they wouldn't be hiring correct?

Your rention plan theory sounds great, but it isn't practical. Ambition drives people, and it doesn't follow the company plan.

Your ability to logically reason is lacking. Let?s compare Mississippi state to other middle tier programs and Bama to Clemson and other too 5 programs.

Your logic is comparing apples to lava rocks. Get back to me when You correct f the mindset.

[Bothrops]

We could have a wet paper bag coaching DL and be great.

We had a wet paper bag in the shape of a Peter. It didn't do what it was supposed to.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

This is the same guy that tried to save money on a chartered flight and cost us two days of Bowl prep because the cheap airline didn?t have a plane ready ....

[RougeDawg]

He's loyal to MSU. Book it.

As they say. Actions speak louder than words. Inactions count as actions.

[I seen it dawg]

A question...give some reasons why Baker shouldn't leave State?

[dawgday166]

I guess that's why Sarkisian is retuning right? Stop regurgitating nonsense.

Sarkisian has very few options. I don't see a line of ADs or NFL GMs waiting to offer him OC positions.

ETA: I think Saban also may have somewhat limited options here (self imposed). His inherent offensive philosophy clashes with modern day OCs and he's struggling some to find that balance. He's trying to make the transition and he finding it difficult.

[CadaverDawg]

A question...give some reasons why Baker shouldn't leave State?

Definitely not a big ole pay check that we could be paying him. So absolutely nothing. Yes, Bama is great, but these guys wouldn't go to Bama for a pay cut....If we want to make another step, we have to either use/find the money to pay the great coaches we get, OR admit that 7-8 wins with an occasional 9 is the absolute ceiling going forward and lower any and all expectations. It's pretty simple.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

He's from Tuscaloosa and grew up a Bama football fan.

This is the dumbest take I've ever seen from you SD. John Cohen grew up a Bama fan, went to college here, played baseball here, left a solid Kentucky job to be our HC, and pushed hard to be our AD, and your take is that he's INTENTIONALLY HARMING MSU SPORTS TO HELP BAMA? Really? this is akin to saying Fitz intentionally threw the '17 UGA game because he grew up in Georgia. Your logic is so so so dumb. Literally it makes less sense than accusing Johnson of intentionally sucking to bring us down, yet nobody says that.

we have 4 options all far more plausible than what you suggest: 1) Boosters just won't contribute enough to have competitive salaries, 2) Moorhead is a sinking ship and people want to leave rather than be tied to him, 3) All these coaches left for better jobs and the high number leaving is just a coincidence, and 4) Cohen is simply incompetent. All FAR more reasonable than "The guy who played and coached and is the current AD at State is trying to help Bama!"

[LC Dawg]

Cohen just signed Baker to a contract extension. Unless he paid him way more than he was worth I don't know what else he could have done. I don't know the salaries of every DL coach in the league but I would guess Bama could easily give every one of them a raise. Including Orgeron.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Not sure what business you are in but I do know you aren?t successful in it from your response.

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn?t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .


Care to share why Bama, the most successful program in the last decade, has vacancies they need to fill? Wouldn't they have locked up their "top talent"? Otherwise, they wouldn't be hiring correct?

Your rention plan theory sounds great, but it isn't practical. Ambition drives people, and it doesn't follow the company plan.


Your ability to logically reason is lacking. Let?s compare Mississippi state to other middle tier programs and Bama to Clemson and other too 5 programs.

Your logic is comparing apples to lava rocks. Get back to me when You correct f the mindset.

So let me get this straight, in your first post you said a successful business has a retention plan to keep top talent. I replied and said that doesn't factor in a person's ambition and used Bama as an example of a successful business who has had massive turnover. Now you want to take a pot shot and hurl insults and state that we should compare ourselves to mid-tier programs.

Keep taking personal shots when you are proven wrong or try to move the goal posts within the discussion if you want. You're obviously melting so anything logical being said right now will only be met with emotion from you.

[ShotgunDawg]

Cohen just signed Baker to a contract extension. Unless he paid him way more than he was worth I don't know what else he could have done. I don't know the salaries of every DL coach in the league but I would guess Bama could easily give every one of them a raise. Including Orgeron.

It?s not your job to know what he could?ve done but it?s his job to figure that out.

MSU?s nuts have been severed in this recruiting cycle

[TUSK]

I don't know that paying coaches more money is a catch-all solution... Bammer pays their coaches a good bit more than most programs and it's coaching staff gets poached waaaaay more than anyone else's...

I would love to see the SEC step in and stop the intra-conference coachin' poachin'....

[yjnkdawg]

A question...give some reasons why Baker shouldn't leave State?



These coaches don't have any allegiance to MSU. They didn't grow up cheering and ringing a cowbell for MSU. If they make a move then they are doing so because they think it's best for their family and career. If some don't don't think a coaching move to Bama, even what some would call a lateral move, is looked upon as a more prestigious position nationally, then they need to find another hobby (other than posting on a message board), because reality has left them. And Bama can pay whatever they need to get a coach, and those who think we can compete on the money side are lacking in reality too.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/index.ssf/2018/05/alabama_adds_an_assistant_coac.html

Bama paid the last DL coach $750,000.

http://www.cdispatch.com/sports/article.asp?aid=70804

Baker, pre new contract, was making $375,000.

AD's love to hire former Saban assistants.

Bama has a far easier time recruiting top talent

So at Bama he will make a LOT more money, be in a better position to get promoted, and will have an easier time looking like a great DL coach.

1) Why on earth would he stay, and 2) do you really expect John to come up with Bama levels of money? Loafers couldn't do it, and neither could Byrne.

But yeah lets conclude that Cohen is terrible at his job at best and intentionally helping Bama at worst. And if we aren't drawing those conclusions about Cohen we'll say Moorhead has lost control because his staff are getting undeniably better job offers.

Get your heads out of you asses people. I get this sucks and we're emotional, but sometimes there's no clear person to blame. Our boosters are either relatively poor or have always been stingy no matter the AD. That's not Moorheads or Cohens fault. Really though what do you want them to do? Moorhead can't give them more money, Cohen can't give salaries the boosters won't pay for. If you say it's Cohens' job to raise funding then we have to levy the same criticism at literally ever AD we've ever had.

This isn't sunshine pumping. It's math. We don't have the money to compete. it's actually a far more depressing view than blaming a few fireable people. And it's because it's so final and demoralizing that so many of you can't accept it

[TUSK]

Any of yall seeing confirmation that Baker has accepted the job at Bammer? I've seen/heard that a couple of places.

[Cooterpoot]

Brian Baker is never going to be a HC or DC. He took the money.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Any of yall seeing confirmation that Baker has accepted the job at Bammer? I've seen/heard that a couple of places.

No

[BuckyIsAB****]

If he does leave, and thats IF. How any of you can blame Cohen is beyond me. The guy just signed him to an extension. What do you want John to do? Lock him in the football building?

[TUSK]

No

You're likely more plugged in than I... Logan Lowery (Daily Journal) and BOL reporting it...

[Homedawg]

I'd worry if they weren't taking "better" jobs. We're losing guys to the NFL and Bama.

This. And nobody had a problem w us sniping a coach from Oregon during recruiting. What's good for the goose.....it sucks but a phone call to the commissioner isn't going to solve it.

[ShotgunDawg]

If he does leave, and thats IF. How any of you can blame Cohen is beyond me. The guy just signed him to an extension. What do you want John to do? Lock him in the football building?

I see what you’re saying but it’s his responsibility at the end of the day. No one ever said being an AD at MSU is easy. We need someone that CAN solve these issues and Cohen is proving he cannot.

[sandwolf]

We could have a wet paper bag coaching DL and be great. Saban is trying to disrupt this recruiting class because he is scared. The DL talent in Mississippi would make any coach look great. Just look at the nfl rosters.

This is about Saban trying to disrupt what he sees as his biggest threat in the West.
Sweet Jesus, you're delusional.

[I seen it dawg]

Definitely not a big ole pay check that we could be paying him. So absolutely nothing. Yes, Bama is great, but these guys wouldn't go to Bama for a pay cut....If we want to make another step, we have to either use/find the money to pay the great coaches we get, OR admit that 7-8 wins with an occasional 9 is the absolute ceiling going forward and lower any and all expectations. It's pretty simple.

Yes it is

[I seen it dawg]

https://www.al.com/alabamafootball/index.ssf/2018/05/alabama_adds_an_assistant_coac.html

Bama paid the last DL coach $750,000.

http://www.cdispatch.com/sports/article.asp?aid=70804

Baker, pre new contract, was making $375,000.

AD's love to hire former Saban assistants.

Bama has a far easier time recruiting top talent

So at Bama he will make a LOT more money, be in a better position to get promoted, and will have an easier time looking like a great DL coach.

1) Why on earth would he stay, and 2) do you really expect John to come up with Bama levels of money? Loafers couldn't do it, and neither could Byrne.

But yeah lets conclude that Cohen is terrible at his job at best and intentionally helping Bama at worst. And if we aren't drawing those conclusions about Cohen we'll say Moorhead has lost control because his staff are getting undeniably better job offers.

Get your heads out of you asses people. I get this sucks and we're emotional, but sometimes there's no clear person to blame. Our boosters are either relatively poor or have always been stingy no matter the AD. That's not Moorheads or Cohens fault. Really though what do you want them to do? Moorhead can't give them more money, Cohen can't give salaries the boosters won't pay for. If you say it's Cohens' job to raise funding then we have to levy the same criticism at literally ever AD we've ever had.

This isn't sunshine pumping. It's math. We don't have the money to compete. it's actually a far more depressing view than blaming a few fireable people. And it's because it's so final and demoralizing that so many of you can't accept it

Good post

[BuckyIsAB****]

I see what you’re saying but it’s his responsibility at the end of the day. No one ever said being an AD at MSU is easy. We need someone that CAN solve these issues and Cohen is proving he cannot.

No AD in the country or head coach is going to always keep his assistants when they are sought after, esp by Nick Saban. You are blowing this way out of proportion. This happens to every single program from high school to the NFL. We will have DL talent and will make a good hire. Moorhead is a likable guy and people want to work with him, contrary to the mob around here that has already labeled him a failure

[CadaverDawg]

Nobody said pay them ALL Bama money....but the best ones you have to

[ShotgunDawg]

No AD in the country or head coach is going to always keep his assistants when they are sought after, esp by Nick Saban. You are blowing this way out of proportion. This happens to every single program from high school to the NFL. We will have DL talent and will make a good hire. Moorhead is a likable guy and people want to work with him, contrary to the mob around here that has already labeled him a failure

Does it happen to every program the weekend of their big DL recruiting visits?

[dawgday166]

If he does leave, and thats IF. How any of you can blame Cohen is beyond me. The guy just signed him to an extension. What do you want John to do? Lock him in the football building?

I never understand why everyone always wants to fire Cohen. The guy just became AD a year ago and so far I can't tell he has an established track record worth evaluating yet. And just to add something ... any coach we hire at MSU will be somewhat of a crap shoot (for sure in football). Mullen was. We have to take a chance on an up-and-comer coordinator ... which means there's always a chance they can't handle the HC position.

[Cooterpoot]

Funny that a coach who played at Bama and they offered the job, turned them down to stay at OM. But Baker is just improving his situation.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Does it happen to every program the weekend of their big DL recruiting visits?

Maybe, maybe not. Im sure it has at some point. The timing is unfortunate but we havent lost a DL commit because of it. Pickering has said he is staying no matter what and Young was never committed. Moore was before all of this even happened.

Moorhead is a good recruiter, much better than the guy that yall wanted to proclaim as savior for half assing it most of his time here wanting to leave, and kept getting everything he couldve asked for.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Funny that a coach who played at Bama and they offered the job, turned them down to stay at OM. But Baker is just improving his situation.

Pete Golding turned down the OM DC job earlier this year so it goes both ways. Roach must have beef with Saban

[Homedawg]

Nobody said pay them ALL Bama money....but the best ones you have to

Well I didn't think Marcus Johnson was that good but saban looked at him. How do you decide in advance who is saban worthy? Cause in all honesty, I thought Getsey was overpaid at his salary, but the packers didn't think so.

[WeWonItAll(Most)]

It?s not your job to know what he could?ve done but it?s his job to figure that out.

MSU?s nuts have been severed in this recruiting cycle

I know that you refuse to believe this but sometimes the answer to what could have been done is "nothing", at least in the short term. I would rehash what Saban and Bama have to sell that we don't, but it's been pointed out ad nauseam at this point.

[CadaverDawg]

Funny that a coach who played at Bama and they offered the job, turned them down to stay at OM. But Baker is just improving his situation.

Yep. Our fan base will come up with every excuse in the book before admitting MAYBE somebody could have done a better job in our program. Blows my mind how it's always just poor MSU, and coaches & AD's are void of criticism. Why is that? It's strange

[CadaverDawg]

Well I didn't think Marcus Johnson was that good but saban looked at him. How do you decide in advance who is saban worthy? Cause in all honesty, I thought Getsey was overpaid at his salary, but the packers didn't think so.

After this season and the early recruiting results....Shoop, Baker, and Johnson were the only ones deserving raises....and Baker would have gotten the biggest one if it were me. A school would have to highly overpay for those 3 to steal them if I were Cohen and Joe. Obviously you wouldn't have to raise Johnson as much as the others due to body of work being smaller...he's a little bit lesser known. But everyone agreed Baker was the biggest piece of our defensive puzzle. Should have overpaid the shit out of him

[Alphadog]

Would you rather be CEO of Piggly Wiggly or Walmart? Simple

[ShotgunDawg]

I know that you refuse to believe this but sometimes the answer to what could have been done is "nothing", at least in the short term. I would rehash what Saban and Bama have to sell that we don't, but it's been pointed out ad nauseam at this point.

In isolated circumstances, I agree but from the baseball hire to this football exodus, we are seeing a real trend.

[BrunswickDawg]

Would you rather be CEO of Piggly Wiggly or Walmart? Simple
Depends. Does Piggly Wiggly still give out green stamps so I can get some China? Or nice towels?

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Nobody said pay them ALL Bama money....but the best ones you have to

Nobody has poached Shoop. You know why? because he's the one we decided to pay top dollar to. We are following the strategy you say we should, we just don't have enough money to do it as well as you'd like

[I seen it dawg]

In isolated circumstances, I agree but from the baseball hire to this football exodus, we are seeing a real trend.

How in the absolute **** can anyone know yet if the baseball hire was bad? We haven't played a ****ing game.

[CadaverDawg]

Nobody has poached Shoop. You know why? because he's the one we decided to pay top dollar to. We are following the strategy you say we should, we just don't have enough money to do it as well as you'd like

BS, Moorhead is making far less than Dan did for that very reason...to pay assistants. You're telling me all that SEC money and we can't bump Baker from 375k to 750k? C'mon. I get it that we don't have big money, but we have plenty to lock down our key cogs with IF we're strategic.

[Cooterpoot]

Nobody has poached Shoop. You know why? because he's the one we decided to pay top dollar to. We are following the strategy you say we should, we just don't have enough money to do it as well as you'd like

Not true. He’s still underpaid (based on performance) and isnt locked down either.

[CadaverDawg]

Not true. He’s still underpaid (based on performance) and isnt locked down either.

Exactly

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

BS, Moorhead is making far less than Dan did for that very reason...to pay assistants. You're telling me all that SEC money and we can't bump Baker from 375k to 750k? C'mon. I get it that we don't have big money, but we have plenty to lock down our key cogs with IF we're strategic.

Are you accusing Cohen of stockpiling money?

[dawgday166]

After this season and the early recruiting results....Shoop, Baker, and Johnson were the only ones deserving raises....and Baker would have gotten the biggest one if it were me. A school would have to highly overpay for those 3 to steal them if I were Cohen and Joe. Obviously you wouldn't have to raise Johnson as much as the others due to body of work being smaller...he's a little bit lesser known. But everyone agreed Baker was the biggest piece of our defensive puzzle. Should have overpaid the shit out of him

Not sure who everyone is but I think Shoop is the biggest piece of defensive puzzle. I think Baker is very good but our Dline and whole defense got better after Shoop installed "toughness tuesdays". And of all the position coaches Baker did have the most talent to work with. What happened with our backend D overall was at least as impressive and maybe even moreso, given the talent levels. And also think Shoop is the key straw in game strategies, which I also believe helped our defense.

I do think now Saban will have some insight into that but not sure it will matter that much. I guess we'll find out if Shoop is the key cog or not next year, although even with Baker staying I don't expect us to be as elite on D next year.

[maroonmania]

Nobody said pay them ALL Bama money....but the best ones you have to

Agreed, Huff had not proven himself AT MSU. Baker certainly had. We could have doubled Baker's salary had we felt it was important enough. Of course if Saban wants Baker bad enough he could always pay more than the most we could pay. Bama has an unlimited football budget.

[Doggie_Style]

We could have a wet paper bag coaching DL and be great. Saban is trying to disrupt this recruiting class because he is scared. The DL talent in Mississippi would make any coach look great. Just look at the nfl rosters.

This is about Saban trying to disrupt what he sees as his biggest threat in the West.

Yep...Moorhead is terrifying ***

[maroonmania]

Well I didn't think Marcus Johnson was that good but saban looked at him. How do you decide in advance who is saban worthy? Cause in all honesty, I thought Getsey was overpaid at his salary, but the packers didn't think so.

It is somewhat ironic that our coaching staff if getting looted in a year where our coaching staff, primarily on offense, did not perform well. Baker's group did, but how Huff, Getsy and Johnson would be attractive for other teams right now I don't get.

[CadaverDawg]

Agreed, Huff had not proven himself AT MSU. Baker certainly had. We could have doubled Baker's salary had we felt it was important enough. Of course if Saban wants Baker bad enough he could always pay more than the most we could pay. Bama has an unlimited football budget.

Exactly. If we were overpaying Baker for example by a little bit, that could encourage Saban to go to his next DL target whom he might consider equal to Baker. But if you have the #1 DL in the country and have a "Clearance" tag dangling from your DL coach, that makes getting poached a shit ton easier.

In other words...it's not about getting into a bidding war with Bama. It's about being strategic with the pay of your best guys in order to best deter poaching

[IMissJack]

BS, Moorhead is making far less than Dan did for that very reason...to pay assistants. You're telling me all that SEC money and we can't bump Baker from 375k to 750k? C'mon. I get it that we don't have big money, but we have plenty to lock down our key cogs with IF we're strategic.

Are donations down? Honest question. Because I really don't know anyone that was happy with how things went with Football since the KY game. FB pays the bills, and if fans aren't happy with that result, they generally don't open the wallet.

[CadaverDawg]

Are donations down? Honest question. Because I really don't know anyone that was happy with how things went with Football since the KY game. FB pays the bills, and if fans aren't happy with that result, they generally don't open the wallet.

True. I'm pretty sure they are down, especially as of late. (But I have no numbers to back that)

And to be honest, maybe that's the answer....if anybody complaining because they desire to see State win at a high level is getting told to quit bitching, maybe they should accept the same mediocrity that the sunshine brigade accepts and just close their wallets altogether.

[Jack Lambert]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

Sounds to me since Bama is having to replace so many coaches they are a farm team.

[Lord McBuckethead]

I don't know that paying coaches more money is a catch-all solution... Bammer pays their coaches a good bit more than most programs and it's coaching staff gets poached waaaaay more than anyone else's...

I would love to see the SEC step in and stop the intra-conference coachin' poachin'....

Bama's coaches move up when they move out. This is a lateral move as far as position and responsibility. Now working for Saban has a big bonus of being in his coaching tree. Also, beating Bama has a bigger plus side to it.

[Cooterpoot]

Sounds to me since Bama is having to replace so many coaches they are a farm team.

Half the guys they lost got better jobs. Other half were told to leave. Only exception was OC.

[Cooterpoot]

You 17rs justifying all this with “I can’t blame them it’s a better opportunity “ remember that shit when we can’t sign instate talent that Bama is taking. Because you’re basically telling those kids the same thing and we’re losing a guy that’s killing it instate. You guys keep accepting the whole, “know your place BS”.

[ShotgunDawg]

You 17rs justifying all this with “I can’t blame them it’s a better opportunity “ remember that shit when we can’t sign instate talent that Bama is taking. Because you’re basically telling those kids the same thing and we’re losing a guy that’s killing it instate. You guys keep accepting the whole, “know your place BS”.

Agree.

There are two groups of MSU fans, those that accept our place and those that don't. I don't accept it but, situations like this, are causing me to lose hope in even being capable changing our position.

How can you build anything with this happening?

[Jack Lambert]

Half the guys they lost got better jobs. Other half were told to leave. Only exception was OC.

That's the same for all schools.

[Jack Lambert]

Exactly

You were bitching this past summer about the shoop hire.

[Cooterpoot]

That's the same for all schools.

Neither of ours got promotions. Neither were told to leave.

[BrunswickDawg]

True. I'm pretty sure they are down, especially as of late. (But I have no numbers to back that)

And to be honest, maybe that's the answer....if anybody complaining because they desire to see State win at a high level is getting told to quit bitching, maybe they should accept the same mediocrity that the sunshine brigade accepts and just close their wallets altogether.

Actually, it's the exact opposite. Why can Clemson build themselves up? Because they gave, and gave some more. The schools that continue to build thru adversity and give more money instead of taking their money away are the ones who have succeeded. Every time things have gotten tough over the past 50 years, our fan base has started eating itself instead of pulling together and doing more. Every. Single. Time. And yet we wonder why we can't have nice things.

[IMissJack]

Agree.

There are two groups of MSU fans, those that accept our place and those that don't. I don't accept it but, situations like this, are causing me to lose hope in even being capable changing our position.

How can you build anything with this happening?

It is always going to be harder for schools like State, but I don't feel that fans (donors) believe Joe can take us to the promised land. You have to have the certain "it" factor for confidence and support to build behind the program, and it feels like we have lost all momentum there.

[Jack Lambert]

Neither of ours got promotions. Neither were told to leave.

More money is not a promotion. If saban wants them he will get them. They have 100 million more to spend each year.

[Cooterpoot]

More money is not a promotion. If saban wants them he will get them. They have 100 million more to spend each year.

Nope. Promotion is advancing to the next level. More money is a raise.

[Jack Lambert]

So you woudn't leave for raise?

[CadaverDawg]

Actually, it's the exact opposite. Why can Clemson build themselves up? Because they gave, and gave some more. The schools that continue to build thru adversity and give more money instead of taking their money away are the ones who have succeeded. Every time things have gotten tough over the past 50 years, our fan base has started eating itself instead of pulling together and doing more. Every. Single. Time. And yet we wonder why we can't have nice things.

Well then maybe some of our fans should stop telling donors to shut up and accept mediocre

[Cooterpoot]

So you woudn't leave for raise?

For only a raise? No, not if I’m happy. And that raise certainty didn’t pull one of their former players at OM. Baker just got a good raise from us too.

[I seen it dawg]

Bama's coaches move up when they move out. This is a lateral move as far as position and responsibility. Now working for Saban has a big bonus of being in his coaching tree. Also, beating Bama has a bigger plus side to it.

Lol it's not a lateral move. Come on.

[I seen it dawg]

Agree.

There are two groups of MSU fans, those that accept our place and those that don't. I don't accept it but, situations like this, are causing me to lose hope in even being capable changing our position.

How can you build anything with this happening?

Not true. There are some that don't accept it but understand the reality. They don't like it but they aren't diving off tall buildings to show how mad they are.

State as a whole has to decide if it's gonna do what Clemson did or not. Pretty simple. It can be done but it takes effort from everywhere State, and moreso than in a lot of places bc of our size. Otherwise State is 6-9 wins a year.

[preachermatt83]

Outside of your perception how was the baseball search a joke? We got a young up and comer who apparently has good references. One you keep posting is gonna be awesome. Did he just call up Cohen and say hey I'm lemonis you should hire me and Cohen said sounds good? To me it played out not a joke.

If you don't think the baseball search(I didn't say hire, I said search) was a joke then you are the only person in America that feels that way.

[I seen it dawg]

Neither of ours got promotions. Neither were told to leave.

Promotions don't just come in title alone. And paths to 2 step ahead promotions sometimes means taking a small step or a sidestep to get there.

[I seen it dawg]

Actually, it's the exact opposite. Why can Clemson build themselves up? Because they gave, and gave some more. The schools that continue to build thru adversity and give more money instead of taking their money away are the ones who have succeeded. Every time things have gotten tough over the past 50 years, our fan base has started eating itself instead of pulling together and doing more. Every. Single. Time. And yet we wonder why we can't have nice things.

Nailed it. We sulk and pout (like right now) instead of band together.

[I seen it dawg]

Neither of ours got promotions. Neither were told to leave.

I'm sorry but if I'm making 300k as a position coach and I got an offer to make 750 doing the same thing at a school with stability I'd say I'm prob calling my wife and telling her to pack the house and sell that bitch I'll see you there.

[preachermatt83]

Yep. Our fan base will come up with every excuse in the book before admitting MAYBE somebody could have done a better job in our program. Blows my mind how it's always just poor MSU, and coaches & AD's are void of criticism. Why is that? It's strange

PREACH!!

[I seen it dawg]

If you don't think the baseball search(I didn't say hire, I said search) was a joke then you are the only person in America that feels that way.

Well maybe so. I just know how corporate job searches, which this basically is, goes and sometimes the perception isn't the reality. I'm not saying it wasn't a cluster but no one really knows for sure what went down.

[Turfdawg67]

On the bright side, at least Saban doesn't want Shoop... yet.

[I seen it dawg]

True. I'm pretty sure they are down, especially as of late. (But I have no numbers to back that)

And to be honest, maybe that's the answer....if anybody complaining because they desire to see State win at a high level is getting told to quit bitching, maybe they should accept the same mediocrity that the sunshine brigade accepts and just close their wallets altogether.

I can't see the sunshine brigade you speak of. It's too dark in here.

[BiscuitEater]

Successful companies have retention plans and make sure their top talent doesn?t leave. Bottom line. Do more reading and searchihg and lest posting please .

How's that 'retention' working out for Bama? EVERY company/school HAS to replace talent. Please explain exactly 'how' a school retains a coach that wants to leave!

[WeWonItAll(Most)]

In isolated circumstances, I agree but from the baseball hire to this football exodus, we are seeing a real trend.


In isolated circumstances, I agree but from the baseball hire to this football exodus, we are seeing a real trend.

Baseball has nothing to do with this thread, and the new coach hasn't even coached his first game yet. So I don't know what you're getting at there. Our previous coach didn't leave for a better job, and we didn't hire the interim after he took us to the CWS, so I don't know what you're griping about besides that we were unable to a pull head coach from other elite programs.

The trend you see is that there is nothing in college football that promotes parity except for limiting how many players a team can have on scholarship. You acquire talent through what's more or less a black market, and your budget is as big as your donors want it to be. To go along with all this, the most successful program and one of the most resource rich programs in the country isn't just in our conference, they're the closest team to us in the freaking country geographically. That program has decided they wanted two of our coaches.

[Cooterpoot]

I'm sorry but if I'm making 300k as a position coach and I got an offer to make 750 doing the same thing at a school with stability I'd say I'm prob calling my wife and telling her to pack the house and sell that bitch I'll see you there.

A school with stability? LOL. And he was offered big money to stay.

[LC Dawg]

A school with stability? LOL. And he was offered big money to stay.

How much was he offered to stay?

[Cooterpoot]

How much was he offered to stay?

Not 750K.

[Backspin]

According to USA Today, the MSU assistant coach compensation pool is $3.6 million...last in the SEC. As a comparison, TSUN?s pool is $5.1 million. However, we are spending $60 million on baseball. Maybe we should have spent $50 million on a great baseball stadium and pumped $2 million per year more into the football assistants who were doing a great job. Especially since football is the revenue driver. And I?m a baseball guy.

[Homedawg]

A school with stability? LOL. And he was offered big money to stay.

Again, we didn't lose him bc of money. As w most every coach we've ever lost.

[yjnkdawg]

According to USA Today, the MSU assistant coach compensation pool is $3.6 million...last in the SEC. As a comparison, TSUN?s pool is $5.1 million. However, we are spending $60 million on baseball. Maybe we should have spent $50 million on a great baseball stadium and pumped $2 million per year more into the football assistants who were doing a great job. Especially since football is the revenue driver. And I?m a baseball guy.




I agree our assistant coaches need more money, but if we have an assistant coach who Bama wants, and our coach, being offered by Bama, has mutual feelings about moving to Tuscaloosa, then you can forget ir on the money thing. So yeah we need to supplement our assistant coaches, but that is not going to prevent things like this.

[HoopsDawg]

According to USA Today, the MSU assistant coach compensation pool is $3.6 million...last in the SEC. As a comparison, TSUN?s pool is $5.1 million. However, we are spending $60 million on baseball. Maybe we should have spent $50 million on a great baseball stadium and pumped $2 million per year more into the football assistants who were doing a great job. Especially since football is the revenue driver. And I?m a baseball guy.

Screw that. Extra 10 mill well spent.

[Cooterpoot]

Again, we didn't lose him bc of money. As w most every coach we've ever lost.

We didn’t lose him to a promotion either. You guys can accept it to be true if you want. He’s just paid better.

[HoopsDawg]

Again, we didn't lose him bc of money. As w most every coach we've ever lost.


Well, it's kind of about money.

[Todd4State]

The only way for us to have the stability that it seems like a lot of our fans want to have at the rate that we are paying would be to hire a MSU grad that loves MSU above all else except God and to hire a staff that has the same feelings about MSU. Kind of like Cohen for us in baseball. Unfortunately there isn't really what I would consider a qualified coaching candidate on the horizon like that.

That said I would like to see us hire someone that is from Mississippi next time as our coach and see how that goes. I bet our fans would accept them more easily than someone from the North.

[Hambone]

Crazy thing is, 98% of you would do the EXACT same thing... The other % would just be the rare exception.

[TUSK]

Crazy thing is, 98% of you would do the EXACT same thing... The other 2% would too.

FTFY

[CadaverDawg]

Again, we didn't lose him bc of money. As w most every coach we've ever lost.

He didn't go to Bama for less money, I guarantee you that. It was bare minimum equal to what we offered him to stay, but likely more. And therein lies the problem....if you pay the man upfront what you felt he is worth on his way out the door, you might not have people snooping around to begin with. We try to be cheap until it's too late.

In other words, if we threw out a $750k matching offer after Bama did, well of course he leaves....but if we extend him for $750k right after or during the season, it makes a statement that you better be ready to pay for Baker if you try to get him, and most would steer clear. But when they look and see he's making $350k while coaching up the best DL in the country, you might as well have a neon sign above his head saying "Priced To Move!"

[Homedawg]

Well, it's kind of about money.

Of pay we're exacrly the same he'd still be gone. No different than Geoff Collins.

[KOdawg1]

One of the reasons I like EliteDawgs is the fact that there are opinions that aren't all sunshine and flower posts. I stay away from GenesPage when bad stuff happens for that reason.

Guys, it's okay to melt a little. We all want what's best for MSU and some aren't satisfied with mediocrity. And that's okay.

[yjnkdawg]

He didn't go to Bama for less money, I guarantee you that. It was bare minimum equal to what we offered him to stay, but likely more. And therein lies the problem....if you pay the man upfront what you felt he is worth on his way out the door, you might not have people snooping around to begin with. We try to be cheap until it's too late.

In other words, if we threw out a $750k matching offer after Bama did, well of course he leaves....but if we extend him for $750k right after or during the season, it makes a statement that you better be ready to pay for Baker if you try to get him, and most would steer clear. But when they look and see he's making $350k while coaching up the best DL in the country, you might as well have a neon sign above his head saying "Priced To Move!"



He accepted the extension agreement (negotiation) so he must have thought that was an acceptable deal, at that time. You don't over pay if a person accepts an offered contract. That's not a good business practice and Cohen definitely isn't going to to do that. Then Bama comes a calling and offers him an assistant position. He takes the Bama position because he feels it is in the best interest of his family, and his future expectations and goals. I don't know if Baker wants to be a DC or some day be a head coach, but getting in the Saban coaching tree sure has worked for some who wanted to move up to a coordinator or head coach. Again I think our assistant coaches need higher salaries to at least meet the average in the SEC if not higher, but if there is mutual feelings on a move to Tuscaloosa then Bama will win.

[Bothrops]

Maybe they want to go somewhere they can do the same job, but get better results. More W's. Work the same level, without all the negativity and grief from losing every other week. At Bama, you may not have to lose once.

[Todd4State]

One of the reasons I like EliteDawgs is the fact that there are opinions that aren't all sunshine and flower posts. I stay away from GenesPage when bad stuff happens for that reason.

Guys, it's okay to melt a little. We all want what's best for MSU and some aren't satisfied with mediocrity. And that's okay.


You call this a little melt?**

People are acting like our football program is going to collapse because Alabama hired our d-line coach.

[Todd4State]

Maybe they want to go somewhere they can do the same job, but get better results. More W's. Work the same level, without all the negativity and grief from losing every other week. At Bama, you may not have to lose once.

I assure you Bama has their share of negativity and grief from their fans. And it's probably worse than MSU when you take into account the nitpicking things that their fans bitch about and the fact that they win anyway. It would be like me bitching that we only beat someone 56-0 instead of 63-0 and we failed because we didn't win the National Championship.

Most of the coaches don't give a rats ass what we think or say about them.

[dawgday166]

You call this a little melt?**

People are acting like our football program is going to collapse because Alabama hired our d-line coach.

If replacing coaches and staff chemistry weren't that important then Saban wouldn't have had his ass handed to him so badly this past year. And if SEC refs weren't helping him out ... he'd probably have lost more than just 2 games over last 2 years too.

To me our better chances are trying to emulate Dabo ... which means staff continuity.

Not saying our program is going to collapse, but Pickering plus Young would've been a step forward to something better. I'm personally saying bye-bye to Young and ain't totally convinced Pickering ain't in jeopardy yet. And staff continuity and chemistry on the D staff could've helped a lot too. AND ... unlike you I don't have complete faith in Joe on the O side of the ball just yet.

Plus, Saban just got a really good coach and recruiter from all I've read and ... those don't seem to be a dime a dozen. I do sorta trust Shoop to have good ideas about replacements tho.

More than anything tho ... I'm just sick of Saban and his bullshit. Now if we get a great Dline coach and recruiter, Pickering and Young, then I melted for nothing.

[Coach007]

I know people are mad, but you can not fault a coach.

Just look at our own fan base. You guys would turn out a coach in a year if you could. You talk about it with JoMo. If it betters him or his family, I'm not faulting him because like I said.... fickle fans.

As to no competition clauses. Hard time getting them to hold up in court.

[CadaverDawg]

He accepted the extension agreement (negotiation) so he must have thought that was an acceptable deal, at that time. You don't over pay if a person accepts an offered contract. That's not a good business practice and Cohen definitely isn't going to to do that. Then Bama comes a calling and offers him an assistant position. He takes the Bama position because he feels it is in the best interest of his family, and his future expectations and goals. I don't know if Baker wants to be a DC or some day be a head coach, but getting in the Saban coaching tree sure has worked for some who wanted to move up to a coordinator or head coach. Again I think our assistant coaches need higher salaries to at least meet the average in the SEC if not higher, but if there is mutual feelings on a move to Tuscaloosa then Bama will win.

Wrong. You DO overpay when you can't keep coaches in today's landscape. Of course he accepted the deal, he hadn't been offered a better one at the time. Had we paid up, they may not even come knocking, who knows.

[CadaverDawg]

I know people are mad, but you can not fault a coach.

Just look at our own fan base. You guys would turn out a coach in a year if you could. You talk about it with JoMo. If it betters him or his family, I'm not faulting him because like I said.... fickle fans.

As to no competition clauses. Hard time getting them to hold up in court.

I don't fault Baker. I fault the men signing his check

[smootness]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

Why do we think the solution to every problem we have is 'Cohen needs to pay more.' We have limited resources, more limited than any other program in the conference. Pretending we can compete with the top programs by doing the same thing they do is foolish.

[CadaverDawg]

Why do we think the solution to every problem we have is 'Cohen needs to pay more.' We have limited resources, more limited than any other program in the conference. Pretending we can compete with the top programs by doing the same thing they do is foolish.

Read. I didn't say that was the solution to every problem....but it is for some, like Baker. The key is not trying to get in a bidding war by being proactive with paying your best coaches. Play offense, not defense like our cheap ass AD's do. $400k more is something we can afford in order to maintain the top DL in the country, no??

[yjnkdawg]

Wrong. You DO overpay when you can't keep coaches in today's landscape. Of course he accepted the deal, he hadn't been offered a better one at the time. Had we paid up, they may not even come knocking, who knows.




If Saban wanted him, Bama would have definitely come knocking. Saban may not get everything he wants concerning the Alabama Football Program, but he doesn't miss on much. But how do you come up with a formula to over pay somebody but not actually way over pay them, when you have no clue that a program like Bama will come after your DL Coach, and don't know what their salary package offer will be? Again, whether we want to believe, or admit it, on the national scene, a DL assistant coaching position at Bama is a more prestigious coaching position than one with us. It is what it is.

[Barkman Turner Overdrive]

This is about Saban trying to disrupt what he sees as his biggest threat in the West.

That?s hilarious

[CadaverDawg]

If Saban wanted him, Bama would have definitely come knocking. Saban may not get everything he wants concerning the Alabama Football Program, but he doesn't miss on much. But how do you come up with a formula to over pay somebody but not actually way over pay them, when you have no clue that a program like Bama will come after your DL Coach, and don't know what their salary package offer will be?

Our D was #1 in the nation, and Baker was recruiting his ass off....overpay by enough that it doesn't matter. I bet Clemson feels like they got pretty good ROI on their overpaying of Venebles. If you truly want to take a next step, if you truly want to be a Clemson one day...You HAVE to lock down your best guys. You don't have to overpay everybody, just be strategic by knowing who is truly the glue to your #1 Defense and pay their ass handsomely. It's not hard. Nobody on O (maybe Johnson for recruiting) should have gotten a penny raise, so making substantial raises for guys like Baker shouldn't have been hard. Stop making excuses...we aren't Huge money but we aren't Southern Miss either

[War Machine Dawg]

And stop allowing our program to be the farm team of the real competitors every year. The buck stops with you whether fair or not. Open up the wallet and let some air in, brother

I figure it has way more to do with JoeMo. I mean, I'm sure it's completely coincidental 4 of our 5 best coaches have all jumped off the SS Moorhead at their first opportunity.

You're right, Cohen needs to do his job. But it starts with getting rid of Sylvester Moorhead. But your point about increasing our assistant pay is accurate, too.

[bluelightstar]

I figure it has way more to do with JoeMo. I mean, I'm sure it's completely coincidental 4 of our 5 best coaches have all jumped off the SS Moorhead at their first opportunity.

You're right, Cohen needs to do his job. But it starts with getting rid of Sylvester Moorhead. But your point about increasing our assistant pay is accurate, too.

I don't think Moorhead is going to be successful, but Baker supposedly turned down Florida and LSU before signing the extension.

[maroonmania]

I agree our assistant coaches need more money, but if we have an assistant coach who Bama wants, and our coach, being offered by Bama, has mutual feelings about moving to Tuscaloosa, then you can forget ir on the money thing. So yeah we need to supplement our assistant coaches, but that is not going to prevent things like this.

I agree, we were probably paying him pretty competitively for most normal college football programs, heck, even competively for the SEC, but when you compete with Bama you are basically competing with an NFL franchise with unlimited resources. I do think overall we should bump our assistants' pay WHERE there is someone that our HC wants to do all we can to not lose. We certainly should have, at a minimum, our assistant pay in line with what OM has, but none of that will ever stop us from losing an assistant that Bama comes after because we can't afford to pay on that scale as a norm.

[Bdawg]

Read. I didn't say that was the solution to every problem....but it is for some, like Baker. The key is not trying to get in a bidding war by being proactive with paying your best coaches. Play offense, not defense like our cheap ass AD's do. $400k more is something we can afford in order to maintain the top DL in the country, no??

And if our Dline would have come out and played crappy this year under Baker everybody would be bitching how stupid Cohen was for overpaying the DL coach. Not saying paying coaches what their worth is wrong. Just saying your scenario of overpaying could work the other way too.

[preachermatt83]

He didn't go to Bama for less money, I guarantee you that. It was bare minimum equal to what we offered him to stay, but likely more. And therein lies the problem....if you pay the man upfront what you felt he is worth on his way out the door, you might not have people snooping around to begin with. We try to be cheap until it's too late.

In other words, if we threw out a $750k matching offer after Bama did, well of course he leaves....but if we extend him for $750k right after or during the season, it makes a statement that you better be ready to pay for Baker if you try to get him, and most would steer clear. But when they look and see he's making $350k while coaching up the best DL in the country, you might as well have a neon sign above his head saying "Priced To Move!"

You got that right!! LT 2.0. We have low balled every coach in our entire program with the exception of Vic

[preachermatt83]

I figure it has way more to do with JoeMo. I mean, I'm sure it's completely coincidental 4 of our 5 best coaches have all jumped off the SS Moorhead at their first opportunity.

You're right, Cohen needs to do his job. But it starts with getting rid of Sylvester Moorhead. But your point about increasing our assistant pay is accurate, too.

Preach brother!!! #SinkingShip

[CadaverDawg]

And if our Dline would have come out and played crappy this year under Baker everybody would be bitching how stupid Cohen was for overpaying the DL coach. Not saying paying coaches what their worth is wrong. Just saying your scenario of overpaying could work the other way too.

You don't do it unless they're proven...Baker is proven, and you could have even done it after the season and been fine. It only works against you if you arent paying attention.

[Bdawg]

You don't do it unless they're proven...Baker is proven, and you could have even done it after the season and been fine. It only works against you if you arent paying attention.

I do agree we need to pony up for good coaches. But is money the sole reason for him leaving? He is leaving though, right?

[CadaverDawg]

I do agree we need to pony up for good coaches. But is money the sole reason for him leaving? He is leaving though, right?

He isn't leaving for less money, that's for sure. It's always about the money in my opinion. Sure, Bama & Saban are great, but you still aren't taking a pay cut to go there.

[Turfdawg67]

Preach brother!!! #SinkingShip

God I liked it when you were on hiatus. Go back to your Coach 34 strike, please.

[Really Clark?]

Per Steve, we offered Huff a long extension (to 2022) and more money but it was the Bama opportunity. Piroli was offered more but really wanted to go and work with Bruce again. Baker was offer a match, then offered to exceed Bama’s offer at the time but he also thought the opportunity for advancement was too good to pass up

[ShotgunDawg]

Per Steve, we offered Huff a long extension (to 2022) and more money but it was the Bama opportunity. Piroli was offered more but really wanted to go and work with Bruce again. Baker was offer a match, then offered to exceed Bama’s offer at the time but he also thought the opportunity for advancement was too good to pass up

Piroli I get.

Huff I get to some extent but he's a climber that won't show loyalty to anyone. He needs to watch who he follows on twitter.

Baker - Complete sell out. Would rather get something for free than build that something special. Was lying to our recruits last night about staying.

[dawgday166]

Piroli I get.

Was lying to our recruits last night about staying.

I read that and also that he had already accepted offer last night too. He probably should've just been honest and excused himself from the whole recruiting deal last night, or made some excuse and just left while telling Joe & Shoop why. That's another thing that pissed me off about this ... Saban's ass could've offered sooner or waited until late today or early tomorrow to offer IMO. I think this was calculated to some degree by Saban.

[preachermatt83]

God I liked it when you were on hiatus. Go back to your Coach 34 strike, please.
Why not hit ignore? It would be like I'm not even here.

[yjnkdawg]

Per Steve, we offered Huff a long extension (to 2022) and more money but it was the Bama opportunity. Piroli was offered more but really wanted to go and work with Bruce again. Baker was offer a match, then offered to exceed Bama’s offer at the time but he also thought the opportunity for advancement was too good to pass up


Well, that kind of blows up the fantasy of a few on here that more money would have kept them here. Some just can't realize that this is a business,and coaches are going to do what they think is best for their family and their career. And this over paying concept (how much do you pay him?) a coach to make sure he doesn't want to go somewhere else was almost laughable. That's not even using good business principles. You negotiate a new salary package with a coach that you really want to keep where he is satisfied with it. Then you up the ante to whatever you can or think you should, if another program comes a calling. It's pretty simple.

[yjnkdawg]

Piroli I get.

Huff I get to some extent but he's a climber that won't show loyalty to anyone. He needs to watch who he follows on twitter.

Baker - Complete sell out. Would rather get something for free than build that something special. Was lying to our recruits last night about staying.


I agree with Baker should have not been involved in our recruiting weekend, but he didn't actually accept the offer till last night, so that was possibility the reason he was not at the game with the recruits. You still don't get it though on the other. Coaches are going to do what they think is best for their family and their career. Loyalty is not even an equation in this situation. Why do you think they should be loyal? They didn't grow up cheering for the Dawgs. So why do you think they would turn down an offer to go where they think it is a better situation for them. We all want what's best for our university and sport's programs, but everything just doesn't happen the way you think it should all the time. That is not reality.

[Todd4State]

Well, that kind of blows up the fantasy of a few on here that more money would have kept them here. Some just can realize that this is a business,and coaches are going to do what they think is best for their family and their career. And this over paying concept (how much do you pay him?) a coach to make sure he doesn't want to go somewhere else was almost laughable.

We have too many fans that try to make our coaches "family" and don't understand that for most of our coaches MSU is just another job.

[maroonmania]

We have too many fans that try to make our coaches "family" and don't understand that for most of our coaches MSU is just another job.

Exactly, unless a coach is an alum or has some direct connection to a school, they are all pretty much guns for hire and will leave for the next shiny toy that comes along. Here is Brian Baker's coaching resume:

Coaching Experience
2016-present: Mississippi State (Defensive Line)
2015: Covenant Christian Academy of Colleyville (Texas) (Assistant Coach/Mentor)
2014: Washington Redskins (Outside Linebackers)
2013: Cleveland Browns (Outside Linebackers)
2011-12: Dallas Cowboys (Defensive Line)
2009-10: Carolina Panthers (Defensive Line)
2006-08: St. Louis Rams (Defensive Line)
2004-05: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
2002-03: Minnesota Vikings (Linebackers)
2001: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
1997-2000: Detroit Lions (Defensive Line)
1996: San Diego Chargers (Defensive Line)
1995: Georgia Tech (Defensive Coordinator/Linebackers)
1987-94: Georgia Tech (Linebackers)
1986: Army (Fullbacks)
1985: Maryland (Graduate Assistant)
1984: Maryland (Student Assistant)

Does that look like a guy committed to coaching anywhere for very long? We pulled him off of the coaching trash heap at a TX HS to resurrect his career after the NFL no longer had any interest in him. If Young signs with Bama he should do so assuming that Baker will likely not be there when he is an upperclassmen.

[bluelightstar]

The danger with hiring outside of the SEC is that this league is just brutal in all aspects. From a fan's perspective, it just seems like we've had to live through Moorhead's baptism by fire on the field, in recruiting, and in retention. Maybe it all ends up being just fine, but it's worrisome.

Reminds me of Shoop's comment earlier this year after the consecutive losses to UF and UK: "I think we’re all learning this, especially the guys that are just coming to the SEC. It is different."

[yjnkdawg]

Exactly, unless a coach is an alum or has some direct connection to a school, they are all pretty much guns for hire and will leave for the next shiny toy that comes along. Here is Brian Baker's coaching resume:

Coaching Experience
2016-present: Mississippi State (Defensive Line)
2015: Covenant Christian Academy of Colleyville (Texas) (Assistant Coach/Mentor)
2014: Washington Redskins (Outside Linebackers)
2013: Cleveland Browns (Outside Linebackers)
2011-12: Dallas Cowboys (Defensive Line)
2009-10: Carolina Panthers (Defensive Line)
2006-08: St. Louis Rams (Defensive Line)
2004-05: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
2002-03: Minnesota Vikings (Linebackers)
2001: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
1997-2000: Detroit Lions (Defensive Line)
1996: San Diego Chargers (Defensive Line)
1995: Georgia Tech (Defensive Coordinator/Linebackers)
1987-94: Georgia Tech (Linebackers)
1986: Army (Fullbacks)
1985: Maryland (Graduate Assistant)
1984: Maryland (Student Assistant)

Does that look like a guy committed to coaching anywhere for very long? We pulled him off of the coaching trash heap at a TX HS to resurrect his career after the NFL no longer had any interest in him. If Young signs with Bama he should do so assuming that Baker will likely not be there when he is an upperclassmen.

Looks to me like he took another position when he thought it was best for his family and/or his career, or maybe when he was told to leave (thus the high school stint), but I could be totally wrong and according to a few on here he still may should have been loyal to MSU for some unknown reason.

[Todd4State]

Exactly, unless a coach is an alum or has some direct connection to a school, they are all pretty much guns for hire and will leave for the next shiny toy that comes along. Here is Brian Baker's coaching resume:

Coaching Experience
2016-present: Mississippi State (Defensive Line)
2015: Covenant Christian Academy of Colleyville (Texas) (Assistant Coach/Mentor)
2014: Washington Redskins (Outside Linebackers)
2013: Cleveland Browns (Outside Linebackers)
2011-12: Dallas Cowboys (Defensive Line)
2009-10: Carolina Panthers (Defensive Line)
2006-08: St. Louis Rams (Defensive Line)
2004-05: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
2002-03: Minnesota Vikings (Linebackers)
2001: Minnesota Vikings (Defensive Line)
1997-2000: Detroit Lions (Defensive Line)
1996: San Diego Chargers (Defensive Line)
1995: Georgia Tech (Defensive Coordinator/Linebackers)
1987-94: Georgia Tech (Linebackers)
1986: Army (Fullbacks)
1985: Maryland (Graduate Assistant)
1984: Maryland (Student Assistant)

Does that look like a guy committed to coaching anywhere for very long? We pulled him off of the coaching trash heap at a TX HS to resurrect his career after the NFL no longer had any interest in him. If Young signs with Bama he should do so assuming that Baker will likely not be there when he is an upperclassmen.

How many of our fans would have flipped out knowing that Baker was on the same staff as Croom?

That's a pretty typical coaching resume'. After Georgia Tech it looks like his typical stay at any place ranges from 1-3 years.

And for the heck of it let's look at Lance Thompson. GT then LSU, then the DC at UCF, Tennessee, Alabama, then left them for AUBURN, and then left for South Carolina. He has coached at almost HALF of the schools in the entire SEC.

Until we find a MSU grad that is a tremendous football coach or get a retread like a Sherrill or a Cutcliffe we're honestly probably looking at changing coaches every five years or so on average good or bad.

[Todd4State]

The danger with hiring outside of the SEC is that this league is just brutal in all aspects. From a fan's perspective, it just seems like we've had to live through Moorhead's baptism by fire on the field, in recruiting, and in retention. Maybe it all ends up being just fine, but it's worrisome.

Reminds me of Shoop's comment earlier this year after the consecutive losses to UF and UK: "I think we’re all learning this, especially the guys that are just coming to the SEC. It is different."

I'll get worried when he starts having issues with his players. Shoop could have been referring to anything- including the intensity of our fans after those losses. I think football is a lot more personal here in the South than up North.

[Todd4State]

Looks to me like he took another position when he thought it was best for his family and/or his career, or maybe when he was told to leave (thus the high school stint), but I could be totally wrong and according to a few on here he still may should have been loyal to MSU for some unknown reason.

And sometimes good coaches are fired because the head coach is fired and the next coach wanted to bring "his guys" in.

Our fans have to get past the "well, this guy was fired so he must suck" attitude. If that was the case then Bob Shoop sucks. Or should have in theory.

[dawgday166]

I'll get worried when he starts having issues with his players. Shoop could have been referring to anything- including the intensity of our fans after those losses. I think football is a lot more personal here in the South than up North.

Shoop was referring to how much more physical the SEC is and that tends to be a shock to most coaches. He was already somewhat aware due to coaching at Vandy.

[yjnkdawg]

And sometimes good coaches are fired because the head coach is fired and the next coach wanted to bring "his guys" in.

Our fans have to get past the "well, this guy was fired so he must suck" attitude. If that was the case then Bob Shoop sucks. Or should have in theory.



Excellent points, Todd.

[yjnkdawg]

DELETE

[Belegal]

Why don't we have in their contracts a large buy out? 1 million minimum-5 million to an sec east school- 10 million to a sec west school-if bama wants to pay that - thanks! This isn't rocket science - put it in the contracts

[Todd4State]

Why don't we have in their contracts a large buy out? 1 million minimum-5 million to an sec east school- 10 million to a sec west school-if bama wants to pay that - thanks! This isn't rocket science - put it in the contracts

Just because a coach has a large buyout it doesn't mean that someone won't pay it. Remember when Alabama first went after Saban when he was with the Dolphins? The salary that they gave him was astronomical at that time. Everyone has a number.

A large buyout can be negotiable too. That happened when we hired Cohen away from Kentucky as our baseball coach. They lowered the buyout and we agreed not to take their coaches or recruits. A lot of times businesses will lower or negotiate a buyout to be lower because in general you want employees that want to work for you and not want to leave. That was a big reason why I said that we should have told Dan to just leave after 2015. It affected us a lot in 2016-2017 and honestly still did in 2018. And probably will for the next year or two to a smaller and smaller degree. Usually if someone wants to leave it's best to just let them leave even if they're really good at what they do. Because usually if you prevent that they still find a way to leave anyway. Like- resign and then go wherever. Or if they stay they will be unhappy and you won't get their best effort.


There is no way to eliminate turnover. Heck- massive turnover is why Alabama is going after our coaches in the first place. They couldn't avoid it either.

[Dawg2003]

I don't understand this meltdown over coaches leaving. This is typical in college football. I think a lot of if boils down to insecurity about our program. Any little thing that happens like a position coach leaving, and the sky is collapsing. It's comical that people think these coaches owe us anything. They don't know us and aren't from MS. They are trying to build a resume like all of us are doing. Why should these coaches turn down an opportunity for career advancement just because the fans want them to stay? Those coaches can also get fired on a whim just like when Mullen left. They will get kicked to to curb just as quickly, so let's not act like this program is loyal to the coaches either.

[BrunswickDawg]

I don't understand this meltdown over coaches leaving. This is typical in college football. I think a lot of if boils down to insecurity about our program. Any little thing that happens like a position coach leaving, and the sky is collapsing. It's comical that people think these coaches owe us anything. They don't know us and aren't from MS. They are trying to build a resume like all of us are doing. Why should these coaches turn down an opportunity for career advancement just because the fans want them to stay? Those coaches can also get fired on a whim just like when Mullen left. They will get kicked to to curb just as quickly, so let's not act like this program is loyal to the coaches either.

Reading some of the comments on these threads makes me wonder if some people have ever had a job not working for Daddy at the insurance office.
I've worked for 4 organizations since 1996 - and that is very low for most people I know. But, I have always looked for opportunities or have been approached about changing jobs a dozen times. I've changed jobs for more money, turned down jobs for more money because I didn't want to move, turned down promotions because it meant doing something I didn't want to do, taken promotions without a pay bump to add to my resume, left jobs with no job in hand because I hated my job, I've had bosses try to keep me when I left, and had one tell me not to let the screen door hit me in the ass on the way out. I turned down a major, high profile, high paying, career making job because my kids wanted to finish high school and my wife's business was doing too well to sell after all the work she had put in and have to start over.

To think that any football coach - head coach, position coach, analyst, or GA - would think any other way is just comedic. Legendary QB comes calling and wants you - you go. Top College program in the country comes calling, you listen. Old friend has a job opening and wants you, you go. Or maybe, you are tired of the moves and thankful for what you have (Shoop) and stay. It's not a sign of the apocalypse. It's not lack of leadership in the AD's office. It's not rats jumping a sinking ship. It's life.

[yjnkdawg]

Why don't we have in their contracts a large buy out? 1 million minimum-5 million to an sec east school- 10 million to a sec west school-if bama wants to pay that - thanks! This isn't rocket science - put it in the contracts



I guess you can put it in a contract, but I'm not sure what position coach you would get to sign it, on what you are asking. It was reported that if Mullen left FL that he would have to pay them $2 million. We are talking about a position coach salary, and not a HC or even a DC. Now there are some head coaches in those ranges ($5 to $10 million), that you mentioned and even $26 plus for Saban

[smootness]

I agree with Baker should have not been involved in our recruiting weekend, but he didn't actually accept the offer till last night, so that was possibility the reason he was not at the game with the recruits. You still don't get it though on the other. Coaches are going to do what they think is best for their family and their career. Loyalty is not even an equation in this situation. Why do you think they should be loyal? They didn't grow up cheering for the Dawgs. So why do you think they would turn down an offer to go where they think it is a better situation for them. We all want what's best for our university and sport's programs, but everything just doesn't happen the way you think it should all the time. That is not reality.

Not to mention that the only reason we got them in the first place...is because they weren't loyal to their previous job.

[Homedawg]

Not to mention that the only reason we got them in the first place...is because they weren't loyal to their previous job.

Oh it's ok when they leave their current job to come here, just not the other way around. Sounds logical****

[msbulldog]

The man is just trying to do what's best for him and his family, something we would all do. I want to thank him for the great job he did for us and I wish him all the luck in the world.

[I seen it dawg]

Reading some of the comments on these threads makes me wonder if some people have ever had a job not working for Daddy at the insurance office.
I've worked for 4 organizations since 1996 - and that is very low for most people I know. But, I have always looked for opportunities or have been approached about changing jobs a dozen times. I've changed jobs for more money, turned down jobs for more money because I didn't want to move, turned down promotions because it meant doing something I didn't want to do, taken promotions without a pay bump to add to my resume, left jobs with no job in hand because I hated my job, I've had bosses try to keep me when I left, and had one tell me not to let the screen door hit me in the ass on the way out. I turned down a major, high profile, high paying, career making job because my kids wanted to finish high school and my wife's business was doing too well to sell after all the work she had put in and have to start over.

To think that any football coach - head coach, position coach, analyst, or GA - would think any other way is just comedic. Legendary QB comes calling and wants you - you go. Top College program in the country comes calling, you listen. Old friend has a job opening and wants you, you go. Or maybe, you are tired of the moves and thankful for what you have (Shoop) and stay. It's not a sign of the apocalypse. It's not lack of leadership in the AD's office. It's not rats jumping a sinking ship. It's life.

Stop with all this damn reality!!

[ScoobaDawg]

Reading some of the comments on these threads makes me wonder if some people have ever had a job not working for Daddy at the insurance office.
I've worked for 4 organizations since 1996 - and that is very low for most people I know. But, I have always looked for opportunities or have been approached about changing jobs a dozen times. I've changed jobs for more money, turned down jobs for more money because I didn't want to move, turned down promotions because it meant doing something I didn't want to do, taken promotions without a pay bump to add to my resume, left jobs with no job in hand because I hated my job, I've had bosses try to keep me when I left, and had one tell me not to let the screen door hit me in the ass on the way out. I turned down a major, high profile, high paying, career making job because my kids wanted to finish high school and my wife's business was doing too well to sell after all the work she had put in and have to start over.

To think that any football coach - head coach, position coach, analyst, or GA - would think any other way is just comedic. Legendary QB comes calling and wants you - you go. Top College program in the country comes calling, you listen. Old friend has a job opening and wants you, you go. Or maybe, you are tired of the moves and thankful for what you have (Shoop) and stay. It's not a sign of the apocalypse. It's not lack of leadership in the AD's office. It's not rats jumping a sinking ship. It's life.


I don't think it can be said any better really. This is a sign of a program that is on the rise.. Noone wanted to take Croom from us. Noone wanted his assistants. This is a problem our fanbase isn't used to so they think the sky is falling and we aren't doing enough and are the problem. The only problem is that we have established a winning culture at MSU in Football but we aren't at the top... So some coaches are going to take the chance to move up to someone who is if the chance arrives.

It just really sucks cause that school on top or near the top, is 90 miles away and in our conference.. and we haven't beaten them in a long time.

Guys get over it, stop b!tching about someone make a better life for themselves. As long as they handle it correctly, just move on and believe in Joe to make the best coaching hire possible with what we have to offer (a lot...)

But that wouldn't fit the mold of some who just wan't to bash Joe and John.

[Commercecomet24]

Reading some of the comments on these threads makes me wonder if some people have ever had a job not working for Daddy at the insurance office.
I've worked for 4 organizations since 1996 - and that is very low for most people I know. But, I have always looked for opportunities or have been approached about changing jobs a dozen times. I've changed jobs for more money, turned down jobs for more money because I didn't want to move, turned down promotions because it meant doing something I didn't want to do, taken promotions without a pay bump to add to my resume, left jobs with no job in hand because I hated my job, I've had bosses try to keep me when I left, and had one tell me not to let the screen door hit me in the ass on the way out. I turned down a major, high profile, high paying, career making job because my kids wanted to finish high school and my wife's business was doing too well to sell after all the work she had put in and have to start over.

To think that any football coach - head coach, position coach, analyst, or GA - would think any other way is just comedic. Legendary QB comes calling and wants you - you go. Top College program in the country comes calling, you listen. Old friend has a job opening and wants you, you go. Or maybe, you are tired of the moves and thankful for what you have (Shoop) and stay. It's not a sign of the apocalypse. It's not lack of leadership in the AD's office. It's not rats jumping a sinking ship. It's life.

Well said! This is the most for real down to earth post I've seen in a long time! I left a job for a lower paying job one time because the job was killing the time I was able to spend with my family. I had young ones then and was missing watching them grow up. I have never regretted that decision for one minute! While I may not have millions I have what I need but most importantly I have a great family. Great post Brunswick.

[AROB44]

Well said! This is the most for real down to earth post I've seen in a long time! I left a job for a lower paying job one time because the job was killing the time I was able to spend with my family. I had young ones then and was missing watching them grow up. I have never regretted that decision for one minute! While I may not have millions I have what I need but most importantly I have a great family. Great post Brunswick.


I did it twice in my career. Turned out the best thing (both of them) I ever did. I hate that Baker left, but find it comical that folks are lighting up J Cohen because of it.

[Commercecomet24]

I did it twice in my career. Turned out the best thing (both of them) I ever did. I hate that Baker left, but find it comical that folks are lighting up J Cohen because of it.

Good stuff man, I agree completely!

[BrunswickDawg]

Well said! This is the most for real down to earth post I've seen in a long time! I left a job for a lower paying job one time because the job was killing the time I was able to spend with my family. I had young ones then and was missing watching them grow up. I have never regretted that decision for one minute! While I may not have millions I have what I need but most importantly I have a great family. Great post Brunswick.


I did it twice in my career. Turned out the best thing (both of them) I ever did. I hate that Baker left, but find it comical that folks are lighting up J Cohen because of it.

I'm convinced the Cohen bashing goes back to the Polk/Cohen split from when John was hired as baseball coach. There are some people so "loyal" to Polk that nothing Cohen ever does at MSU will be good.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

I don't think it can be said any better really. This is a sign of a program that is on the rise.. Noone wanted to take Croom from us. Noone wanted his assistants. This is a problem our fanbase isn't used to so they think the sky is falling and we aren't doing enough and are the problem. The only problem is that we have established a winning culture at MSU in Football but we aren't at the top... So some coaches are going to take the chance to move up to someone who is if the chance arrives.

It just really sucks cause that school on top or near the top, is 90 miles away and in our conference.. and we haven't beaten them in a long time.

Guys get over it, stop b!tching about someone make a better life for themselves. As long as they handle it correctly, just move on and believe in Joe to make the best coaching hire possible with what we have to offer (a lot...)

But that wouldn't fit the mold of some who just wan't to bash Joe and John.

I think the most that we can expect Cohen to do is to at least push for legislation in the SEC that reduces coaches leaving during critical recruiting periods. Regulate that and it would help tremendously.

[ScoobaDawg]

I think the most that we can expect Cohen to do is to at least push for legislation in the SEC that reduces coaches leaving during critical recruiting periods. Regulate that and it would help tremendously.


Not really... The NCAA isn't gonna make that rule and tell coaches they can't leave when a opportunity opens.
Bama lost 7 coaches now and not one I believe to another team in the SEC.

So you can't make a rule to say Asst Coaches can't leave on their own to a different conference or NFL....

[Lord McBuckethead]

How does this work with their "contract"?