Conversation with LSU buddy this morning.,,,

[CadaverDawg]

He said this year we got to experience life as an LSU fan, where you have a Championship caliber D but a one dimensional offense with no passing game at all. He said the minute he knew Moorhead wasn't a SEC coach was when he saw Fitzgerald actually regress early in the season. He said the sign of a good offensive minded head coach is when the QB play improves immediately, bc that means they're developing the QB while also catering to their QB's strengths to generate offense. His examples were Mullen at State, Mullen with Franks, Herman with Ehrlinger and Jimbo with Mond. And I couldn't agree with him more. Guys, Fitz got no better this year, and Moorhead made no adjustments to still be able to generate offense....this guy isn't the answer, and will only set us back the next few years. I hate to say it, but unless Cohen grows a pair like no other MSU AD has ever had and fires him this offseason...we're likely going to be circling the drain the next few years and watching everything Mullen built disintegrate before our eyes. Our team will be McCorvey/Ellis Johnson 2.0 where we have no offense and just hope our D can shut everyone down and we can find a way to 6 wins.

I may be wrong, and hope I am because I know we're stuck with his ass for 3 more years more than likely.... but I've been around MSU football a LONG time and I feel like I see exactly where this is heading. Sometimes having an outsiders perspective regurgitate your thoughts, like my LSU buddy did, makes you realize that what you're thinking is probably not just the frustration talking. Maybe I'm wrong though. Thoughts

[ShotgunDawg]

What you say may be entirely correct but I believe it's an over reaction at this point.

- first off, LSU fans don't know football better than us. Neither do Bama fans.

- Secondly, his analysis doesn't take into account Nick's injury. He did regress, but there was a major injury and the reason that he was suspended that played into that. How much? I have no clue.

- I have no issue with firing Moorhead after year 2 if I don't see QB development in 2019, since I don't believe MSU has any chance of competing without above average QB development. However, you just can't fire a coach after an 8 win season at MSU.

[CadaverDawg]

What you say may be entirely correct but I believe it's an over reaction at this point.

- first off, LSU fans don't know football better than us. Neither do Bama fans.

- Secondly, his analysis doesn't take into account Nick's injury.

- I have no issue with firing Moorhead after year 2 if I don't see QB development in 2019, since I don't believe MSU has any chance of competing without above average QB development. However, you just can't fire a coach after an 8 win season at MSU.

This guy knows football. Not that that was my point. I was just mentioning him because he shared my exact thoughts while having no emotional ties to MSU...so he wasn't overreacting like I thought I could have been. Hearing it from a knowledgeable football friend that could give two shits about MSU, only reaffirmed my thoughts. Maybe I'm overreacting, but I hate what I see from Moorhead so far, and I'm worried he's about to wipe out 10 years of growth in a few seasons. Would be awful

[ShotgunDawg]

This guy knows football. Not that that was my point. I was just mentioning him because he shared my exact thoughts while having no emotional ties to MSU...so he wasn't overreacting like I thought I could have been. Hearing it from a knowledgeable football friend that could give two shits about MSU, only reaffirmed my thoughts. Maybe I'm overreacting, but I hate what I see from Moorhead so far, and I'm worried he's about to wipe out 10 years of growth in a few seasons. Would be awful

I agree. I'm just saying we need to see what type of QB development takes place between now and 2019. If our QB play looks anything close to what we got this year, I'll completely agree.

[parabrave]

Two things that has soured me on Jomo and I hope he can get it turned around is scheme and player development. The way we approach the pre-snap read is not working and is actually hurting us is waiting til 5 seconds to get your package in and 2 seconds to snap the ball. Now the defense is controlling what the read will be and knows when the ball will be snapped. Also the lack of player development. KT is talented. We have seen what he can do and what he is capable of. If Jomo can't develop him what makes you think he can do it with the nest coming of Tom Brady. I have said this and I will continue to say it but JOMO needs to hire a competent QB coach who can TEACH the RPO to KT and the other QBs.

[CadaverDawg]

I agree. I'm just saying we need to see what type of QB development takes place between now and 2019. If our QB play looks anything close to what we got this year, I'll completely agree.

Maybe so, but how do you take something as raw as Fitz and go backwards? That's a terrible sign. And unfortunately waiting for "his guy" means giving him 3-4 years, which he could demolish our program in that timeframe. Scary spot we're in

[msstate7]

Two things that has soured me on Jomo and I hope he can get it turned around is scheme and player development. The way we approach the pre-snap read is not working and is actually hurting us is waiting til 5 seconds to get your package in and 2 seconds to snap the ball. Now the defense is controlling what the read will be and knows when the ball will be snapped. Also the lack of player development. KT is talented. We have seen what he can do and what he is capable of. If Jomo can't develop him what makes you think he can do it with the nest coming of Tom Brady. I have said this and I will continue to say it but JOMO needs to hire a competent QB coach who can TEACH the RPO to KT and the other QBs.

The best play callers imo seem to come out with scripted plays to see how the defense defends them and then play call off that. We just come out and do what the defense wants us to do right off the bat

[dawgday166]

I'm giving Joe some time.

I've been a big Fitz homer and defended him in Ky & FL games since other parts of offense broke down and there were quite a few key drops. I watched FL game 3 times and he didn't play that bad in that game.

But he played selfish or was overwhelmed (or something similar) in 3 games for sure ... LSU, Bama, & Iowa. He keeps the ball way too much when there are other options, or at least he did in LSU & Iowa games. It's ridiculous how many times he carried the ball in those 2 games. Bama was the worst game I saw where he missed seeing open receivers. I have yet to figure out why the flea flicker that was called in Bama game with the primary receiver running wide open down the middle of the field, Nick did not even look his way. Did not even look at him. And he had time to make that throw, unlike in Ky & FL games when he had much less time on most of his throws. In either Arky or OM game down on goal line around 3 or 4 yd line, what looked like a pass play with 2 open receivers looking for ball on right side of end zone (it was well designed play), Nick didn't even look their way and just tucked it and ran up middle. He made the score but that's against Arky or OM, whichever one it was.

So I tend to think there was quite a bit of mis-execution in those games and Moorhead isn't throwing Nick under the bus by saying so. When in doubt, Nick keeps it every time. Or, maybe he just makes up his mind he's going to make it happen, not sure. I know yesterday I was getting pissed at him. I don't think Joe is calling all those QB up-the-middle plays. I think that is Nick deciding to keep it. Which also leads me to believe that even tho Nick says otherwise, I'm not sure he bought into Joe's philosophy. Or he didn't spend enough time doing his homework on the offense.

We do need to be a more disciplined and organized team tho in every game. The timeouts called in 3rd period were terrible and we played undisciplined football yesterday. Stupid penalties (and yea I know Iowa had 0 penalties but they ain't Bama ... we should've been able to overcome that). Our Oline play did regress from last year so Marcus needs to tighten that up. We much softer on Oline this year than we were last IMO, with essentially the same players.

There a quite a few things I see that are positive about this staff. There are some things they need to work on. I believe the staff may be somewhat stable relative to staying here, unlike Mullen's first few years, and really his entire tenure on the D side of the ball.

I think Joe really has a passion for doing well and I'm willing to give him some time to figure it out. I tend to believe he really wants to elevate MSU. One thing I believe I've noticed from Joe is he will look in the mirror. That's something our previous coach did not do very well.

[ShotgunDawg]

Maybe so, but how do you take something as raw as Fitz and go backwards? That's a terrible sign. And unfortunately waiting for "his guy" means giving him 3-4 years, which he could demolish our program in that timeframe. Scary spot we're in

Common sense. In Mullen's system for 4 years and Moorhead's 1. Bad injury and he got suspended for something. Just saying don't know yet.

[MetEdDawg]

Maybe so, but how do you take something as raw as Fitz and go backwards? That's a terrible sign. And unfortunately waiting for "his guy" means giving him 3-4 years, which he could demolish our program in that timeframe. Scary spot we're in

I think the problem here is that our 5th year senior was raw after being in the same system with Mullen for 4 years. Dude shouldn't be raw.

That's why I'm not crazy on Joe being piss poor. Ultimately the QB is supposed to make the reads at the line, not the staff. That's what takes so much time.

[basedog]

Fitz was a good athlete playing QB, he never has been good at reading defenses, plus his accuracy was iffy.
He could play next year and I thin he would be the same. Also Shotgun is correct about injury, he was limited in practicing, I also don't think he put the time in to understand better the offense required. I have wondered about him being suspended the first game.


Time will tell about Joe and this staff.

[Tbonewannabe]

Fitz was a good athlete playing QB, he never has been good at reading defenses, plus his accuracy was iffy.
He could play next year and I thin he would be the same. Also Shotgun is correct about injury, he was limited in practicing, I also don't think he put the time in to understand better the offense required. I have wondered about him being suspended the first game.


Time will tell about Joe and this staff.

I heard Joe say that Nick definitely didn't lack confidence. I also heard Nick say he mastered the offense. I think Nick thought way too much of his ability in this offense. He did enough amazing plays like the TD run but he didn't do the basic things like give it to a RB when they might only get 5 yards. In that instance, he just keeps the ball instead of giving it up. We would have benefited more if Nick thought of being a game manager more than a record breaker.

[Commercecomet24]

Fitz regressed every year as a passer. He was a better passer his first year. He just doesn't read defenses well pre or post snap. I loved how hard Fitz played for us and for all the great things he accomplished. He was a great athlete and runner but not so much as a "complete" qb. He gave us everything he had he was just limited in reading defenses and as a passer. I'm grateful he was a Dawg.

[bulldawg28]

Maybe so, but how do you take something as raw as Fitz and go backwards? That's a terrible sign. And unfortunately waiting for "his guy" means giving him 3-4 years, which he could demolish our program in that timeframe. Scary spot we're in

This was on Fitz. He wasn't focused and didn't put in the film study and footwork to become a more accurate passer. The difference in Mullen and Jomo is Mullen ran more plays to setup the next. Jomo gives the Qb options to put the team in the best situation every down regardless of the previous play. Fitz could not handle it.

[1bigdawg]

I hate to say it, but unless Cohen grows a pair like no other MSU AD has ever had and fires him this offseason

I am disappointed also. However, what coach would want to come to MSU if you showed them that you would fire them after ONE year if they were only 8-4?

[Commercecomet24]

This was on Fitz. He wasn't focused and didn't put in the film study and footwork to become a more accurate passer. The difference in Mullen and Jomo is Mullen ran more plays to setup the next. Jomo gives the Qb options to put the team in the best situation every down regardless of the previous play. Fitz could not handle it.

This is it in a nutshell. I've coached pitchers, catchers and infielders for years. Footwork is so critically important in making any kind of throw. Fitz has some of the worst footwork I've ever seen. Got to put in the work to get that right.

[maroonmania]

This guy knows football. Not that that was my point. I was just mentioning him because he shared my exact thoughts while having no emotional ties to MSU...so he wasn't overreacting like I thought I could have been. Hearing it from a knowledgeable football friend that could give two shits about MSU, only reaffirmed my thoughts. Maybe I'm overreacting, but I hate what I see from Moorhead so far, and I'm worried he's about to wipe out 10 years of growth in a few seasons. Would be awful

I think I'm being very reasonable in saying we need a bigger data set than just this year with Fitz to truly judge. Fitz is a Mullen system guy that no other P5 school was going to touch with a ten foot pole out of HS and then he was asked to change systems in his SR year where he spent the entire offseason rehabbing a broken ankle. No, I didn't like what I saw from our QB or WRs this year BUT I also know that under Frankilin, PSU's offense sucked ass under Hackenburg until Moorhead showed up and got the offense going. I realize McSorley was an upgrade from Hackenburg (though NFL scouts loved him) but McSorley is not THAT good, as was demonstrated this season without Moorhead. I say the jury is still out until Moorhead can actually have a QB that is used to being a QB from HS on making decisions with the football and seeing how he produces in this system. Fitz was not that and would have needed way more time to get comfortable trying to run the true RPO. System teaching is done much more in the offseason than in Fall camp and when you are preparing for games week to week.

[1bigdawg]

The way we approach the pre-snap read is not working and is actually hurting us is waiting til 5 seconds to get your package in and 2 seconds to snap the ball.

This drives me nuts. Joe changes the play to adjust to the defensive alignment. The defense then changes. Yesterday, Iowa had a safety rushing toward the line on one play to blitz. When we did not snap the ball he back off. We adjusted our play for the safety blitz and they adjusted their defensive package and did not blitz. We ended up with a bad play call and got nothing.

In a worst case scenario against a great D coordinator, they could even set us up. Showing a defense with a weakness, then adjusting to make it a strength AFTER we changed the play. In many cases this year, we have out-smarted ourselves. I hope coach realizes this and makes adjstments. It should be obvious in the film.

[Bothrops]

Let's hold off some and see what Joe can do with his option at qb. Next season is going to be a tough one regardless, but if qb play improves a lot in 2019, then 2020 may be a good season.

[Dental Dawg33]

I'm giving Joe some time.

I've been a big Fitz homer and defended him in Ky & FL games since other parts of offense broke down and there were quite a few key drops. I watched FL game 3 times and he didn't play that bad in that game.

But he played selfish or was overwhelmed (or something similar) in 3 games for sure ... LSU, Bama, & Iowa. He keeps the ball way too much when there are other options, or at least he did in LSU & Iowa games. It's ridiculous how many times he carried the ball in those 2 games. Bama was the worst game I saw where he missed seeing open receivers. I have yet to figure out why the flea flicker that was called in Bama game with the primary receiver running wide open down the middle of the field, Nick did not even look his way. Did not even look at him. And he had time to make that throw, unlike in Ky & FL games when he had much less time on most of his throws. In either Arky or OM game down on goal line around 3 or 4 yd line, what looked like a pass play with 2 open receivers looking for ball on right side of end zone (it was well designed play), Nick didn't even look their way and just tucked it and ran up middle. He made the score but that's against Arky or OM, whichever one it was.

So I tend to think there was quite a bit of mis-execution in those games and Moorhead isn't throwing Nick under the bus by saying so. When in doubt, Nick keeps it every time. Or, maybe he just makes up his mind he's going to make it happen, not sure. I know yesterday I was getting pissed at him. I don't think Joe is calling all those QB up-the-middle plays. I think that is Nick deciding to keep it. Which also leads me to believe that even tho Nick says otherwise, I'm not sure he bought into Joe's philosophy. Or he didn't spend enough time doing his homework on the offense.

We do need to be a more disciplined and organized team tho in every game. The timeouts called in 3rd period were terrible and we played undisciplined football yesterday. Stupid penalties (and yea I know Iowa had 0 penalties but they ain't Bama ... we should've been able to overcome that). Our Oline play did regress from last year so Marcus needs to tighten that up. We much softer on Oline this year than we were last IMO, with essentially the same players.

There a quite a few things I see that are positive about this staff. There are some things they need to work on. I believe the staff may be somewhat stable relative to staying here, unlike Mullen's first few years, and really his entire tenure on the D side of the ball.

I think Joe really has a passion for doing well and I'm willing to give him some time to figure it out. I tend to believe he really wants to elevate MSU. One thing I believe I've noticed from Joe is he will look in the mirror. That's something our previous coach did not do very well.


This^^

JoMo definitely has plenty to work on and made some absolutely head scratching calls and management moves this year, but to call for his head is not justified imo. It?s hard not to grab the pitch fork bc of what was wasted this year, but execution was substandard a lot this year. Dozens of balls were dropped this year that hit receivers in the numbers or hands. I know Fitz throws a Randy Johnson fastball but you?re a D1 receiver in the SEC, no excuse catch the damn ball. Two drops played an enormous role in the Florida and Iowa losses. There were also countless times this year that receivers were running wide open down field and Fitz never gave them a passing glance. There were times that the RB should have been handed the ball for an 8 yard gain on first down instead of a Fitz keeper for a 2 yard loss. It was a combination of issues this year but plays were there a lot of time our guys just didn?t execute.
Now, JoMo has got to clean up the penalties, his game management, and offensive scheme. One player on defense should not be able to dictate what offensive play you run. And when your QB is incapable of executing your system, you have to take the decisions out of his hands and simplify.
I give joe a pass but he had got a lot of work to do and quick. He had one of the most talented teams in decades and underperformed any way you want to look at it. He is ultimately responsible so he must show improvement next year

[NCDawg]

I am disappointed also. However, what coach would want to come to MSU if you showed them that you would fire them after ONE year if they were only 8-4?

Plenty coaches would want to come to MSU as HC. Several years ago, Arkansas fired their coach after one game-the opening game after they lost to The Citadel. So I don't buy that argument that no coaches would want to come to MSU if we fired Moorhead after one year. It's probably a moot point anyway because Cohen's not going to do anything.

[fader2103]

Plenty coaches would want to come to MSU as HC. Several years ago, Arkansas fired their coach after one game-the opening game after they lost to The Citadel. So I don't buy that argument that no coaches would want to come to MSU if we fired Moorhead after one year. It's probably a moot point anyway because Cohen's not going to do anything.

You are not going to attract head coaches from mid-tier programs to leave their jobs to come to a middle of the road SEC program just to get fired in one year. The same people wanting to fire JOMO are the same that thinks we can go get a Matt Campell, Luke Fickell, or Lane Kiffin. These coaches are not leaving their programs just to go to a place where they can't build programs.

You have to give these coaches time to build THEIR program not get rid of them because of the first season results.

I bet most of the people are also those that can't stand when an athlete decides to transfer after one year at a program.

[Tbonewannabe]

Plenty coaches would want to come to MSU as HC. Several years ago, Arkansas fired their coach after one game-the opening game after they lost to The Citadel. So I don't buy that argument that no coaches would want to come to MSU if we fired Moorhead after one year. It's probably a moot point anyway because Cohen's not going to do anything.

Had to look it up but your point is that it happened in 1992 so it is valid?

1. So Moorhead was the top offensive coordinator in college football and comes to a school.
2. Wins 8 regular season games which is the 2nd most in 20 years.
3. Goes to the 2nd best Bowl game in 20 years.
4. Might possibly finish with the highest ranked recruiting class in around 20 years.
5. Had around the same offensive statistics as the previous year which was lauded by fans.

Then gets fired and we are to expect zero repercussions from firing someone like that.

Who knows because money talks but I doubt you get someone like Dan Mullen who was an up and comer to sign on when you are a QB not doing well in your system from getting fired.

Do you have any examples from this century that we could analyze?

[NCDawg]

Had to look it up but your point is that it happened in 1992 so it is valid?

1. So Moorhead was the top offensive coordinator in college football and comes to a school.
2. Wins 8 regular season games which is the 2nd most in 20 years.
3. Goes to the 2nd best Bowl game in 20 years.
4. Might possibly finish with the highest ranked recruiting class in around 20 years.
5. Had around the same offensive statistics as the previous year which was lauded by fans.

Then gets fired and we are to expect zero repercussions from firing someone like that.

Who knows because money talks but I doubt you get someone like Dan Mullen who was an up and comer to sign on when you are a QB not doing well in your system from getting fired.

Do you have any examples from this century that we could analyze?

I don't think it matters whether it is 1992 or 2018. Football is football. Some schools tolerate losing better than others. Like I said, it's a moot point anyway because Cohen isn't going to do anything.

[Tbonewannabe]

I don't think it matters whether it is 1992 or 2018. Football is football. Some schools tolerate losing better than others. Like I said, it's a moot point anyway because Cohen isn't going to do anything.

Well if the only time you can find is 1992 then it does matter. If we are the only school that is willing to shit can someone after an 8 win season being their first year then we would be the outlier. You start doing things like that and you end up paying McGriff to be your DC at $1 Mil a year for guaranteed 3 years.

[MarketingBully]

I'm giving Joe some time.

I've been a big Fitz homer and defended him in Ky & FL games since other parts of offense broke down and there were quite a few key drops. I watched FL game 3 times and he didn't play that bad in that game.

But he played selfish or was overwhelmed (or something similar) in 3 games for sure ... LSU, Bama, & Iowa. He keeps the ball way too much when there are other options, or at least he did in LSU & Iowa games. It's ridiculous how many times he carried the ball in those 2 games. Bama was the worst game I saw where he missed seeing open receivers. I have yet to figure out why the flea flicker that was called in Bama game with the primary receiver running wide open down the middle of the field, Nick did not even look his way. Did not even look at him. And he had time to make that throw, unlike in Ky & FL games when he had much less time on most of his throws. In either Arky or OM game down on goal line around 3 or 4 yd line, what looked like a pass play with 2 open receivers looking for ball on right side of end zone (it was well designed play), Nick didn't even look their way and just tucked it and ran up middle. He made the score but that's against Arky or OM, whichever one it was.

So I tend to think there was quite a bit of mis-execution in those games and Moorhead isn't throwing Nick under the bus by saying so. When in doubt, Nick keeps it every time. Or, maybe he just makes up his mind he's going to make it happen, not sure. I know yesterday I was getting pissed at him. I don't think Joe is calling all those QB up-the-middle plays. I think that is Nick deciding to keep it. Which also leads me to believe that even tho Nick says otherwise, I'm not sure he bought into Joe's philosophy. Or he didn't spend enough time doing his homework on the offense.

We do need to be a more disciplined and organized team tho in every game. The timeouts called in 3rd period were terrible and we played undisciplined football yesterday. Stupid penalties (and yea I know Iowa had 0 penalties but they ain't Bama ... we should've been able to overcome that). Our Oline play did regress from last year so Marcus needs to tighten that up. We much softer on Oline this year than we were last IMO, with essentially the same players.

There a quite a few things I see that are positive about this staff. There are some things they need to work on. I believe the staff may be somewhat stable relative to staying here, unlike Mullen's first few years, and really his entire tenure on the D side of the ball.

I think Joe really has a passion for doing well and I'm willing to give him some time to figure it out. I tend to believe he really wants to elevate MSU. One thing I believe I've noticed from Joe is he will look in the mirror. That's something our previous coach did not do very well.

Wow, incredible post. I agree with all of this.

[1bigdawg]

Plenty coaches would want to come to MSU as HC. Several years ago, Arkansas fired their coach after one game-the opening game after they lost to e Citadel. So I don't buy that argument that no coaches would want to come to MSU if we fired Moorhead after one year. It's probably a moot point anyway because Cohen's not going to do anything.

So, in 1992, Arkansas fired Jack Crowe after one game in his THIRD season. That is not in the same ballpark as firing a coach after an 8-4 first season.

[Todd4State]

So, in 1992, Arkansas fired Jack Crowe after one game in his THIRD season. That is not in the same ballpark as firing a coach after an 8-4 first season.

I was about to say the exact same thing. Plus The Citadel is a FCS team. We lost to four top 15 teams and a bowl team that won 9 games this year in year one. If we lose to Abeline Christian next year by all means we should fire Joe.


We're a lot closer to this except we had a better season this year because we didn't lose to anyone close to a 6-7 Vanderbilt team.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Georgia_Bulldogs_football_team

[Scared_Hitless]

I am just can't understand the outrage when we have a coach that goes 8-4 with some good wins mixed in. You can do the what if scenario every season, sure we should have beaten Florida and Iowa to get 10 wins. Tell Guidry and Osiris to catch the ball easy enough right. Could have gotten 10 wins last season with an easier schedule, but we still didn't and finished with an Egg Bowl Loss. Its all cyclical I just dont understand the folks fearing we are about to enter a tail spin.

[thf24]

Its all cyclical I just dont understand the folks fearing we are about to enter a tail spin.

Combination of way too much self-esteem tied up in the success of sports teams and the desire for everyone to be aware of how smart they are.

[NCDawg]

So, in 1992, Arkansas fired Jack Crowe after one game in his THIRD season. That is not in the same ballpark as firing a coach after an 8-4 first season.

Not to belabor the point but Ellis Johnson was fired at USM after one season (2012), primarily because he went 0-12. I agree this is very different from going 8-5. I'm sure Moorhead won't be fired after this year, but I hope he shows significant improvement next year. We had too much talent on this year's team to end up with an 8-5 record.

[Tbonewannabe]

Not to belabor the point but Ellis Johnson was fired at USM after one season (2012), primarily because he went 0-12. I agree this is very different from going 8-5. I'm sure Moorhead won't be fired after this year, but I hope he shows significant improvement next year. We had too much talent on this year's team to end up with an 8-5 record.

We also had too much talent in 2011 and 2013 and 2016 for those records but it is what it is. Moorhead now has his learning year in the SEC so training wheels off.

[Sienfield]

So, in 1992, Arkansas fired Jack Crowe after one game in his THIRD season. That is not in the same ballpark as firing a coach after an 8-4 first season.

Major Applewhite was fired last week after finishing the regular season 8-4. His 2017 team was 7-5. The 2018 season was an improvement over the 2017 season. I don't know if they have found a replacement yet though.

Now, I'm not advocating firing JoMo but just pointing out some schools expect high standards.

[Tbonewannabe]

Major Applewhite was fired last week after finishing the regular season 8-4. His 2017 team was 7-5. The 2018 season was an improvement over the 2017 season. I don't know if they have found a replacement yet though.

Now, I'm not advocating firing JoMo but just pointing out some schools expect high standards.

There was also some turmoil with him so I am not sure it came down to just losing his last game even though Army absolutely killed them.

[Todd4State]

I am just can't understand the outrage when we have a coach that goes 8-4 with some good wins mixed in. You can do the what if scenario every season, sure we should have beaten Florida and Iowa to get 10 wins. Tell Guidry and Osiris to catch the ball easy enough right. Could have gotten 10 wins last season with an easier schedule, but we still didn't and finished with an Egg Bowl Loss. Its all cyclical I just dont understand the folks fearing we are about to enter a tail spin.


I see fans consistently talking about how we "wasted a once in a lifetime defense". But I think we will actually reload by 2021 on that side of the ball based on what we are recruiting with a d-line that is absolutely potentially as good as what we had this year with depth. We also have a four star safety in Marcus Murphy and DB/CB in Jarrion Jones signed or already on the team and they will be upperclassmen by that time to go with some promising linebackers like Aaron Brule, Nathaniel Watson, and Ani I. who is a four star edge player. The thing that we all underestimated was the offense and Fitz's ability to grow- and that's what did us in. And why we have to start hauling in four stars on the offensive side of the ball at the same rate as we are on defense right now. Some people want to deny it- but Gonzalez and Hevesy and their recruiting reared it's ugly head this year at WR and OL. More specifically OT where we started two sophomores who struggled at times. Getting Cross and hopefully Mingo would go towards correcting that. Along with Heath, Mason, and Tulu who are all four star WR's. The only way we're going to win 10 games in the SEC is to recruit at a high level on BOTH sides of the ball.


Not to belabor the point but Ellis Johnson was fired at USM after one season (2012), primarily because he went 0-12. I agree this is very different from going 8-5. I'm sure Moorhead won't be fired after this year, but I hope he shows significant improvement next year. We had too much talent on this year's team to end up with an 8-5 record.


In light of how Larry Fedora has left UNC and the fact that Todd Monken went 1-11 the next year I think USM blamed Ellis Johnson too much.


Major Applewhite was fired last week after finishing the regular season 8-4. His 2017 team was 7-5. The 2018 season was an improvement over the 2017 season. I don't know if they have found a replacement yet though.

Now, I'm not advocating firing JoMo but just pointing out some schools expect high standards.

It sounds like Houston has or had Dana Holgerson lined up and ready to go. If Cohen fires Joe next year he better have someone good lined up before hand. And not get on the radio and run his mouth about them before the ink is dry.

[ShotgunDawg]

2 drop passes away from 10-3

[OSCAR]

He said this year we got to experience life as an LSU fan, where you have a Championship caliber D but a one dimensional offense with no passing game at all. He said the minute he knew Moorhead wasn't a SEC coach was when he saw Fitzgerald actually regress early in the season. He said the sign of a good offensive minded head coach is when the QB play improves immediately, bc that means they're developing the QB while also catering to their QB's strengths to generate offense. His examples were Mullen at State, Mullen with Franks, Herman with Ehrlinger and Jimbo with Mond. And I couldn't agree with him more. Guys, Fitz got no better this year, and Moorhead made no adjustments to still be able to generate offense....this guy isn't the answer, and will only set us back the next few years. I hate to say it, but unless Cohen grows a pair like no other MSU AD has ever had and fires him this offseason...we're likely going to be circling the drain the next few years and watching everything Mullen built disintegrate before our eyes. Our team will be McCorvey/Ellis Johnson 2.0 where we have no offense and just hope our D can shut everyone down and we can find a way to 6 wins.

I may be wrong, and hope I am because I know we're stuck with his ass for 3 more years more than likely.... but I've been around MSU football a LONG time and I feel like I see exactly where this is heading. Sometimes having an outsiders perspective regurgitate your thoughts, like my LSU buddy did, makes you realize that what you're thinking is probably not just the frustration talking. Maybe I'm wrong though. Thoughts
I don?t see how anyone really could argue with any of that. I had the same thoughts about Dan/Franks and Jimbo/Mond during the season.

[redstickdawg]

Not to belabor the point but Ellis Johnson was fired at USM after one season (2012), primarily because he went 0-12. I agree this is very different from going 8-5. I'm sure Moorhead won't be fired after this year, but I hope he shows significant improvement next year. We had too much talent on this year's team to end up with an 8-5 record.

My issue with JoMo is that the same mistakes that cost us against ky and uf were evident and the difference in the game against iowa. The dropped passes, poor play calls and lack of discipline were not addressed in a positive manner. If he attempted to change these this is even more troubling as it shows an inability to lead and or coach. He must show marked improvement next year or the barbarians will be at the gates calling for his head.

[Goldendawg]

Two things that has soured me on Jomo and I hope he can get it turned around is scheme and player development. The way we approach the pre-snap read is not working and is actually hurting us is waiting til 5 seconds to get your package in and 2 seconds to snap the ball. Now the defense is controlling what the read will be and knows when the ball will be snapped. Also the lack of player development. KT is talented. We have seen what he can do and what he is capable of. If Jomo can't develop him what makes you think he can do it with the nest coming of Tom Brady. I have said this and I will continue to say it but JOMO needs to hire a competent QB coach who can TEACH the RPO to KT and the other QBs.

Jomo seems to me as stubborn with his "offense" this past year as Croom and Woody were with their "West Coast O". I have heard good coaches adapt their offense to the abilities of the players, not the opposite he tried to force. I think he interviewed well and is in over his head in the SEC. He turned 10 -2 talent into a 8 - 5 disappointment, a chance I don't see happening under him anytime soon. "Get me your ring sizes, clear shelf room for a Heisman, Championship Standard, no titles since 41", what about winning the West in 98? I don't think his RPO, will ever work against good, fast SEC D's, especially when you finally have over analysed the D and get the play in in with 10 or less seconds on the play clock. JMO and I am still disgusted over 2018.

[Todd4State]

My issue with JoMo is that the same mistakes that cost us against ky and uf were evident and the difference in the game against iowa. The dropped passes, poor play calls and lack of discipline were not addressed in a positive manner. If he attempted to change these this is even more troubling as it shows an inability to lead and or coach. He must show marked improvement next year or the barbarians will be at the gates calling for his head.

My guess as to what happened with that is after we lost a couple of games with those mistakes and people started to criticize them the team straightened up until the Egg Bowl. After that everyone was patting them on the back and they went back to their old ways. That is something that has to be fixed. The season isn't over until the bowl game ends.

[Todd4State]

Jomo seems to me as stubborn with his "offense" this past year as Croom and Woody were with their "West Coast O". I have heard good coaches adapt their offense to the abilities of the players, not the opposite he tried to force. I think he interviewed well and is in over his head in the SEC. He turned 10 -2 talent into a 8 - 5 disappointment, a chance I don't see happening under him anytime soon. "Get me your ring sizes, clear shelf room for a Heisman, Championship Standard, no titles since 41", what about winning the West in 98? I don't think his RPO, will ever work against good, fast SEC D's, especially when you finally have over analysed the D and get the play in in with 10 or less seconds on the play clock. JMO and I am still disgusted over 2018.

But again- how do you adjust to a QB that has difficulty reading defenses even at an elementary level? Just hand it off every time? You can't do that for long in today's game with the defenses out there right now. And if you watch Penn State from last year Joe did adjust as much as he could. We had very little deep passing game and the screen game was almost totally taken out because Nick would fire 100 MPH fastballs every time we ran one. And the rare time we did try to go back to the screen game it usually resulted in an incompletion or like yesterday it resulted in an INT.

At some point it gets so predictable it doesn't work either. The Auburn game where everyone loved the play calling we scored 23 points compared to 22 yesterday. That's my point.

[Goldendawg]

My guess as to what happened with that is after we lost a couple of games with those mistakes and people started to criticize them the team straightened up until the Egg Bowl. After that everyone was patting them on the back and they went back to their old ways. That is something that has to be fixed. The season isn't over until the bowl game ends.

Hey, I will admit several of our seasons with Dan ended after his annual loss to bama set off that year's job search with little prep for the Egg or some of the bowls. Hail State!

[Todd4State]

Hey, I will admit several of our seasons with Dan ended after his annual loss to bama set off that year's job search with little prep for the Egg or some of the bowls. Hail State!

What blew my mind was the MSU administration letting him do it year after year. I was more mad at Stricklin than anything. Of course we typically won the bowl after the job search season ended when Dan realized he wasn't going anywhere.

[Goldendawg]

But again- how do you adjust to a QB that has difficulty reading defenses even at an elementary level? Just hand it off every time? You can't do that for long in today's game with the defenses out there right now. And if you watch Penn State from last year Joe did adjust as much as he could. We had very little deep passing game and the screen game was almost totally taken out because Nick would fire 100 MPH fastballs every time we ran one. And the rare time we did try to go back to the screen game it usually resulted in an incompletion or like yesterday it resulted in an INT.

At some point it gets so predictable it doesn't work either. The Auburn game where everyone loved the play calling we scored 23 points compared to 22 yesterday. That's my point.

I don't remember how the D contributed in the 23 against AU, they set up the O at least on Gay's int. yesterday. Jo and his staff's ability to recruit highly skilled O players over our big name SEC rivals will determine if this O can defeat/outsmart the tough SEC D's. Time will tell and it will take more than one top 15 class on O. I learned what RTDB meant from this board. Got a new one that is needed also: GTDPIQ, Get the D**N play in faster. Hail State!

[Todd4State]

I don't remember how the D contributed in the 23 against AU, they set up the O at least on Gay's int. yesterday. Jo and his staff's ability to recruit highly skilled O players over our big name SEC rivals will determine if this O can defeat/outsmart the tough SEC D's. Time will tell and it will take more than one top 15 class on O. I learned what RTDB meant from this board. Got a new one that is needed also: GTDPIQ, Get the D**N play in faster. Hail State!

You're right about the recruiting. Our defense wasn't built on one class alone either.

[justwin]

He said this year we got to experience life as an LSU fan, where you have a Championship caliber D but a one dimensional offense with no passing game at all. He said the minute he knew Moorhead wasn't a SEC coach was when he saw Fitzgerald actually regress early in the season. He said the sign of a good offensive minded head coach is when the QB play improves immediately, bc that means they're developing the QB while also catering to their QB's strengths to generate offense. His examples were Mullen at State, Mullen with Franks, Herman with Ehrlinger and Jimbo with Mond. And I couldn't agree with him more. Guys, Fitz got no better this year, and Moorhead made no adjustments to still be able to generate offense....this guy isn't the answer, and will only set us back the next few years. I hate to say it, but unless Cohen grows a pair like no other MSU AD has ever had and fires him this offseason...we're likely going to be circling the drain the next few years and watching everything Mullen built disintegrate before our eyes. Our team will be McCorvey/Ellis Johnson 2.0 where we have no offense and just hope our D can shut everyone down and we can find a way to 6 wins.

I may be wrong, and hope I am because I know we're stuck with his ass for 3 more years more than likely.... but I've been around MSU football a LONG time and I feel like I see exactly where this is heading. Sometimes having an outsiders perspective regurgitate your thoughts, like my LSU buddy did, makes you realize that what you're thinking is probably not just the frustration talking. Maybe I'm wrong though. Thoughts

if you really watch the tape, you will see that Moorhead made countless adjustments to aid Fitzgerald. Watch the actual play and not the result. Go as far back to UK. There is so many options in Joe's offense, but when your QB has either already decided where to go with the ball presnap or maybe makes one read regardless of run or pass play, then incredibly tough to be productive. This is the mental part of it.

Removing the passing game all together, Fitz misread RUNNING PLAYS 15-20 games / game. Think about that. That's leaving a few tds and 100+ yds out there every game. How many of the run plays did he never truly read it but instead was looking for where to cut. How many times did you see Kylin or Aeris or Gibson throw their hands up on a wide ass open sweep only to NEVER get the ball. How man different variations of getting the ball to the RB on the edges did Joe's O present to Fitz only to see Fitz read running up the middle in a cloud of dust. In Fitz's mind, it's 3rd and 2 and I can get hit 5 times by DL & LBs and get 3 for the first down instead of pitch it to the RB on the sweep for 30+ yds when the entire front 9 of the D is keying on Fitz.

vs UK ~ Fitz had 16 carries; Aeris & Kylin had 12
vs UF ~ 20 to their 12
vs LSU ~ 23 to their 14
same for Iowa.

Fitz is a one read player, at best. that's why we lost.

Then, all you have to do on the passing side is cut half of the uncatchable balls. Fitz would literally throw 10+ balls / game out of bounds or in the dirt skip to them. 10 / game. You can't recover from that. That's not arm strength or measurables, that's playing catch.

Look, Fitz missed the first game for drugs, most likely. Then, the off week before LSU he goes to rave in UGA and chills out on the weekend. You really think any other SEC qb does that? I could not believe he told Peter Burns he left Starkville for the weekend to to Atlanta to chill & party.

He's tough. give him that. But Fitz had ample surrounding talent to be more than a .500 winning % as a starter. he's the guy in between.

As for LSU, they lose b/c of culture. Not their QB. LSU fans blaming their QB is so convenient. LSU signs 4* qbs dam near every year or gets them to transfer in. 2 years ago, the DE sat out the spring & summer, gained 50 lbs, missed fall camp and O starts him game 1. that's cultural. The same swagger that wins LSU a few games a year they probably shouldn't is the same swagger that costs them in the big games that matter.

I'm not trying to be hard on your, but it's not all gloom & doom.

[justwin]

2 drop passes away from 10-3

true, but more like 10-15 add'l running back carries / game to be 11-2. We win KY, UF, Iowa, and proably LSU if Kylin / Aeris get 30+ totes combined. For 2018 and THIS team, that's what was necessary and Fitz couldn't get them the ball. But certainly the dropped passes hurt too.

[BhamDawg205]

Two things that has soured me on Jomo and I hope he can get it turned around is scheme and player development. The way we approach the pre-snap read is not working and is actually hurting us is waiting til 5 seconds to get your package in and 2 seconds to snap the ball. Now the defense is controlling what the read will be and knows when the ball will be snapped. Also the lack of player development. KT is talented. We have seen what he can do and what he is capable of. If Jomo can't develop him what makes you think he can do it with the nest coming of Tom Brady. I have said this and I will continue to say it but JOMO needs to hire a competent QB coach who can TEACH the RPO to KT and the other QBs.

This and to add....
What was our identity? RO or RPO? His in-game or halftime adjustments are MEH. I chalk this year to 1st year HC. Hell what was his game plan for the bowl? Saw way too many gimmicky plays in that game.