The Sun Rose This Morning & It's Time to Look Forward

[ShotgunDawg]

The 2018 season is now over. It will forever be what it is & nothing can change that. Today is the start of the 2019 season & it's time to look forward.

IMO, today marks day 1 of this being Joe Moorhead's program. I think up until this point, with this 2018 roster, many considered him the caretaker of Mullen's program, but starting today, Moorhead is no longer a caretaker, it is his program & everything we do must be done in support of the vision HE wants.

With that being said, 2019 will be a huge year for Moorhead. Not because I expect him to compete for Atlanta, but because, generally, year 2 is when you find out if you have a good coach or not. We can look at numerous coaches to see this trend: Kirby Smart - 8-5 in year 1 followed up by 13-2 in year 2; Nick Saban at Bama, & numerous other examples. Point is, it doesn't take till year 3 or 4 for a coach to show that he's the man for the job. That usually happens in year 2 & that's what I'll want to see out of Moorhead next year.

- I want to see more accountability & discipline in 2019
- I want to see offensive players develop.
- I want to the running backs more involved
- I want to WRs that have hands instead of frying pans attached to their wrists.
- I want to see the future at QB. Whoever that may be.
- I want to see the offense SEC-ified.

As for the state of our program, we've got to figure out how to stop having massive holes our roster. We don't have to recruit 5 stars at every position like Bama & UGA to have great teams & go to NY6 bowl games (which is the new goal); we just need to stop having massive holes on our roster. If the talent we average on defense was averaged on offense, we are a NY6 team. You can look at pretty much every MSU team over the the past decade & find one position unit that was awful & cost us games. In recruiting that is that is the next step. The next step is not recruiting at the blue blood level. The next step is to not miss on the same position group year after year after year & the issue is that that position isn't always the same one: in 2015 it was the OL, in 2016 it was RB & WR, in 2017 it was WR & in 2018 it was WR & a limited QB.

Point is, the recruiting & development must be more well rounded. When I watch the many of the NY6 teams play, I believe MSU can match up with them at most positions, but they are complete teams with very little drop off from position unit to unit, while we may be slightly better than them at 3 out of 5 position units while completely inept at the other two.

Going forward, I feel like we are in a similar spot right now as we were after the 2012 (we believe) season in which we lost to Northwestern in the Gator Bowl in an awful, egregious game for Mullen. Following that game, we did not rebound until Dak came on in the 2013 season. That's what Moorhead MUST find. We MUST find the next MSU QB that is capable of taking us to great heights. Out of Moorhead, I want to see a plan. I don't to see a shit show in the first game next year because he can't pick a QB (Mullen in the South Al loss). I want to see conviction & an effort put forth to completely support that guy. Additionally, I like where the program is headed in the trenches. Our OL & DL should be solid for year to come, but we've got to upgrade our skill positions as we are dreadfully limited at those currently.

[msstate7]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

[ShotgunDawg]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

Mostly correct. The new goals & standard should be set at NY6 or Citrus Bowl.

You care correct that we won't out recruit many of these teams but we should be within the talent range to beat LSU, Kentucky, Penn State, Florida, ND, & maybe Michigan if we played them.

[basedog]

It's funny to me, I've read for years the same folks who wanted Mullen gone and kept saying how terrible a recruiter he and staff were. Now expectations by many were this is our best team maybe ever so Joe is the reason we "only won 8" and IF Dan would have stuck around we win 10 maybe 11.

As far as Joe, I've said it once and I will say it again, he will review, make changes and be much prepared and do a better job 2019. Him being a rookie had much to learn about the Sec, for you guys that don't understand mostly never have been a coach or a coaching meeting. Yes he made mistakes, but I'm pretty sure he was thinking of the future with his system and not just one year.

You got to give Joe a few years to really know, players have to make plays, they didn't yesterday, so I hope we get or improve in recruiting, we need speed and play makers on offense. That was Dan's weakness in recruiting and that showed this year especially.

Gonna be interesting to see what changes if any with staff and going forward with Joe's program.


HailState!

[BrunswickDawg]

QB's and WR - seem's like since I started following State 30 years ago this has been the Achilles Heel of our program. When we had very good WR, we have struggled to get them the ball. When we have had better QB's, we have stone hands and no speed. I have only seen 3 seasons when I thought we had quality players at both positions - '99, '14 & '15. And in '15 we had no RB (which figures).

[Tbonewannabe]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

Depends on if you ever want to compete with Bama or that level team. That requires explosive plays and a decent to good passing attack. You can't count on the once every 10 years playcalling like in 2017 when you can actually run on Bama. That is typically a recipe for disaster.

[ShotgunDawg]

QB's and WR - seem's like since I started following State 30 years ago this has been the Achilles Heel of our program. When we had very good WR, we have struggled to get them the ball. When we have had better QB's, we have stone hands and no speed. I have only seen 3 seasons when I thought we had quality players at both positions - '99, '14 & '15. And in '15 we had no RB (which figures).

But in 2015, we had an awful OL.

My point is that the recruiting doesn't necessarily have to go from high 3/low 4 star type players to high 4/5 star types. If we simply fielded an entire team full of low 4 star type players, we would be better than this odd collection of a bunch a 4 stars, 1 5 star, & 3 dudes that have no business playing SEC football.

If believe that you are only as strong as your weakest link, then our weakest links have been WAAAYYYY too weak

[msstate7]

Depends on if you ever want to compete with Bama or that level team. That requires explosive plays and a decent to good passing attack. You can't count on the once every 10 years playcalling like in 2017 when you can actually run on Bama. That is typically a recipe for disaster.

Who has competed on the national level with Bama? OM got lucky a couple times, but didn't win the west either year. Clemson, Georgia, Ohio state, and occasionally auburn... that's it. They're all top 10 recruiting schools.

ETA... we should be shooting for NY6 bowls/citrus every year bc we ain't getting in the playoffs with saban and smart around

[ShotgunDawg]

Depends on if you ever want to compete with Bama or that level team. That requires explosive plays and a decent to good passing attack. You can't count on the once every 10 years playcalling like in 2017 when you can actually run on Bama. That is typically a recipe for disaster.

IMO we need to worry less about beating Bama right now & more about not being so lopsided in our talent (Good quote Liverpool) that we are forced into playing football games with one hand because the other hand is a numb

[Tbonewannabe]

QB's and WR - seem's like since I started following State 30 years ago this has been the Achilles Heel of our program. When we had very good WR, we have struggled to get them the ball Especially if that WR banged the QB's girlfriend. When we have had better QB's, we have stone hands and no speed. I have only seen 3 seasons when I thought we had quality players at both positions - '99, '14 & '15. And in '15 we had no RB (which figures).

fify.

The only reason we didn't do better with Moulds is Taite refused to throw him the ball.

When is the last truly explosive WR that was a game breaker that we had? I don't know if I would put Fred Ross in that category but maybe him or Chad Bumphis.

[Scared_Hitless]

First and Foremost we need better offensive talent. Can Moorhead Recruit this and develop it. Recruiting looks like a yes, development remains to be seen we regressed on O-Line and QB this year. WRs were bad both years so that is a wash. On defense we improved at every level. Keep that staff together. It works and the talent while it will dip is still very good.

Moorhead needs to improve as a play caller and disciplinarian. We were bad to often and kids while they played hard were unhinged.
Marcus Johnson needs to figure out the O-Line scheme. We have to many instances of getting free rushers that kill drives.
Getsy what can I say your WRs were bad just bad. Do better and we need to recruit better here.
Huff you are okay an ace recruiter and our RBs seemed to be equal or better. Still a MStake not using Aries all season.

Year 2 will be the tell all, can KT be the guy or is it Mayden or Schrader? How far do we fall defensively? Do we beat any teams we shouldnt?

[Tbonewannabe]

Who has competed on the national level with Bama? OM got lucky a couple times, but didn't win the west either year. Clemson, Georgia, Ohio state, and occasionally auburn... that's it. They're all top 10 recruiting schools.

ETA... we should be shooting for NY6 bowls/citrus every year bc we ain't getting in the playoffs with saban and smart around

Well, Mullen rarely competed with good to great teams so if you are fine winning 6-8 games every year then I guess we need to not risk it and just get another coach who just runs the ball. We occasionally did well but most of the time it ended up like UGA and Auburn last year. Mullen wouldn't have done any better against Bama this year. When Mullen couldn't run the ball we reverted to QB draws almost every play so not sure why so many people are complaining.

Our schedule was actually tougher this year than last year and someone linked the offensive stats and they were pretty much better all across the board. Am I pissed that we didn't take advantage of the best defense since 99? Yes I am extremely disappointed but not enough to fire a coaching staff who is recruiting better than we have in a long time.

If Key or Mayden look completely lost next year then Schraeder better be the answer and play as a freshman. Next year is all on Moorhead. It isn't like he could have benched Fitz and not had torches and pitchforks at his door immediately. Fitz was just not good in this offense. He actually ran the offense correctly only a handful of times. Unfortunately, Fitz also thought he was great which actually lead to a worse season than expected. One interview toward the end of the year, Fitz said he mastered the offense which he definitely did not.

[starkvegasdawg]

The only reason we didn't do better with Moulds is Taite refused to throw him the ball.

I remember The Reflector ran an op ed telling Moulds to keep his head up as he would soon be getting paid in the NFL. Heard a rumor that after that Peach Bowl loss where Moulds ran open all game and Taite refused to throw it to him the OL beat the unholy hell out of Taite for costing them the game.

[BrunswickDawg]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

You know you say that - but we out rushed Kentucky this year. By a lot. 186 to 166 "in conference", and 228 to 184 overall; total rushing yards of 2907 vs. 2592. Their running game got shut down in their 3 losses (less than 90 yards total in each) just like ours did in 3 of our 5 losses. Kentucky's performance offensively was actually pretty close ours - We had 316 ypg vs 314 "in conference" and 397 to 361 overall.

[msstate7]

Well, Mullen rarely competed with good to great teams so if you are fine winning 6-8 games every year then I guess we need to not risk it and just get another coach who just runs the ball. We occasionally did well but most of the time it ended up like UGA and Auburn last year. Mullen wouldn't have done any better against Bama this year. When Mullen couldn't run the ball we reverted to QB draws almost every play so not sure why so many people are complaining.

Our schedule was actually tougher this year than last year and someone linked the offensive stats and they were pretty much better all across the board. Am I pissed that we didn't take advantage of the best defense since 99? Yes I am extremely disappointed but not enough to fire a coaching staff who is recruiting better than we have in a long time.

If Key or Mayden look completely lost next year then Schraeder better be the answer and play as a freshman. Next year is all on Moorhead. It isn't like he could have benched Fitz and not had torches and pitchforks at his door immediately. Fitz was just not good in this offense. He actually ran the offense correctly only a handful of times. Unfortunately, Fitz also thought he was great which actually lead to a worse season than expected. One interview toward the end of the year, Fitz said he mastered the offense which he definitely did not.

Mullen's last 4 years' win totals: 10, 9, 6, 9 (Mullen didn't get 9th win, but it was his team)

That's pretty good in my book

Moorhead said no one had ever picked his offense up as fast as us.

[WeWonItAll(Most)]

Mullen's last 4 years' win totals: 10, 9, 6, 9 (Mullen didn't get 9th win, but it was his team)

That's pretty good in my book

Moorhead said no one had ever picked his offense up as fast as us.

So 10, 9, 6 and 9 wins in years 6, 7, 8, and 9 is pretty good in your book but 8 wins in year 1 leads to you being in a constant state of melting?

[Gutter Cobreh]

So 10, 9, 6 and 9 wins in years 6, 7, 8, and 9 is pretty good in your book but 8 wins in year 1 leads to you being in a constant state of melting?

BOOM! Rep. given.

[msstate7]

So 10, 9, 6 and 9 wins in years 6, 7, 8, and 9 is pretty good in your book but 8 wins in year 1 leads to you being in a constant state of melting?

Vegas o/u was 8.5 this season without bowl. We didn't even get the over counting the bowl. We were the favorite in 10 games this season

[Tbonewannabe]

Mullen's last 4 years' win totals: 10, 9, 6, 9 (Mullen didn't get 9th win, but it was his team)

That's pretty good in my book

Moorhead said no one had ever picked his offense up as fast as us.

And Moorhead was a Guidry catching a pass that hit him in the chest from 9 wins and not including Mitchell dropping a TD that would probably have lead to a UF win. So you want to fire a guy for 2 dropped passes when you just said that 9 wins is damn good?

[Dawg61]

I want to see you take 6 days off a week from this site and on the 7th day I will. Nobody is reading that novel.

[basedog]

I want to see you take 6 days off a week from this site and on the 7th day I will. Nobody is reading that novel.

Are you saying he needs to be in a rehab for message boards****

LOL

[Tbonewannabe]

Vegas o/u was 8.5 this season without bowl. We didn't even get the over counting the bowl. We were the favorite in 10 games this season

I wonder what Vegas had UK? That could be the 0.5 difference right there. Truth is Mullen going to UF moved that game from a win to a push. Mullen is a good coach and took over a top 15 talent wise team.

The truth is the ceiling with Mullen here was probably 10 wins. We were more than likely not winning at LSU or Bama. Auburn and A&M were toss ups along with UK. No one knows how UK would have turned out but if we had 160 yards of penalties then Mullen loses that game also. UF is the game you don't know about because not getting Mullen would have made UF go after someone else. Who knows if someone else has UF playing well but Mullen got them to a NY6 where they beat the hell out of Michigan. You don't win that many games without talent.

Moorhead is very well thought of or he wouldn't have won the Offensive Coach of the Year. He was successful before going to Penn St so it just wasn't having Saquon and Trace on offense.

[basedog]

I wonder what Vegas had UK? That could be the 0.5 difference right there. Truth is Mullen going to UF moved that game from a win to a push. Mullen is a good coach and took over a top 15 talent wise team.

The truth is the ceiling with Mullen here was probably 10 wins. We were more than likely not winning at LSU or Bama. Auburn and A&M were toss ups along with UK. No one knows how UK would have turned out but if we had 160 yards of penalties then Mullen loses that game also. UF is the game you don't know about because not getting Mullen would have made UF go after someone else. Who knows if someone else has UF playing well but Mullen got them to a NY6 where they beat the hell out of Michigan. You don't win that many games without talent.

Moorhead is very well thought of or he wouldn't have won the Offensive Coach of the Year. He was successful before going to Penn St so it just wasn't having Saquon and Trace on offense.

+1

[Tbonewannabe]

Mullen's last 4 years' win totals: 10, 9, 6, 9 (Mullen didn't get 9th win, but it was his team)

That's pretty good in my book

Moorhead said no one had ever picked his offense up as fast as us.

Honestly this is probably what pissed me off the most. He blew a lot of smoke up our ass about this team. Not sure if he really believed it or if he was trying to give the team confidence. He was a Carl Torbush hire away from missing a bowl game like Mullen did his first year.

Honestly his offense was similar to Mullen's in that we beat the crap out of bad defenses but then got shut down against good ones. Auburn is the head scratcher because if he just uses that gameplan then we probably win 9 or 10 games instead of 8.

[msstate7]

And Moorhead was a Guidry catching a pass that hit him in the chest from 9 wins and not including Mitchell dropping a TD that would probably have lead to a UF win. So you want to fire a guy for 2 dropped passes when you just said that 9 wins is damn good?

I don't wanna fire him, yet. You guys will start to see it my way more next season though. Moorhead is nothing special, and we can't have just a decent coach and survive in our conference

[dawgs]

It's funny to me, I've read for years the same folks who wanted Mullen gone and kept saying how terrible a recruiter he and staff were. Now expectations by many were this is our best team maybe ever so Joe is the reason we "only won 8" and IF Dan would have stuck around we win 10 maybe 11.


I do think Moorhead was the reason we only won 8 instead of 10 or 11 games. Not because I think Mullen is the better coach necessarily, but the offensive roster was built for Mullen's offense, not Moorhead's. Time will tell if ultimately Moorhead is worse, equal to, or better than Mullen, and I think next year will be when we get a better idea on what we can expect from the Moorhead era. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if shrader wins the job. True freshmen QBs start every year for programs better and worse than ours, and if shrader is the best passer we got, I'd wanna see what how a QB who can pass transforms the offense. Moorhead's tenure likely rides on shrader panning out.

[dawgs]

And Moorhead was a Guidry catching a pass that hit him in the chest from 9 wins and not including Mitchell dropping a TD that would probably have lead to a UF win. So you want to fire a guy for 2 dropped passes when you just said that 9 wins is damn good?

Yeah, basically 2 dropped passes from 10-3 and everyone fired up for Moorhead. There's room for improvement by Moorhead for sure, hopefully he's more open to adjustments than Mullen was, but it doesn't matter who the coach is when your top WRs drop TD passes (on the semi-rare occurrence that our QB puts the ball on target).

[basedog]

I do think Moorhead was the reason we only won 8 instead of 10 or 11 games. Not because I think Mullen is the better coach necessarily, but the offensive roster was built for Mullen's offense, not Moorhead's. Time will tell if ultimately Moorhead is worse, equal to, or better than Mullen, and I think next year will be when we get a better idea on what we can expect from the Moorhead era. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if shrader wins the job. True freshmen QBs start every year for programs better and worse than ours, and if shrader is the best passer we got, I'd wanna see what how a QB who can pass transforms the offense. Moorhead's tenure likely rides on shrader panning out.

I agree.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

Yep. And that sits squarely on Moorhead. He didnt do what we could do, he did what he wanted. Thats not a good sign

[Doggie_Style]

I don't wanna fire him, yet. You guys will start to see it my way more next season though. Moorhead is nothing special, and we can't have just a decent coach and survive in our conference

and Moorhead proved yesterday that he intends to change nothing as he made no substantial changes over the course of the last 4 months....next year will be ugly

[1bigdawg]

With that being said, 2019 will be a huge year for Moorhead. Not because I expect him to compete for Atlanta, but because, generally, year 2 is when you find out if you have a good coach or not. We can look at numerous coaches to see this trend: Kirby Smart - 8-5 in year 1 followed up by 13-2 in year 2; Nick Saban at Bama, & numerous other examples. Point is, it doesn't take till year 3 or 4 for a coach to show that he's the man for the job. That usually happens in year 2 & that's what I'll want to see out of Moorhead next year.

This is a great observation. Herman at Texas and even Mullen at MSU are further examples. One more: Moorhead at Fordham.

I am not optimistic or pessimistic, really, but an anxious to see how the next season goes. We have all the traditional "toss-up" games on the road except Ole Miss. If we win at home against the OOcs and Kentucky and Ole Miss, that gets us to six. To do better we have to either beat an Alabama or LSU at home or win against A&M, Auburn, Tennessee or Arkansas. I put Arkansas in the likely column. The rest are really tough.

IF the offense comes around ans is top 25 or so, I believe we can have a great season because the defense wiil be stout again. (Not as good as this year, but stout.) With a decent offense we can win the above 7 plus 2 more. With this years O, we will struggle for 6

[1bigdawg]

And Moorhead was a Guidry catching a pass that hit him in the chest from 9 wins and not including Mitchell dropping a TD that would probably have lead to a UF win. So you want to fire a guy for 2 dropped passes when you just said that 9 wins is damn good?

While the above is true, even great receivers drop passes sometimes. It is Moorhead's job to make sure that one play is not the difference in those games.

[dawgday166]

I don't wanna fire him, yet. You guys will start to see it my way more next season though. Moorhead is nothing special, and we can't have just a decent coach and survive in our conference

I don't know which way it will go. You're a stats guy tho. How many years did Mullen have a top 30 offense vs a top 30 defense? You'll find that Mullen won with D much more than O. Will Moorhead's O be as good as Mullen's doing forward? ... I don't know but if Shoop and D staff stays, we should be top 30 in D most every year and probably top 20.

[msu15]

You guys will start to see it my way

Come on man......

[basedog]

While the above is true, even great receivers drop passes sometimes. It is Moorhead's job to make sure that one play is not the difference in those games.

Huh? You mean like penalties, interceptions and a few dropped passes? Players have to make plays, we didn't.

[msstate7]

Come on man......

Hey, I'd much rather you guys be right

[msstate7]

Bama
Clemson
Oklahoma
ND
Michigan
Florida
Penn st
Kentucky
Texas
LSU
Ucf
Georgia

Throw ucf out bc they got in on charity. We will never outrecruit 10 of the remaining 11. The only other team that got in was Kentucky. They won by playing stellar defense and running the ball... particularly with the RBs. Kentucky got in and won with the formula we should've used.

How in the world did y'all not catch my mistake? Kentucky and penn st were not NY6 teams; Ohio state and Washington were.

Y'all know I'm quick to fact check someone so y'all let me have it when I get it wrong haha