Now That it is Over, What is Nick Fitzgerald's Legacy At MSU?

[ShotgunDawg]

Was thinking about this while watching the Rose Bowl & Haskins throw touch pass after touch pass that we haven't seen since Dak's SR year & hopefully see again soon (Really makes it clear what he dreadfully lack):

Here are some thoughts:

- First off, we will probably have a much greater perspective on Fitz's legacy 5 years from now than we do right now. We have to see if MSU has a new normal at QB or if things will regress back to where they were before Dak. In 5 years, will we see Fitz as just ok due to the type of QB play we are getting or will we long for the Fitz days?

- To me, determining Fitz's legacy come down completely on whether you are comparing him to past MSU QBs or if you are comparing him to Dak or the standard necessary to compete for the SEC West. Compared to past MSU QBs, Fitz is undeniably a top 5 QB in school history. Compared to the standard necessary to compete for the West, I'm not sure I've ever been more frustrated with a QB, due to knowing that he just didn't have the type of accuracy, instincts, pocket presence, or touch necessary to beat good defenses.

- He'll obviously go down with great stats that should stand that test of time, but I'm not sure I've ever seen an MSU reach his ceiling so early. Did Nick ever improve from his Sophomore year on?

- When all is said & done, he sets many QB rushing records, MSU scoring records, etc but also was suspended for the first game of his SR year, & had a pretty mediocre SEC & overall record in games where he started. What type of leader was he?

Overall, the Fitz era was good, but frustrating. Good in that the overall body of work was pretty good & the team went to bowls all 3 years, but frustrating in that you knew he was just too limited in the passing & processing parts of the game to lead MSU anything more that just being an OK team. For me, Fitz will go down as a really good football player & just an average QB. Football is a structured sport in which QBs MUST be able to perform certain skill sets if the team is going to succeed at a high level & he just didn't have those skills.

-

[Goldendawg]

Got criticized a lot on the internet?**** Cursed by Native Americans when he broke his word on the Mohawk?****

[99jc]

Great runner obviously. Tough as hell. Not a passer at all. And now greedy on the goal line.

[Todd4State]

For me he's like Jeff Francouer. Five tool talent but lacks commitment to reach full potential and has a hot girlfriend.

Highly questionable ceiling as far as football IQ is concerned.

[chef dixon]

Can run. Can't pass. Tough. Makes bad decisions.

[West Tn Dawg]

Great runner that could have been better thought of if he wasn't so selfish every time he was on the goal line. He is definitely an attention whore. It was way more often than just today.

[ShotgunDawg]

For me he's like Jeff Francouer. Five tool talent but lacks commitment to reach full potential and has a hot girlfriend.

Highly questionable ceiling as far as football IQ is concerned.

He's not a 5 tool talent though.

He's more like a pitcher threw 98 but was in & out of the strike zone & lacked consistency. Watch 5 min of Haskins for Ohio State & it's clear how inadequate Fitz' throwing ability was for this offense to take the next step. Has absolutely no ability to drop the ball in different layers of the defense

[BrunswickDawg]

First - Fitz is one of my favorite MSU players ever.

I think Fitz is emblematic of all the good and bad of the Dan Mullen Era. Fitz is a talented athlete who was a project from the start. In any other SEC program he probably never sees the field as a starter at QB. It is a damn miracle that Dan was able to take a kid who basically learned to play QB the summer before his SR year in high school and make him a serviceable QB in the SEC. The problem with that is that if Mullen had been able to recruit worth a shit on offense we wouldn't have had to rely on a kid like that to begin with. Nick is a warrior with a limited skill set and no amount of work or coaching could get past those limited skills.

[Commercecomet24]

First - Fitz is one of my favorite MSU players ever.

I think Fitz is emblematic of all the good and bad of the Dan Mullen Era. Fitz is a talented athlete who was a project from the start. In any other SEC program he probably never sees the field as a starter at QB. It is a damn miracle that Dan was able to take a kid who basically learned to play QB the summer before his SR year in high school and make him a serviceable QB in the SEC. The problem with that is that if Mullen had been able to recruit worth a shit on offense we wouldn't have had to rely on a kid like that to begin with. Nick is a warrior with a limited skill set and no amount of work or coaching could get past those limited skills.

Great post and extremely accurate in all respects! Fitz was a warrior and competitor but didn't have the necessary skills to be a "complete" qb.

ETA I'm glad Nick is a Dawg and grateful for what he did here.

[Maroonthirteen]

One of the best QBs in MSU history

[wild_dawg]

Tough as nails. Was put in a difficult situation following the most iconic Mississippi State player ever. One of the toughest players we’ve ever had.

[bluelightstar]

Fitz is a tough guy but this year really takes him down a lot for me. He and his turnovers added losses that our defense could not overcome. 4 picks against LSU. He threw the pick that let UK open the game up. No awareness against UF to get obliterated on 4th down by a 15 yard safety blitz. And today, even outside the Guidry pick, he set Iowa up with 2TDs. He may have been worse as a senior than he was as a sophomore. In fact, he seemed worse every year which suggests that he was figured out by DCs and didn?t really improve in the off seasons.

Should never be compared to Dak again.

[msstate7]

First - Fitz is one of my favorite MSU players ever.

I think Fitz is emblematic of all the good and bad of the Dan Mullen Era. Fitz is a talented athlete who was a project from the start. In any other SEC program he probably never sees the field as a starter at QB. It is a damn miracle that Dan was able to take a kid who basically learned to play QB the summer before his SR year in high school and make him a serviceable QB in the SEC. The problem with that is that if Mullen had been able to recruit worth a shit on offense we wouldn't have had to rely on a kid like that to begin with. Nick is a warrior with a limited skill set and no amount of work or coaching could get past those limited skills.

Is Moorhead recruiting better on the offensive side of the ball?

[Cooterpoot]

The QB that followed Dak.

[Liverpooldawg]

Tough as nails competitor. Great runner but not a great passer. Did about as much as he could do with his skill set. Destroyed Ole Miss except for when they intentionally broke his leg. Led us to back to back 8 win seasons. He will be well remembered by most. Most people will eventually remember him for what he was, not what he wasn't. I for one thank him and will remember him as a great Bulldog, a better version of John Bond.

[LC Dawg]

I don't want to come off as being negative about Fitz because he's been tough as nails for us but I can't say he's a top 5 Mississippi State quarterback.
I can't put him ahead of
Dak
Jackie Parker
Don Smith
Rockey
Bond

All those guys were all american and/or all conference except for maybe Bond and I can't put Fitz ahead of Bond.

I really think the injury in the Egg Bowl ****ed him up mentally and physically and affected his play this year. Which is why Cohen should tell Bjork to go **** himself when they meet with Sankey.

[Todd4State]

He's not a 5 tool talent though.

He's more like a pitcher threw 98 but was in & out of the strike zone & lacked consistency. Watch 5 min of Haskins for Ohio State & it's clear how inadequate Fitz' throwing ability was for this offense to take the next step. Has absolutely no ability to drop the ball in different layers of the defense

I can buy that. Comparing baseball players and football players is apples and oranges anyway. But Fitz has NFL arm strength and size and he is a plus runner. He has all the measureables to be first pick taken in the draft. But like you are saying he can't apply it.

[Captain Falcon]

Very good football player, not a great QB. Tough as nails. Wreaked havoc against average and bad teams but was a liability as a passer against good defenses. He gave us a lot more good than bad though, so I?ll always be grateful for what he did for us.

At the end of the day, we signed a guy that was a high school QB for one year and nobody but us and MTSU wanted him. He accomplished a lot more than most thought he would when we signed him but obviously he just always lacked a few certain skills necessary to be a great SEC quarterback.

[BrunswickDawg]

Is Moorhead recruiting better on the offensive side of the ball?
TBD

[Cooterpoot]

Is Moorhead recruiting better on the offensive side of the ball?

Yes. OL especially. QB yes. WR somewhat. RB questionable. TE yes.

[Todd4State]

Is Moorhead recruiting better on the offensive side of the ball?

Yes.

Shrader- 4 star.
Heath, E Jai Mason, and Tulu are all four star WR's and we may pull Mingo. Compare that to Reggie Todd, Osirus, and Jamal Couch. We also lead for Antonio Harmon.
Cross has a legit shot to be a five star OL recruit and is no worse than a four star and Brandon Cunningham is a four star OL recruit.
We may be able to flip Ealy too even though he is a pro baseball guy.

[Liverpooldawg]

I don't want to come off as being negative about Fitz because he's been tough as nails for us but I can't say he's a top 5 Mississippi State quarterback.
I can't put him ahead of
Dak
Jackie Parker
Don Smith
Rockey
Bond

All those guys were all american and/or all conference except for maybe Bond and I can't put Fitz ahead of Bond.

I really think the injury in the Egg Bowl ****ed him up mentally and physically and affected his play this year. Which is why Cohen should tell Bjork to go **** himself when they meet with Sankey.
Fitz is way better than Bond. He even passes it better. I was in school during the Bond years.

[Commercecomet24]

Yes. OL especially. QB yes. WR somewhat. RB questionable. TE yes.

This is correct and recruiting will only get better.

[Todd4State]

Fitz is way better than Bond. He even passes it better. I was in school during the Bond years.

You're right. I've seen video. I suspect that both probably have similar personalities though.

[LC Dawg]

Fitz is way better than Bond. He even passes it better. I was in school during the Bond years.
They are very similar. Bond beat Bama and never lost to LSU. That puts him ahead of Fitz to me. Just my opinion.

[msstate7]

Yes. OL especially. QB yes. WR somewhat. RB questionable. TE yes.

We have 2 olinemen about to be drafted after 1 last season... 3 in 2 years ain't bad. Moorhead's guys look better on paper though, but hev is better than Johnson coaching

Key was higher rated than shrader

Wr looks like a wash

Next season does appear to be better, but we signed 4 4-star offensive players in 2015 too.... only 1 really panned out

[Sacrifice]

I'm gonna remember Fitz as one tough MFer that could make a 60 yard TD run look like a 20 yard dash.
Limited in his passing abilities, poised for a huge senior season that got derailed by a gruesome leg injury and a coaching change.

He gave it everything he had, I wish nothing but the best for him In whatever field he goes into.

I watched some lean years at the QB position before DM arrived. He's one of the best in my book and I don't think his rushing record will be broken for a very long time.

[Liverpooldawg]

They are very similar. Bond beat Bama and never lost to LSU. That puts him ahead of Fitz to me. Just my opinion.

He also had two losing seasons. We weren't very good at all his last two years.

[msstate7]

I'm gonna remember Fitz as one tough MFer that could make a 60 yard TD run look like a 20 yard dash.
Limited in his passing abilities, poised for a huge senior season that got derailed by a gruesome leg injury and a coaching change.

He gave it everything he had, I wish nothing but the best for him In whatever field he goes into.

I watched some lean years at the QB position before DM arrived. He's one of the best in my book and I don't think his rushing record will be broken for a very long time.

Emory Jones at Florida is the guy to watch for breaking that record.

[Cooterpoot]

We have 2 olinemen about to be drafted after 1 last season... 3 in 2 years ain't bad. Moorhead's guys look better on paper though, but hev is better than Johnson coaching

Key was higher rated than shrader

Wr looks like a wash

Next season does appear to be better, but we signed 4 4-star offensive players in 2015 too.... only 1 really panned out

If they all show up, we?re about to sign the best OL class I can remember. Cross is about to bump to 5 star. You said recruiting better. We?ll have to see on development. Shrader is a better QB prospect than KT was. I don?t care what the ranking says. He was 4 star before his injury.
WR is better than what we currently have but how much? Hell, Our WRs are the worst in P5.

[bluelightstar]

Shrader is a better QB prospect than KT was. I don?t care what the ranking says. He was 4 star before his injury.

This isn’t true, at least from a recruiting site perspective. KT was a high 4-star and had always been higher ranked than Shrader this year.

[msstate7]

This isn’t true, at least from a recruiting site perspective. KT was a high 4-star and had always been higher ranked than Shrader this year.

Yep.

Key composite = .9258
247 = 94

Shrader composite = .9106
247 = 88

[Goldendawg]

If they all show up, we?re about to sign the best OL class I can remember. Cross is about to bump to 5 star. You said recruiting better. We?ll have to see on development. Shrader is a better QB prospect than KT was. I don?t care what the ranking says. He was 4 star before his injury.
WR is better than what we currently have but how much? Hell, Our WRs are the worst in P5.

Mitchell, Todd, and Couch (maybe) were all signed after signing day. WR recruiting has been bad for a long time, I for one was overly excited that Whop and Landry could change things in one year if ever.

[Todd4State]

Mitchell, Todd, and Couch (maybe) were all signed after signing day. WR recruiting has been bad for a long time, I for one was overly excited that Whop and Landry could change things in one year if ever.

I think both are a step in the right direction. Guidry had a bad day today but he also has his moments this year. Whop is still just a sophomore in 2019 and has time to develop. Adding the talent we are in the future will pay off down the road.

[ShotgunDawg]

Yep.

Key composite = .9258
247 = 94

Shrader composite = .9106
247 = 88

You have to take into account Schrader's shoulder injury though. With Schrader's measurables, I think there's a chance he would've been ranked higher than KT has he been healthy on the circuit all Summer.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Fitz ankle injury really set him back... even today you could tell it affected his running ability... there was a couple of plays today that Fitz would have taken it to the house two years ago....

[Hot Rock]

Fitz, I kept waiting for him to become a decent passer but it never happened. He never learned touch. He did get better but not good.

He gave it his all and was tough but judging toughest ever kind of thing is impossible. Lots of football players are tough. He does not get toughest ever distinction from me. For me, Stan Black was that guy and always will be.

Good runner but he needed some space to operate. He wasn't particularly shifty, just fast enough in a straight line and could break some tackles. He should have given it up more and was a bit selfish but that was him giving his best. I get it.

Not a top five QB in State History but that may be a bit butt hurt talking after the loss but I don't think so.

I think of him as all Dawg and one of our own that was a heck of a lot more than expected when he came to Starkville.

It is up to my coaches to find the players and to put the best we got on the field and get us wins. The players? All I can ask is they do their best. He did, no doubt.

[BuckyIsAB****]

He was asked to do something he has never done, and being asked to do it in the best league in America.

He always played as hard as physically possible and was by far the most hated on player in my lifetime of watching MSU football. A lot of it undeserved.

[OSCAR]

Was thinking about this while watching the Rose Bowl & Haskins throw touch pass after touch pass that we haven't seen since Dak's SR year & hopefully see again soon (Really makes it clear what he dreadfully lack):

Here are some thoughts:

- First off, we will probably have a much greater perspective on Fitz's legacy 5 years from now than we do right now. We have to see if MSU has a new normal at QB or if things will regress back to where they were before Dak. In 5 years, will we see Fitz as just ok due to the type of QB play we are getting or will we long for the Fitz days?

- To me, determining Fitz's legacy come down completely on whether you are comparing him to past MSU QBs or if you are comparing him to Dak or the standard necessary to compete for the SEC West. Compared to past MSU QBs, Fitz is undeniably a top 5 QB in school history. Compared to the standard necessary to compete for the West, I'm not sure I've ever been more frustrated with a QB, due to knowing that he just didn't have the type of accuracy, instincts, pocket presence, or touch necessary to beat good defenses.

- He'll obviously go down with great stats that should stand that test of time, but I'm not sure I've ever seen an MSU reach his ceiling so early. Did Nick ever improve from his Sophomore year on?

- When all is said & done, he sets many QB rushing records, MSU scoring records, etc but also was suspended for the first game of his SR year, & had a pretty mediocre SEC & overall record in games where he started. What type of leader was he?

Overall, the Fitz era was good, but frustrating. Good in that the overall body of work was pretty good & the team went to bowls all 3 years, but frustrating in that you knew he was just too limited in the passing & processing parts of the game to lead MSU anything more that just being an OK team. For me, Fitz will go down as a really good football player & just an average QB. Football is a structured sport in which QBs MUST be able to perform certain skill sets if the team is going to succeed at a high level & he just didn't have those skills.

-

He will go down as the greatest NFL TE to ever wear Maroon and White.

[Todd4State]

You have to take into account Schrader's shoulder injury though. With Schrader's measurables, I think there's a chance he would've been ranked higher than KT has he been healthy on the circuit all Summer.

This is true. Shrader may have been an Elite 11 QB if he was healthy.

[OSCAR]

Was thinking about this while watching the Rose Bowl & Haskins throw touch pass after touch pass that we haven't seen since Dak's SR year & hopefully see again soon (Really makes it clear what he dreadfully lack):

Here are some thoughts:

- First off, we will probably have a much greater perspective on Fitz's legacy 5 years from now than we do right now. We have to see if MSU has a new normal at QB or if things will regress back to where they were before Dak. In 5 years, will we see Fitz as just ok due to the type of QB play we are getting or will we long for the Fitz days?

- To me, determining Fitz's legacy come down completely on whether you are comparing him to past MSU QBs or if you are comparing him to Dak or the standard necessary to compete for the SEC West. Compared to past MSU QBs, Fitz is undeniably a top 5 QB in school history. Compared to the standard necessary to compete for the West, I'm not sure I've ever been more frustrated with a QB, due to knowing that he just didn't have the type of accuracy, instincts, pocket presence, or touch necessary to beat good defenses.

- He'll obviously go down with great stats that should stand that test of time, but I'm not sure I've ever seen an MSU reach his ceiling so early. Did Nick ever improve from his Sophomore year on?

- When all is said & done, he sets many QB rushing records, MSU scoring records, etc but also was suspended for the first game of his SR year, & had a pretty mediocre SEC & overall record in games where he started. What type of leader was he?

Overall, the Fitz era was good, but frustrating. Good in that the overall body of work was pretty good & the team went to bowls all 3 years, but frustrating in that you knew he was just too limited in the passing & processing parts of the game to lead MSU anything more that just being an OK team. For me, Fitz will go down as a really good football player & just an average QB. Football is a structured sport in which QBs MUST be able to perform certain skill sets if the team is going to succeed at a high level & he just didn't have those skills.

-

He will go down as the greatest NFL TE to ever wear Maroon and White.

[TaleofTwoDogs]

Some great comments in this thread. I think each of us knew what we had with Fitz from his first spring game until now. He is an athlete playing QB, we have seen many at MSU. But every year we held out hope that his passing game would catch up with with his great running game but it never did. In fact, I believe it regressed somewhat over the last couple of years. I don't see Fitz making the cut on an NFL team but it could happen. Good luck to him and thanks for being a dawg.

[Goldendawg]

Anyone remember the spring game where Nick threw 4 ints and many said we just had very good DB's and poor receivers. Well that didn't really tell the tale later. I appreciate all the good things he did for us and wish him the best with that NFL type QB coach he is working with b4 the draft.

[TimberBeast]

First - Fitz is one of my favorite MSU players ever.

I think Fitz is emblematic of all the good and bad of the Dan Mullen Era. Fitz is a talented athlete who was a project from the start. In any other SEC program he probably never sees the field as a starter at QB. It is a damn miracle that Dan was able to take a kid who basically learned to play QB the summer before his SR year in high school and make him a serviceable QB in the SEC. The problem with that is that if Mullen had been able to recruit worth a shit on offense we wouldn't have had to rely on a kid like that to begin with. Nick is a warrior with a limited skill set and no amount of work or coaching could get past those limited skills.

Very well said. He was a warrior and I hate that he didn?t have a single receiver that could catch a football.

[Matty Dispatch]

One of the best QBs in MSU history

Without question.

In each of his 3 years as a starter, he was finished with one less win than Dak. Dak was 7-6, 10-3 & 9-4. Fitz was 6-7, 9-4, 8-5.

Considering he was an afterthought in recruiting, it was supposed to be Staley after Dak, he took the reigns and was prolific by MSU record book standards.

[Saltydog]

Now, considering MSU's football history, 21 wins as a starting QB is pretty doggone good and certainly ranks up there with the best of them in the program's history.

[ShotgunDawg]

Now, considering MSU's football history, 21 wins as a starting QB is pretty doggone good and certainly ranks up there with the best of them in the program's history.

Agree. What you think about his legacy come down completely to whether you are comparing him to past MSU QBs or comparing him to the QB you want.

[BrunswickDawg]

I've thought about this a little more because there have been some good takes in this thread.

We were spoiled as a fanbase because of the progression Dak made from year 3 to year 5, and we put similar expectations on Fitz. Fitz isn't Dak. In fact, Fitz isn't like any other modern P5 QB I can think of. Name me another modern college QB who had thrown less than 100 passes in game situations before becoming a starter. Not passes in college - passes in his life. I saw him play high school ball. Their offense was archaic. What passes they threw were incredibly simple. Why? Because they had a WR who had never played the position playing QB. I don't think people really understand how incredibly difficult it is to literally learn to play QB in college - let alone learning it on the field in the SEC West. And yet, he was able become arguably one of our best QB's in history. It's insane to even think about.

Think about it like this - imaging picking up a golf club for the first time in your life today. You are a good athlete - maybe played baseball - so the basics of the swing and what to do come pretty natural to you. You take lessons on the range for about 2 months and then spend 15 weeks playing 1 round a week with lessons every day for a couple of hours. Your strength is booming the ball off the tee. Like 375-395, occasionally 410-415. But, everything else is erratic. You have big potential though, and the Head Pro at the Sea Island Golf Performance Center says "move here, we have world class courses, facilities, and trainers. You can learn from Davis Love, Zach Johnson, and Matt Kuchar and I'll teach you to be a scratch golfer." You spend 2 years doing that and the pro says, "Davis Love is retiring. Go play the Masters, and if you make the cut, you get his spot on the Tour." Somehow, you make the cut, and get handed Davis Love's spot on the tour. You compete against guys who were prodigies. Literally guys who picked up a club at 2, and have been training 20 years for the spot you have. No matter what you do over the next 3 years your play on tour is inconsistent. You still boom drives. But, your putting is like Happy Gilmore. There are some courses where your style plays to your advantages and you finish top ten, but in majors you miss the cut. And not just a little. Bad. Real bad. Like 100 bad. Sometimes it makes you stubborn, because you know you can do it. You "Tin Cup" holes because of it. You may even be a little arrogant about golf - because you've only been playing a few years and are better than most people who have played their whole lives. Through it all, you will never be Davis Love though. You took his spot, but he was just better. Most of the guys you play against are just better. And that's ok.

That's outlandish - but it is the only comparison I can come up with. Nick is our Happy Gilmore. He's our Tin Cup. He's the guy who wasn't supposed to be here, yet here he is. We get so lost in the stats, the wins and loses, that we lose sight of what an actual incredible story the kid is. And who knows, he might not be done yet. It's something we should embrace instead of looking for every way we can to discount and denigrate it.

[Bully13]

Recuperating from the most dastardly injury and then sticking it up shitbirds ass uhGAIN.

[phatdog]

Couldn't read a defense.

[lastmajordog]

skull****** UNM 2 out of 3 yEARS........

[tcdog70]

He's not a 5 tool talent though.

He's more like a pitcher threw 98 but was in & out of the strike zone & lacked consistency. Watch 5 min of Haskins for Ohio State & it's clear how inadequate Fitz' throwing ability was for this offense to take the next step. Has absolutely no ability to drop the ball in different layers of the defense


Dude, come on put Haskins in our offense with our sunbelt WRs, and he won't be as good as Fitz. Wonder what Fitz could do with Urban as a coach with OSU talent. I know he would have been hell on wheels.

[Cooterpoot]

Fitz is in no way close to as good as Haskins. Not in the same universe.

[Cooterpoot]

Now, considering MSU's football history, 21 wins as a starting QB is pretty doggone good and certainly ranks up there with the best of them in the program's history.

12 games weren?t played by most of our QBs either. Certainly not an extra OOC patsy at home.

[msstate7]

Dude, come on put Haskins in our offense with our sunbelt WRs, and he won't be as good as Fitz. Wonder what Fitz could do with Urban as a coach with OSU talent. I know he would have been hell on wheels.

You lost your mind? Haskins is a very good qb. He might be the first qb taken

[Bothrops]

This game doesn't hurt Fitz' legacy in the long term. He is the SEC rushing king and may hold that title for a while, possibly a long time. He was all Dawg, so he's good. I wish him the best in whatever he decides to do, and hope he comes back and visits a lot.

[ckDOG]

Fitz is an athlete, not a quarterback. He put up shit passing numbers (under both staffs) bc he isn't a good decision maker or passer. Sure he has a rocket arm but that means nothing for production. His athleticism allowed him put up sick yards per play and his lack of being able to throw allowed him to pad the totals bc why would you expect him to throw a ton when everyone knows he can't.

So I'll remember him for what he was...a damn good runner.

[tcdog70]

You lost your mind? Haskins is a very good qb. He might be the first qb taken

so you think Haskins would look like the same QB at MSU as He does at OSU? Nick at OSU and he would have been very successful. Nick has never had players around Him that Haskins has. if we were chosing up sides with equal talent -I'll take Nick and we will run it down your throat--but it won't be with an RPO offense.

put Haskins in the SEC at MSU with Our sunbelt wrs and see how good he looks.

[msstate7]

so you think Haskins would look like the same QB at MSU as He does at OSU? Nick at OSU and he would have been very successful. Nick has never had players around Him that Haskins has. if we were chosing up sides with equal talent -I'll take Nick and we will run it down your throat--but it won't be with an RPO offense.

put Haskins in the SEC at MSU with Our sunbelt wrs and see how good he looks.

So you think the jags should take fitz at #4 over Haskins?

[Maroonthirteen]

So you think the jags should take fitz at #4 over Haskins?

Surely someone tells Fitz. His nfl future is at TE or WR.

[Saltydog]

the first game of this year either. We can slice it any way we want too but NF is one of the best QB's in this programs history. How many other MSU QB's, or MSU players for that matter, have a career SEC record for something, anything?

[StarkVegasSteve]

I'll remember Nick as a player who when he stepped between those lines he was gonna give you everything he had. He definitely had his deficiencies in his decision making and accuracy, but I never doubted that the kid wasn't giving everything he had for us. His toughness and game breaking speed is what I'll remember the most.

[tcdog70]

So you think the jags should take fitz at #4 over Haskins?

7 we are talking College. Tebow and Johnny Football are maybe the two best colleges QBs ever. But they ain't shit in the NFL . You put Nick on OSU and the other dude on MSU and who does better?? MSU might win but it will because of the defense. Who was in top 2 total offens their Sophomore year when he actually had SEC WRs?

[msstate7]

7 we are talking College. Tebow and Johnny Football are maybe the two best colleges QBs ever. But they ain't shit in the NFL . You put Nick on OSU and the other dude on MSU and who does better?? MSU might win but it will because of the defense. Who was in top 2 total offens their Sophomore year when he actually had SEC WRs?

We'll just disagree. I love nick and think he gets way too much criticism, but nick ain't Haskins. Haskins is one hell of a qb. Watch him and you'll see the accuracy and arm strength.

[Tripp McNeely]

Is there any real difference between Fitz and Relf...other than expectations being lower for Relf?

[Pit Bull]

IMO, don't think he has one. Just another QB who was a good runner and couldn't pass. Bout like John Bond. I would rate Bond ahead of him for managing to beat an undefeated #1 ranked BAMA team in 1980. Of course, Fitz probably would have been awesome running the wishbone at one of the service academies.

[RocketDawg]

Given his 'not so hot' passing ability, will Fitz still be known as a dual-threat quarterback?

[RocketDawg]

IMO, don't think he has one. Just another QB who was a good runner and couldn't pass. Bout like John Bond. I would rate Bond ahead of him for managing to beat an undefeated #1 ranked BAMA team in 1980. Of course, Fitz probably would have been awesome running the wishbone at one of the service academies.

You think he was capable of handling the academic requirements at a service academy?

[Pit Bull]

You think he was capable of handling the academic requirements at a service academy?

Probably not....but I am not aware of his academic progress at MSU so I really don't know.

[msstate7]

You think he was capable of handling the academic requirements at a service academy?
Most option QBs are small. Scott Frost was an exception, and he was fun to watch. I really wish someone would bust the old Nebraska offense out the closet.

[Tbonewannabe]

You think he was capable of handling the academic requirements at a service academy?

He graduated in Finance and was in a Masters program this year. I think he could have handled the academic requirements. He seems a little wild for what they expect cadets to act like though. No judgement but they are very regimented and that doesn't seem like Nick.

[RocketDawg]

He graduated in Finance and was in a Masters program this year. I think he could have handled the academic requirements. He seems a little wild for what they expect cadets to act like though. No judgement but they are very regimented and that doesn't seem like Nick.

I suppose those reasons are why I was wondering, and his apparent slow decision making (might've been ball hogging too) at times. Maybe he just didn't prepare enough. Could've been burned out a little too, not to mention the terrible injury.

[Todd4State]

Probably not....but I am not aware of his academic progress at MSU so I really don't know.

I'm pretty sure he wasn't talking about Nick's academics.

[Todd4State]

Most option QBs are small. Scott Frost was an exception, and he was fun to watch. I really wish someone would bust the old Nebraska offense out the closet.

Nick would have been an absolute beast in a service academy offense. They just don't find QB's with his skill set with their talent pool unless they are related to Norman Schwartzkoff

[Pit Bull]

Service academies would have FIXED Nick's wildness or he wouldn't cut it there. They got ways to do it that won't get published anywhere. The only reason the Naval Academy put up with John McCain's antics was because his father and grandfather were bigshot Admirals.

[Scared_Hitless]

Nick's legacy will not be finalized for a few years and the anger blows over for his shortcomings this season. (Not his fault his Coach left him at the Altar)

It should show he was one of the toughest SOB's to ever wear the uniform. A guy that put his body on the line week in and week out for this university. A player that followed a legend and became one in his own right. A guy that was carted off the field his Junior year only to return and fight his guts out his senior year for a new coach. Nick will be beloved when we look back, he had limitations, but he was damn fun to watch and gave it everything he had. Big wins, toughness and a human highlight reel. He will be missed.

[Tbonewannabe]

We'll just disagree. I love nick and think he gets way too much criticism, but nick ain't Haskins. Haskins is one hell of a qb. Watch him and you'll see the accuracy and arm strength.

Haskins is also the first QB taken by most NFL draft guys and Nick will be lucky to get a FA deal unless he goes as a Hell on Wheels TE.

[Tbonewannabe]

Nick's legacy will not be finalized for a few years and the anger blows over for his shortcomings this season. (Not his fault his Coach left him at the Altar)

It should show he was one of the toughest SOB's to ever wear the uniform. A guy that put his body on the line week in and week out for this university. A player that followed a legend and became one in his own right. A guy that was carted off the field his Junior year only to return and fight his guts out his senior year for a new coach. Nick will be beloved when we look back, he had limitations, but he was damn fun to watch and gave it everything he had. Big wins, toughness and a human highlight reel. He will be missed.

Similar to Relf, he definitely had deficiencies in the pass game but you never doubted his heart and toughness. Also like Relf, he ran all over and through UM in the Egg Bowl. Definitely a great Bulldog and will be remembered fondly.

[thf24]

Is there any real difference between Fitz and Relf...other than expectations being lower for Relf?

Fitz is much better. More dynamic runner, and while Fitz probably isn't more accurate than Relf at his best, Fitz can make more throws.

[Scared_Hitless]

Fitz is much better. More dynamic runner, and while Fitz probably isn't more accurate than Relf at his best, Fitz can make more throws.

Go look at the 9-4 season for Relf and Last season for Fitz. The stats are virtually identical. Nick was a better athlete like you said.

[thf24]

Go look at the 9-4 season for Relf and Last season for Fitz. The stats are virtually identical. Nick was a better athlete like you said.

Relf wasn't asked to throw the ball nearly as many times over the course of his career. If he had been, I suspect his passing line would look significantly worse.

[Tbonewannabe]

Relf wasn't asked to throw the ball nearly as many times over the course of his career. If he had been, I suspect his passing line would look significantly worse.

Mullen did a lot better job hiding his deficiencies than Joe did with Fitz this year.

[Scared_Hitless]

Relf wasn't asked to throw the ball nearly as many times over the course of his career. If he had been, I suspect his passing line would look significantly worse.

I was just comparing both of their 9-4 seasons the stats are identical. Fitz was a better version of Relf but cut from the same cloth tough athletic but limited as a passer.

[BB30]

Dude, come on put Haskins in our offense with our sunbelt WRs, and he won't be as good as Fitz. Wonder what Fitz could do with Urban as a coach with OSU talent. I know he would have been hell on wheels.

Let me preface this by saying I am a Nick fan probably more so than most on this board. If Haskins were our QB this year we win 2 more games at a minimum. We beat UF and we beat Iowa. We have had guys open all season and couldn't get them the ball.

Fitz just got screwed when Mullen left due to an offense that was perfect for him leaving as well. He just didn't really fit what Moorhead was wanting to do and JOMO struggled to mold the offense around him. Not for a lack of trying, I just don't think JOMO could completely get away from what he knows.

Go back and watch some of our games, your always going to have guys open that get missed due to being the 2nd or 3rd read but it happened a lot this year.

That is the one reason I have hope that JOMO will end up panning out. He was able to get our "sunbelt" WRs open quite a bit. We just couldn't get them the ball when they did get open.

[msstate7]

Let me preface this by saying I am a Nick fan probably more so than most on this board. If Haskins were our QB this year we win 2 more games at a minimum. We beat UF and we beat Iowa. We have had guys open all season and couldn't get them the ball.

Fitz just got screwed when Mullen left due to an offense that was perfect for him leaving as well. He just didn't really fit what Moorhead was wanting to do and JOMO struggled to mold the offense around him. Not for a lack of trying, I just don't think JOMO could completely get away from what he knows.

Go back and watch some of our games, your always going to have guys open that get missed due to being the 2nd or 3rd read but it happened a lot this year.

That is the one reason I have hope that JOMO will end up panning out. He was able to get our "sunbelt" WRs open quite a bit. We just couldn't get them the ball when they did get open.

Just forget all that... Haskins is a top 5 QB in the country. He's better than fitz, and that isn't an insult to fitz

[Scared_Hitless]

I wish there was a place to get a coach film to our games, would love to look at the all 22 like I do with NFL teams on Gamepass. Seeing if Nick was all misreads or if our receivers are as bad as we all think.

[Tbonewannabe]

I wish there was a place to get a coach film to our games, would love to look at the all 22 like I do with NFL teams on Gamepass. Seeing if Nick was all misreads or if our receivers are as bad as we all think.

That would also tell you if the playcallling was bad or if it was players not executing.

[msstate7]

I wish there was a place to get a coach film to our games, would love to look at the all 22 like I do with NFL teams on Gamepass. Seeing if Nick was all misreads or if our receivers are as bad as we all think.
Not exactly what you looking for, but PFF rankings for players will tell you how they grade out

[Tbonewannabe]

Not exactly what you looking for, but PFF rankings for players will tell you how they grade out

I am interested in how they grade something like the flea flicker play? It was the perfect play call to the point that Fitz just didn't throw the ball. The play worked exactly like you hope and just depended on a QB being able to complete a 40 yard pass.

I know Joe said Fitz was making the correct reads but is he just saying that because Fitz was already getting enough shit so he was protecting him. Maybe Key or Mayden weren't any better or Fitz was good in practice but not great in games when facing a good defense.

[yjnkdawg]

I am interested in how they grade something like the flea flicker play? It was the perfect play call to the point that Fitz just didn't throw the ball. The play worked exactly like you hope and just depended on a QB being able to complete a 40 yard pass.

I know Joe said Fitz was making the correct reads but is he just saying that because Fitz was already getting enough shit so he was protecting him. Maybe Key or Mayden weren't any better or Fitz was good in practice but not great in games when facing a good defense.


I think Fitz thought he was making the right reads based upon what he was reading on the defense sets, but I know LSU baited him into keeping the ball a lot , and I think Iowa did the same thing.

[maroonmania]

I think Fitz thought he was making the right reads based upon what he was reading on the defense sets, but I know LSU baited him into keeping the ball a lot , and I think Iowa did the same thing.

Apparently every team we played every week baited him into keeping the ball inside the 5 yard line because that is about the only play we ever ran although it became clear every team was keying in him. It's odd that people were surprised that Fitz kept the ball 3 straight times against Iowa from the one. Going back to the Auburn game he kept it 4 straight times where he questionably scored the TD on 4th and goal. For this year I would dare say that 90% of our plays inside the 5 were delayed runs by Fitz. Whatever Fitz was reading it always seemed to end up in him taking the ball himself.

[yjnkdawg]

Apparently every team we played every week baited him into keeping the ball inside the 5 yard line because that is about the only play we ever ran although it became clear every team was keying in him. It's odd that people were surprised that Fitz kept the ball 3 straight times against Iowa from the one. Going back to the Auburn game he kept it 4 straight times where he questionably scored the TD on 4th and goal. For this year I would dare say that 90% of our plays inside the 5 were delayed runs by Fitz. Whatever Fitz was reading it always seemed to end up in him taking the ball himself.


Well, he did also like to run the ball. So that could be a determining factor in some instances. I know LSU said they were not going to get beat by our running backs, and they weren't scared of our passing game. So if they got beat, it would be our quarterback running the ball. I don't like those delayed RPO checks when you are down inside the 5 yard line. That just seems to give the defense more time to react.

[Todd4State]

Mullen did a lot better job hiding his deficiencies than Joe did with Fitz this year.


Dan's offense was so QB run heavy no one noticed when Fitzgerald made a bad read. The thing is Dan's offense steadily declined every year since 2014. And Nick's stats were pretty comparable this year to when Dan was here. Maybe even better considering that Nick didn't play against Stephen F Austin who I am sure he would have lit up.


I am interested in how they grade something like the flea flicker play? It was the perfect play call to the point that Fitz just didn't throw the ball. The play worked exactly like you hope and just depended on a QB being able to complete a 40 yard pass.

I know Joe said Fitz was making the correct reads but is he just saying that because Fitz was already getting enough shit so he was protecting him. Maybe Key or Mayden weren't any better or Fitz was good in practice but not great in games when facing a good defense.


PFF grades players individually. So if the running back "did their job" on a flea flicker by giving the QB a good pitch back it's graded on a scale of like a 1. If you make an exceptional play you get like a 2. Nick missing the wide open receiver probably would have gotten a 0 or a -1. At the end of the game they add up all of the players points and then they are rated. I'm probably off on the scale that they use but it's an example of how they do it.


Apparently every team we played every week baited him into keeping the ball inside the 5 yard line because that is about the only play we ever ran although it became clear every team was keying in him. It's odd that people were surprised that Fitz kept the ball 3 straight times against Iowa from the one. Going back to the Auburn game he kept it 4 straight times where he questionably scored the TD on 4th and goal. For this year I would dare say that 90% of our plays inside the 5 were delayed runs by Fitz. Whatever Fitz was reading it always seemed to end up in him taking the ball himself.


Well, he did also like to run the ball. So that could be a determining factor in some instances. I know LSU said they were not going to get beat by our running backs, and they weren't scared of our passing game. So if they got beat, it would be our quarterback running the ball. I don't like those delayed RPO checks when you are down inside the 5 yard line. That just seems to give the defense more time to react.

The RPO works better with the "P" option. I don't know that I buy Nick making the right reads. You can't tell me that he's making the right read when he keeps the ball on a RPO and there are two guys in front of him looking like they are unblocked tackling him while Kylin is running free by himself. Someone should have been open or we should have been able to hand it off for a walk in TD. The only other possibility is our o-line getting beat which I'm sure happened at times as well. If anything if I'm a DC and I want Nick to try to beat me I'm going to try to bait him into a throw- not a run.


I think Joe is protecting the players. As he should.

[Matty Dispatch]

I'll remember Nick as a player who when he stepped between those lines he was gonna give you everything he had. He definitely had his deficiencies in his decision making and accuracy, but I never doubted that the kid wasn't giving everything he had for us. His toughness and game breaking speed is what I'll remember the most.

That's all you can ask for. It is up to the coaches to recruit and play the best players. If they thought Nick was the best QB to play for 3 years than that's what it was. I don't ever recall anyone saying he didn't give it 100% on and off the field, so you have to respect him for that. He may not have played how we wanted a QB to play at times, but he did the best he could with his abilities and the coaches are the ones who put him in the position and called the plays.

[Matty Dispatch]

IMO, don't think he has one. Just another QB who was a good runner and couldn't pass. Bout like John Bond. I would rate Bond ahead of him for managing to beat an undefeated #1 ranked BAMA team in 1980. Of course, Fitz probably would have been awesome running the wishbone at one of the service academies.

Fitz would've beat #1 Bama if his defense hadn't given up two late scores in 2017. He did enough in that game and was much more productive vs. Bama than Bond was in his win. I beat if you put Fitz in the 1980 wishbone he dominates a lot more than Bond did.

[Saltydog]

option offense...?..

[was21]

I worked with several Naval Academy graduates and they weren't all that intelligent.