Some Thoughts on Recruiting.....

[ShotgunDawg]

Here are some thoughts on observations from today.....

- Congrats to all the MSU signees today. While I know it is frustrating, I looked back at the caliber of players we were signing 10 years ago, & it's night & days difference. While building this program is going slower & is more painstaking that anyone wants, we are still headed in the right direction. The train is still moving forward & the engine can be heard.

- While don't think today was "Championship Standard", I want to see what this staff is able to get done in February. We MUST close out the guys we currently have committed & hopefully add Mingo, Young, Plumlee, & a few others. This thing is a long way from over.

- What has happened with our CB commits is almost a perfect storm. I completely understand James being intrigued by in-state Alabama offers & wanting to take his time, I think Brooks may have found him a girl or something at Arkansas, & Emerson, while committed, is a Florida kid. The point is that out of state commits that don't choose MSU over offers from their in-state schools are always risky when they get offered by the in-state school. The bigger issue IMO is that Mississippi kids don't seem to have the same loyalty as those kids. We collectively all have to work together to change that.

- I think in many ways today was the blue bloods counter punch with the early signing day. Last year many more kids signed early & I'm not totally sure the blue bloods knew how things would go or the exact strategy of how to deal with the early signing period. Thus they spent a year figuring out how to maximize the situation & this is what you get. The blue bloods convincing more kids to wait & sign.

- Losing Derick Hall was a disappointment. I'm not completely sure why he cancelled his visit & what caused him to do that, but it's a another MS kid that left the state & for what? To play for a different coaching staff in 2 years ?However, from all indications from anyone that has see the kid play, he's not very good & likely won't ever play at Auburn.

- I'm in complete agreement with the staff waiting to sign non-early enrollee JUCO guys until February. Unless they are elite, which none are, by waiting we offer ourselves more flexibility & options with transfers.

- UGA flipped a long time Ohio State QB commit & another top notch DL that never stepped foot on campus at UGA. Kirby Smart is cheating worse than Hugh Freeze ever thought. It's shameful what recruiting really is.

- I'm in agreement with Wolken that it's past time to lower the roster size in college football from 85 to something less. 70 or 75. It hurts the sport when blue bloods hoard talent like they are currently doing. College football would be so much greater with a more even playing field.

- I'm just not sure what MSU needs to do to up it's recruiting profile & not be a fall back for so many kids. The last decade of success is simply better than that. We've built something better than that. I wish I knew what the answer was. Dave Bartoo often talks about "range bound recruiting" meaning that most schools recruit within the same range every year & I couldn't agree more. Not sure what you have to do to change ranges.

- Lastly, it's not over. There are big targets both our commits & other's commits that are still on the board. This staff MUST figure out a way to finish strong. They MUST. We can't afford to land the same ole same ole recruiting class when the state has more talent than it ever has.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Here are some thoughts on observations from today.....

- Congrats to all the MSU signees today. While I know it is frustrating, I looked back at the caliber of players we were signing 10 years ago, & it's night & days difference. While building this program is going slower & is more painstaking that anyone wants, we are still headed in the right direction. The train is still moving forward & the engine can be heard.

- While don't think today was "Championship Standard", I want to see what this staff is able to get done in February. We MUST close out the guys we currently have committed & hopefully add Mingo, Young, Plumlee, & a few others. This thing is a long way from over.

- What has happened with our CB commits is almost a perfect storm. I completely understand James being intrigued by in-state Alabama offers & wanting to take his time, I think Brooks may have found him a girl or something at Arkansas, & Emerson, while committed, is a Florida kid. The point is that out of state commits that don't choose MSU over offers from their in-state schools are always risky when they get offered by the in-state school. The bigger issue IMO is that Mississippi kids don't seem to have the same loyalty as those kids. We collectively all have to work together to change that.

- I think in many ways today was the blue bloods counter punch with the early signing day. Last year many more kids signed early & I'm not totally sure the blue bloods knew how things would go or the exact strategy of how to deal with the early signing period. Thus they spent a year figuring out how to maximize the situation & this is what you get. The blue bloods convincing more kids to wait & sign.

- Losing Derick Hall was a disappointment. I'm not completely sure why he cancelled his visit & what caused him to do that, but it's a another MS kid that left the state & for what? To play for a different coaching staff in 2 years ?However, from all indications from anyone that has see the kid play, he's not very good & likely won't ever play at Auburn.

- I'm in complete agreement with the staff waiting to sign non-early enrollee JUCO guys until February. Unless they are elite, which none are, by waiting we offer ourselves more flexibility & options with transfers.

- UGA flipped a long time Ohio State QB commit & another top notch DL that never stepped foot on campus at UGA. Kirby Smart is cheating worse than Hugh Freeze ever thought. It's shameful what recruiting really is.

- I'm in agreement with Wolken that it's past time to lower the roster size in college football from 85 to something less. 70 or 75. It hurts the sport when blue bloods hoard talent like they are currently doing. College football would be so much greater with a more even playing field.

- I'm just not sure what MSU needs to do to up it's recruiting profile & not be a fall back for so many kids. The last decade of success is simply better than that. We've built something better than that. I wish I knew what the answer was. Dave Bartoo often talks about "range bound recruiting" meaning that most schools recruit within the same range every year & I couldn't agree more. Not sure what you have to do to change ranges.

- Lastly, it's not over. There are big targets both our commits & other's commits that are still on the board. This staff MUST figure out a way to finish strong. They MUST. We can't afford to land the same ole same ole recruiting class when the state has more talent than it ever has.

First off, I dont think your 3rd point is true at all. I think you are living in the moment a little bit. I'd be willing to bet More high profile kids in this state stay more than they go. And what makes MS HSFB so great is there a lot of good players that slip thru the cracks and end up in the league. We are a great example of that.

I knew all I needed to know about the Hall kid after seeing the video he put on twitter last night just begging people to give him attention and predict where he was going to go.

Lastly we are going to have a chance to land some big ones in Feb and this staff will spare no expense to do it. Moorhead is an incredibly likable guy and say what you want but that is a lot to do with recruiting. We are going to sign a top 20 class, maybe 15. ESPN has us in the top 15 right now. I am not a big recruiting rankings guy because I see some of these kids on Friday nights and some are better than they get credit for and some are worse. Not a lot of difference in a class ranked 10 and a class ranked 15.

[ShotgunDawg]

First off, I dont think your 3rd point is true at all. I think you are living in the moment a little bit. I'd be willing to bet More high profile kids in this state stay more than they go. And what makes MS HSFB so great is there a lot of good players that slip thru the cracks and end up in the league. We are a great example of that.

I knew all I needed to know about the Hall kid after seeing the video he put on twitter last night just begging people to give him attention and predict where he was going to go.

Lastly we are going to have a chance to land some big ones in Feb and this staff will spare no expense to do it. Moorhead is an incredibly likable guy and say what you want but that is a lot to do with recruiting. We are going to sign a top 20 class, maybe 15. ESPN has us in the top 15 right now. I am not a big recruiting rankings guy because I see some of these kids on Friday nights and some are better than they get credit for and some are worse. Not a lot of difference in a class ranked 10 and a class ranked 15.

We are ranked where we are due to who we have committed, not who we've signed. We've got to sign what we have committed and add a few

[BuckyIsAB****]

We are ranked where we are due to who we have committed, not who we've signed. We've got to sign what we have committed and add a few

We will. If I had to name a leader for Plumlee now it would be us. We are in the thick of it for Mingo and a lot has happened lately to help us with him. Depending on who they get for OC will make or break us with him IMO. Offering his QB made some headway though.

I dont know enough about Young to say anything

[BigEasyDawg]

Good take Shotgun. I think the chase to beat Bama is making Kirby go insane

[Dawg2003]

You need better bagmen to compete with these blue bloods, but we saw what happened when OM did this.!

[ShotgunDawg]

Good take Shotgun. I think the chase to beat Bama is making Kirby go insane

I think Kirby is going to have a short shelf life.

He's high flying act & will make a mistake soon.

[gravedigger]

Here are some thoughts on observations from today.....

- Congrats to all the MSU signees today. While I know it is frustrating, I looked back at the caliber of players we were signing 10 years ago, & it's night & days difference. While building this program is going slower & is more painstaking that anyone wants, we are still headed in the right direction. The train is still moving forward & the engine can be heard.

- While don't think today was "Championship Standard", I want to see what this staff is able to get done in February. We MUST close out the guys we currently have committed & hopefully add Mingo, Young, Plumlee, & a few others. This thing is a long way from over.

- What has happened with our CB commits is almost a perfect storm. I completely understand James being intrigued by in-state Alabama offers & wanting to take his time, I think Brooks may have found him a girl or something at Arkansas, & Emerson, while committed, is a Florida kid. The point is that out of state commits that don't choose MSU over offers from their in-state schools are always risky when they get offered by the in-state school. The bigger issue IMO is that Mississippi kids don't seem to have the same loyalty as those kids. We collectively all have to work together to change that.

- I think in many ways today was the blue bloods counter punch with the early signing day. Last year many more kids signed early & I'm not totally sure the blue bloods knew how things would go or the exact strategy of how to deal with the early signing period. Thus they spent a year figuring out how to maximize the situation & this is what you get. The blue bloods convincing more kids to wait & sign.

- Losing Derick Hall was a disappointment. I'm not completely sure why he cancelled his visit & what caused him to do that, but it's a another MS kid that left the state & for what? To play for a different coaching staff in 2 years ?However, from all indications from anyone that has see the kid play, he's not very good & likely won't ever play at Auburn.

- I'm in complete agreement with the staff waiting to sign non-early enrollee JUCO guys until February. Unless they are elite, which none are, by waiting we offer ourselves more flexibility & options with transfers.

- UGA flipped a long time Ohio State QB commit & another top notch DL that never stepped foot on campus at UGA. Kirby Smart is cheating worse than Hugh Freeze ever thought. It's shameful what recruiting really is.

- I'm in agreement with Wolken that it's past time to lower the roster size in college football from 85 to something less. 70 or 75. It hurts the sport when blue bloods hoard talent like they are currently doing. College football would be so much greater with a more even playing field.

- I'm just not sure what MSU needs to do to up it's recruiting profile & not be a fall back for so many kids. The last decade of success is simply better than that. We've built something better than that. I wish I knew what the answer was. Dave Bartoo often talks about "range bound recruiting" meaning that most schools recruit within the same range every year & I couldn't agree more. Not sure what you have to do to change ranges.

- Lastly, it's not over. There are big targets both our commits & other's commits that are still on the board. This staff MUST figure out a way to finish strong. They MUST. We can't afford to land the same ole same ole recruiting class when the state has more talent than it ever has.

I feel for you shotgun. I used to be like that. I've watched the signing day celebration of kids that didnt work out and shed the tears of losing kids that didnt wind up amounting to a thing.

Bottom line: if your happiness or lack thereof today is tied to what some recruiting service said about the players we signed or failed to put out, you are in some sad shape. The truth is that this class could be WORSE or better than you think. But you wont know that for at least a year, most likely 2.

if you dont believe me, go back and look at our last 2-3 classes. Look at all the misses. This team is about the coaching staff and their ability to make what we have work.

[BuckyIsAB****]

I think Kirby is going to have a short shelf life.

He's high flying act & will make a mistake soon.

Kirby is legit and wont go anywhere unless the NCAA runs him off

[hailmari]

I’ve never heard/considered the scholarship reduction idea, but I love it. I think just lowering it to 80 would have a notable effect after a couple of years.

Five fewer studs taken from the blue bloods automatically adds at least thirty studs into the recruiting circulation for the rest of us every year. Of course, that would also knock a bunch of lower 3* guys out of the P5, but it’d only make for more competition in G5. More competition, more intrigued, more money.

[TUSK]

Kirby is legit and wont go anywhere unless the NCAA runs him off

Just snagged Dean, too....

[BuckyIsAB****]

Just snagged Dean, too....

Kirby is that dude man. Now why he faked that punt idk but he is eventually going to beat yall

[Tbonewannabe]

I’ve never heard/considered the scholarship reduction idea, but I love it. I think just lowering it to 80 would have a notable effect after a couple of years.

Five fewer studs taken from the blue bloods automatically adds at least thirty studs into the recruiting circulation for the rest of us every year. Of course, that would also knock a bunch of lower 3* guys out of the P5, but it’d only make for more competition in G5. More competition, more intrigued, more money.

I like the idea of free transfers if guys play less than a certain percentage of plays for the year. It keeps someone from having guys on the bench that could play other places but is stuck without burning a year if they have redshirted. Gives a redshirt sophomore a chance to play somewhere else for 2 years instead of 1.

[TUSK]

Kirby is that dude man. Now why he faked that punt idk but he is eventually going to beat yall

Oh, I'm certain he will.... because he's gonna get plenty of opportunities... UGA is gonna KILL the East for the very near future...

I went to that game and it was a weird one... Bammer played like shit, UGA coached like shit, the crowd was about 60-40ish and one side of the Dome was quiet as a mouse and the other was erupting alternating back and forth...

not as nice as the JerryDome, but pretty nice...

[Beaver]

I'm just not sure what MSU needs to do to up it's recruiting profile & not be a fall back for so many kids. The last decade of success is simply better than that. We've built something better than that. I wish I knew what the answer was. Dave Bartoo often talks about "range bound recruiting" meaning that most schools recruit within the same range every year & I couldn't agree more. Not sure what you have to do to change ranges.

Here's the thing. Until MSU wins the SEC West it won't matter what our record is in terms of national perception. We will always start at least 5th in the SEC West. Alabama, LSU, Texas A&M, and Auburn will always be viewed as better options than MSU. The only way you change that perception is by winning games that actually matter. We had a chance in 2014, but Bama and Ole Miss games killed us. Orange bowl didn't really affect recruiting. Beating Bama would be a start. Obviously OM cheated, but their national perception went up since they were one of the few teams to beat Bama. And they did it 2x. Luckily for us, they shot themselves in the foot with a rocket launcher, but we have to find a way to beat Bama and win the West.

And like it or not, Starkville is not an asset when it comes to recruiting. Not many 17 to 18 year olds are looking for small town charm. Especially guys that come from out of state. How do you convince a recruit Starkville is better than Tuscaloosa or Athens? Really the only way is to get them on campus. And the only we'll attract more blue chips to campus is by raising our national perception.

I will say one thing we have going for us is the NFL. We really need to market the crap out of our guys that are not just playing, but starring in the NFL. I can't help but think that's at least somewhat contributed to the defense we have on the field this year. Dak helped a bit for QB, but it'd be nice to have a few more high round draft picks from the WR, RB, or QB positions.

[ShotgunDawg]

I’ve never heard/considered the scholarship reduction idea, but I love it. I think just lowering it to 80 would have a notable effect after a couple of years.

Five fewer studs taken from the blue bloods automatically adds at least thirty studs into the recruiting circulation for the rest of us every year. Of course, that would also knock a bunch of lower 3* guys out of the P5, but it’d only make for more competition in G5. More competition, more intrigued, more money.

A few thoughts here:

- You allocate the other schollies to baseball & other men's sports

- I don't think lowering the scholly limit would help USM as much as it would help Vandy, Purdue, Indiana, Minnesota, Kansas, Rutgers, etc. I think kids would choose those schools over G5

- I don't mind Bama signing all 5 stars. My issue continues to be the guys that sit on their bench that never play, but could be starting or contributing for other top 25 teams. Baseball used to have this problem until they created numerous rules to ensure that the best players in the world were on the field instead of in AAA backing up Mickey Mantle.

[ShotgunDawg]

I like the idea of free transfers if guys play less than a certain percentage of plays for the year. It keeps someone from having guys on the bench that could play other places but is stuck without burning a year if they have redshirted. Gives a redshirt sophomore a chance to play somewhere else for 2 years instead of 1.

Agree with this as well

[smootness]

- UGA flipped a long time Ohio State QB commit & another top notch DL that never stepped foot on campus at UGA. Kirby Smart is cheating worse than Hugh Freeze ever thought. It's shameful what recruiting really is.

You think this is some kind of proof they're cheating?

Mathis was committed to Ohio State, yes...who just lost their coach and now look like they may get Fields...meanwhile Fields' departure leaves a wide open space at UGA.

[BrunswickDawg]

Kirby is legit and wont go anywhere unless the NCAA runs him off

It's been 20 years since UGA got popped. They are due.

[msstate7]

You think this is some kind of proof they're cheating?

Mathis was committed to Ohio State, yes...who just lost their coach and now look like they may get Fields...meanwhile Fields' departure leaves a wide open space at UGA.

Fields is ours, and Bryce Harper is gonna be a brave. Ok, maybe not, but I'm gonna keep dreaming till reality slap me... like always

[BrunswickDawg]

You think this is some kind of proof they're cheating?

Mathis was committed to Ohio State, yes...who just lost their coach and now look like they may get Fields...meanwhile Fields' departure leaves a wide open space at UGA.

In my day it was Nissan 240SXs. Today, apparently, Ford Raptors.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Oh, I'm certain he will.... because he's gonna get plenty of opportunities... UGA is gonna KILL the East for the very near future...

I went to that game and it was a weird one... Bammer played like shit, UGA coached like shit, the crowd was about 60-40ish and one side of the Dome was quiet as a mouse and the other was erupting alternating back and forth...

not as nice as the JerryDome, but pretty nice...

I dont think Mullen will ever beat Kirby. Maybe a few times if he stays long enough but Mullen wants no part of that life

[tcdog70]

we lose a couple out of state 3 star CBs and people freak out. We can get someone ready to play out of JUCO just as good as these High School projects. Another Slay-Bean or Smoot--they are out there go get one.

[Howboutdemdogs]

I don?t think anything would happen to Kirby because of Sabin. Kirby knows where all the bodies are hidden at Bama. To turn in GA would in effect burn Bama. So now, Sabin just has to live with it, and makes sure that no one causes a GA stink. Kirby is just following Bama?s playbook.

[TUSK]

I don?t think anything would happen to Kirby because of Sabin. Kirby knows where all the bodies are hidden at Bama. To turn in GA would in effect burn Bama. So now, Sabin just has to live with it, and makes sure that no one causes a GA stink. Kirby is just following Bama?s playbook.

wow.

[Homedawg]

we lose a couple out of state 3 star CBs and people freak out. We can get someone ready to play out of JUCO just as good as these High School projects. Another Slay-Bean or Smoot--they are out there go get one.

That's fine and true. However, we have- had 3 cbs committed and all 3 might jump ship. For sure 2. Following a less than stellar signing class at that position last year. While it might not seem big, it's huge. And don't say well just we'll just get the next best available. As a rule, the next best available aren't as good. As a rule, I said before I get littered w t Calhoun comments.
ETA- and yes there will be some good jucos. But no guarantee you get them. Can't bank on that ask Jackie and the Arizona western line

[dawgs]

First off, I dont think your 3rd point is true at all. I think you are living in the moment a little bit. I'd be willing to bet More high profile kids in this state stay more than they go. And what makes MS HSFB so great is there a lot of good players that slip thru the cracks and end up in the league. We are a great example of that.

I knew all I needed to know about the Hall kid after seeing the video he put on twitter last night just begging people to give him attention and predict where he was going to go.

Lastly we are going to have a chance to land some big ones in Feb and this staff will spare no expense to do it. Moorhead is an incredibly likable guy and say what you want but that is a lot to do with recruiting. We are going to sign a top 20 class, maybe 15. ESPN has us in the top 15 right now. I am not a big recruiting rankings guy because I see some of these kids on Friday nights and some are better than they get credit for and some are worse. Not a lot of difference in a class ranked 10 and a class ranked 15.

Scouting/recruiting is about looking at a kid's talent and how it projects over the next 4-5 years st the next level. Lots of kids that put up big numbers in Fridays simply does have the inherent talent that will transition well to SEC football.

[tcdog70]

That's fine and true. However, we have- had 3 cbs committed and all 3 might jump ship. For sure 2. Following a less than stellar signing class at that position last year. While it might not seem big, it's huge. And don't say well just we'll just get the next best available. As a rule, the next best available aren't as good. As a rule, I said before I get littered w t Calhoun comments.
ETA- and yes there will be some good jucos. But no guarantee you get them. Can't bank on that ask Jackie and the Arizona western line

Arz Western--right. One time in 25 years we sign Some out of State JuCOs and they are less than good. But how many times did we sign MS JUCO's and they save our bacon? Forget AZ. Western, how many Highschool wasted scholly have we issued since then.

[mparkerfd20]

I don?t think anything would happen to Kirby because of Sabin. Kirby knows where all the bodies are hidden at Bama. To turn in GA would in effect burn Bama. So now, Sabin just has to live with it, and makes sure that no one causes a GA stink. Kirby is just following Bama?s playbook.

You are 100% correct.

[Pit Bull]

Oh, I'm certain he will.... because he's gonna get plenty of opportunities... UGA is gonna KILL the East for the very near future...

I went to that game and it was a weird one... Bammer played like shit, UGA coached like shit, the crowd was about 60-40ish and one side of the Dome was quiet as a mouse and the other was erupting alternating back and forth...

not as nice as the JerryDome, but pretty nice...


I agree......JerryWorld looks a lot nicer than Hotlanta's new Dome. Hard to figure.....just about everybody I have talked to said the old Georgia Dome had better sight lines than the new Mercedes Dome. Guess Hotlanta has got money hand over fist to be able to build a new venue when they already had one of the best anyway.

[Pit Bull]

Slap, slap......it's me.....Reality.

[msstate7]

I agree......JerryWorld looks a lot nicer than Hotlanta's new Dome. Hard to figure.....just about everybody I have talked to said the old Georgia Dome had better sight lines than the new Mercedes Dome. Guess Hotlanta has got money hand over fist to be able to build a new venue when they already had one of the best anyway.

Man, I had a blast at saints falcons game at new stadium. I loved it

[duncflydawg]

I disagree that the next step is beating Bama and winning the West. I think what has held us back has been wetting the bed against OM, Arky and South Alabama. We need to start getting to NY6 bowls consistently. If we do that and always finish in the Top-25, we will SLOWLY start raising our national recognition and brand. We will not have ESPN calling us U of Miss or the Delta Dawgs. Or we can take the fast track and get the #1 WR, DT and LT all in one recruiting year, but that has been ops tested and has undesired consequences. We need to just win 1-2 more games every year and slowly we will get to where we want to be. Bama has a 40 year head start on getting serious with football and the stuff Bear did would make Hugh Freeze blush.

[smootness]

I agree......JerryWorld looks a lot nicer than Hotlanta's new Dome. Hard to figure.....just about everybody I have talked to said the old Georgia Dome had better sight lines than the new Mercedes Dome. Guess Hotlanta has got money hand over fist to be able to build a new venue when they already had one of the best anyway.

MB is infinitely better than the Dome. Not even a comparison.

[Homedawg]

Arz Western--right. One time in 25 years we sign Some out of State JuCOs and they are less than good. But how many times did we sign MS JUCO's and they save our bacon? Forget AZ. Western, how many Highschool wasted scholly have we issued since then.

Well if it's so easy to fill spots we food players why do we have such a hard time being a contender in this league. I mean it did happen 77 years ago.....