In 2017, we had 2 wins against a top 50 scoring defense and one of those was BYU

[Tbonewannabe]

I will say we did look better against the other teams that we lost to.

3 points vs #6 scoring defense UGA

10 points vs #11 Auburn

24 points vs #1 Bama

We also had wins against LSU and BYU

#14 LSU - 37 points
#46 BYU - 35 points

This year we have documented round and round the losses but let's look at the wins

#14 AU - 23 points
#37 A&M - 28 points

So other than the Bama game, the offense isn't too far off what it actually was in 2017. We have actually played 1 more top 50 defense than last year.

So at the end of the day, it seems like competing with Bama and then being back to the normal over the past 10 years is what most people seem to be pissed off about. Replace AU and UGA with LSU and UK and it looks like the same outcome but different years.

[MedDawg]

I will say we did look better against the other teams that we lost to.

3 points vs #6 scoring defense UGA

10 points vs #11 Auburn

24 points vs #1 Bama

We also had wins against LSU and BYU

#14 LSU - 37 points
#46 BYU - 35 points

This year we have documented round and round the losses but let's look at the wins

#14 AU - 23 points
#37 A&M - 28 points

So other than the Bama game, the offense isn't too far off what it actually was in 2017. We have actually played 1 more top 50 defense than last year.

So at the end of the day, it seems like competing with Bama and then being back to the normal over the past 10 years is what most people seem to be pissed off about. Replace AU and UGA with LSU and UK and it looks like the same outcome but different years.

In 2017 LSU lost two defensive starters out for injury and another two ejected for targeting. We don't score 37 if those players aren't out.

[msstate7]

In 2017 LSU lost two defensive starters out for injury and another two ejected for targeting. We don't score 37 if those players aren't out.

We lost rankin at auburn. Maybe we score more there if that wasn't eiland's first action.

[Covercorner2]

I will say we did look better against the other teams that we lost to.

3 points vs #6 scoring defense UGA

10 points vs #11 Auburn

24 points vs #1 Bama

We also had wins against LSU and BYU

#14 LSU - 37 points
#46 BYU - 35 points

This year we have documented round and round the losses but let's look at the wins

#14 AU - 23 points
#37 A&M - 28 points

So other than the Bama game, the offense isn't too far off what it actually was in 2017. We have actually played 1 more top 50 defense than last year.

So at the end of the day, it seems like competing with Bama and then being back to the normal over the past 10 years is what most people seem to be pissed off about. Replace AU and UGA with LSU and UK and it looks like the same outcome but different years.

And our defense is elite, and much better this year. That's what people fail to realize. If Mullen was still here, we would still have 3rd and Grantham, in lieu of Bob Shoop. It's a wash, except for the fact that one guy is in his first year and here to stay, and the other was in his 10th year with one foot out the door. Give me the former with better recruiting forthcoming.

[Really Clark?]

BYU adjusted defense was 66th in the rankings. Part of the reason why eliminating OOC teams has been a stat debate so much. Staying in conference only, unless playing a legit OOC team, is more agreeable across the board with posters. Last year we played 3 of the top 5 defenses in the country

[Tbonewannabe]

BYU adjusted defense was 66th in the rankings. Part of the reason why eliminating OOC teams has been a stat debate so much. Staying in conference only, unless playing a legit OOC team, is more agreeable across the board with posters. Last year we played 3 of the top 5 defenses in the country

Throw out BYU and we are basically the Bama game different from last year except we faced one more premium defense this year. So harder schedule but we still probably finish with the same record. The Defense got better but the offense got worse.

[Really Clark?]

Throw out BYU and we are basically the Bama game different from last year except we faced one more premium defense this year. So harder schedule but we still probably finish with the same record. The Defense got better but the offense got worse.

How you figure we played 1 more priemium defense this year? Playing 3 of the Top 5 is much harder (with 2 of those finishing 1,2 in the country) vs only 2 Top 10 this season. (Adjusted FEI numbers)

[Tbonewannabe]

How you figure we played 1 more priemium defense this year? Playing 3 of the Top 5 is much harder (with 2 of those finishing 1,2 in the country) vs only 2 Top 10 this season. (Adjusted FEI numbers)

If we want to throw out UF at #34 then we played 4 teams in the top 15 in scoring defense since we are talking about points. Last year we put up 24 on #1 Bama (This seems to be the biggest thing that people hang their hat on) in Starkville. Other than 2014 with the #1 team in the country, we haven't scored more than 7 points in Tuscaloosa in over a decade. Bama also had their entire LB core out which greatly benefited us.

Can we agree that comparing last year's 24 points to this year probably isn't Apples to Apples?

Ok, now lets look at the other games.

At #6 Defense UGA - 3 points.
So we compare that to #11 UK - 7 points so 4 points better but I do realize there is a little bit of ranking difference.

At #11 AU - 10 points. We can compare that to 7 points at UK or #12 LSU 3 points. Both road games, however UK and LSU were both embarrassed last year so both are probably really up for our game. Also LSU at night is the toughest place to play that isn't Tuscaloosa.

Home against #14 LSU - 37 points. LSU has several people hurt and Arden Key is very limited. Still, we kicked that ass at home. This year AU is also #14. We put up 23 points but that is probably lowered because we rushed for 350 yards and burned clock.

So in conclusion, it looks like this year is basically getting skewed from one game against Bama where Mullen has only scored more than 7 points 1 time.

Last year we played 2 at home and 2 on the road. We looked like dog shit on the road. This year we also looked like dog shit on the road but played 3 on the road with 1 at home.

[Dawgology]

I will say we did look better against the other teams that we lost to.

3 points vs #6 scoring defense UGA

10 points vs #11 Auburn

24 points vs #1 Bama

We also had wins against LSU and BYU

#14 LSU - 37 points
#46 BYU - 35 points

This year we have documented round and round the losses but let's look at the wins

#14 AU - 23 points
#37 A&M - 28 points

So other than the Bama game, the offense isn't too far off what it actually was in 2017. We have actually played 1 more top 50 defense than last year.

So at the end of the day, it seems like competing with Bama and then being back to the normal over the past 10 years is what most people seem to be pissed off about. Replace AU and UGA with LSU and UK and it looks like the same outcome but different years.

Not going to lie...this gives me a glimmer of hope with JoMo.

[Really Clark?]

[QUOTE=Tbonewannabe;1025480]If we want to throw out UF at #34 then we played 4 teams in the top 15 in scoring defense since we are talking about points. Last year we put up 24 on #1 Bama (This seems to be the biggest thing that people hang their hat on) in Starkville. Other than 2014 with the #1 team in the country, we haven't scored more than 7 points in Tuscaloosa in over a decade. Bama also had their entire LB core out which greatly benefited us.

Can we agree that comparing last year's 24 points to this year probably isn't Apples to Apples?

Ok, now lets look at the other games.

At #6 Defense UGA - 3 points.
So we compare that to #11 UK - 7 points so 4 points better but I do realize there is a little bit of ranking difference.

At #11 AU - 10 points. We can compare that to 7 points at UK or #12 LSU 3 points. Both road games, however UK and LSU were both embarrassed last year so both are probably really up for our game. Also LSU at night is the toughest place to play that isn't Tuscaloosa.

Home against #14 LSU - 37 points. LSU has several people hurt and Arden Key is very limited. Still, we kicked that ass at home. This year AU is also #14. We put up 23 points but that is probably lowered because we rushed for 350 yards and burned clock.

So in conclusion, it looks like this year is basically getting skewed from one game against Bama where Mullen has only scored more than 7 points 1 time.

Last year we played 2 at home and 2 on the road. We looked like dog shit on the road. This year we also looked like dog shit on the road but played 3 on the road with 1 at home.[/QUOTE

3 Top 5 defenses played last year > 2 Top 10 defenses this year. If you want to add Kentucky then it’s 3 Top 5 defenses > than 3 Top 15 defenses. Period. And the adjusted stats take care of field position, garbage points, sos, opponent, location, etc

[Tbonewannabe]

[QUOTE=Tbonewannabe;1025480]If we want to throw out UF at #34 then we played 4 teams in the top 15 in scoring defense since we are talking about points. Last year we put up 24 on #1 Bama (This seems to be the biggest thing that people hang their hat on) in Starkville. Other than 2014 with the #1 team in the country, we haven't scored more than 7 points in Tuscaloosa in over a decade. Bama also had their entire LB core out which greatly benefited us.

Can we agree that comparing last year's 24 points to this year probably isn't Apples to Apples?

Ok, now lets look at the other games.

At #6 Defense UGA - 3 points.
So we compare that to #11 UK - 7 points so 4 points better but I do realize there is a little bit of ranking difference.

At #11 AU - 10 points. We can compare that to 7 points at UK or #12 LSU 3 points. Both road games, however UK and LSU were both embarrassed last year so both are probably really up for our game. Also LSU at night is the toughest place to play that isn't Tuscaloosa.

Home against #14 LSU - 37 points. LSU has several people hurt and Arden Key is very limited. Still, we kicked that ass at home. This year AU is also #14. We put up 23 points but that is probably lowered because we rushed for 350 yards and burned clock.

So in conclusion, it looks like this year is basically getting skewed from one game against Bama where Mullen has only scored more than 7 points 1 time.

Last year we played 2 at home and 2 on the road. We looked like dog shit on the road. This year we also looked like dog shit on the road but played 3 on the road with 1 at home.[/QUOTE

3 Top 5 defenses played last year > 2 Top 10 defenses this year. If you want to add Kentucky then it’s 3 Top 5 defenses > than 3 Top 15 defenses. Period. And the adjusted stats take care of field position, garbage points, sos, opponent, location, etc

Either way those are Great Defenses. You want to nitpick. We have been historically bad ON THE ROAD against GOOD or GREAT Defenses. Even with our #1 in the country team in 2014, we still only managed 13 points until the last 19 seconds of the game. That was with a QB that had been in Mullen's system for 4 years and ended up as the NFL Rookie of the Year while starting for the Cowboys.

Do we think Fitz has that type of talent even though he has been in this system for 10 games with no live reps until August?

So basically the difference between the scoring from last year to this year is Bama at home and we scored more points against LSU at home vs AU at home this year. And again the LSU compared to AU, does anyone think we didn't just stomp a mudhole in AU. 350 yards rushing is DOMINATING. We also kicked A&M's ass and they are A LOT Improved but it was at home.

[msstate7]

If we score 35 the next 2 games, we'll finish the year at 17.1 per game in conf. Here's the list of the teams that's been that low that since 2009:

2017 tenn (Jones fired)
2016 South Carolina (Muschamp first year)
2015 mizzou (Pinkel last year)
2015 vandy (mason)
2014 vandy (Franklin left previous year/mason)
2013 ark (Bielema first year)
2013 Kentucky (stoops first year)
2012 Kentucky (Phillips fired)
2012 auburn (Chizik fired)
2011 Kentucky (Phillips)
2011 OM (Nutt fired)
2011 tenn (Dooley)
2010 vandy (Caldwell fired)
2009 vandy (Johnson fired)

So it's happened 14 times...
1. 7 times the coach was fired/resigned

2. 4 times it was the coach's first year. None of the coaches went on to be what I consider successful

3. Only Dooley, mason, and Phillips did it in a year where the coach wasn't new or fired

[RezDog7]

If we want to throw out UF at #34 then we played 4 teams in the top 15 in scoring defense since we are talking about points. Last year we put up 24 on #1 Bama (This seems to be the biggest thing that people hang their hat on) in Starkville. Other than 2014 with the #1 team in the country, we haven't scored more than 7 points in Tuscaloosa in over a decade. Bama also had their entire LB core out which greatly benefited us.

Can we agree that comparing last year's 24 points to this year probably isn't Apples to Apples?

Ok, now lets look at the other games.

At #6 Defense UGA - 3 points.
So we compare that to #11 UK - 7 points so 4 points better but I do realize there is a little bit of ranking difference.

At #11 AU - 10 points. We can compare that to 7 points at UK or #12 LSU 3 points. Both road games, however UK and LSU were both embarrassed last year so both are probably really up for our game. Also LSU at night is the toughest place to play that isn't Tuscaloosa.

Home against #14 LSU - 37 points. LSU has several people hurt and Arden Key is very limited. Still, we kicked that ass at home. This year AU is also #14. We put up 23 points but that is probably lowered because we rushed for 350 yards and burned clock.

So in conclusion, it looks like this year is basically getting skewed from one game against Bama where Mullen has only scored more than 7 points 1 time.

Last year we played 2 at home and 2 on the road. We looked like dog shit on the road. This year we also looked like dog shit on the road but played 3 on the road with 1 at home.

The Bama we scored 24 on last year was missing their first and second string linebackers.

[Really Clark?]

The Bama we scored 24 on last year was missing their first and second string linebackers.

No they were not. They had 2 LB hurt early the year long before our game. Plenty of time to adjust. Mosley started and played all year until bowl practice. 2 were injured during LSU game. Evans and Jennings had both returned by our game and played

[dawgday166]

[QUOTE=Tbonewannabe;1025480]If we want to throw out UF at #34 then we played 4 teams in the top 15 in scoring defense since we are talking about points. Last year we put up 24 on #1 Bama (This seems to be the biggest thing that people hang their hat on) in Starkville. Other than 2014 with the #1 team in the country, we haven't scored more than 7 points in Tuscaloosa in over a decade. Bama also had their entire LB core out which greatly benefited us.

Can we agree that comparing last year's 24 points to this year probably isn't Apples to Apples?

Ok, now lets look at the other games.

At #6 Defense UGA - 3 points.
So we compare that to #11 UK - 7 points so 4 points better but I do realize there is a little bit of ranking difference.

At #11 AU - 10 points. We can compare that to 7 points at UK or #12 LSU 3 points. Both road games, however UK and LSU were both embarrassed last year so both are probably really up for our game. Also LSU at night is the toughest place to play that isn't Tuscaloosa.

Home against #14 LSU - 37 points. LSU has several people hurt and Arden Key is very limited. Still, we kicked that ass at home. This year AU is also #14. We put up 23 points but that is probably lowered because we rushed for 350 yards and burned clock.

So in conclusion, it looks like this year is basically getting skewed from one game against Bama where Mullen has only scored more than 7 points 1 time.

Last year we played 2 at home and 2 on the road. We looked like dog shit on the road. This year we also looked like dog shit on the road but played 3 on the road with 1 at home.[/QUOTE

3 Top 5 defenses played last year > 2 Top 10 defenses this year. If you want to add Kentucky then it?s 3 Top 5 defenses > than 3 Top 15 defenses. Period. And the adjusted stats take care of field position, garbage points, sos, opponent, location, etc

No ... can't agree. Dline and Secondary for Bama was better last year and it's not that close. LBs better this year, Holcomb killed Bama last year. But LBs this year ain't as good as ours this year. Not elite.

There were plays to be made against Bama this year, and could've run on them too.

[BrunswickDawg]

[QUOTE=Really Clark?;1025485]

No ... can't agree. Dline and Secondary for Bama was better last year and it's not that close. LBs better this year, Holcomb killed Bama last year. But LBs this year ain't as good as ours this year. Not elite.

There were plays to be made against Bama this year, and could've run on them too.

Maybe, but the statstics say they just as good.

In conference scoring D '17 - 13.4 ppg
In conference scoring D '18 - 13.1 ppg

In conference Total D '17 - 264.8 ypg
In conference Total D '18 - 268.7 ypg

All 4 of those stats are #1 in the SEC.

[Tbonewannabe]

[QUOTE=Really Clark?;1025485]

No ... can't agree. Dline and Secondary for Bama was better last year and it's not that close. LBs better this year, Holcomb killed Bama last year. But LBs this year ain't as good as ours this year. Not elite.

There were plays to be made against Bama this year, and could've run on them too.

Sorry, I didn't realize we had Dan Mullen running his offense and the game was at home. We basically have a high score of 13 points with a TD in the last 19 seconds. That is the highest score at Bama in the last decade. That was with the best offensive team in MSU history.

So we are supposed to be mad that Joe doesn't surpass the last 10 years in his first year while changing the offense? We scored 7 which is pretty much the average score of a Dan Mullen offense against Bama.

[Tbonewannabe]

[QUOTE=dawgday166;1025655]

Maybe, but the statstics say they just as good.

In conference scoring D '17 - 13.4 ppg
In conference scoring D '18 - 13.1 ppg

In conference Total D '17 - 264.8 ypg
In conference Total D '18 - 268.7 ypg

All 4 of those stats are #1 in the SEC.


Basically people are angry that our defense gave us a chance and we didn't win. They thought Joe would do something that hasn't been done against Saban at Tuscaloosa. Somehow Mullen is this offensive genius that wasn't going to shit the bed this time. Who knows what would have happened if we kept Mullen but if we are wishing for shit that isn't true just give me Saban. There is exactly the same chance of having Saban coaching as Mullen.

[dawgday166]

[QUOTE=dawgday166;1025655]

Maybe, but the statstics say they just as good.

In conference scoring D '17 - 13.4 ppg
In conference scoring D '18 - 13.1 ppg

In conference Total D '17 - 264.8 ypg
In conference Total D '18 - 268.7 ypg

All 4 of those stats are #1 in the SEC.

I know. They've gotten better over last 3 or 4 weeks ... but they still ain't that great. Stats say the same thing last year and AU & GA was better. And we hung 24 on them and it should've been 31. Bama plays the weakest schedule in SEC every year. Plus, they love to blow teams out which probably helps their D a lot due to other teams just giving up. It also helps when they play good teams that targeting is not called, PI isn't called, and facemask sometimes isn't called.

Last year D about the same as when we played them this year. But ... if it makes folks feel better thinking they are great ... go ahead. They a fraction of the 2011 and 2012 Bama Ds and 2011 LSU D and they ain't near as good as we are this year. We stopped an exceptional offense and played much cleaner game than Bama ever does against a good team.

Having said that, I'm not as upset about Bama as other SEC losses relative to points scored. When refs make blatant call/no calls in Bama favor, it will take the wind out of any team playing them. Bad enough that most teams show up with less talent, mucho less resources, much less equal footing but when a team as talented or close to as talented shows up and smacks them in the mouth, when refs start the stream of calls in Bama's favor ... if you on the other team you probably just say WTF.

ETA: Much easier to be "great" D when they can blitz Fitz, hit him practically as he catches snap from center, because all 3 down linemen and 2 LBs were all offsides and jumped the snap.