Misplaced frustration

[Walkerhill]

A lot of people said that Joe Moorhead was extremely fortunate to be inheriting so much talent. But there was a down side to that, in that it came with very high expectations even though we had to go through the always difficult aspects of transition - breaking in a first time coach at the cfp level in the hardest conference in the country, installing a new system, establishing new recruiting relationships, instilling a culture change from one coach to another.

Those things are very rarely seamless, even in a well conceived transition where the pieces fit well.

The person to be angry with is Dan Mullen. He left us in the lurch on the eve of possibly our best season ever for greener career pastures, and from there it was always going to be uphill to achieve the potential success we all hoped for in this season. That is modern college football. Sucks for us.

If we wanted to prioritize this season, we should have reached for Brian Johnson and retained Brett Elliott and tried to keep the previous system in place as much as possible without Dan. But that would possibly be short circuiting the future to sell out on this season.

It sucks that we lost winnable games against UK and especially UF and a chance for the rare winning SEC season, 10 win season, possible New Years Six or even CFP appearance. But that is due to the circumstance of a unfortunately timed transition moreso than the new coach.

Bottom line in my mind is I hate to see JoeMo take the beating he is in the fan base. Maybe he could have been more flexible and squeezed out a couple more wins. I won?t argue that. But this is who the program has and I do believe he has a big upside in the 5 year time horizon and I hate to see our own fan base tearing that down based on the could have beens that JoeMo never really had a chance to realize.

[gravedigger]

A lot of people said that Joe Moorhead was extremely fortunate to be inheriting so much talent. But there was a down side to that, in that it came with very high expectations even though we had go through the always difficult aspects of transition - breaking in a first time coach at the cfp level in the hardest conference in the country, installing a new system, establishing new recruiting relationships, instilling a culture change from one coach to another.

Those things are very rarely seamless, even in a well conceived transition where the pieces fit well.

The person the be angry with is Dan Mullen. He left us in the lurch on the eve of possibly our best season ever for greener career pastures, and from there it was always going to be uphill to achieve the potential success we all hoped for in this season. That is modern college football. Sucks for us.

If we wanted to prioritize this season, we should have reached for Brian Johnson and retained Brett Elliott and tried to keep the previous system in place as much as possible without Dan. But that would possibly be short circuiting the future to sell out on this season.

It sucks that we lost winnable games against UK and especially UF and a chance for the rare winning SEC season, 10 win season, possible New Years Six or even CFP appearance. But that is due to the circumstance of a unfortunately timed transition moreso than the new coach.

Bottom line in my mind is I hate to see JoeMo take the beating he is in the fan base. Maybe he could have been more flexible and squeezed out a couple more wins. I won?t argue that. But this is who the program has and I do believe he has a big upside in the 5 year time horizon and I hate to see our own fan base tearing that down based on the could have beens that JoeMo never really had a chance to realize.

Great points. Now , prepare to be told that being reasonable means you don?t have a high enough standard of winning.

[cheewgumm]

Would agree for the most part.

Though I?d say the error of forcing square peg into round hole was avoidable and aggregious.

And knowing that we have a coach that will not adjust to players but will rather run his offense no matter what our players strengths are is more than troubling to me.

You could say Mullen does that but we changed a good bit over time. Dak threw the ball a ton. Relf didnt.

[deadheaddawg]

Too many of our fans thought a great defense and a bad to decent offense is a guaranteed playoffs team

So stupid.

At the best our offense is extremely one deminsional but good at that deminsion.

None of that translates into a complete team. You need to be a complete team to win this conference.

10 wins might have been possible without the guy who built this team, Mullen. When he left that was never going to happen.

I wish Mullen had taken a big chunk of our fans with him to Florida

[cheewgumm]

Saying our offense was bad or average is just wrong. Our ?bad? offense averaged 30 points a game last year. Everyone was back.

If we average 30 points this year, we are 10-0.

It?s a valid complaint.

[deadheaddawg]

Everyone isnt back. Mullen isn't. We lost the best QB coach in the country and we have a QB who isn't a good passer and our WRs are average

If you didn't expect a drop-off at QB and offense after losing the best QB coach in the country then I don't know what to tell you other than you don't understand football.

It's not Moorhead's fault you don't understand how important Mullen was to Fitz's success and the offense.

This is a one deminsional offense with a very specialized QB.....and Mullen is gone.

Sorry it sucks. Put your big boy pants on and deal with it

[cheewgumm]

If you don?t agree with me , I?m sorry you don?t understand football? Ha... ok.

[cheewgumm]

Not to mention , I?d love to hear Moorhead make the case that the reason we suckmonnoffense now is because he?s here and we lost Mullen.

That is your point right?

[deadheaddawg]

Not to mention , I?d love to hear Moorhead make the case that the reason we suckmonnoffense now is because he?s here and we lost Mullen.

That is your point right?

Yeah my point is Mullen is the best QB coach in the country and that has an actual impact on the QB.

Do you disagree?

It's mind boggling you can't see that

[RougeDawg]

Everyone isnt back. Mullen isn't. We lost the best QB coach in the country and we have a QB who isn't a good passer and our WRs are average

If you didn't expect a drop-off at QB and offense after losing the best QB coach in the country then I don't know what to tell you other than you don't understand football.

It's not Moorhead's fault you don't understand how important Mullen was to Fitz's success and the offense.

This is a one deminsional offense with a very specialized QB.....and Mullen is gone.

Sorry it sucks. Put your big boy pants on and deal with it

Damn dude. Guess you had half a handle of bourbon left knee from last night and decided to start hitting it for breakfast. SloMo took a guaranteed 10 win team and is struggling to win 8. If you can?t see that, put the bottle down and seek an AA meeting this week.

[dawgday166]

Damn dude. Guess you had half a handle of bourbon left knee from last night and decided to start hitting it for breakfast. SloMo took a guaranteed 10 win team and is struggling to win 8. If you can?t see that, put the bottle down and seek an AA meeting this week.

I could be wrong and I'm sure most will tell me so but ... I believe the minimum we win with Pruitt is 10 and we might just be undefeated now with him as HC. This team would've been taylor-made for him.

ETA: We sure would've been tough on both sides of ball at a minimum .. not just on the D side.

[deadheaddawg]

I've been in AA 7 years. Half a handle is for little girls.

It going to be interested to watch your posting in the future. As you learn how the game works. This is obviously only your second year of watching. It's the only logical excuse to you not understanding anything.

Guaranteed 10 wins. lol. bless your heart.

[HoopsDawg]

7-6-3-0.

There is 6-4 and then there's 6-4 scoring 7-6-3-0. That's the problem.

[Walkerhill]

Though I?d say the error of forcing square peg into round hole was avoidable and aggregious.

And knowing that we have a coach that will not adjust to players but will rather run his offense no matter what our players strengths are is more than troubling to me.



I agree with both of these points.

The first one is not on Joe. His system was known. People were wondering the day of the hire whether Nick could execute the complex reads and execute the deep touch passes which are hallmarks of the system, although those questions are mostly shouted down. It turned out the answer was that the old system fit Nick better. Now it is a 3 year process of recruiting and developing offensive personnel that can run this system fully.

That being said, it was ridiculous Joe came in talking up Fitz for a Heisman and ring size, sight unseen. That only added to the expectations problem. Also, if the new staff could have been more pragmatic and flexible, we still should have won the UK and especially the UF games. We could have had 10 wins, new staff or no.

I understand that frustration, but I just prefer not to let that poison the program moving forward. We have a green coach learning on the job and building his program from the ground up. Dude s still one of the brightest offensive minds in college football, even in the face of this years challenges. And he will learn from this year, guarantee it.

[Walkerhill]

Disagree with that totally. Pruitt would have been just as iffy offensively with scheme and fit, maybe moreso.

Maybe Bill Clark or someone gets 10 wins, not Pruitt.

[Bubb Rubb]

A lot of people said that Joe Moorhead was extremely fortunate to be inheriting so much talent. But there was a down side to that, in that it came with very high expectations even though we had go through the always difficult aspects of transition - breaking in a first time coach at the cfp level in the hardest conference in the country, installing a new system, establishing new recruiting relationships, instilling a culture change from one coach to another.

Those things are very rarely seamless, even in a well conceived transition where the pieces fit well.

The person the be angry with is Dan Mullen. He left us in the lurch on the eve of possibly our best season ever for greener career pastures, and from there it was always going to be uphill to achieve the potential success we all hoped for in this season. That is modern college football. Sucks for us.

If we wanted to prioritize this season, we should have reached for Brian Johnson and retained Brett Elliott and tried to keep the previous system in place as much as possible without Dan. But that would possibly be short circuiting the future to sell out on this season.

It sucks that we lost winnable games against UK and especially UF and a chance for the rare winning SEC season, 10 win season, possible New Years Six or even CFP appearance. But that is due to the circumstance of a unfortunately timed transition moreso than the new coach.

Bottom line in my mind is I hate to see JoeMo take the beating he is in the fan base. Maybe he could have been more flexible and squeezed out a couple more wins. I won?t argue that. But this is who the program has and I do believe he has a big upside in the 5 year time horizon and I hate to see our own fan base tearing that down based on the could have beens that JoeMo never really had a chance to realize.

I think this is the big issue. "Squeezing out a couple more wins" means a 10 win season and a potential NY6 Bowl. That's a big deal. Sacrificing this roster and this season to try and implement a system that he doesn't have the kind of talent to run is just a mistake. He could have maintained a lot of last year's philosophy and had a big year, earning collateral with the fanbase. That would have bought him time to do it his way with his roster later on.

I have no love for Mullen, and I want Moorhead to be successful. It's fair to question his methodology at this point, however.

[Bubb Rubb]

I could be wrong and I'm sure most will tell me so but ... I believe the minimum we win with Pruitt is 10 and we might just be undefeated now with him as HC. This team would've been taylor-made for him.

ETA: We sure would've been tough on both sides of ball at a minimum .. not just on the D side.

Pruitt would've been a disaster here. Glad we didn't go that direction.

[msstate7]

Pruitt would've been a disaster here. Glad we didn't go that direction.

Why you say that? Just curious bc pruitt has done a solid job at tenn, and he's recruiting well

[Todd4State]

Why do people assume that Joe would run an offense that he is unfamiliar with and then expect Joe doing so would have the same results as Dan? What coach has EVER done that anywhere? Dan certainly didn't do that with Tyler Russell.

That would be like us hiring Mike Leach and being pissed that he is running the Air Raid in year one with his players.

[Cooterpoot]

So, you?d rather Dan have left us with no talent? I don?t blame Dan for this at all. Brilliant coaches have teams that show improvement. Our offense has improved nil. We can stop with that offensive genius talk.

[Todd4State]

I agree with both of these points.

The first one is not on Joe. His system was known. People were wondering the day of the hire whether Nick could execute the complex reads and execute the deep touch passes which are hallmarks of the system, although those questions are mostly shouted down. It turned out the answer was that the old system fit Nick better. Now it is a 3 year process of recruiting and developing offensive personnel that can run this system fully.

That being said, it was ridiculous Joe came in talking up Fitz for a Heisman and ring size, sight unseen. That only added to the expectations problem. Also, if the new staff could have been more pragmatic and flexible, we still should have won the UK and especially the UF games. We could have had 10 wins, new staff or no.

I understand that frustration, but I just prefer not to let that poison the program moving forward. We have a green coach learning on the job and building his program from the ground up. Dude s still one of the brightest offensive minds in college football, even in the face of this years challenges. And he will learn from this year, guarantee it.

The thing is it's not about just this year- it's about the next five years. If he brings in players that can run his system he will succeed.

[cheewgumm]

Or its like having Tom Brady and the coach running the wishbone.

Nobody expected him to totally run someone else?s system but get our RBs more than 10 combined carries a game.

Adjust your offense to your teams strengths when their strengths are sooo clear.

[Todd4State]

So, you?d rather Dan have left us with no talent? I don?t blame Dan for this at all. Brilliant coaches have teams that show improvement. Our offense has improved nil.

There is no question that we are lacking at a couple of key position groups on offense- the offensive line and wide receiver. The two that most people complained about the most when Dan was here.


To me, we have improved since the LSU game. A&M and La Tech were by far the two best games we've played this year. And then we lost to Alabama on the road. But we have a good chance to finish strong.

[Todd4State]

Or its like having Tom Brady and the coach running the wishbone.

Nobody expected him to totally run someone else?s system but get our RBs more than 10 combined carries a game.

Adjust your offense to your teams strengths when their strengths are sooo clear.

Our top two RB's had 14 carries yesterday. Our QB had 14 carries.

[cheewgumm]

Sorry i was being hyperbolic. If you think 14 combined carries for our RBs is enough then I guess I?m wrong.

[Bubb Rubb]

Why do people assume that Joe would run an offense that he is unfamiliar with and then expect Joe doing so would have the same results as Dan? What coach has EVER done that anywhere? Dan certainly didn't do that with Tyler Russell.

That would be like us hiring Mike Leach and being pissed that he is running the Air Raid in year one with his players.

I'm not advocating that he run Dan's offense. But he can adjust his philosophy to match his personnel.

Postgame, Fitz was asked about the false start penalties and his answer was interesting..."we have struggled with the clap cadence all year." He was asked about what happened on the flea flicker and he said, "I never saw him," referring to Thomas streaking open down the middle of the field. This is the frustration of a guy with too much on his plate in this offense. The coaches have to put him in a better position to be successful.

[Bubb Rubb]

Why you say that? Just curious bc pruitt has done a solid job at tenn, and he's recruiting well

It's just my opinion. I don't think he's going to be successful at UT, either....he just reeks of a guy who is better suited to be a career defensive coordinator to me.

[HoopsDawg]

The thing is it's not about just this year- it's about the next five years. If he brings in players that can run his system he will succeed.

I appreciate your optimism. Do you not see major flaws in joes system?

[Cooterpoot]

There is no question that we are lacking at a couple of key position groups on offense- the offensive line and wide receiver. The two that most people complained about the most when Dan was here.


To me, we have improved since the LSU game. A&M and La Tech were by far the two best games we've played this year. And then we lost to Alabama on the road. But we have a good chance to finish strong.

This OL has 3 guys that will be playing in the NFL. Our coaching has sucked. No touches for our RBs. No touches by our best WR. Jo makes the presnap calls on what the defense is doing and can?t identify a blitz. It?s unorganized confusion.

[cheewgumm]

Kylin Hill is our most explosive player and Aeries is second.

They average 3-6 carries a game.

It?s not about yesterday. It?s about all year.

[HoopsDawg]

Kylin Hill is our most explosive player and Aeries is second.

They average 3-6 carries a game.

It?s not about yesterday. It?s about all year.

It's just so brutal. And looking at PSU last year their RB, TE, and WR are all in the NFL this year. Hard not to be good in the big ten with that talent.

[Bubb Rubb]

Kylin Hill is our most explosive player and Aeries is second.

They average 3-6 carries a game.

It?s not about yesterday. It?s about all year.

It's negligence, pure and simple. The one time we committed to running the ball, we ran all over Auburn, and Moorhead bragged postgame about having taken his coaching pills that week.

[Homedawg]

The thing is it's not about just this year- it's about the next five years. If he brings in players that can run his system he will succeed.

If he's still here maybe. Next year will be a down year. Hope it's not a disaster year. If it is, he won't be here for year 3. And for our sake recruiting etc I pray it isn't.

[Walkerhill]

I appreciate your optimism. Do you not see major flaws in joes system?

Every system has strengths and weaknesses. Joe?s system attacks the field horizontally and vertically and is dynamic when implemented effectively, but does not stay on schedule in terms of down and distance as well as say Mullen and offers less running back rushing touches (but more running back catches).

Watching 2017 Penn State games, I do not see major flaws though, so no. I actually think McSorley was a good but not perfect fit for the offense. Imagine a genuine dual threat in this offense, it could get scary.

[cheewgumm]

Bubb AMEN!! He said that. I thought at the time he meant ?ok I get it it. We have to give it to our RBs?

Obviously not.

What did he mean by that then and why did he say it?

[Cooterpoot]

There is no question that we are lacking at a couple of key position groups on offense- the offensive line and wide receiver. The two that most people complained about the most when Dan was here.


To me, we have improved since the LSU game. A&M and La Tech were by far the two best games we've played this year. And then we lost to Alabama on the road. But we have a good chance to finish strong.

A&M and La Tech suck on defense. We had one drive vs AL.

[Todd4State]

I appreciate your optimism. Do you not see major flaws in joes system?

I see more major flaws with our current players.

Why is it unrealistic for us to expect a QB to be able to read a defense after year five? I also question Fitz's overall motivation to succeed at a high level based on the fact that he was suspended in game one and how he has acted towards our fans on Twitter at times. And the thing is if we dumb it down too much- people like Saban are going to eat it alive.


The RB's are fine.


The WR's drop too many passes and other than Guidry we don't have a gamebreaker or really a true deep threat. Within the system itself- I see us with players that are open at times. See the flea flicker yesterday. Among many others. Someone like a Minchew is probably able to take advantage of that.


The TE's are fine.


We're starting two offensive tackles that probably should be back ups. Reese should be moved to guard next year. That's from recruiting three offensive linemen a year.


This offense with these same player has worked fine against lesser talented teams. There is no question about that. If it was solely the system- we would be having similar struggles against everyone. Not just top 20 teams. The best solution is to get a QB that can run the system, get better receivers, and fix the depth on the o-line. Not dumb it down to where we're handing it off every play and all pass routes are two man routes. People can talk about conference stats all they want- and that's only because it fits their argument. When you realize that on the season we are only averaging 6 points less than we did last year it's not so dramatic.

[DancingRabbit]

Damn dude. Guess you had half a handle of bourbon left knee from last night and decided to start hitting it for breakfast. SloMo took a guaranteed 10 win team and is struggling to win 8. If you can?t see that, put the bottle down and seek an AA meeting this week.

That doesn't exist except for Bama.

You act like we lost to South Alabama or Maine. How many times did Dan win 10 in the regular season?

[Walkerhill]

I am not saying the coaching this year has been effective as hoped or that fans can’t be disappointed in the 2018 season. They can and I share those concerns. The bigger point is that is is possible to be disappointed in this year and also supportive of the program and even optimistic about 2020, with an expectation of a bowl appearance next year in a rebuilding year.

We need to close this year out with 2 wins and possibly a bowl win on top and move forward. (If we lose one of these last 2 games then I think that would cost Joe a lot of credibility so he needs to take care of business)

[Todd4State]

This OL has 3 guys that will be playing in the NFL. Our coaching has sucked. No touches for our RBs. No touches by our best WR. Jo makes the presnap calls on what the defense is doing and can?t identify a blitz. It?s unorganized confusion.

And what about the other two? Eiland is going to be good- but he isn't a finished product right now. Reese is out of position. Jenkins still snaps balls at Fitz's feet at times.

[cheewgumm]

Our running backs should be fresh, that?s for sure.

[Todd4State]

A&M and La Tech suck on defense. We had one drive vs AL.

And we scored on both of them. Like we were supposed to do. If there was so much confusion and etc. why didn't it show up there? If it's truly confusion and disorganization it's going to carry across to all games. See Croom.

Alabama has the top scoring defense in the league and has the officials in their back pocket. And that's the standard you're judging this offense by?

[Schultzy]

This staff didn?t inherit the same qb Mullen had. Fitz has clearly lost mobility with that broken ankle.

[Todd4State]

I am not saying the coaching this year has been effective as hoped or that fans can’t be disappointed in the 2018 season. They can and I share those concerns. The bigger point is that is is possible to be disappointed in this year and also supportive of the program and even optimistic about 2020, with an expectation of a bowl appearance next year in a rebuilding year.

We need to close this year out with 2 wins and possibly a bowl win on top and move forward. (If we lose one of these last 2 games then I think that would cost Joe a lot of credibility so he needs to take care of business)

But noooooo we lost to Kentucky so fire everyone because I said that Kentucky sucks.**********

I agree that these last two games are important for Joe and the offense needs to perform well.

[cheewgumm]

Nobody is judging this offense based in just Alabama.

So we were good every game, but Bama?

We?v been Good in this offense against a decent team once - A&M.

Against Auburn our RBs got the ball. That?s apparently not this offense, as it hasn?t happens since.

I?m not counting Stephen F Austin, La Laffeyetee or La a tech as we will always beat those teams up. That can?t be our standard unless we are moving to the Sunbelt conference.

[Bubb Rubb]

I see more major flaws with our current players.

Why is it unrealistic for us to expect a QB to be able to read a defense after year five? I also question Fitz's overall motivation to succeed at a high level based on the fact that he was suspended in game one and how he has acted towards our fans on Twitter at times. And the thing is if we dumb it down too much- people like Saban are going to eat it alive.

It might surprise you to know that Fitz was suspended for missing one offseason workout. But let's go ahead and paint him as not motivated to succeed. He busted his ass rehabbing a broken ankle and took one day off to hang out with his girlfriend. That's why he was suspended. As for the twitter thing, I don't blame him with the shit that gets thrown his way. On the comment about "dumbed down" offenses, we sure kicked Saban's ass last year with it. We ran all over them and should have won that game.


The RB's are fine.

Apparently not fine enough to get the touches they should be getting.


The WR's drop too many passes and other than Guidry we don't have a gamebreaker or really a true deep threat. Within the system itself- I see us with players that are open at times. See the flea flicker yesterday. Among many others. Someone like a Minchew is probably able to take advantage of that.

So, does Fitz suck, or do the receivers suck? Just trying to get the narrative straight.
The TE's are fine.

The tight ends are also under-utilized in this offense too, although Green dropped a big third down pass that killed a drive yesterday.


We're starting two offensive tackles that probably should be back ups. Reese should be moved to guard next year. That's from recruiting three offensive linemen a year.

This same offensive line, almost fully intact, was a top 3 offensive line in the conference last year. #facts. Those tackles you speak of will be in the NFL. #facts.


This offense with these same player has worked fine against lesser talented teams. There is no question about that. If it was solely the system- we would be having similar struggles against everyone. Not just top 20 teams. The best solution is to get a QB that can run the system, get better receivers, and fix the depth on the o-line. Not dumb it down to where we're handing it off every play and all pass routes are two man routes. People can talk about conference stats all they want- and that's only because it fits their argument. When you realize that on the season we are only averaging 6 points less than we did last year it's not so dramatic.

That the offense works against lesser teams doesn't help your argument. It, on the contrary, hurts it. It shows that this offense is talented enough to impose their will on lesser defenses despite their struggles.



*

[Walkerhill]

But noooooo we lost to Kentucky so fire everyone because I said that Kentucky sucks.**********

I agree that these last two games are important for Joe and the offense needs to perform well.

It seems like people also to some degree just remember things better than they were with Dan. We struggled with Kentucky in 2014 when we were ranked #1 and had way more talent than them. We lost to them in 2016. Yet people keep saying at least Dan dominated Kentucky. Stoops is doing a good job there and they have given us trouble away for several years.

We are always way better at home than on the road, excepting a few great performances at LSU in 2014 and Texas A&M in 2017.

[msstate7]

It seems like people also to some degree just remember things better than they were with Dan. We struggled with Kentucky in 2014 when we were ranked #1 and had way more talent than them. We lost to them in 2016. Yet people keep saying at least Dan dominated Kentucky. Stoops is doing a good job there and they have given us trouble away for several years.

We are always way better at home than on the road, excepting a few great performances at LSU in 2014 and Texas A&M in 2017.

We've lost to Kentucky 2 times since Mullen got here. Both times were when we were totally incompetent on one side: sirmon running defense and Moorhead running offense

[dawgday166]

I see more major flaws with our current players.

Why is it unrealistic for us to expect a QB to be able to read a defense after year five? I also question Fitz's overall motivation to succeed at a high level based on the fact that he was suspended in game one and how he has acted towards our fans on Twitter at times. And the thing is if we dumb it down too much- people like Saban are going to eat it alive.


The RB's are fine.


The WR's drop too many passes and other than Guidry we don't have a gamebreaker or really a true deep threat. Within the system itself- I see us with players that are open at times. See the flea flicker yesterday. Among many others. Someone like a Minchew is probably able to take advantage of that.


The TE's are fine.


We're starting two offensive tackles that probably should be back ups. Reese should be moved to guard next year. That's from recruiting three offensive linemen a year.


This offense with these same player has worked fine against lesser talented teams. There is no question about that. If it was solely the system- we would be having similar struggles against everyone. Not just top 20 teams. The best solution is to get a QB that can run the system, get better receivers, and fix the depth on the o-line. Not dumb it down to where we're handing it off every play and all pass routes are two man routes. People can talk about conference stats all they want- and that's only because it fits their argument. When you realize that on the season we are only averaging 6 points less than we did last year it's not so dramatic.

LOL ... yea all games counts. 26.5 in SEC last year and that's playing 2 elite Ds better than any in SEC this year except ours, and 1 D about the same as their last year Ds (Bama). In fact, even with the missing LBs last year I believe last year's Bama team better on Dline, maybe not quite up to '18 LBs, and much better in secondary. And we score 24 on them .. it was at home tho.

[Todd4State]

Nobody is judging this offense based in just Alabama.

So we were good every game, but Bama?

We?v been Good in this offense against a decent team once - A&M.

Against Auburn our RBs got the ball. That?s apparently not this offense, as it hasn?t happens since.

I?m not counting Stephen F Austin, La Laffeyetee or La a tech as we will always beat those teams up. That can?t be our standard unless we are moving to the Sunbelt conference.

You missed the context of the conversation. No one is saying that anyone is comparing the entire offense on the Alabama game. We were talking about improvement.

We always beat up those teams? We literally had at least one competitive OOC a year for almost as long as I can remember across multiple coaches including some very embarrassing losses. No one is saying that is our standard- but the reality is again if we don't know what we're doing against LSU and the other good teams- we're not going to know what we're doing against everyone.

I'd say Auburn is pretty "decent". You could make an argument for La Tech being "decent" as they are about to win 8-9 games with two losses against SEC teams- and they played LSU a lot closer than us. In fact LSU scored fewer points against them on offense.

[Todd4State]

*

If Fitz missed a workout to be with his girlfriend that absolutely confirms that he isn't focused on football like he needs to be. It's a lot easier to run on Saban's third string LB's at home than it is in Tuscaloosa.

Both Fitz and the WR's suck. That's the "narrative".

Those NFL offensive linemen are still sophomores. Look at tape of Derek Sherrod before his junior year- he definitely took some lumps. If Reese makes it to the NFL, again it will be at guard so he is not only not ready from an experience standpoint he is also out of position. This offensive line also struggled with top 20 teams last year- Georgia, Auburn, and even had trouble at times with UMass. #facts


Showing that the offense does well against lesser teams doesn't "hurt my argument" at all since the entire basis of my argument is that we lack the talent on the offensive side of the ball to beat better teams. How many top 20 teams has this current group of all-stars beat the past 2-3 years? Explain to me how come we know the plays against Texas A&M but then all of a sudden do we magically forget the plays against Alabama?

[Todd4State]

LOL ... yea all games counts. 26.5 in SEC last year and that's playing 2 elite Ds better than any in SEC this year except ours, and 1 D about the same as their last year Ds (Bama). In fact, even with the missing LBs last year I believe last year's Bama team better on Dline, maybe not quite up to '18 LBs, and much better in secondary. And we score 24 on them .. it was at home tho.

http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category09/sort01.html

http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category10/sort01.html

I'd say this year the defenses are better than last year as a whole. Even La Tech is in the top 50.


I still want to see where we are after playing Arkansas and Ole Miss.

[Todd4State]

It seems like people also to some degree just remember things better than they were with Dan. We struggled with Kentucky in 2014 when we were ranked #1 and had way more talent than them. We lost to them in 2016. Yet people keep saying at least Dan dominated Kentucky. Stoops is doing a good job there and they have given us trouble away for several years.

We are always way better at home than on the road, excepting a few great performances at LSU in 2014 and Texas A&M in 2017.

As I've said before- the funny thing about all the Joe Moorhead hate is he is essentially on pace to have a season that is about on par with what Dan did repeatedly except for 2014.


But you are exactly right.

[msudawglb]

Saying our offense was bad or average is just wrong. Our ?bad? offense averaged 30 points a game last year. Everyone was back.

If we average 30 points this year, we are 10-0.

It?s a valid complaint.

We are averaging 26.2 now after 10 games. If we had scored 40 more points this season we would be averaging 30. So give us 10 more points in each of our 4 loses and guess what...we?d be 7-3.

So, your argument is wrong. Hell, we?d be averaging 28/game right now if Mitchell catches the ball against FL and if the refs don?t screw us with the phantom block in the back against Bama.

[Bubb Rubb]

If Fitz missed a workout to be with his girlfriend that absolutely confirms that he isn't focused on football like he needs to be. It's a lot easier to run on Saban's third string LB's at home than it is in Tuscaloosa.

Both Fitz and the WR's suck. That's the "narrative".

Those NFL offensive linemen are still sophomores. Look at tape of Derek Sherrod before his junior year- he definitely took some lumps. If Reese makes it to the NFL, again it will be at guard so he is not only not ready from an experience standpoint he is also out of position. This offensive line also struggled with top 20 teams last year- Georgia, Auburn, and even had trouble at times with UMass. #facts


Showing that the offense does well against lesser teams doesn't "hurt my argument" at all since the entire basis of my argument is that we lack the talent on the offensive side of the ball to beat better teams. How many top 20 teams has this current group of all-stars beat the past 2-3 years? Explain to me how come we know the plays against Texas A&M but then all of a sudden do we magically forget the plays against Alabama?

1. Taking off one afternoon in May when he otherwise rehabbed six days a week for 8 months is not worthy of you accusing him of not being focused on football like he needs to be. Don't be an idiot. As for running on Saban's third string LBs at home, don't be that guy. Alabama's defense was better last year, even with the injuries, than they are this year.

2. Keep moving those goalposts.

3. So you are now an expert on scouting offensive line talent, in addition to your many other self-proclaimed skills? Here's some advice for you: you don't know what you're talking about.

4. How hard is it for you to understand that we play better against A&M than we do Alabama because we can out-talent A&M but can't out-talent Bama? This bullshit offense we run won't work against teams like Alabama because we aren't superior enough on the line, for example, to create enough time for our QB to make the right reads.

You really need to stick to thinking you know it all about baseball.

[Bubb Rubb]

We are averaging 26.2 now after 10 games. If we had scored 40 more points this season we would be averaging 30. So give us 10 more points in each of our 4 loses and guess what...we?d be 7-3.

So, your argument is wrong. Hell, we?d be averaging 28/game right now if Mitchell catches the ball against FL and if the refs don?t screw us with the phantom block in the back against Bama.


What are we averaging in SEC play, versus what we averaged in SEC play last year? Counting non-conference scoring in the average is stupid.

[Bubb Rubb]

As I've said before- the funny thing about all the Joe Moorhead hate is he is essentially on pace to have a season that is about on par with what Dan did repeatedly except for 2014.


Dan never had a team this loaded, including the 2014 team, but don't let facts get in the way of your little diatribe. IF this is now the expectation, that 8-4 is acceptable, which includes two losses to double digit underdogs, then we deserve every big of ridicule as a fanbase that others throw at us. Let's stop making excuses for underperformance and demand better.

[Cooterpoot]

We are averaging 26.2 now after 10 games. If we had scored 40 more points this season we would be averaging 30. So give us 10 more points in each of our 4 loses and guess what...we?d be 7-3.

So, your argument is wrong. Hell, we?d be averaging 28/game right now if Mitchell catches the ball against FL and if the refs don?t screw us with the phantom block in the back against Bama.

Go look at SEC games. Our OOC scheduled was trash. We’re 15 points a game worse.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Yeah my point is Mullen is the best QB coach in the country and that has an actual impact on the QB.

Do you disagree?

It's mind boggling you can't see that

Mullen is the best running qb coach in the country.

[Dawgtini]

I see more major flaws with our current players.

Why is it unrealistic for us to expect a QB to be able to read a defense after year five? I also question Fitz's overall motivation to succeed at a high level based on the fact that he was suspended in game one and how he has acted towards our fans on Twitter at times. And the thing is if we dumb it down too much- people like Saban are going to eat it alive.


The RB's are fine.


The WR's drop too many passes and other than Guidry we don't have a gamebreaker or really a true deep threat. Within the system itself- I see us with players that are open at times. See the flea flicker yesterday. Among many others. Someone like a Minchew is probably able to take advantage of that.


The TE's are fine.


We're starting two offensive tackles that probably should be back ups. Reese should be moved to guard next year. That's from recruiting three offensive linemen a year.


This offense with these same player has worked fine against lesser talented teams. There is no question about that. If it was solely the system- we would be having similar struggles against everyone. Not just top 20 teams. The best solution is to get a QB that can run the system, get better receivers, and fix the depth on the o-line. Not dumb it down to where we're handing it off every play and all pass routes are two man routes. People can talk about conference stats all they want- and that's only because it fits their argument. When you realize that on the season we are only averaging 6 points less than we did last year it's not so dramatic.
Well said Todd

[Really Clark?]

And we scored on both of them. Like we were supposed to do. If there was so much confusion and etc. why didn't it show up there? If it's truly confusion and disorganization it's going to carry across to all games. See Croom.

Alabama has the top scoring defense in the league and has the officials in their back pocket. And that's the standard you're judging this offense by?

I kind of agree with you and Croom’s last year is a historic offensive low that we have been comparing. But even that season we put up 24 vs 5th ranked LSU and 31 vs Ark right before getting shut out in the EB. And scored 17 to beat #13 Vandy. So as bad as Croom’s offense was that year, a blind coach finds some offensive nuts every once and a while. We avg 10 points per game against 5 ranked opponents that season, we stand at 4 points per game against the 4 ranked opponents this year. I agree that it’s disjointed and it’s not as bad as Croom in the overall sense but that year we scored over 30 multiple times against weak opponents, including an SEC team. The comoarable markers are just worrying, not as consistently bad as Croom, not saying that but troubling.

[Cooterpoot]

We have no WR difference makers being signed this year. We can’t find a RB that wants to play for us. We think we’ve got our QB but he won’t play for 2 years. Improvement is going to take too long. We’re looking at 3 more years maybe. If we can’t sign stud skill guys, this offense will not work. That’s the major concern for me.

[Really Clark?]

We are averaging 26.2 now after 10 games. If we had scored 40 more points this season we would be averaging 30. So give us 10 more points in each of our 4 loses and guess what...we?d be 7-3.

So, your argument is wrong. Hell, we?d be averaging 28/game right now if Mitchell catches the ball against FL and if the refs don?t screw us with the phantom block in the back against Bama.

It’s the conference game drop. We averaged 26 in conference last year and 11.2 so far this season. With additional offensive possessions scoring, field position, time of possession, etc. It’s reasonable to see how the games play out differently leading to 7-9 wins right now.

[dawgday166]

http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category09/sort01.html

http://www.cfbstats.com/2018/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category10/sort01.html

I'd say this year the defenses are better than last year as a whole. Even La Tech is in the top 50.


I still want to see where we are after playing Arkansas and Ole Miss.

I know these support what you want to believe in, how it's all Mullen's fault, it's not Moorhead's fault etc.

What you're trying to prove is this. If I go look at overall CFB stats and Michigan is #1 in total defense. Then I go look at the NFL's total defense leader and they don't have as good of stats as Michigan ... well I guess that means Michigan has a better defense then. It must be so, they have better stats. But it ain't so cause they ain't played the same level of competition. The only way you can compare is in conference only, and that sill won't tell you if Michigan has a better D, or we have the better D. Do you believe the total D leader of the Mountain West is as good as ours?

Maybe overall the Ds are better this year than last (although none are in GAs and AUs class from last year except us). But Vanderbilt ... Vander freaking bilt is scoring 10 more in conference than we are. There is no excuse for that. I bitched about Mullen's ho-hum offensive stats many times but he never approached this level of ineptitude. AU with replacing 4 Olinemen and Kerryon Johnson from last year, are scoring 11 pts more. And they're terrible on offense.