Aeris Sitting First Half

[Really Clark?]

Moorehead stayed it was an accountability issue and he understood

[dawgday166]

Accountability from Aeris. That's somewhat hard to believe.

[msstate7]

Accountability from Aeris. That's somewhat hard to believe.

Twice this year. He's lost his starting job, and that's a tough pill to swallow

[dawgday166]

Twice this year. He's lost his starting job, and that's a tough pill to swallow

What happened then ... Do you know?

[msstate7]

What happened then ... Do you know?

Nah, no idea

[sandwolf]

Didn't he sit a game earlier in the year because of this?

[I_Spy]

I love all our running backs Kylin, aeris, nick, d lee

Will we have a 1000 yard rushing running back this year? Because we should out of this group, one would think. I can’t figure it out. But it’s all pissing me off when I think about our losses.

[Cooterpoot]

I?m already on record as saying I completely disagree with how Jo handles the practice crap and player rotations of the skill guys. Aries has never been a problem. Jo not letting him touch the damn field most of the season is bullshit. Losing your starting job is one thing. Not touching the field is stupid. Of course, the RBs don?t get carries anyway, so it?s a moot point I guess. Not rotating players is going to be tough in the SEC. Just too damn physical.

[Dawg2003]

I?m already on record as saying I completely disagree with how Jo handles the practice crap and player rotations of the skill guys. Aries has never been a problem. Jo not letting him touch the damn field most of the season is bullshit. Losing your starting job is one thing. Not touching the field is stupid. Of course, the RBs don?t get carries anyway, so it?s a moot point I guess. Not rotating players is going to be tough in the SEC. Just too damn physical.

How do you know Aeris was never a problem? How do you know Mullen didn't play favorites and let him get away with stuff?

[msstate7]

How do you know Aeris was never a problem? How do you know Mullen didn't play favorites and let him get away with stuff?

With your insinuation, I suppose you have proof he did

[Cooterpoot]

How do you know Aeris was never a problem? How do you know Mullen didn't play favorites and let him get away with stuff?

Because I know. And that’s as good an answer as your question asked.

[DanDority]

Because I know. And that’s as good an answer as your question asked.

Inquiring minds, let us in on what you KNOW.

[Dawg2003]

With your insinuation, I suppose you have proof he did

No, I have no idea. I only asked a question and made no insinuations or statements of fact. I'm just wondering because of the thread on Six Pack that talked about Mullen playing favorites and letting certain players slide. It's weird in any event. He's had two issues that caused him to be benched. The other option is that Moorhead doesn't like him and is doing it out of spite. That seems less likely.

[Dawg2003]

Twice this year. He's lost his starting job, and that's a tough pill to swallow

That makes me wonder if he's acted out in some way because he lost his starting job. That seems the most plausible of any explanation.

[shoeless joe]

How do you know Aeris was never a problem? How do you know Mullen didn't play favorites and let him get away with stuff?

Because the folks that know aeris know that your scenario is extraordinarily unlikely to the point that it's absurd.

[Bully13]

I thought the first time it was due to practice hustle. Same stuff maybe?

[MaroonFlounder]

It's hard to make sense of the reduced carries for a Senior RB that is coming off a 1,000 yard rushing season last year.

But I think the minimal wear and tear on his body means he will do very well at the combine in the spring and have a chance to be on a NFL roster.

[West Tn Dawg]

I have no idea what the issue is, but I would have to believe there is something going on. No way a coach would come out publicly and lie about something like this. Williams and anybody else would call him out in a second!

[sandwolf]

Because the folks that know aeris know that your scenario is extraordinarily unlikely to the point that it's absurd.

I'm sure he's a good guy, but whether it is on the field or off, he's clearly not getting his shit handled. Because this is the second time that Moorhead has suspended him, and he's not doing it for no reason.

[msu15]

It's hard to make sense of the reduced carries for a Senior RB that is coming off a 1,000 yard rushing season last year.

But I think the minimal wear and tear on his body means he will do very well at the combine in the spring and have a chance to be on a NFL roster.

How is it hard to make sense when he has a superior RB ahead of him?

[Really Clark?]

How is it hard to make sense when he has a superior RB ahead of him?

Different skill set and Aeris is a true 3 down back. They are both avg 6.62 and 6.65 yards per carry this season. Not a big drop off in that area. Hill has bigger play potential but Aeris is a better inside runner and can help in more ways. At this point in their career Hill is not superior and Aeris and Fitz work better together.

[dawgday166]

Different skill set and Aeris is a true 3 down back. They are both avg 6.62 and 6.65 yards per carry this season. Not a big drop off in that area. Hill has bigger play potential but Aeris is a better inside runner and can help in more ways. At this point in their career Hill is not superior and Aeris and Fitz work better together.

Nail head meet hammer **

[Cooterpoot]

How is it hard to make sense when he has a superior RB ahead of him?

While I have no problem with Hill being the starter and Aries the #2, yards per carry 6.6 for Hill vs 6.7 for Aries. Rushing TDs 3 for Hill, 2 for Aries. Rec. TDs 3 for Hill vs 1 for Aries. Per Rec. avg Hill 8.8 vs Aries 12.9. So I don't see where Hill is that much better, performance wise, than Aries. And Aries is just over half the touches. I think we all see Hill's potential, but he's not putting up better numbers.

[dawgday166]

While I have no problem with Hill being the starter and Aries the #2, yards per carry 6.6 for Hill vs 6.7 for Aries. Rushing TDs 3 for Hill, 2 for Aries. Rec. TDs 3 for Hill vs 1 for Aries. Per Rec. avg Hill 8.8 vs Aries 12.9. So I don't see where Hill is that much better, performance wise, than Aries. And Aries is just over half the touches. I think we all see Hill's potential, but he's not putting up better numbers.

And that's with the inflation due to his huge KSU game. I'm pretty sure most of Aeris' touches have come against SEC foes. Right now Hill isn't an NFL back IMO. Can he develop into one? Maybe. He has a lot of work to do tho.

[msstate7]

And that's with the inflation due to his huge KSU game. I'm pretty sure most of Aeris' touches have come against SEC foes. Right now Hill isn't an NFL back IMO. Can he develop into one? Maybe. He has a lot of work to do tho.

No idea if he'll be drafted or not, but no nfl team will trust him picking up LBs protecting the qb right now

[dawgday166]

No idea if he'll be drafted or not, but no nfl team will trust him picking up LBs protecting the qb right now

No doubt about that. Won't make NFL as RB if you can't/won't block.

ETA: I really think that if Joe starts Kylin against Bama ... that will be a very bad move IMO.

[msstate7]

No doubt about that. Won't make NFL as RB if you can't/won't block.

ETA: I really think that if Joe starts Kylin against Bama ... that will be a very bad move IMO.

It's gonna happen. I'd just tell Kylin to go to the flat on obvious passing situations as a hot read. He can't pick up bama LBs.

[dawgday166]

It's gonna happen. I'd just tell Kylin to go to the flat on obvious passing situations as a hot read. He can't pick up bama LBs.

I know ... Fitz gotta get rid of it quick. Shots down the field won't have time to develop ... and Joe likes shots down the field. Hope Fitz comes out alive this week.

[Cooterpoot]

Jo is so caught up in this idea of "explosive plays" that he hasn't figured out the SEC defenses eat that crap up. You're effectively playing for a couple a game in the SEC unless you've got dynamic WRs and a good QB ie. MO and AL. Long routes and runs off the edge are hard to block.

[dawgday166]

Jo is so caught up in this idea of "explosive plays" that he hasn't figured out the SEC defenses eat that crap up. You're effectively playing for a couple a game in the SEC unless you've got dynamic WRs and a good QB ie. MO and AL. Long routes and runs off the edge are hard to block.

Most years the only way you can beat Bama is with a load of explosive plays. But I'm not sure we have the personnel and I also believe we can run on this Bama D. We do have to be able to pass it some too ... but Joe do like to air it out a good bit. We'll see how that turns out.

[shoeless joe]

I'm sure he's a good guy, but whether it is on the field or off, he's clearly not getting his shit handled. Because this is the second time that Moorhead has suspended him, and he's not doing it for no reason.

You're right. But my response was to the guy sayin it was possible for aeris to have been a problem child all along. That's simply not the case.

I haven't heard this straight from the horses mouth but based on what I have been told I'm going to put 2 & 2 together and I'll choose to believe that aeris saw from the beginning what we all saw after the Kentucky and Florida games. Because of this he had trouble buying in since he had way more SEC experience than the offensive staff for the most part. I'm sure losing carries based on this made things even worse.

[Really Clark?]

Nm

[drunkernhelldawg]

How do you know Aeris was never a problem? How do you know Mullen didn't play favorites and let him get away with stuff?

Don't get lost on playing favorites. All humans have favorites.. Even your Mom, and mine.

[gravedigger]

Jo is so caught up in this idea of "explosive plays" that he hasn't figured out the SEC defenses eat that crap up. You're effectively playing for a couple a game in the SEC unless you've got dynamic WRs and a good QB ie. MO and AL. Long routes and runs off the edge are hard to block.

He?s not any more

[MaroonFlounder]

Aeris should start Saturday and play until Joe figures out Bama's pressure schemes.

[Cowbell]

You're right. But my response was to the guy sayin it was possible for aeris to have been a problem child all along. That's simply not the case.

I haven't heard this straight from the horses mouth but based on what I have been told I'm going to put 2 & 2 together and I'll choose to believe that aeris saw from the beginning what we all saw after the Kentucky and Florida games. Because of this he had trouble buying in since he had way more SEC experience than the offensive staff for the most part. I'm sure losing carries based on this made things even worse.

Why you mind sharing more about this? I would really like to know what is going on in Joes mind right now.

[TUSK]

No doubt about that. Won't make NFL as RB if you can't/won't block.

ETA: I really think that if Joe starts Kylin against Bama ... that will be a very bad move IMO.

If Hill continues to struggle in pass protection. and starts this weekend, those that wanna see KT will likely get their wish...

[Todd4State]

Don't discount Hill's receiving ability. He's our second leading receiver on the team, is tied for the team lead for receiving TD's and is averaging 40 more all-purpose yards per game than Aeris. All the while averaging the same YPC essentially as a running back.

[BhamDawg205]

Don't discount Hill's receiving ability. He's our second leading receiver on the team, is tied for the team lead for receiving TD's and is averaging 40 more all-purpose yards per game than Aeris. All the while averaging the same YPC essentially as a running back.

Hill has great hands that's been seen. Those stats are good. But giving those yards back by missing pass rusher every game is the issue. Hill is explosive, Aries is consistent.

[msbulldog]

Don't discount Hill's receiving ability. He's our second leading receiver on the team, is tied for the team lead for receiving TD's and is averaging 40 more all-purpose yards per game than Aeris. All the while averaging the same YPC essentially as a running back.

So start Hill in the slot and AW in the backfield, problem solved.

[BhamDawg205]

So start Hill in the slot and AW in the backfield, problem solved.

Works for me... Or at least a package both in backfield and Hill motions to the slot. That formation alone could lead to screens, jet sweeps and more. That gives Hill touches in space. Gives us a reliable pass blocker in the backfield. JoMo hint hint

[RiverCityDawg]

It's interesting to me that some people railed on Mullen for playing seniority/experience over talent and citing pass blocking as a reason the more talented running back wasn't getting snaps, yet now we have a thread full of people wanting the less talented senior running back that is only better at pass blocking to be playing over the more talented guy. I'm sure it is a different group of people, so I'm not suggesting that minds have changed, just pointing out the difference in viewpoint.

Kylin is quicker, faster, stronger, a more talented runner, a more explosive receiver and apparently more accountable off the field. Aeris is tough as nails, a great pass blocker who is more experienced, but otherwise brings nothing as a runner that Kylin doesn't. Aeris will make a 0 yard gain 4 yards every time, but sometimes he'll also make a 12 yard gain only 4 yards.

I think the upside Kylin gives as a ball carrier and playmaker is worth the downgrade in pass blocking. Clearly many in this thread do not, and I respect that opinion though I disagree.

Just an interesting fan dynamic...

[Thick]

I like the idea of playing both at the same time, sometimes in the backfield together, some in the slot, motion in and out of the backfield regardless if it’s a run or pass. Scouts are going to tell our staff that Hill is going to have to improve in pass pro if he wants to play in the NFL. The staff will relay that message to him this year, if it hasn’t been mentioned already.

My opinion is it’s a fvcking waste of talent to not have a running game and a short passing game with those 2 in the game simultaneously. It completely amazes me that coaches get paid so much to deliver so little when the talent is right there in front of them. Just no imagination or creativity especially in short yardage or goal line situations. I digress.

[Cooterpoot]

It's interesting to me that some people railed on Mullen for playing seniority/experience over talent and citing pass blocking as a reason the more talented running back wasn't getting snaps, yet now we have a thread full of people wanting the less talented senior running back that is only better at pass blocking to be playing over the more talented guy. I'm sure it is a different group of people, so I'm not suggesting that minds have changed, just pointing out the difference in viewpoint.

Kylin is quicker, faster, stronger, a more talented runner, a more explosive receiver and apparently more accountable off the field. Aeris is tough as nails, a great pass blocker who is more experienced, but otherwise brings nothing as a runner that Kylin doesn't. Aeris will make a 0 yard gain 4 yards every time, but sometimes he'll also make a 12 yard gain only 4 yards.

I think the upside Kylin gives as a ball carrier and playmaker is worth the downgrade in pass blocking. Clearly many in this thread do not, and I respect that opinion though I disagree.

Just an interesting fan dynamic...

Kylins numbers aren't any better than Aries's though. That's the point people are making.

[tcdog70]

It's interesting to me that some people railed on Mullen for playing seniority/experience over talent and citing pass blocking as a reason the more talented running back wasn't getting snaps, yet now we have a thread full of people wanting the less talented senior running back that is only better at pass blocking to be playing over the more talented guy. I'm sure it is a different group of people, so I'm not suggesting that minds have changed, just pointing out the difference in viewpoint.

Kylin is quicker, faster, stronger, a more talented runner, a more explosive receiver and apparently more accountable off the field. Aeris is tough as nails, a great pass blocker who is more experienced, but otherwise brings nothing as a runner that Kylin doesn't. Aeris will make a 0 yard gain 4 yards every time, but sometimes he'll also make a 12 yard gain only 4 yards.

I think the upside Kylin gives as a ball carrier and playmaker is worth the downgrade in pass blocking. Clearly many in this thread do not, and I respect that opinion though I disagree.

Just an interesting fan dynamic...

he will make a 12 yarder into a 4 yarder--what are you basing that on. some stat you have found--eye test--what? I have not seen it.

[RiverCityDawg]

Kylins numbers aren't any better than Aries's though. That's the point people are making.

Number don't always tell the truth. For example, Aeris had 2 carries last week. One was the 29 yard TD late in the 3Q straight up the middle through a wide open hole. Good run, but I think everyone would agree that Kylin or Gibson could have made that play. His only other carry was a 13 yard draw on 3rd and 39. A 13 yard carry is great, but they were playing everyone back and conceded the yardage to get the stop. So he ends the game with a 21 yard average. Is he better than Kylin because Kylin only had 4ypc? Of course not. Now it doesn't mean he's NOT better either. Honestly we don't get either enough carriers for the stats to be reliable on this. Since numbers aren't telling the story, you basically have to make an eye test evaluation.

So, how many non-pass blocking plays this year have you seen Aeris make that you thought Kylin would/could not have made? I haven't seen any. Think of how many plays Kylin has made that Aeris likely couldn't have made? The first play of the season, the TD catch last week. A couple of the runs against KSU. Many of the outside runs and sweeps against Auburn.

Again, pass blocking aside, I don't see how anyone can watch the 2 without bias and say that Kylin is not clearly the more talented runner/receiver. If that's true, you have to admit you would be losing some of Aeris is playing more over him. At that point becomes a subjective debate on the value of Aeris's pass blocking vs Kylin's superior skill as a runner/receiver.

[Cooterpoot]

Nothing against Kylin but he's not breaking long runs and putting up big numbers. He's getting double the carries but he's not putting up better numbers with them. The difference between the two in skill level isn't being taken advantage of. If that's going to be the case, give Aries touches. If we were actually running Jo's offense, Kylin would be great I think. But we're not running his offense.

[Lord McBuckethead]

What has shown us Kylin is better or more explosive than Aeris. Sure, he looks shiftier. I said this before the season, Aeris rarely if ever get tackled for a loss. Aeris picks up blocks. Aeris also probably has just as man 10+ yard runs as Kylin and Kylin is getting 2x the amount of carries. If we are going to go with Kylin, that dude needs to be all over the field. Motioned all over the place to form mismatches. I really want him to get the Saquon treatment in our offense. Hell, let him throw it too.

[Really Clark?]

What has shown us Kylin is better or more explosive than Aeris. Sure, he looks shiftier. I said this before the season, Aeris rarely if ever get tackled for a loss. Aeris picks up blocks. Aeris also probably has just as man 10+ yard runs as Kylin and Kylin is getting 2x the amount of carries. If we are going to go with Kylin, that dude needs to be all over the field. Motioned all over the place to form mismatches. I really want him to get the Saquon treatment in our offense. Hell, let him throw it too.

Kylin 10+ yard rushes 15, 20+ yard rushes 3 on 81 carries. Ares 11 and 2 on 48 carries. Aeris has higher percentage of explosive runs

[Todd4State]

Hill has great hands that's been seen. Those stats are good. But giving those yards back by missing pass rusher every game is the issue. Hill is explosive, Aries is consistent.

They both bring different things to the table and both should be used. I'm just pointing out that at this point they are both similar in production and that's not that clear that one is better than the other.


So start Hill in the slot and AW in the backfield, problem solved.


And that this is how you solve the situation. I would imagine that both Hill and Aeris are among our top five most productive skill players. Get them on the field.


I like the idea of playing both at the same time, sometimes in the backfield together, some in the slot, motion in and out of the backfield regardless if it?s a run or pass. Scouts are going to tell our staff that Hill is going to have to improve in pass pro if he wants to play in the NFL. The staff will relay that message to him this year, if it hasn?t been mentioned already.

My opinion is it?s a fvcking waste of talent to not have a running game and a short passing game with those 2 in the game simultaneously. It completely amazes me that coaches get paid so much to deliver so little when the talent is right there in front of them. Just no imagination or creativity especially in short yardage or goal line situations. I digress.


I think with the spread systems that are so prevalent nowadays a lot of coaches have forgotten that you can get a lot of production with two good running backs. I remember Auburn using Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams both in the same formation at times when they were running the WCO. Aeris blocks well enough to function as a de facto FB but he can run and catch like a tailback. That's a luxury. And on top of it Hill catches well enough he could function as a slot receiver and has the vision and physicality to be a great SEC RB. I think a lot of coaches get stuck into the two backs = one must be a traditional blocking back. And it doesn't have to be that way. See the 49ers with Tom Rathman.

[DancingRabbit]

Again, pass blocking aside, I don't see how anyone can watch the 2 without bias and say that Kylin is not clearly the more talented runner/receiver. If that's true, you have to admit you would be losing some of Aeris is playing more over him. At that point becomes a subjective debate on the value of Aeris's pass blocking vs Kylin's superior skill as a runner/receiver.

I pretty much agree. Kylin is clearly more talented, but not by some huge gap. It needs to be handled situationally. If both are healthy, both should play. For Alabama I'd probably start Aeris, just for his blocking.

Nothing wrong with playing 2 RBs, even if they are similar. Look at Georgia. Give both some touches and see who has the hot hand.

[thf24]

Kylin 10+ yard rushes 15, 20+ yard rushes 3 on 81 carries. Ares 11 and 2 on 48 carries. Aeris has higher percentage of explosive runs

Could be at least partially explained by Aeris playing more later in games when defenses are wearing down this year.

[Really Clark?]

Could be at least partially explained by Aeris playing more later in games when defenses are wearing down this year.

Aeris also started in conference games as well. You have weak opponents where they both had big runs...once you get around 50 or so rushes in 9 games it starts evening out. And I suspect if we really chart it out then they both are behind Nick in percentage

[tcdog70]

Could be at least partially explained by Aeris playing more later in games when defenses are wearing down this year.

come on , he had 1000 yards last year--I guess they came when the defense was tired. They both are quality backs. I'm glad when either one runs the ball. I would like to see Hill in the slot with the Train at RB.

[TUSK]

Aeris also started in conference games as well. You have weak opponents where they both had big runs...once you get around 50 or so rushes in 9 games it starts evening out. And I suspect if we really chart it out then they both are behind Nick in percentage

Yeppers....

SECRank, Name, Carries, Yards, YPC, TDs (Vs Conference)

13 Kylin Hill 44-223-5.07-0
20 Aeris Williams 31-148-4.77-0
23 Nick Fitzgerald 103-466-4.52-5

[thf24]

come on , he had 1000 yards last year--I guess they came when the defense was tired. They both are quality backs. I'm glad when either one runs the ball. I would like to see Hill in the slot with the Train at RB.

They're both great, no doubt. Just speculating as to why Kylin's average is lower despite obviously having more big play ability.

[RiverCityDawg]

They're both great, no doubt. Just speculating as to why Kylin's average is lower despite obviously having more big play ability.

Fair question. I think one reason is there has been so much pressure by everyone to force feed the running backs regardless of the look we're getting from the defense. As the starting running back and guy getting most of the looks, naturally Kylin is going to get more of those force fed or scripted carries. When Aeris gets carries, which isn't often, I think they are typically true run looks.

Actually I think both running backs have high YPCs over 6 because they generally only get the ball when it's a beneficial run look, which isn't often. Naturally, an "always run never pass" approach is going to lead to lower YPC because you don't care what the defense does, your running it anyway. The problem, as we all know, is we haven't been able to consistently take advantage of the pass looks we get most often.

[Turfdawg67]

It's interesting to me that some people railed on Mullen for playing seniority/experience over talent and citing pass blocking as a reason the more talented running back wasn't getting snaps, yet now we have a thread full of people wanting the less talented senior running back that is only better at pass blocking to be playing over the more talented guy. I'm sure it is a different group of people, so I'm not suggesting that minds have changed, just pointing out the difference in viewpoint.

Kylin is quicker, faster, stronger, a more talented runner, a more explosive receiver and apparently more accountable off the field. Aeris is tough as nails, a great pass blocker who is more experienced, but otherwise brings nothing as a runner that Kylin doesn't. Aeris will make a 0 yard gain 4 yards every time, but sometimes he'll also make a 12 yard gain only 4 yards.

I think the upside Kylin gives as a ball carrier and playmaker is worth the downgrade in pass blocking. Clearly many in this thread do not, and I respect that opinion though I disagree.

Just an interesting fan dynamic...

Aries is the complete back and Kylin is a liability on pass blocking.