Gene Chizik With A Reality Check

[TrapGame]

Paraphrasing: State expected a first year coach to come in and win 9 or 10 games in the SEC West. That's a tall order for a coach who doesn't know his team and what they can do.


I think Chiz summed it up well.

[DownwardDawg]

He summed it up well. And they all pointed out we are playing our best football right now.

[HoopsDawg]

He's not completely wrong but the offensive performances against UK, UF, and LSU are tough to deal with. If we had just beaten Mullen, I would feel a lot better about the season. It's going to be a while before we have a D like this again.

[deadheaddawg]

Yep

He's 100% right. It's pretty mind boggling how some fans can't see this.

This is the SEC.

[msstate7]

Yep

He's 100% right. It's pretty mind boggling how some fans can't see this.

This is the SEC West.

It is the west, but we have the 2nd best team in the west. No excuse to lose to Kentucky and Florida

[dawgday166]

It is the west, but we have the 2nd best team in the west. No excuse to lose to Kentucky and Florida

Yep.

[TrapGame]

It is the west, but we have the 2nd best team in the west. No excuse to lose to Kentucky and Florida

Nick missing spring practice was huge. We've been playing football for two months. Nick is just now getting this offense. With him in spring practice 100% good to go we are 8-1 right now.

[Commercecomet24]

I don't like chizik but what he said was accurate.

[RougeDawg]

I don't like chizik but what he said was accurate.

I didn?t like Cheesedick when he was at auburn because of Scam. But did he really have anything to do with buying Scam?

Cheesedick is a nice commentator and analyst.

ETA: we do know that Don did actively avoid the Scam payments. Don was given first dibs at that national champtionship and he went full Merlins deer in the headlights mode. We got a gator bowl and Cheesedick got a ring.

[cheewgumm]

Some fans don?t realize how talented our team is and how this was a once in a decade type opportunity.

He blew that when he didn?t have to.

When the NFL draft comes the next couple of years our fans will look back and understand how horrible that Kentucky, Florida and LSU losses were.

We will be way less talented next year. We built to this point. This was the year.

We blew this opportunity. We will be worse next year because of talent.

Some of our fans don?t get it but they?ll realize it at some point.

[DogsofAnarchy]

He's not completely wrong but the offensive performances against UK, UF, and LSU are tough to deal with. If we had just beaten Mullen, I would feel a lot better about the season. It's going to be a while before we have a D like this again.

Just get the fu$) over it. You’re a little to emotional about this. We are going to our 9th Bowl Game in a row and there have been a lot of times we dreamed of going to ONE!! So take of the pull-ups and join the grown ups....shit happens!!

[ckDOG]

Some fans don?t realize how talented our team is and how this was a once in a decade type opportunity.

He blew that when he didn?t have to.

When the NFL draft comes the next couple of years our fans will look back and understand how horrible that Kentucky, Florida and LSU losses were.

We will be way less talented next year. We built to this point. This was the year.

We blew this opportunity. We will be worse next year because of talent.

Some of our fans don?t get it but they?ll realize it at some point.

Be mad at Cohen then for not hiring a seasoned HC with a Mullen system to seamlessly integrate. We hired a coordinator and we got coordinator learning curve. Joe is getting into the swing of things about as well as a coordinator could in the SECW.

[RougeDawg]

Some fans don?t realize how talented our team is and how this was a once in a decade type opportunity.

He blew that when he didn?t have to.

When the NFL draft comes the next couple of years our fans will look back and understand how horrible that Kentucky, Florida and LSU losses were.

We will be way less talented next year. We built to this point. This was the year.

We blew this opportunity. We will be worse next year because of talent.

Some of our fans don?t get it but they?ll realize it at some point.

Most of our fans will never get it. They are stuck in the woe is me Mississippi State mentality. This is our most talented team ever and the only real team that could have knocked of Alabama this year. We f*cked it up.

[Bdawg]

Be mad at Cohen then for not hiring a seasoned HC with a Mullen system to seamlessly integrate. We hired a coordinator and we got coordinator learning curve. Joe is getting into the swing of things about as well as a coordinator could in the SECW.

Hiring a seasoned head coach still doesn't mean there wouldn't be growing pains with a completely new staff. You hire who you think is the best coach for your program for the short term and the long term. You don't hire a coach hoping to capitalize on one year and not thinking about your future.

[Homedawg]

I don't like chizik but what he said was accurate.


Fired coaches always are correct

[Homedawg]

Be mad at Cohen then for not hiring a seasoned HC with a Mullen system to seamlessly integrate. We hired a coordinator and we got coordinator learning curve. Joe is getting into the swing of things about as well as a coordinator could in the SECW.

He hired the guy he thought was the best of the candidates he had. Moorhead is the guy that lost 3 games.

[ckDOG]

Hiring a seasoned head coach still doesn't mean there wouldn't be growing pains with a completely new staff. You hire who you think is the best coach for your program for the short term and the long term. You don't hire a coach hoping to capitalize on one year and not thinking about your future.

To be clear. I'm not mad. I agree with everything you typed.

[ckDOG]

He hired the guy he thought was the best of the candidates he had. Moorhead is the guy that lost 3 games.

Yeah and it was a solid hire for us and the losses aren't out from left field. Folks have convinced themselves that we are a loaded team by repeating it enough. Fact is we are loaded on defense and have good running backs (including the QB). We don't have playmaker WRs which is a necessity for championship football in 2018. Offense crapped out during the transition. It's sucks but shouldn't be shocking to anyone with a grasp of reality. Change takes time. Both ways. Players learning systems and coaches learning players.

[99jc]

Some fans don?t realize how talented our team is and how this was a once in a decade type opportunity.

He blew that when he didn?t have to.

When the NFL draft comes the next couple of years our fans will look back and understand how horrible that Kentucky, Florida and LSU losses were.

We will be way less talented next year. We built to this point. This was the year.

We blew this opportunity. We will be worse next year because of talent.

Some of our fans don?t get it but they?ll realize it at some point.

No they won't they are to 17ing stupid.

[yjnkdawg]

I don't like Chizik either, but he makes sense on what he said. He said said expecting a new coach to come in and win 9 or 10 games his first season, especially in the SEC West, is basically unrealistic. He said you have a new staff, and the staff has to learn the players and vice versa. He also said that the coaches don't know how players will react in certain situations throughout the season until they have gone through it on the field. The main thing is that he said it would have been a lot easier for a coach to come into a rebuild year. Even though I don't care for him, I would value what he says concerning a football program, and a coaching situation over what a very few keyboard coaches say on a football message board.

[I_Spy]

Most coaches don’t walk into the doors of inheriting a top D and O of the SEC tho. Most are hired to rebuild so you can’t expect them to win 8 or 9.

[I_Spy]

If you hire coaches to go to last, that’s absurd and no wonder chiz got fired. Donal trump would let him go immediately.

[I_Spy]

That’s like, hey I have a top business, but hey we can bottom out in profits next year because you New.

[deadheaddawg]

What coach, other than saban, doesn't have terrible games

Everyone says Mullen would be 9-0. Mullen got trucked at home today by Missouri. And Mullen lost to Kentucky.

Kentucky who lost to Georgia today, even though that same Georgia team got whipped by LSU, who lost to Mullen.

People seems to think its clear that the team with the most talent should always win. I fully expect Florida, Georgia, Kentucky, and LSU to all fire their coaches for losing those games.

Moorhead is in his first year as a coach. In the sec.

It sucks we had to change coaches the year we had all this talent. But we can't do anything about it.

But so many people here are just complete idiots. It's a tough game, a tough league, and moorheads first year. We don't know yet if he will be awful or great. Anyone that claims they do......well bless their hearts.

[I_Spy]

My thing is we brought in someone unfamiliar and we looked unprepared for the SEC. that’s my only problem, in that sense I guess you can expect the losses.

[yjnkdawg]

No they won't they are to 17ing stupid.



MSU fans are stupid because they don't agree with what you and a very few other keyboard coaches say on this message board. LOL........ I want the best for our athletic programs, and to achieve the highest our programs can be, but some on this board think they know and have all the answers which is pretty pathetic in itself.

[maroonmania]

Most coaches don?t walk into the doors of inheriting a top D and O of the SEC tho. Most are hired to rebuild so you can?t expect them to win 8 or 9.

Yep, our situation is VERY difficult to compare to any other coaching changes recently in the SEC. Seriously, when is the last time an SEC coach left the job with THIS kind of talent on hand. Mullen screwed us by not staying one more year but Mullen had been determined to leave for 2 or 3 years so he wasn't going to stay even for a team that had a legitimate chance to challenge Bama for the West. None of the other new coaches recently coming into the SEC West have had anything like this kind of situation.

[Dawg61]

Is this the still crying cause our offense was trash in 3 games thread #3,672 or did I miss a couple in the count?

[I_Spy]

I’m not mad Dan left, we still had the team, we kept the recruits. But maybe someone familiar would have foreseen that our offense was moving too slow for the SEC defenses and whatever else was going on. Fitz didn’t just now learn to complete a pass. LSU Florida were winnable and we slept through tucky. We prob get slaughtered by Bama and it will be our players primarily that keep us bowl worthy. That’s how good we were. Used to be, better than 8 wins or 7. That’s how good our players are.

[yjnkdawg]

I’m not mad Dan left, we still had the team, we kept the recruits. But maybe someone familiar would have foreseen that our offense was moving too slow for the SEC defenses and whatever else was going on. Fitz didn’t just now learn to complete a pass. LSU Florida were winnable and we slept through tucky. We prob get slaughtered by Bama and it will be our players primarily that keep us bowl worthy. That’s how good we were. Used to be, better than 8 wins or 7. That’s how good our players are.



Fitz is not having to think (or over think) as much now on the field, and feels more comfortable in this offense now, and the wide receivers and the OL have stepped up too.

[dawgday166]

Most of our fans will never get it. They are stuck in the woe is me Mississippi State mentality. This is our most talented team ever and the only real team that could have knocked of Alabama this year. We f*cked it up.

You know ... I been thinking about this some and folks may blast me for what I'm fixin to say but ... we would've f***ed it up with Dan too. That's just what we do in football. The moment is always too big for us when it rolls around.

Having said that ... right now it wouldn't shock me to upset Bama next week but ... this is Moorhead's first go at Saban and in TTown too. Probably won't be pretty cause of that more than anything else. And one more thing ... Aeris is DEFINITELY the back that should play in this game. It's a between the tackles and blocking big, fast LBs game. But I think Hill starts, which is a mistake IMO.

[mstatefan91]

The Florida loss will always be the biggest WTF moment of 2018 to me. All we had to do was run the ball and we beat them.. hell, we didn't and a dropped TD pass is why we lost.. that's how bad Florida and State were offensively that night.

[Tbonewannabe]

You know ... I been thinking about this some and folks may blast me for what I'm fixin to say but ... we would've f***ed it up with Dan too. That's just what we do in football. The moment is always too big for us when it rolls around.

Having said that ... right now it wouldn't shock me to upset Bama next week but ... this is Moorhead's first go at Saban and in TTown too. Probably won't be pretty cause of that more than anything else. And one more thing ... Aeris is DEFINITELY the back that should play in this game. It's a between the tackles and blocking big, fast LBs game. But I think Hill starts, which is a mistake IMO.

Aeris apparently is having some issues. If we stay within 3 TDs we will probably move up in the polls. This Bama offense is on another planet compared to previous offenses. There is probably about 4 teams that would have a chance in Tuscaloosa. Hopefully we are one of them next week.

[mstatefan91]

Aeris apparently is having some issues. If we stay within 3 TDs we will probably move up in the polls. This Bama offense is on another planet compared to previous offenses. There is probably about 4 teams that would have a chance in Tuscaloosa. Hopefully we are one of them next week.

It is strange that Aeris is the 3rd back when Kylin is healthy but the 1 back when Kylin isn't available... just weird weird weird to me

[Tbonewannabe]

It is strange that Aeris is the 3rd back when Kylin is healthy but the 1 back when Kylin isn't available... just weird weird weird to me

Supposedly an accountability issue. I wonder if Aeris missed a class or team meeting.

[mstatefan91]

Supposedly an accountability issue. I wonder if Aeris missed a class or team meeting.

That's mind boggling. He had zero issues before this year and should be equally sharing playing time with Kylin.

[Todd4State]

That's mind boggling. He had zero issues before this year and should be equally sharing playing time with Kylin.

That we're aware of. I'm pretty sure Dan played favorites and certain players got more leeway than others. Especially once they became upperclassmen.

[mstatefan91]

That we're aware of. I'm pretty sure Dan played favorites and certain players got more leeway than others. Especially once they became upperclassmen.

I've never heard anything negative about aeris before this year.. That could be the Dan program but more likely is that he never did anything to get in trouble.

[Todd4State]

You know ... I been thinking about this some and folks may blast me for what I'm fixin to say but ... we would've f***ed it up with Dan too. That's just what we do in football. The moment is always too big for us when it rolls around.

Having said that ... right now it wo
uldn't shock me to upset Bama next week but ... this is Moorhead's first go at Saban and in TTown too. Probably won't be pretty cause of that more than anything else. And one more thing ... Aeris is DEFINITELY the back that should play in this game. It's a between the tackles and blocking big, fast LBs game. But I think Hill starts, which is a mistake IMO.

The Dan Mullen worshipers have forgotten about Dan's history in big games- it shows that we would be about where we are now. With job shopping season just around the corner.

We have a National Championship caliber defense- but our offense is not. And we are having the same struggles that we had last year except that we appear to be improving in the pass game. Fitzgerald has been a disappointment to me early in the year- but he has been getting better too.

We're good on defense because we recruit well there. For us to take the next step we must recruit better on offense.

But it's funny to me to see Joe getting bashed for having essentially a Dan Mullen season.

[Todd4State]

I've never heard anything negative about aeris before this year.. That could be the Dan program but more likely is that he never did anything to get in trouble.

Well, if a player is missing half a game it's probably not anything major. I'm thinking late for a meeting of practice probably.

[mstatefan91]

Well, if a player is missing half a game it's probably not anything major. I'm thinking late for a meeting of practice probably.

Which makes me wonder what changed in the player.. he never missed any playing time before this year.. See what I mean? Was Dan really willing to turn a blind eye to "his guys", is Joe just that strict, or has something changed with Aeris?? I know none of us know 100%.. just interesting.

[I_Spy]

Dan would be undefeated until the next game. We were undefeated with Russell and Dak going into Bama game. With Russell it seemed we lost Bama and then some after we should have won but even Dan would beat OM and Ark.

[mstatefan91]

Dan would be undefeated until the next game. We were undefeated with Russell and Dak going into Bama game. With Russell it seemed we lost Bama and then some after we should have won but even Dan would beat OM and Ark.

I think he would have lost to LSU.. but that's it

[I_Spy]

This year! OM and Ark this year

[I_Spy]

No Dan would have had Nick score probably.

[I_Spy]

Dan started to have LSU’s number

Dan probably beat Kentucky with this offense as it was. LSU and Florida obviously lol

Aeris or Kylin probably closer to 1000 yards

Say what you want but in reality, dans usual gameplan we all know by now probably would have beaten Tucky, might and only might have lost to LSU at worse, would have beaten Florida so legitimately with Dan we would be 1 loss or none going into next week but Dan would probably lose that one. Dan would beat ark and OM tho. They have no D and Dan was or state was matching arks 50 pt scoring games and winning and OM is awful.

[I_Spy]

We lost to Mullen and I know we got the better team. Or Franks shows me nothing compared to Nick...so we are the fools.

[Cooterpoot]

We?re playing our best because the schedule got easier. Next week will look like the first few SEC weeks. Hoping Jo finishes the season better than Mullen would.

[msstate7]

We?re playing our best because the schedule got easier. Next week will look like the first few SEC weeks. Hoping Jo finishes the season better than Mullen would.

We'll finish 2-1... 3 blow outs

[Dawgfan77]

We?re playing our best because the schedule got easier. Next week will look like the first few SEC weeks. Hoping Jo finishes the season better than Mullen would.
I agree with this. But I heard Moorehead say after the game last week he was going to stop protecting Fitz and start being more aggressive in play calling. Now I thought that was coach speak until i noticed something after re watching the A&M game. That was that Joe took out the safety reads. I watched it last night and we were doing the same thing. In other words we call the play and that?s what we go with(in a way), meaning the OL have to think less they know how to block the called played. The WR know the routes to run, and the QB knew where to go with the ball. Less thinking has led to better decisions by Fitz the WR feel more confident and the OL look a lot better.
We slept walked the second half last night and still won by 42

[msstate7]

Found this interesting... we are the only Kentucky sec opponent to throw more than run vs them. They beat us worse than any other sec team. Vandy, South Carolina, Missouri, aTm, and Georgia are their sec opponents.

[BrunswickDawg]

Which makes me wonder what changed in the player.. he never missed any playing time before this year.. See what I mean? Was Dan really willing to turn a blind eye to "his guys", is Joe just that strict, or has something changed with Aeris?? I know none of us know 100%.. just interesting.
Fitz never missed any time either until SFA - but half the board has dogged him for years as being a **** up. People need to go read Baker Swedenberg's thread on SPS about Dan. He says flat out that Dan played favorites, put guys in the dog house for no apparent reason, was selective in his discipline, and played head games with people. If you haven't figured it out by now - Joe doesn't seem to have a problem with fairly making kids accountable - he's benched a team captain and a 1,000 yard RB twice.

[Dawg2003]

Most of our fans will never get it. They are stuck in the woe is me Mississippi State mentality. This is our most talented team ever and the only real team that could have knocked of Alabama this year. We f*cked it up.

It doesn't have anything to do with a woe is me attitude. It has to do with the reality of what happens when you have coaches and players that didn't even know each other a year ago and now have to learn a new offense. And with a coach who has never been a head coach. And playing in the hardest conference. And we don't have wide recievers or a QB that can throw it consistently. That's the reality of it.

[Dawg2003]

Dan started to have LSU’s number

Dan probably beat Kentucky with this offense as it was. LSU and Florida obviously lol

Aeris or Kylin probably closer to 1000 yards

Say what you want but in reality, dans usual gameplan we all know by now probably would have beaten Tucky, might and only might have lost to LSU at worse, would have beaten Florida so legitimately with Dan we would be 1 loss or none going into next week but Dan would probably lose that one. Dan would beat ark and OM tho. They have no D and Dan was or state was matching arks 50 pt scoring games and winning and OM is awful.

But what does that have to do with anything right now?

[RiverCityDawg]

Dan started to have LSU’s number

Dan probably beat Kentucky with this offense as it was. LSU and Florida obviously lol

Aeris or Kylin probably closer to 1000 yards

Say what you want but in reality, dans usual gameplan we all know by now probably would have beaten Tucky, might and only might have lost to LSU at worse, would have beaten Florida so legitimately with Dan we would be 1 loss or none going into next week but Dan would probably lose that one. Dan would beat ark and OM tho. They have no D and Dan was or state was matching arks 50 pt scoring games and winning and OM is awful.

You know Dan wanted to leave and left on his own, right? Him staying wasn't an option for us, so just save your pointless rambling for your diary. What Dan might do is irrelevant. What would Saban do with our roster? Doesn't matter because that wasn't an option for us. What don't you and the other "But Dan would have..." guys get about this?

[basedog]

The Dan Mullen worshipers have forgotten about Dan's history in big games- it shows that we would be about where we are now. With job shopping season just around the corner.

We have a National Championship caliber defense- but our offense is not. And we are having the same struggles that we had last year except that we appear to be improving in the pass game. Fitzgerald has been a disappointment to me early in the year- but he has been getting better too.

We're good on defense because we recruit well there. For us to take the next step we must recruit better on offense.

But it's funny to me to see Joe getting bashed for having essentially a Dan Mullen season.

+1

[MetEdDawg]

Found this interesting... we are the only Kentucky sec opponent to throw more than run vs them. They beat us worse than any other sec team. Vandy, South Carolina, Missouri, aTm, and Georgia are their sec opponents.

Weren't we the first SEC team to play them? And that was our first SEC game. Moorhead had not made any adjustments yet because we hadn't played anyone of consequence yet that showed us we needed to change. If we switch where Bama and Kentucky fall on the schedule we would beat Kentucky.

[basedog]

Fitz never missed any time either until SFA - but half the board has dogged him for years as being a **** up. People need to go read Baker Swedenberg's thread on SPS about Dan. He says flat out that Dan played favorites, put guys in the dog house for no apparent reason, was selective in his discipline, and played head games with people. If you haven't figured it out by now - Joe doesn't seem to have a problem with fairly making kids accountable - he's benched a team captain and a 1,000 yard RB twice.

Big +1

[Cooterpoot]

Fitz never missed any time either until SFA - but half the board has dogged him for years as being a **** up. People need to go read Baker Swedenberg's thread on SPS about Dan. He says flat out that Dan played favorites, put guys in the dog house for no apparent reason, was selective in his discipline, and played head games with people. If you haven't figured it out by now - Joe doesn't seem to have a problem with fairly making kids accountable - he's benched a team captain and a 1,000 yard RB twice.

Baker didn’t speak for everyone. He’s one guy that didn’t like Mullen. Be careful taking one guy’s opinion as the whole truth.

[BrunswickDawg]

Baker didn’t speak for everyone. He’s one guy that didn’t like Mullen. Be careful taking one guy’s opinion as the whole truth.

I get that - but you also can't discount completely it either.

[dawgday166]

I agree with this. But I heard Moorehead say after the game last week he was going to stop protecting Fitz and start being more aggressive in play calling. Now I thought that was coach speak until i noticed something after re watching the A&M game. That was that Joe took out the safety reads. I watched it last night and we were doing the same thing. In other words we call the play and that?s what we go with(in a way), meaning the OL have to think less they know how to block the called played. The WR know the routes to run, and the QB knew where to go with the ball. Less thinking has led to better decisions by Fitz the WR feel more confident and the OL look a lot better.
We slept walked the second half last night and still won by 42

I noticed that too. The RPOs were messing everyone up. Didn't want to debate on here cause everyone said "That's what Joe's offense is supposed to look like".

PSU not doing as well either since a lot of NFL talent has left. McSorley's completion percentage is hovering right around where Nick's has been the last 2 years.

[dawgday166]

The Dan Mullen worshipers have forgotten about Dan's history in big games- it shows that we would be about where we are now. With job shopping season just around the corner.

We have a National Championship caliber defense- but our offense is not. And we are having the same struggles that we had last year except that we appear to be improving in the pass game. Fitzgerald has been a disappointment to me early in the year- but he has been getting better too.

We're good on defense because we recruit well there. For us to take the next step we must recruit better on offense.

But it's funny to me to see Joe getting bashed for having essentially a Dan Mullen season.

I think there is a strong likelihood we'd be 8-1 right now with Dan. But he'd would've probably given Bama a good game but screwed up at the end of that game. And even if he wins that one, screw up one of the last 2. That's MSU football really ... I wasn't talking Dan vs Joe or anything.

Also, the people who hate Mullen, can't give him any credit for how good he can be. And he can be pretty good.

With our D, we are close to a National Championship team IMO this year, cause there aren't any elite teams. But next week Bama DBs will be pass interfering with Guidry and Mitchell every down ... and they will have to fight thru that. If we run a lot of counters/sweeps at them, I think we can run the ball. I think we can run a lot of hitches against them. But on downfield routes, our WRs will get mugged every time. This O is really better than people think it is, especially when Aeris is in there.

However, the game is also in TTown and I'm still not sure if the O has completely got their confidence all the way back yet. Joe kinda screwed the O up this year, although it does appear to be bouncing back .. but it's hard to say for sure their confidence is back enough to go play Bama in TTown.

We'll see how Joe game plans it ... but I'm not extremely confident him having a good plan for this game next week.

[KentuckyDawg13]

It really amazes me that so many just assumed State would be UF. Mullen knows EVERYONE of our players strengths/weaknesses. The UK game was a fluke and a gift via the refs. The LSU game, come on! How many times have we beaten LSU @ BR when we didn't have a once-in-a-lifetime QB (Dak).

[basedog]

Funny how some of ED posters keep bitching about the Fl game and how Joe f*cked that game up, well if #87 catches the long pass we win. Fitz was awful in our losses, as he goes so does Msu, it was that way last year as well.

I don't get the bitching about Williams not playing in the first half, obviously he broke a rule, I'm for discipline.

[gravedigger]

Paraphrasing: State expected a first year coach to come in and win 9 or 10 games in the SEC West. That's a tall order for a coach who doesn't know his team and what they can do.


I think Chiz summed it up well.

I think EXPECTED is a misleading way to put it.

Some morons were,and still are, melting like a child whose pacifier fell out. They will be back with their conniptions in the bama game because, you know, the addiction to the attention and such.

[Todd4State]

I think there is a strong likelihood we'd be 8-1 right now with Dan. But he'd would've probably given Bama a good game but screwed up at the end of that game. And even if he wins that one, screw up one of the last 2. That's MSU football really ... I wasn't talking Dan vs Joe or anything.

Also, the people who hate Mullen, can't give him any credit for how good he can be. And he can be pretty good.

With our D, we are close to a National Championship team IMO this year, cause there aren't any elite teams. But next week Bama DBs will be pass interfering with Guidry and Mitchell every down ... and they will have to fight thru that. If we run a lot of counters/sweeps at them, I think we can run the ball. I think we can run a lot of hitches against them. But on downfield routes, our WRs will get mugged every time. This O is really better than people think it is, especially when Aeris is in there.

However, the game is also in TTown and I'm still not sure if the O has completely got their confidence all the way back yet. Joe kinda screwed the O up this year, although it does appear to be bouncing back .. but it's hard to say for sure their confidence is back enough to go play Bama in TTown.

We'll see how Joe game plans it ... but I'm not extremely confident him having a good plan for this game next week.

I still don't understand how people assume that Dan would have beaten those teams. Kentucky beat Dan this year in Gainesville and Dan lost to them in Lexington two years ago. Plus Kentucky made us their Super Bowl.

Florida would have been dependent on who they would have hired as a coach.

LSU is a top ten team on the road and much better than last year. Has Dan ever beaten a top 10 team on the road ever?

And as far as going forward we know what Dan would do against Bama and then he would go job shopping Egg Bowl week and screw that up too.

So even if Dan beats Florida it's likely we end up right back at 8-4 which is what we are on pace to do.

[Todd4State]

I think EXPECTED is a misleading way to put it.

Some morons were,and still are, melting like a child whose pacifier fell out. They will be back with their conniptions in the bama game because, you know, the addiction to the attention and such.

Yep. And then they'll be over it after Arkansas.

[dawgday166]

I still don't understand how people assume that Dan would have beaten those teams. Kentucky beat Dan this year in Gainesville and Dan lost to them in Lexington two years ago. Plus Kentucky made us their Super Bowl.

Florida would have been dependent on who they would have hired as a coach.

LSU is a top ten team on the road and much better than last year. Has Dan ever beaten a top 10 team on the road ever?

And as far as going forward we know what Dan would do against Bama and then he would go job shopping Egg Bowl week and screw that up too.

So even if Dan beats Florida it's likely we end up right back at 8-4 which is what we are on pace to do.

I think Dan loses to KY cause he overlooks them. He beats FL and LSU tho. He owns Ogre. Owwwwnnnnnss him. And our offensive personnel are just better than FL has this year ... they are. They may not have shown it but ... they are. This year's Bama game probably would be close to last year's maybe ... depends on how fairly game is called tho. The real difference tho I believe is Shoop over Grantham. I believe I like Shoop better than Grantham. He mixes it up better and calls a better game I think. With Grantham you almost always know when he's bringing it.

But if you insist on believing Mullen sucks all the way around ... then go right ahead. It's still early but I believe we may have a coach similar to Mullen in a lot of ways and can get/keep us at that level. Can he take us beyond that ... not sure yet. The only real difference will depend on keeping his defensive staff intact, and they've learned some things this year, and recruiting. Moorhead also will take more shots down the field too. Moorhead is not a run between the tackles a good bit type of coach.

[Todd4State]

I think Dan loses to KY cause he overlooks them. He beats FL and LSU tho. He owns Ogre. Owwwwnnnnnss him. And our offensive personnel are just better than FL has this year ... they are. They may not have shown it but ... they are. This year's Bama game probably would be close to last year's maybe ... depends on how fairly game is called tho. The real difference tho I believe is Shoop over Grantham. I believe I like Shoop better than Grantham. He mixes it up better and calls a better game I think. With Grantham you almost always know when he's bringing it.

But if you insist on believing Mullen sucks all the way around ... then go right ahead. It's still early but I believe we may have a coach similar to Mullen in a lot of ways and can get/keep us at that level. Can he take us beyond that ... not sure yet. The only real difference will depend on keeping his defensive staff intact, and they've learned some things this year, and recruiting. Moorhead also will take more shots down the field too. Moorhead is not a run between the tackles a good bit type of coach.

I'm not saying that he sucks as a coach but I don't believe he would go 11-1 or 10-2 with this team either.

And a coach that is not paying attention to our job so that he can take a job with a cooler name on the jersey while costing us three Egg Bowls and at least one Sugar Bowl if not two should be held accountable for that by our fans and we let him do it at least twice.

[dawgday166]

I'm not saying that he sucks as a coach but I don't believe he would go 11-1 or 10-2 with this team either.

And a coach that is not paying attention to our job so that he can take a job with a cooler name on the jersey while costing us three Egg Bowls and at least one Sugar Bowl if not two should be held accountable for that by our fans and we let him do it at least twice.

Probably 9-3 while he loses one job hunting after Bama game. Although ... he might could win those 2 by default this year.

[TrapGame]

There's a lot of Dan this and Dan that but in reality we are a healthy QB from being probably 8-1. No injury, no rehab, no mental effect on performance and a full spring in the new system means this offense would have been clicking a lot sooner, Joe making the necessary changes sooner and Nick developing chemistry with his receivers sooner.

[cheewgumm]

This thread is a great study in psychology. To rationalize with things they don?t like ( losing to Kentucky) people rationalize it away ( we wouldn?t have beat them anyway).

History being rewritten before our eyes.

How bad did we beat Kentucky last year? I forget.

[BrunswickDawg]

This thread is a great study in psychology. To rationalize with things they don?t like ( losing to Kentucky) people rationalize it away ( we wouldn?t have beat them anyway).

History being rewritten before our eyes.

How bad did we beat Kentucky last year? I forget.

Yes, people rationalize the losses. But, when you add anything about "last year", your argument isn't any better. Last year has zero bearing on this year.

[cheewgumm]

Yes, people rationalize the losses. But, when you add anything about "last year", your argument isn't any better. Last year has zero bearing on this year.

That doesn?t make any sense to me. Literally every view of what will happen in any endeavor is based on history. But in this one instance it?s meaningless. That?s silly.

[Commercecomet24]

Yes, people rationalize the losses. But, when you add anything about "last year", your argument isn't any better. Last year has zero bearing on this year.

Exactly! One year has no bearing in the next year in any sport especially college football. By the "last year" argument auburn beat us by 39 last year and we whipped them this year so what does that mean? It means we were better than them this year.

[Dawgfan77]

We would be anywhere from 9-0 to 7-2 if joe would have gotten his head out his ass and called the games they way he has the last two weeks. I have said it repeatedly that RPO read the safety?s BS it?s gonna work. He went to just calling the play and look what happened. We looked a lot better. And yeah I know it?s A & M and La Tech but We looked like a different team
But it is what it is our record is 6-3. We get to 9 wins with the bowl win and it?s a good year

[BrunswickDawg]

That doesn?t make any sense to me. Literally every view of what will happen in any endeavor is based on history. But in this one instance it?s meaningless. That?s silly.


Exactly! One year has no bearing in the next year in any sport especially college football. By the "last year" argument auburn beat us by 39 last year and we whipped them this year so what does that mean? It means we were better than them this year.

Commerce answered for me. Each team is different year to year. History can be an indicator of potential - but not a predictor or some sort of guarantee. That's why you play the games.

[Cooterpoot]

Yes, people rationalize the losses. But, when you add anything about "last year", your argument isn't any better. Last year has zero bearing on this year.

Disagree. When you return 17 starters, and teams like AU lost a lot, you see it. If we hadn?t returned so much talent from- you got it- last year, we would be happy with where we are. Last year matters from an experience and improvement point of view.

[DancingRabbit]

That doesn?t make any sense to me. Literally every view of what will happen in any endeavor is based on history. But in this one instance it?s meaningless. That?s silly.

The last time we played at Kentucky, we lost. When we debate, we tend to focus on the parts of history that support our argument.

In retrospect, our very optimistic outlook for the season assumed a seamless coaching transition. But we've had some "learning on the job" bumps in the road. Doesn't mean Joe was the wrong hire.
Maybe we're over the worst of the new coach transition process but there will probably be a few more lessons to learn this year and next.

[cheewgumm]

I?d be happy with where we are if it were next year.

The error here is taking our ?once in a decade at least? talent and losing to lesser teams like Kentucky and Florida and yes, LSU.

People say ?well we got a new coach, growing pains, etc?, they act like we are at the start of a rebuilding process talent wise. We?re not. We?re at the end of that journey.

It starts over next year. So if this were next year, I?m good. But it?s not, so it?s a total miss this year, imo.

[BrunswickDawg]

I?d be happy with where we are if it were next year.

The error here is taking our ?once in a decade at least? talent and losing to lesser teams like Kentucky and Florida and yes, LSU.

People say ?well we got a new coach, growing pains, etc?, they act like we are at the start of a rebuilding process talent wise. We?re not. We?re at the end of that journey.

It starts over next year. So if this were next year, I?m good. But it?s not, so it?s a total miss this year, imo.
If we returned 17 starters from an 8-4 team, how is it a "once in a decade" team of talent? How can you call it "once in a decade" when we had teams in 2010, 2012, 2014, & 2015 that have all shown they had a considerable amount of NFL talent on the field and had just as good or better records?

And don't get me wrong - this is a very talented team, especially on defense. It is also a team with personnel flaws that people bitched about constantly over the past 3 years. Those flaws limited us last year in the same ways they have limited us this year. Just because we returned a lot of players was no guarantee of performance growth. The SEC is the toughest conference in college football. Outside of Bama, Vandy, and Ole Miss - the outcome of games from week to week is a crapshoot.

[DancingRabbit]

I?d be happy with where we are if it were next year.

The error here is taking our ?once in a decade at least? talent and losing to lesser teams like Kentucky and Florida and yes, LSU.

People say ?well we got a new coach, growing pains, etc?, they act like we are at the start of a rebuilding process talent wise. We?re not. We?re at the end of that journey.

It starts over next year. So if this were next year, I?m good. But it?s not, so it?s a total miss this year, imo.

I hear ya.

I think many of us (me included), mistakenly thought Joe would keep a lot of Dan's offense because of personnel - if it ain't broke, don't fix it - just tweak the passing game in a positive way. In reality that probably almost never happens, except when an assistant takes over. So, you have a new offense to install - and we're still working on some aspects of that.

Most of the other 1st year coaches have hit some bumps in the road too. Only exception that comes to mind is Josh Heupel at UCF.

[Percho]

Screw Dan. If Joe could play Ky, Fl and Lsu beginning this coming weekend;How would he do? Joe, not Dan, is our future coach.

[BrunswickDawg]

Screw Dan. If Joe could play Ky, Fl and Lsu beginning this coming weekend;How would he do? Joe, not Dan, is our future coach.

We might beat them. But play Auburn or A&M again and we might lose.

[deadheaddawg]

This thread is a great study in psychology. To rationalize with things they don?t like ( losing to Kentucky) people rationalize it away ( we wouldn?t have beat them anyway).

History being rewritten before our eyes.

How bad did we beat Kentucky last year? I forget.


Well you are not very smart.

[deadheaddawg]

I?d be happy with where we are if it were next year.

The error here is taking our ?once in a decade at least? talent and losing to lesser teams like Kentucky and Florida and yes, LSU.

People say ?well we got a new coach, growing pains, etc?, they act like we are at the start of a rebuilding process talent wise. We?re not. We?re at the end of that journey.

It starts over next year. So if this were next year, I?m good. But it?s not, so it?s a total miss this year, imo.

We should have kept Mullen instead of sending him to Florida.

Will us. This should have been easy

[BB30]

That doesn?t make any sense to me. Literally every view of what will happen in any endeavor is based on history. But in this one instance it?s meaningless. That?s silly.

I assure you history isn?t on your side of the argument when it comes to state football and winning/losing.

It is called reality. The reality is we screwed up and lost two games we probably shouldn?t have early in the season breaking a new coach and scheme in. It happens, does it suck it happened this year with all the talent we have on defense, yes. But how about getting over it and not dwelling on it/ bringing it up after every week.

We get it.. no amount of bitching or bringing it back up will change the outcome.

Also, yes, we have a ton of NFL talent on the defensive side of the ball but our O is average as far as talent goes. It?s not like Moorhead wasted the same type of talent that we have on defense.

We will finish 8-4 instead of 9-3/10-2. 10-2 would have still been a coin flip with Mullen here. We just need to keep winning and continue to build on the solid foundation Mullen laid. If we do that we will have another shot at a great season in the next 2-3 years. Realistically as of now having a shot at 10+ wins every 2-4 years would be awesome and a big step above our past history.

[Todd4State]

This thread is a great study in psychology. To rationalize with things they don?t like ( losing to Kentucky) people rationalize it away ( we wouldn?t have beat them anyway).

History being rewritten before our eyes.

How bad did we beat Kentucky last year? I forget.

What's irrational is not understanding that some teams can improve or get worse over the course of an offseason and expecting the same result the next season because of what happened the season before.

If Kentucky was going to go 7-6 this year- I would probably agree. However they are in the top 12 of the BCS poll team coming into this week and will exceed their win total from last year easily.

[msstate7]

What's irrational is not understanding that some teams can improve or get worse over the course of an offseason and expecting the same result the next season because of what happened the season before.

If Kentucky was going to go 7-6 this year- I would probably agree. However they are in the top 12 of the BCS poll team coming into this week and will exceed their win total from last year easily.

They're a 3.5 point favorite vs tenn this week. They aren't good

[Todd4State]

I hear ya.

I think many of us (me included), mistakenly thought Joe would keep a lot of Dan's offense because of personnel - if it ain't broke, don't fix it - just tweak the passing game in a positive way. In reality that probably almost never happens, except when an assistant takes over. So, you have a new offense to install - and we're still working on some aspects of that.

Most of the other 1st year coaches have hit some bumps in the road too. Only exception that comes to mind is Josh Heupel at UCF.

I didn't expect Joe to run any of Dan's offense at all. Why would a coach run a system that he is unfamiliar with and not run the one he ultimately wants to run and is comfortable with? My biggest disappointment is I thought Nick would have picked it up more quickly than he has. Yes, there does have to be some "fit" with the players but at the same time the players have a responsibility to learn and execute the system somewhat effectively as well. I'm glad that he is finally picking it up- don't get me wrong- but I think the reality is had he been able to pick it up sooner we probably have at least one more win right now.

It is what it is in the short term- but long term I think we will be happy with the overall results in years to come.

[Todd4State]

They're a 3.5 point favorite vs tenn this week. They aren't good

You're using betting lines as opposed to actual on the field results to determine who is and isn't good?


What's next? You're going to use Athlon pre-season predictions to tell who is and who isn't good?

[msstate7]

You're using betting lines as opposed to actual on the field results to determine who is and isn't good?


What's next? You're going to use Athlon pre-season predictions to tell who is and who isn't good?

Kentucky is garbage. Losing to them is unacceptable. Moorhead has since turned in a few nice performances that give me hope for the future, but make no mistake, Kentucky is garbage... so is Florida

[Todd4State]

Kentucky is garbage. Losing to them is unacceptable. Moorhead has since turned in a few nice performances that give me hope for the future, but make no mistake, Kentucky is garbage... so is Florida

Keep telling yourself that to make yourself feel better or worse. But it's still wrong. And it makes you look completely ignorant when Kentucky wins week after week.

[cheewgumm]

I hope Moorhead works and I?m glad Mullen is gone. Honestly.

However, Kentucky seems good because they beat us. Otherwise they?d have 3 losses. Same with Florida.

We shouldn?t have lost those. No amount of rationalization will make it true, and we blew the best opportunity we?ve had or will have on a while to win 10-11 games.

Regardless the point that we need to move on is a good one, and I?m on board. However, don?t try to convince me that we would have lost those anyway as it?s jut not true. We almost beat both of them with absolute garbage on offense.

And because our offense works great against La Laffeyetee and La Texh doesn?t mean anyting to me. Need to see it work against decent teams consistently.

Hopefully we can have an offense that doesn?t really include running backs work in the SEC. not sure I?ve seen it yet but we?ll see.

[cheewgumm]

Msstate7 you are right. Everyone wants Kentucky to be good ( because they pounded us), but they aren?t.

[Todd4State]

I hope Moorhead works and I?m glad Mullen is gone. Honestly.

However, Kentucky seems good because they beat us. Otherwise they?d have 3 losses. Same with Florida.

We shouldn?t have lost those. No amount of rationalization will make it true, and we blew the best opportunity we?ve had or will have on a while to win 10-11 games.

Regardless the point that we need to move on is a good one, and I?m on board. However, don?t try to convince me that we would have lost those anyway as it?s jut not true. We almost beat both of them with absolute garbage on offense.

And because our offense works great against La Laffeyetee and La Texh doesn?t mean anyting to me. Need to see it work against decent teams consistently.

Hopefully we can have an offense that doesn?t really include running backs work in the SEC. not sure I?ve seen it yet but we?ll see.

Kentucky and Florida seem good because they are. Are you saying that the BCS poll is wrong too?


I'd say our offense worked OK against A&M and Auburn.


Basically your defense is "Kentucky and Florida are bad because I said so."


I don't think we will have to wait too long to win 10-11 games. We're still recruiting well on the defensive side of the ball. If Joe can recruit well on the offensive side we will be fine.

[msstate7]

Msstate7 you are right. Everyone wants Kentucky to be good ( because they pounded us), but they aren?t.

We scored 7 points vs Kentucky, which is same as vandy did. South Carolina scored more than us and allowed less. We played an east school that's barely better than South Carolina and vandy and we lost. Unbelievable for a team as talented as us

[cheewgumm]

We didn?t run this offense against Auburn.

Kylin Hill has 17 carries that game. That?s his 3 game average typically.

[cheewgumm]

Brunswick - we may have 2 top 15 picks and both are on the DL. That has NEVER happened at State... ever.

I should have said once in a lifetime, not once in a decade.

[Todd4State]

We scored 7 points vs Kentucky, which is same as vandy did. South Carolina scored more than us and allowed less. We played an east school that's barely better than South Carolina and vandy and we lost. Unbelievable for a team as talented as us

It's the transient scores game! Yay!

Transient scores have been shown to have zero bearing on who is good and who isn't.

It's better than using a betting line to determine who is good and who isn't so that's progress I guess.

[msstate7]

It's the transient scores game! Yay!

Transient scores have been shown to have zero bearing on who is good and who isn't.

It's better than using a betting line to determine who is good and who isn't so that's progress I guess.

I don't even care anymore... you win, Kentucky is one BA football team that if not for Moorhead we'd have really got pounded.

[Todd4State]

I don't even care anymore... you win, Kentucky is one BA football team that if not for Moorhead we'd have really got pounded.

Actually had Dan paid attention to recruiting on the offensive side of the ball we would have the team that you expected. What happened to us earlier in the year was why I would have told Dan to go to Maryland after 2015 if I was in the MSU AD administration. Keenum wanted to- but Stricklin talked him out of it. Long term we're better off without Dan and Stricklin.

[cheewgumm]

Actually had Dan paid attention to recruiting on the offensive side of the ball we would have the team that you expected. What happened to us earlier in the year was why I would have told Dan to go to Maryland after 2015 if I was in the MSU AD administration. Keenum wanted to- but Stricklin talked him out of it. Long term we're better off without Dan and Stricklin.

Wait a minute.

Fitzgerald led the SEC in total offense last year. We also had Bama beat.

We averaged 30 points a game.

To say that our offense was lacking because our RBs no longer get the ball ia just false.

I?m sorry Moorhead didn?t know to run it down Kentucky and Florida?s throat, but that?s on him, not our supposed lack of talent. And if you think we lack talent this year, wait until next year.

[BrunswickDawg]

Wait a minute.

Fitzgerald led the SEC in total offense last year. We also had Bama beat.

We averaged 30 points a game.

To say that our offense was lacking because our RBs no longer get the ball ia just false.

I?m sorry Moorhead didn?t know to run it down Kentucky and Florida?s throat, but that?s on him, not our supposed lack of talent. And if you think we lack talent this year, wait until next year.

Fitz didn't lead the SEC in total offense last year - he was 3rd at 230 ypg. He's 5th this year at 261 ypg.

And we averaged 30 ppg last year - and 29.1 ppl this year.

[cheewgumm]

Actually had Dan paid attention to recruiting on the offensive side of the ball we would have the team that you expected. What happened to us earlier in the year was why I would have told Dan to go to Maryland after 2015 if I was in the MSU AD administration. Keenum wanted to- but Stricklin talked him out of it. Long term we're better off without Dan and Stricklin.


Fitz didn't lead the SEC in total offense last year - he was 3rd at 230 ypg. He's 5th this year at 261 ypg.

And we averaged 30 ppg last year - and 29.1 ppl this year.

Great, so you agree our offense doesn?t lack talent as Todd was saying.

[cheewgumm]

Actually had Dan paid attention to recruiting on the offensive side of the ball we would have the team that you expected. What happened to us earlier in the year was why I would have told Dan to go to Maryland after 2015 if I was in the MSU AD administration. Keenum wanted to- but Stricklin talked him out of it. Long term we're better off without Dan and Stricklin.


Fitz didn't lead the SEC in total offense last year - he was 3rd at 230 ypg. He's 5th this year at 261 ypg.

And we averaged 30 ppg last year - and 29.1 ppl this year.



Begs the question ... how did we score

7 against Kentucky,
6 against Florida and
3 against LSU

?

[Todd4State]

Wait a minute.

Fitzgerald led the SEC in total offense last year. We also had Bama beat.

We averaged 30 points a game.

To say that our offense was lacking because our RBs no longer get the ball ia just false.

I?m sorry Moorhead didn?t know to run it down Kentucky and Florida?s throat, but that?s on him, not our supposed lack of talent. And if you think we lack talent this year, wait until next year.

Did it ever occur to you that maybe we were giving it to the running backs less because of the RPO based system that we were running and teams causing Fitzgerald to read "keep" on the RPO? Or Fitzgerald having confusion reading defenses in general?

It's not a secret that Moorhead has simplified the offense and taken a lot of reads out and the results have improved the last two weeks.

Yes, we averaged 32 points per game last year but these SAME players are the same ones that struggled against top 12 teams last year on offense. Conveniently forget Georgia and Auburn when these players looked just as awful running Dan's offense as they did Joe's against top 12 teams? We had Alabama "beat" in part because they had a ton of injuries on defense. We're currently averaging 29 points per game as it is and we still haven't faced two of the worst defenses in the league yet. So we're not that far off from where we were last year at all.

But the very BASIC point you are missing is that our defense is elite. Our offense is not. And wasn't going to be unless Fitzgerald and our receivers picked up the offense more quickly than they did. That was always a question mark in the offseason. Add in the fact that Kentucky is yes, much better than expected and it looks worse than it actually is. But back to the POINT- for us to be a 10-11 elite team like you expected we have to reach the level of talent and experience that we have on defense on BOTH sides of the ball. That only happens through recruiting. Had Dan not whiffed on AJ Brown and the other WR's three years ago while only signed three offensive lineman a year we may be elite on both sides of the ball but we're not.

[Todd4State]

Great, so you agree our offense doesn?t lack talent as Todd was saying.

Are you saying that we have three first round picks on the offensive side of the ball?

And last year we finished 7th and 6th in the SEC in scoring offense and total offense. We're not "bad"- but we're not anywhere as talented on the offensive side as we are on the defensive side.

[Todd4State]

Begs the question ... how did we score

7 against Kentucky,
6 against Florida and
3 against LSU

?

The same way we scored 3 and 10 on Georgia and Auburn last year.

[BrunswickDawg]

Great, so you agree our offense doesn?t lack talent as Todd was saying.

Sorry - I was wrong. We averaged 32 ppg last year. That was good for 7th in the league. If you think 7th in the league in scoring and 6th in total offense is the mark of an offense that is supremely talented, then I understand why you don't understand Todd's point.

We are extremely talented on defense. Dan left us major holes on offense. That didn't change when he left.

[Homedawg]

Did it ever occur to you that maybe we were giving it to the running backs less because of the RPO based system that we were running and teams causing Fitzgerald to read "keep" on the RPO? Or Fitzgerald having confusion reading defenses in general?

It's not a secret that Moorhead has simplified the offense and taken a lot of reads out and the results have improved the last two weeks.

Yes, we averaged 32 points per game last year but these SAME players are the same ones that struggled against top 12 teams last year on offense. Conveniently forget Georgia and Auburn when these players looked just as awful running Dan's offense as they did Joe's against top 12 teams? We had Alabama "beat" in part because they had a ton of injuries on defense. We're currently averaging 29 points per game as it is and we still haven't faced two of the worst defenses in the league yet. So we're not that far off from where we were last year at all.

But the very BASIC point you are missing is that our defense is elite. Our offense is not. And wasn't going to be unless Fitzgerald and our receivers picked up the offense more quickly than they did. That was always a question mark in the offseason. Add in the fact that Kentucky is yes, much better than expected and it looks worse than it actually is. But back to the POINT- for us to be a 10-11 elite team like you expected we have to reach the level of talent and experience that we have on defense on BOTH sides of the ball. That only happens through recruiting. Had Dan not whiffed on AJ Brown and the other WR's three years ago while only signed three offensive lineman a year we may be elite on both sides of the ball but we're not.

First, he started callling more runs. Straight runs. Counter treys etc against a&m. Last night he went back to the rpo. He didn't take reads out of the rpo's. Just wrong. Second why did it take him so damn long to call more straight runs?? And I love your bitterness to the former staff. Like I said a couple weeks ago, be glad when it's 3/4 years down the road and you can bitch to about the next crew. Jomo has done way less w the same players and that's not in question. Except apparently, to you and a couple others who sat in third chair.

[Todd4State]

Sorry - I was wrong. We averaged 32 ppg last year. That was good for 7th in the league. If you think 7th in the league in scoring and 6th in total offense is the mark of an offense that is supremely talented, then I understand why you don't understand Todd's point.

We are extremely talented on defense. Dan left us major holes on offense. That didn't change when he left.

That's the disconnect. People think our offense is much more talented than it is. We're not "bad" like Croom level at all- but we're not elite like the defense is where they are leading the league in most major categories.

[Todd4State]

First, he started callling more runs. Straight runs. Counter treys etc against a&m. Last night he went back to the rpo. He didn't take reads out of the rpo's. Just wrong. Second why did it take him so damn long to call more straight runs?? And I love your bitterness to the former staff. Like I said a couple weeks ago, be glad when it's 3/4 years down the road and you can bitch to about the next crew. Jomo has done way less w the same players and that's not in question. Except apparently, to you and a couple others who sat in third chair.

That's exactly what I said and I never said "he took out the reads in the rpo's".

Why did it take him so long? Oh- I don't know. Maybe because he figured that if guys less talented than Fitzgerald could pick up his offense in 5-6 games at Fordham and Penn State could do that our guys could do the same? Maybe if you weren't busy wasting your life failing as an athlete you would have figured it out sooner too.


I guess "way less" is three points worse? By the way since you aren't very good at math- one more win and he ties Dan's average win per year total.


I'll bitch at Joe in 3-4 years IF he deserves it. I didn't bitch about Dan in year one either BTW. Feel free to check sixpack if you are smart enough to use the search feature over there. I'm smart enough to see a pattern after seven years to know that something is an issue.

[cheewgumm]

The disconnect is not seeing that we could have run it down Kentucky and Florida and maybe LSUs throat but didn?t do it.

Our offense is not talented at receiver. That?s true. We are talented OL at RB. Which makes it even more crazy that they never get the ball.

But if you can run it and beat Kentucky and Florida, do it.

Why you and Todd don?t understand this is hard to understand but some fans just don?t get it.

[Homedawg]

The same way we scored 3 and 10 on Georgia and Auburn last year.

Hahaha. Comparing those two to Florida and Kentucky is utterly freaking laughable. One beat Bama and he other took them to OT. Please just stop. So stupid.

[Todd4State]

The disconnect is not seeing that we could have run it down Kentucky and Florida and maybe LSUs throat but didn?t do it.

Our offense is not talented at receiver. That?s true. We are talented OL at RB. Which makes it even more crazy that they never get the ball.

But if you can run it and beat Kentucky and Florida, do it.

Why you and Todd don?t understand this is hard to understand but some fans just don?t get it.

You are aware that Kentucky was the ONLY game of those three where we had more pass attempts than rushing attempts correct? More "because I said so" that's not grounded in any reality at all.

[Homedawg]

That's exactly what I said and I never said "he took out the reads in the rpo's".

Why did it take him so long? Oh- I don't know. Maybe because he figured that if guys less talented than Fitzgerald could pick up his offense in 5-6 games at Fordham and Penn State could do that our guys could do the same? Maybe if you weren't busy wasting your life failing as an athlete you would have figured it out sooner too.


I guess "way less" is three points worse? By the way since you aren't very good at math- one more win and he ties Dan's average win per year total.


I'll bitch at Joe in 3-4 years IF he deserves it. I didn't bitch about Dan in year one either BTW. Feel free to check sixpack if you are smart enough to use the search feature over there. I'm smart enough to see a pattern after seven years to know that something is an issue.

One more win and he's tied dan's avg with the most talented team he or dan ever coached. With players that dan recruited. But next year when we suck, you'll be back here w your jomo bib on blaming his losses on dan. Great. Can't wait.

[Todd4State]

Hahaha. Comparing those two to Florida and Kentucky is utterly freaking laughable. One beat Bama and he other took them to OT. Please just stop. So stupid.

More "because I said so" without anything to back it up.

[Todd4State]

One more win and he's tied dan's avg with the most talented team he or dan ever coached. With players that dan recruited. But next year when we suck, you'll be back here w your jomo bib on blaming his losses on dan. Great. Can't wait.

You mean suck like Jamal Peters?** Can't wait either if that's the case sports expert.

[cheewgumm]

I?ve read this bird enough to know Todd will get the last word.... no matter what.

So I?ll let you have it.

[Homedawg]

You mean suck like Jamal Peters?** Can't wait either if that's the case sports expert.

He's not an nfl corner. He's good in zone due to his length. Not a man fo man cover guy. Call me when he makes a roster. Thanks.

[Homedawg]

More "because I said so" without anything to back it up.

Not anything to back it up?? So Georgia and auburn last year aren't better than uk and fla this year? Good grief man. That's something. Thanks for your supporting facts bro.

[BrunswickDawg]

Not anything to back it up?? So Georgia and auburn last year aren't better than uk and fla this year? Good grief man. That's something. Thanks for your supporting facts bro.

KY is giving up 15.3 ppg so far. Last year, UGA gave up 16.4 and Auburn gave up 18.5. KY has given up 311 ypg compared to UGA 295 and AU 319 ypg last year. Kentucky has a very good defense. One that statically is as good as AU and UGA last year. They are a defense that was able to exploit our weaknesses on offense this year that UGA and AU were able to exploit last year. Kentucky also could conceivably finish this season with the same number of losses as UGA Had last year - 2.

[msstate7]

KY is giving up 15.3 ppg so far. Last year, UGA gave up 16.4 and Auburn gave up 18.5. KY has given up 311 ypg compared to UGA 295 and AU 319 ypg last year. Kentucky has a very good defense. One that statically is as good as AU and UGA last year. They are a defense that was able to exploit our weaknesses on offense this year that UGA and AU were able to exploit last year. Kentucky also could conceivably finish this season with the same number of losses as UGA Had last year - 2.

Georgia faced ND, us, auburn x2, bama, and Oklahoma. You really wanna compare Georgia and Kentucky?

ETA... Georgia faced 6 top 25 scoring offenses last season. Kentucky has faced 1 this season, and they gave up 30 something Saturday to them

[Cooterpoot]

He's not an nfl corner. He's good in zone due to his length. Not a man fo man cover guy. Call me when he makes a roster. Thanks.

He’s projected top 3 rounds. He’ll be on a roster.

[Todd4State]

He's not an nfl corner. He's good in zone due to his length. Not a man fo man cover guy. Call me when he makes a roster. Thanks.

No one said he was a NFL anything. You have repeatedly said he sucks. Now he is projected as a third round pick.

[LC Dawg]

If we win a national championship the game thread will have 100+ posts about what the coach is doing wrong and there will be multiple postgame threads about how it should be our second natty because Moorhead ****ed up the one we should have won in 2018. It's the nature of message boards.
I'm looking forward to finishing the football season strong so I can start reading about what a ****ing idiot Ben Howland is.

[Todd4State]

Not anything to back it up?? So Georgia and auburn last year aren't better than uk and fla this year? Good grief man. That's something. Thanks for your supporting facts bro.

See Brunswick's post. Point is these players have never done well against top 12 teams. I've already proven it several times in this thread- which is why I didn't point it out again. You're basically saying that players that have never performed well against top 12 teams should without question perform well against top 12 teams all of a sudden and that it's the coaches total fault that they can't. While learning a new offense on top of all of that. All the while defending the previous coach for doing the exact same thing that you're calling out the current coach for.


You also threw out last year's Alabama team as a comparison. Alabama last year is not Alabama this year. Georgia and Auburn last year would get blown out by this years Alabama team. And is it really that surprising that Auburn beat and UGA took to OT the Alabama team we played the closest at home last year of all three? It probably shouldn't be when you think about it logically.

[Todd4State]

He’s projected top 3 rounds. He’ll be on a roster.

He knows more than NFL scouts. There's a reason why he is trying to pull the NFL corner angle right now even though no one said anything about Peters being a NFL corner in this thread.

[Todd4State]

Georgia faced ND, us, auburn x2, bama, and Oklahoma. You really wanna compare Georgia and Kentucky?

ETA... Georgia faced 6 top 25 scoring offenses last season. Kentucky has faced 1 this season, and they gave up 30 something Saturday to them

What's their won/loss record and where are they in the BCS poll?

[DancingRabbit]

What's their won/loss record and where are they in the BCS poll?

What is this BCS poll you keep referring to? You mean the CFP poll, I guess?

Not disagreeing with your points though. Carry on.

[Todd4State]

What is this BCS poll you keep referring to? You mean the CFP poll, I guess?

Not disagreeing with your points though. Carry on.

Yes! Some habits are hard for me to break.

[dawgday166]

Yes! Some habits are hard for me to break.

LOL ... like making sure Dan gets all the blame for Joe's screw ups ***

Now that our Oline isn't somewhere between run blocking and pass blocking on every play, they actually playing a lot better. They doing one or the other every play not trying to do both. Don't have the tackles with enough agility for speed rushers but this Oline is upper tier on run blocking.

WRs are the hole that Dan left. Everything else could be very good with more time with these coaches and Joe adjusting his offense just a little bit. Guidry and Osirus are stepping up now too and are playing pretty good.

The problems we've had on O are a combination of Joe, the offensive staff, and the players. None are 100% innocent. And Dan ain't 100% guilty either. If Joe had worked the O harder and not been telling them how good they were the whole preseason, he might've figured this out a little more prior to the season starting.

Joe may be figuring it out now tho. If he had figured it out before KY, FL, & LSU we'd be undefeated right now, regardless of what anyone says. This Oline can road grade all the teams just mentioned. Have to mix it up some defending width of field but our Oline is more physical than any of the front 7s just mentioned. They just have to know for sure they are run blocking on a play.

[BrunswickDawg]

Georgia faced ND, us, auburn x2, bama, and Oklahoma. You really wanna compare Georgia and Kentucky?

ETA... Georgia faced 6 top 25 scoring offenses last season. Kentucky has faced 1 this season, and they gave up 30 something Saturday to them

Read what I wrote - they are as good STATISTICALLY, which means by the STATISTICAL measurements they are as good. I recognize that the schedule may not have been as tough. The players on our offense also have a history of not performing well against teams with similar STATISTICAL measurements as those 3 teams. That's a fact. Teams with those profiles that are able to exploit our weaknesses in the passing game (no true passing QB, an OL that can be bad at pass pro, and suspect WR) typically have beaten us. They did last year. They did this year. You don't even have to completely shut down the running game to do it. It's forcing you to pass when you don't want to.

Our whole offense revolves around constantly being in 2nd or 3rd and short. If you force us into 2nd and long or 3rd and long consistently, our passing game has to be perfect to win. It ain't that hard to figure out.

[BrunswickDawg]

LOL ... like making sure Dan gets all the blame for Joe's screw ups ***

Now that our Oline isn't somewhere between run blocking and pass blocking on every play, they actually playing a lot better. They doing one or the other every play not trying to do both. Don't have the tackles with enough agility for speed rushers but this Oline is upper tier on run blocking.

WRs are the hole that Dan left. Everything else could be very good with more time with these coaches and Joe adjusting his offense just a little bit. Guidry and Osirus are stepping up now too and are playing pretty good.

The problems we've had on O are a combination of Joe, the offensive staff, and the players. None are 100% innocent. And Dan ain't 100% guilty either. If Joe had worked the O harder and not been telling them how good they were the whole preseason, he might've figured this out a little more prior to the season starting.

Joe may be figuring it out now tho. If he had figured it out before KY, FL, & LSU we'd be undefeated right now, regardless of what anyone says. This Oline can road grade all the teams just mentioned. Have to mix it up some defending width of field but our Oline is more physical than any of the front 7s just mentioned. They just have to know for sure they are run blocking on a play.

Most of those are very good points - which then circle back to Chiziks reality check. Unless you promote from within, even very talented teams go thru a transition phase when you bring in a new coaching staff. That transition is easier in situations like Tennessee coming off a 4 win season (or MSU from Croom to Mullen) then it is for a team coming off a 8 wins and a bowl with a core of players coming back. Any time that would have been spent growing in a system you have known for 3-4 years is gone. You start from scratch. Add a QB coming back from injury, and new WR expected to contribute immediately (which rarely happens), and coaches that don't know the players and you will take a step back. It is also an exceedingly rare situation today. It sucks that it happens. It truly does.

[dawgday166]

Most of those are very good points - which then circle back to Chiziks reality check. Unless you promote from within, even very talented teams go thru a transition phase when you bring in a new coaching staff. That transition is easier in situations like Tennessee coming off a 4 win season (or MSU from Croom to Mullen) then it is for a team coming off a 8 wins and a bowl with a core of players coming back. Any time that would have been spent growing in a system you have known for 3-4 years is gone. You start from scratch. Add a QB coming back from injury, and new WR expected to contribute immediately (which rarely happens), and coaches that don't know the players and you will take a step back. It is also an exceedingly rare situation today. It sucks that it happens. It truly does.

I'm cutting Joe some slack .. just sucks the learning curve he had to go thru. And while the blame can be spread around among all the parties involved ... I ultimately hold the coaching staff responsible ... just like always do and like I did with Dan (to state7's vociferous disagreement **).

State 7 loves Dan above all else on earth ... Todd despises him below all else on earth. It evens out the Universe **

[StateDawg44]

Some fans don?t realize how talented our team is and how this was a once in a decade type opportunity.

He blew that when he didn?t have to.

When the NFL draft comes the next couple of years our fans will look back and understand how horrible that Kentucky, Florida and LSU losses were.

We will be way less talented next year. We built to this point. This was the year.

We blew this opportunity. We will be worse next year because of talent.

Some of our fans don?t get it but they?ll realize it at some point.


Where have you read that our fans don't understand how poor those performances were? If anything it's completely the opposite.

[Duckdog]

We have a chance if tua gets hurt on the first play of the game and they spot us 21

[msstate7]

I'm cutting Joe some slack .. just sucks the learning curve he had to go thru. And while the blame can be spread around among all the parties involved ... I ultimately hold the coaching staff responsible ... just like always do and like I did with Dan (to state7's vociferous disagreement **).

State 7 loves Dan above all else on earth ... Todd despises him below all else on earth. It evens out the Universe **

Dan is #2. Brees and Payton are #1

Haha

[dawgday166]

Dan is #2. Brees and Payton are #1

Haha

There is imbalance in the Universe then cause ... I'm sure Todd despises Dan more than anything on earth **

[Tbonewannabe]

He's not an nfl corner. He's good in zone due to his length. Not a man fo man cover guy. Call me when he makes a roster. Thanks.

A lot of people compare him to the same body type as Richard Sherman. Sherman ran a 4.56 at the NFL Combine so if Peters can run in the 4.5s then he is really close physically. I could see Atlanta or Seattle giving him a shot based on that.

[Tbonewannabe]

LOL ... like making sure Dan gets all the blame for Joe's screw ups ***

Now that our Oline isn't somewhere between run blocking and pass blocking on every play, they actually playing a lot better. They doing one or the other every play not trying to do both. Don't have the tackles with enough agility for speed rushers but this Oline is upper tier on run blocking.

WRs are the hole that Dan left. Everything else could be very good with more time with these coaches and Joe adjusting his offense just a little bit. Guidry and Osirus are stepping up now too and are playing pretty good.

The problems we've had on O are a combination of Joe, the offensive staff, and the players. None are 100% innocent. And Dan ain't 100% guilty either. If Joe had worked the O harder and not been telling them how good they were the whole preseason, he might've figured this out a little more prior to the season starting.

Joe may be figuring it out now tho. If he had figured it out before KY, FL, & LSU we'd be undefeated right now, regardless of what anyone says. This Oline can road grade all the teams just mentioned. Have to mix it up some defending width of field but our Oline is more physical than any of the front 7s just mentioned. They just have to know for sure they are run blocking on a play.

Maybe Joe thought they were about to understand it and needed confidence. Joe and Fitz have said that the A&M game was the first time Fitz felt confident in what he was doing. We were kicking ass until UK and it was in constant rain with 160 yards of penalties. UF was the game were I wondered if the offense would truly work. Everyone said it usually took 4 to 5 games to really get going in Joe's offense. Fitz missing spring probably added more games to that number in hindsight.

There is still things I don't agree with (Fitz in the 2nd half last week) but Joe is the coach and he will finish with a record that would be the best under Mullen outside of 2014. I personally thought 7-5 was the floor and 10-2 was the ceiling. I thought 9-3 or 10-2 was where we would end up with Mullen but adding in a new coaching staff there is usually a step back. I am happy with 8-4 and Joe having a chance to build on it. It sucks that Mullen built a team to compete for the West but there was 0% chance that Mullen would have beaten Bama.

[Cooterpoot]

Peters is going to be drafted pretty high. I hate to break to the haters, but he's been good and will blow up the combine.

[Commercecomet24]

Peters is going to be drafted pretty high. I hate to break to the haters, but he's been good and will blow up the combine.

Yeah 6'2" 220 pound corners that can run like him, don't grow on trees.