Moorhead on XM Radio: Fitz ain't no passer

[TrapGame]

Moorhead said they thought the K State game was a good sign for Fitz but after UK and Florida he realized Fitz can't make the passes his offense requires. The K State game was fool's gold b/c their defense was not as good as everyone thought it was. That's when Joe decided to go back to a heavy run package.

No mention of asst. coaches offering up resignations.

[hacker]

He actually said that?

[Cooterpoot]

I'm not going to lie, I'm really concerned about Moorhead. Maybe he's a goofyassed genius, but man, I don't know.

[TrapGame]

That's what I got from a friend that listens. Also they are talking about it on SPS. I did not hear it with my own ears.

[Saltydog]

passes anyway. Plus, if it took him that long to figure out that Fitz didn't fit his offense then we have a bigger issue than I thought with the "chessmaster".

[Jack Lambert]

This is his first season as a FBS head coach. Cut him a little slack.

[TrapGame]

I kinda think Moorhead offers too much information. I get that from his press conferences. Although, he was really coy about looking at film and game planning against LSU today.

[dawgday166]

This isn't what he said. He said that Nick really looked good against ULL and did everything well. But against KY & FL he regressed some in his progressions in passing and "quite frankly" running. He said Nick will be fine going forward running ... after all he's the all-time leader in QB rushing in SEC, and he will continue to progress as a passer.

[TNDawg35]

Or did anyone ever think he is playing mind games with our opponents?? Hell before the Auburn game he said he wasn’t changing shit, then came out had pretty much a totally new offense. Maybe he is trying to make LSU think about shit.

[TNDawg35]

This isn't what he said. He said that Nick really looked good against ULL and did everything well. But against KY & FL he regressed some in his progressions in passing and "quite frankly" running. He said Nick will be fine going forward running ... after all he's the all-time leader in rushing in SEC, and he will continue to progress as a passer.

The actual truth isn’t welcome here...***

[lastmajordog]

I kinda think Moorhead offers too much information. I get that from his press conferences. Although, he was really coy about looking at film and game planning against LSU today. No reason to be coy....go back to 14 and add some intermediate passes for LSU......you got this...

[Homedawg]

He actually said that?

No.

[MaroonFlounder]

And even with Fitz's deficiencies as a passer, if Mitchell catches a pass, and if Guidry doesn't drop 2 balls on the crossing routes, this team outlook is so much better. Then, the narrative is that Fitz doesn't throw a "catchable ball", and doesn't have any touch on passes that don't need to be missiles. ( The 2nd part of that may actually be true)

[yjnkdawg]

If somebody is going to post a negative thread like this, you would think that they would at least know what JoeMo actually said, and it not be bases on basically heresay. As the dude on SPS, said basically JoeMo said Fitz was not a passer. So JoeMo basically said that? JoeMo wouldn't throw Fitz under the bus. Then some start criticizing JoeMo on things he didn't actually say, based upon the inaccuracies of the first post. .....................Great thread.***

[yjnkdawg]

He actually said that?



Nope! One poster on SPS.

[TrapGame]

If somebody is going to post a negative thread like this, you would think that they would at least know what JoeMo actually said, and it not be bases on basically heresay. As the dude on SPS, said basically JoeMo said Fitz was not a passer. So JoeMo basically said that? JoeMo wouldn't throw Fitz under the bus. Then some start criticizing JoeMo on things he didn't actually say, based upon the inaccuracies of the first post. .....................Great thread.***

Yeah, cause no one ever posts second hand info around here.**

But, seriously, point taken.

[Leroy Jenkins]

That's what I got from a friend that listens. Also they are talking about it on SPS. I did not hear it with my own ears.

https://media.giphy.com/media/l2JdTjaYYhlma03hS/giphy.gif




https://media.giphy.com/media/3orifg31w2MOgZBTgs/giphy.gif

[biggun]

Moorhead said they thought the K State game was a good sign for Fitz but after UK and Florida he realized Fitz can't make the passes his offense requires. The K State game was fool's gold b/c their defense was not as good as everyone thought it was. That's when Joe decided to go back to a heavy run package.

No mention of asst. coaches offering up resignations.

Total BS and terrible post. Nice job

[TrapGame]

Total BS and terrible post. Nice job

It's a message board. Rumors welcome. Thanks for playing.**

[mparkerfd20]

It's a message board. Rumors welcome. Thanks for playing.**

Except that wasn't a rumor the way you posted it. You posted it as fact making yourself look like an idiot when called out on it. Thanks for playing.**

[Bothrops]

I kinda think Moorhead offers too much information. I get that from his press conferences. Although, he was really coy about looking at film and game planning against LSU today.

So Mullen offered nothing to fans and was deceiving with reporters, while Moorhead tells all...?

[TrapGame]

So Mullen offered nothing to fans and was deceiving with reporters, while Moorhead tells all...?

His responses to questions are more detailed than Mullen's. That's b/c his an English major. We tend to do that.

[TrapGame]

Except that wasn't a rumor the way you posted it. You posted it as fact making yourself look like an idiot when called out on it. Thanks for playing.**

I actually posted I didn't hear first hand. Read. And again, thanks for playing.****

[Todd4State]

The thing that worries me about Joe is it seems like we have a lot of fans that simply do not believe in him. I'm not sure why.

[Todd4State]

So Mullen offered nothing to fans and was deceiving with reporters, while Moorhead tells all...?

I think Croom was simply hardheaded and not flexible. Dan was more flexible than Croom but was paranoid when telling things to the media- so while he wasn't trying to outright deceive anyone he really didn't give us a lot. When the media did push him which was rare he would freak out.

Joe does appear to be more flexible than both and we're not used to that as fans. He does seem to be more in touch with what people are saying and thinking and seems to look at criticism objectively. Now, I reserve the right to take that back if we come out against LSU and start throwing the ball all over the field like UK and UF but I would be surprised if he did that.

[mparkerfd20]

I actually posted I didn't hear first hand. Read. And again, thanks for playing.****

I did! In the OP you said nothing of the sort. You posted it as if you heard it yourself... You then started backpedaling later.

[shannondawg]

As our beloved president says: Fake News!

[TrapGame]

Mea culpa.

http://replygif.net/i/1455.gif

[yjnkdawg]

The thing that worries me about Joe is it seems like we have a lot of fans that simply do not believe in him. I'm not sure why.



I think it is more accurate saying a few very vocal posters on messsage boards. I see people upset with our two losses outside of the message board arenas, but they go on with their lives, and don't freak out, do crazy stuff on social media, or have an agenda against JoeMo, as it appears a few on message boards (especially this one) do. The good thing is that those who seem to have something against JoeMo, for reasons who knows why, their opinions shouldn't make two cents worth of difference in what Cohen thinks or does, or what JoeMo thinks or does.

[Dawg2003]

The thing that worries me about Joe is it seems like we have a lot of fans that simply do not believe in him. I'm not sure why.

Here are my feelings on that. Over time, I have found him a little robotic. I don't want to say he's fake because I don't know how he feels, but he comes off as programmed to me at times. He has a lot of good sayings, but I don't always feel that he means it. It seems like he has some kind of saying for every event. "You can't accept in victory what you would in defeat" and so on and so forth.

I also think he is a victim of his circumstances. He's following a coach that took us to number 1 and gave us a lot of NFL players like Dak. He's basically following the best coach we've ever had. That's not an enviable position. A lot of people made him out to be some kind of savior before he even coached a game. Truthfully, I think a lot of people built him up to be something that he may not be, or they imagined him to be something that he's not. I think that a lot of the fans projected what they wanted him to be on him. For better or worse, I do think that our program has a built in ceiling because of our recruiting disadvantages. I just don't think that some of the fans have accepted that yet. Some of our fans genuinely think that he can build us a program that can compete with Bama and win the SEC. But I just don't see that happening no matter who the coach is. And part of that is Moorhead's fault for setting the championship standard.

[dawgday166]

Here are my feelings on that. Over time, I have found him a little robotic. I don't want to say he's fake because I don't know how he feels, but he comes off as programmed to me at times. He has a lot of good sayings, but I don't always feel that he means it. It seems like he has some kind of saying for every event. "You can't accept in victory what you would in defeat" and so on and so forth.

I also think he is a victim of his circumstances. He's following a coach that took us to number 1 and gave us a lot of NFL players like Dak. He's basically following the best coach we've ever had. That's not an enviable position. A lot of people made him out to be some kind of savior before he even coached a game. Truthfully, I think a lot of people built him up to be something that he may not be, or they imagined him to be something that he's not. I think that a lot of the fans projected what they wanted him to be on him. For better or worse, I do think that our program has a built in ceiling because of our recruiting disadvantages. I just don't think that some of the fans are accepted that yet.

This is what's bothering me too somewhat. Don't care if we start kicking everyone's arse but ... I just think I'm getting sold a bill of goods when he has a press conference.

Reading stats about how good our D is, talking about it, etc. ... I don't really care. There's things they can improve on and I think I prefer talking about that some. I will say tho that he takes responsibility for when the O ain't performing ... while Dan would deflect all that stuff most of time.

[Commercecomet24]

Y'all every coach in the world gets nit picked to death about what they say to the media and their approach. It's why Belichick says exactly zero to them and with zero emotion. If you're winning you're a genius if you're losing you're a fool. Give the man some time.

[confucius say]

The thing that worries me about Joe is it seems like we have a lot of fans that simply do not believe in him. I'm not sure why.

Bc he lost to FL. Some here will never forgive that sans a 11-1 season or west title

[dawgday166]

Y'all every coach in the world gets nit picked to death about what they say to the media and their approach. It's why Belichick says exactly zero to them and with zero emotion. If you're winning you're a genius if you're losing you're a fool. Give the man some time.

I'm really doing this. I like Moorhead I think ... I want him to be the guy that goes and kick's Saban's ass (and rest of west).

I just can't put my finger on why his pressers don't come across well to me. I dunno ... probably just me and I'm not real happy overall with the way we're playing yet (at least I hope that's it).

[Commercecomet24]

I'm really doing this. I like Moorhead I think ... I want him to be the guy that goes and kick's Saban's ass (and rest of west).

I just can't put my finger on why his pressers don't come across well to me. I dunno ... probably just me and I'm not real happy overall with the way we're playing yet (at least I hope that's it).

I believe it's because we all aren't real sure what we have yet. It's like starting any kind of relationship, it takes time to build that trust and confidence level where you just go "yeah this is gonna be good!". Joe could be the greatest coach ever or another croom(I don't believe this is likely). We will definitely know more by the end of the season. I'm just to old to be reactionary anymore and I tend to lean more towards being patient because great things generally don't happen overnight. I also understand why some fans have some angst. My belief is Joe is going to be at least as successful as Dan and once he gets the proper pieces in place will be even better. As always time will tell.

[Todd4State]

I think it is more accurate saying a few very vocal posters on messsage boards. I see people upset with our two losses outside of the message board arenas, but they go on with their lives, and don't freak out, do crazy stuff on social media, or have an agenda against JoeMo, as it appears a few on message boards (especially this one) do. The good thing is that those who seem to have something against JoeMo, for reasons who knows why, their opinions shouldn't make two cents worth of difference in what Cohen thinks or does, or what JoeMo thinks or does.

You're probably right.

[Todd4State]

Here are my feelings on that. Over time, I have found him a little robotic. I don't want to say he's fake because I don't know how he feels, but he comes off as programmed to me at times. He has a lot of good sayings, but I don't always feel that he means it. It seems like he has some kind of saying for every event. "You can't accept in victory what you would in defeat" and so on and so forth.

I also think he is a victim of his circumstances. He's following a coach that took us to number 1 and gave us a lot of NFL players like Dak. He's basically following the best coach we've ever had. That's not an enviable position. A lot of people made him out to be some kind of savior before he even coached a game. Truthfully, I think a lot of people built him up to be something that he may not be, or they imagined him to be something that he's not. I think that a lot of the fans projected what they wanted him to be on him. For better or worse, I do think that our program has a built in ceiling because of our recruiting disadvantages. I just don't think that some of the fans have accepted that yet. Some of our fans genuinely think that he can build us a program that can compete with Bama and win the SEC. But I just don't see that happening no matter who the coach is. And part of that is Moorhead's fault for setting the championship standard.

That's fair. I will admit that I thought Nick would flourish in this offense and it has been the opposite.

[Todd4State]

I believe it's because we all aren't real sure what we have yet. It's like starting any kind of relationship, it takes time to build that trust and confidence level where you just go "yeah this is gonna be good!". Joe could be the greatest coach ever or another croom(I don't believe this is likely). We will definitely know more by the end of the season. I'm just to old to be reactionary anymore and I tend to lean more towards being patient because great things generally don't happen overnight. I also understand why some fans have some angst. My belief is Joe is going to be at least as successful as Dan and once he gets the proper pieces in place will be even better. As always time will tell.

I think this is fair too. The thing is Dan won five games his first year and didn't necessarily have a QB that fit his system really either- Tyson Lee and Relf was inconsistent. Joe has already won four. If Joe gets to seven wins that will equal Jackie as the best first year record we have had in my lifetime from a first year coach.

I want to see what Joe can do with his type of player on offense. It will also be interesting to see if the 5-6 week grace period thing is a real thing with Joe. We did look better against Auburn even though we mainly just ran the ball- just a lot less confusion and a better offensive rhythm despite more motion in general.

[dawgday166]

I believe it's because we all aren't real sure what we have yet. It's like starting any kind of relationship, it takes time to build that trust and confidence level where you just go "yeah this is gonna be good!". Joe could be the greatest coach ever or another croom(I don't believe this is likely). We will definitely know more by the end of the season. I'm just to old to be reactionary anymore and I tend to lean more towards being patient because great things generally don't happen overnight. I also understand why some fans have some angst. My belief is Joe is going to be at least as successful as Dan and once he gets the proper pieces in place will be even better. As always time will tell.

I liked Joe a lot initially. Not saying I don't now ... just saying. He just keeps using some of the same cliches win or loss, which are growing a little old and thin. I think he has potential and am willing to give him at least 3 years to show me something on the field, almost regardless of how this year turns out. The next 3 out of 4 will show us something. If we do our worst case in those games, should still finish 7-5 and I'll then chalk UK & FL games up to his and the staff's indoctrination into the SEC.

[Commercecomet24]

I liked Joe a lot initially. Not saying I don't now ... just saying. He just keeps using some of the same cliches win or loss, which are growing a little old and thin. I think he has potential and am willing to give him at least 3 years to show me something on the field, almost regardless of how this year turns out. The next 3 out of 4 will show us something. If we do our worst case in those games, should still finish 7-5 and I'll then chalk UK & FL games up to his and the staff's indoctrination into the SEC.

I completely understand what you're saying. Every coach has there little things they use over and over. I'm a pats fan. Don't know if you've ever watched a Belichick press conference but Bill says exactly the same things over and over and in a monotone. It drives the fans and media insane but I find it hilarious. Of course he wins so everyone just kinda says that's bill.

Good to see you being patient. I think he's got the kids playing hard and with a lot of effort. Hope we finish the season strong.

[Commercecomet24]

I think this is fair too. The thing is Dan won five games his first year and didn't necessarily have a QB that fit his system really either- Tyson Lee and Relf was inconsistent. Joe has already won four. If Joe gets to seven wins that will equal Jackie as the best first year record we have had in my lifetime from a first year coach.

I want to see what Joe can do with his type of player on offense. It will also be interesting to see if the 5-6 week grace period thing is a real thing with Joe. We did look better against Auburn even though we mainly just ran the ball- just a lot less confusion and a better offensive rhythm despite more motion in general.

Yep good points.

[Dawgfan77]

I was in the corner we made a bad hire after the UK and UF games. After auburn I was in the maybe the guy gets it then we see AU was just bad. So I?m still on the fence and the main reason is that he had a spring and fall (including two games with Fitz) to watch film and see what this OL and QB can do. His lack of adjustments in games and after really left me scratching my head.
I will say that should he keep this offense we have after Auburn and we beat LSU and ATM then I?m all aboard the Joe train. If we reverts back to AirHead and we struggle the rest of the way and end up 5-7 to 6-6 then I will go back to the idea we made a bad hire. I wanted to like him but after 6 games their are more questions than answers. The next 6 IMO will determine if we made a good hire

[TrapGame]

I was in the corner we made a bad hire after the UK and UF games. After auburn I was in the maybe the guy gets it then we see AU was just bad. So I?m still on the fence and the main reason is that he had a spring and fall (including two games with Fitz) to watch film and see what this OL and QB can do. His lack of adjustments in games and after really left me scratching my head.
I will say that should he keep this offense we have after Auburn and we beat LSU and ATM then I?m all aboard the Joe train. If we reverts back to AirHead and we struggle the rest of the way and end up 5-7 to 6-6 then I will go back to the idea we made a bad hire. I wanted to like him but after 6 games their are more questions than answers. The next 6 IMO will determine if we made a good hire

I still say Sweat broke Stidham. This is still the Auburn that beat Washington.

But, I get where you're coming from. I'm starting to have flashbacks of Croom having that one big win every season where you'd scratch your head and think "Is he starting to get it?". And then the rest of the season work be the same shit show on ice.

[BrunswickDawg]

All coaches use coach speak. I'd rather hear a tired cliche than a contrived one like "strain" over, and over again.

I think Joe, like any first year coach, is adjusting to the environment. MSU is different than PSU, which was different from Fordham, etc.
We are adjusting to a new face, the People's Eyebrow, and a coach who will talk about injuries.

I'm also amazed by the number of people who have been willing to support or give up on a coach based on such an incomplete body of work.
And Todd's point about Dan going 5-7 is a good one. Croom left talent that didn't know how to win. But, people tend to forget that we were 4 points away in '08 from being 6-6 and being stuck with Croom for at least a couple of years. Those 4 points kept Croom on the bubble until the Ole Miss beat down sealed his fate. Thru that lens, Dan didn't do that much his first season to improve the overall. It was basically status quo with a new face and new approach, an offense that gained more yards, and we beat Ole Miss.

So, if Moorhead comes in and while learning this environment and implementing his system, goes 8-4 (the status quo), is that a terrible thing? I don't buy the Dan would do more with this team when essentially the same team (17 returning starters!!) went 8-4 last year and the SEC overall seems to be very evenly matched. We would still have the same issues in the passing game - minus Whop and Guidry (they would have red-shirted if they had even come to State), Kylin would not be sniffing the field any more than last year because he can't pass protect, and Chris Rayford would be getting torched instead of Cam Dantzler making plays (Sr. "system" guy over younger talent). I'm sure there are other similar things that we all know Dan would be doing with this team that we would be bitching about.

When you bring in a whole new system and staff you have to look at the totality of the season instead of the prisoner of the moment approach. Prisoner of the moment will kill your program.

[Dawg2003]

That's fair. I will admit that I thought Nick would flourish in this offense and it has been the opposite.

I did too, and now I wonder why I thought that. I really think Moorhead is a victim of his circumstances and of the media and fans building him up before he ever coached a game.

[Prediction? Pain.]

I think this is fair too. The thing is Dan won five games his first year and didn't necessarily have a QB that fit his system really either- Tyson Lee and Relf was inconsistent. Joe has already won four. If Joe gets to seven wins that will equal Jackie as the best first year record we have had in my lifetime from a first year coach.

I want to see what Joe can do with his type of player on offense. It will also be interesting to see if the 5-6 week grace period thing is a real thing with Joe. We did look better against Auburn even though we mainly just ran the ball- just a lot less confusion and a better offensive rhythm despite more motion in general.

This is an interesting point, Todd. A few thoughts that it spurred, which may or may not be interesting when Mullen's early tenure here with our tiny sample of games from Moorhead:

1) Our personnel this year is reminiscent of Mullen's early squads, and maybe 2010's more than 2009's. Defensive talent out the wazoo -- eight of 2010's 11 starters on D played in the NFL for some period; six of the eight were on the DL and LB corp; one was a safety; and one was a future Thorpe Award winner starting at CB. A lightly recruited, 3-star, run-first quarterback -- per 24/7, Relf was a 3-star QB with a rating 0.8035 who the 34th best dual-threat QB prospect in the country, while Fitz was a 3-star QB with a rating of 0.8133 who was the 40th best dual-threat QB prospect in the country. A stout OL -- three of 2010's starters on the OL made NFL rosters (Sherrod, Jackson, and Saulsberry) and the other two (Brignone and Lawrence) made NFL preseason rosters. And a great RB tandem -- Ballard (who was drafted after the 2011 season and was derailed professionally only by persistent injuries) and pre-beefcakes (and properly used) Perkins (who saw a little time in the NFL, too). Actually, looking back at the personnel on that team, I wonder if that defense was top-to-bottom just as talented at 2018's, at least among the starters? And I wonder how much more talented overall 2018's offense is compared to 2010's? At first blush, I wouldn't have thought that it was close. But now, maybe they're not so far apart after all.

2) Mullen got 9 total wins out of the 2010 team, which turned out to be tied with 2015 -- and 2017, if you forget about his bolting before the bowl win -- for his second best squad in nine years here. (And of course in 2015, he had exactly the QB he needed to run his system.) But he got it done with an amazing defense, not an intimidating offense. In SEC games, we were 11th (out of 12) in the SEC in scoring offense, 6th in yards per rush, 10th in QB rating, 9th in yards per passing attempt, 11th in completion percentage, 11th in yards per play, and dead last in TD-to-INT ratio (6 TD to 10 INT; yikes). I guess my point here is that another offensive wonderboy that we hired took a little time to get his offense firing on all cylinders even when he had a stout OL, talented and diverse RBs, a hard-nosed running QB that may have been punching above his weight, and an amazing, disruptive defense to lean on.

3) All that said, I too am disappointed that it seems to have taken this long for our current staff to figure out the level at which our QB, O-line, and receivers can execute the passing scheme they've installed. The key now is continuing to develop the passing game as best they can given the talent they've got while figuring out ways to make sure the running game can stay productive. I hope we can against quality defenses. We've been pretty inconsistent on that front in the past (see UGA and AU last year, AU, Bama, LSU in 2016, and, uh, almost everyone in 2015, etc.).

4) But I'll also give a little credit where credit is due. Moorhead's team in year 1 averaged 6.12 YPC against Auburn. With pretty much this exact same offensive roster, Mullen last year got us two yards less per carry (4.13) and with a similar one in 2016, it was even worse (3.12). In fact, in his nine years here, Mullen never got the offense to rush as efficiently against Auburn as Moorhead did this year. Yeah, Auburn is trending down right now, but Mullen played Auburn while they were way up, way down, and everything in between. He didn't get that kind of production in 2012 -- the season that saw Auburn put up a goose egg in SEC play before canning Chizik -- or in any of Auburn's other seasons since 2009. So if Moorhead resorted to running a Mullen-like rushing attack with Fitz a couple of weeks ago -- which I don't think is the case -- it looks like he did it better than Mullen ever did.

Ok. Back to pretending like I'm working.