Carter Stewart

[BrickCityDawgs]

I was able to speak to someone close to the situation and was informed there is a "less than 20% chance" of Stewart attending Mississippi State. The Stewarts do not believe the injury is serious and are focusing on re-entering the draft process as soon as possible after a year in JUCO.

[DawgFromOxford]

Can someone explain why you can go JUCO and be one and done but must remain 3 years (or until you are 21) at a four year school?

[Dawg2003]

I hope they got good advice on the mystery injury. Does a doctor think it’s minor? Something spooked the Braves. Hopefully, the parents and kid aren’t in denial.

[Johnson85]

Yea, something about this just doesn't sound right.

I have trouble seeing what's going to change in one year that would get him back to the same spot in the draft unless the braves were just being ridiculously over cautious. If it is something that can be repaired and/or rehabbed within a year without a lot of risk, that doesn't seem like it would have tanked his signing bonus.

I hope for their sake it's the braves being way over cautious.

[jumbo]

Can someone explain why you can go JUCO and be one and done but must remain 3 years (or until you are 21) at a four year school?


Would like to know this as well

[msudawglb]

I was able to speak to someone close to the situation and was informed there is a "less than 20% chance" of Stewart attending Mississippi State. The Stewarts do not believe the injury is serious and are focusing on re-entering the draft process as soon as possible after a year in JUCO.

Did your source tell you he's 80% headed to Eastern Florida State JUCO?

[Dawg2003]

Yea, something about this just doesn't sound right.

I have trouble seeing what's going to change in one year that would get him back to the same spot in the draft unless the braves were just being ridiculously over cautious. If it is something that can be repaired and/or rehabbed within a year without a lot of risk, that doesn't seem like it would have tanked his signing bonus.

I hope for their sake it's the braves being way over cautious.

Something is definitely off here. The Braves obviously wanted him until the physical. So logically, it makes you think something serious came up on the physical. Something that the Braves felt needed serious rehab or felt would damage his ability to be worth millions. It’s all speculation, but that would be the most obvious conclusion with the information we have. I keep hearing the family doesn’t think the injury is serious, but I have heard anything about an orthopedist saying it isn’t serious. I wonder if they were told he needed surgery or rehab back in April when it happened, and they shrugged it off so he could go ahead with the draft. Or maybe they got some bad advice about the injury. Something to consider, but I hope he does what is appropriate to heal his injury regardless. It would be terrible to lose such a talent.

[Bully13]

I was able to speak to someone close to the situation and was informed there is a "less than 20% chance" of Stewart attending Mississippi State. The Stewarts do not believe the injury is serious and are focusing on re-entering the draft process as soon as possible after a year in JUCO.

Well that sucks. As someone who knows next to nothing about how all this stuff works, I find it hard to believe the Braves would not have a very thorough medical examination of the wrist prior to cutting Stewart's bonus in half. If they felt anywhere near confident that a fast 100% recovery was a certainty, they would not have cut it to the degree they did. I'm of the opinion (which means absolute dick) that there is smoke here on the wrist. He still got offered 1st round $, or at least damned close to it. I'm thinking the Braves got a medical report that says surgery will or may be needed and he will not be 100% for a year or two which takes some value out of him. If this is the case, Stewart's making a mistake thinking he's a one and done at Juco. Just my worthless 2 cents opinion. Of course my biased opinion wants him with us.

[Buddy]

Can someone explain why you can go JUCO and be one and done but must remain 3 years (or until you are 21) at a four year school?

It's just the rules.... don't know why it's that way. Any player that goes JUCO is eligible for the MLB draft after each year as long as they stay in JUCO. If they sign with a D-1 school they have to wait until they've been in school 3 years or until they turn 21... whichever comes first. So, if a kid goes to JUCO for 2 years he could conceivably be drafted about 6 different times (out of HS, after 1st JUCO season, after 2nd JUCO season, after junior year at D1 school, after senior year at D1 school, also another time if redshirted somewhere in there).

[Bully13]

It's just the rules.... don't know why it's that way. Any player that goes JUCO is eligible for the MLB draft after each year as long as they stay in JUCO. If they sign with a D-1 school they have to wait until they've been in school 3 years or until they turn 21... whichever comes first. So, if a kid goes to JUCO for 2 years he could conceivably be drafted about 6 different times (out of HS, after 1st JUCO season, after 2nd JUCO season, after junior year at D1 school, after senior year at D1 school, also another time if redshirted somewhere in there).

I'd be willing to bet these are MLB rules designed to entice / threaten / gain advantage in the negotiations with high school ball players. They want them now instead of later which I think is a shame. 2 yrs of D-1 college experience vs toiling away in the minors a couple of years. I wish MLB would change their way of thinking and look at colleges as a free training ground for their future players. It would be better for the future lives of the players as well who end up not making it to the bigs.

[MarketingBully]

I was able to speak to someone close to the situation and was informed there is a "less than 20% chance" of Stewart attending Mississippi State. The Stewarts do not believe the injury is serious and are focusing on re-entering the draft process as soon as possible after a year in JUCO.

If we end up with Foxhall as our pitching coach and Stewart comes to State, you will be 0-3. Love how you’re hedging your bets here though.

[MarketingBully]

So if it?s something positive for State, you make fun of this guy. But if it?s negative, you believe him. Got it.

[Johnson85]

Something is definitely off here. The Braves obviously wanted him until the physical. So logically, it makes you think something serious came up on the physical. Something that the Braves felt needed serious rehab or felt would damage his ability to be worth millions. It’s all speculation, but that would be the most obvious conclusion with the information we have. I keep hearing the family doesn’t think the injury is serious, but I have heard anything about an orthopedist saying it isn’t serious. I wonder if they were told he needed surgery or rehab back in April when it happened, and they shrugged it off so he could go ahead with the draft. Or maybe they got some bad advice about the injury. Something to consider, but I hope he does what is appropriate to heal his injury regardless. It would be terrible to lose such a talent.

The more I think about it, it actually doesn't require the braves to be that concerned for them to lowball Stewart so hard. As long as they offer 40% of slot (or whatever the minimum is), they aren't really punished because of the compensatory pick next year. They basically lose out on a year of services of a 1st round draft pick. But if you look at the likelihood of them coming back and drafting a college JR, they arguably aren't losing anything. So why put $4.8M on the line for somebody with an injury concern. They can offer ~$2M, and if he takes it, they just got an awesome deal (except maybe one with some ill will built up for later). If he doesn't, they get to be in basically the same position next year and hopefully will have somebody without any injury concerns.

So maybe the braves just don't see any reason for them to take much risk with the injury.

[msstate7]

The more I think about it, it actually doesn't require the braves to be that concerned for them to lowball Stewart so hard. As long as they offer 40% of slot (or whatever the minimum is), they aren't really punished because of the compensatory pick next year. They basically lose out on a year of services of a 1st round draft pick. But if you look at the likelihood of them coming back and drafting a college JR, they arguably aren't losing anything. So why put $4.8M on the line for somebody with an injury concern. They can offer ~$2M, and if he takes it, they just got an awesome deal (except maybe one with some ill will built up for later). If he doesn't, they get to be in basically the same position next year and hopefully will have somebody without any injury concerns.

So maybe the braves just don't see any reason for them to take much risk with the injury.

The braves lost any shot at signing hess too though by not signing Stewart. Next season, the braves get the pick at 9 now, but pretty sure the amount of money they can spend in early rounds is the same. So getting 2 really good players in the 1st round will be tough.

This was the first pick for the braves' brand new GM. I don't think there is any way he took Stewart with the idea he might not sign him. I think right or wrong, the braves are clearly concerned over the wrist

[maroonmania]

I found this chronology on Stewart rather interesting.

https://www.talkingchop.com/2018/7/9/17545928/a-chronology-of-what-happened-with-carter-stewart-and-atlanta-braves

[mparkerfd20]

I'm even more convinced now that Stewart will never play in the Maroon and White. He simply doesn't want to be here.

[BoomBoom]

The more I think about it, it actually doesn't require the braves to be that concerned for them to lowball Stewart so hard. As long as they offer 40% of slot (or whatever the minimum is), they aren't really punished because of the compensatory pick next year. They basically lose out on a year of services of a 1st round draft pick. But if you look at the likelihood of them coming back and drafting a college JR, they arguably aren't losing anything. So why put $4.8M on the line for somebody with an injury concern. They can offer ~$2M, and if he takes it, they just got an awesome deal (except maybe one with some ill will built up for later). If he doesn't, they get to be in basically the same position next year and hopefully will have somebody without any injury concerns.

So maybe the braves just don't see any reason for them to take much risk with the injury.

Exactly. That has been AA's MO. Any risk comes up in the physical on these high priced top picks, ditch them and take your comp pick next year. Add to that that this pick is protected should they sign a FA, and that they are struggling to come up with $$ for trade deals to help this year's team, and the deck was stacked against Stewart from the beginning.

[MarketingBully]

I found this chronology on Stewart rather interesting.

https://www.talkingchop.com/2018/7/9/17545928/a-chronology-of-what-happened-with-carter-stewart-and-atlanta-braves

It?s interesting but I don?t know if I trust Matt Powers? sources. He already admitted in that article he made up the JUCO name.

[deadheaddawg]

I have a source that gives us a 34% chance

[MarketingBully]

And here’s Powers’ latest tweet which seems to be backing off the JUCO statement he claimed with 100% certainty. Lol.

Matt Powers Tweet

Haven’t heard anything new since the weekend. Know he was really looking JUCO, which has been picked up by others as well but it may not be the final decision. Probably the kind of thing that needs some time after the initial not signing sets in and the real decision making comes

[Todd4State]

And here’s Powers’ latest tweet which seems to be backing off the JUCO statement he claimed with 100% certainty. Lol.

Matt Powers Tweet

Haven’t heard anything new since the weekend. Know he was really looking JUCO, which has been picked up by others as well but it may not be the final decision. Probably the kind of thing that needs some time after the initial not signing sets in and the real decision making comes

Powers was literally the only one reporting JUCO- and most of the "other" people reporting it were going off of his report. The fact that he is a reporter making what amounts to an educated guess as to what JUCO Stewart would even go to tells me everything I need to know. Of course then there were the reputable media people wondering where the hell the JUCO rumors were coming from which was also a dead giveaway.

Powers is either wrong or going to have a blind squirrel finds a nut moment. All around pretty irresponsible reporting no matter how it turns out.

[BiscuitEater]

Exactly. That has been AA's MO. Any risk comes up in the physical on these high priced top picks, ditch them and take your comp pick next year. Add to that that this pick is protected should they sign a FA, and that they are struggling to come up with $$ for trade deals to help this year's team, and the deck was stacked against Stewart from the beginning.

Nope. Braves have signed EVERY 1st round pick since ~ '95. Hopefully, Stewart doesn't make a choice until we get a pitching coach.

[BiscuitEater]

The more I think about it, it actually doesn't require the braves to be that concerned for them to lowball Stewart so hard. As long as they offer 40% of slot (or whatever the minimum is), they aren't really punished because of the compensatory pick next year.

NO team drafts a player .. unless they are relatively sure they can sign them. There were 30 first round picks .. 27/30 (90%) signed.

THREE didn't sign ..

Atlanta Braves - no. 8 RHP Carter Stewart
Arizona Diamondbacks - no. 25 SS Matt McLain
Los Angeles Dodgers - no. 30 RHP J.T. Ginn

McLain is headed to UCLA, while Stewart and Ginn will join Mississippi State's roster.

[RocketCityDawg]

Nope. Braves have signed EVERY 1st round pick since ~ '95. Hopefully, Stewart doesn't make a choice until we get a pitching coach.

This is AA's first draft as GM of the Braves. So, what the Braves have done in the past is irrelevant to AA's MO.

[Johnson85]

The braves lost any shot at signing hess too though by not signing Stewart. Next season, the braves get the pick at 9 now, but pretty sure the amount of money they can spend in early rounds is the same. So getting 2 really good players in the 1st round will be tough.

This was the first pick for the braves' brand new GM. I don't think there is any way he took Stewart with the idea he might not sign him. I think right or wrong, the braves are clearly concerned over the wrist

Think this is wrong. Based on what someone else has said without a source, but I think they have to be right because I can't believe the team owners would sign on to a system where they essentially lose a draft pick when they don't sign. Just way too much leverage for the players. I also don't think an organization like the dodgers would take a flyer on Ginn if their comp pick next year didn't come with money to allow them to actually sign the comp pick (either by adding to their pool or by excluding teh comp pick contract from the pool and applying a different limit).

[BiscuitEater]

This is AA's first draft as GM of the Braves. So, what the Braves have done in the past is irrelevant to AA's MO.

AND, that could've been his LAST draft! Braves front office is NOT happy about BOTH Stewart and Hess.

[msstate7]

Think this is wrong. Based on what someone else has said without a source, but I think they have to be right because I can't believe the team owners would sign on to a system where they essentially lose a draft pick when they don't sign. Just way too much leverage for the players. I also don't think an organization like the dodgers would take a flyer on Ginn if their comp pick next year didn't come with money to allow them to actually sign the comp pick (either by adding to their pool or by excluding teh comp pick contract from the pool and applying a different limit).

Could be. I just asked the question on a braves' board I'm a member of. There are some mlb rule savants there, so should have a clear answer soon.

If there is no more money though, it would just require drafting college seniors for a majority of the 5-10 round picks

[ShotgunDawg]

AND, that could've been his LAST draft! Braves front office is NOT happy about BOTH Stewart and Hess.

AA is the front office. What do you mean that could be his last draft?

AA has a history of this. He did the same thing with Tyler Beede when he was in Toronto

[msstate7]

Think this is wrong. Based on what someone else has said without a source, but I think they have to be right because I can't believe the team owners would sign on to a system where they essentially lose a draft pick when they don't sign. Just way too much leverage for the players. I also don't think an organization like the dodgers would take a flyer on Ginn if their comp pick next year didn't come with money to allow them to actually sign the comp pick (either by adding to their pool or by excluding teh comp pick contract from the pool and applying a different limit).

"So take the Braves pool from this year, add something like the money for the 22nd pick plus third round pick in same range. So maybe something like 10.5-11 million in the pool pending whatever happens with comp picks. That'd be about the fourth or fifth largest pool probably."
....

Apparently, you're correct. This is the answer I got. 22nd pick is guess as to where the braves will pick next season. 3rd round pick is added in bc it was taken by mlb this season

[Tbonewannabe]

AND, that could've been his LAST draft! Braves front office is NOT happy about BOTH Stewart and Hess.

I don't understand why they didn't offer whatever they needed to get Stewart and Hess. If you get Hess basically with a free pick then it is worth it taking a flyer on Stewart rehabbing. Unless they think the Stewart injury could be career threatening.

[PSYCHO(thesis)DEFENSE]

just wondering out loud. if he goes juco then has an injury setback or bad year and isn't satisfied with where he gets drafted next year could he decide to transfer to MSU and come out in the next draft (2 years college) since he took the juco route or would he then have to follow the must-be 21 rule (3 years college) since he'd be playing division 1.

[bostondawg]

just wondering out loud. if he goes juco then has an injury setback or bad year and isn't satisfied with where he gets drafted next year could he decide to transfer to MSU and come out in the next draft (2 years college) since he took the juco route or would he then have to follow the must-be 21 rule (3 years college) since he'd be playing division 1.

I believe he could stay in juco for a second year and go to the draft, or transfer to any D1 school and go out after year 3.

[dickiedawg]

Please don?t let this be the first thing this guy is right about...

[Todd4State]

just wondering out loud. if he goes juco then has an injury setback or bad year and isn't satisfied with where he gets drafted next year could he decide to transfer to MSU and come out in the next draft (2 years college) since he took the juco route or would he then have to follow the must-be 21 rule (3 years college) since he'd be playing division 1.

He could but if he gets hurt I bet he gets a lot less than 2 million if he gets drafted out of JUCO.

[BoomBoom]

"So take the Braves pool from this year, add something like the money for the 22nd pick plus third round pick in same range. So maybe something like 10.5-11 million in the pool pending whatever happens with comp picks. That'd be about the fourth or fifth largest pool probably."
....

Apparently, you're correct. This is the answer I got. 22nd pick is guess as to where the braves will pick next season. 3rd round pick is added in bc it was taken by mlb this season

i've always heard your bonus pool is the sum of the slot value of your picks in the 1st 10 rounds. add 5% because no penalties until you go over that (or none that anyone cares about). go over that and you lose a pick the next year i think. also any amount you spend in the later rounds above $100K i think counts against your pool as well, even though you get no pool value for those picks. but you can't save against the pool for cheap signings in those rounds.

[msstate7]

i've always heard your bonus pool is the sum of the slot value of your picks in the 1st 10 rounds. add 5% because no penalties until you go over that (or none that anyone cares about). go over that and you lose a pick the next year i think. also any amount you spend in the later rounds above $100K i think counts against your pool as well, even though you get no pool value for those picks. but you can't save against the pool for cheap signings in those rounds.

You could be correct. I've given up trying to keep up with the rules of mlb off the field

[MarketingBully]

i've always heard your bonus pool is the sum of the slot value of your picks in the 1st 10 rounds. add 5% because no penalties until you go over that (or none that anyone cares about). go over that and you lose a pick the next year i think. also any amount you spend in the later rounds above $100K i think counts against your pool as well, even though you get no pool value for those picks. but you can't save against the pool for cheap signings in those rounds.

This is correct.

[Homedawg]

This is correct.

Except the number is 125 not 100. Otherwise, yes this is correct.

[Tbonewannabe]

Except the number is 125 not 100. Otherwise, yes this is correct.

How did that work with Bryce Bush? 33rd round signed for almost $300k

[CoachT14]

He could but if he gets hurt I bet he gets a lot less than 2 million if he gets drafted out of JUCO.

Probably won’t matter the way this pitching coach hire is currently trending.

[Homedawg]

How did that work with Bryce Bush? 33rd round signed for almost $300k

They had leftover cash from the pool.

[Tbonewannabe]

They had leftover cash from the pool.

Is that a lot of cash to have left over or is that normal? You would think the signing bonus at that point is like $10k if that.

[Cooterpoot]

Would be nice to have Stewart with Ashcraft leaving now.

[Homedawg]

Would be nice to have Stewart with Ashcraft leaving now.

I’m sure Ashcroft had his scholarship pulled. Nature of the beast Can’t sit around w money on a guy who hasn’t pitched in 2 years. And don’t blame him for leaving either.

[msstate7]

Would be nice to have Stewart.

You could've ended it there. Carter would be the most talented pitcher on our roster day 1

[Bully13]

You could've ended it there. Carter would be the most talented pitcher on our roster day 1

Does the Brave's medical report on his wrist contradict your statement here? Isn't there a chance he's gonna a year of re-hab before he's 100%?

Also, are we gonna have to wait until late Aug before we know where he's heading? or has that already been determined?

[msstate7]

Does the Brave's medical report on his wrist contradict your statement here? Isn't there a chance he's gonna a year of re-hab before he's 100%?

Also, are we gonna have to wait until late Aug before we know where he's heading? or has that already been determined?

Good questions that I can't answer, except the first one. Stewart, even if he has to sit out a year, would still be the most talented pitcher we have day 1.

[Bully13]

Good questions that I can't answer, except the first one. Stewart, even if he has to sit out a year, would still be the most talented pitcher we have day 1.

Gotcha. in other words "day 1" is the day he's ready to suit up and throw. whether that's Feb 2019 or later.

[msstate7]

Gotcha. in other words "day 1" is the day he's ready to suit up and throw. whether that's Feb 2019 or later.

Correct. Bad wording on my part

[BoomBoom]

Is that a lot of cash to have left over or is that normal? You would think the signing bonus at that point is like $10k if that.

it's normal to sign a few players over the slot. could be early round guys.....may be late round guys. paid for by signing a few guys under slot, usually college seniors in rounds 5-10 that sign for $10k. it's all part of the strategery.

[Tbonewannabe]

it's normal to sign a few players over the slot. could be early round guys.....may be late round guys. paid for by signing a few guys under slot, usually college seniors in rounds 5-10 that sign for $10k. it's all part of the strategery.

I was just wondering if it was normal for a guy in that late of a round to sign for almost $300k. I know the White Sox saved something like $50-70k on Pilk. I wasn't sure how they could use that money, if it had to be used in the top 10 rounds. All that signing bonus pool money is just confusing.

[maroonmania]

I was just wondering if it was normal for a guy in that late of a round to sign for almost $300k. I know the White Sox saved something like $50-70k on Pilk. I wasn't sure how they could use that money, if it had to be used in the top 10 rounds. All that signing bonus pool money is just confusing.

Yes, it is unusual. 300K would normally be 5th round draft pick money.