I Hate Our Basketball Program

[ShotgunDawg]

I?m no basketball fan (thanks to the purists that insist that everything is a foul. It?s unwatchable to me) but nonetheless I gave today a chance.

I don?t know much about basketball, but it?s pretty easy to see that over half our team are clowns, lack any semblance of mental toughness, can?t shoot, and simply have egregious errors in concentration that other teams don?t appear to have.

Additionally, all our guys seem to have bad hands and it?s easy to see within 2 minutes of watching us that our ball movement is elementary compared to virtually every team we play. However, have no clue if we lack ball movement due to poor coaching or having a roster full of Joe Morrows.

In any event, i have no clue what the problem is or where to start in fixing it but the product on the floor, the players act on twitter, and the mental makeup of this program is unbecoming of what I expect to represent our great university. It?s like we have team full of rich kid brats that don?t respect anyone or take any coaching or accountability whatsoever.

I bet Victoria and Tiera would whip half this roster?s ass. Softer than tissue paper and you can?t blame AAU. Every team has AAU players.

Whatever culture our football team and women?s basketball team has, this program has the opposite. Just a cesspool of premadonnas.

[Quaoarsking]

Fair enough, but it's not nearly as unlikable as it was 7-8 years ago.

[BayouDawg]

Like I said in the other thread, I?d prefer getting an elite X?s and O?s coach instead of an elite recruiter next go round. You can have good success in basketball by just being fundamentally sound.

[civildawg]

Coaching means more in basketball in my opinion. See butler, Xavier, and other schools that constantly are winning in the tournament

[BayouDawg]

Coaching means more in basketball in my opinion. See butler, Xavier, and other schools that constantly are winning in the tournament

This all day. Hell look at Wisconsin. They put out the undefeated Kentucky a few years ago. They didn?t have near the amount of raw talent or recruiting stars as big blue. They had better coaching and better basketball IQ though.

[ShotgunDawg]

Coaching means more in basketball in my opinion. See butler, Xavier, and other schools that constantly are winning in the tournament

Yeah but those kids come from higher basketball IQ regions. The Midwest and East coach for basketball is what Southern Cal or Florida is to baseball. The kids are better coached and have higher baseball IQ.

[MarketingBully]

It also helps when Auburn got to shoot 20-23 freethrows during their run. Thought we played well until the refs took over and called fouls on us while let Auburn foul everytime on our drives. If that game is even called neutral down the stretch we still win the game by five.

[Goldendawg]

And stop blaming the fans that refuse to drive hrs and shell out good $ to watch this inferior product. I admire the season ticket holders who pay good $ to support this MSU "program" and try to keep it from being a total financial loss (may be for all I know), whether they show up or not. The late Bill Veek couldn't think of enough promotions to fill the Hump to get people to watch this poor display of a "team" sport.

[ShotgunDawg]

This all day. Hell look at Wisconsin. They put out the undefeated Kentucky a few years ago. They didn?t have near the amount of raw talent or recruiting stars as big blue. They had better coaching and better basketball IQ though.

Well, if we can get Wisconsin, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio, etc high school coaching and youth programs around here, we may have a chance of winning with that type of recruiting.

[ShotgunDawg]

It also helps when Auburn got to shoot 20-23 freethrows during their run. Thought we played well until the refs took over and called fouls on us while let Auburn foul everytime on our drives. If that game is even called neutral down the stretch we still win the game by five.

Eh. I’m looking more at the body language, fundamentals, and 30,000 ft view of the program. Us wining or losing today is irrelevant.

[BayouDawg]

Yeah but those kids come from higher basketball IQ regions. The Midwest and East coach for basketball is what Southern Cal or Florida is to baseball. The kids are better coached and have higher baseball IQ.

This is also true. That?s why Butler has had so much success. Indiana produces some of the best pure basketball players. But we could still get a solid Coach that at least knows how to assemble a basic offensive game plan. Randy Kennedy even knows how to do that. Sure it?s just jack up as many shots as possible but he has one and he damn sure sticks to it.

[Goldendawg]

It also helps when Auburn got to shoot 20-23 freethrows during their run. Thought we played well until the refs took over and called fouls on us while let Auburn foul everytime on our drives. If that game is even called neutral down the stretch we still win the game by five.

So the refs hate us on the road and at home? This group of players and coaches have many more issues to address than just that. JMO.

[Activated Alpha]

I totally blank out basketball season. We aren't good and won't be "next year." Can't wait for baseball to start

[ShotgunDawg]

See. Complete lack of culture.

It’s amazing to me that these players have such a lack of respect for their coaching staff or our university to behave this way.

Again, the entire program is embarrassing. This doesn’t happen in legit programs.

https://twitter.com/headshotpeters_/status/952311926033473536

[Liverpooldawg]

Fair enough, but it's not nearly as unlikable as it was 7-8 years ago.

YeAh, 20 wins was unlikable alll right. This collection of individuals, I'm not using the word team to describe them for now, is totally clueless on the offensive end. We have players that are regressing from year to year. It's just down right painful to watch.

[Goldendawg]

I totally blank out basketball season. We aren't good and won't be "next year." Can't wait for baseball to start

Maybe Perry and other new comers can help, along with some current players being processed, but then we would be "young" again. Maybe some coaches need to be processes as well. What do I know, I quit my Sr year in HS in '73 because I was the 6th man instead of a starter! I do know this is a disgusting example of team BB.

[BayouDawg]

YeAh, 20 wins was unlikable alll right. This collection of individuals, I'm not using the word team to describe them for now, is totally clueless on the offensive end. We have players that are regressing from year to year. It's just down right painful to watch.

You still think Stans shares no blame in this? You take up for a man that allowed rampant drug usage and fights in the locker room and on national television? Hell Rayvern Johnson was high in every game he played for us. If you take up for stans you?re not pro MSU at all.

[sonofozarka]

You still think Stans shares no blame in this? You take up for a man that allowed rampant drug usage and fights in the locker room and on national television? Hell Rayvern Johnson was high in every game he played for us. If you take up for stans you?re not pro MSU at all.

Good lord are you guys still doing this? He didn't even bring Stans up but you twist it into blaming Stans for the state of our program SIX YEARS LATER?

Stans ain't got nothing to do with where MSU is now and if anything, what's going on now should make you finally appreciate what going to an NCAA tournament and being a top 5 team in the SEC year in year out is like.

Even in the "bad" Stans years we were disappointed with a 1 seed in the NIT. 6 years later and we can't get on the CBI bubble for christ's sake. But you guys won't ever cop to that viewpoint because it would make you wrong about everything you posted on a dumbass message board for a decade

[Goldendawg]

Good lord are you guys still doing this? He didn't even bring Stans up but you twist it into blaming Stans for the state of our program SIX YEARS LATER?

Stans ain't got nothing to do with where MSU is now and if anything, what's going on now should make you finally appreciate what going to an NCAA tournament and being a top 5 team in the SEC year in year out is like.

Even in the "bad" Stans years we were disappointed with a 1 seed in the NIT. 6 years later and we can't get on the CBI bubble for christ's sake. But you guys won't ever cop to that viewpoint because it would make you wrong about everything you posted on a dumbass message board for a decade

Planning on getting Rodney, "can't we all just get along", King as motivational speaker to help cure old wounds among several Elite Dawgs asap!*** Hail State!

[MaroonFlounder]

You still think Stans shares no blame in this? You take up for a man that allowed rampant drug usage and fights in the locker room and on national television? Hell Rayvern Johnson was high in every game he played for us. If you take up for stans you?re not pro MSU at all.

Wow. I didn’t know Rayvern was playing while high.

[Liverpooldawg]

You still think Stans shares no blame in this? You take up for a man that allowed rampant drug usage and fights in the locker room and on national television? Hell Rayvern Johnson was high in every game he played for us. If you take up for stans you?re not pro MSU at all.

Dude, what we are putting on the court is Embarrassing. Some of you guys let your hatred of one man mKe you blind when it comes to basketball and actual records. For the record I do NOT want Stans back. That's water under the bridge. I think we are going to have to go through a few more coaches before we get back to where he had us on the court though.

[Liverpooldawg]

Good lord are you guys still doing this? He didn't even bring Stans up but you twist it into blaming Stans for the state of our program SIX YEARS LATER?

Stans ain't got nothing to do with where MSU is now and if anything, what's going on now should make you finally appreciate what going to an NCAA tournament and being a top 5 team in the SEC year in year out is like.

Even in the "bad" Stans years we were disappointed with a 1 seed in the NIT. 6 years later and we can't get on the CBI bubble for christ's sake. But you guys won't ever cop to that viewpoint because it would make you wrong about everything you posted on a dumbass message board for a decade

Excellent post.

[BayouDawg]

Good lord are you guys still doing this? He didn't even bring Stans up but you twist it into blaming Stans for the state of our program SIX YEARS LATER?

Stans ain't got nothing to do with where MSU is now and if anything, what's going on now should make you finally appreciate what going to an NCAA tournament and being a top 5 team in the SEC year in year out is like.

Even in the "bad" Stans years we were disappointed with a 1 seed in the NIT. 6 years later and we can't get on the CBI bubble for christ's sake. But you guys won't ever cop to that viewpoint because it would make you wrong about everything you posted on a dumbass message board for a decade

What am I wrong about? The inmates were running the asylum when stans retired. We still kept him on the payroll with an office job for the next 3 Years. What coach was going to take over that dumpster fire with the guy who sunk still in the athletic office? Again what am I wrong about?

[Liverpooldawg]

What am I wrong about? The inmates were running the asylum when stans retired. We still kept him on the payroll with an office job for the next 3 Years. What coach was going to take over that dumpster fire with the guy who sunk still in the athletic office? Again what am I wrong about?

And the results were better than what we have now.

[BayouDawg]

And the results were better than what we have now.

So we should have kept that drug ridden culture? Where the best we could hope for was an 8 seed in the tournament and the worst was players fighting in the stands on national tv. Yea you really know what you?re talking about. Having that kind of embarrassing culture was not worth it to me for a ncaa appearance every 3 Years. Now throw in a natty and it may have been more tempting.

[Liverpooldawg]

So we should have kept that drug ridden culture? Where the best we could hope for was an 8 seed in the tournament and the worst was players fighting in the stands on national tv. Yea you really know what you?re talking about. Having that kind of embarrassing culture was not worth it to me for a ncaa appearance every 3 Years. Now throw in a natty and it may have been more tempting.

I'd be ecstatic with an 8 seed at this point. . In case you haven't noticed our "culture" ain't that good right now either. If there was a Fulmar Cup in basketball we would be a contender this year.

[BayouDawg]

I'd be ecstatic with an 8 seed at this point. . In case you haven't noticed our "culture" ain't that good right now either. If there was a Fulmar Cup in basketball we would be a contender this year.

Have we had players fighting in the stands on national tv? Do we have a morbidly obese center that the coach doesn?t make him work out and the announcers make fun of us on national tv every game about it?

We have a coaching problem right now. If you liked the thuggery we had in stans last 4 years then there?s no helping you. You?re part of the problem.

[BankerDog]

If you're making fun about the drug use under Stans then you'll be shocked by the stuff Cohen and Mullen had going on. I know a certain player or two who were high during the Natty against UCLA. There are a lot of things you don't or need to know. But casting out one guy for his teams when every other team in the nation is the exact same is ridiculous.

[Liverpooldawg]

Have we had players fighting in the stands on national tv? Do we have a morbidly obese center that the coach doesn?t make him work out and the announcers make fun of us on national tv every game about it?

We have a coaching problem right now. If you liked the thuggery we had in stans last 4 years then there?s no helping you. You?re part of the problem.

Nobody except us remembered or cared the day after that happened. People like you hated Stans prior to that, it was just more ammo. What we are putting on the court has been embarrassing right now. They obviously have no clue what to do in offense. Most players are regressing from year to year. I'm tired of hating to go to or watch one of our games. I don't think there is a solution. We are done for a while.

[Liverpooldawg]

If you're making fun about the drug use under Stans then you'll be shocked by the stuff Cohen and Mullen had going on. I know a certain player or two who were high during the Natty against UCLA. There are a lot of things you don't or need to know. But casting out one guy for his teams when every other team in the nation is the exact same is ridiculous.
Yep. He actually thinks it's better now, lol.

[BayouDawg]

If you're making fun about the drug use under Stans then you'll be shocked by the stuff Cohen and Mullen had going on. I know a certain player or two who were high during the Natty against UCLA. There are a lot of things you don't or need to know. But casting out one guy for his teams when every other team in the nation is the exact same is ridiculous.

Again I was very involved with the basketball team when I was a student at state. 2010-2013. This wasn?t your run of the mill college players doing recreational drugs. Stories that would make your skin crawl. But on top of hay stans made up for it by not practicing but maybe once a week. Before the tennessee game in 2012 we didn?t have a team practice that whole week. We won the game because Tennessee was horrible that year. And do you remember how out of shape our players were?
Yea I?m sure every program in the nation does things like that***

[BayouDawg]

Nobody except us remembered or cared the day after that happened. People like you hated Stans prior to that, it was just more ammo. What we are putting on the court has been embarrassing right now. They obviously have no clue what to do in offense. Most players are regressing from year to year. I'm tired of hating to go to or watch one of our games. I don't think there is a solution. We are done for a while.

You?re right I did want stans gone before that. Our players were out of shape we had no discipline and he made up for it by not being a great court coach.
It seemed like stans really went down hill after the 2007-2008 season. He got away from what he built the program on which was defense and rebounding. We went to a more finesse style and then discipline disappeared.

[BankerDog]

Again I was very involved with the basketball team when I was a student at state. 2010-2013. This wasn?t your run of the mill college players doing recreational drugs. Stories that would make your skin crawl. But on top of hay stans made up for it by not practicing but maybe once a week. Before the tennessee game in 2012 we didn?t have a team practice that whole week. We won the game because Tennessee was horrible that year. And do you remember how out of shape our players were?
Yea I?m sure every program in the nation does things like that***

So you were there during '13? So you should know about some of the baseball team and their deals. Since you're also just a few years older than me, you should also know some other stories about other sports, which I am not putting out here, and know this isn't your typical weed we're talking about.

I also know some frats that were providing for the team (Wendell and Dee).

I'm not saying our S&C was awesome. I'm just saying you can't single out the drug use because things have gotten a lot better out of Starkville on keeping things quite then what it use to be. And it's all programs.

[BayouDawg]

So you were there during '13? So you should know about some of the baseball team and their deals. Since you're also just a few years older than me, you should also know some other stories about other sports, which I am not putting out here, and know this isn't your typical weed we're talking about.

I also know some frats that were providing for the team (Wendell and Dee).

I'm not saying our S&C was awesome. I'm just saying you can't single out the drug use because things have gotten a lot better out of Starkville on keeping things quite then what it use to be. And it's all programs.

Again i?ll say it was not normal college kid shenanigans. This was a problem and it wasn?t just Sidney although he was a large part of it. Our little back up point guard in 2011 made the 9th Ward look tame with the stuff he was in to. Why do you think our basketball team was so out of shape?

[MaroonFlounder]

Yeah, I’m gonna call bullshit on the extreme drug use. Sorry.

[Percho]

Again I was very involved with the basketball team when I was a student at state. 2010-2013. This wasn?t your run of the mill college players doing recreational drugs. Stories that would make your skin crawl. But on top of hay stans made up for it by not practicing but maybe once a week. Before the tennessee game in 2012 we didn?t have a team practice that whole week. We won the game because Tennessee was horrible that year. And do you remember how out of shape our players were?
Yea I?m sure every program in the nation does things like that***

That was the last time we won more than we lost. 21 and 12 I think

[Liverpooldawg]

Until we quit blaming Stans, and he has been gone for what, six years now,we will never progress in men's basketball. We are still at year zero, and will remain there for the foreseeable future.WE as a fan base SUCK.

[BayouDawg]

Yeah, I’m gonna call bullshit on the extreme drug use. Sorry.

K

[BayouDawg]

Until we quit blaming Stans, and he has been gone for what, six years now,we will never progress in men's basketball. We are still at year zero, and will remain there for the foreseeable future.WE as a fan base SUCK.

I actually blame strick more than stans. But you?re right it?s time to move on. Maybe Howland can get it right. I lost what little faith I had left in him today though.

[sonofozarka]

What am I wrong about? The inmates were running the asylum when stans retired. We still kept him on the payroll with an office job for the next 3 Years. What coach was going to take over that dumpster fire with the guy who sunk still in the athletic office? Again what am I wrong about?

Well... everything.

College kids smoke weed, multiple Saban players get arrested frequently for it, but I don't hear people calling them an undisciplined program.

But acting as if NO ONE wanted to take over a program because kids smoked weed (and all of those guys would be gone in one year anyway) is just dumb. Probably time to take a break from posting, maybe go smoke some weed.

Regardless, I could give 2 shits about all you random msg board posters w your "inside info" on guys being on drugs, the team not practicing (which is also likely not true), or your perception of our strength and conditioning. All that matters to me is the ****ing bottom line, winning and losing. And the bottom line is we were much better almost every year of Stans tenure than we've been EVERY YEAR since he's been gone, and that's all that matters.

You and todd4state can shove your pep band flutes up your ass

[Liverpooldawg]

I actually blame strick more than stans. But you?re right it?s time to move on. Maybe Howland can get it right. I lost what little faith I had left in him today though.

Strict? I despise loafers but on that hire he did all he could do. My source on that is IMPECCABLE. The fact is we committed program suicide with how we handled Stans. The only thing that compares to it at MSU is what we did to Allyn McKeen.

[Goldendawg]

"Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it", or so they say. BTW, on looking there to rehire, Ron Polk says good idea. This bunch of individuals must learn to play team ball with a set rotation of starters and supportive role players who can contribute or this will be another long season.

[BayouDawg]

Strict? I despise loafers but on that hire he did all he could do. My source on that is IMPECCABLE. The fact is we committed program suicide with how we handled Stans. The only thing that compares to it at MSU is what we did to Allyn McKeen.

I?ll say this. I loved Stansbury. He gave us 9 great years. His last 5 something changed. He got away from what he built our program around. Our identify was defense and rebounding and being physical. About 2009 or 2010 he started to move to a more finesse style and it was never the same then discipline went down the tube and it was just a mess. It was time for a change but the whole administration and Stansbury could?ve all done better in their part.

[BayouDawg]

Well... everything.

College kids smoke weed, multiple Saban players get arrested frequently for it, but I don't hear people calling them an undisciplined program.

But acting as if NO ONE wanted to take over a program because kids smoked weed (and all of those guys would be gone in one year anyway) is just dumb. Probably time to take a break from posting, maybe go smoke some weed.

Regardless, I could give 2 shits about all you random msg board posters w your "inside info" on guys being on drugs, the team not practicing (which is also likely not true), or your perception of our strength and conditioning. All that matters to me is the ****ing bottom line, winning and losing. And the bottom line is we were much better almost every year of Stans tenure than we've been EVERY YEAR since he's been gone, and that's all that matters.

You and todd4state can shove your pep band flutes up your ass

Yea our strength and conditioning were amazing under stans. Sidney was in amazing shape. The bottom line is it was time for a change. And I wish it was just weed that was happening with our players. That?s not even a hard core drug. Stans let the program get away from him his last 4 or 5 years. Don?t get your panties in such a wad man. It?s pretty common knowledge we?d go a week or between practices towards the end of his tenure.

[Todd4State]

Well... everything.

College kids smoke weed, multiple Saban players get arrested frequently for it, but I don't hear people calling them an undisciplined program.

But acting as if NO ONE wanted to take over a program because kids smoked weed (and all of those guys would be gone in one year anyway) is just dumb. Probably time to take a break from posting, maybe go smoke some weed.

Regardless, I could give 2 shits about all you random msg board posters w your "inside info" on guys being on drugs, the team not practicing (which is also likely not true), or your perception of our strength and conditioning. All that matters to me is the ****ing bottom line, winning and losing. And the bottom line is we were much better almost every year of Stans tenure than we've been EVERY YEAR since he's been gone, and that's all that matters.

You and todd4state can shove your pep band flutes up your ass

Did I trigger you?

And by the way- I'm sorry Stansbury had to go. The bottom was about to fall out had we kept him. I'm not a Stansbury hater- but the fact of the matter is he was the coach over one of the most embarrassing incidents in MSU sports history with the Renardo Sidney and Elgin fight in Hawaii. Anyone that thinks that Stansbury should come back or should have stayed has no clue.

The problem is we hired Rick Ray who was in over his head. We'll see if Howland can turn it around.

And part of the problem with MSU basketball is the exact SAME problem MSU baseball had under Polk. Let's keep a sacred cow coach and not be willing to change and while we're at it let's let the vocal cronies try to do everythign that they can to sabotage the program to try to teach the progressive youngin's how good things were.

So, respectfully- shove that up your ass.