Slive rule

[preachermatt83]

We will find out for sure this season if this unwritten rule is still in effect. My guess is that it is. There will be more sec hc jobs open this season than ever before. If no current SEC hc jumps to another sec program will we all be in agreement that the Slive rule is real?

[Political Hack]

The rule is real. It's a question of whether a new administration will continue to enforce it.

[TStationDawg]

well....if it is real.....and not "enforced" by the new admin, doesn't that, in fact, mean it's not real?

[chainedup_Dawg]

I'm not real sure what to think of the whole "unwritten rule" thing. I mean, if it were really a thing and schools/coaches/ADs, etc. were told that SEC programs would not be poaching other SEC coaches, it seems to me someone would've made reference to it by now like a coach, agent, AD, someone. Maybe I'm over thinking, I don't know.

With that being said, Mullen isn't going to FL and if he hated the way he was treated in FL he damn sure wouldn't go to TN either. I grew up and lived most of my life in TN, those people are insane.

[Political Hack]

well....if it is real.....and not "enforced" by the new admin, doesn't that, in fact, mean it's not real?

Nope. It's not a bylaw. Otherwise it would be in writing and well known to all the idiot media members that continue to spew "SEC coach A" is moving to "SEC school b" next year. After two decades of being wrong, you think they'd pick up on it.

[MrKotter]

Nope. It's not a bylaw. Otherwise it would be in writing and well known to all the idiot media members that continue to spew "SEC coach A" is moving to "SEC school b" next year. After two decades of being wrong, you think they'd pick up on it.
You would think some on this board would pick up on it by now too

[Drugdog]

Nope. It's not a bylaw. Otherwise it would be in writing and well known to all the idiot media members that continue to spew "SEC coach A" is moving to "SEC school b" next year. After two decades of being wrong, you think they'd pick up on it.

I don't believe you need much talent to be a media person. Have an agenda and a microphone.

[RiverCityDawg]

We will find out for sure this season if this unwritten rule is still in effect. My guess is that it is. There will be more sec hc jobs open this season than ever before. If no current SEC hc jumps to another sec program will we all be in agreement that the Slive rule is real?

No. If we assume Mullen stays put, what other SEC coach would we see moving in order to prove the rule is real? No one would want any of the others except Saban and Smart and they aren't going anywhere.

[ShotgunDawg]

While I agree with the rule in general, the pushback on the rule will be using examples like James Franklin to show that the SEC can’t afford to lose quality coaches because they weren’t allowed to take another SEC job.

[RocketDawg]

Not sure it's a "rule" per se, but more of a gentleman's agreement to be courteous to one another. The level of animosity between schools doesn't even approach that of the fans ... the schools on a professional level get along and respect one another (I think).

[Political Hack]

While I agree with the rule in general, the pushback on the rule will be using examples like James Franklin to show that the SEC can’t afford to lose quality coaches because they weren’t allowed to take another SEC job.

Rising tide raises all ships. Or whatever that saying is...

The SEC doesn't export good coaches. They import them. Outside of Franklin and Meyer (who was fired from UF), the SEC hasn't really lost any quality coaches to other conferences unless they were pushed out (e.g., Richt & Cut).

[TUSK]

I don't know the definition of "real" in this context, but I do know this:

1. It likely depends on what program is doing the hiring from which other program.
2. It's unenforceable.

That being said, I don't think YDL is going any damn where.

[parabrave]

Rising tide raises all ships. Or whatever that saying is...

The SEC doesn't export good coaches. They import them. Outside of Franklin and Meyer (who was fired from UF), the SEC hasn't really lost any quality coaches to other conferences unless they were pushed out (e.g., Richt & Cut).

Kinda reminds me of the Bill Belichick rule. Just because you are a winner and a great head coach doesn't mean your coordinator are HC material.

[Tbonewannabe]

Rising tide raises all ships. Or whatever that saying is...

The SEC doesn't export good coaches. They import them. Outside of Franklin and Meyer (who was fired from UF), the SEC hasn't really lost any quality coaches to other conferences unless they were pushed out (e.g., Richt & Cut).

This is enough to say Dan isn't going to UF and probably not UT. He realizes those crazy bastards don't give you time to put in the foundation of your program. By the time you have 1 recruiting class in, you better be playing in the SEC Championship game or in McE's case, winning a Natty.

[Commercecomet24]

I understand why slive put the rule in place. If schools start poaching other schools hc then you could open up Pandora?s box. There?s already an arms race in the sec and this would escalate it to nuclear levels. Can you just imagine how toxic it could become? Remember the ole southwest conference ate its self up. That being said there is no way to enforce this.

[Johnson85]

No. If we assume Mullen stays put, what other SEC coach would we see moving in order to prove the rule is real? No one would want any of the others except Saban and Smart and they aren't going anywhere.

^^^THIS^^^

Mullen is the only potential coach that would be wanted that is not at a clear final destination job. UF should be able to poach him but can't because of personal reasons. UT is a program in disarray with Bama level expectations but that has to recruit nationally after being bad for over a decade.

If A&M fires Sumlin, they would have the resources and natural recruiting ground that it would make sense that they could poach Mullen, but I'm not sure they fire Sumlin to go pay more money to Mullen when Mullen's overall record against Sumlin isn't dominant.

Arkansas is not a program that can poach from another SEC program and I don't even think Auburn is if they fire Malzahn.

While the rule won't be proven to be in existence, it could be proven to be false if Malzahn goes 8-4 and he jumps ship to Arkansas rather than start 2018 with a red hot seat when he knows he will have difficult games against Bama, UGA, and MSU in 2018

[Tbonewannabe]

^^^THIS^^^

Mullen is the only potential coach that would be wanted that is not at a clear final destination job. UF should be able to poach him but can't because of personal reasons. UT is a program in disarray with Bama level expectations but that has to recruit nationally after being bad for over a decade.

If A&M fires Sumlin, they would have the resources and natural recruiting ground that it would make sense that they could poach Mullen, but I'm not sure they fire Sumlin to go pay more money to Mullen when Mullen's overall record against Sumlin isn't dominant.

Arkansas is not a program that can poach from another SEC program and I don't even think Auburn is if they fire Malzahn.

While the rule won't be proven to be in existence, it could be proven to be false if Malzahn goes 8-4 and he jumps ship to Arkansas rather than start 2018 with a red hot seat when he knows he will have difficult games against Bama, UGA, and MSU in 2018

If Malzahn goes to Arkansas, it isn't because Arkansas stole him from Auburn. It would probably be similar to when Nutt went to UM.

[ShotgunDawg]

If Malzahn goes to Arkansas, it isn't because Arkansas stole him from Auburn. It would probably be similar to when Nutt went to UM.

I have wondered is Malzahn would leave Auburn for Arkansas just to reset the clock.

At Auburn, he’s year to year. At Arkansas, he’d have at least another 5 years.

[Tbonewannabe]

I have wondered is Malzahn would leave Auburn for Arkansas just to reset the clock.

At Auburn, he’s year to year. At Arkansas, he’d have at least another 5 years.

If people think UT could steal Mullen then this is backwards logic. Auburn is the bigger program with more money so it would be interesting if he left there for Arkansas with AU actually wanting to keep him. It isn't like Bert has done a horrible job. His first year is his only losing season prior to this one and he still has a chance at a bowl game although LSU and MSU will probably skull 17 them.

[RocketDawg]

Rising tide raises all ships. Or whatever that saying is...

The SEC doesn't export good coaches. They import them. Outside of Franklin and Meyer (who was fired from UF), the SEC hasn't really lost any quality coaches to other conferences unless they were pushed out (e.g., Richt & Cut).

Darryl Royal?

Did you jsut say that Meyer was fired from Florida? I think he just quit because he couldn't stand the pressure of SEC expectations. And it wasn't his health.

[Johnson85]

If people think UT could steal Mullen then this is backwards logic. Auburn is the bigger program with more money so it would be interesting if he left there for Arkansas with AU actually wanting to keep him. It isn't like Bert has done a horrible job. His first year is his only losing season prior to this one and he still has a chance at a bowl game although LSU and MSU will probably skull 17 them.

You have to remember that Arkansas is where Gus coached high school ball and coached Arkansas State, so there might be a connection there that would make him consider it where other coaches wouldn't.

But I would agree that if Auburn really wanted Gus to stick around, he won't leave for Arkansas. But if he finishes 8-4, there will be a lot of Auburn people who are not excited about him sticking around. IN that scenario, I don't think it would be crazy for him to say he'd rather get essentially four years salary guaranteed from Arkansas rather than coach for his job in 2018 at Auburn. Or even if Auburn is willing to up his buyout, he might would just rather go somewhere where a much greater percentage of the fan base is happy for him to be there.

[Anonymous]

Not sure it's a rule. We are all just able to pay so much that poaching isn't feasible. When is the last time a top 15 salary HC was hired away? Any SEC school can pay that money, therefore any of our HC's worth hiring are getting paid enough that nobody comes after them.

You're talking about 6-7 mil a year to hire Mullen away. A coach without at least a conference ring on his resume simply isn't worth that money to anyone other than us, because he is established and proven here.



Example: Let's say we don't get into a bidding war and someone gets Mullen for 6 mil/year over 4. He has 3 years left on his contract, about 15 million. So the school hiring him is going to be paying almost 10 million/year over the next 4 years for a hire that may or may not work out. Just isn't worth it, not when you have lower budget options out there who look very promising.

[Mimi's Babies]

Is this considered a "Gentlemen unspoken rule"?

[preachermatt83]

Nope. It's not a bylaw. Otherwise it would be in writing and well known to all the idiot media members that continue to spew "SEC coach A" is moving to "SEC school b" next year. After two decades of being wrong, you think they'd pick up on it.

This

[preachermatt83]

If Malzahn goes to Arkansas, it isn't because Arkansas stole him from Auburn. It would probably be similar to when Nutt went to UM.

Exactly!! This is an exception to the rule. It's a mutual thing between schools.

[Political Hack]

This is enough to say Dan isn't going to UF and probably not UT. He realizes those crazy bastards don't give you time to put in the foundation of your program. By the time you have 1 recruiting class in, you better be playing in the SEC Championship game or in McE's case, winning a Natty.

Anybody who knows anything about anything knows Florida was never in play. People are starting to figure it out now, but it took a while for people to really explore the situation from outside. I think most have moved on now.

I suppose some people think Tenn a still intriguing, but other than getting another raise UT isn't really going to impact our coaching situation either.

[Commercecomet24]

Anybody who knows anything about anything knows Florida was never in play. People are starting to figure it out now, but it took a while for people to really explore the situation from outside. I think most have moved on now.

I suppose some people think Tenn a still intriguing, but other than getting another raise UT isn't really going to impact our coaching situation either.

Hack,Always the voice of reason. I think Dan is extremely intelligent. If he took the ut job I would have to question my thoughts about his intelligence. Personally I hope we give Dan and all the boys on staff a nice raise(even hev lol)

[preachermatt83]

Anybody who knows anything about anything knows Florida was never in play. People are starting to figure it out now, but it took a while for people to really explore the situation from outside. I think most have moved on now.

I suppose some people think Tenn a still intriguing, but other than getting another raise UT isn't really going to impact our coaching situation either.

Hack has def been the best poster on ED lately.

[TUSK]

gawd.


Rule, is there?

No.

[MSUDAWGFAN]

Hack has def been the best poster on ED lately.

Sent you a PM preacher.

[Anonymous]

Again, he isn't worth that kind of money to them.

UT would be paying Mullen at least 6 mil per year, plus his remaining contract of 15 mil over three, plus whatever they settle with Butch for. Let's say Butch gets the shaft and only gets 6 mil to part ways. That's still right at 50 million dollars total. If it doesn't work out and he only stays 3 years, that is a 16+ million/year mistake. They would effectively be paying almost double what any coach in football makes.

On top of the fact that they just announced a nearly 400 million renovation to Neyland. They are in a position where they have to make a hire of exceptional value (Frost, Norvell, etc), make an ethically questionable hire and get the sure thing in Kelly, or swing for the fence and get the fan favorite in Gruden.



TL/DR: UT would drop a blank check on Carrol or Saban's desk, or bring the Bear back from the dead, before they pay 10+ mil/year to get Mullen.

[BB30]

Again, he isn't worth that kind of money to them.

UT would be paying Mullen at least 6 mil per year, plus his remaining contract of 15 mil over three, plus whatever they settle with Butch for. Let's say Butch gets the shaft and only gets 6 mil to part ways. That's still right at 50 million dollars total. If it doesn't work out and he only stays 3 years, that is a 16+ million/year mistake. They would effectively be paying almost double what any coach in football makes.

On top of the fact that they just announced a nearly 400 million renovation to Neyland. They are in a position where they have to make a hire of exceptional value (Frost, Norvell, etc), make an ethically questionable hire and get the sure thing in Kelly, or swing for the fence and get the fan favorite in Gruden.



TL/DR: UT would drop a blank check on Carrol or Saban's desk, or bring the Bear back from the dead, before they pay 10+ mil/year to get Mullen.

Gruden gets paid over 6 million dollars a year at a job that has zero pressure. I don't know why anyone would leave a job that pays 6+ million a year with zero chance of getting fired to take a job with similar pay where if you fail your out. Gruden just doesn't seem realistic to me.

[msudawglb]

Anybody who knows anything about anything knows Florida was never in play. People are starting to figure it out now, but it took a while for people to really explore the situation from outside. I think most have moved on now.

I suppose some people think Tenn a still intriguing, but other than getting another raise UT isn't really going to impact our coaching situation either.


Yeah, Mullen has said time and time again that his process starts from the ground so that he can build a program the right way so that it will sustain over time. He has said on the record just last week that a lot of what's wrong with programs that they wanted immediate success and that just doesn't happen. If it does happen, then typically illegal actions are happening >>> Ole Miss.

I think since Mullen enforces this long term plan, many schools do not have the patience to hire him. I can't see Florida or Tennessee being patient enough to have a new coach go 5-7 his first season and maybe 7-5 his second and 8-4 in his third. If Florida was ok with that, then they would have kept McElwain.

All of these schools are like kids at Christmas. They get that new toy that they've been whining about and play with it for 30 minutes Christmas morning, but then toss it to the side and never touch it again. MSU is the poor kid who has been used to doing without and Mullen is our cardboard box that we just love.

[Johnson85]

gawd.


Rule, is there?

No.

I'm not sure how necessary it was, but I absolutely believe Slive intended to prevent it and had the juice to enforce the "rule" against everybody but Bama. I think Auburn would have ignored him and taken any backlash if it came down to a coach they wanted, but I think the AD's at UF, UGA, and LSU would not have pushed back against it.

Same with stopping SEC schools from turning each other in. I think the only person that ignored it was Mullen with the Cam thing, and I think that was the only time he ignored it, having learned his lesson.

I think that's what suckered Ole Miss into thinking they could cheat with impunity, not realizing that the SEC wasn't going to burn political capital to try to protect them if they managed to really piss off Bama and UGA at the same time while also pissing off Michigan, Nebraska, etc. Not sure the SEC could have protected them, but simply outbidding UGA for a player they had no connection with pretty much guaranteed that the SEC wasn't going to break a sweat trying.

[Johnson85]

Again, he isn't worth that kind of money to them.

UT would be paying Mullen at least 6 mil per year, plus his remaining contract of 15 mil over three, plus whatever they settle with Butch for. Let's say Butch gets the shaft and only gets 6 mil to part ways. That's still right at 50 million dollars total. If it doesn't work out and he only stays 3 years, that is a 16+ million/year mistake. They would effectively be paying almost double what any coach in football makes.

On top of the fact that they just announced a nearly 400 million renovation to Neyland. They are in a position where they have to make a hire of exceptional value (Frost, Norvell, etc), make an ethically questionable hire and get the sure thing in Kelly, or swing for the fence and get the fan favorite in Gruden.



TL/DR: UT would drop a blank check on Carrol or Saban's desk, or bring the Bear back from the dead, before they pay 10+ mil/year to get Mullen.

Where are you getting Mullen's buyout numbers from? I would be surprised if his buyout was the full price of his contract. If it is, that must be a new addition to his contract because he wouldn't have wasted time taking a call from Miami in 2015 if his buyout was the full price of his contract (even if at the time it was only two years left).

[Hugh's Hooker]

I don't believe you need much talent to be a media person. Have an agenda and a microphone.

Lol Yancy agrees

[Anonymous]

Where are you getting Mullen's buyout numbers from? I would be surprised if his buyout was the full price of his contract. If it is, that must be a new addition to his contract because he wouldn't have wasted time taking a call from Miami in 2015 if his buyout was the full price of his contract (even if at the time it was only two years left).

Do we even know that he did take the call? Regardless, it's really not his concern whether they want to pay the buyout or not.

Mullen's contract isn't available to the public but the remainder of contract as a buyout clause is pretty standard.

[Acid mouth]

It's a bad look for the conference if other schools are allowed to poach HCs from with the conference. I would normally not be concerned but Sankey did nothing while Mississippi tried to burn multiple teams within the SEC. His lack of assertion is somewhat concerning tho.

[RocketDawg]

If Malzahn goes to Arkansas, it isn't because Arkansas stole him from Auburn. It would probably be similar to when Nutt went to UM.

Wasn't Nutt already fired at Arkansas when OM hired him?

The last time I can remember one SEC team stealing another team's coach was when Tubberville went to Auburn in the middle of the night. And that was a loooong time ago.

[Bass Chaser]

Wasn't Nutt already fired at Arkansas when OM hired him?

The last time I can remember one SEC team stealing another team's coach was when Tubberville went to Auburn in the middle of the night. And that was a loooong time ago.

Yes, Nutt was gone. It’s interesting that no one mentions Malzahn as being on Nutt’s staff. That’s how Nutt got Mustain who was a later bust.