Cole Smith

[ShotgunDawg]

OL from Pontotoc just committed to LSU.

What's the story here?

Is he an MSU legacy?

Did we offer? If not, why?

[lamont]

I dont know but someone will come along and make an excuse for Hevesy pretty soon

[BayouDawg]

We have people higher on our board**
This seems to be the usual excuse

[Noxdog]

OL from Pontotoc just committed to LSU.

What's the story here?

Is he an MSU legacy?

Did we offer? If not, why?

Did we offer? Not soon enough apparently!!!!! Oregon offered then LSU.

Man, this depressing.

Back yard and a legacy. Hope he reconsiders.

[msbulldog]

CB to us, tall,not very big.
http://247sports.com/Player/Cole-Smith-46039454

[Tripp McNeely]

I've never been a proponent of the "laziness" theory, but if I'm Mullen, unless there's a detailed scouting report from Hev on my desk as to why this kid should be slow-played or down the board, I'd be putting together of list of new OL coaches today, fire Hev the day after the Spring Game, and start interviews the next week!

Other O-line losses on the recruiting front over the years have had viable excuses, but to lose an instate, legacy simply because you don't have enough information at this point to offer is absolutely damnable! If LSU has enough info to offer, we should've had enough information 6 months ago to make an offer!

I can tolerate misses because of bad evaluations...no way this is the case here!

[BayouDawg]

It looks like he hasn't been to any of our camps. That's probabaly why we haven't offered. For some reason we only offer OL if they come to our camps.

[lamont]

He was at practice this week and we didnt offer- so he accepted LSU's

[Ari Gold]

Kid was here this week for spring practice , he leaves without an offer and commits to LSU..
It's mother ****ing amazing how bad we are at recruiting OL.. no way to sugar coat it.

Still wouldn't surprise me at all if we get the kid, but no excuse if he is legit, and from all my Info he is..

[lamont]

It looks like he hasn't been to any of our camps. That's probabaly why we haven't offered. For some reason we only offer OL if they come to our camps.

Thats lazy ass recruiting

[BayouDawg]

Thats lazy ass recruiting

Yep. And that's why our offensive line is a crap shoot most years.

[msbulldog]

If he is legit I'm sure he would have an offer. 275 lbs?

[Ari Gold]

If he is legit I'm sure he would have an offer. 275 lbs?

Yeah as a JR.. you don't think the kid can gain 20 lbs in 2 years.?? well he is legit enough for a LSU and Oregon offer..
Go defend your boy Hev somewhere else..

I don't go off on staff often, bu that mother ****er should get his pay check each month with a ski mask on.. he is basically robbing the university with what he gets paid..

[Bully13]

How long must this bullshit go on?

[Ari Gold]

And just for those that still question how shitty that ****er is.. and this wondering why the Oregon offer.. the OL coach at Oregon is Mario Cristobal who was where last year??. That's right ****ing Bama...
I will take his evaloution on how good a kid is over our slap**** every day...

[msbulldog]

Yeah as a JR.. you don't think the kid can gain 20 lbs in 2 years.?? well he is legit enough for a LSU and Oregon offer..
Go defend your boy Hev somewhere else..

I don't go off on staff often, bu that mother ****er should get his pay check each month with a ski mask on.. he is basically robbing the university with what he gets paid..

Well Ari, Hev ain't my man. I think he is a weak link on our staff. The kid gains 20 lbs, he is still too small to play OL in the SEC.
Put me on your damn list, I don't give a damn.

[msstate7]

This obviously looks crazy that we didn't offer. It is a little odd to me that om hasn't offered either. Lsu also took Brennan last season who state and om showed no interest... well om did after Brennan's coach threw a temper tantrum on twitter

[Ari Gold]

This obviously looks crazy that we didn't offer. It is a little odd to me that om hasn't offered either. Lsu also took Brennan last season who state and om showed no interest... well om did after Brennan's coach threw a temper tantrum on twitter

Who gives a **** if Umiss offered or not..

[Ari Gold]

Well Ari, Hev ain't my man. I think he is a weak link on our staff. The kid gains 20 lbs, he is still too small to play OL in the SEC.
Put me on your damn list, I don't give a damn.

Dillon Day says go **** yourself.. give me a mean ass mother ****er around 295-310 pounds over any 6'5 350 soft ass ****er any day..

[msstate7]

Who gives a **** if Umiss offered or not..

2 best programs in Mississippi have apparently passed on a Miss kid. Could certainly be both are wrong, but seems odd neither offer. Kid attended om junior day too

[msbulldog]

Who gives a **** if Umiss offered or not..

Ari, have you ever thought about why MSU and TSUN have not offered? Maybe we have seen him up close. Ed O. and Oregon are handing out blanket scholarship offers, it's their M.O., these are not committable offers.

[Madisonmd]

2 best programs in Mississippi have apparently passed on a Miss kid. Could certainly be both are wrong, but seems odd neither offer. Kid attended om junior day too

Is this Brent Smith's kid? He played for us in early '90s?

[msstate7]

Is this Brent Smith's kid? He played for us in early '90s?

No idea

[Ari Gold]

Is this Brent Smith's kid? He played for us in early '90s?

Yes...

[craigmid]

Odd, why would he go to the OM camp and not ours?

[CadaverDawg]

Hmm

[DoctorDawg]

Flipmas from LSU, cause Ole Miss is now irrelevant.

[lamont]

2 best programs in Mississippi have apparently passed on a Miss kid. Could certainly be both are wrong, but seems odd neither offer. Kid attended om junior day too

I'll take LSU's recruiting over State/OM every day

[lamont]

As many misses as we have had on the OL- how could anybody question this offer by LSU??? That's a serious question. Bama had a guy from an Academy in South Miss start for them for 2 years. Other schools evaluate better than we do on the OL. Its been proven over and over

[Noxdog]

As many misses as we have had on the OL- how could anybody question this offer by LSU??? That's a serious question. Bama had a guy from an Academy in South Miss start for them for 2 years. Other schools evaluate better than we do on the OL. Its been proven over and over

South MS???? Steen was from Cleveland unless I'm forgetting someone. Your point still stands. Beyond PISSED! What a cf the OL is.

[ShotgunDawg]

Personally, I don't think Hev trusts his evaluations.

[dawgoneyall]

I will find out what is what. Know the family well and will find what is the situation. They are very MSU, naturally.

[craigmid]

Maybe it's a power play by Cole.
"See, you should have offered me"
And I don't trust the LUS offer, it won't stand.

[Thick]

Dillon Day says go **** yourself.. give me a mean ass mother ****er around 295-310 pounds over any 6'5 350 soft ass ****er any day..

THIS ALL DAY LONG!!!!

[Bothrops]

It seems to me that Mullen was beaten to the punch, because he didn't think this kid would get this kind of recognition from big out of state programs. At least not this early. He looks like a strong effort kid in his Hudl film.

[CadaverDawg]

But as long as we put up good rushing numbers against the sisters of the poor while every decent SEC team steamrolls our weak OL, we're fine? Stats are all that matters right?**

I've been saying Hev sucks ass since 2012 and slowly everybody on this board has started figuring it out and quit basing him being "a good coach" on cherry picking stats. The bottom line is we have the talent to take a big step up in the SEC...AT every position EXCEPT the OL. Hevesy's lazy ass is single handedly holding this program back, and I'm honestly surprised our fan base hasn't taken it more personally. I get so invested in our football program, and I'm sick to death of one lazy pile of shit holding it back from an extra 2-3 wins per year and/or the chance to step up and beat one of the big boys.

[msstate7]

But as long as we put up good rushing numbers against the sisters of the poor while every decent SEC team steamrolls our weak OL, we're fine? Stats are all that matters right?**

I've been saying Hev sucks ass since 2012 and slowly everybody on this board has started figuring it out and quit basing him being "a good coach" on cherry picking stats. The bottom line is we have the talent to take a big step up in the SEC...AT every position EXCEPT the OL. Hevesy's lazy ass is single handedly holding this program back, and I'm honestly surprised our fan base hasn't taken it more personally. I get so invested in our football program, and I'm sick to death of one lazy pile of shit holding it back from an extra 2-3 wins per year and/or the chance to step up and beat one of the big boys.

2-3 wins seems a stretch. Throw out mullen's first year and he's avg'd 8 wins a year here. You saying replace Hev and we'd avg 10-11 wins a year?

[DownwardDawg]

Well Ari, Hev ain't my man. I think he is a weak link on our staff. The kid gains 20 lbs, he is still too small to play OL in the SEC.
Put me on your damn list, I don't give a damn.

Hahaha!!!!! I had forgotten about the list!!! Haha. That made my night!!

[lamont]

But as long as we put up good rushing numbers against the sisters of the poor while every decent SEC team steamrolls our weak OL, we're fine? Stats are all that matters right?**

I've been saying Hev sucks ass since 2012 and slowly everybody on this board has started figuring it out and quit basing him being "a good coach" on cherry picking stats. The bottom line is we have the talent to take a big step up in the SEC...AT every position EXCEPT the OL. Hevesy's lazy ass is single handedly holding this program back, and I'm honestly surprised our fan base hasn't taken it more personally. I get so invested in our football program, and I'm sick to death of one lazy pile of shit holding it back from an extra 2-3 wins per year and/or the chance to step up and beat one of the big boys.

Ease up Cad- we managed 58 yards on 32 carries vs LSU last year. And that was with 3 starters returning. Not having a Center for Spring practice this year wont matter at all. We good.

[MetEdDawg]

I don't understand how some on this board can defend this crap. LSU not only beats us consistently, but they put more guys in the NFL consistently and recruit better than us consistently. But they defend Hevesy when we miss on an MSU legacy that LSU accepted a junior commit from?

This is why we can't get over the hump. Would love to hear an explanation as to how we don't offer him but LSU does and accepts his commit and that's a good thing for us.

[lamont]

in a bit of a funny twist- LSU is taking him as a Center.

[msstate7]

Being someone who melts often, I consider myself somewhat of an expert in the area. Some of you need to pace your melt or you'll burn out before February.

[ShotgunDawg]

in a bit of a funny twist- LSU is taking him as a Center.

That's what I've heard he is. Could be why we've slow played

[lamont]

That's what I've heard he is. Could be why we've slow played

because we have an abundance of Centers

[CadaverDawg]

Ease up Cad- we managed 58 yards on 32 carries vs LSU last year. And that was with 3 starters returning. Not having a Center for Spring practice this year wont matter at all. We good.

Haha exactly

[blacklistedbully]

It looks like he hasn't been to any of our camps. That's probabaly why we haven't offered. For some reason we only offer OL if they come to our camps.

Same thing happened a few years ago to a legacy...son of former MSU DB Stephen Johnson. I know his dad, and he told me his son was locked up, ready to sign with state, even though they are OOS, but we never offered. A birdy told me it was probably because he didn't come to any of our camps. Apparently, our staff does not look kindly on kids who refuse to come to camps.

http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Stephen-Johnson-41123/RecruitInterests

Kid's official 40 was a 4.37. His dad told me his son was injured that day, and had ran sub-4.3's before.

[Ari Gold]

Hahaha!!!!! I had forgotten about the list!!! Haha. That made my night!!

Yeah that post of his didn't even deserve to make the list it was so stupid even for the List. And you can't self gloss yourself to make the list..

[CadaverDawg]

2-3 wins seems a stretch. Throw out mullen's first year and he's avg'd 8 wins a year here. You saying replace Hev and we'd avg 10-11 wins a year?

Quite possibly. At least averaging 9. You're telling me if we were landing the Jeff Simmons, Leo Lewis, Jamal Peters, etc at the OL position every year we wouldn't be WAY better? We have been winning 7-8 games a year in an offense that is designed to be "run first" without any stud offensive linemen! Imagine what we would have been doing if we had just recruited OL at the rate we recruit every other position except WR

[msstate7]

Quite possibly. At least averaging 9. You're telling me if we were landing the Jeff Simmons, Leo Lewis, Jamal Peters, etc at the OL position every year we wouldn't be WAY better? We have been winning 7-8 games a year in an offense that is designed to be "run first" without any stud offensive linemen! Imagine what we would have been doing if we had just recruited OL at the rate we recruit every other position except WR

DB play hasn't exactly been killing it either

[Todd4State]

But as long as we put up good rushing numbers against the sisters of the poor while every decent SEC team steamrolls our weak OL, we're fine? Stats are all that matters right?**

I've been saying Hev sucks ass since 2012 and slowly everybody on this board has started figuring it out and quit basing him being "a good coach" on cherry picking stats. The bottom line is we have the talent to take a big step up in the SEC...AT every position EXCEPT the OL. Hevesy's lazy ass is single handedly holding this program back, and I'm honestly surprised our fan base hasn't taken it more personally. I get so invested in our football program, and I'm sick to death of one lazy pile of shit holding it back from an extra 2-3 wins per year and/or the chance to step up and beat one of the big boys.

The thing about the stats is they only tell us what our offense would do with a Hevesy coached o-line and not what they would be with a better coach- but it's pretty reasonable to assume that a better coach would yield even better stats.

Hevesy does hold us back- and I think part of it is fear (False Evidence Appearing Real) that Dan will leave "like Cutcliffe" if the alumni force Hevesy out. So, a lot of our fans just deal with it. Some are actually I think OK with just beating Ole Miss and going to the Liberty Bowl. I don't really understand that since we have a chance to legitimately be better than that. We're still not a big boy in that regard- if Hevesy was at another SEC school other than Vandy, may Kentucky, or Mizzou the cigar boys would have run his ass out after the 2015 season at the latest. Even I am guilty of trying to "bargain"- that's a stage of grief- where he is the assistant head coach to try to make everyone happy.

There's no reason for him to be our o-line coach at this point. He has repeatedly shown that he is unwilling to work on his recruiting, he plays people out of position, and he has not recruited any player that has been here for 4-5 years and gotten drafted by the NFL at this point over a period of eight seasons. There's especially zero reason for him to be our o-line coach in this day and age of "football analysts" where he can still be on our staff and probably provide the exact same value to Dan as he does now without doing nearly as much damage. Just like we have already done with Sallach- who while he certainly did not hang the moon, at least his position group was never a liability, seemed to be well coached for the most part and he also was a better recruiter than Hevesy. Hell, the tight ends even blocked better than Hevesy's group. That's sad.

I'm hoping that Looney takes over as the o-line coach next year or even better- we move Hevesy off the staff and hire Will Friend or get Steve Addazio if he gets fired next year. I hope the only reason he is still the o-line coach is because of the fact that the "extra" coach won't be added until 2018.

[Todd4State]

DB play hasn't exactly been killing it either

We haven't exactly had the same DB coaches over the past 8-9 years either. And none of them were a liability in recruiting other than Melvin after he got over the hill.

We've also had a lot more DB's in the NFL too- Banks, Redmond, Calhoun, Whitley, Charles Mitchell, etc.

[Ari Gold]

because we have an abundance of Centers

Exacatly. I don't give a **** where he plays.. Oregon offered because Cristboal knows about him... period ..
Cristobal to Hev is like comparing Bill Belichick to Sly Croom

[Bass Chaser]

Can a JR receive a commitable offer?

[BayouDawg]

DB play hasn't exactly been killing it either

DB play seemed to really drop after Melvin smith left and we've never really recovered.

[BayouDawg]

Same thing happened a few years ago to a legacy...son of former MSU DB Stephen Johnson. I know his dad, and he told me his son was locked up, ready to sign with state, even though they are OOS, but we never offered. A birdy told me it was probably because he didn't come to any of our camps. Apparently, our staff does not look kindly on kids who refuse to come to camps.

http://247sports.com/Recruitment/Stephen-Johnson-41123/RecruitInterests

Kid's official 40 was a 4.37. His dad told me his son was injured that day, and had ran sub-4.3's before.

That's a shame. i thought with ole miss being irrelevant we would be able to clean up instate but it looks like we'll just lose the kids to out of state schools now.

[Todd4State]

Can a JR receive a commitable offer?

Yes- verbally. But they can't officially get the offer until I think August of their senior year. It's basically word of mouth until then- in other words- "Todd4State I know you are a junior, but we're going to give you an offer in August." is basically how it sort of goes.

[Todd4State]

That's a shame. i thought with ole miss being irrelevant we would be able to clean up instate but it looks like we'll just lose the kids to out of state schools now.

At least on the o-line. It seems like most of the players in state favor us at the other position groups.

[Liverpooldawg]

I live in NE MS in a town that is something of a rival to Pontotoc. I had never heard of him till the Daily Journal had a blurb about his offer from Oregon a couple of days ago. It's March, y'all might need to chill out before you all jump off a cliff or something.

[Homedawg]

Quite possibly. At least averaging 9. You're telling me if we were landing the Jeff Simmons, Leo Lewis, Jamal Peters, etc at the OL position every year we wouldn't be WAY better? We have been winning 7-8 games a year in an offense that is designed to be "run first" without any stud offensive linemen! Imagine what we would have been doing if we had just recruited OL at the rate we recruit every other position except WR

Look our ol recruiting has lacked no argument. But then explain why our defense sucked last year and our secondary has sucked for years. If we are soooo elite recruiting at every other position, which is bs, then why do we struggle so bad at other positions besides OL. Hell ol wasn't even close to being our worst unit lay year. Not close. Again, our ol recruiting needs to step. Anything otherwise wouldn't be a prudent statement.

[Irondawg]

In the end though nothing is "commitable" until they send the official papers Right before signing day

[Homedawg]

DB play seemed to really drop after Melvin smith left and we've never really recovered.

Huh? Melvin was a joke the last 3-4 years he was here. Awful. Beyond awful. Sucked.

[CadaverDawg]

I live in NE MS in a town that is something of a rival to Pontotoc. I had never heard of him till the Daily Journal had a blurb about his offer from Oregon a couple of days ago. It's March, y'all might need to chill out before you all jump off a cliff or something.

No offense, but Wake up, man. It's not about the time of year or even if we get the guy or not...it's about an OL coach that is constantly missing out on the top targets on our board, yet STILL gets outworked by out of state schools for a good OL in our back yard. That is a BIG problem, regardless of time of year or where this kid ends up, period.

[CadaverDawg]

Look our ol recruiting has lacked no argument. But then explain why our defense sucked last year and our secondary has sucked for years. If we are soooo elite recruiting at every other position, which is bs, then why do we struggle so bad at other positions besides OL. Hell ol wasn't even close to being our worst unit lay year. Not close. Again, our ol recruiting needs to step. Anything otherwise wouldn't be a prudent statement.

Nobody said we were "elite" anywhere. And I don't know about you, but in my opinion, as soon as we have a new OL coach every year, we can compare OL to the defense. If anything, OL has less of an excuse to suck than even a poorly talented defense, due to continuity with the coach for 8 years.

[Todd4State]

Look our ol recruiting has lacked no argument. But then explain why our defense sucked last year and our secondary has sucked for years. If we are soooo elite recruiting at every other position, which is bs, then why do we struggle so bad at other positions besides OL. Hell ol wasn't even close to being our worst unit lay year. Not close. Again, our ol recruiting needs to step. Anything otherwise wouldn't be a prudent statement.

No doubt the defense has sucked at times especially last year. But again the difference is Dan responded by making changes. He hired Todd Grantham to address that and we're all satisfied. That's the issue as much as anything- we have issues on the o-line but what has done about it? Why is it allowed to continue every year? Three years in a row- we lost Lashley from West Point to Alabama, last year Charles from MRA said he committed to LSU because "they showed me more attention", and now this. From a legacy o-lineman who has a Dad that played o-line in the NFL.

If Dan's defense sucked every year but we had Carl Torbush manning it very year for the past 8-9 years and nothing was done it would be just as much an issue and discussed every bit as much as Hevesy.

[BayouDawg]

Huh? Melvin was a joke the last 3-4 years he was here. Awful. Beyond awful. Sucked.

Don't know how you figure that. His 2010 and 2011 corners were pretty good. 2012 was ok. I thought we should have been better with slay and banks. Townsend was aweful in my opinion. Townsends first year in 2013 was ok and we got worse each year.

[msstate7]

No offense, but Wake up, man. It's not about the time of year or even if we get the guy or not...it's about an OL coach that is constantly missing out on the top targets on our board, yet STILL gets outworked by out of state schools for a good OL in our back yard. That is a BIG problem, regardless of time of year or where this kid ends up, period.

If we haven't offered, I don't think he was a top target.

I have no idea what the deal is with the kid, but perhaps he's a fringe prospect and we wanna be sure before offering. With his dad being an ex-player, we certainly don't wanna end up having to drop smith like gainer. Again though, I have no idea... it very well could be just a completely dumb non-offer by Hev and Mullen

[starkvegasdawg]

He must have been a three star. We don't take OL prospects rated that highly. We like to develop our linemen thank you very much.

[BayouDawg]

He must have been a three star. We don't take OL prospects rated that highly. We like to develop our linemen thank you very much.

Hev keeps those south al and Troy coaches up at night.

[CadaverDawg]

If we haven't offered, I don't think he was a top target.

I have no idea what the deal is with the kid, but perhaps he's a fringe prospect and we wanna be sure before offering. With his dad being an ex-player, we certainly don't wanna end up having to drop smith like gainer. Again though, I have no idea... it very well could be just a completely dumb non-offer by Hev and Mullen

https://media.giphy.com/media/dEdmW17JnZhiU/giphy.gif

[CadaverDawg]

Hev keeps those south al and Troy coaches up at night.

Hahaha

Rep given

[msstate7]

https://media.giphy.com/media/dEdmW17JnZhiU/giphy.gif

Lol... if the kid was a sure fire guy, surely om would've offered after he camped there.

[Todd4State]

If we haven't offered, I don't think he was a top target.

I have no idea what the deal is with the kid, but perhaps he's a fringe prospect and we wanna be sure before offering. With his dad being an ex-player, we certainly don't wanna end up having to drop smith like gainer. Again though, I have no idea... it very well could be just a completely dumb non-offer by Hev and Mullen

He's good enough for Oregon and LSU but he's not one of our top targets? Those are two better offers than any that Gainer had. That's not any better of an argument for Dan or Hevesy. And who did we even replace Gainer with? Suggs was committed, Cooper we were just waiting on his grades, and we had Richardson committed. I'm not even really sure if we dropped him or not. And we missed on Hayes in the JUCO ranks so it wasn't to get another JUCO guy in.

[BayouDawg]

At this point nodody can defend Hev with a straight face. Everybody knows he's dead weight. the people making excuses at this point are just carrying water and pumping sunshine.

[msstate7]

He's good enough for Oregon and LSU but he's not one of our top targets? Those are two better offers than any that Gainer had. That's not any better of an argument for Dan or Hevesy. And who did we even replace Gainer with? Suggs was committed, Cooper we were just waiting on his grades, and we had Richardson committed. I'm not even really sure if we dropped him or not. And we missed on Hayes in the JUCO ranks so it wasn't to get another JUCO guy in.

You're arguing gainer dropped us? Really?

[Liverpooldawg]

No offense, but Wake up, man. It's not about the time of year or even if we get the guy or not...it's about an OL coach that is constantly missing out on the top targets on our board, yet STILL gets outworked by out of state schools for a good OL in our back yard. That is a BIG problem, regardless of time of year or where this kid ends up, period.

That's just it, he may be a good one and he may not be. I have never heard of him. With where I live I would have thought I would have if he was such a big time national recruit. The tone of the Journal article was a bit "interesting." Y'all need to chill out.

[CadaverDawg]

That's just it, he may be a good one and he may not be. I have never heard of him. With where I live I would have thought I would have if he was such a big time national recruit. The tone of the Journal article was a bit "interesting." Y'all need to chill out.

I'll take Cristobal's opinion of him over Liverpooldawg's. Thanks though

[BayouDawg]

He's good enough for Oregon and LSU but he's not one of our top targets? Those are two better offers than any that Gainer had. That's not any better of an argument for Dan or Hevesy. And who did we even replace Gainer with? Suggs was committed, Cooper we were just waiting on his grades, and we had Richardson committed. I'm not even really sure if we dropped him or not. And we missed on Hayes in the JUCO ranks so it wasn't to get another JUCO guy in.

It's just like when we lost Charles to LSU last year. The Hev apologists said we had others higher on our board. Then when that was revealed to be complete bs it switched to well he has strong Louisiana ties so we never had a chance. The people that make excuses for Hev are nothing more than enablers.

[Todd4State]

You're arguing gainer dropped us? Really?

Again- who replaced him? His whole reason for de-committing was because he hadn't heard from Hevesy.

It's better than your argument that we shouldn't pay attention to the o-line with the same coach because our DB's sucked.

Come to think of it- I bet we dropped him trying to go after those o-linemen that ended up going to ****ing South Carolina where Hevesy got out recruited again and couldn't land one of the three guys and then we left empty handed.

[BayouDawg]

I'll take Cristobal's opinion of him over Liverpooldawg's. Thanks though

Bo Bounds said on his show a couple months ago when Cristobal took the Oregon job that he thought state and OM really dropped the ball by not hiring him to be ol coach. I don't know if we could have realistically hired him away from Bama though:

[msstate7]

It's just like when we lost Charles to LSU last year. The Hev apologists said we had others higher on our board. Then when that was revealed to be complete bs it switched to well he has strong Louisiana ties so we never had a chance. The people that make excuses for Hev are nothing more than enablers.

Lol... yeah, if not for a few anonymous posters on ED, Mullen would fire Hev and we'd have that certain natty

[Ari Gold]

Look our ol recruiting has lacked no argument. But then explain why our defense sucked last year and our secondary has sucked for years. If we are soooo elite recruiting at every other position, which is bs, then why do we struggle so bad at other positions besides OL. Hell ol wasn't even close to being our worst unit lay year. Not close. Again, our ol recruiting needs to step. Anything otherwise wouldn't be a prudent statement.

Secondary has sucked for years???? Redmond , Slay, Banks, Calhoun....
it's an embarrassment that we can't put OL in the league. That means not recruiting elite OL that have NFL potential and not being able to develop and push the ones who need it..
and it is a known fact the reason we missed out on Saddiq Charles last year , he didn't want to play for Hev.. **** all that he was from Louisiana bullshit..
Hell one of the best OL we had the lastb7 years was a walk on..

[BayouDawg]

Lol... yeah, if not for a few anonymous posters on ED, Mullen would fire Hev and we'd have that certain natty

Don't know about a natty but we'd have a competent o line.

[Todd4State]

It's just like when we lost Charles to LSU last year. The Hev apologists said we had others higher on our board. Then when that was revealed to be complete bs it switched to well he has strong Louisiana ties so we never had a chance. The people that make excuses for Hev are nothing more than enablers.

I feel bad for the recruiting reporters because they have to constantly take up for him even though I'm pretty sure they know there are no excuses for Hevesy.

[Todd4State]

Lol... yeah, if not for a few anonymous posters on ED, Mullen would fire Hev and we'd have that certain natty

I don't know about that- but we would have a Sugar Bowl win and a playoff appearance. That's what pisses me off to no end about Hevesy.

[msstate7]

Again- who replaced him? His whole reason for de-committing was because he hadn't heard from Hevesy.

It's better than your argument that we shouldn't pay attention to the o-line with the same coach because our DB's sucked.

Maybe rivers. Maybe Abrams. Maybe landrews. None of them were locks until they signed. Once they all signed, maybe room had to be made and gainer was the spot

[BayouDawg]

Maybe rivers. Maybe Abrams. Maybe landrews. None of them were locks until they signed. Once they all signed, maybe room had to be made and gainer was the spot

I still don't understand this whole "room had to be made" talk. If my math is correct we're still not up to the full 85.

[msstate7]

Secondary has sucked for years???? Redmond , Slay, Banks, Calhoun....
it's an embarrassment that we can't put OL in the league. That means not recruiting elite OL that have NFL potential and not being able to develop and push the ones who need it..
and it is a known fact the reason we missed out on Saddiq Charles last year , he didn't want to play for Hev.. **** all that he was from Louisiana bullshit..
Hell one of the best OL we had the lastb7 years was a walk on..

When we lost to freeze in his first year, we lost bc we couldn't cover moncrief. We had 2 NFL CBs, but couldn't even slow him down. To me that's a good example of talent means nothing if the coaching is garbage

[msstate7]

I still don't understand this whole "room had to be made" talk. If my math is correct we're still not up to the full 85.

Fine we lost gainer to usm bc of Hev. You guys are right

[Liverpooldawg]

I'll take Cristobal's opinion of him over Liverpooldawg's. Thanks though

I don't have an opinion, I ain't never seen him play. All I'm saying is he ISN'T a household name here. He may be the next hall of fame lineman.

[Todd4State]

Bo Bounds said on his show a couple months ago when Cristobal took the Oregon job that he thought state and OM really dropped the ball by not hiring him to be ol coach. I don't know if we could have realistically hired him away from Bama though:

I'm not in the Hevesy boat by any means, but that doesn't make any sense.

[BayouDawg]

When we lost to freeze in his first year, we lost bc we couldn't cover moncrief. We had 2 NFL CBs, but couldn't even slow him down. To me that's a good example of talent means nothing if the coaching is garbage

You are correct on that. We had Whitley trying to cover moncrief for some idiotic reason. But I'm tellin ya the decline of DBs really started with Townsend.

[Todd4State]

Maybe rivers. Maybe Abrams. Maybe landrews. None of them were locks until they signed. Once they all signed, maybe room had to be made and gainer was the spot

I think I figured out what happened. It's my edited post above. Basically we whiffed on a couple of targets and left empty handed.

[CadaverDawg]

Maybe rivers. Maybe Abrams. Maybe landrews. None of them were locks until they signed. Once they all signed, maybe room had to be made and gainer was the spot

http://www.lifestrategies.net/change-my-life/the-real-meaning-of-wealth/files/real-meaning-of-wealth-is-not-hauling-buckets.png

[BayouDawg]

I'm not in the Hevesy boat by any means, but that doesn't make any sense.

That's just what Bo was saying. I don't know if would have been a realistic possibility to pull him. Probably not.

[Homedawg]

Don't know how you figure that. His 2010 and 2011 corners were pretty good. 2012 was ok. I thought we should have been better with slay and banks. Townsend was aweful in my opinion. Townsends first year in 2013 was ok and we got worse each year.

He had 2 nfl corners and we should have been 1000 times better. We will never be that talented again at corner. The casual fan didn't even know who slay was until late in his career. Melvin was a great recruiter in the day and a decent coach. There is a reason he's no longer employed.

[Homedawg]

Nobody said we were "elite" anywhere. And I don't know about you, but in my opinion, as soon as we have a new OL coach every year, we can compare OL to the defense. If anything, OL has less of an excuse to suck than even a poorly talented defense, due to continuity with the coach for 8 years.

My point is everyone tells me how great we recruit at dl, CB and others compared for the ol. Well the results have hardly shown that the last 2 years. Just sayin.

[CadaverDawg]

My point is everyone tells me how great we recruit at dl, CB and others compared for the ol. Well the results have hardly shown that the last 2 years. Just sayin.

Yep, and that's why we have a new DC. Where is our new OL coach?

[BayouDawg]

He had 2 nfl corners and we should have been 1000 times better. We will never be that talented again at corner. The casual fan didn't even know who slay was until late in his career. Melvin was a great recruiter in the day and a decent coach. There is a reason he's no longer employed.

Oh I know why he's no longer employed. He still put out a better product in his crap years than Townsend did. Our corners went to crap in a hurry starting in 2013. But Mississippi high schools have always produced good DBs so its head scratching why we have regressed so much.

[Thick]

South MS???? Steen was from Cleveland unless I'm forgetting someone. Your point still stands. Beyond PISSED! What a cf the OL is.

Actually Steen was from Clarksdale, and played at Lee Academy.

[blacklistedbully]

No doubt the defense has sucked at times especially last year. But again the difference is Dan responded by making changes. He hired Todd Grantham to address that and we're all satisfied. That's the issue as much as anything- we have issues on the o-line but what has done about it? Why is it allowed to continue every year? Three years in a row- we lost Lashley from West Point to Alabama, last year Charles from MRA said he committed to LSU because "they showed me more attention", and now this. From a legacy o-lineman who has a Dad that played o-line in the NFL.

If Dan's defense sucked every year but we had Carl Torbush manning it very year for the past 8-9 years and nothing was done it would be just as much an issue and discussed every bit as much as Hevesy.

Great post.

[archdog]

I dont know but someone will come along and make an excuse for Hevesy pretty soon

The OL recruiting is easy. Recruit everyone aTm and Arkansas recruit on the OL. Seems easy enough.

[msstate7]

The OL recruiting is easy. Recruit everyone aTm and Arkansas recruit on the OL. Seems easy enough.

Sec rankings...

Rushing offense:
State -- 5th
aTm -- 6th
Ark -- 10th tie with vandy

Rushing yards per carry:
aTm -- 3rd
State -- 4th
Ark -- 12th

Sacks allowed:
State -- 2nd
aTm -- 5th
Ark -- 13th

TFL allowed:
State -- 3rd
aTm -- 4th
Ark -- 12th

[Mimi's Babies]

Yeah as a JR.. you don't think the kid can gain 20 lbs in 2 years.?? well he is legit enough for a LSU and Oregon offer..
Go defend your boy Hev somewhere else..

I don't go off on staff often, bu that mother ****er should get his pay check each month with a ski mask on.. he is basically robbing the university with what he gets paid..

May not have to worry about Coach "O" before the OM mess is over......

[Cooterpoot]

Sec rankings...

Rushing offense:
State -- 5th
aTm -- 6th
Ark -- 10th tie with vandy

Rushing yards per carry:
aTm -- 3rd
State -- 4th
Ark -- 12th

Sacks allowed:
State -- 2nd
aTm -- 5th
Ark -- 13th

TFL allowed:
State -- 3rd
aTm -- 4th
Ark -- 12th

Look at our numbers vs SEC competition only, then mutual opponents only, and compare. And not just last year.

[DeputyDawg94]

There are 3 position groups (OL, DL and RB) that when LUS and Bama offer everyone else should be offering as well. Especially when the player is from MS. If he has a legitimate offer from LSU and a former Bama coach wanted him I can't possibly make a case for not offering him. This whole idea of "we don't offer unless they come to camp" is dumb. I can see that mentality on the marginal kids but for a sure fired player it doesn't make sense.

[msstate7]

Look at our numbers vs SEC competition only, then mutual opponents only, and compare. And not just last year.

Sec games only last 3 years going from '16 to '14...

Rushing: 5th, 12th, 3rd
Yards per rush: 3rd, 11th, 3rd
Sacks allowed: 3rd, 13th, 5th
TFL allowed: 3rd, 7th, 5th
Pts per game: 4th, 6th, 5th

Now is '16 the anomaly or is it '15?

[I seen it dawg]

Mean OL. Great genetics. Room to grow. Legacy. Good film. Loves State. Yeah let's not take him and see if he can be another Day or Beckwith....so profoundly ****ing stupid I don't know where to begin. Fireable. And by not offering now and slow playing we will have to work harder to tell him but yeah we've always loved you son and convince him to come. Because he hasn't camped yet? Again fireable.

[NCDawg]

Mean OL. Great genetics. Room to grow. Legacy. Good film. Loves State. Yeah let's not take him and see if he can be another Day or Beckwith....so profoundly ****ing stupid I don't know where to begin. Fireable. And by not offering now and slow playing we will have to work harder to tell him but yeah we've always loved you son and convince him to come. Because he hasn't camped yet? Again fireable.

We might as well accept the fact that Mullen is not going to fire Hevesy no matter how poorly he recruits or coaches. We should reconcile ourselves we will never get to the SEC Championship game as long as Mullen is here, buy your tickets, and be glad to settle for a mediocre bowl game. Face it.

[lamont]

Sec games only last 3 years going from '16 to '14...

Rushing: 5th, 12th, 3rd
Yards per rush: 3rd, 11th, 3rd
Sacks allowed: 3rd, 13th, 5th
TFL allowed: 3rd, 7th, 5th
Pts per game: 4th, 6th, 5th

Now is '16 the anomaly or is it '15?

Vs the top 3 in the SEC West 2015:

LSU- 26 carries/43 yards
Alabama- 42 carries/89 yards
Ole Miss- 34/148 yards

vs Top 3 in the SEC West- 2016:

LSU- 32 carries/56 yards
Auburn- 33 carries/103 yards
Alabama- 35 carries/94 yards


Those are the numbers we put up vs the top of the SEC West year in and year out(2014 was the outlier and we all know this). It's why we never are any kind of legit threat to push for the West title. Its also why we wont be until we recruit better on the OL

[Human Meat]

We obviously cannot recruit offensive linemen. We will max out at 9/10 level until we correct this. I am not attempting to denigrate Mullen because he does many things well. I am simply pointing out the barrier to elite success.

[Todd4State]

We might as well accept the fact that Mullen is not going to fire Hevesy no matter how poorly he recruits or coaches. We should reconcile ourselves we will never get to the SEC Championship game as long as Mullen is here, buy your tickets, and be glad to settle for a mediocre bowl game. Face it.

That's bullshit. It's past time for our cigar boys and AD to step up and address this.

[Human Meat]

That's bullshit. It's past time for our cigar boys and AD to step up and address this.

You can't do that and keep program harmony. Your idea is the one that is bullshit. Cigar boys should be talking to Cohen and no one else.

I do agree with the premise regarding the coach, however. There is just not much that can be done about it if Mullen does not want to do it.

[Bothrops]

We make it so tough on ourselves. When our offense get obliterated by LSU this year, it's gonna get real hot for Hev. That's gonna be ****ing ugly.

[Human Meat]

We make it so tough on ourselves. When our offense get obliterated by LSU this year, it's gonna get real hot for Hev. That's gonna be ****ing ugly.

We won the Egg Bowl. Time to get fat, happy and cocky again. #Mullening

[1bigdawg]

Vs the top 3 in the SEC West 2015:

LSU- 26 carries/43 yards
Alabama- 42 carries/89 yards
Ole Miss- 34/148 yards

vs Top 3 in the SEC West- 2016:

LSU- 32 carries/56 yards
Auburn- 33 carries/103 yards
Alabama- 35 carries/94 yards


Those are the numbers we put up vs the top of the SEC West year in and year out(2014 was the outlier and we all know this). It's why we never are any kind of legit threat to push for the West title. Its also why we wont be until we recruit better on the OL

Random, With MSTATE7 is always someone else's fault and not the Oline. Don't bother him with valid statistics. I have often thought he is Hevesy.

[msstate7]

Random, With MSTATE7 is always someone else's fault and not the Oline. Don't bother him with valid statistics. I have often thought he is Hevesy.
Lol... I think the oline should take a lot of the blame, not 100% though which is what this board does

[parabrave]

Not only OL, but most all positions. Like what Coach Gonzales told me a few years ago. They have to attend our camps to be offered with a few exections.

[Human Meat]

Lol... I think the oline should take a lot of the blame, not 100% though which is what this board does

It was the weak link in 2014 and 2015. It seems that it will be the weak link once again in 2017 and 2018 (years in which we have the overall talent to compete).

The offensive line to Mullen is like quarterback to Sherrill.

[BayouDawg]

Sure we have had issues at other positions but we've also made coaching changes at those positions. Hev's group is a constant crap stain. And he's still getting paid.

[msstate7]

Sure we have had issues at other positions but we've also made coaching changes at those positions. Hev's group is a constant crap stain. And he's still getting paid.

Your issue is with Mullen then, not hev. If you have to make a coach fire an assistant, you might as well fire the HC.

[1bigdawg]

Your issue is with Mullen then, not hev. If you have to make a coach fire an assistant, you might as well fire the HC.

Are you Hevesy?????

[msstate7]

Are you Hevesy?????

He's my role model. Hev is the man I one day hope to be.

[BayouDawg]

Your issue is with Mullen then, not hev. If you have to make a coach fire an assistant, you might as well fire the HC.

I think Dan has done a solid job. It is obvious that Hev has been holding us back though. So I'm not gonna carry water for that. My opinion won't get anyone fired though so you and liver can relax.

[Turfdawg67]

We obviously cannot recruit offensive linemen. We will max out at 9/10 level until we correct this. I am not attempting to denigrate Mullen because he does many things well. I am simply pointing out the barrier to elite success.

Bout all you've done in your 30 something posts. Probably a 17'n bear...

[msstate7]

I think Dan has done a solid job. It is obvious that Hev has been holding us back though. So I'm not gonna carry water for that. My opinion won't get anyone fired though so you and liver can relax.

And mine won't get Hev retained so you can relax also

[BayouDawg]

And mine won't get Hev retained so you can relax also
So is now the time we join hands around the fire and sing kumbaya?

[msstate7]

So is now the time we join hands around the fire and sing kumbaya?

I could use a fire. I'm freezing at baseball game

[Turfdawg67]

Vs the top 3 in the SEC West 2015:

LSU- 26 carries/43 yards
Alabama- 42 carries/89 yards
Ole Miss- 34/148 yards

vs Top 3 in the SEC West- 2016:

LSU- 32 carries/56 yards
Auburn- 33 carries/103 yards
Alabama- 35 carries/94 yards


Those are the numbers we put up vs the top of the SEC West year in and year out(2014 was the outlier and we all know this). It's why we never are any kind of legit threat to push for the West title. Its also why we wont be until we recruit better on the OL

I guess if LSU wants to win the West they'll have to recruit OL better too...

LSU vs AL

2015: 26 carries/54 yards
2016: 27 carries/33 yards

[lamont]

I guess if LSU wants to win the West they'll have to recruit OL better too...

LSU vs AL

2015: 26 carries/54 yards
2016: 27 carries/33 yards

LSU is changing their offense- wanna bet they rush for more yards vs Bama this year?????

[Todd4State]

Your issue is with Mullen then, not hev. If you have to make a coach fire an assistant, you might as well fire the HC.

That's a ridiculous take. And how shit like Ron Polk II actually happens at MSU. You tell Dan to re-assign Hevesy within the football program front office which is commonly done or no extension. 4.5 million or Hevesy? What's it going to be Dan?

[msstate7]

That's a ridiculous take. And how shit like Ron Polk II actually happens at MSU. You tell Dan to re-assign Hevesy within the football program front office which is commonly done or no extension. 4.5 million or Hevesy? What's it going to be Dan?

Yeah, he just signed an extension. Dan has done a good job here and I don't think he needs cohen telling him how to coach football

[Todd4State]

Yeah, he just signed an extension. Dan has done a good job here and I don't think he needs cohen telling him how to coach football

He doesn't need Cohen to tell him how to coach football- he needs Cohen to tell him to get rid of his albatross of an o-line coach.

[Maroon Wizardry]

LSU and Oregon can both pull that offer without any backlash... we better make dam sure when we offer that it is legit when it is in our backyard. I'm not a fan of the whole get them to camp before we offer on everybody but i'd wait a little before losing my brains... Also how do we know he hasn't double secret committed already?

[maroonmania]

He doesn't need Cohen to tell him how to coach football- he needs Cohen to tell him to get rid of his albatross of an o-line coach.

Well Cohen would have to do it because Dan is not firing or "reassigning" his buddy. That is the whole issue in that Dan seems to hold coaches that are not is his buddy circle to a much different standard than he does the ones that are, especially Hevesy. We can certainly be a program that routinely wins 6-8 regular season games most years with Hevesy on staff but we certainly can't max out the potential of our program with Hevesy recruiting and running the OL. And you could also say that about some other assistants we've had during Mullen's tenure, the difference with those though is that Dan was more than happy to show them the door.

[HSVDawg]

LSU and Oregon can both pull that offer without any backlash... we better make dam sure when we offer that it is legit when it is in our backyard. I'm not a fan of the whole get them to camp before we offer on everybody but i'd wait a little before losing my brains... Also how do we know he hasn't double secret committed already?

Best take yet from this thread (except maybe the double-secret committed part). This is essentially the reverse of the Keith Holcombe situation with Bama from a few years ago. The point about us not being able to pull the offer later is especially accurate. We can't **** up and piss off an MSU legacy and MS high school coaching staff by pulling an offer from a kid during or after his senior year if he turns out to not be SEC caliber. The fact that both State and OM appear to be keeping him warm tells me that is a possibility. I'm sure he will get an invite to Big Dawg Camp and if he impresses he will get an offer there. If he gets that offer but sticks with LSU all the way through the process, then we can definitely say it was a mistake and laziness from our staff.

[Todd4State]

Well Cohen would have to do it because Dan is not firing or "reassigning" his buddy. That is the whole issue in that Dan seems to hold coaches that are not is his buddy circle to a much different standard than he does the one that are, especially Hevesy. We can certainly be a program that routinely wins 6-8 regular season games most years with Hevesy on staff but we certainly can't max out the potential of our program with Hevesy recruiting and running the OL. And you could also say that about some other assistants we've had during Mullen's tenure, the difference with those though is that Dan was more than happy to show them the door.

I have no problem is Cohen does it.

[Liverpooldawg]

I saw in the Daily Journal this morning his offer list was Troy and Tulane prior to last week. If we had offered him with that list there would have been nearly as much bitching as there was as is. This one is a head scratcher.

[dawgday166]

Best take yet from this thread (except maybe the double-secret committed part). This is essentially the reverse of the Keith Holcombe situation with Bama from a few years ago. The point about us not being able to pull the offer later is especially accurate. We can't **** up and piss off an MSU legacy and MS high school coaching staff by pulling an offer from a kid during or after his senior year if he turns out to not be SEC caliber. The fact that both State and OM appear to be keeping him warm tells me that is a possibility. I'm sure he will get an invite to Big Dawg Camp and if he impresses he will get an offer there. If he gets that offer but sticks with LSU all the way through the process, then we can definitely say it was a mistake and laziness from our staff.

I might agree with this except ... we take so many other OL projects who are busts. If he is a bust not sure that would make a huge difference. Hell, I believe he could at least be like Desper and go through his entire junior year never hitting a soul when run blocking.

[Todd4State]

I saw in the Daily Journal this morning his offer list was Troy and Tulane prior to last week. If we had offered him with that list there would have been nearly as much bitching as there was as is. This one is a head scratcher.

Yes, but it's also fairly early in the process. When Oregon and LSU offer someone and Oregon's coach used to be at Alabama that says a lot. Even worse, Smith was at one of our practices like a week ago.

[Todd4State]

I might agree with this except ... we take so many other OL projects who are busts. If he is a bust not sure that would make a huge difference. Hell, I believe he could at least be like Desper and go through his entire junior year never hitting a soul when run blocking.

If you look at our o-linemen numbers we aren't taking enough as it is if anything from a pure numbers standpoint- I would guess we're only averaging about three high school o-linemen a class. But those three are "projects" because the ones that we aren't getting are the ones that have offers from other schools much of the time, so that's literally all we're left with by default. Otherwise we would have no o-line recruits period. That's why we have to take so many JUCO's- and the bad thing there is often times again we're taking projects like Phillips so there's not really any relief. The highest rated o-linemen we actually have landed the past two cycles from a star standpoint was Martinas Rankin- and not coincidentally it looks like he is our best o-line prospect we've had in awhile.

And when you take three projects a year at a position group that is already difficult to evaluate- you make your margin for error a lot less because the only way that is ever going to work is for us to find three projects and actually have them all pan out.

[Tbonewannabe]

If you look at our o-linemen numbers we aren't taking enough as it is if anything from a pure numbers standpoint- I would guess we're only averaging about three high school o-linemen a class. But those three are "projects" because the ones that we aren't getting are the ones that have offers from other schools much of the time, so that's literally all we're left with by default. Otherwise we would have no o-line recruits period. That's why we have to take so many JUCO's- and the bad thing there is often times again we're taking projects like Phillips so there's not really any relief. The highest rated o-linemen we actually have landed the past two cycles from a star standpoint was Martinas Rankin- and not coincidentally it looks like he is our best o-line prospect we've had in awhile.

And when you take three projects a year at a position group that is already difficult to evaluate- you make your margin for error a lot less because the only way that is ever going to work is for us to find three projects and actually have them all pan out.

Rankin also took a year and a half to look like a SEC Olineman. Does the TEs work with the Oline in practice at all? If they do, hopefully Looney can help out there.

[Ari Gold]

Mean OL. Great genetics. Room to grow. Legacy. Good film. Loves State. Yeah let's not take him and see if he can be another Day or Beckwith....so profoundly ****ing stupid I don't know where to begin. Fireable. And by not offering now and slow playing we will have to work harder to tell him but yeah we've always loved you son and convince him to come. Because he hasn't camped yet? Again fireable.

This guy gets it.. Mic 🎤 drop

[dawgday166]

If you look at our o-linemen numbers we aren't taking enough as it is if anything from a pure numbers standpoint- I would guess we're only averaging about three high school o-linemen a class. But those three are "projects" because the ones that we aren't getting are the ones that have offers from other schools much of the time, so that's literally all we're left with by default. Otherwise we would have no o-line recruits period. That's why we have to take so many JUCO's- and the bad thing there is often times again we're taking projects like Phillips so there's not really any relief. The highest rated o-linemen we actually have landed the past two cycles from a star standpoint was Martinas Rankin- and not coincidentally it looks like he is our best o-line prospect we've had in awhile.

And when you take three projects a year at a position group that is already difficult to evaluate- you make your margin for error a lot less because the only way that is ever going to work is for us to find three projects and actually have them all pan out.

I absolutely agree with this. The scenario that is playing out this spring plays out almost every spring. Every damn year. Our depth sucks cause we lose out on recruits and are usually scrambling at the end to get the 3 or sometimes 4 you're talking about. Usually 1 or 2 of those don't pan out at all, so we are left with about 8 or so somewhat ready to play at an average SEC level Olinemen. And in the spring 2 or 3 starters are out due to rehabilitation.

[dawgday166]

Mean OL. Great genetics. Room to grow. Legacy. Good film. Loves State. Yeah let's not take him and see if he can be another Day or Beckwith....so profoundly ****ing stupid I don't know where to begin. Fireable. And by not offering now and slow playing we will have to work harder to tell him but yeah we've always loved you son and convince him to come. Because he hasn't camped yet? Again fireable.

Everything I've read about him this morning backs up what you just said. And in his picture he looks like he may have the body of a body builder, no big gut hanging over ... he's lean but it says he weighs 275 ... and I've read where he's only 16 too. I believe I also read where he's a power lifting champ I believe.

If this is all true ... I can understand why we don't take him. Hev likes major projects to work with and this guy may not fit that mold *****

[NCDawg]

Yeah, he just signed an extension. Dan has done a good job here and I don't think he needs cohen telling him how to coach football

Yeah, I guess you could say Mullen has done a good job here by our standards, although we were 5-7 last year, barely beat Miami, Ohio in the bowl game, and have lost to Alabama every year Mullen has been here. Not sure that deserves another 4 year 4.5M per year contract, one of the highest in the country. I'm disappointed that our new AD apparently wasn't aware of our inferior OL recruiting and performance and demand that Mullen rectify that situation before awarding him with the new contract.

[Political Hack]

There was also a CB with a 40+" vertical who blew up last year that was interested in State. Scheduled an unofficial but had to cancel because he had a basketball game. Staff hasn't reached out since. Since that times he's gotten over 10 offers including 4 ACC offers. He'll be a 4 star after summer camps and we had a chance to be his 1st P5 offer.

I think this can probably be chalked up to the timing of the new defensive staff, but it's still an example of how we're always late to the party. Bama throws out 100 offers with only 10 being committable this early. I'm not sure why we can't do the same.

[HSVDawg]

If you look at our o-linemen numbers we aren't taking enough as it is if anything from a pure numbers standpoint- I would guess we're only averaging about three high school o-linemen a class. But those three are "projects" because the ones that we aren't getting are the ones that have offers from other schools much of the time, so that's literally all we're left with by default. Otherwise we would have no o-line recruits period. That's why we have to take so many JUCO's- and the bad thing there is often times again we're taking projects like Phillips so there's not really any relief. The highest rated o-linemen we actually have landed the past two cycles from a star standpoint was Martinas Rankin- and not coincidentally it looks like he is our best o-line prospect we've had in awhile.

And when you take three projects a year at a position group that is already difficult to evaluate- you make your margin for error a lot less because the only way that is ever going to work is for us to find three projects and actually have them all pan out.

I agree we need to take more OL. No doubt about that. And I also agree that the ones we do take need to be more talented than they have been. But, for a kid to even qualify as a "project", he has to have the measurables to work with. Right now, there is some doubt about those measurables being there with Smith amongst the in-state staffs. Shit, OM's campus is 20 minutes away, so Luke has probably seen him in person a double-digit number of times (plus, he attended their Jr. day). And we all know how much they'd love to stick a thumb in our eye and pull in an MSU legacy that may end up being a really good player. And they haven't even offered yet either. It cannot be emphasized enough that we just cannot offer an in-state legacy in March or a recruiting cycle if there is even a hint that he might not be a bona fide SEC player. If the situation were reversed and he was a Louisiana kid, we absolutely could do it. But not for a MS kid and especially not for a legacy.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Bama throws out 100 offers with only 10 being committable this early. I'm not sure why we can't do the same.

I get the point, but over the last couple of years we have increased our offers by 100. We were in the 250's in 2014, but last year's class had 360 offers. We already have 230 out right now for 2018, but I understand why Cole is special in this instance.

I'd guess you would know the answer to this...do we recruit by region or by position group?

[HSVDawg]

Bama throws out 100 offers with only 10 being committable this early. I'm not sure why we can't do the same.

We do send out out blanket offers just like Bama and everyone else. But the purpose of blanket offers is to get your foot in the door with out of state kids who may not currently have your school on their radar. You don't send them to in state kids who are very aware of your program unless they are committable offers. And as you said, only 10% are actually committable. LSU also does this same thing and it is very debateable as to how long Smith's offer is commitable if they add more guys. At a minimum, he may have a grayshirt offer coming his way next February.

[Todd4State]

Rankin also took a year and a half to look like a SEC Olineman. Does the TEs work with the Oline in practice at all? If they do, hopefully Looney can help out there.

I still do not believe that Rankin was worse than Rufus Warren. I think if we had allowed him to play in 2015 he probably would have progressed like he did this past year when he was actually given an opportunity to play. I think a lot of the adjustment is actually being out there on the field and playing and experiencing it.

[Todd4State]

I agree we need to take more OL. No doubt about that. And I also agree that the ones we do take need to be more talented than they have been. But, for a kid to even qualify as a "project", he has to have the measurables to work with. Right now, there is some doubt about those measurables being there with Smith amongst the in-state staffs. Shit, OM's campus is 20 minutes away, so Luke has probably seen him in person a double-digit number of times (plus, he attended their Jr. day). And we all know how much they'd love to stick a thumb in our eye and pull in an MSU legacy that may end up being a really good player. And they haven't even offered yet either. It cannot be emphasized enough that we just cannot offer an in-state legacy in March or a recruiting cycle if there is even a hint that he might not be a bona fide SEC player. If the situation were reversed and he was a Louisiana kid, we absolutely could do it. But not for a MS kid and especially not for a legacy.

If he is a good enough prospect for LSU and Oregon, he is a good enough prospect for us to offer right now regardless of whether he is a legacy or not. Slow playing a kid "just because he's a legacy" is equally as bad if not worse than just taking a legacy because he's a legacy and can't play. And even though he is a legacy we still have to recruit them and let them know that we want them. If you think a kid can play- don't *****foot around because you think he will be easy to pick up. Offer him. If Hevesy doesn't think he can play- he better hope he doesn't pan out for LSU is all I have to say about that.

As far as Ole Miss not offering him- they ARE about to be on probation and I would imagine that their numbers are going to be very tight. I think they also would fear us flipping him and basically doing the same thing that happened when they flipped Sean Rawlings from us. If he was an Ole Miss legacy I'm 100% sure they would have offered him right now- and he would probably be in their class.

[Todd4State]

And I'll say this about Mississippi State and legacies in general in all sports....


It seems like if you are a MSU legacy you almost have to be twice as good as a typical prospect to even get an offer from MSU, and that's not right. We have burned so many bridges over the years it's not even funny- John Grisham comes to mind. What does it really hurt if a guy is on our practice squad for five years? I just don't understand it. If there is one thing I am envious of Ole Miss of it's the fact that they treat their legacies well. And while most of those guys end up being Ryan Buchanan's- they also end up being the guys that donate a lot of time and money and have a huge impact on the program in other ways a lot of the time.

And it's even worse if it's a guy that is a legacy that can actually help us out on the field.

[dawgday166]

Just watched the film of Cole. Don't know if his true measureables are 6-4 275, but he moves lot better than any HS OL prospect I believe I've watched other than Lashley. He certainly moves much, much (significantly) better than Eiland did his senior year, and Eiland is playing LT for us right now during spring camp. And Cole looks sculpted like a body builder.

I dunno ... maybe the Dan & Hev know something the rest of us don't. Maybe the drawback is they project him as only being able to play center ... and Hev likes guys that can play anywhere on the line (like Dillon Day ***).

I know we only have about 20 schollys or so to give next year ... so we may not want to waste too many of those on Olinemen *****

[HSVDawg]

If he is a good enough prospect for LSU and Oregon, he is a good enough prospect for us to offer right now regardless of whether he is a legacy or not.

Agreed, but the question is if he is actually good enough for either of them. Him getting a blanket offer that might not still be on the table on signing day does not equate to "good enough for Oregon or LSU". And that is exactly what both of those offers are.


Slow playing a kid "just because he's a legacy" is equally as bad if not worse than just taking a legacy because he's a legacy and can't play. And even though he is a legacy we still have to recruit them and let them know that we want them.

Agreed again, but it is 11 months until signing day. Way too early to say we are "slow playing". We hold just about all of our committable in-state offers until Big Dawg (not just for OL but for everyone) unless the player is 100% elite. This is nothing new. If he shows up at Big Dawg and leaves without an offer and we change our minds and give him one in September or October, then we can say we slow played him.


If you think a kid can play- don't *****foot around because you think he will be easy to pick up. Offer him. If Hevesy doesn't think he can play- he better hope he doesn't pan out for LSU is all I have to say about that.

So what if you think the kid can't play, or don't know if he can play? That is obviously where we are with Cole Smith right now. If we haven't seen him in person yet and that is why we haven't offered yet, that is a problem. But if we have seen him and are in process of gathering more data to make sure he's not a tweener, that is another story.


As far as Ole Miss not offering him- they ARE about to be on probation and I would imagine that their numbers are going to be very tight. I think they also would fear us flipping him and basically doing the same thing that happened when they flipped Sean Rawlings from us. If he was an Ole Miss legacy I'm 100% sure they would have offered him right now- and he would probably be in their class.

Fair point.

[TimberBeast]

Your issue is with Mullen then, not hev. If you have to make a coach fire an assistant, you might as well fire the HC.

Yep, been saying it for years. Go ahead and get it done.

[Dawg61]

Yep, been saying it for years. Go ahead and get it done.

wtf? You don't fire the most successful coach by far in our history because he won't fire a guy you think he should fire. You guys don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. Get over it or become our AD and guess what you still don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. He's not firing Hevesy so stop acting like a bunch of shitty diaper toddlers about it. Posting 7 billion melt posts about it isn't going to change Mullen's mind.

[smootness]

There was also a CB with a 40+" vertical who blew up last year that was interested in State. Scheduled an unofficial but had to cancel because he had a basketball game. Staff hasn't reached out since. Since that times he's gotten over 10 offers including 4 ACC offers. He'll be a 4 star after summer camps and we had a chance to be his 1st P5 offer.

I think this can probably be chalked up to the timing of the new defensive staff, but it's still an example of how we're always late to the party. Bama throws out 100 offers with only 10 being committable this early. I'm not sure why we can't do the same.

We've been first to the party on plenty of kids like this.

[smootness]

wtf? You don't fire the most successful coach by far in our history because he won't fire a guy you think he should fire. You guys don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. Get over it or become our AD and guess what you still don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. He's not firing Hevesy so stop acting like a bunch of shitty diaper toddlers about it. Posting 7 billion melt posts about it isn't going to change Mullen's mind.

100% agreed. Good post, 61.

[NCDawg]

Yep, been saying it for years. Go ahead and get it done.

No, I'm sure most fans don't want Mullen fired. But it is a shame that he's making this personal, not business, as they say in The Godfather. Guess we'll never know how good we could be if we had a good, solid, offensive line.

[dawgday166]

We've been first to the party on plenty of kids like this.

Can you give us a list on OL targets? On D side of ball and at QB or RB I would probably agree with you.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

As far as Ole Miss not offering him- they ARE about to be on probation and I would imagine that their numbers are going to be very tight. I think they also would fear us flipping him and basically doing the same thing that happened when they flipped Sean Rawlings from us. If he was an Ole Miss legacy I'm 100% sure they would have offered him right now- and he would probably be in their class.

Isn't this supposed to be a small class for us as well?

I can't get an answer on this...do you know if our recruiters recruit by their position group or are they assigned a region?

[dawgday166]

Yep, been saying it for years. Go ahead and get it done.

I'm not there just yet but ... chiming in to defend your statement somewhat here.

If this guy blows up big, goes somewhere else and becomes a stud, we better win the whole SEC in 2018 or I'll be on board with you. I'm really tired of the same ole OL scenario every spring and thus translating into fall that we go through every year. Looking for a center, in spring starters are hurt, just in general looking for bodies to put out there cause we don't have any freakin depth to speak of.

Everyone seems to think all these big 340 - 350 lb guys are the answer. We'll see when a 230 lb Bama OLB is blowing past them to kill one of our stud QBs!!

[msstate7]

I'm not there just yet but ... chiming in to defend your statement somewhat here.

If this guy blows up big, goes somewhere else and becomes a stud, we better win the whole SEC in 2018 or I'll be on board with you. I'm really tired of the same ole OL scenario every spring and thus translating into fall that we go through every year. Looking for a center, in spring starters are hurt, just in general looking for bodies to put out there cause we don't have any freakin depth to speak of.

Everyone seems to think all these big 340 - 350 lb guys are the answer. We'll see when a 230 lb Bama OLB is blowing past them to kill one of our stud QBs!!

Cole smith has yet to begin his senior year and you clowns are already planning mullen's (most successful HC here ever) termination bc Mullen hasn't offered in your timely manner. Good grief

[Liverpooldawg]

Had any Of y'all even heard of this guy before last week?

[maroonmania]

Cole smith has yet to begin his senior year and you clowns are already planning mullen's (most successful HC here ever) termination bc Mullen hasn't offered in your timely manner. Good grief

No, but I think most have been planning Hevesy's termination for at least the past 4 years. Just can't get Mullen to execute the order.

[dawgday166]

Cole smith has yet to begin his senior year and you clowns are already planning mullen's (most successful HC here ever) termination bc Mullen hasn't offered in your timely manner. Good grief

No ... just saying if this does happen. I'm not buying into 6'8" and 6'9" - 350 lb guys that can't move either. Size ain't everything. Maybe they are that big and can move ... we'll see. I don't know for sure yet. There usually is a law of diminishing return tho.

I'm already some irritated about the spring practice reports relative to OL from this year. And I'm really tired of losing 4 SEC W games every year ... sorry if that offends anyone.

I'm trying my best to be open-minded and wait to see and give Dan a chance. So I'll say 10 wins in '18 will be acceptable to unless Cole Smith becomes a stud lineman somewhere else haha. Then we better win SEC W and SEC Championship.

[msstate7]

No ... just saying if this does happen. I'm not buying into 6'8" and 6'9" - 350 lb guys that can't move either. Size ain't everything. Maybe they are that big and can move ... we'll see. I don't know for sure yet. There usually is a law of diminishing return tho.

I'm already some irritated about the spring practice reports relative to OL from this year. And I'm really tired of losing 4 SEC W games every year ... sorry if that offends anyone.

I'm trying my best to be open-minded and wait to see and give Dan a chance. So I'll say 10 wins in '18 will be acceptable to unless Cole Smith becomes a stud lineman somewhere else haha. Then we better win SEC W and SEC Championship.

In the original Rankin playing center melt thread, I posted a link telling about how bama had to completely re-shuffle oline bc of an injury on the oline. We've got our 2 top guys at center out right now. Now if bama with the best recruiting in the country has to shuffle the line with 1 oline injury, how much more so with us considering Hev is the worst coach to ever walk the earth and supported hitler in the holocaust?

No, I'm not really saying Hev supported hitter

[Dawg61]

I'm trying my best to be open-minded and wait to see and give Dan a chance. So I'll say 10 wins in '18 will be acceptable to unless Cole Smith becomes a stud lineman somewhere else haha. Then we better win SEC W and SEC Championship.

Acceptable? Haha unless it's been 50 years since we last lost to Maine and 3-2 vs Auburn the words "acceptable" and "10 wins" should never be uttered in the same sentence when referring to MSU football. Acceptable means the same thing as par. 10 wins in a season will never be our par unless we start playing 16 game seasons. Only Alabama has averaged 10 wins a season the last decade in the SEC.

[maroonmania]

In the original Rankin playing center melt thread, I posted a link telling about how bama had to completely re-shuffle oline bc of an injury on the oline. We've got our 2 top guys at center out right now. Now if bama with the best recruiting in the country has to shuffle the line with 1 oline injury, how much more so with us considering Hev is the worst recruiter to ever walk the earth and supported hitler in the holocaust?

No, I'm not really saying Hev supported hitter

FIFY, I think most would say his coaching is at least not terrible.

[dawgday166]

In the original Rankin playing center melt thread, I posted a link telling about how bama had to completely re-shuffle oline bc of an injury on the oline. We've got our 2 top guys at center out right now. Now if bama with the best recruiting in the country has to shuffle the line with 1 oline injury, how much more so with us considering Hev is the worst coach to ever walk the earth and supported hitler in the holocaust?

No, I'm not really saying Hev supported hitter

Well ... I like this kid's video and if he is truly 6'4 275 ... seems exactly like the kind of kid Wisconsin recruits all day every day. And they put guys into the league.

I'm not saying fire Dan just yet. If you can get all over Howland and Cann in there first 2 and 1 years each when they have an excuse for getting there asses handed to them by other SEC teams ... I reserve the right to do the same with Dan/Hev going on their 9th year now ******

[dawgday166]

Acceptable? Haha unless it's been 50 years since we last lost to Maine and 3-2 vs Auburn the words "acceptable" and "10 wins" should never be uttered in the same sentence when referring to MSU football. Acceptable means the same thing as par. 10 wins in a season will never be our par unless we start playing 16 game seasons. Only Alabama has averaged 10 wins a season the last decade in the SEC.

In 1 season (2018) is what I'm talking about. 2014 we won 10 didn't we?

[Dawg61]

In 1 season (2018) is what I'm talking about. 2014 we won 10 didn't we?

Yea but that's never just "acceptable". If you start putting measures like that on a program at MSU you will always be miserable.

[lamont]

We've got our 2 top guys at center out right now.

Only guys we have out are Calhoun and Jenkins. Jenkins isnt a Center. We have 1 Center out. Moon is working with the 2nd group

[msstate7]

Only guys we have out are Calhoun and Jenkins. Jenkins isnt a Center. We have 1 Center out. Moon is working with the 2nd group

Williams

[lamont]

He is playing RG with the 1st group

[smootness]

Can you give us a list on OL targets? On D side of ball and at QB or RB I would probably agree with you.

He wasn't talking about OL.

[msstate7]

He is playing RG with the 1st group

Cool. I heard he was out and center. Glad he's healthy

[lamont]

So that means Williams isnt a Center and Moon isnt good enough to work with the 1st group.

Either Rankin is our back-up Center- or we are moving Rankin to Center.

[dawgday166]

He wasn't talking about OL.

I know ... that's my point. We good at early offers to future studs on D. I guess that in 9 years you'd think we did that 1 time with an OL recruit. Maybe we have but if so, I don't remember it.

[WSOPdawg]

Isn't this supposed to be a small class for us as well?

I can't get an answer on this...do you know if our recruiters recruit by their position group or are they assigned a region?

My thoughts exactly. I thought our signing # for 2018 was gonna be 15 or so plus who we process so that we may can push 20 signees. If so, then we've got to be careful who we offer and it seems like the ones who've camp with us move to the top of the list over those who don't.

[Todd4State]

Isn't this supposed to be a small class for us as well?

I can't get an answer on this...do you know if our recruiters recruit by their position group or are they assigned a region?

My guess is we will sign between 23-25. I think we will process guys out that are currently off the roster that aren't performing so it won't be small.

Each player has two recruiters- one is the area recruiter and then the other one is the position coach based on whatever position that recruit plays.

So, if I am QB prospect from Madison Central, my two recruiters are going to be Greg Knox (area) and Brett Elliott (position) and I'll probably be hearing from Brad Peterson a lot too on the phone.

[msbulldog]

wtf? You don't fire the most successful coach by far in our history because he won't fire a guy you think he should fire. You guys don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. Get over it or become our AD and guess what you still don't get to dictate everything Mullen does. He's not firing Hevesy so stop acting like a bunch of shitty diaper toddlers about it. Posting 7 billion melt posts about it isn't going to change Mullen's mind.

Testify!