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View Full Version : Kenpom ratings and Howland



Quaoarsking
03-11-2017, 02:37 PM
I know it's cool to be down on Howland these days, but he's really done a pretty good job here. Here's a chart of the Kenpom ratings going back to 2002 (as far as they go):

http://i.imgur.com/pihYg59.png

The Kenpom ratings examine a team's offense and defense and are a lot more accurate way to measure how good a team really is, compared to RPI (which doesn't even consider margin of victory) or just record, postseason success, etc. If you want to do really well in your bracket challenge, use these ratings as your #1 resource.

Anyway, Rick Ray's last team was his best, but was still a good bit worse than Stansbury's worst. Howland took all those same players who couldn't do anything under Ray and got their Kenpom all the way back down to the average over Stansbury's last 4 years. Then he loses almost all of the contributors on the team (all but Q and Ready), reloads with a bunch of freshmen and only drops off a little.

Now don't get me wrong, we've got to improve. I want us to be more like 2002-08 Stansbury, not 2009-12 Stansbury, but it's pretty clear we're on the way.

msstate7
03-11-2017, 02:44 PM
In no way am I saying ray is better or equal to howland, but howland had more than just returning starters from '15. Q and Malik were pretty big additions. I know Malik wouldn't have been here without howland, but that loss would've been negligible bc of tookie. Q was a ray recruit. I think '15 would've been close to the same KenPom rating had ray stayed. Our outlook for next season and beyond would've been much worse though. Obviously I'm happy we made the move

Dawg61
03-11-2017, 03:07 PM
That's a drastic jump with the same players. Pretty amazing actually that we are top 100 both years. Any chance we get in the CBI?

MarketingBully
03-11-2017, 03:09 PM
In no way am I saying ray is better or equal to howland, but howland had more than just returning starters from '15. Q and Malik were pretty big additions. I know Malik wouldn't have been here without howland, but that loss would've been negligible bc of tookie. Q was a ray recruit. I think '15 would've been close to the same KenPom rating had ray stayed. Our outlook for next season and beyond would've been much worse though. Obviously I'm happy we made the move

Malik injured his toe and did not recover. There were also major chemistry issues with that team last year. The injury along with the seniors acting like a bunch of jealous assholes basically led to Malik leaving. I think had our seniors bought in initially and understood their role things would have been exceedingly different the last two years. Malik would have stayed averaged 20 or so with Q probably averaging about as much as he is now and we would have been in the tournament both years along with Malik leaving for the NBA a first round pick.

missouridawg
03-11-2017, 03:22 PM
Malik injured his toe and did not recover. There were also major chemistry issues with that team last year. The injury along with the seniors acting like a bunch of jealous assholes basically led to Malik leaving. I think had our seniors bought in initially and understood their role things would have been exceedingly different the last two years. Malik would have stayed averaged 20 or so with Q probably averaging about as much as he is now and we would have been in the tournament both years along with Malik leaving for the NBA a first round pick.

Your impression of Malik was very different than mine. Really good player, but I think he is going to struggle to make an NBA roster.

MarketingBully
03-11-2017, 03:27 PM
Your impression of Malik was very different than mine. Really good player, but I think he is going to struggle to make an NBA roster.

We shall see. Unfortunately, he will be at Kansas one year then off to the NBA. I think in the end it was better for both parties that he moved on the way it worked out.

thf24
03-11-2017, 03:56 PM
Your impression of Malik was very different than mine. Really good player, but I think he is going to struggle to make an NBA roster.

Agreed. Newman was not the same player for us that he was billed to be coming in. Great shooter and smart player, but fairly sluggish and awkward handling the ball. I'm sure the toe injury played a role in that but I don't think as much as most seem to believe. He just doesn't appear to be a very fluid athlete when placed alongside college-level peers. I would love for him still to be here, and I'm sure he would have had a great career with us and will have a decent one with Kansas. But unless he develops/redevelops better ball handling, ability to drive, and fluidity in general, at 6'2" he won't sniff the NBA.