Cowboys vs. Packers Game thread...

[IMissJack]

Crap!!!!Good game though.

[Goldendawg]

Dog gone it! Never thought I would feel really bad cause Dallas lost a game! Hail Dak! Hail State!

[LC Dawg]

Great game. That catch will go down in Packers history. Oh yeah, **** Aaron Rodgers.

[MarketingBully]

The Officials game. Dallas was ****ed by the refs.

[msstate7]

Falcons vs chiefs super bowl

[IMissJack]

So the Dez Bryant call wasn't a catch and that was? **** the officials!

they were both catches

[MarketingBully]

Falcons will be in the Super Bowl.

[msstate7]

Dak was great, but unfortunately his int in scoring position is the difference in the game. He's gonna be great though and pretty much is already

[parabrave]

FU GB, FU REFS. Lets go chiefs

[IMissJack]

Dak- 24/38 302 yds 3 TD 1 INT

Rodgers- 28/43 356 yds 2TDs 1 INT

Dallas D was just not strong enough most of the day.

[Goldendawg]

Dallas D lost this game in the 1st half, along with questionable calls at times by the Refs.

[starkvegasdawg]

Falcons will be in the Super Bowl.
Hope you're right.

[DownwardDawg]

Sickening

[msstate7]

Dallas D lost this game in the 1st half, along with questionable calls at times by the Refs.

Dallas clocking ball on 1st down on their last possession was dumb and led to Rodgers having time

[MarketingBully]

Dak was great, but unfortunately his int in scoring position is the difference in the game. He's gonna be great though and pretty much is already

Are you kidding me? That next drive Rodgers threw the pick and Dallas scored on it. That loss was on their defense.

[maroonmania]

Well, with GB's kicker they had to keep them out of FG range and couldn't do it. Tough one for sure.

[dawgday166]

Not a good play call on D on last catch. Rush 3 with a spy on Rogers, drop 7. Every rusher was picked up easily. Can't give Rogers that much time back there. You lose every time.

[IMissJack]

Time to trade Romo and use some of that salary cap to buy a defense!!!

[smootness]

Dak was great, but unfortunately his int in scoring position is the difference in the game. He's gonna be great though and pretty much is already

He outplayed Rodgers. That is not why they lost.

Ultimately, the decision to rush 3 on Rodgers on the 3rd and 20 will haunt them. Atrocious call there.

[MarketingBully]

Dallas clocking ball on 1st down on their last possession was dumb and led to Rodgers having time

Two idiot things you said in a row. You have to stop the clock there. How did Dallas know that their OL wouldn't give Dak anytime on that third down.

[DownwardDawg]

That wasn't a catch.

It was a great catch and a great throw. Unfortunately, it was poorly defended. Prevent D

[Dawgface]

Dak- 24/38 302 yds 3 TD 1 INT

Rodgers- 28/43 356 yds 2TDs 1 INT

Dallas D was just not strong enough most of the day.

True. Dallas needs to add a couple of players on D. Just not a Super bowl type D. But good comeback effort by Dak. Made a couple of mistakes but gutted it out as usual.

[dawgday166]

It was a great catch and a great throw. Unfortunately, it was poorly defended. Prevent D

Precisely. I have no clue why anyone will run it, especially against a QB the caliber of Rogers. You just beat yourself.

[maroonmania]

Dallas clocking ball on 1st down on their last possession was dumb and led to Rodgers having time

Well you've got to do that because at the time you are thinking you might still have a shot at scoring a game winning TD.

[msstate7]

Two idiot things you said in a row. You have to stop the clock there. How did Dallas know that their OL wouldn't give Dak anytime on that third down.

At the 40 with a TO, so you only need 5 yards and have :48 seconds left. Don't waste the down

[MarketingBully]

Well you've got to do that because at the time you are thinking you might still have a shot at scoring a game winning TD.

Exactly.

[BeardoMSU]

Dak was great, but unfortunately his int in scoring position is the difference in the game. He's gonna be great though and pretty much is already

Not really. GB didn't score off that turn over. If you're gonna place blame, it goes on the D...and it wasn't just giving up that 36 yard bomb with 3 seconds left. They put the offense in such a hole. The offense tied it up. Then the D gave it right back. The offense tied it again. The D let them down, uh-gan....

[msstate7]

Well you've got to do that because at the time you are thinking you might still have a shot at scoring a game winning TD.

You give yourself 2 downs though instead of 3. GB is scrambling around to get set... that's your time to take a shot downfield

[DancingRabbit]

Dallas clocking ball on 1st down on their last possession was dumb and led to Rodgers having time

Yeah, if you do that you have to convert the 1st down.

[msstate7]

Not really. GB didn't score off that turn over. If you're gonna place blame, it goes on the D...and it wasn't just giving up that 36 yard bomb with 3 seconds left. They put the offense in such a hole. The offense tied it up. Then the D gave it right back. The offense tied it again. The D let them down, uh-gan....
I'm not blaming dak for the loss, but it was a lost scoring opportunity.

[dawgday166]

Well you've got to do that because at the time you are thinking you might still have a shot at scoring a game winning TD.


At the 40 with a TO, so you only need 5 yards and have :48 seconds left. Don't waste the down

I can see it either way. If it works either way its a great call. If it doesn't its a stupid call.

[smootness]

You give yourself 2 downs though instead of 3. GB is scrambling around to get set... that's your time to take a shot downfield

They got the FG. The extra time doesn't matter if you don't rush 3 the next drive. They played them straight up on that drive and it worked...then on the last play, gave it all back.

[maroonmania]

Bottom line is that 21-3 is just a gigantic hole to climb out of. I'm still amazed they got it back tied twice.

[MarketingBully]

The play of the game was the defensive pass interference call that led to the first Green Bay field goal try. At the very least, that ball was uncatchable. You hold your whistle there because not only was that not holding but it wasn't interference either. Every call possible went Green Bay's way. Never seen an away team not named Alabama get that privledge. It's obvious for whatever reason the refs wanted Green Bay in the NFC championship game.

[Dawgowar]

Marinelli can only work with what Jerry invests in - some hard truth's:

The defensive talent is marginal and he has squeezed everything out of that line he can.
Jerry wasted a second round pick on the gamble Jaylon Smith will be healthy NEXT year (out with knee from Bowl Game) - he should have drafted the best DL available
DB's are spotty
The only reason they were competitive was Marinelli and his calls. He does not have a Sapp or Simeon Rice on this team.
Time to invest in the defense, a new RT, and another WR - draft and FA market. Cap should be friendly.

[dawgday166]

The play of the game was the defensive pass interference call that led to the first Green Bay field goal try. At the very least, that ball was uncatchable. You hold your whistle there because not only was that not holding but it wasn't interference either. Every call possible went Green Bay's way. Never seen an away team not named Alabama get that privledge. It's obvious for whatever reason the refs wanted Green Bay in the NFC championship game.

That was the right call.

[msstate7]

Either way, the NFC championship game will mimic a big12 game in scoring. Atlanta offense is better than dallas' though, so Atlanta wins

[MarketingBully]

I'm not blaming dak for the loss, but it was a lost scoring opportunity.

You said it was on Dak.

[DownwardDawg]

Not really. GB didn't score off that turn over. If you're gonna place blame, it goes on the D...and it wasn't just giving up that 36 yard bomb with 3 seconds left. They put the offense in such a hole. The offense tied it up. Then the D gave it right back. The offense tied it again. The D let them down, uh-gan....

Yep. This game was lost by the Dallas D in the first half. Plain and simple. And that prevent D on the next to last play was stupid.

[smootness]

The play of the game was the defensive pass interference call that led to the first Green Bay field goal try. At the very least, that ball was uncatchable. You hold your whistle there because not only was that not holding but it wasn't interference either. Every call possible went Green Bay's way. Never seen an away team not named Alabama get that privledge. It's obvious for whatever reason the refs wanted Green Bay in the NFC championship game.

No, it was catchable. He stopped running after the penalty because he couldn't see the ball and was still only about 5 yards away when it came down. You have to call it. It was a clear penalty.

[smootness]

Marinelli can only work with what Jerry invests in - some hard truth's:

The defensive talent is marginal and he has squeezed everything out of that line he can.
Jerry wasted a second round pick on the gamble Jaylon Smith will be healthy NEXT year (out with knee from Bowl Game) - he should have drafted the best DL available
DB's are spotty
The only reason they were competitive was Marinelli and his calls. He does not have a Sapp or Simeon Rice on this team.
Time to invest in the defense, a new RT, and another WR - draft and FA market. Cap should be friendly.

But if Smith is healthy next year, your D gets a massive boost.

[MarketingBully]

That was the right call.

It was an uncatchable Hail Mary that shit head Rodgers threw up for grabs. You rarely see that called on that kind of play. Normally when a QB takes a chance like that and throws into double coverage you get burned. They wouldn't have called it and let GB get away with a lot worse on the other side.

[msstate7]

You said it was on Dak.

I said that lost scoring chance was the difference in the game. I'm not even sure the int was completely dak's fault bc dez whiffed on block. Whatever though... don't you have some officials to blame?

[dawgday166]

It was an uncatchable Hail Mary that shit head Rodgers threw up for grabs. You rarely see that called on that kind of play. Normally when a QB takes a chance like that and throws into double coverage you get burned. They wouldn't have called it and let GB get away with a lot worse on the other side.

I wasn't uncatchable if he ain't held.

[smootness]

It was an uncatchable Hail Mary that shit head Rodgers threw up for grabs. You rarely see that called on that kind of play. Normally when a QB takes a chance like that and throws into double coverage you get burned. They wouldn't have called it and let GB get away with a lot worse on the other side.

It was a penalty. It wasn't a Hail Mary throw. Without the contact, the WR is right there to make a play on it. You can't give Dallas the INT after that contact.

[MarketingBully]

No, it was catchable. He stopped running after the penalty because he couldn't see the ball and was still only about 5 yards away when it came down. You have to call it. It was a clear penalty.

The bump occurred before the ball was in the air. The ball landed at the 25 yet the foul occured at the 35. How the **** is that catchable?

[MarketingBully]

If you are a receiver and give up on the route, you can't catch the damn ball.

[smootness]

The bump occurred before the ball was in the air. The ball landed at the 25 yet the foul occured at the 35. How the **** is that catchable?

He could have easily run 10 yards while the ball was in the air. I'm fine if you want to call it holding because it happened right before the ball came out, but you hit the WR downfield and knocked him off his route. That is a penalty every time.

[smootness]

If you are a receiver and give up on the route, you can't catch the damn ball.

He didn't know where the ball was because he got hit. He didn't just give up.

[MarketingBully]

He could have easily run 10 yards while the ball was in the air. I'm fine if you want to call it holding because it happened right before the ball came out, but you hit the WR downfield and knocked him off his route. That is a penalty every time.

Wasn't on Green Bay's secondary and they had many more egregious calls that weren't called. If you want to get technical about it, GB had a take down of Whitten much worse then what was called on Dallas that would have made it first and goal at the three instead Dallas had to get a field goal. Those 4 points loom pretty large right about now...

[dawgday166]

Lotta coulda, woulda, shouldas. An accumulation of plays/calls made up the game. Good hard fought game just didn't turn out the way we wanted. Dak made a mistake on pick but came back tough and brought them back. Just good football IMO on both sides of ball.

These 2 teams are good teams. Somebody's gotta lose.

[DancingRabbit]

The bump occurred before the ball was in the air. The ball landed at the 25 yet the foul occured at the 35. How the **** is that catchable?

I'm not sure if the pass had been thrown or not, but I was thinking it should have been the 5 yard penalty,

[smootness]

Wasn't on Green Bay's secondary and they had many more egregious calls that weren't called. If you want to get technical about it, GB had a take down of Whitten much worse then what was called on Dallas that would have made it first and goal at the three instead Dallas had to get a field goal. Those 4 points loom pretty large right about now...

I'm not talking about any other calls. That play was a penalty. Every time.

[Dawgowar]

But if Smith is healthy next year, your D gets a massive boost.

Won't argue that but we really needed help this year. It was on the board and they wasted it in the second round. That said he seems to be a hard working kid who wants to play equally as hard. They need some star quality on that D apart from Sean Lee and the Safety Jones. Maybe the nose tackle from Nebraska. He came on strong towards the end.

Ugh, haven't been this frustrated with a loss by any of my teams in a long time. When ROmo was under center I just expected to lose. Dak played his ass off. 17! 17! 17!

[MarketingBully]

Look, I'm of the mantra for an officiaiting crew that if you're going to let things slide let them slide equally. Green Bay held all game. Dallas gets called for one. Green Bay's secondary was holding and interfering practically the whole night. They get called for two while Dallas has all of theirs called except two or so of them. If your going to call it tight or close, at least call the shit evenly. That pass intereference call that changed the game should have been a five yard hold. No way is that catchable and it was a hold before the ball is even released. But I am okay with them calling that if they would have called the Whitten take down at the goal line because they cost Dallas 4 points by not doing their job. I am also okay with no holds called but what did they do? Call a hold on Dallas even though almost every Rodgers scramble play was a hold. If they call at least one hold against GB on one of their scramble play plays I would have been okay with it.

[smootness]

Won't argue that but we really needed help this year. It was on the board and they wasted it in the second round. That said he seems to be a hard working kid who wants to play equally as hard. They need some star quality on that D apart from Sean Lee and the Safety Jones. Maybe the nose tackle from Nebraska. He came on strong towards the end.

Ugh, haven't been this frustrated with a loss by any of my teams in a long time. When ROmo was under center I just expected to lose. Dak played his ass off. 17! 17! 17!

I get that, but he's a top 10 talent. You weren't getting that with anybody else in the 2nd, so though someone else may have helped this year, he should help a lot more next year.

This is Year 1 of a long, successful stretch coming up for Dallas. You have one of the best QBs in the league, and you're paying him nothing. Roethlisberger and Wilson both won the SB in Year 2 because of what it allowed them to invest in elsewhere, and neither one was as good as Dak is right now.

[MarketingBully]

I'm not talking about any other calls. That play was a penalty. Every time.

The Whitten take down play is a penalty every time except today.

[Dawgowar]

I get that, but he's a top 10 talent. You weren't getting that with anybody else in the 2nd, so though someone else may have helped this year, he should help a lot more next year.

This is Year 1 of a long, successful stretch coming up for Dallas. You have one of the best QBs in the league, and you're paying him nothing. Roethlisberger and Wilson both won the SB in Year 2 because of what it allowed them to invest in elsewhere, and neither one was as good as Dak is right now.

The other piece is Jerry's tendency to draft head cases who smoke weed like Snoop Dog or pay Bama LB's who practice amateur pharmacology. Oh well, time to look at the 2017 FA's and start tracking the draft (infinitely more enjoyable than following recruiting)

[Commercecomet24]

Look, I'm of the mantra for an officiaiting crew that if you're going to let things slide let them slide equally. Green Bay held all game. Dallas gets called for one. Green Bay's secondary was holding and interfering practically the whole night. They get called for two while Dallas has all of theirs called except two or so of them. If your going to call it tight or close, at least call the shit evenly. That pass intereference call that changed the game should have been a five yard hold. No way is that catchable and it was a hold before the ball is even released. But I am okay with them calling that if they would have called the Whitten take down at the goal line because they cost Dallas 4 points by not doing their job. I am also okay with no holds called but what did they do? Call a hold on Dallas even though almost every Rodgers scramble play was a hold. If they call at least one hold against GB on one of their scramble play plays I would have been okay with it.

Yep this is an accurate synopsis of the game.

[maroonmania]

I'm not talking about any other calls. That play was a penalty. Every time.

So was the takedown of Whitten in the redzone before the first half but it wasn't called. Nothing is a penalty until the ref decides he wants to call it. Yes, the defender raked against the shoulder when the receiver was making the turn but there was much worse in the game that didn't get called. I'll agree it was a legit call though.

[MarketingBully]

So I guess it's basically a foregone conclusion IMO that the Patriots win the Super Bowl. Count me out of watching any more NFL this year. GB and ATL have no defense and New England is gonna light up whoever wins the AFC championship game. At least with Dak playing, I had someone to root for. I'm not a fan of any of the other teams left.

[Dawgowar]

So I guess it's basically a foregone conclusion IMO that the Patriots win the Super Bowl. Count me out of watching any more NFL this year. GB and ATL have no defense and New England is gonna light up whoever wins the AFC championship game. At least with Dak playing, I had someone to root for. I'm not a fan of any of the other teams left.

Chris Jones plays for the Chiefs

[smootness]

So I guess it's basically a foregone conclusion IMO that the Patriots win the Super Bowl. Count me out of watching any more NFL this year. GB and ATL have no defense and New England is gonna light up whoever wins the AFC championship game. At least with Dak playing, I had someone to root for. I'm not a fan of any of the other teams left.

Not at all. I think the Falcons are the best team left, and they, Pittsburgh, or GB could absolutely beat NE.

[msstate7]

Not at all. I think the Falcons are the best team left, and they, Pittsburgh, or GB could absolutely beat NE.

Is Julio healthy? If he's good to go, the falcons are the best offense in the NFL

[MarketingBully]

Not at all. I think the Falcons are the best team left, and they, Pittsburgh, or GB could absolutely beat NE.

The Falcons aren't winning the Super Bowl and it wouldn't surprise me if the Refs do the same thing to Atlanta that they did to Dallas. Rodgers is one of their "stars" they'll do whatever it takes to help.

[MarketingBully]

Chris Jones plays for the Chiefs

I don't think they beat Pittsburgh but if KC makes the Super Bowl I'll pull for them.

[ShotgunDawg]

Other than Rodgers being a part of the game, in many ways this game reminded me of our game against LSU in 2015.

Dak played his rear off, came back, but the ill-advised spike on first down after the first down completion to Witten reminded me an awful lot of the Mullen/Dak snafu to end the LSU game. Not sure if things were moving too fast for Dak, Garrett, or Linehan, but that spike basically cost them the game.

If they run a play, the clock keeps running thus no leaving 3 seconds on the clock for Green Bay at the end & the Cowboys would've had 3 downs to get a first down before attempting a Bailey FG.

Not sure what the thinking was there, but you just can't waste a down in that situation.

[MarketingBully]

Other than Rodgers being a part of the game, in many ways this game reminded me of our game against LSU in 2015.

Dak played his rear off, came back, but the ill-advised spike on first down after the first down completion to Witten reminded me an awful lot of the Mullen/Dak snafu to end the LSU game. Not sure if things were moving too fast for Dak, Garrett, or Linehan, but that spike basically cost them the game.

If they run a play, the clock keeps running thus no leaving 3 seconds on the clock for Green Bay at the end & the Cowboys would've had 3 downs to get a first down before attempting a Bailey FG.

Not sure what the thinking was there, but you just can't waste a down in that situation.

The thinking is you want to conserve time to win the game with a touchdown. The problem was that the ahole Green Bay lineman jumped up and deflected the pass. If the DL doesn't do that, it's a completion and first and ten inside the red zone. It was only a bad play because of the good play by the GB lineman who timed his jump perfectly to deflect the pass.

[ShotgunDawg]

The thinking is you want to conserve time to win the game with a touchdown. The problem was that the ahole Green Bay lineman jumped up and deflected the pass. If the DL doesn't do that, it's a completion and first and ten inside the red zone. It was only a bad play because of the good play by the GB lineman who timed his jump perfectly to deflect the pass.

Nah, the Cowboys had a time out. No sense in wasting a play there unless absolutely necessary to stop the clock. With 48 seconds left after a 10 yard gain, immediately stopping the clock isn't the utmost priority. Running a play at 36 seconds to go & one time out would've been fine.

[dawgday166]

Other than Rodgers being a part of the game, in many ways this game reminded me of our game against LSU in 2015.

Dak played his rear off, came back, but the ill-advised spike on first down after the first down completion to Witten reminded me an awful lot of the Mullen/Dak snafu to end the LSU game. Not sure if things were moving too fast for Dak, Garrett, or Linehan, but that spike basically cost them the game.

If they run a play, the clock keeps running thus no leaving 3 seconds on the clock for Green Bay at the end & the Cowboys would've had 3 downs to get a first down before attempting a Bailey FG.

Not sure what the thinking was there, but you just can't waste a down in that situation.


The thinking is you want to conserve time to win the game with a touchdown. The problem was that the ahole Green Bay lineman jumped up and deflected the pass. If the DL doesn't do that, it's a completion and first and ten inside the red zone. It was only a bad play because of the good play by the GB lineman who timed his jump perfectly to deflect the pass.

Yea ... I don't put today anywhere near the same category of mistake than Dan 2 years ago against LSU. Today ... it's a percentage call that didn't work out for big D.

[HSVDawg]

The thinking is you want to conserve time to win the game with a touchdown. The problem was that the ahole Green Bay lineman jumped up and deflected the pass. If the DL doesn't do that, it's a completion and first and ten inside the red zone. It was only a bad play because of the good play by the GB lineman who timed his jump perfectly to deflect the pass.

With 50 seconds left, already across midfield, and a timeout still in their pocket, the spike wasn't a great decision there. That is a football eternity. But, it was at least understandable what they were trying to do. No way was it comparable to the delay of game at the end of that LSU game. The prevent D on 3rd and 20 against the best improvising QB in the game is what really cost them. Rushing only 3 against Rogers in that situation is a death sentence. Keeping two high safeties and bringing pressure would have likely forced the ball out sooner.

[Mjoelner34]

I didn't mind the spike. I question the 3rd down pass. They were already in FG range and had a TO. Run the read option to Zeke and let Dak keep it. Get a 1st down, spike it. Don't get a first down, run clock down to 3 seconds call TO, kick FG go to OT.

[HSVDawg]

I didn't mind the spike. I question the 3rd down pass. They were already in FG range and had a TO. Run the read option to Zeke and let Dak keep it. Get a 1st down, spike it. Don't get a first down, run clock down to 3 seconds call TO, kick FG go to OT.

Well it was 3rd and 5. Not saying Zeke couldn't have gotten that, but thats a passing down typically. And they were in the 47 - 52 yard FG range if they were short of the first down which is no chip shot. I think the correct call was to try and get the first down there, and they had a pretty good play dialed up. DL made a great play though. Shit happens.

[MarketingBully]

I didn't mind the spike. I question the 3rd down pass. They were already in FG range and had a TO. Run the read option to Zeke and let Dak keep it. Get a 1st down, spike it. Don't get a first down, run clock down to 3 seconds call TO, kick FG go to OT.

Yeah, passing it there probably wasn't a great call. The OL also was atrocious at picking up the rush in that situation. A good draw play there probably guts them with the pressure they were bringing.

[Mjoelner34]

Just watching the recap of the game at halftime of the Chief's game and WOW! Go back an watch the Greco-Roman style takedown by #62 of the Packers on that long 3rd down conversion. I know there is holding every play by every team from pee wee to the NFL but this was a take down better than any tackle made all day.

[BoomBoom]

Well it was 3rd and 5. Not saying Zeke couldn't have gotten that, but thats a passing down typically. And they were in the 47 - 52 yard FG range if they were short of the first down which is no chip shot. I think the correct call was to try and get the first down there, and they had a pretty good play dialed up. DL made a great play though. Shit happens.

It was 3rd and 2. Cowboy coach just didn't think ahead. No way you give Aaron Hail Mary Rodgers any more time than you have to. A running play plays to your strengths and away from the opponents. He just made a bad call.

[Bdawg]

Dak was great, but unfortunately his int in scoring position is the difference in the game. He's gonna be great though and pretty much is already

Your nuts!! I was at the game and watched Rodgers shred the D the whole first half. Officiating was atrocious and pass rush was nonexistent. If you think you can win by not putting pressure on Rodgers, you shouldn't be a coach. Not saying that play by Dak didn't sting, but it damn sure didn't cost them the game. Defense lost the game. Period.

[HSVDawg]

It was 3rd and 2. Cowboy coach just didn't think ahead. No way you give Aaron Hail Mary Rodgers any more time than you have to. A running play plays to your strengths and away from the opponents. He just made a bad call.

Damn. I'll have to go back and watch but I could have sworn Beasley went out of bounds after a 5 or 6 yard pickup. I'll just go ahead and say that you are right though. I stand corrected.

[maroonmania]

Damn. I'll have to go back and watch but I could have sworn Beasley went out of bounds after a 5 or 6 yard pickup. I'll just go ahead and say that you are right though. I stand corrected.

On watching replay it was shown as a 3rd and 3.

[MarketingBully]

Just a thought as well but Green Bay had two timeouts at that time. Don't you think they use those time outs to prevent Dallas from running the clock down too far?

[Mjoelner34]

Just a thought as well but Green Bay had two timeouts at that time. Don't you think they use those time outs to prevent Dallas from running the clock down too far?

True. Had not thought of it from their side of the ball.

[BoomBoom]

Just a thought as well but Green Bay had two timeouts at that time. Don't you think they use those time outs to prevent Dallas from running the clock down too far?

Yes. If Dallas ran and failed to convert, GB takes a TO. They ended the gake with one, but if they only had one to start that drive they likely would have saved it.