1st back to back SEC road wins ....

[Liverpooldawg]

since 2011. Nice win all the way around from what little I got to see of it. The threes feel again and all is well. It did look like we had a bit of an inside game. THAT is really encouraging.

[Commercecomet24]

Kids are starting to play together. Last couple of games have showed flashes of being a really good team. Fun to watch our basketball team again and actually know they have a chance to win any game.

[HaggardDawg]

Stapleton reminds me of Dietrich Slater in that he always seems to be in the right place at the right time and gets clean up baskets. He's 1000xs more athletic than Slater though.

[MarketingBully]

since 2011. Nice win all the way around from what little I got to see of it. The threes feel again and all is well. It did look like we had a bit of an inside game. THAT is really encouraging.

Shit, you just don't get it. Our offense, if we are patient, is going to get us open looks. Peters penetration and the defense having to collapse causes us to get open three point looks. We are starting a formidable long front court now so some of those problems we had earlier this year have been addressed. Holman is looking better because he is able to play the stretch four and we are starting players in positions that they are comfortable with and not out of position. Howland is also subbing much better and playing 10 players well so we now are developing into a deep team. I think these past two games we have definitely made a positive leap in the right direction. We keep playing like this and we could challenge for one of the top four positions in the league.

[confucius say]

Herard's development has been huge. Allows Holman to play the four and us to play big.

[BeardoMSU]

Herard's development has been huge. Allows Holman to play the four and us to play big.

Yep. Having a front line finally is a huge factor to our current success. Also, I love bringing IJ in off the bench; he provides a great spark.

[gtowndawg]

We out rebounded them 41 to 29. That's by far the most positive thing to me. Great win guys. Let's get another one Saturday.

[gravedigger]

Shit, you just don't get it. Our offense, if we are patient, is going to get us open looks. Peters penetration and the defense having to collapse causes us to get open three point looks. We are starting a formidable long front court now so some of those problems we had earlier this year have been addressed. Holman is looking better because he is able to play the stretch four and we are starting players in positions that they are comfortable with and not out of position. Howland is also subbing much better and playing 10 players well so we now are developing into a deep team. I think these past two games we have definitely made a positive leap in the right direction. We keep playing like this and we could challenge for one of the top four positions in the league.

"Shit you just don't get it?"

If you start a post with this responding to someone, you might want to explain why.

[MarketingBully]

"Shit you just don't get it?"

If you start a post with this responding to someone, you might want to explain why.

He keeps saying the threes were falling so we win. What he doesn't get is that there was a reason why the threes are falling. It is A) because we are being patient running our offense and making the extra pass which leads to our shots being mostly wide open and B) we are a great shooting team which if we shoot wide open shots will make them most of the time. We are also finally playing a starting five at their natural more comfortable positions instead of starting three players out of position which led to inconsistent play. Liverpool keeps saying when we hit our shots we win when we don't we lose. It goes much deeper then that and when we are patient and running our offense we will hit our shots most of the time.

[smootness]

Yeah, there is still a large group of people who think that shooting a bunch of 3's is lazy offense or risky. But the two best shots in basketball (assuming they are taken by people who are good enough at them) are shots right at the basket and 3's. Mid-range shots and even shots in the paint but outside the restricted area are far less efficient. Corner 3's are even better than other 3's and are almost as efficient as those shots right at the basket, but other 3's are still way more efficient than most shots you can get.

The best offenses are the ones designed to get good looks right at the basket and to get open looks from behind the arc. Period.

[Liverpooldawg]

Shit, you just don't get it. Our offense, if we are patient, is going to get us open looks. Peters penetration and the defense having to collapse causes us to get open three point looks. We are starting a formidable long front court now so some of those problems we had earlier this year have been addressed. Holman is looking better because he is able to play the stretch four and we are starting players in positions that they are comfortable with and not out of position. Howland is also subbing much better and playing 10 players well so we now are developing into a deep team. I think these past two games we have definitely made a positive leap in the right direction. We keep playing like this and we could challenge for one of the top four positions in the league.

I agree with all of that actually other than me not getting it. I was a season ticket holder for 25 years or so till my Dad's health declined too much to go. That dated back to before Richard Williams' 1st SEC title. We WENT to nearly ever home game during that stretch. I've seen a LOT of both good and bad MSU basketball. I'm still going to wait to see if we can get a win against a decent opponent when we don't make a bunch of threes before I get too excited. That doesn't mean I don't think we are headed in the right direction. We are.

[smootness]

I agree with all of that actually other than me not getting it. I was a season ticket holder for 25 years or so till my Dad's health declined too much to go. That dated back to before Richard Williams' 1st SEC title. We WENT to nearly ever home game during that stretch. I've seen a LOT of both good and bad MSU basketball. I'm still going to wait to see if we can get a win against a decent opponent when we don't make a bunch of threes before I get too excited. That doesn't mean I don't think we are headed in the right direction. We are.

So what happens if we make a bunch of 3's in all our wins as we go 12-6 in the SEC? Will you still wait to get excited because we didn't win any without making a bunch of 3's?

This team is one that is built to get open looks and hit 3's. You're saying you'll wait until we beat a decent team while not playing the way we're built to play, which is fine I guess, it just seems like a really weird barometer.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I agree with all of that actually other than me not getting it. I was a season ticket holder for 25 years or so till my Dad's health declined too much to go. That dated back to before Richard Williams' 1st SEC title. We WENT to nearly ever home game during that stretch. I've seen a LOT of both good and bad MSU basketball. I'm still going to wait to see if we can get a win against a decent opponent when we don't make a bunch of threes before I get too excited. That doesn't mean I don't think we are headed in the right direction. We are.

I think the argument is that's who we are a 3 point shooting team. This is the best collection of shooters we've had at MSU maybe ever on a team. We're going to shoot a lot of 3's we need to shoot a lot of 3's. What Marketing Bully is saying is that what has been different the last 2 games is the manner we're getting those 3's. Most of our 3's the last 2 games haven't been quick 3's or contested 3's. They've been open 3's off of ball movement & penetration. If that continues we will continue to do well because good shooters + open looks = made baskets.

[Liverpooldawg]

He keeps saying the threes were falling so we win. What he doesn't get is that there was a reason why the threes are falling. It is A) because we are being patient running our offense and making the extra pass which leads to our shots being mostly wide open and B) we are a great shooting team which if we shoot wide open shots will make them most of the time. We are also finally playing a starting five at their natural more comfortable positions instead of starting three players out of position which led to inconsistent play. Liverpool keeps saying when we hit our shots we win when we don't we lose. It goes much deeper then that and when we are patient and running our offense we will hit our shots most of the time.

It still boils down to hitting the threes. Good basketball teams have an inside game that can stand on it's on and, along with a good defense, win games when the threes aren't falling. I haven't seen that yet from this team.

[Liverpooldawg]

I think the argument is that's who we are a 3 point shooting team. This is the best collection of shooters we've had at MSU maybe ever on a team. We're going to shoot a lot of 3's we need to shoot a lot of 3's. What Marketing Bully is saying is that what has been different the last 2 games is the manner we're getting those 3's. Most of our 3's the last 2 games haven't been quick 3's or contested 3's. They've been open 3's off of ball movement & penetration. If that continues we will continue to do well because good shooters + open looks = made baskets.

Agree, but to really be good you still have to have an inside game. Would you agree to that?

[Liverpooldawg]

So what happens if we make a bunch of 3's in all our wins as we go 12-6 in the SEC? Will you still wait to get excited because we didn't win any without making a bunch of 3's?

This team is one that is built to get open looks and hit 3's. You're saying you'll wait until we beat a decent team while not playing the way we're built to play, which is fine I guess, it just seems like a really weird barometer.

You still need at least something of an inside game to get anywhere much. I'd be happier with 12-6 than what we have had recently for sure. I'm still thinking about how Alabama defended the arc. You have to be able to score somehow when that happens. Consistent defensive intensity is something else I still haven't seen. THAT is always doable.

[smootness]

You still need at least something of an inside game to get anywhere much. I'd be happier with 12-6 than what we have had recently for sure. I'm still thinking about how Alabama defended the arc. You have to be able to score somehow when that happens. Consistent defensive intensity is something else I still haven't seen. THAT is always doable.

There's no doubt that every team becomes better when they have multiple ways to score and can beat any defense. But the lack of a good inside post game doesn't mean we can't be a good team. There aren't a whole lot of teams, in college basketball especially, that are going to have a good post game and be able to knock down shots. But a team with a good post game that can't hit 3's is not better than a team that can hit 3's and doesn't have a good post game.

We are a team built around penetrating and getting open looks on 3's. I would like to see us develop a better post game, certainly. But until Herard gets fully comfortable and gains experience, and until we get Ado and Brooks out there, that's probably not going to happen. That doesn't mean this year's team can't end up being very good and winning a lot of games.

[Liverpooldawg]

There's no doubt that every team becomes better when they have multiple ways to score and can beat any defense. But the lack of a good inside post game doesn't mean we can't be a good team. There aren't a whole lot of teams, in college basketball especially, that are going to have a good post game and be able to knock down shots. But a team with a good post game that can't hit 3's is not better than a team that can hit 3's and doesn't have a good post game.

We are a team built around penetrating and getting open looks on 3's. I would like to see us develop a better post game, certainly. But until Herard gets fully comfortable and gains experience, and until we get Ado and Brooks out there, that's probably not going to happen. That doesn't mean this year's team can't end up being very good and winning a lot of games.

Agree. If you remember early on I said Herard was the key to this team being really good. I think y'all are confused on what I mean by really good. I'm talking about a tourney team that can win a game or two there maybe. I just don't think we are there, yet. We ARE better than we have been since we fired Stans. We may be better than we were his last couple of years. Time will tell there. With a couple more pieces we can be very, very good. Next year maybe. The next is a REAL possibility.

[MadDawg]

He keeps saying the threes were falling so we win. What he doesn't get is that there was a reason why the threes are falling. It is A) because we are being patient running our offense and making the extra pass which leads to our shots being mostly wide open and B) we are a great shooting team which if we shoot wide open shots will make them most of the time.

I think Q had one "wide open shot" all night.

[Intramural All-American]

Agree, but to really be good you still have to have an inside game. Would you agree to that?

The Golden State Warriors would disagree. Their best lineup has draymond green playing an undersized center.

[Turfdawg67]

Maybe we just like playing in front of a crowd...

[tcdog70]

The Bud looked half full