Well, it's next year now.

[drunkernhelldawg]

I still have some hope for the season because I know how good we can be. Last night though was the shits how from hell. I do acknowledge a few good plays and moments. But damn. Final insult was the clown show turnover when we had it down to 8 in the last two minutes.

Ugh!

[HoopsDawg]

Was a new thread needed? I posted on here last week that the NIT is a realistic goal for next year and then NCAA in 2018-2019. That's assuming no key transfers or no one makes a dumb decision and leaves early. This season is all about improvement and gaining experience. The pieces aren't in place yet.

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

^^ This..

[gtowndawg]

Was a new thread needed? I posted on here last week that the NIT is a realistic goal for next year and then NCAA in 2018-2019. That's assuming no key transfers or no one makes a dumb decision and leaves early. This season is all about improvement and gaining experience. The pieces aren't in place yet.

I'm not arguing this but if the BEST we can hope for is a potential NCAA tourney appearance in year number four of Howland, than personally, I'm disappointed in him.

[drunkernhelldawg]

Was a new thread needed? I posted on here last week that the NIT is a realistic goal for next year and then NCAA in 2018-2019. That's assuming no key transfers or no one makes a dumb decision and leaves early. This season is all about improvement and gaining experience. The pieces aren't in place yet.

Maybe it wasn't you, but when I complained last season, I was told that we had ace recruits and would be great this season.

I think we did this to ourselves, and I think we need to remember that.

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Who the hell told you this? We are not UK. Just because a player is a 4 star doesnt mean they are instantly ready for college. Alot of that is potential and with the right coaching, could develop into a great player.

[smootness]

Was a new thread needed? I posted on here last week that the NIT is a realistic goal for next year and then NCAA in 2018-2019. That's assuming no key transfers or no one makes a dumb decision and leaves early. This season is all about improvement and gaining experience. The pieces aren't in place yet.

The NIT is not the goal next year, nor should it be.

[gtowndawg]

The NIT is not the goal next year, nor should it be.

https://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder489/54911489.jpg

[lamont]

We are an NCAA team next year with Ado

The lack of a low post player- which I mentioned a couple of weeks ago- is going to keep this team to 6-7 SEC wins.

No low post play to force the D to sag
No sagging D means contested 3 point shots
Contested 3 point shots leads to a lower percentage
Lower percentage means no victory

[msstate7]

The NIT is not the goal next year, nor should it be.

I agree. Team full of 4*s with a year of experience, an sec POY candidate, and adding a 5*... we should be an NCAA team

[smootness]

We are an NCAA team next year with Ado

The lack of a low post player- which I mentioned a couple of weeks ago- is going to keep this team to 6-7 SEC wins.

No low post play to force the D to sag
No sagging D means contested 3 point shots
Contested 3 point shots leads to a lower percentage
Lower percentage means no victory

You wise sage.

[HoopsDawg]

The NIT is not the goal next year, nor should it be.

It won't be the player's goal or the coaches goal and probably not your goal. I'm talking more about realistic expectations other than goals. Although Nick Spoon gives us a major upgrade on both ends of the court at PG.

[HoopsDawg]

We are an NCAA team next year with Ado

The lack of a low post player- which I mentioned a couple of weeks ago- is going to keep this team to 6-7 SEC wins.

No low post play to force the D to sag
No sagging D means contested 3 point shots
Contested 3 point shots leads to a lower percentage
Lower percentage means no victory

Ado will help, but I don't know if he is the difference maker in year 1 that you want him to be. He is a good screener and a good low post defender. I'm not sure how much offense he will bring in Year 1.

[MadDawg]

It won't be the player's goal or the coaches goal and probably not your goal. I'm talking more about realistic expectations other than goals. Although Nick Spoon gives us a major upgrade on both ends of the court at PG.

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

[Liverpooldawg]

We are an NCAA team next year with Ado

The lack of a low post player- which I mentioned a couple of weeks ago- is going to keep this team to 6-7 SEC wins.

No low post play to force the D to sag
No sagging D means contested 3 point shots
Contested 3 point shots leads to a lower percentage
Lower percentage means no victory

For once we agree on basketball............although I think the NCAA may be a bit of a stretch.

[gtowndawg]

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

I admit it...I just looked up Stans record to see what he did his first four years. NIT, nothing, NIT, NCAA.

Yes, it wasn't the same NIT, but the SEC was also much more difficult then. At the end of the day, being an NCAA team under someone with Howland's record should be expected in my book, not a bonus.

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

What was the status of the program?Who was Stans following as coach?....oh that's right a coach that took us to our only ever Final Four. R.Wiliams>>>>>Rick Ray.

[smootness]

It won't be the player's goal or the coaches goal and probably not your goal. I'm talking more about realistic expectations other than goals. Although Nick Spoon gives us a major upgrade on both ends of the court at PG.

Yes, a realistic goal for next year is making the NCAA Tournament.

And regarding the OP, no, it is not next year yet.

[HoopsDawg]

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

Correct.

[KentuckyDawg13]

After Stansbury was handed a made program from Richard Williams. No rebuild was needed, just reload.

[gtowndawg]

What was the status of the program?Who was Stans following as coach?....oh that's right a coach that took us to our only ever Final Four. R.Wiliams>>>>>Rick Ray.

Fair enough, but we were 15-15 and 12-18 the two seasons prior to Stansbury.

Under Ray we were 13-19 and 14-19 the two seasons prior to Howland.

At some point, improvement must be seen. Literal player development as THIS year goes on. Personally, I think we will see that as this year continues. But poor defense against Alabama and at times, pure laziness is not a Rick Ray problem.

[CadaverDawg]

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

Stansbury haters when reading this truth...

http://assets.adamriff.com/images/rick_stansbury.gif

[lamont]

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

This is year 5 post- Stands

Stands got fired for off the court things more than on the court

[lamont]

After Stansbury was handed a made program from Richard Williams. No rebuild was needed, just reload.

Stands was handed a team that should have been in the NCAA Tourney and he turned them into an NIT team

Stands didnt make the NCAA Tourney his last 4 seasons as coach
Stands had turned our program into the "the most dysfunctional program in America" and we were being laughed at.

Our male cheerleader making a bad hire is his fault- he chose that route on Ray
Howland needs to get his ass in gear

[MadDawg]

Stands was handed a team that should have been in the NCAA Tourney and he turned them into an NIT team

Stands didnt make the NCAA Tourney his last 4 seasons as coach
Stands had turned our program into the "the most dysfunctional program in America" and we were being laughed at.

Our male cheerleader making a bad hire is his fault- he chose that route on Ray
Howland needs to get his ass in gear

Just to be clear, it takes EIGHT YEARS to produce a better product than "the most dysfunctional program in America" could produce?

[HSVDawg]

Just to be clear, it takes EIGHT YEARS to produce a better product than "the most dysfunctional program in America" could produce?

When the first 5 of those years are throw-away seasons due to "the most dysfunctional program in America" and the bad hire that followed that tenure, that is correct. You can't heighten expectations on Howland because of bad decisions that took place before he arrived.

[Maroonthirteen]

Stands got fired for off the court things more than on the court

How do people not realize this?

Renardo embarrassed us on national TV. Players were running the program. The NCAA was up our tail with a microscope. It had nothing to do with Ws and Ls.

[gtowndawg]

How do people not realize this?

Renardo embarrassed us on national TV. Players were running the program. The NCAA was up our tail with a microscope. It had nothing to do with Ws and Ls.

I can honestly say I'm neither a Stands Lover or a Howland hater. Stans basically deserved what he got. But I also throw that out the window when watching a game like I did last night that had poor team defense and little hustle other than in spurts. That is a problem squarely on the shoulders of the existing coaching staff. And again, for the record, I think he fixes that, but I'm also not going to give him a pass for several years based off what he did a decade ago at UCLA. Carry on...

[drunkernhelldawg]

How do people not realize this?

Renardo embarrassed us on national TV. Players were running the program. The NCAA was up our tail with a microscope. It had nothing to do with Ws and Ls.

MSU "fans" choose to make a big deal out of the Renardo situation. You blow something up big enough and it gets past your control. At this point, W's and L's really don't matter, so into the future you're right. But they used to matter. The Hump used to be a big deal. We used to a top three SEC basketball school. We used to dominate the states of Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana, and Arkansas in basketball. But all that was back when W's and L's made a damn. Now we ain't nobody.

[smootness]

MSU "fans" choose to make a big deal out of the Renardo situation. You blow something up big enough and it gets past your control. At this point, W's and L's really don't matter, so into the future you're right. But they used to matter. The Hump used to be a big deal. We used to a top three SEC basketball school. We used to dominate the states of Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana, and Arkansas in basketball. But all that was back when W's and L's made a damn. Now we ain't nobody.

Stans went 8-8 in the SEC and saw a 1st round NIT exit with the most talented team we've ever had. It was only going to get worse.

[drunkernhelldawg]

Stans went 8-8 in the SEC and saw a 1st round NIT exit with the most talented team we've ever had. It was only going to get worse.

I still don't think that the witch hunt, careless way it was done has served us well. That's what we need to remember.

[HoopsDawg]

LOL, ya'll are still talking about Stans.

[Maroonthirteen]

I can honestly say I'm neither a Stands Lover or a Howland hater. Stans basically deserved what he got. But I also throw that out the window when watching a game like I did last night that had poor team defense and little hustle other than in spurts. That is a problem squarely on the shoulders of the existing coaching staff. And again, for the record, I think he fixes that, but I'm also not going to give him a pass for several years based off what he did a decade ago at UCLA. Carry on...

Yeah, I liked Stans. I like Howland.

When Stans allowed Renardo to stay on the team after the Hawaii fight. I knew his days were numbered if Renardo didn't pay off in a big way.

The current situation....is on Howland. You can turn around a basketball team in one recruiting class. However, MSU is a difficult place to recruit a one and done level player. I think the lack of experienced talent has showed so far this season.

[HoopsDawg]

Yeah, I liked Stans. I like Howland.

When Stans allowed Renardo to stay on the team after the Hawaii fight. I knew his days were numbered if Renardo didn't pay off in a big way.

The current situation....is on Howland. You can turn around a basketball team in one recruiting class. However, MSU is a difficult place to recruit a one and done level player. I think the lack of experienced talent has showed so far this season.

Youth and post play. That's all it is.

[drunkernhelldawg]

Youth and post play. That's all it is.

Especially youth. Wouldn't be shocked to see us go on a little winning streak.

[lamont]

Just to be clear, it takes EIGHT YEARS to produce a better product than "the most dysfunctional program in America" could produce?

We are in year 5- I personally believe we will be an NCAA Tourney team next seaso. In Year 6.

We wasted 3 years with RR. NOBOdy wanted RR to be our HC. It was a terrible decision just as LT hiring Croom. Neither coach was picked because they were the best candidate for the job. Now- it's time for Howland to get the job done.

[gtowndawg]

We are in year 5- I personally believe we will be an NCAA Tourney team next seaso. In Year 6.

If that happens than everything is kosher with me.

[CadaverDawg]

I was a big Stans fan. I hated the Ray hire from day 1. I am now a big Howland fan.

It was time for Stans to go, but the way we did it was shitty in my opinion. I will hope he succeeds wherever he is. But I hope Howland becomes our greatest ever, and I think everyone needs to relax, bc this team will get better & better as they grow up. I just think this process wouldn't have taken so long to get to if we had handled Stans exit a little better, and Stricklin effed us with the Ray hire.

[lamont]

I was a big Stans fan. I hated the Ray hire from day 1. I am now a big Howland fan.

It was time for Stans to go, but the way we did it was shitty in my opinion. I will hope he succeeds wherever he is. But I hope Howland becomes our greatest ever, and I think everyone needs to relax, bc this team will get better & better as they grow up. I just think this process wouldn't have taken so long to get to if we had handled Stans exit a little better, and Stricklin effed us with the Ray hire.

Strick made damn sure we werent going to hire another Stands-type guy. One who was known for "recruiting" and ran a lax program. He passed over guys like the one at Florida Gulf Coast as well as Little Kermit at MTSU. Bigger names wanted 2.5MM-3MM to coach at State- and we werent going to do that with Mullen just making about 3MM at the time.

Strick brought in a guy that agreed to take the job of eliminating players that couldnt pass drug tests and wasnt going to be up in the middle of AAU recruiting deals. After 3 years of ugly basketball- Strick was informed that we could land Ben Howland and he best get that deal done. In comes Howland- out goes Ray

Howland couldnt get last year's Sr's on board with Newman. Too much team bullshit. It happens. This year we are very young and dont have a block post player. Thats on Howland. We will get lots of experience this year and have more Croots coming- but the next 2 years better be some better basketball. No excuses these next 2 years

[Liverpooldawg]

So we are still a year away from the level of basketball that got Stans fired? This is year SIX post-Stans. Year SEVEN will get us to the level that got Stans fired. So maybe year EIGHT?

Essentially, yes.

[lamont]

Essentially, yes.

No- we are in Year 5 currently