2017

[GTHOM]

A W is a W. It wasnt pretty but it beats the hell out of an L. If everybody on our team played has hard as Fitz does we wouldnt be 6-7. Extremely disappointed that Mullen didnt let Williams run the ball more today. Really odd. Really odd to put in 11 and let him throw it on 4th and 4 too.

Looking at 2017 I see potential to win 8-9 games maybe 10 with a bowl, OR I could see us going 6-6 and making another St Pete style bowl.


The difference will be on defense and our OL. We should be better on D cant be any worse. We have to have these JUCO guys ready to go. They cant wait till game 8 or 9 to be ready.


Fitz is the real deal talent wise. If he has the offseason we need out of him he will be the best offensive player in the SEC next year.

[CadaverDawg]

Peter Sirmon's D may keep us from winning 6. He has got to go. Our defense is an embarrassment. Our O sucked today too, but the D sucked bad all year. Soft soft defense. I hate it.

We have no shot at 8 or more wins without MAJOR improvement on D. I don't think Sirmon can get it done

[the59dawg]

Peter Sirmon's D may keep us from winning 6. He has got to go. Our defense is an embarrassment. Our O sucked today too, but the D sucked bad all year. Soft soft defense. I hate it.

We have no shot at 8 or more wins without MAJOR improvement on D. I don't think Sirmon can get it done

Got to have better corners in order to play better defense. Not good enough to play press defense, have to zone.

[Goldendawg]

Sirmon, "rush three and drop eight into a soft zone". Never catch on that the TE is an eligible receiver and we might want to defend a pass across the middle. P.S., maybe there is a reason his family doesn't move to Starkville.

[ShotgunDawg]

Need a new locker room culture to win more than 6 next year. This program is soft, soft, soft. At very least, hopefully the JUCO guys will come in and create some intense competition and that makes everyone better.

We don't have a ton of 5 stars, but we are going to have 17 or 18 4 stars on defense next year. No excuses for not being significantly better

[I seen it dawg]

5 more wins and another thanks for the great apr shitburger bowl.

[Goldendawg]

Better hope the JC players get a real chance to see the field over less talented players rewarded for being in the system ahead of them. I hope we see the best players on the field at all times.

[Coach007]

A W is a W. It wasnt pretty but it beats the hell out of an L. If everybody on our team played has hard as Fitz does we wouldnt be 6-7. Extremely disappointed that Mullen didnt let Williams run the ball more today. Really odd. Really odd to put in 11 and let him throw it on 4th and 4 too.

Looking at 2017 I see potential to win 8-9 games maybe 10 with a bowl, OR I could see us going 6-6 and making another St Pete style bowl.


The difference will be on defense and our OL. We should be better on D cant be any worse. We have to have these JUCO guys ready to go. They cant wait till game 8 or 9 to be ready.


Fitz is the real deal talent wise. If he has the offseason we need out of him he will be the best offensive player in the SEC next year.


Players have got to learn the system and assignments. It's never a good thing to hear a coach is having to simplify the defense....aka dumb it down, because players are not catching on.

I'm willing to give it another year because of what that defense offers.

[Goldendawg]

I have never coached a game in my life, but have been a devout State season ticket holder since the mid '70's. What are the advantages of the 3 - 4 over a 4 -3 in today's world of spread offenses in college ball?

[I seen it dawg]

I hope the jucos come in and shake shit up, piss our current players off. That's what should happen. These soft ****ers in our program right now should be mad that these jucos are coming in. Because it's a loud statement that we don't believe that the guys going home on the plane today can get it done. Well to you returning players prove you can. Toughen up buttercups.

[Goldendawg]

Read the recent interview with Bryant on 24/7. Full of himself, brags about his improvement on the field and in leadership abilities this year. Speaks of the talent of the guys already on the team behind him and how he hopes the JUCO guys can add depth. We need a real open competition for almost all positions in 2017 no matter what your seniority.

[DudyDawg]

They punted what, once? All I need to know. Fire Sirmon 6 months ago. Should've never been hired

[basedog]

Sure is great seeing our players celebrate and enjoying themselves as some of y'all must be miserable.

Happy New Year!

P.S. Winning is good especially bowl games as they can be hard to judge. Let's see how the other SEC teams fair.

[Goldendawg]

We went 6 -7 and looked bad doing it in all but 2 wins. Reality.

[Coach007]

I have never coached a game in my life, but have been a devout State season ticket holder since the mid '70's. What are the advantages of the 3 - 4 over a 4 -3 in today's world of spread offenses in college ball?

- more coverage
- faster to the edges
- better zone blitzing

[Goldendawg]

What about pressure on the QB in today's pass happy offenses?

[NCDawg]

Good thing Richie Brown grabbed hold of the TE's jersey, or we would probably lost.

[Goldendawg]

I think Richie was totally out of place this year in our not so great 3 - 4. I thought he played much better in years' past in the 4 -3. I am totally unimpressed in the 3 - 4. Who else in the SEC runs it with success. We sure don't.

[Coach007]

What about pressure on the QB in today's pass happy offenses?

I answered that question above and in another thread. Who has the top defense in the nation right now? Bama. What do they run?

Bama:

Ranked 1 in defense
Ranked 1 in defensive TDs
Ranked 6 in pass defense
Ranked 1st in rush defense
ranked 26th in INT
Ranked 4th in sacks
Ranked 7th in TFL

[DudyDawg]

I answered that question above and in another thread. Who has the top defense in the nation right now? Bama. What do they run?

Bama:

Ranked 1 in defense
Ranked 1 in defensive TDs
Ranked 6 in pass defense
Ranked 1st in rush defense
ranked 26th in INT
Ranked 4th in sacks
Ranked 7th in TFL

Let us know when we have NFL players at every spot on the field and in the two deep.

[Goldendawg]

Yeah, let's run a D just because Bama can. What happened to adapting a D or an O for that matter to the abilities of your players. I will reserve future judgement on the influx of hopefully better talent with the incoming JUCO players in 2017. Simon is (maybe) becoming a DC with on the job training. It is what it is.

[thf24]

Coming up with 3 or 4 good cover corners next year would improve the defense as a whole by leaps and bounds, but it doesn't change the fact that the 2-gap 3-4 is a very difficult, complicated, demanding defense for us at the current point in time. Until I see otherwise, I'm going to continue believing we're voluntarily handicapping ourselves as long as we continue to try to run it.

[Sacrifice]

When I first heard we were going to the 34 I thought we would bring hell from all different angles, It's just not happening.
I have no faith that Sirmon will turn this D around next season. Our players on D are not this bad. They look lost and unmotivated. It looks like there playing to about 50% of there potential.

[IMissJack]

Need a new locker room culture to win more than 6 next year. This program is soft, soft, soft. At very least, hopefully the JUCO guys will come in and create some intense competition and that makes everyone better.

I really don't think we have an identity in our locker room. The OM game and A&M games were the only games where I felt we came out with a fire and played about as well as we could. We are not talented enough, yet, on this team to come out lifeless and expect to win by out talenting anyone. I can't remember the last time we played with an attacking defense. I don't know if we can get that toughness back with these assistants on D.

[Coach007]

Let us know when we have NFL players at every spot on the field and in the two deep.


We don't have Bama's players of course. I doubt a 3 - 4 especially under Sirmon will ever be successful for us. Thanks for your response to my questions. Hope I am proved wrong in 2017. Hail State and have a great 2017.

Do we at any position? Who does have bama's players all across the board? Are you listening to yourself? So abandon a defense because we don't recruit as well as the top program in the nation.

1- We can stick to a 4-3 and struggle vs the spread or we can switch and better handle it. Therefore handling most teams that we will face.
2- We don't know what Sirmon can do because it's the first year this team has played a 3-4 under Mullen. Sirmon doesn't have a year under him in recruiting players he may need.


Bama switched to a 3-4 in 2007. Bama ranked 31st that season. The next season they jumped 3, then 2, and have pretty much stayed in the top from that point. Their 2007 classhad no 5 stars and only 3 4 stars.

Let's look at leading up to that change.

2004, no 5 stars and only 1 4 star signed(WR)
2005, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed (SDE)
2006, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed(RB)

Already told you 2007...

2008 1 5 star on defense..CB 9 4star players signed


So let's talk about those players that Bama gets and we don't? The difference wasn't just in coaching, but it was also the switch. Sirmon is working with far better talent than Bama had making the switch.

[IMissJack]

When I first heard we were going to the 34 I thought we would bring hell from all different angles, It's just not happening.
I have no faith that Sirmon will turn this D around next season. Our players on D are not this bad. They look lost and unmotivated. It looks like there playing to about 50% of there potential.

Agree, we play reactive, and slow. We have had plenty of defenses as bad as this one, that played with a lot more attitude...

[Goldendawg]

These assistants remind me of Jackie's last couple of staffs. Probably the best we can get with paying the least in the SEC and Dan's alleged micro-managing. We need to pay what it takes and get a successful, veteran DC and let him do his thing.

[DudyDawg]

Do we at any position? Who does have bama's players all across the board? Are you listening to yourself? So abandon a defense because we don't recruit as well as the top program in the nation.

1- We can stick to a 4-3 and struggle vs the spread or we can switch and better handle it. Therefore handling most teams that we will face.
2- We don't know what Sirmon can do because it's the first year this team has played a 3-4 under Mullen. Sirmon doesn't have a year under him in recruiting players he may need.


Bama switched to a 3-4 in 2007. Bama ranked 31st that season. The next season they jumped 3, then 2, and have pretty much stayed in the top from that point. Their 2007 classhad no 5 stars and only 3 4 stars.

Let's look at leading up to that change.

2004, no 5 stars and only 1 4 star signed(WR)
2005, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed (SDE)
2006, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed(RB)

Already told you 2007...

2008 1 5 star on defense..CB 9 4star players signed


So let's talk about those players that Bama gets and we don't? The difference wasn't just in coaching, but it was also the switch. Sirmon is working with far better talent than Bama had making the switch.

Bama didn't just switch the the 3-4 in 07, they got the best coach in football. Again, lemme know when Saban and his classes walk through that door for us. You're trying to compare us, with a first year coordinator, to nick Saban. Get a grip.

[Dawgface]

Peter Sirmon's D may keep us from winning 6. He has got to go. Our defense is an embarrassment. Our O sucked today too, but the D sucked bad all year. Soft soft defense. I hate it.

We have no shot at 8 or more wins without MAJOR improvement on D. I don't think Sirmon can get it done

Agree 100%. Hard to be fired up about next year at this point......unless the Juco's are major upgrades.

[Coach007]

Bama didn't just switch the the 3-4 in 07, they got the best coach in football. Again, lemme know when Saban and his classes walk through that door for us. You're trying to compare us, with a first year coordinator, to nick Saban. Get a grip.

What you just stated is 100% false.

I showed you the talent they had on their team. So the whole "Lemme know when Saban and his classes" doesn't have a single thing to do with 2007 and 2008. We have a better talent pool than they did at the time they switched.

You fail to consider the effects of making that switch while losing that many dbs, the effects to the over all scheme when losing that many.

[dawg27]

b
Got to have better corners in order to play better defense. Not good enough to play press defense, have to zone.
We have no pass rush look at just about ever team that has good secondary they all have a good pass rush.

[DudyDawg]

So the whole "Lemme know when Saban and his classes" doesn't have a single thing to do with 2007 and 2008..

They didn't have Saban in 2007 and 2008?

[dawg27]

One think is for sure we have got a long way to go before we are a good team.

[DudyDawg]

One think is for sure we have got a long way to go before we are a good team.

As long as we stick with a guy who's never been a DC, we are only a few years away from being just like Alabama. After all, look what defense they run!

[Jacksondevildog]

We are very confused on defense. You can see the players looking around throwing their hands up like they are not sure. It's been happening all year long. We have also been late getting personnel onto the field and in position out of dead ball situations. That has been happening all year long. That's coaching.

[Coach007]

They didn't have Saban in 2007 and 2008?

You stated "Saban and his Classes"

[CadaverDawg]

Sirmon's defense is really really horrible against the pass, but they make up for it by being atrocious against the run and not tackling worth a shit.

Total defensive dumpster fire. WAY too much talent on that side to be as bad as we were/are. I just don't see how we could totally ruin guys like Richie, Gerri, & Brandon Bryant in one off season like that....seems you'd have to physically injure them to cause such a collapse in play. This 3-4 risk could ruin our defense for years to come...it was a failed experiment & poor decision imo. Time for Mullen to just admit that, part ways, and move on. Never dreamed I would be begging for a Geoff Collins or Diaz D this much so soon. We don't do a single thing well on D....don't press, don't cover, don't prevent the long catches, don't smother the short throws, don't cover tight ends, don't pressure the QB, don't stop the run, don't tackle well at all, don't make adjustments....NOTHING. I wish I could get paid $600K to do poorly in every phase of my job.

[Coach007]

As long as we stick with a guy who's never been a DC, we are only a few years away from being just like Alabama. After all, look what defense they run!

Since we are talking about Bama and people who have never been a DC before, did you know that Saban hired a guy who had never been a DC before in 2007? But what does that have to do with anything right?

[DudyDawg]

You stated "Saban and his Classes"

I agree that losing DBs to injury hurt us- it would any team regardless of scheme. But you're defending sirmon by saying bama is the best defense in the country and runs the same D. It's asinine

[Coach007]

We are very confused on defense. You can see the players looking around throwing their hands up like they are not sure. It's been happening all year long. We have also been late getting personnel onto the field and in position out of dead ball situations. That has been happening all year long. That's coaching.

That's players not knowing the system.

[DudyDawg]

Since we are talking about Bama and people who have never been a DC before, did you know that Saban hired a guy who had never been a DC before in 2007? But what does that have to do with anything right?

Saban could hire my mother to be DC, it wouldn't matter. He runs that defense.

[Coach007]

I agree that losing DBs to injury hurt us- it would any team regardless of scheme. But you're defending sirmon by saying bama is the best defense in the country and runs the same D. It's asinine

No, I'm defending the 3-4.

I'm defending players who are having to switch to a 3-4

If we are not vastly improved next year, then we have something to talk about.

[DudyDawg]

Bama switched to a 3-4 in 2007. Bama ranked 31st that season.

Sirmon is working with far better talent than Bama had making the switch.

And how close to 31 do we rank?

[defiantdog]

Since we are talking about Bama and people who have never been a DC before, did you know that Saban hired a guy who had never been a DC before in 2007? But what does that have to do with anything right?
And Saban demoted Steele the next year and actually apologized to the boosters for his poor hire. Your comparing apples to oranges in your argument here.

[Coach007]

And how close to 31 do we rank?

In some areas very close. In others, not close enough. Not sure what that has to do with what we are talking about. So long as we see huge gains in defense, we will compete. It would only taken a little to have been 10-3 or 11-2 this year. Now we need it for next year.

[HoopsDawg]

In some areas very close. In others, not close enough. Not sure what that has to do with what we are talking about. So long as we see huge gains in defense, we will compete. It would only taken a little to have been 10-3 or 11-2 this year. Now we need it for next year.

Stop talking about Bama. They are the exception to everything considering their talent and their coach. He is a 3-4 guru.

[DudyDawg]

In some areas very close. In others, not close enough. Not sure what that has to do with what we are talking about. So long as we see huge gains in defense, we will compete. It would only taken a little to have been 10-3 or 11-2 this year. Now we need it for next year.

You didn't answer me. Where do we rank overall?

[Coach007]

And Saban demoted Steele the next year and actually apologized to the boosters for his poor hire. Your comparing apples to oranges in your argument here.

OH BS! But let's go with that.

Steele hired, No DC experience.
Smart hired, NO DC EXPERIENCE.

[Coach007]

Stop talking about Bama. They are the exception to everything considering their talent and their coach. He is a 3-4 guru.

There we go again with the word TALENT. Again, I showed you their talent at that time.

This defense will be vastly improved next year.

[defiantdog]

You didn't answer me. Where do we rank overall?

110..... no excuses

[DudyDawg]

There we go again with the word TALENT. Again, I showed you their talent at that time.

This defense will be vastly improved next year.

And you said we have more TALENT. They ranked 31st. Where do we rank?

[DudyDawg]

110..... no excuses


Ahhhh okay thank you. So, with more talent, we are 80 places below Alabama and Saban when they first switched. Let's keep sirmon, if we improve like bama did we could be in the 70s next season.

[Coach007]

And you said we have more TALENT. They ranked 31st. Where do we rank?

I stated we will have. And we will be vastly improved.

[defiantdog]

OH BS! But let's go with that.

Steele hired, No DC experience.
Smart hired, NO DC EXPERIENCE.
Smart had a year under Saban before he was promoted. But Saban runs that defense like Mullen runs our offense. What's BS is your argument. We were ranked 110 this year in total defense. You can't honestly defend that. I think opposing teams averaged 450 yards against us. We were pathetic on defense this year. Do you really think we're going to be that much better next year? Because a few Juco guys?

[DudyDawg]

Sirmon is working with far better talent than Bama had making the switch.


I stated we will have. And we will be vastly improved.

No, you didn't. Nice try.

And you still haven't told me where we ranked.

[Goldendawg]

Anyone else in the SEC run the 3 - 4 besides teams loaded with talent on D besides bama and us? We better hope the incoming JUCO talent makes a difference in 2017 because I don't see a shakeup of the D staff coming or even the O staff for that matter. I guess Country Club dues have been prepaid for next year. Just asking.

[Coach007]

Ahhhh okay thank you. So, with more talent, we are 80 places below Alabama and Saban when they first switched. Let's keep sirmon, if we improve like bama did we could be in the 70s next season.

LMAO! sorry, I just gotta laugh at generalized comments like this.

[Coach007]

No, you didn't. Nice try.

YEs, in reference to 2017... you know the title of the thread!

[redstickdawg]

That's players not knowing the system.

Who would you hold responsible for this? Is it the players, the coaches or a West Coast offense ala Croom that takes 5 years to learn. I wonder if part of our lack of aggression was no comfort level with the scheme.

[DudyDawg]

YEs, in reference to 2017

You said Sirmon IS working with far better talent.

[maroonmania]

Do we at any position? Who does have bama's players all across the board? Are you listening to yourself? So abandon a defense because we don't recruit as well as the top program in the nation.

1- We can stick to a 4-3 and struggle vs the spread or we can switch and better handle it. Therefore handling most teams that we will face.
2- We don't know what Sirmon can do because it's the first year this team has played a 3-4 under Mullen. Sirmon doesn't have a year under him in recruiting players he may need.


Bama switched to a 3-4 in 2007. Bama ranked 31st that season. The next season they jumped 3, then 2, and have pretty much stayed in the top from that point. Their 2007 classhad no 5 stars and only 3 4 stars.

Let's look at leading up to that change.

2004, no 5 stars and only 1 4 star signed(WR)
2005, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed (SDE)
2006, no 5 stars, 1 4 star signed(RB)

Already told you 2007...

2008 1 5 star on defense..CB 9 4star players signed


So let's talk about those players that Bama gets and we don't? The difference wasn't just in coaching, but it was also the switch. Sirmon is working with far better talent than Bama had making the switch.

Are you listening to yourself? How about making a comparison to a college defense somewhere with comparable talent to ours that is successful running the 3-4. Bama has always had talent, even under Mike Shula and others. Coaching may have been bad but Bama recruits itself.

[DudyDawg]

Coach, bama (who you originally compared us to) ranked 31 their first year in the 3-4. Where do we rank?

[redstickdawg]

what are you willing to bet that we will be ranked above 31 in total defense at the end of '17?

[GTHOM]

We run a NFL style conservative bend but still break 3-4. We are going to be conservative on defense and overall as long as Mullen is here. Its just the way it is. I personally prefer the 3-4 because you can throw more at the offense out of it. We just sit back and wait for the offense to make a mistake. You can run a traditional NFL style 3-4 if you have a bad ass front 3 and your 2 OLBs can rush the passer. We dont have that. You can stunt, slant, twist and bring all kind of fire zone blitzes to make up for it but we dont. It wont change under Mullen you can book it. On the positive we will be better at CB next year due to Dantzler and Morgan Walker

[DudyDawg]

For the record, I don't really care what we run as far as 3-4, 4-3, 4-2-5, whatever. I'm wholeheartedly against sirmon being employed by Mississippi state university tomorrow though.

[Goldendawg]

Hey, you better hope Mulllen puts the best DB's on the field next year. Smokey will be a Senior, Jiles a 6th year Senior, and Cleveland a Senior will be back. Heck, JUCO's ( I know 3 are safeties) may not see the field for three years as redshirt Srs, if we go by seniority again.

[Coach007]

Smart had a year under Saban before he was promoted. But Saban runs that defense like Mullen runs our offense. What's BS is your argument. We were ranked 110 this year in total defense. You can't honestly defend that. I think opposing teams averaged 450 yards against us. We were pathetic on defense this year. Do you really think we're going to be that much better next year? Because a few Juco guys?

Had Smart been a DC before, yes or no? Isn't that how we play the this game?

I'm not defending the 110 rank. Show me where I have. Maybe you are reading to much into what I'm saying.

Do I think we are going to be that much better on defense? Yes! Making a generalized statement isn't the best approach to this, but yes. We will be better. No it's not a "few" juco guys. It's not just because of 11 new guys already on campus.

[DudyDawg]

It would only taken a little to have been 10-3 or 11-2 this year.

Would've taken six inches to have been 5-8

[Really Clark?]

Are you listening to yourself? How about making a comparison to a college defense somewhere with comparable talent to ours that is successful running the 3-4. Bama has always had talent, even under Mike Shula and others. Coaching may have been bad but Bama recruits itself.

I agree with you about the Bama comparison. But to your question Vandy and Wisconsin both run a 3-4. So their talent would be comparable or even lower than our talent with Vandy.

[Goldendawg]

I do not buy in at all to the Maroon colored look that we lost three games on the last play in 2016. There were many other plays not made, bad coaching decisions, and other issues in the losses to BYU, USA, and KY that helped us become the the 6 -7 team we barely are for 2016. I'm soon to be 62 years of age, a season ticket holder for 50 plus years and this was not a good team and by far not a good coaching staff, especially on D. JMO. BTW, Nick James got his one and only career sack today according to 24/7.

[HoopsDawg]

Are you listening to yourself? How about making a comparison to a college defense somewhere with comparable talent to ours that is successful running the 3-4. Bama has always had talent, even under Mike Shula and others. Coaching may have been bad but Bama recruits itself.

You just can't argue with stupid.

[dawgday166]

I agree with you about the Bama comparison. But to your question Vandy and Wisconsin both run a 3-4. So their talent would be comparable or even lower than our talent with Vandy.

I was trying to remember who I saw running a 3-4 with similar talent to ours and it's Vandy. And they do a pretty damn good job on defense. If we played them we'd be in serious trouble.

[maroonmania]

I agree with you about the Bama comparison. But to your question Vandy and Wisconsin both run a 3-4. So their talent would be comparable or even lower than our talent with Vandy.

And that's fine, that's all I'm talking about. If you want to make a point use a reasonable comparison, leave Bama out of it.

[Dawgsfanalongtime77]

Actually a chip shot missed fg in the opener kept us from 6. However the defense caused major issues all season

[RougeDawg]

Better hope the JC players get a real chance to see the field over less talented players rewarded for being in the system ahead of them. I hope we see the best players on the field at all times.

Did you forget these **? We all have a Better chance of hitting the lottery than the most talented players seeing the field no matter age or years in program. This glaring issue has been the most prominent during Dan's tenure.

[parabrave]

I answered that question above and in another thread. Who has the top defense in the nation right now? Bama. What do they run?

Bama:

Ranked 1 in defense
Ranked 1 in defensive TDs
Ranked 6 in pass defense
Ranked 1st in rush defense
ranked 26th in INT
Ranked 4th in sacks
Ranked 7th in TFL

They are also aggressive as shit, know how to tackle and are held to a higher standard. Do you think Saban would continue to play personnel who can't tackle?