Best improvement this season....... the OL

[Coach007]

He catches alot of grief, but the OL improved drastically over this season.

[Spiderman]

He catches alot of grief, but the OL improved drastically over this season.

Yes they did. Hev is a good line coach. I know some here think he can't recruit. I have no idea, but he is a sound line coach

[DeviousDawg]

Absolutely...

In the last 4 games of the 2015 regular season Dak was sacked 21 times for -122 yards. Ole Miss(7), Arkansas(2), Alabama(9), and Mizzou(3).

In the last 4 games of the 2016 regular season Fitz was sacked only 4 times for -32 yards. Ole Miss(1), Arkansas(0), Alabama(3), and TAMU(0).

That's pretty incredible.

[Coach007]

Absolutely...

In the last 4 games of the 2015 regular season Dak was sacked 21 times for -122 yards. Ole Miss(7), Arkansas(2), Alabama(9), and Mizzou(3).

In the last 4 games of the 2016 regular season Fitz was sacked only 4 times for -32 yards. Ole Miss(1), Arkansas(0), Alabama(3), and TAMU(0).

That's pretty incredible.

Yep. Not only that, look at the rushing yards. Those big bodies were shedding blocks and getting into LBs etc.

[dawgday166]

Hev has to get quicker about this Oline development tho. And I'm not sure about this philosophy of having them learn every Oline position. I believe that may be why it takes so long for them to develop and why they look bad for so long. They too busy thinking and confused.

ETA: And Hev needs to recruit much better dammit. Get out of that lounge chair and fly you ass up to the western part of the midwest and find some big farm bred white dudes.

[msbulldog]

Problem could be the turnover on the line, the last 2 years we lost roughly half the line each year. We need to sign more O line each year to try and develop more continuity each year. I know its Alabama, but's that is what Saban does.

[dawgday166]

Problem could be the turnover on the line, the last 2 years we lost roughly half the line each year. We need to sign more O line each year to try and develop more continuity each year. I know its Alabama, but's that is what Saban does.

That was part of my point. Don't sign the bare minimum to get by each year.

[msbulldog]

That was part of my point. Don't sign the bare minimum to get by each year.

Just agreeing with you Dawgday.

[DeviousDawg]

Yep. Not only that, look at the rushing yards. Those big bodies were shedding blocks and getting into LBs etc.

Yep, something I also noticed in the Egg Bowl was that we were using Jordan Thomas as a sort of lead blocker on multiple instances. He would line up off the line of scrimmage off tackle, and we would run Aeris behind him, it was working to say the least. I would like to go back and watch the game and see how many big blocks he had. He was a big part of our success Saturday, and I feel that he didn't get the recognition he deserved.

[dawgday166]

Yep, something I also noticed in the Egg Bowl was that we were using Jordan Thomas as a sort of lead blocker on multiple instances. He would line up off the line of scrimmage off tackle, and we would run Aeris behind him, it was working to say the least. I would like to go back and watch the game and see how many big blocks he had. He was a big part of our success Saturday, and I feel that he didn't get the recognition he deserved.

One thing that has me somewhat hopeful (again). Mullen showed some different looks the other day like he'd been tweaking for the skillsets of the players he has. He needs to do that here and there from time to time ... exercise some of those "brilliant" offensive coordinator muscles.

[DeviousDawg]

One thing that has me somewhat hopeful (again). Mullen showed some different looks the other day like he'd been tweaking for the skillsets of the players he has. He needs to do that here and there from time to time ... exercise some of those "brilliant" offensive coordinator muscles.

I agree. There were multiple plays where we had our 5 O-lineman plus Justin Johnson on the line of scrimmage, with Jordan Thomas playing off the line of scrimmage next to Johnson, with Aeris and Fitz in the backfield and Fred Ross and Donald Gray out wide. That's a TON of poundage to match up against in the box for opposing Defensive Coordinators, and it almost forces you to match up one on one with the 2 recievers out wide whether it be Ross, Gray, Mixon, or Dear. Eventually a DB is going to bite on the play action and leave one of our Wide out's wide open, this is what happened on the Malik Dear touchdown.

This is what I have been begging to see from Mullen, as have others, and what do you know it worked. Force the opposing team to load up the box due to a two-TE set, shove it down their throat with our big backs in Aeris and Fitz, then pop a play action deep when their defense is worn down and expecting run. Then you throw in a wide reciever motion play where you can hand it off to him, or fake the hand off and pull one of their guys out of the box. There are just so many things our offense can do when it is ran correctly. What you saw Saturday was the power option spread offense ran to perfection. It truly was a thing of beauty.

[dawgday166]

Yea ... and I like it. Hope Dan doesn't forget about it during the off season.

[lamont]

The knock on Hev is his recruiting- not his coaching

While there is no doubt the OL was improved- making Aeris the every down back was just as big. Fitz was the nation's leader in TO the last 5 weeks or so- that also coincided with Aeris getting nod at TB and riding him.

[HoopsDawg]

The knock on Hev is his recruiting- not his coaching

While there is no doubt the OL was improved- making Aeris the every down back was just as big. Fitz was the nation's leader in TO the last 5 weeks or so- that also coincided with Aeris getting nod at TB and riding him.

Also, why wasn't Jenkins in there at guard all year? And Desper was clearly a better RG than LG. That's the kind of stuff along with Aeris at RB that really pisses me off.

[dawgday166]

Also, why wasn't Jenkins in there at guard all year? And Desper was clearly a better RG than LG. That's the kind of stuff along with Aeris at RB that really pisses me off.

Sho'' left some games out on the table this year cause of all of that.

[lamont]

Also, why wasn't Jenkins in there at guard all year? And Desper was clearly a better RG than LG. That's the kind of stuff along with Aeris at RB that really pisses me off.

Jenkins was certainly better there than Calhoun. He looks really good at LG. Rankin woke up out of his funk too.

[Bucky Dog]

Yes I'm with you on the OLine. I think once Rankin got confident and we established who was playing where after the Auburn game, wthey got better throughout the season.

For most improved from beginning to end, how about Fitz?! I mean from his decision making, toughness, but especially his leadership. He grew up big time this year.

[msbulldog]

I agree. There were multiple plays where we had our 5 O-lineman plus Justin Johnson on the line of scrimmage, with Jordan Thomas playing off the line of scrimmage next to Johnson, with Aeris and Fitz in the backfield and Fred Ross and Donald Gray out wide. That's a TON of poundage to match up against in the box for opposing Defensive Coordinators, and it almost forces you to match up one on one with the 2 recievers out wide whether it be Ross, Gray, Mixon, or Dear. Eventually a DB is going to bite on the play action and leave one of our Wide out's wide open, this is what happened on the Malik Dear touchdown.

This is what I have been begging to see from Mullen, as have others, and what do you know it worked. Force the opposing team to load up the box due to a two-TE set, shove it down their throat with our big backs in Aeris and Fitz, then pop a play action deep when their defense is worn down and expecting run. Then you throw in a wide reciever motion play where you can hand it off to him, or fake the hand off and pull one of their guys out of the box. There are just so many things our offense can do when it is ran correctly. What you saw Saturday was the power option spread offense ran to perfection. It truly was a thing of beauty.

For a man with so few posts you make a ton of sense!

[msbulldog]

The knock on Hev is his recruiting- not his coaching

While there is no doubt the OL was improved- making Aeris the every down back was just as big. Fitz was the nation's leader in TO the last 5 weeks or so- that also coincided with Aeris getting nod at TB and riding him.

C'mon man, you think that might have to do with the competition in November?

[HoopsDawg]

Jenkins was certainly better there than Calhoun. He looks really good at LG. Rankin woke up out of his funk too.

I hope Hev leaves him there and doesn't shuffle things up like he does every spring and move him to RT. Need Champion to win the RG job. Develop a RT, I don't know who. Hopefully, Hayes signs.

[1bigdawg]

I hope Hev leaves him there and doesn't shuffle things up like he does every spring and move him to RT. Need Champion to win the RG job. Develop a RT, I don't know who. Hopefully, Hayes signs.

I hope Hev does not leave him there, but someone who replaces Hev does. People are acting like it is ok to have a bad O line for half a season as long as they "come around." We did get much better as the season went on, but we were starting three seniors. The others should have been plug and play for the South Alabama game.

He does not recruit well apparently because recruits don't like him. Then he takes half a season for the "developmental" players to gel or whatever, even after they have been in the program at least three springs.

Please Coach, remember what losing to USA was like. Let's get an Oline coach who get recruit and develop.

PS: For those who say our recruiting is much better this year: Who are we getting that the really big boys want? That is what it takes to compete with them.

[DeviousDawg]

C'mon man, you think that might have to do with the competition in November?

I think he mean to say Fitz was the nations leader in TD the last 5 weeks or so, not TO. Fitz had 22 total TD over the last 5 games to just 6 TO.

[lamont]

C'mon man, you think that might have to do with the competition in November?

No- not at all. In October we played Kentucky, Samford, and BYU. Teams tacked Holloway with one hand- they couldnt do that with Aeris. It changes your entire run game.

[lamont]

I think he mean to say Fitz was the nations leader in TD the last 5 weeks or so, not TO. Fitz had 22 total TD over the last 5 games to just 6 TO.

Fitz led the nation for QB's in Total Offense the last 5 weeks

[maroonmania]

Hev is at least a decent OL coach but is a terrible recruiter. I in no way am joking when I say Hev should be sent to essentially a "charm school" of some kind where he doesn't just totally grate on people and refrains from acting like an ass at least when he's off the field.

[msstate7]

Fitz led the nation for QB's in Total Offense the last 5 weeks

Pretty impressive esp considering bama was in that 5 weeks, so essentially 4 games vs 5 for others

[dparker]

People are acting like it is ok to have a bad O line for half a season as long as they "come around."

Amen. It's not too much to ask for someone who is a decent coach AND can recruit.

[Coach007]

Amen. It's not too much to ask for someone who is a decent coach AND can recruit.


People are acting like it is ok to have a bad O line for half a season as long as they "come around."


Not at all. People are acting like they know what took place in the off-season. It's not that hard to understand that we were going to have issues in the secondary due to the graduation of our starters and the lose of their replacements to injuries. Somethings are not some grand failure. It is what it is. We lost a lot last year.

Is there room for improvement? Yes. But that's true no matter where you are. Ask Saban if there is room for improvement.

[deltadawg99]

Jenkins to OG was the difference. I rewatched the egg bowl last night and how he didn't get SEC OL of the week is mind boggling. He dominated and did a great job getting to the second level.

Our OL could be pretty good next year. Question is, who starts at RT? I would guess either a juco, Story or Cochran. Maybe Reese, but I thought he was a OG.

LT - Rankin - played really well the second half of the season
LG - Jenkins
C - Moon - finally a true center and can't be any worse then Clayborn.
RG - Calhoun
RT -Tbd

Recruiting and making adjustments is what kills me about Hevesy. I'll never understand why he put Desper at OG, even though he was an UA at center and Clayborn to center, when clayborn had shown some real flashes at OG early in his career.

[Really Clark?]

Amen. It's not too much to ask for someone who is a decent coach AND can recruit.

The thing is there are not that many good OL coaches that are also really good recruiters. You absolutely have to have a good OL coach first and last. They have to teach their position more than any other coach. If they can recruit a little, it's a bonus. Hev problem is while he is ok to good OL coach he is almost a complete albatross at recruiting. Now when he hits, Dak, Chris Jones, etc. he knocks out of the park. But he is only going to hit .150 for you. If we can stay the same or upgrade at the coaching point, I probably make the change because he has issues and we have had to do a lot of adjusting to make up for those issues in recruiting. If we feel like he has the OL moving in the right direction for next season and we have a great plan for him not to be a liability this recruiting cycle, and they seem to have that part in position so far, then I can see not wanting to break up the offensive potential for next year. But if it's me, I'm probably really looking for the right guy anyway.

[ShotgunDawg]

Jenkins to OG was the difference. I rewatched the egg bowl last night and how he didn't get SEC OL of the week is mind boggling. He dominated and did a great job getting to the second level.

Our OL could be pretty good next year. Question is, who starts at RT? I would guess either a juco, Story or Cochran. Maybe Reese, but I thought he was a OG.

LT - Rankin - played really well the second half of the season
LG - Jenkins
C - Moon - finally a true center and can't be any worse then Clayborn.
RG - Calhoun
RT -Tbd

Recruiting and making adjustments is what kills me about Hevesy. I'll never understand why he put Desper at OG, even though he was an UA at center and Clayborn to center, when clayborn had shown some real flashes at OG early in his career.

What's the word on Moon?

I'd kind of already put him in the Cole Carter/ Jake Thomas category. Has he been turning some heads?

[whatever]

The thing is there are not that many good OL coaches that are also really good recruiters. You absolutely have to have a good OL coach first and last. They have to teach their position more than any other coach. If they can recruit a little, it's a bonus. Hev problem is while he is ok to good OL coach he is almost a complete albatross at recruiting. Now when he hits, Dak, Chris Jones, etc. he knocks out of the park. But he is only going to hit .150 for you. If we can stay the same or upgrade at the coaching point, I probably make the change because he has issues and we have had to do a lot of adjusting to make up for those issues in recruiting. If we feel like he has the OL moving in the right direction for next season and we have a great plan for him not to be a liability this recruiting cycle, and they seem to have that part in position so far, then I can see not wanting to break up the offensive potential for next year. But if it's me, I'm probably really looking for the right guy anyway.
Yeah I mean we did finish 2nd in the conference in sacks allowed and 3rd in yards per carry vs conference teams... plus haven't the last 3 years been the best 3 offenses in school history?

I guess I just don't get the mob mentality that everyone has jumped on board with the last 12 months with him being MSU's biggest problem and being undoubtedly the 1st coach that needs to go.

I agree with the 1st sentence above that I want a good coach first at that position, plus he probably understands Mullen's offense better than anyone on staff and what he wants done and how he wants it done.

Recruit around him, let the other guys with good personalities be the primary recruiters of our top OL prospects. Hell, hire 157 analysts like Alabama and have half of them work on recruiting and building relationships w/ high school staffers like Barney Farrar does. Use support staff to develop all the relationships w player families/influencers and relationships w/ runners in every town we need them. We've got 6-8 off field staff guys with "recruiting specialist" or director titles, let's gets some great guys in those roles and hold them accountable. I get they're limited in the contact they can have, but they can play an important role

[MadDawg]

Yes I'm with you on the OLine. I think once Rankin got confident and we established who was playing where after the Auburn game, wthey got better throughout the season.

For most improved from beginning to end, how about Fitz?! I mean from his decision making, toughness, but especially his leadership. He grew up big time this year.

I'm with you on Fitz. The difference in him in the South Alabama game versus the ole miss game is like night and day. He's running the read option very well as of late.

[Really Clark?]

Yeah I mean we did finish 2nd in the conference in sacks allowed and 3rd in yards per carry vs conference teams... plus haven't the last 3 years been the best 3 offenses in school history?

I guess I just don't get the mob mentality that everyone has jumped on board with the last 12 months with him being MSU's biggest problem and being undoubtedly the 1st coach that needs to go.

I agree with the 1st sentence above that I want a good coach first at that position, plus he probably understands Mullen's offense better than anyone on staff and what he wants done and how he wants it done.

Recruit around him, let the other guys with good personalities be the primary recruiters of our top OL prospects. Hell, hire 157 analysts like Alabama and have half of them work on recruiting and building relationships w/ high school staffers like Barney Farrar does. Use support staff to develop all the relationships w player families/influencers and relationships w/ runners in every town we need them. We've got 6-8 off field staff guys with "recruiting specialist" or director titles, let's gets some great guys in those roles and hold them accountable. I get they're limited in the contact they can have, but they can play an important role

I agree with all that but there is only one issue that we haven't been able cover up. The vast majority of the players do put their position coach high on the list when choosing a school. If we can overcome that to a good enough degree, then that's fine. But that has been the issue. And everybody will tell you I'm not an extremist about changing coaches by any stretch. Hopefully if the issues that made him a bigger problem the last few years then it should have been is corrected as well.