Stolen from Dawg at Auburn

[lamont]

SEC offensive linemen in the NFL:

Alabama 9
Florida 8
LSU 7
Tex A&M 6
Missouri 5
Georgia 5
Tenn 5
Mississippi 5
UPig 4
SC 4
Auburn 3
Vandy 2
Kentucky 1
State 1

There are about 265 OL jobs in the NFL- 65 from the SEC. We have a Croom recruit- Gabe Jackson

Looking at the numbers- the winningest teams in the SEC recently have the most.
Also- roughly 25% of the NFL's OL guys are from the SEC. Shows the importance of OL recruiting for playing winning football.

[WinningIsRelentless]

Agenda again.

Why don't you do it for every position then.
DL
Lbs
CB
S
Wr
Rb

I would have to say we are at the bottom in all of them.

So I guess we might have a hell of a coach who can win more than 70% of his games over 7 years.

[lamont]

Why is truth agenda?

We are in the top half of the SEC in draft picks the last 5 years. So no- we are producing talent

[HoopsDawg]

Agenda again.

Why don't you do it for every position then.
DL
Lbs
CB
S
Wr
Rb

I would have to say we are at the bottom in all of them.

So I guess we might have a hell of a coach who can win more than 70% of his games over 7 years.


Are you serious? He just posted a fact. This is Mullen's/Hevesey's 8th year in the program and they have ZERO O-line recruits in the NFL. ZERO.

[WinningIsRelentless]

Those stats aren't from the last 5 years. Breakdown those numbers further by who recruited them then its not an agenda.

[dawgday166]

I'm thinking the "Agenda" should be to address this issue, regardless of who the HC is. Cause it is a big issue.

[msstate7]

How long a period? If it's over Mullen's state career, auburn has won a natty and been a runner up with 2 more olinemen in the NFL

[HoopsDawg]

Those stats aren't from the last 5 years. Breakdown those numbers further by who recruited them then its not an agenda.

I don't understand what you mean. Hevesey has been here 8 years. He has recruited and signed about 50 O-linemen and none have made it in the NFL. You would think dumb luck would at least provide 1.

[msstate7]

I don't understand what you mean. Hevesey has been here 8 years. He has recruited and signed about 50 O-linemen and none have made it in the NFL. You would think dumb luck would at least provide 1.

Freeze gets praised as a great recruiter and he's only put 1 in the NFL... lot of debt still to be paid for that one too. Freeze did go get a graduate transfer too though to be fair

[HoopsDawg]

Freeze gets praised as a great recruiter and he's only put 1 in the NFL... lot of debt still to be paid for that one too. Freeze did go get a graduate transfer too though to be fair

He's got a couple of more on the roster as well. We don't.

[gtowndawg]

Agenda again.

With all due respect, if we can't all at least admit our O-line recruiting has been horrendous than this is all I got...

https://media.giphy.com/media/Fjr6v88OPk7U4/giphy.gif

[Red Sox Dawg]

Our OLine recruiting is a known quantity. You can go back and look at our teams, or others and a good oline is what it takes to be competitive. The elite coaches recruit that position very hard. Very difficult to be good with a subpar oline.

[StatesboroBlues]

Agenda again.

Why don't you do it for every position then.
DL
Lbs
CB
S
Wr
Rb

I would have to say we are at the bottom in all of them.

So I guess we might have a hell of a coach who can win more than 70% of his games over 7 years.

Well...we have a few DL in the NFL. And you are welcome to get back to me when those other positions are as important as OL. Most would factor that you play 5 OL on every play...so you have had more OL go through than any other position.

[lamont]

Freeze gets praised as a great recruiter and he's only put 1 in the NFL... lot of debt still to be paid for that one too. Freeze did go get a graduate transfer too though to be fair

Freeze has 2 in the NFL after only 4 years of coaching. Don't forget Cooper

[BrunswickDawg]

Why is truth agenda?

We are in the top half of the SEC in draft picks the last 5 years. So no- we are producing talent

Yeah, but it's not like we have really produced a huge number of OL to begin with. Jackie had a run with Brent Smith, Randy Thomas, and Pork Chop on those late 90s teams. But, before or since what big OL talent has there been at MSU? Kent Hull?

It's something that has plagued MSU for a long time.

[dawgday166]

Seems like Freeze has 2 - Fahn Cooper seems to have made it. He's on the 49ers roster.

Overall tho I say screw Freeze, Malzan, Miles, etc. What deficiencies do we have and how do we address them? What do we have to do to get close to the SEC W standard bearer (the big elephant)? Not saying we'll get there but the closer we get the more games we'll win.

If Mullen does that I'll be big time in his corner.

[BulldogBear]

This is a huge issue, whether agenda or not. An OL that blows the other guys off the ball is paramount and instantly upgrades your entire backfield. You don't need 5 star superstar backs. Adequate ones will do. An example of upgrade (potentially). Had Vick Ballard been at Bama, he would have had a good chance at being a Heisman candidate. The OL makes a huge difference.

[msstate7]

Freeze has 2 in the NFL after only 4 years of coaching. Don't forget Cooper
Graduate transfer... I may have missed another though

[lamont]

Graduate transfer... I may have missed another though

Still counts. Freeze recruited and signed him. We are allowed to take grad transfers too

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

How long a period? If it's over Mullen's state career, auburn has won a natty and been a runner up with 2 more olinemen in the NFL

They also had Cam Newton and have an average recruiting ranking in the Top 10...then the talent left and they're 6-10 in the SEC since 2013.

[msstate7]

Anyone have the time frame for this? I'd like to see what the avg offensive ranking for each team is over the period also.

[QuadrupleOption]

Won't argue this point at all, even though for the most part Random and I disagree on the job Mullen's done here. We need better recruiting on the offensive line for sure.

I think we're doing pretty well everywhere else honestly - better than we ever did under Croom.

[msstate7]

They also had Cam Newton and have an average recruiting ranking in the Top 10...then the talent left and they're 6-10 in the SEC since 2013.

One of their 3 was last year... shon Coleman.

[Political Hack]

Agenda again.

Why don't you do it for every position then.
DL
Lbs
CB
S
Wr
Rb

I would have to say we are at the bottom in all of them.

So I guess we might have a hell of a coach who can win more than 70% of his games over 7 years.

Is Hev your wife or are you his?***

Kidding of course, but your agenda seems to be pushing that someone else has an agenda.

[lamont]

One of their 3 was last year... shon Coleman.

Auburn's lack of NFL OL guys shows you why they have been so inconsistent the last 5-6 years.

[Political Hack]

Won't argue this point at all, even though for the most part Random and I disagree on the job Mullen's done here. We need better recruiting on the offensive line for sure.

I think we're doing pretty well everywhere else honestly - better than we ever did under Croom.

I don't think RP would argue that CDM hasn't done a great job here. He just thinks he's capped out and things are trending the wrong direction right now. I don't think he's necessarily capped out, but I do think it's his fault that we're sliding.

[QuadrupleOption]

Anyone have the time frame for this? I'd like to see what the avg offensive ranking for each team is over the period also.

Total offense by year:

2009 - 73rd
2010 - 49th
2011 - 73rd
2012 - 60th
2013 - 76th
2014 - 17th
2015 - 33rd
2016 - 75th (to-date)

For reference, under Croom:
2004 - 118th
2005 - 114th
2006 - 97th
2007 - 97th
2008 - 116th

Source: http://www.sports-reference.com

[Jack Lambert]

Freeze has 2 in the NFL after only 4 years of coaching. Don't forget Cooper

Paid and bought for.

[msstate7]

Auburn's lack of NFL OL guys shows you why they have been so inconsistent the last 5-6 years.

From '09-'14, auburn had 2 olinemen drafted. During that time, auburn won a natty and was a runner up.

Auburn has had 1 NFL olineman drafted the last 2 years and they haven't been real good.

Not sure olinemen are the key factor is their success

[msstate7]

Total offense by year:

2009 - 73rd
2010 - 49th
2011 - 73rd
2012 - 60th
2013 - 76th
2014 - 17th
2015 - 33rd
2016 - 75th (to-date)

For reference, under Croom:
2004 - 118th
2005 - 114th
2006 - 97th
2007 - 97th
2008 - 116th

Source: http://www.sports-reference.com

Thanks. I was gonna go get each team's ranking and stack it against the olinemen drafted rankings to see how it relates to offensive success

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

One of their 3 was last year... shon Coleman.

Shon Coleman signed in the 2010 class and had cancer that prevented him from playing until 2013....he is an outlier

[dawgday166]

I would look at scoring O and red zone efficiency as opposed to overall offense (both against SEC W only competition). You may can get by between the 20's with an average 0 line, but getting into the end zone inside the 20 is another matter.

[mic]

And even better stat would be.
How many ALL SEC Olineman at the end of each season have we had over the last 8 years. (1st 2nd or 3rd team)
I wonder how we rank there..

[Political Hack]

And even better stat would be.
How many ALL SEC Olineman at the end of each season have we had over the last 8 years. (1st 2nd or 3rd team)
I wonder how we rank there..

That would be telling.

Auburn and State had runs because we had great QBs who helped negate not so great OL.

[msstate7]

And even better stat would be.
How many ALL SEC Olineman at the end of each season have we had over the last 8 years. (1st 2nd or 3rd team)
I wonder how we rank there..

Strictly guessing, but sherrod, Jackson, day, and beckwith

[bullygrowl]

http://www.espn.com/nfl/college/_/letter/m

[confucius say]

From '09-'14, auburn had 2 olinemen drafted. During that time, auburn won a natty and was a runner up.

Auburn has had 1 NFL olineman drafted the last 2 years and they haven't been real good.

Not sure olinemen are the key factor is their success

Not to mention they have two NFL guards now in kozan and smith now and they will be 7-5 at best, prob 6-6.

[dawgday166]

I posted that a while back about the disparity between D personnel and O personnel in the league. Seeings as how Mullen is an OC I kinda expect it to be more equal than it is.

[mic]

Strictly guessing, but sherrod, Jackson, day, and beckwith

Take Sherrod off the list he was already here..
So if it's just 3 guys to make 1st 2nd or 3rd team at the end of the season , that's even more pathetic than having 1 NFL guy..

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Freeze is not a great recruiter nor is he a good coach. He is a good salesman. That's it. Once he gets them, he lets them run the show. They do what they want for 3 or 4 years then when they try to make it in the NFL, they get a huge wake up call. I compare it to the Academy that I went to. I goofed off all through junior high and high school, teachers didnt care, and then when I got to junior college I was lost. I had to take intermediate Algebra before I could even take an Algebra class.

[maroonmania]

SEC offensive linemen in the NFL:

Alabama 9
Florida 8
LSU 7
Tex A&M 6
Missouri 5
Georgia 5
Tenn 5
Mississippi 5
UPig 4
SC 4
Auburn 3
Vandy 2
Kentucky 1
State 1

There are about 265 OL jobs in the NFL- 65 from the SEC. We have a Croom recruit- Gabe Jackson

Looking at the numbers- the winningest teams in the SEC recently have the most.
Also- roughly 25% of the NFL's OL guys are from the SEC. Shows the importance of OL recruiting for playing winning football.

As I have stated in other threads, I absolutely believe there are THREE things that will prevent the MSU program under Mullen from ever truly becoming above "pretty good". And when I say that meaning ever becoming a program that could consistently win 9-10 games per year.

1. Recruiting - Mullen nor his staff really embrace it like you need to in order to become elite and really Mullen himself is not that great at it (ask Tim Tebow). You have to give props to the UNM coaches in the sense that even without the cheating part they eat, sleep and drink recruiting. On the positive side we have at least added some guys in the recruiting office that hopefully will help.
2. Defensive Continuity - You can't build any consistency on that side of the ball when you can't keep a DC in place for more than one year at a time. I don't know any highly successful program that transitions the staff on defense at the rate we do.
3. John Hevesy - 'nuf said.

[lamont]

From '09-'14, auburn had 2 olinemen drafted. During that time, auburn won a natty and was a runner up.

Auburn has had 1 NFL olineman drafted the last 2 years and they haven't been real good.

Not sure olinemen are the key factor is their success

They also had a losing season and went 6-6 last year. Their lack of guys on the OL has caused them inconsistency. They also play a quality opponent each year OOC- plus Georgia. We play A weak OOC usually and Kentucky

[Bubb Rubb]

Yeah, but it's not like we have really produced a huge number of OL to begin with. Jackie had a run with Brent Smith, Randy Thomas, and Pork Chop on those late 90s teams. But, before or since what big OL talent has there been at MSU? Kent Hull?

It's something that has plagued MSU for a long time.

This is patently false. State had a reputation for having a big, physical offensive line going back many years. Jackie's offensive lines were always good - they were built to support what we did best as a football team - run the ball, play the field position game, control time of possession, and play defense. Croom even had decent offensive lines.

I think a big part of our problem is scheme. It's a lot harder to zone block and get out in space to block down on screens if you have big, slow, lumbering offensive linemen. If we were more committed to running the ball and blocking downhill, our offensive line would probably be better.

[WinningIsRelentless]

Is Hev your wife or are you his?***

Kidding of course, but your agenda seems to be pushing that someone else has an agenda.

No im just saying you have to look at the macro view vs the micro view. The d has actually been a lot bigger issue for us the past 3 years than the offense. Yes I do blame Dan for not keeping d coordinator. With that being said, the way we recruit isn't each position coach is responsible for his position but instead for his territorial area. Everyone forgets hevs was the one who found Dak for state also.

[Political Hack]

No im just saying you have to look at the micro view vs the macro view. The d has actually been a lot bigger issue for us the past 3 years than the offense. Yes I do blame Dan for not keeping d coordinator. With that being said, the way we recruit isn't each position coach is responsible for his position but instead for his territorial area. Everyone forgets hevs was the one who found Dak for state also.

That's a fair point on Dak, but Mullen gets the credit for recruiting him. That was a QB & QB coach recruitment.

I do agree on defense being the main issue, but having an OL helps a defense a lot.

[BrunswickDawg]

This is patently false. State had a reputation for having a big, physical offensive line going back many years. Jackie's offensive lines were always good - they were built to support what we did best as a football team - run the ball, play the field position game, control time of possession, and play defense. Croom even had decent offensive lines.

I think a big part of our problem is scheme. It's a lot harder to zone block and get out in space to block down on screens if you have big, slow, lumbering offensive linemen. If we were more committed to running the ball and blocking downhill, our offensive line would probably be better.
I was going by the criteria laid out by the OP - OL in the league. Other than all of the guys I listed being in the NFL at the same time we have never had more than 1 or 2 OL in the league at the same time. That is a fact.

[WinningIsRelentless]

That's a fair point on Dak, but Mullen gets the credit for recruiting him. That was a QB & QB coach recruitment.

I do agree on defense being the main issue, but having an OL helps a defense a lot.

Having a defense that can get stops and off the field helps a ol a lot more than having a ol helps a d. The more reps in a shorter period of time a d and dl has to play the better your o and ol will look.

[HancockCountyDog]

Graduate transfer... I may have missed another though

Cooper was a Juco.

[Bubb Rubb]

I was going by the criteria laid out by the OP - OL in the league. Other than all of the guys I listed being in the NFL at the same time we have never had more than 1 or 2 OL in the league at the same time. That is a fact.

And I think it's a flawed criteria. The league drafts players not only on performance at the college level, but on measurables and potential. They have to do this because there are so many things done schematically at the college level that aren't done at the pro level. We don't need to recruit guys that are pro prospects on the offensive line....we need to do a better job of recruiting guys who fit our scheme. I agree we need to improve. But using the stat about how many make it to the league is a flawed comparison in my opinion.

I think a way to make those numbers more relevant is to break out the number - of the ones that made the league, how many became pro-bowl players, how many were journeymen, and how many were just backups/practice squad players. In a lot of cases, pro teams will take a flier on an otherwise undeserving offensive lineman if he came from a powerhouse program - especially from the SEC or Big 10.

[BrunswickDawg]

And I think it's a flawed criteria. The league drafts players not only on performance at the college level, but on measurables and potential. They have to do this because there are so many things done schematically at the college level that aren't done at the pro level. We don't need to recruit guys that are pro prospects on the offensive line....we need to do a better job of recruiting guys who fit our scheme. I agree we need to improve. But using the stat about how many make it to the league is a flawed comparison in my opinion.

I think a way to make those numbers more relevant is to break out the number - of the ones that made the league, how many became pro-bowl players, how many were journeymen, and how many were just backups/practice squad players. In a lot of cases, pro teams will take a flier on an otherwise undeserving offensive lineman if he came from a powerhouse program - especially from the SEC or Big 10.

I don't disagree. Random established the criteria in the OP. I was just adding context. I guess I should have added "your measurement sucks" in my original post?***

[Todd4State]

As I have stated in other threads, I absolutely believe there are THREE things that will prevent the MSU program under Mullen from ever truly becoming above "pretty good". And when I say that meaning ever becoming a program that could consistently win 9-10 games per year.

1. Recruiting - Mullen nor his staff really embrace it like you need to in order to become elite and really Mullen himself is not that great at it (ask Tim Tebow). You have to give props to the UNM coaches in the sense that even without the cheating part they eat, sleep and drink recruiting. On the positive side we have at least added some guys in the recruiting office that hopefully will help.
2. Defensive Continuity - You can't build any consistency on that side of the ball when you can't keep a DC in place for more than one year at a time. I don't know any highly successful program that transitions the staff on defense at the rate we do.
3. John Hevesy - 'nuf said.

This man gets it.

[HoopsDawg]

As I have stated in other threads, I absolutely believe there are THREE things that will prevent the MSU program under Mullen from ever truly becoming above "pretty good". And when I say that meaning ever becoming a program that could consistently win 9-10 games per year.

1. Recruiting - Mullen nor his staff really embrace it like you need to in order to become elite and really Mullen himself is not that great at it (ask Tim Tebow). You have to give props to the UNM coaches in the sense that even without the cheating part they eat, sleep and drink recruiting. On the positive side we have at least added some guys in the recruiting office that hopefully will help.
2. Defensive Continuity - You can't build any consistency on that side of the ball when you can't keep a DC in place for more than one year at a time. I don't know any highly successful program that transitions the staff on defense at the rate we do.
3. John Hevesy - 'nuf said.

Exactly my view.

[Political Hack]

Having a defense that can get stops and off the field helps a ol a lot more than having a ol helps a d. The more reps in a shorter period of time a d and dl has to play the better your o and ol will look.

Or you could argue that continually grounding out first downs with a good running games keeps your defense off the field and fresh.

[SheltonChoked]

Not many of those guys made the league. We had a big OL, but not many NFL guys.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

This year, UGA is a good example of what can happen with poor O-Line play. They will get slaughtered against any team that has an above average D Line.

[PMDawg]

Freeze has 2 in the NFL after only 4 years of coaching. Don't forget Cooper

And Bradley Sowell. I don't agree with you much, but I agree with you here.

[confucius say]

As I have stated in other threads, I absolutely believe there are THREE things that will prevent the MSU program under Mullen from ever truly becoming above "pretty good". And when I say that meaning ever becoming a program that could consistently win 9-10 games per year.

1. Recruiting - Mullen nor his staff really embrace it like you need to in order to become elite and really Mullen himself is not that great at it (ask Tim Tebow). You have to give props to the UNM coaches in the sense that even without the cheating part they eat, sleep and drink recruiting. On the positive side we have at least added some guys in the recruiting office that hopefully will help.
2. Defensive Continuity - You can't build any consistency on that side of the ball when you can't keep a DC in place for more than one year at a time. I don't know any highly successful program that transitions the staff on defense at the rate we do.
3. John Hevesy - 'nuf said.

Define conristently. Bc we've won 9 or more three of last six years.

There are a lot more issues they will keep us from winning 9 or more every year.

[JoseBrown]

This year, UGA is a good example of what can happen with poor O-Line play. They will get slaughtered against any team that has an above average D Line.

That is exactly right.
The three teams combined the past three seasons we have one win against Bama, LSU and UNM.. With an adequate offensive line we would compete with them, but with poor o line play getting dominated by their d lines we are 1-8... When most of our offensive plays don't have a chance of working without improvisation by the QB, we have been noncompetitive in these games.
For anyone belly-aching 'agenda', then the truth hurts don't it?

[WinningIsRelentless]

Or you could argue that continually grounding out first downs with a good running games keeps your defense off the field and fresh.
You could but that's not our offense anymore. Like most teams we look for explosive plays to score on

[Turfdawg67]

This year, UGA is a good example of what can happen with poor O-Line play. They will get slaughtered against any team that has an above average D Line.

And UGA consistantly has top 10 recruiting classes... so what's the point of the OP and this thread? That Mullen can't recruit?

[Turfdawg67]

And Bradley Sowell. I don't agree with you much, but I agree with you here.

Newsflash! Freeze cheats! We could have a Tunsil or a Cam/AJ, for that matter, but we don't pony up that kind of dough. So your point is moot.

[I seen it dawg]

Agenda again.

Why don't you do it for every position then.
DL
Lbs
CB
S
Wr
Rb

I would have to say we are at the bottom in all of them.

So I guess we might have a hell of a coach who can win more than 70% of his games over 7 years.

You're right it is an agenda. An agenda of facts that you won't understand.

[I seen it dawg]

Those stats aren't from the last 5 years. Breakdown those numbers further by who recruited them then its not an agenda.

We've got 1 ****ing guy!!!!!!!!! 1!!!!!!!!!!!! So the last 5 years we have NONE!!!!! Agenda that shit.

[I seen it dawg]

We don't sign guys on the OL that can play football effectively at this level. The OL coach then the head coach are directly responsible. It's not hard.

[Dallas_Dawg]

That's really bad. I just wish we had some that were good enough to be on an NFL practice squad for a couple years.
If one good thing comes from Strick leaving, i hope it's this:
He has the balls to go to Mullen and make him let Hevesy, Knox and Sallach go after the Egg bowl. And then hire a new OL, RB, and special teams/TE coach.
In any working relationship, you have to be able to identify others' weaknesses and address them. Especially arrogant ass SEC football coaches.
If les miles fires Cam last year and hires a good, young OC, they might be #2 in the country right now

[Really Clark?]

That's really bad. I just wish we had some that were good enough to be on an NFL practice squad for a couple years.
If one good thing comes from Strick leaving, i hope it's this:
He has the balls to go to Mullen and make him let Hevesy, Knox and Sallach go after the Egg bowl. And then hire a new OL, RB, and special teams/TE coach.
In any working relationship, you have to be able to identify others' weaknesses and address them. Especially arrogant ass SEC football coaches.
If les miles fires Cam last year and hires a good, young OC, they might be #2 in the country right now

Pretty sure Day is still on the practice squad. Not much but that's one I believe.

[BrunswickDawg]

Pretty sure Day is still on the practice squad. Not much but that's one I believe.
He is.
Blaine Clausell is on one too.

[Really Clark?]

He is.
Blaine Clausell is on one too.

Thanks, forgot him.

[Dallas_Dawg]

Sorry, that was poor wording on my part. I'm saying I wish we had NFL practice squad OL on our roster NOW

[dawgday166]

Sorry, that was poor wording on my part. I'm saying I wish we had NFL practice squad OL on our roster NOW

I believe I could live with that. If we had at least 3, one of which is a center. Gotta open some big holes for Holloway. One D lineman brushing him with his hand slightly and he's down for no gain ****

[PMDawg]

Newsflash! Freeze cheats! We could have a Tunsil or a Cam/AJ, for that matter, but we don't pony up that kind of dough. So your point is moot.

Wait, what???!!!! Well, I'll be. Thanks for filling me in.

[Sacrifice]

The fact that Devon Desper is starting tells you all you need to know about the state of our OL and OL recruiting. Do we not have anyone that can beat him out?

Somebody posted a montage of videos of Desper missing blocks or just flat out getting beat from the UMass game on SPS. It's bad and I mean really bad!

[Political Hack]

And we, the fans and alumni, had to absolutely hammer Hev into submission to get Day an offer. Think about that. The fans were screaming bloody murder trying to get that kid an offer. We realized, before our coaches, how good he was and that we needed him. Between that and the kid from SC that wanted to check out State, and we didn't pursue, I've given up on Hev ever giving half of a shit about recruiting.