I posted that I was concerned about this last week....

[Liverpooldawg]

I've been around a winning program on another level for quite a while now. It's been long enough to watch the ebb and flow of things over time. One thing that the really good teams have is leadership within the team. I'm talking about players. What I think saw Saturday was exactly the thing I posted about last week. When you have a team that has strong leadership that is present and leads for more than one year, whether it is a dominate class or a really strong single leader, and all of a sudden it's gone, teams sometimes struggle to find their feet. They tend to stand around looking for that leader/leaders. Sometimes they find it early, sometimes they don't. I've see some really talented teams that never found it and underachieved because of it. I've seen some less talented teams overachieve because of it. Everything I have heard over the last two years says that Dak was THE guy. We were still looking for him Saturday. I know some of you will say that it's a coach's job to find it, but it just doesn't work that way. It has to come from within. Hopefully it will surface, and soon. We obviously have other problems, but if this one doesn't resolve itself the others most likely won't have a chance to be solved.

[Commercecomet24]

I read something PJ Fleck said last month and it holds true with every team i've ever coached or played on, I mean every single time: “Bad teams, no one leads. Average teams, coaches lead. But elite teams, players lead,” This is an absolute truism, but that type of environment has to be cultivated. I hope some of our players and coaches both nut up this week and get it together.

[SheltonChoked]

I think this is what happened to us Saturday, and to the 2014 baseball team.

It's on the coaches to coax out leaders, and the players to step up.

[Commercecomet24]

I think this is what happened to us Saturday, and to the 2014 baseball team.

It's on the coaches to coax out leaders, and the players to step up.

This man gets it!

[BrunswickDawg]

I think this is what happened to us Saturday, and to the 2014 baseball team.

It's on the coaches to coax out leaders, and the players to step up.

Which is why I think it was a bad move by Dan not to name a #1. If you know coming out of spring that Tiano is too young, Dam. Williams is so quiet or touchy he won't talk, Staley was too much of a clown, and Fitz is our own Dr. Bo, you have put someone in the position to take the reigns. Waiting until fall was a HUGE mistake. I think it was a bigger mistake then making the wrong decision on which one should be your leader. That would have given the #1 guy the whole summer to build the connections with the rest of the O instead of breaking them into factions.

Yes, you would rather have someone step up into that role, but sometimes that issue has to be forced for the leader to step forward - especially when you are in a leadership vacuum like the one Liverpool describes.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

I think this is what happened to us Saturday

I've posted it several times, but AJ Jefferson admitted as much with the game saturday. He said the young guys thought it was over at half and that none of the senior leadership, including himself, said anything to change their tune.

[Tbonewannabe]

Did we have anyone this summer leading voluntary workouts like Dak and BMac did? You would think Damian would have the experience being around Dak so much but sometimes it just isn't in the person's DNA. We don't have to have someone be Dak, we need someone to lead however they do it. Dak left the largest shoes to fill that MSU football has ever had. He was just special and maybe the next guys up don't want to try to follow behind him because the shadow is too big.

[I seen it dawg]

The boss has to set the direction. He should have known by fall camp that leadership was going to be a problem and driven it himself. He didn't. Just kept hoping it would all of a sudden just happen. Take ****ing control.

[Liverpooldawg]

Which is why I think it was a bad move by Dan not to name a #1. If you know coming out of spring that Tiano is too young, Dam. Williams is so quiet or touchy he won't talk, Staley was too much of a clown, and Fitz is our own Dr. Bo, you have put someone in the position to take the reigns. Waiting until fall was a HUGE mistake. I think it was a bigger mistake then making the wrong decision on which one should be your leader. That would have given the #1 guy the whole summer to build the connections with the rest of the O instead of breaking them into factions.

Yes, you would rather have someone step up into that role, but sometimes that issue has to be forced for the leader to step forward - especially when you are in a leadership vacuum like the one Liverpool describes.
It doesn't have to be the QB

[Liverpooldawg]

The boss has to set the direction. He should have known by fall camp that leadership was going to be a problem and driven it himself. He didn't. Just kept hoping it would all of a sudden just happen. Take ****ing control.

It doesn't come from the coaches. Nor can they make it happen.

[I seen it dawg]

It doesn't come from the coaches. Nor can they make it happen.

Bull ****ing shit. You think Saban, Meyer, Harbaugh, Peterson, fisher, swinney, kelly et al don't set the direction of their ****ing program and drive players to leadership roles? You're ****ing lost.

With direction of program set and the players know absolutely with no question how the HC demands things to go, players gravitate into roles and leadership comes out of the ones that have it. If the HC doesn't do those things no leadership comes out. Players just do what they need to do but don't take on leadership roles.

[SheltonChoked]

Last year Bama had the same issue. That's why they lost to Ole Miss. Sabannis a force of will, but even he cannot force a leader. You have to have players step up and lead.

[Liverpooldawg]

Bull ****ing shit. You think Saban, Meyer, Harbaugh, Peterson, fisher, swinney, kelly et al don't set the direction of their ****ing program and drive players to leadership roles? You're ****ing lost.

With direction of program set and the players know absolutely with no question how the HC demands things to go, players gravitate into roles and leadership comes out of the ones that have it. If the HC doesn't do those things no leadership comes out. Players just do what they need to do but don't take on leadership roles.

I'm not talking about setting the direction. I'm talking about internal leadership on the team. You quite obviously have no idea what I'm talking about. The coach can't make that happen, not in a million years.

[BayouDawg]

Just take a look at what happened in the game last night. FSU played like absolute crap the first half and then in the second half they were a completely different team. You think that just happened? That players were sitting around singing kumbaya and just said hey guys I'm ready to be a leader now? No Jimbo busted some heads in that locker room and challenged their man hood! That's how a coach brings out the leader! Some of y'all are bound and determined not to blame the coaches and I can't figure out why. Y'all wanna blame the crowd, the heat, or whatever else y'all can do to deflect blame from the coaches. You don't have to say you want him fired but surely y'all have enough sense to realize that excuse for a performance Saturday falls squarely on Danny boys shoulders.

[Liverpooldawg]

Just take a look at what happened in the game last night. FSU played like absolute crap the first half and then in the second half they were a completely different team. You think that just happened? That players were sitting around singing kumbaya and just said hey guys I'm ready to be a leader now? No Jimbo busted some heads in that locker room and challenged their man hood! That's how a coach brings out the leader! Some of y'all are bound and determined not to blame the coaches and I can't figure out why. Y'all wanna blame the crowd, the heat, or whatever else y'all can do to deflect blame from the coaches. You don't have to say you want him fired but surely y'all have enough sense to realize that excuse for a performance Saturday falls squarely on Danny boys shoulders.

Actually it started when that Freshman QB got knocked into next week but made that TD pass right before the half. Leaders don't have to talk. That team woukd have run through a brick wall for that kid after that.

[BayouDawg]

Actually it started when that Freshman QB got knocked into next week but made that TD pass right before the half. Leaders don't have to talk. That team woukd have run through a brick wall for that kid after that.

That was a great moment but I guarantee you Jimbo and the D coordinator had a come to Jesus meeting in that locker room. The head coach sets the tone for the program. Just like the boss sets the tone for an organization. You can argue with that all you want, but you know it's true

[GTHOM]

Coaches can do just about everything in the world for a program and a team, but you cant make kids lead. You can push them towards it, you can even demand it but if they dont do it. Then they dont. I am of the opinion that they saw Dan wanting out, combine that with possibly the best leader we have ever had graduating, the team prolly said hell we can just get by. Which is part of what happened on saturday. Im not trying to defend Dan he should have and must do better, but no one can make a kid be a leader. Especially not one like Dak was

[BayouDawg]

Coaches can do just about everything in the world for a program and a team, but you cant make kids lead. You can push them towards it, you can even demand it but if they dont do it. Then they dont. I am of the opinion that they saw Dan wanting out, combine that with possibly the best leader we have ever had graduating, the team prolly said hell we can just get by. Which is part of what happened on saturday. Im not trying to defend Dan he should have and must do better, but no one can make a kid be a leader. Especially not one like Dak was

I get that, I really do. It'd be different if we had played an Iowa state or a BYU or even a UCF and just couldn't make the the plays to win. Guys we lost to a middle of the road Sun Belt team. Dan got coached circles around. I am not about to try and make excuses or try and explain it away. It is completely inexcusable

[GTHOM]

I get that, I really do. It'd be different if we had played an Iowa state or a BYU or even a UCF and just couldn't make the the plays to win. Guys we lost to a middle of the road Sun Belt team. Dan got coached circles around. I am not about to try and make excuses or try and explain it away. It is completely inexcusable

I agree 100 percent

[I seen it dawg]

I'm not talking about setting the direction. I'm talking about internal leadership on the team. You quite obviously have no idea what I'm talking about. The coach can't make that happen, not in a million years.

You're the will james of football. And that's not a compliment. Not one coach worth their salt sits back and just waits for a leader to all of a sudden emerge. There are many ways a coach can and does manipulate direction to find leaders then foster their leadership. If a coach sits back and does nothing then more than likely effective leaders don't show. It's not easy to just say "hey somebody will lead" and miraculously someone does. Example this yrs team. So are we to just sit and wait until an internal leader decides to get to it for this yrs team? He obviously hasn't stepped up yet. So the HC does nothing now but wait?

[I seen it dawg]

I'm not talking about setting the direction. I'm talking about internal leadership on the team. You quite obviously have no idea what I'm talking about. The coach can't make that happen, not in a million years.

And go read again...I never said MAKE them lead. You quite obviously can't read.

[I seen it dawg]

Just take a look at what happened in the game last night. FSU played like absolute crap the first half and then in the second half they were a completely different team. You think that just happened? That players were sitting around singing kumbaya and just said hey guys I'm ready to be a leader now? No Jimbo busted some heads in that locker room and challenged their man hood! That's how a coach brings out the leader! Some of y'all are bound and determined not to blame the coaches and I can't figure out why. Y'all wanna blame the crowd, the heat, or whatever else y'all can do to deflect blame from the coaches. You don't have to say you want him fired but surely y'all have enough sense to realize that excuse for a performance Saturday falls squarely on Danny boys shoulders.

Why? Bc they are pussies like our program right now.

[I seen it dawg]

Last year Bama had the same issue. That's why they lost to Ole Miss. Sabannis a force of will, but even he cannot force a leader. You have to have players step up and lead.

Yeah they did lose to OM......but they somehow found a way to win the national title....

[BayouDawg]

Why? Bc they are pussies like our program right now.
I believe you are right. I guess I just don't understand that mindset. I can't understand why some are so scared to criticize a coach after that clown show on Saturday.

[Liverpooldawg]

You're the will james of football. And that's not a compliment. Not one coach worth their salt sits back and just waits for a leader to all of a sudden emerge. There are many ways a coach can and does manipulate direction to find leaders then foster their leadership. If a coach sits back and does nothing then more than likely effective leaders don't show. It's not easy to just say "hey somebody will lead" and miraculously someone does. Example this yrs team. So are we to just sit and wait until an internal leader decides to get to it for this yrs team? He obviously hasn't stepped up yet. So the HC does nothing now but wait?
A coach can set the stage, but as has been pointed out by others besides me you can't MAKE someone lead. Coaches can do thier kind of leading all day long, and do it well, but if you don't have the other kind it doesn't work nearly as well, if at all. I had the luxury of seeing it work, and not work, over an extended time with a good coach. I've since seen it with other coaches who turned out to also be good ones. It's like night and day sometimes.

[Liverpooldawg]

And go read again...I never said MAKE them lead. You quite obviously can't read.

You didn't, but then again you did. You can't just push the right buttons and have a leader magically appear. If you could then every team and organization would have great leadership. There wouldn't be thousands of books and millions of dollars spent on the latest "leadership" training every other year or so. It has to come from within.

[CarolinaDawgs]

Bama doesn't lose a game if they play Coker from Day 1. So obvious it hurts.

[I seen it dawg]

You didn't, but then again you did. You can't just push the right buttons and have a leader magically appear. If you could then every team and organization would have great leadership. There wouldn't be thousands of books and millions of dollars spent on the latest "leadership" training every other year or so. It has to come from within.

Well who the **** you think does that "training"?

[I seen it dawg]

A coach can set the stage, but as has been pointed out by others besides me you can't MAKE someone lead. Coaches can do thier kind of leading all day long, and do it well, but if you don't have the other kind it doesn't work nearly as well, if at all. I had the luxury of seeing it work, and not work, over an extended time with a good coach. I've since seen it with other coaches who turned out to also be good ones. It's like night and day sometimes.
You don't dig deep enough into it. It's more complicated than you can understand so I'll let it go.

[CarolinaDawgs]

Dan goes with Fitz form day 1 and trusts him we win by 30, hell I think we win by 20 if he does with Dam from the start. Indecision ripples through a program a lot further than you think. Leaders are confident and sure of themselves and its contagious AKA (DaGOATa Prescott).. I believe that Dan's indecision was worse for us then making the wrong one. The road to success is paved with squirrels that couldn't make a decision.. Dan was a squirrel this offseason.

[CarolinaDawgs]

Dan goes with Fitz form day 1 and trusts him we win by 30, hell I think we win by 20 if he does with Dam from the start. Indecision ripples through a program a lot further than you think. Leaders are confident and sure of themselves and its contagious AKA (DaGOATa Prescott).. I believe that Dan's indecision was worse for us then making the wrong one. The road to success is paved with squirrels that couldn't make a decision.. Dan was a squirrel this offseason.

And the sad part about this is I don't think that Fitz or Dam has to be "THE GUY" it was just an unnecessary distraction that takes away from all guys that can be "THE GUY"...

[BrunswickDawg]

A coach can set the stage, but as has been pointed out by others besides me you can't MAKE someone lead. Coaches can do thier kind of leading all day long, and do it well, but if you don't have the other kind it doesn't work nearly as well, if at all. I had the luxury of seeing it work, and not work, over an extended time with a good coach. I've since seen it with other coaches who turned out to also be good ones. It's like night and day sometimes.

This may be too long of a post - but I'll give a personal experience on how coaches can "make" leaders. My Freshman year of HS, our baseball coach kept a group of us on the Varsity roster during the early part of the season prior to JV games starting. About 10 games. After losing our first 3 games through some pretty crap play by SR's, he yanks the starting line up mid game and puts all of us Freshmen in. We rally from 6 runs down with 2 to play and fall 1 run short of taking the game extras. On the bus ride back, coach blasts the SR's and said if they didn't step up they were all cut and he wouldn't field a JV team because "the Freshman give a **** and ya'll don't. The SRs won the next 5 and we got sent down to JV.

Our SR rolls around, and we have the best player in the region - our SS - who hit .600 as a Junior, and was 7-1 on the mound in the toughest region in GA. The week baseball practice starts in January, he decides to early enroll at UGA and begin his college football career. One of the first kids I know of to have done that (this was 1991). The team is in a funk for 3 weeks leading into our games. No one was stepping up to fill that leadership void. Before the first game, the coach came to me and said, "this is your team. I'm moving you from 2B to SS because I need you to lead with your game knowledge and show the young guys. You are in charge on field." I am not a vocal guy, not a ra ra type, not the first one into the fray. But coach sat me down and told me what was needed, that I could do it even if it was something I had never done before, and that he had my back. That totally changed my approach to the game, my confidence level, and how the guys on the team looked at me and listened to me. Coach placed me in that role and gave me the tools I needed to be successful, and it led us to 1 game shy of the state playoffs and our best record in years. Don't tell me that coaches can't "make" leaders. They do it all the time.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

This may be too long of a post - but I'll give a personal experience on how coaches can "make" leaders. My Freshman year of HS, our baseball coach kept a group of us on the Varsity roster during the early part of the season prior to JV games starting. About 10 games. After losing our first 3 games through some pretty crap play by SR's, he yanks the starting line up mid game and puts all of us Freshmen in. We rally from 6 runs down with 2 to play and fall 1 run short of taking the game extras. On the bus ride back, coach blasts the SR's and said if they didn't step up they were all cut and he wouldn't field a JV team because "the Freshman give a **** and ya'll don't. The SRs won the next 5 and we got sent down to JV.

Our SR rolls around, and we have the best player in the region - our SS - who hit .600 as a Junior, and was 7-1 on the mound in the toughest region in GA. The week baseball practice starts in January, he decides to early enroll at UGA and begin his college football career. One of the first kids I know of to have done that (this was 1991). The team is in a funk for 3 weeks leading into our games. No one was stepping up to fill that leadership void. Before the first game, the coach came to me and said, "this is your team. I'm moving you from 2B to SS because I need you to lead with your game knowledge and show the young guys. You are in charge on field." I am not a vocal guy, not a ra ra type, not the first one into the fray. But coach sat me down and told me what was needed, that I could do it even if it was something I had never done before, and that he had my back. That totally changed my approach to the game, my confidence level, and how the guys on the team looked at me and listened to me. Coach placed me in that role and gave me the tools I needed to be successful, and it led us to 1 game shy of the state playoffs and our best record in years. Don't tell me that coaches can't "make" leaders. They do it all the time.

+100...Damn, you're on fire today!

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Just take a look at what happened in the game last night. FSU played like absolute crap the first half and then in the second half they were a completely different team. You think that just happened? That players were sitting around singing kumbaya and just said hey guys I'm ready to be a leader now? No Jimbo busted some heads in that locker room and challenged their man hood! That's how a coach brings out the leader! Some of y'all are bound and determined not to blame the coaches and I can't figure out why. Y'all wanna blame the crowd, the heat, or whatever else y'all can do to deflect blame from the coaches. You don't have to say you want him fired but surely y'all have enough sense to realize that excuse for a performance Saturday falls squarely on Danny boys shoulders.

And Winston called out the O-Line here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e_mBsooeVw