If you want sunshine, don't open this thread....

[HancockCountyDog]

I was one of the posters that thought this team could win 9 games, maybe 8 after we lost our starting corners, but I looked past warning signs I was hearing from buddies that had gone to scrimmages. Dan had earned that trust through the years. I trusted that his recruiting of two star players (Don't give me that 3 star bullshit, we have beaten out USM, ULL and ULM for guys, that is a two star player, I don't give a rat's ass that Paul or Steve get them bumped to a 3 star because we are one of the larger subscriptions) would keep panning out, that we would keep signing McKinney's and Preston Smiths.

I read a thread below that this loss was coming. It talked about six games throughout Mullen's tenure that we have squeaked out victories over terrible ****ing teams and our luck was due to run out. Holy hell. So not only can Dan not beat a team he isn't supposed to, he has been lucky to beat Bowling Green and other bullsh!t non power 5 teams. What is the damn point then.

I didn't want to believe it, but today was confirmation that CDM has been a ****ing house of mirrors. This was posted on an OM site, and holy ****ing hell:

https://s3media.247sports.com/Uploads/Assets/421/76/4076421.jpg

Mullen hasn't really elevated our program, he has benefited from us scheduling 4 powder puff OOC opponents, and beating awful train wreck SEC programs.

Also, here is what is really concerning, with all the focus on the bears pending probation, we have ignored the probation that we have self imposed. Guys, we have 78 players on scholarship and that includes kickers. Im not counting the walk ons that were given scholarships, Im talking kids that we signed on signing day and beyond.

We might want to focus more of our energy on our program, because simply cheering for the NCAA and giving Mullen a pass on recruiting causes us to have a situation like today.

Speaking of today, we were not the better team on the field. Period. We couldn't cover their WR/TE all game. If they had just abandoned the run and kept passing, they would have thrown for 500 yards today. That is not an exaggeration, that is the truth. All this talk about how talented we are is just that, talk. Hell, they missed two FG's today. We we were lucky to be in a position to even have a chance to win. A part of me is glad we lost because a cheap win over a terrible USA team would have been just putting a band aid over a gun shot wound.

How many players on our defense did we beat out an SEC power for? Leo Lewis and Gerri Green? AJ is a solid DL, but is usually just good enough to beat OL on untalented teams like South Alabama. In year 8 we should have some talent on defense. Our corners were Durr, Rayford, Smokey and freshman none of whom had power SEC offers. They were judgment calls by our staff. Im watching Kentucky carve up the same type of defensive talent at USM. At this point, every game is going to be battle except Bama.

As for the offense, the OL couldn't create holes against a USA second team DL. Please read that sentence again. Three seniors and two RS Sophomores could not open up holes for our Senior RB's. I also don't want to hear any complaints about Holloway, he was one of the only weapons we have on the damn team. Also, for everyone saying that our WR's are good, I would assume that is based off practice where they are going up against our secondary. I bet they do look good in practice. I bet the intramural team for the Pike house could look good against our secondary.

Finally, this is not about scheme, this is 100% talent. We are not a talented team. Ross is the only player on our team that might get drafted next year. We play in the god damn SEC and we will have one WR drafted next year? Of course we are losing games to South Alabama. A lot of our recruits we have signed, we beat out South Alabama for.

If we think the NCAA is going to save us by pounding the bears into the ground, we have our collective heads up our ass and we deserve to get our asses kicked by South Alabama. The NCAA isn't going to save us. We need to save ourselves, because the bears are just one damn game. Our schedule this year set up perfectly. Now, it will be a scrum for 6 wins. Thankfully for us, the SEC west sucks this year except for Bama. Honestly i either want us to circle the wagons and go win 7-8 games, or crash and burn and win 3. That way a change will be made.

I spent my entire day traveling to Starkville, going to the game and driving home. I haven't decided if I will do it again next weekend and that is a big problem, because I'd say about 15-20K people weren't in the stadium past half time that could have been. There were maybe 40K in the stadium when we missed the FG. Maybe.

Also, Mullen didn't care that he lost that game. He 100% didn't care. He figured, Im getting paid 4 million plus, so who the hell cares. He knows that we will have to cut him a 10+ million check if we want to fire him, so he probably feels just fine. He hasn't cared about a loss since the 2014 egg bowl. I really think he wanted to leave last year, and now he knows he is stuck. Now he is just playing out the string.

Screw it, Im going to watch Clemson kill Auburn.

[civildawg]

Yep. I've been one of mullen's biggest critics over the years but I recognize what he has done for us. With that said, it's just time to move on. I really hope that happens before he destroys what he has built up

[Tbonewannabe]

The biggest thing besides him looking like he is just here to get a check to me is playing not to lose against great teams like Bama. We always play hoping for 5 turnovers like UNM got against Bama to get the win. We very rarely play to win.

[GreenheadDawg]

I really don't think another thread needs to be made. This needs to be made a sticky. That's about the biggest dose of truth you can get. Well done

[lastmajordog]

Hate to tell you but the auburn team I’m watching will drive us into the gulf......

[Todd4State]

One of the best posts I have seen on here.

I agree 100% with everything you said. The NCAA will help us with Ole Miss. But you are spot on that we have to take care of ourselves as well. Ole Miss will come off of probation at some point inevitably. If we keep Dan would he have recruited better? Based on the recruiting results it's highly unlikely. Once Ole Miss comes off of probation they will cheat again and really won't stop cheating.

We need a coach that can recruit AND develop talent.

[GTHOM]

Im not pumping sunshine but we have talent on this team. No one can deny that. I had heard some bad things as well, from people I coach with as well as an NFL scout that went to one of the early fall camp practices. I decided to ignore it and give us the benefit of the doubt like you said. I think the team has a major disconnect with Mullen. It is time for him to go. Its been time. He doesnt wanna be here and we deserve better. We can win, we have won. It was a rough day but it doesnt mean we are going back to 2003-2008 either. Dan has to beat USCe and he knows it, sad thing is he doesnt care

[Liverpooldawg]

Yep....going with the Ole Miss line on us is what is in our best interest. They only have our best interests at heart, as we all know. I think we need to take their advice on everything they say about our program. COME ON GUYS. They have been shopping Mullen for every job since he got here when he is doing well, or when he isn't. THAT is one of the main reasons we may need to hold on to the man. THEY know what is best for us............even when we don't.

[GTHOM]

Yep....going with the Ole Miss line on us is what is in our best interest. They only have our best interests at heart, as we all know. I think we need to take their advice on everything they say about our program. COME ON GUYS. They have been shopping Mullen for every job since he got here when he is doing well, or when he isn't. THAT is one of the main reasons we may need to hold on to the man. THEY know what is best for us............even when we don't.

Are you defending Dan Mullen after a piss poor pathetic absolute disgrace of a game and LOSS VS SOUTH ALABAMA. I'm just wondering

[SailingDawg]

Riddle me this: when has MSU had a better seven year run?

[Dawgface]

We might want to focus more of our energy on our program, because simply cheering for the NCAA and giving Mullen a pass on recruiting causes us to have a situation like today.

I see comments like this from time to time. But how does our(fans) focus on the OM situation affect the recruiting our paid coaching staff are doing?

[IMissJack]

I don't think we have a coaching staff that will ever recruit MS the way it needs to for us to be successful long term. Mullen and Hev are from up north and will never be able to connect with coaches and mamas the way.they have to in MS apparently. Add in the fact we can't keep a DC for more than 2 years and it spells recruiting trouble. Isn't Sirmon from Cali? How's that gonna play? Buckley is the only one I have confidence in to recruit. The way we have been going after jucos lately, it makes me think they have missed a lot on what they did get.

[ShotgunDawg]

Riddle me this: when has MSU had a better seven year run?

That's the Ron Polk argument & it's ridiculous. You pay people for what THEY WILL DO, NOT WHAT THEY HAVE ALREADY DONE

Dan admitted to MSU in the off season that he didn't think he could win at MSU. Why else would a guy that's going to get paid 5 mil per year look for another job?

After he struck out on leaving MSU, he decided to hire a bunch of recruiting dudes to help close the gap, but, I REPEAT, WE HAVE A COACH THAT DOES NOT THINK HE CAN WIN HERE.

If you owned a company & had a CEO that didn't believe in the product or have the belief that the company could become great, why would you want that guy as your CEO?

I seriously want some opinions on this. Why do we want a guy as the CEO of our company that doesn't believe our company can become great?

Dan told us this

[lastmajordog]

Riddle me this: when has MSU had a better seven year run?

Riddle me this, when has the auburn, arkansas, and LSU been this venerable and the SEC paid so much money MSU can pay a coach F O U R million smackers a year???

[Todd4State]

Riddle me this: when has MSU had a better seven year run?

Everyone has their time to go. Even Saban. You can't rely solely on history. You have to look at trends and warning signs. Signs like not caring, team coming out consistently flat, etc.

[Goldendawg]

I owe Tn, SC, and even Vandy an apology after what my son and I sat through and saw today. I agree completely with the opening post. Most on this board worried about OL, QB, and DB's and they were right. Page 4 of the program I bought for my son made me face the state of denial I have been in. Williams, a late flip from Southern Ms, Fitzgerald, offers from us and Middle Tn, and Tiano offers from us, Miami, and Chatanooga, and Staley couldn't beat them out. This story line also is the same for other positions on our team. I saw Tech and 10. I way see UMass/Samford and 10 this year.

[Todd4State]

That's the Ron Polk argument & it's ridiculous. You pay people for what THEY WILL DO, NOT WHAT THEY HAVE ALREADY DONE

Dan admitted to MSU in the off season that he didn't think he could win at MSU. Why else would a guy that's going to get paid 5 mil per year look for another job?

After he struck out on leaving MSU, he decided to hire a bunch of recruiting dudes to help close the gap, but, I REPEAT, WE HAVE A COACH THAT DOES NOT THINK HE CAN WIN HERE.

If you owned a company & had a CEO that didn't believe in the product or have the belief that the company could become great, why would you want that guy as your CEO?

I seriously want some opinions on this. Why do we want a guy as the CEO of our company that doesn't believe our company can become great?

Dan told us this

You don't want that guy.

[Liverpooldawg]

Are you defending Dan Mullen after a piss poor pathetic absolute disgrace of a game and LOSS VS SOUTH ALABAMA. I'm just wondering

Actually no. But if the Rebs think we need to fire him......................we all know they are all for what is best for us. THEY have been consistent on how they want him gone from MSU since he got here. Just saying.

[HancockCountyDog]

Name the last head coach that was handed a team with more NFL talent either on the roster or committed to MSU when they took the job?

Ill hang up and listen.

[HancockCountyDog]

Actually no. But if the Rebs think we need to fire him......................we all know they are all for what is best for us. THEY have been consistent on how they want him gone from MSU since he got here. Just saying.

Every bear fan I know don't want us to fire him. Freeze owns him on the field. He can't even dominate in state recruiting while the Bears are on probation.

[Liverpooldawg]

Everyone has their time to go. Even Saban. You can't rely solely on history. You have to look at trends and warning signs. Signs like not caring, team coming out consistently flat, etc.

Saban..............in College football his time will NEVER come. I doubt it would have in the NFL............except under the Miami regime at that time. You look at RESULTS.

[Liverpooldawg]

Every bear fan I know don't want us to fire him. Freeze owns him on the field. He can't even dominate in state recruiting while the Bears are on probation.

Every bear fan I know has been trying to shop him for every open job since he got here. By the way.....the Bears aren't on probation. Perhaps you aren't up on college football.

[HancockCountyDog]

Every bear fan I know has been trying to shop him for every open job since he got here. By the way.....the Bears aren't on probation. Perhaps you aren't up on college football.

Are you clueless. Being under the cloud of NCAA investigation is actually as bad or at times worse than the actual probation.

[Liverpooldawg]

Name the last head coach that was handed a team with more NFL talent either on the roster or committed to MSU when they took the job?

Ill hang up and listen.

REALLY? Are you serious? We have had more than our normal since Mullen has been here.......but it ain't that much compared to the usual suspects. You sound like those UM idiots.

[DudyDawg]

Yep....going with the Ole Miss line on us is what is in our best interest. They only have our best interests at heart, as we all know. I think we need to take their advice on everything they say about our program. COME ON GUYS. They have been shopping Mullen for every job since he got here when he is doing well, or when he isn't. THAT is one of the main reasons we may need to hold on to the man. THEY know what is best for us............even when we don't.

Just bc our history is shit doesn't mean our future has to be. He's the best we've ever had probably, and that isn't terribly impressive to be truthful. Let's progress. We pay for better

[DudyDawg]

Saban..............in College football his time will NEVER come. I doubt it would have in the NFL............except under the Miami regime at that time. You look at RESULTS.

Look at today's result

[Liverpooldawg]

Are you clueless. Being under the cloud of NCAA investigation is actually as bad or at times worse than the actual probation.

My second team...USC, says hello. There has BEEN no cloud for UM except on OUR boards until Tunsil spilled his guts on draft night. Even after that only MSU people are really up on it. They have had no cloud to work under.

[Liverpooldawg]

Look at today's result

One game. If it continues.....then sure. Saban's results if you took one game would have fired him. CROOM beat him.

[dawgday166]

I wanted Sunshine!! **** Your facts are good tho. I was kinda aware of a lot of those.

[Liverpooldawg]

Just bc our history is shit doesn't mean our future has to be. He's the best we've ever had probably, and that isn't terribly impressive to be truthful. Let's progress. We pay for better
EXACTLY......... but your argument is EXACTLY what fired Allyn McKeen. It took 70 years to approach that again............and we still haven't equaled it.

[HancockCountyDog]

REALLY? Are you serious? We have had a more than our normal since Mullen has been here.......but it ain't that much compared to the usual suspects. You sound like those UM idiots.

Go look at our roster when Mullen took over. The 2010 team was all Croom commits or signees. The defense had like 8 NFL players on it. How many NFL players did Jackie inherit? How many did Croom?

Just answer the damn question.

[DudyDawg]

EXACTLY......... but your argument is EXACTLY what fired Allyn McKeen. It took 70 years to approach that again............and we still haven't equaled it.

Do you really think the circumstances are even close to the same? Seriously

[DudyDawg]

One game. If it continues.....then sure. Saban's results if you took one game would have fired him. CROOM beat him.
Never compared mullen to the ****ing best college football coach in history. Great argument.

[GreenheadDawg]

Just bc our history is shit doesn't mean our future has to be. He's the best we've ever had probably, and that isn't terribly impressive to be truthful. Let's progress. We pay for better

Why should we want better? We are just MS state. I remember when milk was a nickel and we only one 2 games. Life is good. Our best days are to come my friend ** this is the way half of our fanbase thinks. Instead of really sucking we just suck. That's progress.

[cheewgumm]

Wait, I thought our strategy was always to schedule crappy teams and win 8 every year and slowly build our program.

[Maroonthirteen]

I'll deny the claim of talent. As a matter of fact, this team is void of talent at key positions.

Mulllen's string of luck, developing 2 stars, has run out.

[Todd4State]

Saban..............in College football his time will NEVER come. I doubt it would have in the NFL............except under the Miami regime at that time. You look at RESULTS.

That's what some of our fans said about Polk too. People get old and lose touch. It happens to all of us.

[Todd4State]

EXACTLY......... but your argument is EXACTLY what fired Allyn McKeen. It took 70 years to approach that again............and we still haven't equaled it.

I'm not sure why you are hung up on Allyn McKeen. If you actually look at MSU's history our problem historically has been holding on to coaches too long. Since we hired Bob Tyler EVERY coach we have had other than Felker has gone to at least one bowl game. Even Croom. Every coach we have had starting with Paul Davis has had at least one winning season.

Your claim about McKeen and our program has zero historical merit.

[HancockCountyDog]

When the only lineman on your roster that may get drafted is a true freshman that didn't play today, you have no damn talent.

[msstate7]

When the only lineman on your roster that may get drafted is a true freshman that didn't play today, you have no damn talent.

Eiland or Reese?

[HancockCountyDog]

Eiland or Reese?

Lol. We don't have an OL that will get drafted on the roster.

Simmons

[Dawg-gone-dawgs]

Riddle me this: when has MSU had a better seven year run?

Did you even read his post? He said Mullen has benefited from beating OOC cupcakes. Is that good enough for you? Just to beat teams your suppose to, go to a bowl and every once in awhile catch lightning in a bottle and have a year like when we went to number 1? Even in that season, we ended on a terrible note.

[TrapGame]

Excellent post.

Losing to USA set this program back 7 years. Everything Mullen has been feeding us about relentless and finishing and executing is now worthless bullshit. Graves is on Facebook blaming himself for the loss and asking for forgiveness when the arrogant asshole head coach gives a post game presser without claiming one iota of responsibility. That's bullshit. To quote ISeenIt - F*** that guy!

[msstate7]

Lol. We don't have an OL that will get drafted on the roster.

Simmons

Misunderstood you... Thought you meant we had a stud freshman olineman

[dawgday166]

Excellent post.

Losing to USA set this program back 7 years. Everything Mullen has been feeding us about relentless and finishing and executing is now worthless bullshit. Graves is on Facebook blaming himself for the loss and asking for forgiveness when the arrogant asshole head coach gives a post game presser without claiming one iota of responsibility. That's bullshit. To quote ISeenIt - F*** that guy!

This is my problem with Mullen. Never his or the O-lines fault.

[Goldendawg]

Have we ever had a OLineman drafted by the NFL that was recruited on Mullen's watch?

[DogsofAnarchy]

Not in shape. They do not tackle well. I'm not much on whoever is working these guys out. They don't look the part and they show it in their tackling. Now for Dan, shorts? Give me a damn break. Marathon runner or football coach, it has run its course.






QUOTE=civildawg;602469]Yep. I've been one of mullen's biggest critics over the years but I recognize what he has done for us. With that said, it's just time to move on. I really hope that happens before he destroys what he has built up[/QUOTE]

[War Machine Dawg]

Have we ever had a OLineman drafted by the NFL that was recruited on Mullen's watch?

No. The last OL drafted was a Croom recruit - Jackson. Clayborn SHOULD have been a draft pick, but we've completely mismanaged his career. He's a Senior with Junior experience.

[GTHOM]

Actually no. But if the Rebs think we need to fire him......................we all know they are all for what is best for us. THEY have been consistent on how they want him gone from MSU since he got here. Just saying.

We think we need to fire him

[GTHOM]

One game. If it continues.....then sure. Saban's results if you took one game would have fired him. CROOM beat him.

Jesus dude CROOM didnt beat Saban in Sabans 8TH year

[Todd4State]

Jesus dude CROOM didnt beat Saban in Sabans 8TH year

Even then it took a miracle 100 yard pick six on our part to pull it off.

[BayouDawg]

I started easing off the Mullen train after the 2012 egg bowl loss. We were totally unprepared, no motivation and he got up at the post game presser and acted like he was too good to have to answer questions about why he let a beaver coach circles around him. Then in the opener in 2013 against OSU we looked like we hadn't even watched film. Our offensive guru put up a whopping 3 points on a Big 12 minus 2 defense. Then in '14 we had a great year and I thought maybe somebody had lit a fire under Dan's ass. He then proceeds to whore himself out to other schools letting Hevesy and Townsend completely neglect recruiting. But nobody wants to hire him because he's an arrogant ass that thinks he invented football. We're stuck with him and he's stuck with us. The administration won't have the balls to fire him for atleast 2 more years. We needed Miami or Maryland to hire him away badly, but we're stuck together now for better or for worse. It could get real ugly boys

[TimberBeast]

As for the offense, the OL couldn't create holes against a USA second team DL. Please read that sentence again. Three seniors and two RS Sophomores could not open up holes for our Senior RB's. I also don't want to hear any complaints about Holloway, he was one of the only weapons we have on the damn team.

This shit has got to stop. Some of us here have been preaching this for a few years now. We have decent to good talent on the team, the offensive line has some problems, but it is not THE problem. Everything Holloway did was through the air, but he is our starting running back. THAT is the problem. Our idiot "coach" pulled our starting QB after 2 series, in the first game of the season, and put in a garbage QB that wouldn't be on another D1 roster, and went with him the rest of the game, even though it was completely demoralizing the entire team. He's stubborn, he is a terrible game manager, and has no idea how to put the best players on the field. This shit didn't start today. We all saw also that he doesn't care. I would put him out the door today after what I saw, and go with an interim coach.

[msbulldog]

Time for a game plan. If we lose to USCe, fire him Monday. Name Sirmon interim HC, name Baker DC and name our QB coach OC.
I hate firing coaches, but the arguments in this thread have swayed me. The realization that if this season plays out like I think it will after we lose the first 2 to cupcakes has also swayed me. Surely if we have a S**T season like this one is shaping up as CDM will not get an extension, and we don't need to be sitting there with a lame duck coach. If we move quick enough we may be able keep the commitments that we have with the existing personnel still in place. If we move quick enough, maybe a fire can be lit under this years team. Maybe we will turn the defense loose to play aggressive defense, instead of bend don't break. Maybe we can start playing the best players instead of the oldest.
Much as I hate it, it's time now before we lose to much recruiting wise.

[msbulldog]

Thoughts on my last post, we will probably lose K Thompson, our really good QB commitment. He seems pretty sold on CDM's QB development talent. Maybe we can convince him Brian Johnson can do the same thing.

[SailingDawg]

Did you even read his post? He said Mullen has benefited from beating OOC cupcakes. Is that good enough for you? Just to beat teams your suppose to, go to a bowl and every once in awhile catch lightning in a bottle and have a year like when we went to number 1? Even in that season, we ended on a terrible note.

It's as good as we're going to get. I've posted this same comment in three different threads.

Why can't we improve?

Athletic Budget half or third of top tier teams
Stadium just improved to hold 63k when top tier teams already host 100k
No history. We win a few, get excited, go to an average bowl a few years straight then the coach goes 3-8 and we dump him.
Starkville...I love it but it's not Athens or Gainesville or Tuscaloosa or Baton Rouge (whose school enrollments are double or triple MSU and UNM)

Ol ms is in the same boat they just won't admit it. When you accept who we are you can enjoy the games and support whoever is willing to come to Starkvegas.

[Tbonewannabe]

It's as good as we're going to get. I've posted this same comment in three different threads.

Why can't we improve?

Athletic Budget half or third of top tier teams
Stadium just improved to hold 63k when top tier teams already host 100k
No history. We win a few, get excited, go to an average bowl a few years straight then the coach goes 3-8 and we dump him.
Starkville...I love it but it's not Athens or Gainesville or Tuscaloosa or Baton Rouge (whose school enrollments are double or triple MSU and UNM)

Ol ms is in the same boat they just won't admit it. When you accept who we are you can enjoy the games and support whoever is willing to come to Starkvegas.

We are still in the SEC. We should be able to get SEC talent.

[GTHOM]

It's as good as we're going to get. I've posted this same comment in three different threads.

Why can't we improve?

Athletic Budget half or third of top tier teams
Stadium just improved to hold 63k when top tier teams already host 100k
No history. We win a few, get excited, go to an average bowl a few years straight then the coach goes 3-8 and we dump him.
Starkville...I love it but it's not Athens or Gainesville or Tuscaloosa or Baton Rouge (whose school enrollments are double or triple MSU and UNM)

Ol ms is in the same boat they just won't admit it. When you accept who we are you can enjoy the games and support whoever is willing to come to Starkvegas.

This is why we are where we are congrats. Love the attitude too. Po ol MSU we wont never win nuffin

[Maroonthirteen]

We are still in the SEC. We should be able to get SEC talent.

Yeah, we should but we don't and won't until another coach willing to play the game comes in. Then OM will jerk our drawers down in front of everyone,, NCAA spanks our ass and the cycle repeats.

I'm sorry but being the sec only means so much. It is obvious conference affiliation only goes so far. We aren't beating Clemson or any top ACC school or Big10 or Big 12 or Louisville or Houston etc etc. So where are we in the order of desirable destinations for players? 30 or 40?

As our QBs had offers from where??? Mtsu and USM?

Our starting RB? I don't recall. Our secondary?

MSU needs to take that sec cash and REALLY make changes. Like open a satellite campus in the burbs of Jackson. Then slowly move the main campus over a period of time

All this sounds crazy to some but I've been watching sec football since the late 70s....same teams win, same teams are middle to bottom of pack. Changing one man on campus may help beat the S.Bamas but not Alabama's.

[Maroonthirteen]

Oh and I'll add another thing that is a huge detriment to MSU. The fan base..... I have never seen s group of "fans" with so many damn excuses for not going to games. What a lame atmosphere that place is sometimes.

Also, the school gets very little support and positive energy from the fans in the community. I know one State fan in my neighborhood...they guy never talks State unless it is some BS ...like someone being arrested etc etc.

[SailingDawg]

This is why we are where we are congrats. Love the attitude too. Po ol MSU we wont never win nuffin

Nah, it's just reality. Read my summation again about budgets, stadium size, history, host town size...