Ok, who was injured?

[ShotgunDawg]

Apparently, we had a significant injury earlier this week. We are due for one every year. Every team is

Anybody heard who?

[lamont]

We lost 2 starters in the Secondary for the season

A weak group just got worse

[ShotgunDawg]

We lost 2 starters in the Secondary for the season

A weak group just got worse

You've got to be kidding me. Two years in a row with Redmond & now this.

Why does this continue to happen?

[confucius say]

We lost 2 starters in the Secondary for the season

A weak group just got worse

Does one of their names rhyme with grandon gryant?

[ShotgunDawg]

Bryant played in the scrimmage last night, so it wasn't him. Probably one of the other safeties & a corner

[Tripp McNeely]

Well, no use crying over the breast milk. Bring on the young pups: Durr, Graham, Morgan, Peters, Rayford, Smitherman and Stamps.

Our schedule does help us out a TON in this case though. The best 2 passing attacks that we face are A&M and tsun, and they are LATE in the year!

[confucius say]

Bryant played in the scrimmage last night, so it wasn't him. Probably one of the other safeties & a corner

Got ya.

[ShotgunDawg]

Got ya.

Maybe one of the names rhymes with Tivon Bowman

[msbulldog]

Dammit, sure would like to know who. I guess Dan will announce it Monday.

[confucius say]

Maybe one of the names rhymes with Tivon Bowman

Jiles has some things on his Twitter about sadness, overcoming difficult times, etc. Could mean smn

[ShotgunDawg]

Jiles has some things on his Twitter about sadness, overcoming difficult times, etc. Could mean smn

Wow, if true, I feel terrible for him. He has done everything that's ever been asked of him & his body just won't cooperate. Terrible if true

[EngDawg]

I heard the entire team has Zika, Ebola, Swine Flu, and torn ACLs*****

[JoseBrown]

Maybe one of the names rhymes with Tivon Bowman

If that's one, we can overcome that one, really hope the other one is not Jiles. Did Peters play?

[Bothrops]

Did they pull a tarp over DWS so no one could see anything?

[msbulldog]

Hope its not Cedric, he deserves a full season.

[maroonwhitedawg3ddd]

Did they pull a tarp over DWS so no one could see anything?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/content/dam/science/2016/03/12/area51_1768301a-large_trans++qVzuuqpFlyLIwiB6NTmJwZwVSIA7rSIkPn18j gFKEo0.jpg

[Dallas_Dawg]

Just spill it, damn. No matter what, they aren't going to magically get better

[msstate7]

What else happened at the scrimmage? How'd we look?

[ShotgunDawg]

Just spill it, damn. No matter what, they aren't going to magically get better

I think RP has given plenty of info for everyone to digest what's going on. It's most likely 2 of the following: Jiles, Coman, Cleveland. It sucks, but the positive is that it also means some younger guys that may have more talent: Peters, Smitherman, Graham, Dantzler, Durr, Stamps, & McLaurin will gets more chances. It's definitely going to cause some growing pains, but it could also turn out well since we don't face the best passing teams like Ole Miss & A&M till late in the season.

[JoseBrown]

I think RP has given plenty of info for everyone to digest what's going on. It's most likely 2 of the following: Jiles, Coman, Cleveland. It sucks, but the positive is that it also means some younger guys that may have more talent: Peters, Smitherman, Graham, Dantzler, Durr, Stamps, & McLaurin will gets more chances. It's definitely going to cause some growing pains, but it could also turn out well since we don't face the best passing teams like Ole Miss & A&M till late in the season.

That appears correct. Definitely not Bryant...or Smokey.. Wish I could say the same for Jiles.. Idk.

[HSVDawg]

This just pisses me off more about Mullen's recruiting (not signing full classes the past two years). Because injuries do happen. We opened camp with only 79 true scholarship players. With the Staley transfer and two guys done for the year, we are now at 76 able bodies and the first game isn't even here yet. Developmental programs like ours don't need to be in this situation where guys who may not be ready have to see the field early due to lack of depth.

[Reason2succeed]

This just pisses me off more about Mullen's recruiting (not signing full classes the past two years). Because injuries do happen. We opened camp with only 79 true scholarship players. With the Staley transfer and two guys done for the year, we are now at 76 able bodies and the first game isn't even here yet. Developmental programs like ours don't need to be in this situation where guys who may not be ready have to see the field early due to lack of depth.

Are you saying we should have just signed anybody just so that the have 85 players on scholarship? Surely you're not saying that we had other more qualified prospects that we did not allow to come in. Come on. This is silly.

[HancockCountyDog]

Are you saying we should have just signed anybody just so that the have 85 players on scholarship? Surely you're not saying that we had other more qualified prospects that we did not allow to come in. Come on. This is silly.

I think what he is saying is that our recruiting shouldn't be so poor that we can't sign a full class, and end up putting our team on self imposed probation.

[Todd4State]

Are you saying we should have just signed anybody just so that the have 85 players on scholarship? Surely you're not saying that we had other more qualified prospects that we did not allow to come in. Come on. This is silly.

Taking a marginal prospect is better than not taking one at all. You have to have bodies. You can process them out later if necessary.

[HSVDawg]

Are you saying we should have just signed anybody just so that the have 85 players on scholarship? Surely you're not saying that we had other more qualified prospects that we did not allow to come in. Come on. This is silly.

No, I'm saying our "big board" didn't have enough names on it and we did a terrible job of closing of the names that were on it. Especially in the most recent class. That should be obvious to everyone. It speaks to inefficient / lazy recruiting. No SEC program that's not on NCAA mandated scholarship reductions should ever open fall camp with 79 scholarship players. And, +1 to what Todd and Hancock said as well.

[t45fixer]

Tolando Cleveland. He tore his acl I believe.

[msstate7]

Good thing the season starts in 2 weeks. If it were 3-4 weeks, our fanbase may have Mullen fired

[ShotgunDawg]

No, I'm saying our "big board" didn't have enough names on it and we did a terrible job of closing of the names that were on it. Especially in the most recent class. That should be obvious to everyone. It speaks to inefficient / lazy recruiting. No SEC program that's not on NCAA mandated scholarship reductions should ever open fall camp with 79 scholarship players. And, +1 to what Todd and Hancock said as well.

I agree with this. At the same time, I think this is being addressed. Expanding our board may be the single greatest improvement that happens with the additional recruiting staff hires that we've made. If you think about it, expanding your "board" consists of man hours. There is time involved in gathering information, tapes, & someone that is competent about football, filtering through those tapes to narrow down the candidates that the position coaches & Mullen need to watch in order to make an offer.

When you have 10 coaches doing this job, there is only so many man hours they can allocate to this process while also balancing actually having to coach the team & all the man hours that consists of. So, when you add 5 or 6 competent football coaches in the office that can pitch in on this process, all the sudden, the coaches are watching more & better players, which leads to more SEC caliber players on your board.

These staff hires will help less with top rated prospects & more with pulling a 4 star caliber talent out of Minnesota or JUCO somewhere

[maroonwhitedawg3ddd]

It's really sad players have to get injured for us to put the most talented player on the field. Damn Mullen! I'm ready for Football!

[msstate7]

So is it jiles and Cleveland? If so, does smitherman or Cj M-W move full time CB?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Smitherman is back at CB

[confucius say]

Taking a marginal prospect is better than not taking one at all. You have to have bodies. You can process them out later if necessary.

If that's your strategy (6 this year alone) would not it kill your apr?

[Tripp McNeely]

Sounds like it might force the hands of the coaches to play younger, more talented players earlier than they normally would have. Hopefully, we can get them coached up and comfortable before we play a good QB

[djaymsu5]

Tolando Cleveland. He tore his acl I believe.

Who's the other one

[Reason2succeed]

Taking a marginal prospect is better than not taking one at all. You have to have bodies. You can process them out later if necessary.

Process them out? Let's call that what it is: dropping a guy off of his scholarship. These players are people. I'd rather a guy get to go and play at Jackson State for four years, have a great college experience, and graduate with his teammates and friends than to allow him to come to State practice, sit on the bench, and get "processed out" when we want to bring in someone else.

[HoopsDawg]

So is it jiles and Cleveland? If so, does smitherman or Cj M-W move full time CB?

Damn, did we really just lose our 2 starting corners?

[ShotgunDawg]

Process them out? Let's call that what it is: dropping a guy off of his scholarship. These players are people. I'd rather a guy get to go and play at Jackson State for four years, have a great college experience, and graduate with his teammates and friends than to allow him to come to State practice, sit on the bench, and get "processed out" when we want to bring in someone else.

It's not about what you want, it's about what the kid wants. What if that kid has dreamed of playing in the SEC? You are denying him that opportunity. He can always transfer to Jackson State and not sit out.

[ShotgunDawg]

Damn, did we really just lose our 2 starting corners?

Appears so. Not sure why we can't keep corners healthy. Redmond went down last year

[t45fixer]

Jiles injured also. Not season ending.

[lamont]

Jiles injured also. Not season ending.

He's not coming back anytime soon

[ShotgunDawg]

Jiles injured also. Not season ending.

Did our CBs invade Stalingrad this week? The casualty rate is staggering

[HoopsDawg]

He's not coming back anytime soon

So Durr and and smokey starting? Damn. Better get Stamps and Smitherman ready. That's rough.

[ShotgunDawg]

Ok, so it's Jiles and Cleveland?

If so, it stinks and lose experience, but, with those, we are talking about 2 first year starters.

Now, it hurts depth but we replace them with younger guys that were more highly recruited. It likely causes growing pains early, but I'm not sure it's the end of the world. Hopefully.... Cleveland was solid and I was looking forward to seeing a healthy Jiles for the first time.

Does this make Durr and Smitherman the starters with Stamps and Dantzler backing up?

[lamont]

We are going to get torched unless we somehow get very creative with our pass rush.

[War Machine Dawg]

Ok, so it's Jiles and Cleveland?

If so, it stinks and lose experience, but, with those, we are talking about 2 first year starters.

Now, it hurts depth but we replace them with younger guys that were more highly recruited. It likely causes growing pains early, but I'm not sure it's the end of the world. Hopefully.... Cleveland was solid and I was looking forward to seeing a healthy Jiles for the first time.

Does this make Durr and Smitherman the starters with Stamps and Dantzler backing up?

Not trying to belittle the guy, but serious question: Why did anyone ever count on Jiles staying healthy? His injury history is worse than Tobias Smith's injury history. The kid has worked his ass off and done everything ever asked of him. I respect the hell out of that. But his body can't handle the pounding you take at this level. It was always a question of when and how badly, not if, he'd get injured in my mind. So why did so many people seem to be counting so heavily on Jiles being a key contributor for us this season?

Again, not trying to hijack the thread and/or bash Jiles. Just wondering what logical reasoning or evidence has ever pointed to him being able to hold up physically over the course of a season.

[Bothrops]

This is terrible. I guess we go with Durr and Smokey now?

[Tripp McNeely]

We are going to get torched unless we somehow get very creative with our pass rush.

Weren't there a couple dozen threads on this board about how we were gonna get killed if Giles and Cleveland were starting at CB all year? Now that they're not, and were forced to play younger, more talented players, were melting down??? Makes perfect sense****

[BorneDawg]

You had better be careful asking questions and saying names or you will get insults about your wife and blasted for wanting to find out info about our team!

[JoseBrown]

He's not coming back anytime soon

17!!

[ShotgunDawg]

Weren't there a couple dozen threads on this board about how we were gonna get killed if Giles and Cleveland were starting at CB all year? Now that they're not, and were forced to play younger, more talented players, were melting down??? Makes perfect sense****

Yes. Additionally, in the off season, everyone talked about Durr and Smitherman being the two corners.

We do lose experience here, but, with all due respect to the injured, we gain talent. There will be growing pain and the lack of depth will hurt, but in the end I think this will make talented young guys grow up quicker than we expected.

[msstate7]

He's not coming back anytime soon

What's the injury?

[Leroy Jenkins]

Oh well, next man up. I dont want to sound harsh, but move on. It's not like we lost Vernon Hargreaves and Jalen Ramsey.

[ShotgunDawg]

Oh well, next man up. I dont want to sound harsh, but move on. It's not like we lost Vernon Hargreaves and Jalen Ramsey.

This. If our secondary is going to get torched, I'm not really sure these two injuries have much affect on it. Not like we were losing All SEC guys here.

[Csdog]

Yes

[BrunswickDawg]

Yes. Additionally, in the off season, everyone talked about Durr and Smitherman being the two corners.

We do lose experience here, but, with all due respect to the injured, we gain talent. There will be growing pain and the lack of depth will hurt, but in the end I think this will make talented young guys grow up quicker than we expected.
Add to it I seem to remember someone talking about how much Dantzler looked like Banks and lamenting that there was no way he could break through because of Dan's SR Loyalty Program. I don't like injuries, but that's football.

[mparkerfd20]

From what I've seen of the 2 injured we sure aren't losing much. Just experience, but that's not saying much. Still sux for depth tho.

[Reason2succeed]

Good thing the season starts in 2 weeks. If it were 3-4 weeks, our fanbase may have Mullen fired

I see why Mullen shops jobs every year. I would too if I knew our fanbase was going to get so insufferable.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Holy shit!!! All this freak out over players people were pissed off because they were going to start and now they're freaking out because they're not going to play. Which is it? Haha

[ShotgunDawg]

I see why Mullen shops jobs every year. I would too if I knew our fanbase was going to get so insufferable.

Come on Mane. The LSU fan base tried to fire Les Miles last year after winning 9 games & having the number 1 recruiting class in America.

Auburn will fire Malzahn this year if he doesn't win 8

Tennessee will put Butch Jones on hot seat if he doesn't win East

Arkansas may fire or put Bert on hot seat if he doesn't win 8

Freeze will be fired in the next year due to cheating

Sumlin has to win 8 or 9 to keep his job


So how exactly are MSU fans insufferable? Mullen could win 6 games this year & go into 2017 not on the hot seat. By my estimation, he has the longest leash of any SEC coach not named Saban that has been at their school for longer than 2 years.

Think about that.

[Commercecomet24]

I see why Mullen shops jobs every year. I would too if I knew our fanbase was going to get so insufferable.

It is amazing. We want respect from the conference and the media but our own fanbase doesn't even give our team props. We seem to focus on what we don't have or what we don't do well instead of what we have accomplished the last 7 years. Heck you would think reading on here Mullen had never one a game.

[HSVDawg]

Holy shit!!! All this freak out over players people were pissed off because they were going to start and now they're freaking out because they're not going to play. Which is it? Haha

I'm just going to ask a question here, but was it even guaranteed that they were going to start? Or were people just penciling them in because they were the most experienced? I didn't see a fall camp opening depth chart this year, and I seem to also remember a bunch of folks saying Durr would be starting on one side.

[Commercecomet24]

Cleveland got torched a bunch last year so what did we lose there other than experience and depth.

[ShotgunDawg]

I'm just going to ask a question here, but was it even guaranteed that they were going to start? Or were people just penciling them in because they were the most experienced? I didn't see a fall camp opening depth chart this year, and I seem to also remember a bunch of folks saying Durr would be starting on one side.

This

People complain that Dan doesn't start the most talented players in favor of upper class men, yet everyone complains when the upperclassmen go down, forcing Dan to play the most talented players.

I feel terrible for the two players & think they could have been solid this year. There will be some growing pains with younger, inexperienced guys, but, in the end & I don't want to say this to loudly because it will make me come across as non- compassionate to the injured but this may make us a better team in the long run....

[Jarius]

Cleveland tore his acl and Giles broke his arm. Smokey did very well in the scrimmage last night and he is currently on the 1st team at corner.

[Commercecomet24]

This

People complain that Dan doesn't start the most talented players in favor of upper class men, yet everyone complains when the upperclassmen go down, forcing Dan to play the most talented players.

I feel terrible for the two players & think they could have been solid this year. There will be some growing pains with younger, inexperienced guys, but, in the end & I don't want to say this to loudly because it will make me come across as non- compassionate to the injured but this may make us a better team in the long run....

I agree. I don't want any of our players injured ever, but we started 2 star banks and broomfield as freshman and that worked out pretty well. To be honest I'm kinda excited to see the young guys get out there and see what they got.

[msstate7]

Cleveland tore his acl and Giles broke his arm. Smokey did very well in the scrimmage last night and he is currently on the 1st team at corner.

Recovery time on jiles?

If graham can live up to potential this season, it would be huge for our team.

Durr opposite graham?

[Jarius]

Recovery time on jiles?

If graham can live up to potential this season, it would be huge for our team.

Durr opposite graham?

I don't know about recovery time. Smokey is more talented than either one. He needs to be more consistent and he will tell you that. He is getting better though. He's had a good camp.

[Commercecomet24]

I don't know about recovery time. Smokey is more talented than either one. He needs to be more consistent and he will tell you that. He is getting better though. He's had a good camp.

Smokey got the talent to play it, it's just gonna be getting the reps for him.

[HoopsDawg]

I don't know about recovery time. Smokey is more talented than either one. He needs to be more consistent and he will tell you that. He is getting better though. He's had a good camp.

He's probably the fastest. But I don't know if he has the strength to play press coverage like Buckley wants them too.

[Jarius]

He has put on some good weight. He was a worm when he got to state but he has put on good muscle this offseason. He is very aggressive and not scared to hit somebody.

[Reason2succeed]

Can we make sure that the TV announcers refer to him as Smokey Graham?

[ShotgunDawg]

He's probably the fastest. But I don't know if he has the strength to play press coverage like Buckley wants them too.

So this guy
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/98054af424374f2ebadede3feb53ee6f/starkville-ms-usa-17th-oct-2015-mississippi-state-bulldogs-defensive-f4hn6t.jpg

is stronger than this guy? Hmmm
http://thumb.usatodaysportsimages.com/image/thumb/650-510nw/8822555.jpg

[HoopsDawg]

It is amazing. We want respect from the conference and the media but our own fanbase doesn't even give our team props. We seem to focus on what we don't have or what we don't do well instead of what we have accomplished the last 7 years. Heck you would think reading on here Mullen had never one a game.

We just lost our 2 starters at our weakest position. Maybe give people one thread to be upset before you bash our fan base. Actually 70% of your posts are just bashing our fan base. Try to add something to the board.

[HoopsDawg]

So this guy
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/98054af424374f2ebadede3feb53ee6f/starkville-ms-usa-17th-oct-2015-mississippi-state-bulldogs-defensive-f4hn6t.jpg

is stronger than this guy? Hmmm
http://thumb.usatodaysportsimages.com/image/thumb/650-510nw/8822555.jpg

He looks better. If he can step up his mental game, maybe we can be ok. We will just have to use Peters or McLaurin as our nickel guy instead of another corner.

[HoopsDawg]

I'm just going to ask a question here, but was it even guaranteed that they were going to start? Or were people just penciling them in because they were the most experienced? I didn't see a fall camp opening depth chart this year, and I seem to also remember a bunch of folks saying Durr would be starting on one side.

Yes, word from practice is that Cleveland and Jiles were working at 1st team corner.

[msstate7]

Is Morgan-walker expected to play this year? I really like this kid

[ShotgunDawg]

The good news is that this happened at the right time. We've still got three weeks to get young guys ready before South Carolina & we don't face a prolific passing game till maybe BYU on Oct 14th or Texas A&M on Nov 5.

[ShotgunDawg]

Yes, word from practice is that Cleveland and Jiles were working at 1st team corner.

The question is though: is like saying Shumpert was running 1st team RB while we all know Aeris & Gibson are better? or were Cleveland & Jiles really the best two guys?

[msstate7]

The good news is that this happened at the right time. We've still got three weeks to get young guys ready before South Carolina & we don't face a prolific passing game till maybe BYU on Oct 14th or Texas A&M on Nov 5.

Doesn't byu get hill back at Qb? If so, pretty sure he's a runner more than a passer

[Commercecomet24]

He looks better. If he can step up his mental game, maybe we can be ok. We will just have to use Peters or McLaurin as our nickel guy instead of another corner.

I like the idea of Peters or Mclaurin playing nickel. Still plenty of speed and more physicality. May not be as good at coverage but a good idea.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Is Morgan-walker expected to play this year? I really like this kid

He may but he's a safety.

[ShotgunDawg]

Doesn't byu get hill back at Qb? If so, pretty sure he's a runner more than a passer

Not sure. I don't know what they run these days. They were West coast for a long time, but I'm not sure what the current scheme is

[Where'sWaldo]

No one has complained that the backup corners had more talent. Those discussions have revolved around other position groups. Moving peters or Mclaurin to nickel is a terrible idea. I want to get hyped up about those guys but Mcclaurin got run by like he was standing still by Mixon in the spring game and Peters looked absolutely terrible as well. I hope they have improved.

[defiantdog]

Slow down folks..... Here's the thing, we have more safeties then db's now..... weird I know. But smoot 2.0 (smitherman) will step up. Man the dude talks a lot in practice..... He's going to get in someone's head in a game. But I'm with the random poster guy here..... We will be in trouble in one on one situations.

[defiantdog]

No one has complained that the backup corners had more talent. Those discussions have revolved around other position groups. Moving peters or Mclaurin to nickel is a terrible idea. I want to get hyped up about those guys but Mcclaurin got run by like he was standing still by Mixon in the spring game and Peters looked absolutely terrible as well. I hope they have improved.

Mixon runs a 4.3 forty..... He's going to run past everyone. I even talked to a certain dark lord recently (Tusk knows who I'm talking about)..... And he mentioned how that guy could be a decisive factor in the right scheme.

[ShotgunDawg]

Mixon runs a 4.3 forty..... He's going to run past everyone. I even talked to a certain dark lord recently (Tusk knows who I'm talking about)..... And he mentioned how that guy could be a decisive factor in the right scheme.

Are we the right scheme?

[ShotgunDawg]

But I'm with the random poster guy here..... We will be in trouble in one on one situations.

Are we more in trouble now in 1 on 1 situations than we were before the injuries?

[defiantdog]

Are we the right scheme?
Yes..... Mixon is a game changer especially with the 15 lbs of muscle he gained over the off season. If our OL can hold a block, then he'll get behind every defender.

[msstate7]

Are we the right scheme?

I'm worried that we won't get many plays for mixon with Ross and dear in the slot also. I wonder if mixon takes over holloway's position next season

[defiantdog]

Are we more in trouble now in 1 on 1 situations than we were before the injuries?

We're going to have a lot of youth on the field..... A lot of inexperience.

[defiantdog]

I'm worried that we won't get many plays for mixon with Ross and dear in the slot also. I wonder if mixon takes over holloway's position next season
No..... But expect him in the backfield on a few situations.

[lamont]

We just lost our starting CB's. Cleveland was said to be "far and away" our best CB in Fall camp. We didn't just get more talented at CB. As Hoops said- our weakest position just got worse. Smitherman was so far down the chart they were working him at safety- now suddenly he may work his way into starting at CB?

We are going to get torched against teams that can throw the football. And that doesn't even include the possibility of more injuries at the position- which are surely to happen

[lamont]

Are we more in trouble now in 1 on 1 situations than we were before the injuries?

Hell yeah we will be. We are now officially 14th in the SEC at the CB position

[msstate7]

We just lost our starting CB's. Cleveland was said to be "far and away" our best CB in Fall camp. We didn't just get more talented at CB. As Hoops said- our weakest position just got worse. Smitherman was so far down the chart they were working him at safety- now suddenly he may work his way into starting at CB?

We are going to get torched against teams that can throw the football. And that doesn't even include the possibility of more injuries at the position- which are surely to happen

Maybe this is devastating, but I'm not gonna melt till I see them play. Last year, shump was by far our best Rb in practice too... How'd that work out?

[defiantdog]

We just lost our starting CB's. Cleveland was said to be "far and away" our best CB in Fall camp. We didn't just get more talented at CB. As Hoops said- our weakest position just got worse. Smitherman was so far down the chart they were working him at safety- now suddenly he may work his way into starting at CB?

We are going to get torched against teams that can throw the football. And that doesn't even include the possibility of more injuries at the position- which are surely to happen

You make it sound so morbid, but completely correct. I'm just looking for the silver lining in the position group. We're doomed in man to man match ups..... But that's what happens when you miss year after year on big name DB recruits.

[lamont]

Maybe this is devastating, but I'm not gonna melt till I see them play. Last year, shump was by far our best Rb in practice too... How'd that work out?

It turned out that we weren't very good at RB....kinda puts CB in perspective doesn't it?

[ShotgunDawg]

Maybe this is devastating, but I'm not gonna melt till I see them play. Last year, shump was by far our best Rb in practice too... How'd that work out?

My thoughts as well. Not doubting RP or Defiant, but, if Cleveland was our best cover guy, we were already doomed anyway.

So we've got non-SEC caliber players now at CB & a Damien Williams at QB?

If we win 7 games this year with that juggernaut, Mullen should be SEC COY

[msstate7]

It turned out that we weren't very good at RB....kinda puts CB in perspective doesn't it?

Not my point... While we weren't very good at Rb, shump was behind at least aeris and Holloway. Watching practice though, you would've thought shump was by far better than those 2

[bulldawg28]

We're no more doomed in man to man than we were before these injuries. Jiles and Cleveland were both midget corners who would have struggled physically against taller WR's. Neither were overly physical and were ok at best. Now more speed, size, and athletic ability are on the field. Enough with the BS we're now torched with better talent. Hell, any corner in the SEC playing man with no safety help is torched before long. That's why we have safeties on the field to cover up deficiencies.

[Todd4State]

We just lost our starting CB's. Cleveland was said to be "far and away" our best CB in Fall camp. We didn't just get more talented at CB. As Hoops said- our weakest position just got worse. Smitherman was so far down the chart they were working him at safety- now suddenly he may work his way into starting at CB?

We are going to get torched against teams that can throw the football. And that doesn't even include the possibility of more injuries at the position- which are surely to happen

Thank God we play zone 80% of the time.

[bulldawg28]

C34 should stay in retirement.

[Todd4State]

Maybe this is devastating, but I'm not gonna melt till I see them play. Last year, shump was by far our best Rb in practice too... How'd that work out?

I don't care what our coaches say. Cleveland sucked. I wouldn't be shocked if Durr and Smokey are at least as good or better. Dan values experience over talent every time.

[Todd4State]

My thoughts as well. Not doubting RP or Defiant, but, if Cleveland was our best cover guy, we were already doomed anyway.

So we've got non-SEC caliber players now at CB & a Damien Williams at QB?

If we win 7 games this year with that juggernaut, Mullen should be SEC COY


Our underclassmen are more talented in general than our upperclassmen. Will Dan let them play? And by play I mean more than spot duty.

[TUSK]

It's not about what you want, it's about what the kid wants. What if that kid has dreamed of playing in the SEC? You are denying him that opportunity. He can always transfer to Jackson State and not sit out.

Great point, 'Gun... I remember MDL catching a lot of crap about "cuttin" players... it's good to see that others are seeing the light...

All these cats think they can compete... why not give them the opportunity?

[Commercecomet24]

I don't care what our coaches say. Cleveland sucked. I wouldn't be shocked if Durr and Smokey are at least as good or better. Dan values experience over talent every time.

I agree with this. If our younger corners are not at least as good as Cleveland we were in trouble anyways.

[HancockCountyDog]

The question is though: is like saying Shumpert was running 1st team RB while we all know Aeris & Gibson are better? or were Cleveland & Jiles really the best two guys?

I haven't seen anything from Graham that makes me think he is better than Jiles or Cleveland, and I doubt the coaches are not playing the best guys on defense.

It's a blow. No reason to try and sugar coat it. Out of our top 4 corners, Graham has the most experience and he was converted to corner last spring. The other I assume are Durr, Stamps, Rayford? Maybe Smitherman.

Cleveland and Jiles may not have been All SEC talents, but they were experienced SEC corners that we were counting on.

Let's hope that's the end of the injuries for us this summer.

[Homedawg]

I don't care what our coaches say. Cleveland sucked. I wouldn't be shocked if Durr and Smokey are at least as good or better. Dan values experience over talent every time.

This is a mind boggling stupid statement. So you know more than our coaches??? Just plain ****ing stupid.

[MetEdDawg]

This is a mind boggling stupid statement. So you know more than our coaches??? Just plain ****ing stupid.

I would agree if there weren't ample proof to the contrary. Dak as a sophomore was better than Tyler Russell and considerably more dynamic as a runner. Zac Jackson played over Matt Wells. Perkins over J Rob. Shump over everyone last year. Dear getting virtually nothing last year after he broke something every time he touched the ball. Deontae Evans over any breathing human in the secondary. There are other examples but you get the picture.

Don't get me wrong. Love Mullen. But personnel decisions aren't exactly an area Mullen has a brilliant track record on. He's made some questionable decisions at times on personnel so questioning his public comments is warranted. I think regardless of whether Fitz was clearly better than Williams that Williams would be starting game 1. And I'm pretty sure most everyone else on here would agree.

[lamont]

We're no more doomed in man to man than we were before these injuries. Jiles and Cleveland were both midget corners who would have struggled physically against taller WR's. Neither were overly physical and were ok at best.

Thats been my point the whole time- and they were the best we had. We arent putting more talent on the field. Graham was terrible last year and wont be much better this year. We are putting more size on the field now??????

Cleveland- 6'0/190
Jiles- 5'10/186

Graham- 5'10/183
Durr- 5'11/17
Smitherman- 5'9/185

Too bad C34 is retired- he would have smoked your ass much worse than me

[msstate7]

Thats been my point the whole time- and they were the best we had. We arent putting more talent on the field. Graham was terrible last year and wont be much better this year. We are putting more size on the field now??????

Cleveland- 6'0/190
Jiles- 5'10/186

Graham- 5'10/183
Durr- 5'11/17
Smitherman- 5'/185

Too bad C34 is retired- he would have smoked your ass much worse than me

If C34 weren't retired, I'd remind him that he got really upset we wouldn't play lee at Rb. C34 liked the backup there over the starter

[confucius say]

Thats been my point the whole time- and they were the best we had. We arent putting more talent on the field. Graham was terrible last year and wont be much better this year. We are putting more size on the field now??????

Cleveland- 6'0/190
Jiles- 5'10/186

Graham- 5'10/183
Durr- 5'11/17
Smitherman- 5'/185

Too bad C34 is retired- he would have smoked your ass much worse than me

Just a question: why do you say they are the best we had? Bc they were listed as 1's pre-camp? They may have marginally more experience, but their ceilings are much lower than durr and smitherman (who was moved to nickel safety/corner to get him on the field on third downs).

[lamont]

If C34 weren't retired, I'd remind him that he got really upset we wouldn't play lee at Rb. C34 liked the backup there over the starter

I saw C34 post that he understood why once he was told that DLee wasnt going to class and missing study hall sessions. JRob also took himself off the field by doing stupid shit- that he continues to do even today. We as fans dont get to hear about alot of things these guys do to hurt themselves. Simmons has more overall talent than AJ- but he isnt a better player TODAY than AJ is. Will he be by this time next year? probably. At CB- I just dont think there is alot of talent being held back from playing. Look at Peters- top talent. But he was awful in pass coverage last year. Mullen didnt hold him back- his lack of understanding of the passing game and coverage did.

Talent needs experience- but in alot of situations- talent also needs time to grow up before they are ready to play.

[Bothrops]

My thoughts

I've always said Graham is more of a receiver than a CB.

Losing the experience at CB will hurt more than any other factor. More than talent.

One of our new starters at CB will surprise and step up.

If we don't get better pressure on the qb this year, it won't matter whose playing CB.

Our defense will be better by mid season ( probably before) than anytime since 2010.

[lamont]

Just a question: why do you say they are the best we had? Bc they were listed as 1's pre-camp? They may have marginally more experience, but their ceilings are much lower than durr and smitherman (who was moved to nickel safety/corner to get him on the field on third downs).

Because someone on our staff said- "Cleveland is far and away the best CB we have".

1. They see them everyday
2. He didnt say Cleveland does all the little things to put himself ahead- he said "far and away"
3. And yes-I watched Cleveland last year and know he is not a good SEC CB. Just look at how bad our D got once Redmond got hurt.

When someone says "far and away" and I know how good that guy is- its the entire reason Ive got no optimism for this season. Cleveland is "far and away" our best CB and Fitz cant beat out Williams. People think Kentucky has the best WR's in the SEC East- which means they are close to the best in the SEC- and you guys think we are going to walk in there and cruise to another W?

This season is going to be a struggle

[msstate7]

I saw C34 post that he understood why once he was told that DLee wasnt going to class and missing study hall sessions. JRob also took himself off the field by doing stupid shit- that he continues to do even today. We as fans dont get to hear about alot of things these guys do to hurt themselves. Simmons has more overall talent than AJ- but he isnt a better player TODAY than AJ is. Will he be by this time next year? probably. At CB- I just dont think there is alot of talent being held back from playing. Look at Peters- top talent. But he was awful in pass coverage last year. Mullen didnt hold him back- his lack of understanding of the passing game and coverage did.

Talent needs experience- but in alot of situations- talent also needs time to grow up before they are ready to play.

You seem to be quite the fan of C34 haha

[preachermatt83]

Cleveland may very well be our best CBack far and away, but if that's the case them we were screwed anyway bc he was awful.

[bulldawg28]

Thats been my point the whole time- and they were the best we had. We arent putting more talent on the field. Graham was terrible last year and wont be much better this year. We are putting more size on the field now??????

Cleveland- 6'0/190
Jiles- 5'10/186

Graham- 5'10/183
Durr- 5'11/17
Smitherman- 5'9/185

Too bad C34 is retired- he would have smoked your ass much worse than me

The only smoking your doing is crack if you think Cleveland and Jiles are better or more athletic than the backups. Cleveland is 6'0 in heels and Jiles 5'10 in stilettos. Neither were/are quick making plays. The new starters are more playmakers and will help the defense.

Tell 34 his agenda is still shit

[Todd4State]

This is a mind boggling stupid statement. So you know more than our coaches??? Just plain ****ing stupid.

So, you think Zach Jackson should have started because the coaches said so? If you do you should change your user name to Homerdawg because Dan and Zach Jackson’s Mom are literally the only other people that would agree with you.
I think Dan and I have a different philosophy on personnel and roster management. Dan believes that experience wins. I believe the best talent playing the most wins. You apparently agree with Dan. The other 13 coaches in the SEC whom I would believe know at least as much about football as Dan agree with me. Glean from that what you will. Surely you don’t think Nick Saban is “plain ****ing stupid” but again you are inclined to believe whatever you would like.

[Todd4State]

I would agree if there weren't ample proof to the contrary. Dak as a sophomore was better than Tyler Russell and considerably more dynamic as a runner. Zac Jackson played over Matt Wells. Perkins over J Rob. Shump over everyone last year. Dear getting virtually nothing last year after he broke something every time he touched the ball. Deontae Evans over any breathing human in the secondary. There are other examples but you get the picture.

Don't get me wrong. Love Mullen. But personnel decisions aren't exactly an area Mullen has a brilliant track record on. He's made some questionable decisions at times on personnel so questioning his public comments is warranted. I think regardless of whether Fitz was clearly better than Williams that Williams would be starting game 1. And I'm pretty sure most everyone else on here would agree.

This in spades.

[IMissJack]

My thoughts as well. Not doubting RP or Defiant, but, if Cleveland was our best cover guy, we were already doomed anyway.

So we've got non-SEC caliber players now at CB & a Damien Williams at QB?

If we win 7 games this year with that juggernaut, Mullen should be SEC COY

Mullen recruited them and/or did not recruit what we are missing, so he put himself in the position to have to be COY to win 7.

[confucius say]

Because someone on our staff said- "Cleveland is far and away the best CB we have".

1. They see them everyday
2. He didnt say Cleveland does all the little things to put himself ahead- he said "far and away"
3. And yes-I watched Cleveland last year and know he is not a good SEC CB. Just look at how bad our D got once Redmond got hurt.

When someone says "far and away" and I know how good that guy is- its the entire reason Ive got no optimism for this season. Cleveland is "far and away" our best CB and Fitz cant beat out Williams. People think Kentucky has the best WR's in the SEC East- which means they are close to the best in the SEC- and you guys think we are going to walk in there and cruise to another W?

This season is going to be a struggle

Agreed on the struggle. I've said 7-5 all along.

And that staff person may be right. But I was told the opposite. I was told Cleveland was showing leadership though.

[BankerDog]

The only smoking your doing is crack if you think Cleveland and Jiles are better or more athletic than the backups. Cleveland is 6'0 in heels and Jiles 5'10 in stilettos. Neither were/are quick making plays. The new starters are more playmakers and will help the defense.

Tell 34 his agenda is still shit


Bud, I'm 6'2 215. Ced Jiles standing next to me is only 2 inches shorter and makes me look small. The dude is no midget by any means and is also a boxer in his spare time. Go watch the highlights of him in the Egg Bowl going against Treadwell and was the only one man enough to hit the kid.

[HoopsDawg]

Mullen recruited them and/or did not recruit what we are missing, so he put himself in the position to have to be COY to win 7.

Exactly. I'm not going to reward Mullen for being inept at recruiting. We have a GREAT schedule this year. That's the only thing that could make us bowl eligible. BC I think this is a 2-6 conference team.

[Homedawg]

So, you think Zach Jackson should have started because the coaches said so? If you do you should change your user name to Homerdawg because Dan and Zach Jackson?s Mom are literally the only other people that would agree with you.
I think Dan and I have a different philosophy on personnel and roster management. Dan believes that experience wins. I believe the best talent playing the most wins. You apparently agree with Dan. The other 13 coaches in the SEC whom I would believe know at least as much about football as Dan agree with me. Glean from that what you will. Surely you don?t think Nick Saban is ?plain ****ing stupid? but again you are inclined to believe whatever you would like.

That's not the point. What I see is on Saturdays and a practice here and there. On yours is on less than that.....The coaches see them everyday and then breakdown film for hours. Say what you want, but we don't play people bc they have jr or sr by their name. We play them because at that particular moment our coaches think they give us the best chance to win based on what they've seen and know. They don't just make shit up and decide lets play a jr bc he's a jr. If they did we would have Jake Thomas and Cole carter starting right now. Experience wins in this league. Experienced talent, wins championships. We play a ton of young guys every year, go look it up. You see what you want to see. But believe what you want. Your entire premise is based on Internet fodder and is ****ing retarded. Period.

[msstate7]

Bud, I'm 6'2 215. Ced Jiles standing next to me is only 2 inches shorter and makes me look small. The dude is no midget by any means and is also a boxer in his spare time. Go watch the highlights of him in the Egg Bowl going against Treadwell and was the only one man enough to hit the kid.

I thought Calhoun more than held his own vs treadwell

[bulldawg28]

Bud, I'm 6'2 215. Ced Jiles standing next to me is only 2 inches shorter and makes me look small. The dude is no midget by any means and is also a boxer in his spare time. Go watch the highlights of him in the Egg Bowl going against Treadwell and was the only one man enough to hit the kid.

I have no idea which eggbowl you watched because Jiles didn't make any plays against Treadwell. And your also telling me your 6'2 215 lbs yet he's supposedly 5'10 185 and makes you seem small? Hmmmmmm.

[lamont]

The only smoking your doing is crack if you think Cleveland and Jiles are better or more athletic than the backups. Cleveland is 6'0 in heels and Jiles 5'10 in stilettos.

So- those guys are listed wrong on the roster- but those other guys are listed 100% correct? Shirley you arent that much of a moron.

I watched the "agenda" word get thrown around last November- and C34 get proven right yet aGAIN. He was soooo right- our administration didnt extend Mullen's contract. We'll see how this season turns out to find out if its "agenda"- or someone that knows their shit about football and saw this season's struggles coming.

Gonna be a helluva Fall

[bulldawg28]

So- those guys are listed wrong on the roster- but those other guys are listed 100% correct? Shirley you arent that much of a moron.

I watched the "agenda" word get thrown around last November- and C34 get proven right yet aGAIN. He was soooo right- our administration didnt extend Mullen's contract. We'll see how this season turns out to find out if its "agenda"- or someone that knows their shit about football and saw this season's struggles coming.

Gonna be a helluva Fall


So I'm wrong on height your wrong on judging talent. And you do that for a living. When we make a bowl come out of the closet and change your name back

[shoeless joe]

That's not the point. What I see is on Saturdays and a practice here and there. On yours is on less than that.....The coaches see them everyday and then breakdown film for hours. Say what you want, but we don't play people bc they have jr or sr by their name. We play them because at that particular moment our coaches think they give us the best chance to win based on what they've seen and know. They don't just make shit up and decide lets play a jr bc he's a jr. If they did we would have Jake Thomas and Cole carter starting right now. Experience wins in this league. Experienced talent, wins championships. We play a ton of young guys every year, go look it up. You see what you want to see. But believe what you want. Your entire premise is based on Internet fodder and is ****ing retarded. Period.


Best post I've seen in regards to Mullen and his personnel decisions...

[Really Clark?]

So, you think Zach Jackson should have started because the coaches said so? If you do you should change your user name to Homerdawg because Dan and Zach Jackson?s Mom are literally the only other people that would agree with you.
I think Dan and I have a different philosophy on personnel and roster management. Dan believes that experience wins. I believe the best talent playing the most wins. You apparently agree with Dan. The other 13 coaches in the SEC whom I would believe know at least as much about football as Dan agree with me. Glean from that what you will. Surely you don?t think Nick Saban is ?plain ****ing stupid? but again you are inclined to believe whatever you would like.

The depth chart for Bama's 2 deep at one point was 24 upper classman. Ours was 23. That was prior to the injuries. LSU lists 28 upperclassman. Soooo, maybe they see things closer to the way Dan does.

[Reason2succeed]

We will be fine. You can either run and cover and tackle or you can't. Our schedule is set up to where they will get experience along the way.

[msstate7]

I don't think our coaches or any coaches intentionally play subpar players, but it does happen... Perkins over jrob, Tyler Russell over Dak, and hell maybe the best coach in the world played Bledsoe over Brady until Bledsoe was injured

[Percho]

So, you think Zach Jackson should have started because the coaches said so? If you do you should change your user name to Homerdawg because Dan and Zach Jackson?s Mom are literally the only other people that would agree with you.
I think Dan and I have a different philosophy on personnel and roster management. Dan believes that experience wins. I believe the best talent playing the most wins. You apparently agree with Dan. The other 13 coaches in the SEC whom I would believe know at least as much about football as Dan agree with me. Glean from that what you will. Surely you don?t think Nick Saban is ?plain ****ing stupid? but again you are inclined to believe whatever you would like.

Does 1 A 1 B build experience with talent?

[Todd4State]

That's not the point. What I see is on Saturdays and a practice here and there. On yours is on less than that.....The coaches see them everyday and then breakdown film for hours. Say what you want, but we don't play people bc they have jr or sr by their name. We play them because at that particular moment our coaches think they give us the best chance to win based on what they've seen and know. They don't just make shit up and decide lets play a jr bc he's a jr. If they did we would have Jake Thomas and Cole carter starting right now. Experience wins in this league. Experienced talent, wins championships. We play a ton of young guys every year, go look it up. You see what you want to see. But believe what you want. Your entire premise is based on Internet fodder and is ****ing retarded. Period.

1A/1B was among the most retarded things I have ever seen a football team do. Someone on our coaching staff thought that up. Even if you blame Geoff Collins for that- Dan totally signed off on it. Also, you had one of our coaches less than a week ago say “Potential gets you beat.” That speaks volumes to me about what the coaches “think” when they are behind closed doors.

You also realize that you brought up two guys that aren’t even on the football team anymore? Of course Dan isn’t going to play someone on the roster. If they were still on the team, I wouldn’t put it past him as the Rufus Warren’s and Zach Jackson’s outweigh the Deontay Evans’s of this world at this point.

You attempting to call me out because I don’t attend practice while in the same post assuming what the coaches are discussing about our players behind closed doors when you don’t attend the meetings but go to a practice here and there is laughable at best.

I do actually agree with you that EXPERIENCED TALENT wins you games. But the issue is not all of our experienced players are talented on a championship level. And that’s what kills us and keeps us from reaching our potential and beating people like Alabama once every six years or so. So, unless you actually have 22 experienced and talented players Dan’s system is never going to reach its full potential because the experience is always going to trump the talent and there will never be any balance between the two. It’s even to the detriment of the system itself.

Yes, we “play” freshmen- but how much do they actually play? Normally when Dan starts an underclassman it’s because he has absolutely no choice- such as Tyler Russell being injured. Or in other words there are no other upperclassmen to play.

At any rate it’s very obvious that based on the GAME results and actual GAME performance that we’re not always playing the best players. There were several examples presented to you in this very thread. If it were a few random instances, I could see your point. But the examples are mounting every year. And it’s obvious to anyone that knows anything about football regardless of how many practices that they have attended.

[Beaver]

Feel bad for Giles. Losing Cleveland hurts, but let's be honest.. He wasn't a gamer. We will miss the leadership and experience, but this won't be the difference between a successful season or a crappy one.

[Todd4State]

The depth chart for Bama's 2 deep at one point was 24 upper classman. Ours was 23. That was prior to the injuries. LSU lists 28 upperclassman. Soooo, maybe they see things closer to the way Dan does.

At one point when? This spring before the freshman arrived?

http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-chart/alabama/89923

I see two freshmen and a sophomore starting on Bama's o-line- including over a couple of seniors on this depth chart.

[Bass Chaser]

Talent/potential: as Jon Gruden says it means you haven't done anything yet!

[Todd4State]

Does 1 A 1 B build experience with talent?

I'm OK with 1A/1B against South Alabama. Against Alabama- no. There is no reason to do mass NHL style substitutions in football. There is no reason to not have your best guys on the field because "it wasn't their turn" on a crucial drive on the road.

[msstate7]

Could Mullen determine starters and playing time on the safe side? Like last year, warren was probably better than rankin in the offseason, but rankin had more potential. Instead of letting Rankin play early and hoping he hits his potential, Mullen played the player (warren) that was better at the moment even though he was less talented

[lamont]

So I'm wrong on height your wrong on judging talent. And you do that for a living. When we make a bowl come out of the closet and change your name back

Ive said we will be 6-6. A retarded monkey or even you could go 6-6 with an SEC team. 2-6 in conference isnt hard. I'm Random Poster- there is nothing to change my name to.

[Really Clark?]

At one point when? This spring before the freshman arrived?

http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-chart/alabama/89923

I see two freshmen and a sophomore starting on Bama's o-line- including over a couple of seniors on this depth chart.

I used the exact same chart. And if you want to look at just starters we are between Bama and LSU in the number of starting upperclassmen. I think it's 12 for Bama, 15 for us (before injuries) and 17 for LSU. And for the national title game Bama started 17 upperclassman. No we don't have a tendency to start true freshman OL. Then again not many do. They have the luxury of redshirting high 4* OL as well. But I believe Causell, Malone, and Claybourn all started opening games as underclassman. Jenkins played a good bit and started as a RSFr

[lamont]

So I'm wrong on height your wrong on judging talent. And you do that for a living.

Its literally the best thing I do and I hit quite often. Ballard, Russell, Prescott, Redmond, etc. We will not be good at CB in 2016- mark my words and watch us this season. I'm gonna say we finish 10th or worst in the SEC in pass defense. You want to challenge that?

[TUSK]

At one point when? This spring before the freshman arrived?

http://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-depth-charts/depth-chart/alabama/89923

I see two freshmen and a sophomore starting on Bama's o-line- including over a couple of seniors on this depth chart.

yep, that's on the right side of the line, Todd... Juco RT Charles Baldwin was gonna start but was processed in favor of Tr Fr Jonah Williams from Cali... He's a future LT, I believe... RG has been Alphonse Taylor, but he came in over weight and then got popped for DUI... Doghouse...

The OL is gonna be young, for shizzle.

Edit: The whole Offense is gonna be young...

[ShotgunDawg]

Its literally the best thing I do and I hit quite often. Ballard, Russell, Prescott, Redmond, etc. We will not be good at CB in 2016- mark my words and watch us this season. I'm gonna say we finish 10th or worst in the SEC in pass defense. You want to challenge that?

Ok. Can you talk about what we do well?

[Pollodawg]

The only smoking your doing is crack if you think Cleveland and Jiles are better or more athletic than the backups. Cleveland is 6'0 in heels and Jiles 5'10 in stilettos. Neither were/are quick making plays. The new starters are more playmakers and will help the defense.

Tell 34 his agenda is still shit

Yup.

[Tripp McNeely]

I'd bet every dollar of my massive amount of V-cash that were an 8+ win team!

[lamont]

Ok. Can you talk about what we do well?

Our DL is coached very well and has some depth. Our LB's are top 5 SEC talent
Our starting WR's are SEC top 5- but we lack depth
Our OL is bottom half SEC at best
Our RB talent is mid-level SEC
We have green TE's
We have problems at the QB position. Mullen even told the media the QB's are struggling- and thats rare for Mullen.

[Tripp McNeely]

Guys, i HATE it for Tolando and Cedric, especially Cedric. Dude has been absolutely snake bitten from the moment he walked on campus...but if you think there will be ANY dropoff in CB play in the Durr/Smokey/Smitherman/Stamps/Dantzler regime...you are reaching!! As long as those 5 stay relatively healthy, we will see Zero dropoff in play. We have 8 games of warmup time before our CBs will be SERIOUSLY tested!

I don't want to be that guy, but go back and look at Giles and Cleveland's offer lists and film versus the five I named above. This will have ZERO affect on the win/loss column

[Todd4State]

I used the exact same chart. And if you want to look at just starters we are between Bama and LSU in the number of starting upperclassmen. I think it's 12 for Bama, 15 for us (before injuries) and 17 for LSU. And for the national title game Bama started 17 upperclassman. No we don't have a tendency to start true freshman OL. Then again not many do. They have the luxury of redshirting high 4* OL as well. But I believe Causell, Malone, and Claybourn all started opening games as underclassman. Jenkins played a good bit and started as a RSFr

It’s common sense that the majority of starters in the SEC are going to be upperclassmen. I don’t have a problem playing upperclassmen. I have a problem playing upperclassmen if they aren’t as productive as the underclassmen.

About Jenkins and etc. Yes they play- but do they play enough to where they get experience and are maximized? That’s another issue with Dan. If you want to start Zach Jackson because he is a senior that’s fine. But JT Gray should have played about 70-75% of the time because he is a better player and that would have been best for the team. We would have been better off as a team giving Aeries approx. 5-6 more carries per game than he got all year.

[Jarius]

We may suck at cornerback but no one on our roster can possibly be any worse than Cleveland was last year. Like others have said, if he was the best we had then we were screwed anyway. I would rather us have growing pains with guys that actually have the athletic potential to be a good SEC corner than have a guy that doesn't have the God given talent to play in the SEC taking all the snaps because he's the best we have available at the moment (even though his best is nowhere near good enough to do us any good).

[ShotgunDawg]

We may suck at cornerback but no one on our roster can possibly be any worse than Cleveland was last year. Like others have said, if he was the best we had then we were screwed anyway. I would rather us have growing pains with guys that actually have the athletic potential to be a good SEC corner than have a guy that doesn't have the God given talent to play in the SEC taking all the snaps because he's the best we have available at the moment (even though his best is nowhere near good enough to do us any good).

Yup, yup, yup

[Really Clark?]

It’s common sense that the majority of starters in the SEC are going to be upperclassmen. I don’t have a problem playing upperclassmen. I have a problem playing upperclassmen if they aren’t as productive as the underclassmen.

About Jenkins and etc. Yes they play- but do they play enough to where they get experience and are maximized? That’s another issue with Dan. If you want to start Zach Jackson because he is a senior that’s fine. But JT Gray should have played about 70-75% of the time because he is a better player and that would have been best for the team. We would have been better off as a team giving Aeries approx. 5-6 more carries per game than he got all year.

I understand what you are saying and this argument you have. The problem is you made the statement that Dan is way different than the rest of the league with the amount of underclassman he plays. That's not true at all. You also have a tendency to look at starters only forgetting Chris Jones and others would play as many or more snaps than a starter. You only bring up Zack Jackson but his playing time was reduced during the season, also forgetting you wanted Peters and McLaurin starting day one when even at the end of the season it was clear they were not ready for more snaps or the fact Bryant is better than both of them and as talented. This is debate we had a good bit last year and JRob has been the flag bearer for people who make a big deal about playing time based on seniority. It should very clear that Mullen was right because he has the clearest picture of the overall program and the players in the program. It was the same argument many made for Quay playing and starting as a true freshman and sophomore. Again, Mullen was right and it wasn't even a good argument. There has not been a position group, besides QB, that we haven't had underclassman playing significant min. The more talent arguments only holds water IF they can overcome their faults by ability. CJ did. Bear and Ross did. Peters and McLaurin couldn't. This doesn't even get into the difference of players being raw but athletic and the HS programs that a lot of these guys come from. Bama getting the best OL in the country from very developed HS programs is a little different than the OL we have signed. But yeah let's go ahead a put them out there just because you think they are more talented.

[Todd4State]

I understand what you are saying and this argument you have. The problem is you made the statement that Dan is way different than the rest of the league with the amount of underclassman he plays. That's not true at all. You also have a tendency to look at starters only forgetting Chris Jones and others would play as many or more snaps than a starter. You only bring up Zack Jackson but his playing time was reduced during the season, also forgetting you wanted Peters and McLaurin starting day one when even at the end of the season it was clear they were not ready for more snaps or the fact Bryant is better than both of them and as talented. This is debate we had a good bit last year and JRob has been the flag bearer for people who make a big deal about playing time based on seniority. It should very clear that Mullen was right because he has the clearest picture of the overall program and the players in the program. It was the same argument many made for Quay playing and starting as a true freshman and sophomore. Again, Mullen was right and it wasn't even a good argument. There has not been a position group, besides QB, that we haven't had underclassman playing significant min. The more talent arguments only holds water IF they can overcome their faults by ability. CJ did. Bear and Ross did. Peters and McLaurin couldn't. This doesn't even get into the difference of players being raw but athletic and the HS programs that a lot of these guys come from. Bama getting the best OL in the country from very developed HS programs is a little different than the OL we have signed. But yeah let's go ahead a put them out there just because you think they are more talented.

Again- a guy that is a freshman and playing mop up duty and saying “Oh look! Dan is playing a freshman!” and Saban starting a guy that is a true freshman in a meaningful game are two totally different things. You’re only looking at the total number of upperclassmen and underclassmen and saying that is the same thing when it’s not the same at all. Try looking at number of snaps next time if you want to be relevant.

You’re mistaken about my views on Peters/McLaurin and Bryant. I wanted Bryant to start all along. I’ve always liked Bryant and helped lead the charge when Rosebowl tried to run him off for visiting USM. I want Peters to start over Coman and still do. Peters actually outplayed Coman in the Egg Bowl statistically. He isn’t any worse in coverage than Coman and has better instincts and is more likely to cause a turnover. You can say I missed on McLaurin if it makes you feel better, but that’s bound to happen since no one plays three safeties on defense unless it’s Big Nickle. Zach Jackson started ELEVEN games in a row and his playing time was reduced when he and Manny got into it after Manny FINALLY benched him and Zach left the team. Waiting until game 11 when Arkansas is lighting us up and then saying “see Dan is right” is silly when that should have occurred during game three at the latest.

And while you are at it- I also wanted Aeris and Lee to play more. Aeris had more rushing TD’s than Holloway and Lee had the highest yards per carry of any running back we had last year. I said Jenkins should play more than Warren. I said Dear should play more than he did before the season as well. Was I wrong about them as well?

I guess you forgot 2013 because Bear Wilson only had one start and Ross only played in 11 games and had 9 catches on the year. And the starters that year were the less productive than Bear Wilson Robert Johnson and Joe Morrow? Bear had more TD’s than our starting outside WR’s COMBINED and still didn’t start. Good call on that.

[Reason2succeed]

Guys, i HATE it for Tolando and Cedric, especially Cedric. Dude has been absolutely snake bitten from the moment he walked on campus...but if you think there will be ANY dropoff in CB play in the Durr/Smokey/Smitherman/Stamps/Dantzler regime...you are reaching!! As long as those 5 stay relatively healthy, we will see Zero dropoff in play. We have 8 games of warmup time before our CBs will be SERIOUSLY tested!

I don't want to be that guy, but go back and look at Giles and Cleveland's offer lists and film versus the five I named above. This will have ZERO affect on the win/loss column

This right here! I hate to lose players but that's football. I'd rather lose them in a scrimmage before the season than in the middle of the LSU game.

Our corners will be fine if for no reason than they won't face an elite experience QB until late in the season.

All of this Mullen hate and doomsday predictions are getting old. It's always from the same posters. I guess they figure that if they keep throwing crap at the wall one day it will stick.

Mullen is doing a great job! Period. Are there decisions that he make that we don't understand? Yes, but that is leadership from the POTUS, CEO, pastor, down. You're never going to fully understand their decisions because you're not sitting in their seat and you don't know what is happening behind the scenes (I don't care who your sources are or how many practices you see). If you want their job go earn it. Let us know and we'll all be right there to criticize your every decision.

Go ask 13 other SEC programs how great their coaches are. After hearing their frustrations you will be glad that we have Mullen.

Some of y'all need to back away from the computer until the season starts because I'm afraid for your health.

[biggun]

We are going to get torched unless we somehow get very creative with our pass rush.

Come on!!! It's not as if Jiles and Cleveland were the second coming of Smoot and Bean. Our secondary was pretty bad last season, and that is being kind! Nowhere to go but up.

[biggun]

Slow down folks..... Here's the thing, we have more safeties then db's now..... weird I know. But smoot 2.0 (smitherman) will step up. Man the dude talks a lot in practice..... He's going to get in someone's head in a game. But I'm with the random poster guy here..... We will be in trouble in one on one situations.

If Cleveland and Jiles were our starting cb's, we were toast anyway!!!!!

[Dawgface]

Our DL is coached very well and has some depth. Our LB's are top 5 SEC talent
Our starting WR's are SEC top 5- but we lack depth
Our OL is bottom half SEC at best
Our RB talent is mid-level SEC
We have green TE's
We have problems at the QB position. Mullen even told the media the QB's are struggling- and thats rare for Mullen.

So with a secondary that is going to be torched and the above......a 6-7 win season looks like a best case scenario? 7-5 has been my forecast assuming the QB's progress as the season matures.

Never mind.....I see other thread discussing season.

[bulldawg28]

Ive said we will be 6-6. A retarded monkey or even you could go 6-6 with an SEC team. 2-6 in conference isnt hard. I'm Random Poster- there is nothing to change my name to.

Lol...So why couldn't you do it John Madden?

[lamont]

Lol...So why couldn't you do it John Madden?

Because I manage a Taco Bell for Taco Tuohy. Our Drive-Thru is one of the quickest in the business and I have 4 certificates for Manager of the Month in just the last year alone.

[Commercecomet24]

Because I manage a Taco Bell for Taco Tuohy. Our Drive-Thru is one of the quickest in the business and I have 4 certificates for Manager of the Month in just the last year alone.

So you're saying you only have .333 winning percentage in the manager of the month contest.********

[bulldawg28]

Because I manage a Taco Bell for Taco Tuohy. Our Drive-Thru is one of the quickest in the business and I have 4 certificates for Manager of the Month in just the last year alone.

And if true proves you know little about football. Williams could win 7 games with the weapons on offense alone.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

What else happened at the scrimmage? How'd we look?

This is hear say, the offense didn't look good. Apparently Williams threw a pick on his first play from scrimmage and no one is emerging at RB.

[BiscuitEater]

Taking a marginal prospect is better than not taking one at all. You have to have bodies. You can process them out later if necessary.

Violently disagree. You DO what MSU is doing .. you find the 'best' JC players to fill in for the BIG class we are fixing to lose. That way, we have players physically ready to contribute in 2017, instead of taking a marginal developmental prospect and 'building em up' for a couple of years.

[starkvegasdawg]

Because I manage a Taco Bell for Taco Tuohy. Our Drive-Thru is one of the quickest in the business and I have 4 certificates for Manager of the Month in just the last year alone.

I'll vouch for this. Went through the drive thru last week and got my five layer burrito and soft taco in record time. Even got extra taco sauce just like I asked.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Rumor alert and again hearsay, but one of the late WR signees suffered a significant injury during the scrimmage....hope I'm getting incorrect info.

[BorneDawg]

Rumor alert and again hearsay, but one of the late WR signees suffered a significant injury during the scrimmage....hope I'm getting incorrect info.

You better watch out or svd34 will be insulting you wife and saying your trying to bring the program down!

[Ifyouonlyknew]

This is hear say, the offense didn't look good. Apparently Williams threw a pick on his first play from scrimmage and no one is emerging at RB.

I heard Aeris had a great scrimmage.

[HancockCountyDog]

I heard Aeris had a great scrimmage.

Positive news gets nothing, negative news gets an 8 page thread.

I'm ready for the season to start.

[confucius say]

I heard Aeris had a great scrimmage.

But did he pass block well?**

[benbow]

Looked great running the ball. Couldn't be tackled but hi8s pad level was a problem. Won't play no to till that is solved.

[Bama_Dawg]

Rumor alert and again hearsay, but one of the late WR signees suffered a significant injury during the scrimmage....hope I'm getting incorrect info.

Think you're right; its Reggie Todd. Donald Gray posed this on instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/drose_901/

[ShotgunDawg]

Think you're right; its Reggie Todd. Donald Gray posed this on instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/drose_901/

It's an epidemic on our team.

Does it seem like we are having a disproportionate amount of ACL injuries? At least this guy wasn't expected to play this year &, additionally, since he's a big receiver, his future success isn't as reliant on raw speed & agility.

[Eric Nies Grind Time]

It's an epidemic on our team.

Does it seem like we are having a disproportionate amount of ACL injuries? At least this guy wasn't expected to play this year &, additionally, since he's a big receiver, his future success isn't as reliant on raw speed & agility.

You just follow MSU closely so it seems high. Every team has a handful of injuries before the season starts. Hopefully the younger CB's step up and we can stay healthy from here on out.

[bhamdawgfan]

Doesn't byu get hill back at Qb? If so, pretty sure he's a runner more than a passer

He's back, but in a qb battle with Tanner Mangum. Threw for over 3,000 yards as a freshman after Hill was injured. #3 QB in nation when he was recruited. Pro Style QB.

[Johnson85]

That's not the point. What I see is on Saturdays and a practice here and there. On yours is on less than that.....The coaches see them everyday and then breakdown film for hours. Say what you want, but we don't play people bc they have jr or sr by their name. We play them because at that particular moment our coaches think they give us the best chance to win based on what they've seen and know. They don't just make shit up and decide lets play a jr bc he's a jr. If they did we would have Jake Thomas and Cole carter starting right now. Experience wins in this league. Experienced talent, wins championships. We play a ton of young guys every year, go look it up. You see what you want to see. But believe what you want. Your entire premise is based on Internet fodder and is ****ing retarded. Period.

They absolutely don't play who at that particular moment the coaches think will give us the best chance to win. If they did, JRob would have played way more over perkins.

The coaches take the long view, not who will help win immediately. What frustrates people is that instead of playing players with the highest ceiling when two players are reasonably close in talent, the coaches focus on how hard the players work on and off the field and take the position that consistently rewarding work ethic will result in the best long term results for the team, even if it makes us worse over the long run at some positions. Often times this results in more naturally talented players losing playing time to more mature, but less naturally talented upper classmen.

Every coach has to do that to an extent as letting super talented players play even though they are not meeting minimal expectations off the field will result in the coach eventually losing the locker room, but Mullen does seem to be somewhat extreme on this compared to most coaches. But it's hard to know exactly because you don't know exactly what players are doing off the field (or even on field during practice).

[bulldawg28]

Looked great running the ball. Couldn't be tackled but hi8s pad level was a problem. Won't play no to till that is solved.




Ummmm....Where did you get this foolery? Pad level isn't a problem running unless you're fumbling or not getting the tough yards. If he can't be tackled obviously his pad level isn't a problem running the football.

[maroonmania]

It's an epidemic on our team.

Does it seem like we are having a disproportionate amount of ACL injuries? At least this guy wasn't expected to play this year &, additionally, since he's a big receiver, his future success isn't as reliant on raw speed & agility.

Not sure I would say that he would not have played this year. We desperately needed either him or Couch to play this year as a big outside receiver to do some of the things we will miss with no Derunnya. If Todd is injured I guess it will have to be Couch.

[ShotgunDawg]

Not sure I would say that he would not have played this year. We desperately needed either him or Couch to play this year as a big outside receiver to do some of the things we will miss with no Derunnya. If Todd is injured I guess it will have to be Couch.

From some of the information coming out of camp, it appears that Couch was well ahead

[bulldawg28]

From some of the information coming out of camp, it appears that Couch was well ahead

His body is already SEC ready

[BrunswickDawg]

They absolutely don't play who at that particular moment the coaches think will give us the best chance to win. If they did, JRob would have played way more over perkins.

The coaches take the long view, not who will help win immediately. What frustrates people is that instead of playing players with the highest ceiling when two players are reasonably close in talent, the coaches focus on how hard the players work on and off the field and take the position that consistently rewarding work ethic will result in the best long term results for the team, even if it makes us worse over the long run at some positions. Often times this results in more naturally talented players losing playing time to more mature, but less naturally talented upper classmen.

Every coach has to do that to an extent as letting super talented players play even though they are not meeting minimal expectations off the field will result in the coach eventually losing the locker room, but Mullen does seem to be somewhat extreme on this compared to most coaches. But it's hard to know exactly because you don't know exactly what players are doing off the field (or even on field during practice).

I'm perfectly content for Mullen and the staff to make personnel decisions based on what they see on and off the field and set whatever expectations they feel are appropriate to earn playing time - that is what we/MSU are paying them for. If he wins enough, then his philosophy is right. And right now, we are winning enough.

And do you blame Dan if he takes a pretty hard-line approach after having spent time under Urban Meyer and the shitshow that was UF off the field?? They had a murderer on the team.

[Tbonewannabe]

I'm perfectly content for Mullen and the staff to make personnel decisions based on what they see on and off the field and set whatever expectations they feel are appropriate to earn playing time - that is what we/MSU are paying them for. If he wins enough, then his philosophy is right. And right now, we are winning enough.

And do you blame Dan if he takes a pretty hard-line approach after having spent time under Urban Meyer and the shitshow that was UF off the field?? They had a murderer on the team.

Sometimes I wonder if the experience at UF under Urban made Dan go to an extreme with his tolerance of off the field stuff. I would rather get players I am proud of representing my university than winning at all costs. That environment is probably what gave Urban heart trouble.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Think you're right; its Reggie Todd. Donald Gray posed this on instagram:

https://www.instagram.com/drose_901/

Well damn...hate it for the guy. Looks like Couch is going to shoulder the load of the tall WRs.

[Irondawg]

that sucks - he has the biggest upside of the 3 supposedly so this will really delay his development as he was also probably the most raw.

[msbulldog]

Best time for it to happen 1 year to recover, might be eligible for a medical RS, I don't know.

[maroonmania]

that sucks - he has the biggest upside of the 3 supposedly so this will really delay his development as he was also probably the most raw.

All I can say is that if we actually lost 3 guys for the season in one scrimmage then we need to stop scrimmaging.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

All I can say is that if we actually lost 3 guys for the season in one scrimmage then we need to stop scrimmaging.

Cleveland & Jiles were hurt before the scrimmage.

[maroonmania]

Cleveland & Jiles were hurt before the scrimmage.

Ok, apparently we just need to stop practicing altogether.**

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Ok, apparently we just need to stop practicing altogether.**

Just mental reps the rest of camp is the plan. Followed by Madden 17 to work on play calling.

[Political Hack]

I haven't heard that Jiles is a season ender, but I'm not going back and reading this whole thread either. I think it may be a few weeks or so. I just can't see how his injury would kill his entire season.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I haven't heard that Jiles is a season ender, but I'm not going back and reading this whole thread either. I think it may be a few weeks or so. I just can't see how his injury would kill his entire season.

It's not expected to be.

[Johnson85]

I'm perfectly content for Mullen and the staff to make personnel decisions based on what they see on and off the field and set whatever expectations they feel are appropriate to earn playing time - that is what we/MSU are paying them for. If he wins enough, then his philosophy is right. And right now, we are winning enough.

And do you blame Dan if he takes a pretty hard-line approach after having spent time under Urban Meyer and the shitshow that was UF off the field?? They had a murderer on the team.

His approach is obviously not far off from being the right one for his team. I think the major problem for him has been running back. Hindsight has made the decisions on JRob's playing time a lot more understandable, and maybe in the future we'll be saying the same thing about Aeris and D Lee. But I understand why people were frustrated that we spent all season with soembody that clearly wasn't an SEC RB and a guy who was not an everydown back essentially being out two RBs while we didn't develop (hopefully) more talented underclassman. And they are going to be more frustrated if we do something similar this season.

[mic]

I haven't heard that Jiles is a season ender, but I'm not going back and reading this whole thread either. I think it may be a few weeks or so. I just can't see how his injury would kill his entire season.

Jiles back around mid season is the word..

[Todd4State]

His approach is obviously not far off from being the right one for his team. I think the major problem for him has been running back. Hindsight has made the decisions on JRob's playing time a lot more understandable, and maybe in the future we'll be saying the same thing about Aeris and D Lee. But I understand why people were frustrated that we spent all season with soembody that clearly wasn't an SEC RB and a guy who was not an everydown back essentially being out two RBs while we didn't develop (hopefully) more talented underclassman. And they are going to be more frustrated if we do something similar this season.

Offensive line has been even more of an issue. I know dead horse.

Dan does need to come to grips with the fact that his offense works much better with a Vick Ballard/Anthony Dixon/Josh Robinson type back than it does a scat back.

[maroonmania]

Jiles back around mid season is the word..

Are we taking bets on how long it takes him to get injured again when he does?

[Johnson85]

Offensive line has been even more of an issue. I know dead horse.


No doubt that's a much bigger issue, it's just the issue has been not having talent period, as opposed to more talented younger guys not being able to figure things out. Last year is the first time I can think of that we've even had a question about whether the younger OL (Jenkins) should be getting time over the upper classman (Warren).

[Bubb Rubb]

Again- a guy that is a freshman and playing mop up duty and saying ?Oh look! Dan is playing a freshman!? and Saban starting a guy that is a true freshman in a meaningful game are two totally different things. You?re only looking at the total number of upperclassmen and underclassmen and saying that is the same thing when it?s not the same at all. Try looking at number of snaps next time if you want to be relevant.

You?re mistaken about my views on Peters/McLaurin and Bryant. I wanted Bryant to start all along. I?ve always liked Bryant and helped lead the charge when Rosebowl tried to run him off for visiting USM. I want Peters to start over Coman and still do. Peters actually outplayed Coman in the Egg Bowl statistically. He isn?t any worse in coverage than Coman and has better instincts and is more likely to cause a turnover. You can say I missed on McLaurin if it makes you feel better, but that?s bound to happen since no one plays three safeties on defense unless it?s Big Nickle. Zach Jackson started ELEVEN games in a row and his playing time was reduced when he and Manny got into it after Manny FINALLY benched him and Zach left the team. Waiting until game 11 when Arkansas is lighting us up and then saying ?see Dan is right? is silly when that should have occurred during game three at the latest.

And while you are at it- I also wanted Aeris and Lee to play more. Aeris had more rushing TD?s than Holloway and Lee had the highest yards per carry of any running back we had last year. I said Jenkins should play more than Warren. I said Dear should play more than he did before the season as well. Was I wrong about them as well?

I guess you forgot 2013 because Bear Wilson only had one start and Ross only played in 11 games and had 9 catches on the year. And the starters that year were the less productive than Bear Wilson Robert Johnson and Joe Morrow? Bear had more TD?s than our starting outside WR?s COMBINED and still didn?t start. Good call on that.

The problem with this argument is that these players aren't plug-and-play commodities. Wilson and Ross weren't the same players in 2013 that they were last year. Bear Wilson had an impact offensively because he was a great athlete, and you can talk about his offensive production, but quick: can you tell me how many plays for lost yardage we had because he missed a block outside? That's the kind of stuff you have to be careful about. There were reasons those guys didn't play as much as you'd like. For every one thing that's apparent and obvious, there are ten things that we as fans don't have a clue about, and those things go into decisions around who's playing and who's not.

[Todd4State]

The problem with this argument is that these players aren't plug-and-play commodities. Wilson and Ross weren't the same players in 2013 that they were last year. Bear Wilson had an impact offensively because he was a great athlete, and you can talk about his offensive production, but quick: can you tell me how many plays for lost yardage we had because he missed a block outside? That's the kind of stuff you have to be careful about. There were reasons those guys didn't play as much as you'd like. For every one thing that's apparent and obvious, there are ten things that we as fans don't have a clue about, and those things go into decisions around who's playing and who's not.

I was responding to someone who claimed that Bear and Ross played a lot as freshmen.

[Reason2succeed]

It's an epidemic on our team.

Does it seem like we are having a disproportionate amount of ACL injuries? At least this guy wasn't expected to play this year &, additionally, since he's a big receiver, his future success isn't as reliant on raw speed & agility.

It seemed like Balis was able to condition to keep injuries very low. I was worried about this when he left. It's not just about bigger and stronger. It's also about durable and flexible. Availability is more important than ability.

[state66]

I apologize in advance if I missed this in the thread but do we know what Todd's injury was?

[Dallas_Dawg]

It seemed like Balis was able to condition to keep injuries very low. I was worried about this when he left. It's not just about bigger and stronger. It's also about durable and flexible. Availability is more important than ability.
We have fewer injuries than most teams. Look at all the preseason injuries in the the NFL also. We stay healthy, relatively speaking

[Jarius]

Jiles back around mid season is the word..

Yep, and that's a good thing because that's right around the time that we get into our toughest toss up games.

[Jarius]

It seemed like Balis was able to condition to keep injuries very low. I was worried about this when he left. It's not just about bigger and stronger. It's also about durable and flexible. Availability is more important than ability.

We had one of our worst injury years under Mullen in 2011 with multiple olineman going down and a qb with broken ribs. There's only so much you can do.

[Bothrops]

It seemed like Balis was able to condition to keep injuries very low. I was worried about this when he left. It's not just about bigger and stronger. It's also about durable and flexible. Availability is more important than ability.

I remember we had few major injuries under Balis, and he was here for several years. However, when Court came in, it seemed like team speed improved a great deal, especially on offense.

[Really Clark?]

I was responding to someone who claimed that Bear and Ross played a lot as freshmen.

They did play a lot as a true freshman. Ross would have played in every game if he hadn't got injured. Bear played more than him and started a game. Bear almost caught as many passes as Robert Johnson and was 3rd in receiving for WR. But Johnson should have been on the field a lot over Bear because he knew the offense much better and was excellent in blocking for the run game. Which once Tyler went down became more prevalent for that year. Johnson taught a lot of the WR how you are suppose to block down the field. But your premise was we hardly ever play talented underclassman. We do and compared to others in the league we are in line with what they do in the 2 deep (which are the players who will play a ton). If you want to discuss the true freshman we sign not getting on the field I think you have to realize when comparing Bama, which you did, by and large you are comparing our signee's to players who are much more developed in many ways. That takes a significant number of athletes away from being ready to play in this league.