So SHS athletes aren't even attending MSU camps???

[Dawgology]

I know the other thread on this has evolved and mentioned something about the coaching staff at SHS but, having just listened to the Boneyard, apparently not a single SHS athlete attended MSU football camp. What the hell? I understand maybe being upset with a coach or something but to encourage or lead your student athletes to skip a local football camp for a SEC Div. 1 school is the epitome of bad leadership. As a parent if I discovered this was happening (whether or not I was a fan of the school) I would rain holy hell down on the coach or asst. coach causing it. The exposure alone is worth attending...especially with the benefit of not having travel expenses associated.

These are the guys entrusted by the Starkville school system to lead their student athletes?? Mmmmkay. Guess that's why they are having so many issues at all levels in the school system over there.

[Dawg61]

They send them to the future Starkville PD camp instead

[BeastMan]

If it were any other SEC town, that staff would be looking for a job. Not saying that right or wrong, that's just the reality.

[AlSwearengen]

If it were any other SEC town, that staff would be looking for a job. Not saying that right or wrong, that's just the reality.

Yep. When stuff like this happens and when coaches at that h.s. feel comfortable doing this, that is a sign. MSU is to f'n nice apparently.

[confucius say]

I think Steve said a few were there, but a very few. Either way, your point is noted.

[Jacksondevildog]

Don't tell Paul Jones something is going on at SHS. He'll fight you to the death to prove otherwise.

[jumbo]

Paul says the exact opposite. AJ, Kobe and Nelson Jordan camped last year. This year Willie, Ben Owens, a 2017 LT and 2018 WR camped.

He says Ricky Woods doesn't do 7 on 7s though.

[sandwolf]

Don't tell Paul Jones something is going on at SHS. He'll fight you to the death to prove otherwise.

Paul has become a serious sunshine pumper......it has gotten to the point that I rarely visit his board anymore.

[Dawgology]

It seems like Robertson is a huge MSU fan but he also doesn't mince words either. In other words, if its bad news he gives it, if its good news he gives it....if someone done 17'd up...he calls them out. I like it. I've no reason to doubt there is an issue with SHS if Steve is implying that there is something weird going on.

[Jarius]

Rosebowl was not happy with the situation at Starkville on his Latest show. He said that he expects someone to get to the bottom of the issue there, and there is certainly an issue.

[Jack Lambert]

If it were any other SEC town, that staff would be looking for a job. Not saying that right or wrong, that's just the reality.

I would bet it goes on in Columbia SC, Tuscaloosa and Gainesville. I say that because they are big cities and have multiple big time college programs in the State.

[BB30]

Yea, there has to be something going on. It is actually rather frustrating. Not losing the recruits part as that happens from time to time. Unfortunately, it happened in back to back years with a couple of high profile guys. But, the fact that SHS is shying away from our camps etc. is ridiculous. Someone apparently pissed somebody off or there is money funneling in from somewhere to keep these kids from attending. Would be interesting to see if SHS has sent their kids to other camps this year. I think that would be a tell tell sign that something is going on.

[Liverpooldawg]

Yea, there has to be something going on. It is actually rather frustrating. Not losing the recruits part as that happens from time to time. Unfortunately, it happened in back to back years with a couple of high profile guys. But, the fact that SHS is shying away from our camps etc. is ridiculous. Someone apparently pissed somebody off or there is money funneling in from somewhere to keep these kids from attending. Would be interesting to see if SHS has sent their kids to other camps this year. I think that would be a tell tell sign that something is going on.

In Mississippi back in the day where your HS coach went or was a fan of had a massive impact in this sort of thing. I seriously doubt it's changed. It's generally the HEAD coach too.

[StatesboroBlues]

Paul has become a serious sunshine pumper......it has gotten to the point that I rarely visit his board anymore.

I find myself visiting the board less and less myself...

[BB30]

In Mississippi back in the day where your HS coach went or was a fan of had a massive impact in this sort of thing. I seriously doubt it's changed. It's generally the HEAD coach too.

I don't know how the camps really work as I went to a small highschool so we didn't attend many of them. I'm assuming the 7v7 is a team thing but, wouldn't the other camps be left up to the kids to decide if they want to go or are all of the camps a school decision?

[SDDawg]

I find myself visiting the board less and less myself...

I think Paul & Robbie do a pretty good job, but there has been some sunshine pumping on the recruiting front since the February meltdown. I guess I'd rather meltdown in recruiting once in a while vs. be headed to a probation and bowl ban, but to say that nothing has been wrong with MSU recruiting after that finish we had last Feb (especially on OL - forget that prima donna WR) is just absolutely ridiculous. This class needs to start accelerating pretty quickly and the OL slots need to get locked down much sooner - we are terrible at getting highly recruited OL late in the process.

[BB30]

We aren't very good at getting highly recruited OL at all and haven't been for quite some time outside of a few here and there.

[maroonmania]

Yea, there has to be something going on. It is actually rather frustrating. Not losing the recruits part as that happens from time to time. Unfortunately, it happened in back to back years with a couple of high profile guys. But, the fact that SHS is shying away from our camps etc. is ridiculous. Someone apparently pissed somebody off or there is money funneling in from somewhere to keep these kids from attending. Would be interesting to see if SHS has sent their kids to other camps this year. I think that would be a tell tell sign that something is going on.

Oh there is definitely something going on. Losing guys out of your backyard, or in this case same town, is bad enough but when you are losing them to your hated in state rival that makes it WAY worse (and I noticed Steve wouldn't mention that part of it but I will). If a guy just wanted to leave the state or play for a tradition rich program outside of MS, it would be bad, but nothing like as bad as this. And to pile on more this is happening when that rival program is a proven cheater who is about to get hit with serious sanctions.

[mic]

There are a couple of coaches there (one for sure ) that need to be gone..... Should have happened last year...

[Dawgology]

Well the only thing to do to effect a change there is to keep this issue at the front and make sure the right people know we aren't happy about it. At the end of the day an athlete can go to college wherever they want to (and rightfully so) but completely missing a local, major athletics camp where you can show case your talent JUST because some coaches are fans of other schools...well, to put it lightly....that's unacceptable. There should be some heads rolling because of it.

[StatesboroBlues]

I think Paul & Robbie do a pretty good job, but there has been some sunshine pumping on the recruiting front since the February meltdown. I guess I'd rather meltdown in recruiting once in a while vs. be headed to a probation and bowl ban, but to say that nothing has been wrong with MSU recruiting after that finish we had last Feb (especially on OL - forget that prima donna WR) is just absolutely ridiculous. This class needs to start accelerating pretty quickly and the OL slots need to get locked down much sooner - we are terrible at getting highly recruited OL late in the process.

Agree...

To be clear...I don't blame Paul/Robbie for how they run the board. I honestly couldn't tell you the exact reasoning I visit less frequently...

[Dawgology]

Agree...

To be clear...I don't blame Paul/Robbie for how they run the board. I honestly couldn't tell you the exact reasoning I visit less frequently...

The one thing that I love about 247 is their rating system. I think its a neat thing to take combined rankings on an athlete and get an average. Their team commit list/interest/verbal/offers is much easier to navigate than scouts is in my opinion. But Scout has them beat on content hands down.

[AlSwearengen]

In Mississippi back in the day where your HS coach went or was a fan of had a massive impact in this sort of thing. I seriously doubt it's changed. It's generally the HEAD coach too.

Sometimes it is an asst. coach that undermines the head coach. I have witnessed it up close. As in, I was sitting next to the asst. coach while he was on the phone with an asst. coach from fl. state. He had self interests in where the kid went. The head coach is a douche bag and no friend of MSU, so I could give a shit about that particular instance.

[MSUDawg99]

Not to be the opposite of sunshine pumper, I listened to the podcast as well & yes was also very disturbed. But are we sure there's not some fault that lies also on our own staff, as well? Like maybe not showing enough appreciation for those you're recruiting? I'm not talking coddling & kissing their ass but at least let them know they're wanted/needed? I have no idea. I'm just asking. That's the recurring theme I'm seeing with those two that chose to go elsewhere though. Not feeling like they're wanted. I may be way off base. I honestly have no idea the issue. And the staff is on break right now so I don't want to text to ask wtf is going on, but it's def a prob.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

There's difference between telling them what they want to hear and making them feel wanted.

[SDDawg]

There's difference between telling them what they want to hear and making them feel wanted.

I think this is a great point. We need to make every guy feel like we want them, even the ones we can't take. Because when your Plan A falls through, your Plan B guys have to feel like they're a priority and have been throughout the process. In typical MSU fashion, I think we're almost too honest and transparent with prospects and when the stars don't align for us it really hurts that we can't pull guys in late that we need. We saw that on the OL recruiting front in February.

[MSUDawg99]

There's difference between telling them what they want to hear and making them feel wanted.

Couldn't agree more. You made the point better than I did.

[Barking 13]

It's Hev's fault****

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

I never knew high school coaching staff lists were so hard to find. I can't find one for SHS. Anyone got an idea?

[MadDawg]

It's Hev's fault****

He is a huge recruiting disadvantage for us.

[Dawgology]

Here is a list of all the staff at SHS. Football coaches and the generic "coaches" are all listed in it:

http://www.starkvillesd.com/directory-test/cat/starkville-high-school/

[Dawgology]

Let me get this straight. The new head coach at SHS is a previous South Panola coach? HAHAAHAHAHAAH Since he was hired in May of last year all of SHS's high profile recruits have left the state or gone to Ole Miss except for Kobe who was on the fence for a while...

I understand correlation doesn't always equal causation but c'mon!!

[djaymsu5]

We aren't very good at getting highly recruited OL at all and haven't been for quite some time outside of a few here and there.

Until Hevesy is fired expect the same outcome year after year.

[msbulldog]

Let me get this straight. The new head coach at SHS is a previous South Panola coach? HAHAAHAHAHAAH Since he was hired in May of last year all of SHS's high profile recruits have left the state or gone to Ole Miss except for Kobe who was on the fence for a while...

I understand correlation doesn't always equal causation but c'mon!!

I tried to make the same point on the other thread, S. Panola has always been a pipeline to Mississippi.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

Let me get this straight. The new head coach at SHS is a previous South Panola coach? HAHAAHAHAHAAH Since he was hired in May of last year all of SHS's high profile recruits have left the state or gone to Ole Miss except for Kobe who was on the fence for a while...

I understand correlation doesn't always equal causation but c'mon!!

Anybody else on his staff connected to south panola or ole miss?

[gravedigger]

Anybody else on his staff connected to south panola or ole miss?

Yes. And they know people are watching. To include msu fans that sponsor shs athletics.

[Schultzy]

Not to be the opposite of sunshine pumper, I listened to the podcast as well & yes was also very disturbed. But are we sure there's not some fault that lies also on our own staff, as well? Like maybe not showing enough appreciation for those you're recruiting? I'm not talking coddling & kissing their ass but at least let them know they're wanted/needed? I have no idea. I'm just asking. That's the recurring theme I'm seeing with those two that chose to go elsewhere though. Not feeling like they're wanted. I may be way off base. I honestly have no idea the issue. And the staff is on break right now so I don't want to text to ask wtf is going on, but it's def a prob.

No

[Schultzy]

There's difference between telling them what they want to hear and making them feel wanted.

Of course we make them feel wanted. You don't think Tee Sheperd felt wanted? Willie Gay knows we want him badly and has been fiercely recruited by our coaches. I don't think some of you truly understand how crazy this process is.

[MSUDawg99]

Of course we make them feel wanted. You don't think Tee Sheperd felt wanted? Willie Gay knows we want him badly and has been fiercely recruited by our coaches. I don't think some of you truly understand how crazy this process is.

Well if you seem to know for a FACT that we're doing all we can on our end & making them feel like a priority, then that makes me feel better that at least the prob isn't on our end. We're controlling what we can. But I also don't know how well connected you are, so I'm assuming.

[Engine]

Just embarrassing we can be pushed around like this. Need people who understand leverage and power not weakness and capitulation.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Just embarrassing we can be pushed around like this. Need people who understand leverage and power not weakness and capitulation.

So losing two kids from SHS means we've lost the entire recruiting battle as though there aren't other kids in other states that can produce?

I went back and compiled the national average (using 247 info) and here is how it breaks down on average:
Sherrill - average recruiting rank was 29.25 (years 2000 - 2003)
Croom - average recruiting rank was 41.4 (years 2004 - 2008)
Mullen - average recruiting rank is 27.5 (years 2009 - 2016)

Not sure if the analysis has improved over time but in years 2002 & 2003, we had classes ranked 13th and 15th nationally. Croom never had a class rank higher than 30th, with Mullen's best class being 2015 at 18th.

We do need to tweak some things, but if you watched the Fletcher Cox video posted yesterday - it seemed his coach played a HUGE role in him coming to State. Unless SHS' football program starts losing, I doubt we'll see much change in where their players go so we should just get over it. You think Saban is concerned if he loses a Tuscaloosa High kid to Auburn?

[maroonmania]

So losing two kids from SHS means we've lost the entire recruiting battle as though there aren't other kids in other states that can produce?

I went back and compiled the national average (using 247 info) and here is how it breaks down on average:
Sherrill - average recruiting rank was 29.25 (years 2000 - 2003)
Croom - average recruiting rank was 41.4 (years 2004 - 2008)
Mullen - average recruiting rank is 27.5 (years 2009 - 2016)

Not sure if the analysis has improved over time but in years 2002 & 2003, we had classes ranked 13th and 15th nationally. Croom never had a class rank higher than 30th, with Mullen's best class being 2015 at 18th.

We do need to tweak some things, but if you watched the Fletcher Cox video posted yesterday - it seemed his coach played a HUGE role in him coming to State. Unless SHS' football program starts losing, I doubt we'll see much change in where their players go so we should just get over it. You think Saban is concerned if he loses a Tuscaloosa High kid to Auburn?

Well if we could replace a high 4 star or 5 star player we miss out on in Starkville with a replacement player ranked that high in another state like Saban can if he misses on a guy in AL then no, it wouldn't be a big issue, but we aren't able to even come close to doing that.

[Gutter Cobreh]

Well if we could replace a high 4 star or 5 star player we miss out on in Starkville with a replacement player ranked that high in another state like Saban can if he misses on a guy in AL then no, it wouldn't be a big issue, but we aren't able to even come close to doing that.

I agree. At the same time, it also shouldn't send us into full meltdown mode....we aren't Jackson State or Alcorn State for heavens sake....

[MSUDawg99]

So losing two kids from SHS means we've lost the entire recruiting battle as though there aren't other kids in other states that can produce?

I went back and compiled the national average (using 247 info) and here is how it breaks down on average:
Sherrill - average recruiting rank was 29.25 (years 2000 - 2003)
Croom - average recruiting rank was 41.4 (years 2004 - 2008)
Mullen - average recruiting rank is 27.5 (years 2009 - 2016)

Not sure if the analysis has improved over time but in years 2002 & 2003, we had classes ranked 13th and 15th nationally. Croom never had a class rank higher than 30th, with Mullen's best class being 2015 at 18th.

We do need to tweak some things, but if you watched the Fletcher Cox video posted yesterday - it seemed his coach played a HUGE role in him coming to State. Unless SHS' football program starts losing, I doubt we'll see much change in where their players go so we should just get over it. You think Saban is concerned if he loses a Tuscaloosa High kid to Auburn?

I don't think we should have to get over shit. I think we need to figure out wherein lies the prob & fix the damn problem. We shouldn't be letting hometown kids get out of the backyard...Willie Gay said he wanted to be a Bulldog. But oh well, Hobby Lobby instead. Fuq!

[dawgoneyall]

Yes. And they know people are watching. To include msu fans that sponsor shs athletics.

That would fix some things faster than any thing.

[Dawgology]

I don't think we should have to get over shit. I think we need to figure out wherein lies the prob & fix the damn problem. We shouldn't be letting hometown kids get out of the backyard...Willie Gay said he wanted to be a Bulldog. But oh well, Hobby Lobby instead. Fuq!

Exactly. And it's not like we are Alabama and can just replace a 4 star athlete with a 5 star athlete.

[Turfdawg67]

Yes. And they know people are watching. To include msu fans that sponsor shs athletics.

THAT is what needs to happen! Things would change pretty fast if all the MSU fans/alum who are also SHS graduates closed their wallets to the SHS booster club!

[LockeDawg]

THAT is what needs to happen! Things would change pretty fast if all the MSU fans/alum who are also SHS graduates closed their wallets to the SHS booster club!Usually the parents of players make up the large majority of the HS Booster Club. Why can't the parents decide to send their kid to any camp they choose to send them to regardless of where the HS head coach dictates which camps they should attend?